As a Dad who can only play for a couple of hours after everyone is in bed I absolutely depend on content creators to narrow down what’s worth farming for or giving me tips on how to get through things solo, etc. And when I’m not able to play I get to live vicariously through amazing dudes like Vanguard and Aztec!
Content creation killed all video game communities. We used to give each other tips, post secrets, etc just for the love of the game. Now it's a job for you folks & while I don't blame anyone for pursuing it as a job, it's 100% a net negative for the game & the players.
Totally agree. RUclipsrs could be creating their own mini communities where people help each other out. Instead it is just fomo and other BS. I absolutely do not need every gun in the game. I've started to watch less and less recently. Only a key couple of people. I enjoy Aztecross for his personality and I hope he keeps playing other titles. And Maven for her rapid delivery of no nonsense builds. Others only here and there.
Without content creation, EA, Activision, blizzard would run the world. Indie games are more alive than ever, bad quality is called out, and communities are formed
I don’t agree with this. There are some games where the content creator community is what keeps the game alive (in a good way). While for sure there are content creator communities that are toxic or focused on it too much as a job, there are some communities where content creators make the game and the community around it so much better.
I gotta strongly disagree with this. I would much rather a trusted personality like TrueVanguard review a new game or provide a content walkthrough and make money off it than ever send another cent to a "videogame journalist" whose just another Californian/New York Communist activist trying to ruin my hobbies and call me a bad person for liking Stellar Blade or Warhammer or JRPGs or whatever the American far far left of politics has decided is the problem if the month. TV directly derives his income from his audience he has good reason to maintain their trust by behaving within an ethical framework, "games journalists" have no ethics whatsoever because their Communists; but they also have no monetaey inscentive as they get paid by a large corporation to generate clicks.
@VinceTenia you absolutely had no reason to bring politics into the discussion, but given the lack of grammar and clear misunderstanding of what communism is, I hope people can choose to ignore your BS.
13:28 thats so illuminating, and also explains why after accidentally tapping a Family Guy clip Reel one time and not backing out immediately I've been bombarded with them for ages.
As with most things in this post-monetization world, the issue is that creators are paid. Large scale content creators (read: full timers) _are not_ community leaders, they are paid talent who have fan clubs. This isn't a bad thing, get paid for what you do! The problem comes when the player community begins to follow what content creators say and do as if it is The Way To Play. Communities begin to centralize on what paid talent say is the thing to do, individual creativity takes a hit, metas begin to show up at accelerated rates and people who dont keep up, can't keep up.
as per your request, i did indeed make it to the end, i could listen to you talk for hours, also, that d1 snippet of one of your montages, one of those trials clips, you did the nghtly (ogs remember) thank you for always staying true to your vanguard :) blessings to you tv :)
I will always maintain that during peak Destiny 1 it had the most inclusive and fun environment to be in. It was ONE big community rather than many small ones. It didn't matter if I was in Krafty's stream, Goth's stream, Hovey's or your stream it still felt like the same community just different areas of it. I would go to a different stream each day of the week and be greeted by name by the streamer and I played with so many of the streamers and content creators and formed friendships that lasts to this day. That feeling just isn't there anymore. It might be age and I just like to stay in my comfortable lane but in D1 that lane was so wide and included so many people and different experiences. Feel like doing sweats? I knew where to go. Raids? Yup I got that. Trials? Let me check who's on. To use one of my favorite quotes from one of my favorite movies: "We had all the momentum; we were riding the crest of a high and beautiful wave. So now, less than five years later, you can go up on a steep hill in Las Vegas and look west, and with the right kind of eyes you can almost see the high-water mark - that place where the wave finally broke and rolled back."
Thanks for the thoughtful reflection, TV. It was clear from vanilla D2 that content creation was different than it was in D1. The "lack of endgame content" bemoaned by many creators (IMO) led to broader feelings of resentment among players. High profile abandonments for other games fed the cycle. Coupled with the events you described, the player base felt entitled to trash talk every one and everything about the game. Creators like you and Cammy and Aztecross (who can talk about everything and make it interesting) don't actually rely on the game but their personalities. That's a ramble without a strong conclusion, but a takeaway for me is YES, content creators who had the opportunity to make money and play through content faster than regular folks had responsibilities to foster positive interactions, and they often didn't.
Forreal that dude never missed a single point. If he was wrong ever he would have been clapped but he legit never missed . In the heat of battle he don’t miss .
@@db1872 Darkside royalty lore is a guy that makes destiny content but it’s pure criticism . Because he has predicted every bad choice bungie makes and it all comes to pass . He is like a passionate jaded fan. Like me lol
I'll put it this way, my enjoyment of the games (this one in particular) in the last few years skyrocketed when I stopped participating in the community/watching content creators outside of guides and weapon reviews.
It was hilarious when they had Lupo come back to do the QA session after the Osiris debacle. I like Lupo but it was like why are we bringing a Fortnite streamer to ask the questions the community actually needs answers for. It was just peak Bungie management decision.
I appreciate going beyond simple game videos and making context-sensitive layered discussions. More effort but keeps intellectuals like me around longer! Great concept flow and vocal delivery. I think content creation certainly has benefits if you want the interaction and don't want to also manage a friendship or relationship around shared interests. It's great to just be a fly on the wall and heck I usually hide comments and focus on the streamer anyway, unless it's a great community like CB Gray or EpicDan. I've always enjoyed your stuff brother! Also random interjection, I recommend the Flying Cauldron butterscotch soda and vodka for a great weekend 1-2 punch. I know you like your spirits, cheers!
The first part about having sub communities definitely rings a bell for me, I found several content creators I enjoy watching on here, but the community as a whole just feels so toxic at times and I don’t know why, this was a very good video that I’ll definitely have to rewatch and see if I can’t pay more attention to than I did currently lol
Most content creators are Salt like. Getting Bungo to nerf things into the ground. Ruining the fun for most people, they don’t care about the health of the game. Just the money they can make from it. I don’t even know why Cammy has a career and gets to talk to Bungo devs. Stompees nerf is next level stupid.
@@bannedmann4469 I’ve never heard of cammy advocating for a stompees nerf, the community at large was complaining about stompees and everyone else was saying to look up, I heard more streamer complaining about dunemarchers lightning than stompees
Who remembers buying strategy guides for games back in the day and reading through every single page going through campaign levels, weapons, enemy lore, etc. My favorite was the Halo 3 strategy guide and it was like 400 pages, explaining in detail EVERY little thing about the game!! RUclips does not compare, especially these days.
I learned a lot from creators and streamers when I first started Destiny. It was a way to enjoy the game two ways, watching and learning and playing. It was amazing! Then for some it became a business and the fun became less important. Some of the streamers I started with not only don’t stream anymore,they don’t even play,at least publicly. I still enjoy playing but the streamers I follow are far fewer and the ones I donate to are even fewer. Keep up the good work.
What do you think the solution to the community division is? Destiny 1 came out the day after my 14th birthday and has been a huge component of who I am ever since then. It’s been painful to watch the community devolve as it has - I’m motivated to help change it, but this obviously isn’t a task any one person can take on
Content creation became a problem when two things started happening. First off, it became all about money, not the fun. A lot, and I mean a LOT, of the big creators have turned to treating content as a cash grab, going so low as to do reaction videos without adding anything etc. Second, its all just a rush to push out as much content day one as possible to beat other creators to the punch. A big reason that after week 5 of a season everything feels dead is because content creators exhausted all their easy ideas week 1 or 2. They need to go back to making content, not expecting the game to just give them content.
Frostbolt, Aztec, Wallah….all of the bigger channels all suck and its clearly for the views and money….especially Aztec…the crazy part is that his beef is so far down that community’s throat that he legit spreads misinformation or can get things wrong for the sake of a speedy release to suck all of the views first and his comment section is either helping and filling in the blanks or just crickets….let that be smaller channels and the toxicity goes way up Even Mactics is now on some higher than thou flow after bribing his way to a career on youtube and its become a race and battle of the “best” and it really shows in the community of braindead echo chambers.
@@justsomeguy2142 Exactly why I can't stand watching videos by Aztecross anymore. Most of his content seems like the ramblings of a guy who is too sucked into milking the game for profit than someone who actually enjoys playing the game. For real the dude posts like four videos a day every content drop and it's just lazy cut and paste stream clips. Like if I wanted to watch you be boring on stream, I'd watch your stream, but every time I used to tune in he's just silently playing the game with zero audience interaction.
@@justsomeguy2142 Frost and Wallah are on your "they do it for the money" shit list? Like, your go-to shit list content creators are Wallah - one of the best players to ever touch the franchise - and Frostbolt - probably the biggest pubstomper in Destiny? I mean, I get Cross because he's basically just doing reaction content, but those two dudes are OGs and Wallah did this shit for years while he was average less than 200 viewers at 3AM while he was literally the best player in the game. Like, it's their job, sure, but you can still love your job.
@@endlessgl its not like aztec is trash himself, they are good in pvp…but thats all wallah and frost have and can offer….im not one to just outwardly shit on folks but frost is a bot with 0 personality and his content for a while now despite being OG’s is more suited for high school hype beasts….the way they all present their videos, thumbnails and titles are all the same….that would kind of make your standpoint on them being OG’s a negative one because instead of them being who they were and built themselves up to be they are just as shallow and shamelessly trendchasing as the rest of em For someone who plays nothing but pvp frost cant even tell you crap about optimal weapon performance or creative and good rolls that arent already posted on the web. Him and zk talk and you can hear and tell they dont have extensive knowledge in the game they play. Eventually like frost and wallah watching someone be nice or play with specific weapon loadouts with no other forms of entertainment and personality and flair gets old. I can be nice by myself and be a whole ass vibe you know? Wallah is just cringe, the dude spent a good chunk of his career crutching ttd warlock because folks like him, frost and aztec all make videos and play pvp around “the meta” and even that gets boring to watch. Different strokes for different folks but i just dont see the novelty in liking frost when hes all about trying to be first to post new weapons (Bungie WTF this is my new FAVORITE weapon!) to then forget all about and not even breakdown the weapon itself because thats it its just one and done….its not up until more info is out on the web that he even follows up on it or something…quite the easy job there
@@justsomeguy2142 This is how I know you know nothing about Wallah. He never mained TTD Warlock. That's Panduh. Wallah almost exclusively played Goldie until Strand came out. He has around 4300 hours in PvP and 3800 of them are on Hunter. I wish people like you actually took the time to learn what they're talking about. As far as Frost goes, he was an OG from D1. He was a top 10 player in that game and that's where a lot of his following comes from. You claim that him and Zk don't know a lot about the game they play because they don't spew numbers out of their mouths... The fact of the matter is they don't have to worry about that because the people who watch them do so for gameplay reasons. Barely anybody cares about their opinions on weapons, they just want to see some of the best players in the game perform. I'm not saying you have to like these people or support them, you just have to show people the respect they deserve. It's absurd to dismiss people's hard work just because YOU don't like it or because you don't know anything about them. It's honestly insane how people on the outside of content creation feel about people who genuinely just play a game and upload it.
I agree with you 100 percent TV. Yes im also a creator...but the reason I started creating is because I missed the communities from D1. I over, the last two years have created a community called the pond. Its like jakes Jungle. Because hes inspiration of mine. But I know Ill never be as well known as him, but I can still try to make a difference. Im proud of my little community and they've been huge boon to me and to each other. Theyve helped me while ive dealt with cheaters, stream snipers, people being hateful because of my autism, and more recently they've helped me while my dad who is currently in the ICU. I do not know what id do without them. The part that resonated the most with me, is every time ive tried to collab with other creators they are ximming or toxic...which seems to be the norm for smaller creators, and im not big enough for larger creators to even know who I am, so collabing with them is also out of the question. So I too usually avoid collabing. The only two creators I have collabed with and its worked out is a tik tokker named rave and streamer named Jingelhymer. Both are great people! Thank you for the topic Tv... you've been one my favorites and a pillar in this community for years.
The single biggest issue for the community not being where it is…is Bungie dividing the community due to the real world political scheme. Even then it was excusable as long as they were putting out great content. Then Lightfall came, the rest is history. Maybe Final Shape can rejuvenate the community
TV...i always thumbs up my favorite people, and share those videos to my buddies who play, and i always tell people like CoolGuy "thanks for gettin nerdy with it" and say things to you like "YO, YOU NEED TO REVIEW THAT I.W. HARPER 15 YEAR BOURBON ON YOUR DRINKING CHANNEL"..thanks for always being entertaining buddy, and making hitting all your shots easy looking. 👊
Content creation is the best and worst thing for the community I’ve seen. On the one hand are all the things you’ve mentioned, but on the other I feel that the “base” knowledge of your average player has been elevated drastically by the availability of information!
One of the things I struggle as a content viewer, is being able to parse genuine frustration from sensationalism. I try, very hard to avoid sensationalism because consuming it actively effects how willing I am to engage with the "thing." But it is so difficult, thanks to the way YT titles and thumbnails are constructed, to decide what to watch and what to expect sometimes. I understand impassioned content creators need to be able to express their worries. But it can be difficult to figure out what is genuine and what is a drama-farm. Add in the tribalism and such that you discussed and its super easy to understand why Destiny community content always feels like an absolute minefield at the worst times.
I dont think id like the game as much if it werent for content creators like yourself, Cross, Rick K, Heli, Gold Eagle, Maven etc. I had the busiest year of my life recently so I didnt play for 14 months or so but I still watched to stay engaged.
I am here for my heart for making it to the end of the video 😏 I did not know that facebook 3 second thing. It has caused me to have to block soooo many ads lol
I think there is one other issue with content creators - that "love too much" trap. Ascendant Nomad's video is a great example of that - where iit's easy to fall in the trap of toxicity from being too invested.
I think we are all in uncharted waters as we navigate the internet and how it has changed us and gaming. I’m a new player and your videos are one of the reasons I keep playing, so thank you.
I think a lot of people want to blame someone for a shift in the focus of the game that does not align with theirs, so they blame content creators who have had similar stances. Sometimes content creators bring awareness of certain issues that the game has to the devs, sometimes its already in the pipeline before the creator makes a video on the topic. I just know that when I started playing the game in D1 vanilla, my idea of where the game was going to progress through was very different than where it has. Even by the time I finished the first season of D1 I realized that my initial thoughts were different. Content creators can reveal truths to the community that some are too stubborn to accept, and sometimes they are simply entertainment to pass time until we can get behind the controls and run through some encounters. All in all, I think that there was a greater sense of a Destiny community in D1. There was also a lot more youth. The game was young, fresh and new, the players were younger and more optimistic about life in general. Now a decade has passed and the game is now starting to wind down and come to a conclusion of its saga. This makes people reflect more on what it should have been than what it is. All of the thoughts about where we could be going, are now memories of where we have been, and who we have lost in the process. Much of the pain of the losses is placed towards content creators who made the devs change the game and pushed away their clanmates, fellow guardians and friends. I lost my whole clan, even my twin brother who I started the saga with no longer plays because he is in a cancer battle and doesnt have the strength and will to play, I stream on twitch so he can watch along with me. So, I guess I am a content creator too? I remember the first video that I saw from True Vanguard, it was a video about the Three Little Words pulse rifle, and the focus on precision. Much of it was on Shores of Time. You were a very small creator, and a big forum member at that time. I remember a lot of the discussions in the forum where the community would talk about encounters, and builds, and developing strategies for the NF's or raids... now the forum community basically trolls and complains, very little constructive conversation there anymore. Thanks for sticking with it, you are one of the few creators who I feel has just been themselves and tried to increase positivity in the game.
i think world in general is rotting and we're just seeing that reflected in the things we do or hobbies we have. Still, makes me really happy to see folks like you address these issues and show other people how great being kind can be. love u TV thanks for all the vids n stuff
I made it to the end my friend, and I agree with everything here. It’s sad how divided we are when it comes to, well, anything really but it hurts more in the gaming community. I remember when Witch Queen released and my clan at the time was just running Vow with their inner circle that no one else got a chance to learn the raid until they had done everything in it. So I decided to LFG and I met a really kind group of gamers to run me through it for the first time and it went great! I wish we had more interactions like that, just helping each other grow in a game we enjoy. It was awesome seeing that D1 montage TV, great video 👍.
Top notch video here, TV. Always appreciate your balanced outlook/analysis. Also-great NTB reference. Love your content and thankful to have you in the community!
I don't think it was creators. I think it was bad apples in general. Bad creators make it hard to collaborate, and even harder, the smaller you are because no one big knows you too vouch for you. Bad apples ruin sub communities, like the stuff with a creator's partner last year. The creator did a good job getting rid of their problem, but now they probably struggle to trust others moving forward. The examples are endless. I blame bad apples, ruining everything else for everyone else.
I made it to the end of your video. I won’t plug my channel(s) but I got into attempting content creation from the perspective of potentially using it as a way to help people and spread the love of Christ to those who have less. Destiny 2 was the game that made sense to me as I enjoy playing it a lot. Your content in particular was a big inspiration. I don’t think content creation killed anything, it’s the rampant negativity and toxicity of a lot of people in communities. For the sake of not typing up a novel I’ll leave it there. Good video.
I made it to the end, and as someone who’s played Destiny since Day 1, it’s always been about having fun. No matter the builds and weapons, it was about enjoying a good time with friends. A lot of content creators made it about THEM and their own personal gameplay, not about the tips. I still play the way I want, but I really do appreciate some of the ideas content creators have. But I NEVER looked for a content creator to determine whether I will play or not. Great video!
Hey man this was an awesome video I watched all the way till the end like every other video on this channel and on dram guard. This conversation made me really nostalgic for back in the destiny 1 days. Its crazy to think how whole and happy and supportive the D1 community was with groups like Planet Destiny and all the collaborative twitch streamers. I feel I share a sentiment with most when I say I miss that Community a lot and the feeling of camaraderie being a part of it. Content creators like you have continued to keep my interest because of your genuine interest in the game and in the community with your positive attitude regardless of how much I'm playing Destiny your videos draw me back every time and I just want to thank you for keeping me interested in a community that I have felt like I'm not much of a part of anymore because I don't play. I hope one day I can sit and have a drink with you and pick your brain about content creation and the world space of Destiny and all the amazing things that you've accomplished in your career. Don't ever change who you are man this community loves you
Mandatory D1 Alpha Vet comment who is also a Day 1 Clan Founder & we are still 100 strong a decade later. You hit the nail on the head!! Destiny 1 was only on console & the community was cohesive. Once it was available on PC in D2, but not on Day 1 of D2, the CC's bailed to PC and their content ceased to be really relevant strategically to the bulk of regular players. It is also severed friendships and clans. Of course being able to play where you want, with an enhanced mode and easier ways to stream to CCs made sense, but it no less hurt the community in a huge way. Your points about the really sleezy dudes that were CCs and how unoriginal a lot of their "content" really was, just lazily reading TWABs, etc caused a glut of valueless CC's. ADD addled video styles and unauthenticity spread like Thorn across the Destilands. I have been following you a long time even though I suck at PVP just because you have always been on the up and up on a personal level so I feel good saying I'm a TV follower and that matters to me.
I think destiny going f2p hurt the community a lot. The community started complaining 2x as much and started a trend of wanting stuff handed to them instead of grinding for it. Content creation usually helps and hurts in different ways but mostly helps.
TV, thanks for putting this video together. The message you offer is one that I think most of our country, not just YT, should hear in terms of the political scene now... thoughtful, respectful, and evidence-based debate and conversation is so lacking now and I find it hard to be the guy in the middle ground but that's who I am. Thanks again and I wish you nothing but the best going forward
I’ve watched this happen numerous times. I watched as a similar thing happened with the Call of Duty and Battlefield communities. At the start the creators were a cohesive group and fractured as information seeped out about various content creators private lives. The after effects are always the same as people either stay with the creator or move onto other content. After 15 years of watching and previously creating content on RUclips I have seen both sides of the fence and this part of the ebb and flow of these platforms and communities.
You managed to put to words what I have been felling for a while now. It also seems to me that the intensity level of everything has gone through the roof. Every activity is a sweat fest...lol
I don't think I've ever left a comment on RUclips but you sir, have been inspiring, not just as a great gamer but a great human being. I agree with you wholeheartedly and though I may never catch you in the crucible (you're way above my league 😂), I try to take your advice with me to be a better PVP -er and a better person!🙏
The worst algorithm experience was when my wife told me she wanted a divorce. It came after she inherited an enormous amount of money and can only be described as an ambush divorce that seemingly came out of nowhere. Guess what popped up on Facebook the very next day. Divorce attorney ads. It was salt in a very open wound.
King Goth was streaming Fallout 76 the other day and talked about how great it's community is, someone asked him about the D2 Community and he said it is no longer a solid inclusive community
"money is the root of all evil" it will make or break you if your not responsible with it. Content and Gratitude help you stay humble. Everytime in any industry you only focus on the gains you lose what made you special in the first place. Don't sell your soul stay humble and enjoy my friends 😅 Thanks TrueVan 🤝
I think the one of the most damning thing content creation as a whole did was leak secrets. I love seeing perk breakdowns, opinions on guns and their respective godrolls to chase. I like seeing people take a gun and use it in Crucible. I don't like how we lose the surpise of secret missions, events etc because of leakers. Granted leaking isn't explicitly the fault of content creation, but the cat's out of the bag because of it. I enjoyed the video TV, a good breakdown overall.
at 2:33 this is why i think bungie should go all out on final shape then have us lose to the witness and the game be finished.i know this is a bit extreme but it would be the best possible ending to the final shape
@TrueVanguard : Made it to the end my brother. I wholeheartedly agree. Having seen and ridden this rollercoaster from the early days, it's been a heart wrenching journey watching the downward spiral of things. All the while seeking to remain encouraged and uplifted myself. One thing is for sure. Folks like you, @CoolGuyGames and several others have remained as staple grounding points for me and many others in the vast community. Whether that is for Destiny in it's many iterations, or just gaming and content creation in general. My solemn prayer is that you and all of the truly healthy members of the community will rise to the forefront, and remain a beacon of light in the midst of a whole lot of dark that is seen. Without you guys being present, the darkness truly would prevail! Keep pressing forward my brother, and thank you for all that you do! May your heart stay true, and your tribe increase!
I think that Bungie catering certain aspects of the game towards content creators like with the raid date for TFS. It just feels like a lot of major events are just for content creators and it breeds contempt. I get why that makes sense but it does alienate a portion of your playerbase that feels like a lot of decisions are based on the very, very small minority of the population. The “leaders” of the community have also begged for a lot of decisions that don’t line up with the average player’s opinions and you get a lot of contempt building over time. The tribalism has also turned me off from most Destiny creators as a lot of them can be welcoming until any opinion that isn’t parroted by their favorite streamer and then the attack dogs are released. I do appreciate your honest dialogue on this and many other issues
I don't remember the name of the streamer that was married but was being gross with female content creators. I remember I really liked his stuff and thought he was a great broadcaster. That's high praise from me who's made broadcasting his career for the last 25 years. When we all found out what he was doing, the trust I had in most all content creators died. You TV, along with Fallout and Coolguy, are my trusted circle, and I'm okay with that going forward.
Yes because people care more about hot takes and getting their vid out first than the effect that can have on morale. Peoole just parrot any rumour, good or bad, and think they somehow know better that their unsubstantiated claim is true. Then all this leads to is people being disappointed and starting hate mobs that dont do anything besides give the devs and social media manager a headache and morale drop. Happens all the time, and is an issue that plagues the internet in general, its just much more prevalent and normalized in the Destiny 2 community. Criticism is no longer based on what actually needs to be changed to make something better, its just whatever take gets the most attention.
If I ran a video game company I'd not even have community managers. The Internet is great as everyone has a voice. And at the same time the internet is horrendous because everyone feels the need to share their opinion. Video games were better before the internet when we got demos on disks with magazines. Things peaked with the Dreamcast imo.
I still use the subscription feed and go to channel pages to watch videos, and I feel guilty sometimes because I feel like I'm watching videos 'wrong' and hurting clickthrough rates.
I think a great comparison is skateboarding. There’s a lot of debate on if social media is killing the sport and killing the classic video part. A lot of hobbies feel more driven by views than love of the content itself. Idk
I made it to the end Ryan. This was maybe my favorite video you have made, and I have been watching your content since early D1 days. I even wound up making my own RUclips channel for a different game using your family friendly values as a basis for my own creation. I have always been less interested in the crass or sometimes pompous nature of some creators and I was inspired to see someone become so successful while also maintaining their values. Thank you for sharing your creator journey. It gives a lot of room for thought for how to succeed as a creator moving forward and what some major challenges are that stand in the way of that goal. I have run into Hovey in game, but never you. One of these days, it will hopefully happen. Catch you in crucible!
Different creators have pushed personal agendas getting things nerfed, changing matchmaking, etc. That annoys the pve only and pvp only crowds a creates a rift in the community.
Welp, made it to the end. The tombstone on the strand hunter around 15:30 was great and too many good D1 map clips are breaking my heart! The end of D1 when you had the medallions and could self res instantaneously without the animation or sound, haha. Have some good and bad changes been influenced by Content Creators, absolutely. Has the community gotten better as a whole, I do believe so also. The folks that have stuck it out or taken breaks and come back are genuinely here because they care and have an attachment to the game and community. I'd find it hard to believe that there isn't a committed player that doesn't have at least one streamer they trust and enjoy watching. Content Creators keep me engaged when I'm on my lunch break at work or when my wife is sleeping and I am thinking about playing but maybe played too much that week instead of finishing my house remodel lol. I'd consider myself an average PVP player but even I used to help friends do carries in D1. I wouldn't say I carried much, I was barely positive so not a liability but I guess a character to have on. My experience doing that for almost every Friday night for 2 years was incredible. Raffling a random dad, mom, squeaker, young adult and just talking about life while playing for fun and the self enjoyment of helping someone open that lighthouse chest for their first time. There was nothing more fulfilling to me in D1. BTW my friends that streamed on twich or youtube channels were never paid carries, free raffles. My little experience just being on the stream was educational because you had the fun, you also had to moderate the very few random inappropriate folks dropping lines. Doing that at the same time as playing was not always easy so I have respect for Content Creators that are legitimate honest folks whom I believe to be good characters and have good values. TV/Dramguard (I watch both), Coolguy, Matics, Jake, Fallout and Shadow are my go to's. You keep up the good show. BTW if anyone read this paragraph of reminiscing, my thoughts on Bungie's future is that it's bright and that's honestly how I feel. Remember Halo Reach, end of Bungie era's when they experimented with all the Armor Abilities. With what's coming next season crossing class's and exotics essentially, that's that trial for what's next, just like Halo Reach was. My two worthless cents. Take care
Made it to the end. I think you have great points about how it's not necessarily the creators changing it, but the higher ups forcing their hands to engage differently.
Absolute fire. It starts with us, to be kind and to at least be willing to have the conversations and hear each other out. Super grateful to have had the chance to meet you and really grateful for you using your voice in a way that will hopefully have a positive impact. Great video TV! Hope to game with you sometime soon.
Destiny 1 had a different community and vibe because it was a brand new game and everyone saw the potential. Now we're 10 years in and things are just tiring now. We need a Destiny 3. But will essentially a Destiny 3 that is just Destiny 2 with better graphics and engine and new enemies/story be enough?
A lot of the points you made go well beyond one game or one community. The constant chasing of attention and money fosters an awful state of mind for people and continues to further isolate individuals. TV is dropping some serious nuggets of wisdom ☮&❤
I thought this was really interesting and thought provoking TV. I definitely agree that the way the world is now, division is rife and the community isn't as joined up and unified as it used to be. We see this in politics, TV, hobbies, every day life. It's a shame.
I made it to the end and I agree with you 100%. The current social media landscape has caused a portion of society to stick to their views like their favorite sports team without remotely attempting to understand the viewpoint they are arguing against. Smartphones being so accessible and social media ads being strategically tailored creates insane amounts of confirmation bias and separates sub-communities even further.
What you describe about the shady secrets of other creators is real, but it's not all on you. Companies figured this out a while back, which spawned the emergence of being 'values led'. It's how you respond once you do find out that is important. Plus the upfront due diligence and background checks.
TV i quit during Season of Seraph. I saw the writing on the wall (quality drop), it wasnt anything specific but small things here and there. I was a high level PvE player (not top) but i did my GMs, raids and so on. Even after 1.5 year & 2 big Raids i missed, my RaidTracker has still not dropped (top 30% raider). I raided with LFG, never had a dedicated group. I knew some raid roles very well (some roles even mastered, offering tips to other raiders) & could cover for every role if needed. I never liked the fixed light in Seraph & the proposed Light changes in Lightfall. I did my Bounties every season and used the high light level every to make things easily for myself & my teammates for GMs, Raids, Wellspring etc. You know TV, in GMs, Raids, every high level activity there all sorts of people that enter. And not everyone has the top level gear. And lets not say about people who barely make an effort (i had a few hardcore PvPers who enter long-range GMs with their hc, shotty loadout. I specifically mention GMs because you dont really need comms, just for joking around. So they got the boot. So eventually, the high-level activities, dungeons, raids essentially became BIS (best in slot) or at least serviceable gear. Because me wouldnt be bothered to carry deadweights. Also i always had the position from Season of the Black Armory (for me LFG was really a thing with Arrivals), that i could transition to low-end content, like i used to do back then. No TV, with the story having cracks, i just quit.
I think a large part of it is as soon as any content comes out, it's covered by so many CC's and there's no real...figure things out. Not that that is a bad thing and it's only natural especially in our digital age and a nearly decade old game. But there was definitely something about the mystery of Destiny's first years when it was all new.
I made it to the end. You're not wrong about the island nations of our community. This happened to Halo 2, 3 and Reach. You're right though, individuals coming together, will help our community, if we hear what others have to say.
My experience is pretty telling. Literally discovered, documented and have long supported a type of movement tech that no other big youtuber has ever covered or discovered for themselves. I got decent views and retweets, but not a single big name would respond to me when asking if they wanted to do a feature video on it. Some never finished the conversation but most never answered the messages I sent out 😔
I had a pretty decent sized clan based around destiny 2 that eventually one of my admins was able to take away essentially because I got so beyond frustrated with how Bungie was making everything silver and bright dust and not putting everything in the actual game this frustration I always kept light and I would make jokes but eventually they got their feelings hurt because I would point out the fact that they were contributing to the game being in my opinion worse off. This was a year and a half ago it still makes me sad then I lost my entire destiny community I really loved teaching the raids and hanging out with those guys I feel like I lost a friendship when they left
Made it! That was an interesting foray into your experience throughout the years in Destiny. I've been playing since the D1 beta and had a much different experience and perspective (different console, different gender lol, and not a streamer) but I can still agree on or at least see how your outlook of the game today came into being. Thanks for sprinkling in these deeper thinking types of videos among the more nuts and bolts, but also awesome, gameplay videos and weapon overviews etc. Enjoying all of it!
Made it to the end. It is sad the people who hold the keys to the content we want to consume make more money by pushing other stuff onto us that we may not necessarily want to see. I love watching the creators I like, I like supporting new creators if they're doing something cool. But I don't want things pushed on me, I rarely watch ads or recommend content if it's not someone I already watch. I'm glad you're still here through it all tho TV, much love.
Content Creators that make videos regarding news about the game or weapon reviews or build videos are actually helping the community. Its the ones that specifically only play pvp and stream that offer no value to the community as a whole. Thats why people like Aztecross, Lucky (who used to only do pvp, but switched up), khakis, fallout, datto, etc, are still relevant. Whereas you hardly see guys like Frostbolt and insert any other pvper on RUclips much. Content creation is a benefit to that particular games community because it causes engagement between us. Perfect example: this video. A discussion about content creation. Thats interesting. More interesting and relevant to the community than some guy doing trials carries for a check. We dont care about that. I mean good for them for making money, but they're irrelevant in the grand scheme of the game. Even small time channels that do weapon reviews and build videos are more relevant than a big name streamer playing crucible all day. Edit: i forgot Byf. Who provides in depth lore content on destiny. Without him and that other guy, i forget his name, we wouldnt be as interested in the story and deep lore of Destiny. Again, more relevant as content creators for the community than a pvp streamer. And id definitely say someone that dives that deep into the lore, loves the game way more than someone who just cares about pvp streaming. Any day of any week. Those guys may have map awareness and superior skills, but byf can tell you why that map exists and the story behind the factions that made it. Thats content creation. Cross doing damage testing, thats content creation. True Vanguard asking questions to have a discussion, thats content creation. Khakis with his tutorials and overlong introductions, but very precise step by step instructions and walkthroughs for how to do something... thats content creation. Byf with lore videos. Even Esoterick with his amazing solo god tier gameplay is content creation because it helps you plan out how to get through content. Chablo with his master nightfall strategies. I could go on and on. You get the point.
It definitely did bith good and bad There were people who were "heads" of the community who no longer play, and others who are just a detriment to the game. It's a very nuanced issue imo
As a Dad who can only play for a couple of hours after everyone is in bed I absolutely depend on content creators to narrow down what’s worth farming for or giving me tips on how to get through things solo, etc. And when I’m not able to play I get to live vicariously through amazing dudes like Vanguard and Aztec!
❤ I'm glad you have found a way to keep up with the current community in a fun and entertaining way! ❤
Same my friend
Content creation killed all video game communities. We used to give each other tips, post secrets, etc just for the love of the game. Now it's a job for you folks & while I don't blame anyone for pursuing it as a job, it's 100% a net negative for the game & the players.
Totally agree. RUclipsrs could be creating their own mini communities where people help each other out. Instead it is just fomo and other BS. I absolutely do not need every gun in the game. I've started to watch less and less recently. Only a key couple of people. I enjoy Aztecross for his personality and I hope he keeps playing other titles. And Maven for her rapid delivery of no nonsense builds.
Others only here and there.
Without content creation, EA, Activision, blizzard would run the world.
Indie games are more alive than ever, bad quality is called out, and communities are formed
I don’t agree with this. There are some games where the content creator community is what keeps the game alive (in a good way). While for sure there are content creator communities that are toxic or focused on it too much as a job, there are some communities where content creators make the game and the community around it so much better.
I gotta strongly disagree with this. I would much rather a trusted personality like TrueVanguard review a new game or provide a content walkthrough and make money off it than ever send another cent to a "videogame journalist" whose just another Californian/New York Communist activist trying to ruin my hobbies and call me a bad person for liking Stellar Blade or Warhammer or JRPGs or whatever the American far far left of politics has decided is the problem if the month.
TV directly derives his income from his audience he has good reason to maintain their trust by behaving within an ethical framework, "games journalists" have no ethics whatsoever because their Communists; but they also have no monetaey inscentive as they get paid by a large corporation to generate clicks.
@VinceTenia you absolutely had no reason to bring politics into the discussion, but given the lack of grammar and clear misunderstanding of what communism is, I hope people can choose to ignore your BS.
13:28 thats so illuminating, and also explains why after accidentally tapping a Family Guy clip Reel one time and not backing out immediately I've been bombarded with them for ages.
As with most things in this post-monetization world, the issue is that creators are paid. Large scale content creators (read: full timers) _are not_ community leaders, they are paid talent who have fan clubs. This isn't a bad thing, get paid for what you do! The problem comes when the player community begins to follow what content creators say and do as if it is The Way To Play. Communities begin to centralize on what paid talent say is the thing to do, individual creativity takes a hit, metas begin to show up at accelerated rates and people who dont keep up, can't keep up.
I only really watch TV, coolguy and legoleflash these days. Just wholesome dudes who put out good info on the game they're passionate about 👌😌
Add Aztecross and same
as per your request, i did indeed make it to the end, i could listen to you talk for hours, also, that d1 snippet of one of your montages, one of those trials clips, you did the nghtly (ogs remember) thank you for always staying true to your vanguard :) blessings to you tv :)
I will always maintain that during peak Destiny 1 it had the most inclusive and fun environment to be in. It was ONE big community rather than many small ones. It didn't matter if I was in Krafty's stream, Goth's stream, Hovey's or your stream it still felt like the same community just different areas of it. I would go to a different stream each day of the week and be greeted by name by the streamer and I played with so many of the streamers and content creators and formed friendships that lasts to this day.
That feeling just isn't there anymore. It might be age and I just like to stay in my comfortable lane but in D1 that lane was so wide and included so many people and different experiences. Feel like doing sweats? I knew where to go. Raids? Yup I got that. Trials? Let me check who's on.
To use one of my favorite quotes from one of my favorite movies: "We had all the momentum; we were riding the crest of a high and beautiful wave. So now, less than five years later, you can go up on a steep hill in Las Vegas and look west, and with the right kind of eyes you can almost see the high-water mark - that place where the wave finally broke and rolled back."
"This is bat country!" - Us when we meet the new flying dread in Final Shape.
Even though Destiny 1 had less, it felt like it was more.
Thanks for the thoughtful reflection, TV. It was clear from vanilla D2 that content creation was different than it was in D1. The "lack of endgame content" bemoaned by many creators (IMO) led to broader feelings of resentment among players. High profile abandonments for other games fed the cycle. Coupled with the events you described, the player base felt entitled to trash talk every one and everything about the game. Creators like you and Cammy and Aztecross (who can talk about everything and make it interesting) don't actually rely on the game but their personalities. That's a ramble without a strong conclusion, but a takeaway for me is YES, content creators who had the opportunity to make money and play through content faster than regular folks had responsibilities to foster positive interactions, and they often didn't.
I think Darkside Royalty Lore has hit all of these points phenomenally.
Shhh…don’t say that name…we don’t need him having an excuse to rear his ugly head
Forreal that dude never missed a single point. If he was wrong ever he would have been clapped but he legit never missed . In the heat of battle he don’t miss .
Who?
@@db1872 Darkside royalty lore is a guy that makes destiny content but it’s pure criticism . Because he has predicted every bad choice bungie makes and it all comes to pass . He is like a passionate jaded fan. Like me lol
@@Kyubii01 thank you for that, I'll have to look him up
I'll put it this way, my enjoyment of the games (this one in particular) in the last few years skyrocketed when I stopped participating in the community/watching content creators outside of guides and weapon reviews.
It contributed, especially in the lead into D2. A lot of feedback was given by high profile creators who subsequently deserted the game.
good ole mtash
@@michaelferrarini1463man I forgot about him
It was hilarious when they had Lupo come back to do the QA session after the Osiris debacle. I like Lupo but it was like why are we bringing a Fortnite streamer to ask the questions the community actually needs answers for. It was just peak Bungie management decision.
I appreciate going beyond simple game videos and making context-sensitive layered discussions. More effort but keeps intellectuals like me around longer! Great concept flow and vocal delivery. I think content creation certainly has benefits if you want the interaction and don't want to also manage a friendship or relationship around shared interests. It's great to just be a fly on the wall and heck I usually hide comments and focus on the streamer anyway, unless it's a great community like CB Gray or EpicDan. I've always enjoyed your stuff brother! Also random interjection, I recommend the Flying Cauldron butterscotch soda and vodka for a great weekend 1-2 punch. I know you like your spirits, cheers!
Man, those D1 clips at the end are a blast from the past.
Swear, I miss D1. I miss my beloved Plan C fusion rifle 😢
The first part about having sub communities definitely rings a bell for me, I found several content creators I enjoy watching on here, but the community as a whole just feels so toxic at times and I don’t know why, this was a very good video that I’ll definitely have to rewatch and see if I can’t pay more attention to than I did currently lol
Most content creators are Salt like. Getting Bungo to nerf things into the ground. Ruining the fun for most people, they don’t care about the health of the game. Just the money they can make from it. I don’t even know why Cammy has a career and gets to talk to Bungo devs. Stompees nerf is next level stupid.
@@bannedmann4469 I’ve never heard of cammy advocating for a stompees nerf, the community at large was complaining about stompees and everyone else was saying to look up, I heard more streamer complaining about dunemarchers lightning than stompees
@@Scrappy0794 That’s nice, your personal anecdote is worthless. I know for a fact he did, Cool Guy followed.
Not just this. Social media in general is killing society
I liked that you included clips of your guardian dying a few times. Makes me feel better about my crucible performance also. :)
Wow he showed that old map on mars, with planC and 1000 yard stare gameplay.
Wow...that brought back the feels and memories.
Who remembers buying strategy guides for games back in the day and reading through every single page going through campaign levels, weapons, enemy lore, etc.
My favorite was the Halo 3 strategy guide and it was like 400 pages, explaining in detail EVERY little thing about the game!! RUclips does not compare, especially these days.
I learned a lot from creators and streamers when I first started Destiny. It was a way to enjoy the game two ways, watching and learning and playing. It was amazing! Then for some it became a business and the fun became less important. Some of the streamers I started with not only don’t stream anymore,they don’t even play,at least publicly. I still enjoy playing but the streamers I follow are far fewer and the ones I donate to are even fewer. Keep up the good work.
What do you think the solution to the community division is? Destiny 1 came out the day after my 14th birthday and has been a huge component of who I am ever since then. It’s been painful to watch the community devolve as it has - I’m motivated to help change it, but this obviously isn’t a task any one person can take on
I remember loving to jump into creators streams and just hanging out. Now i barely find any i am willing to just hang out and chat in.
Content creation became a problem when two things started happening. First off, it became all about money, not the fun. A lot, and I mean a LOT, of the big creators have turned to treating content as a cash grab, going so low as to do reaction videos without adding anything etc. Second, its all just a rush to push out as much content day one as possible to beat other creators to the punch. A big reason that after week 5 of a season everything feels dead is because content creators exhausted all their easy ideas week 1 or 2. They need to go back to making content, not expecting the game to just give them content.
Frostbolt, Aztec, Wallah….all of the bigger channels all suck and its clearly for the views and money….especially Aztec…the crazy part is that his beef is so far down that community’s throat that he legit spreads misinformation or can get things wrong for the sake of a speedy release to suck all of the views first and his comment section is either helping and filling in the blanks or just crickets….let that be smaller channels and the toxicity goes way up
Even Mactics is now on some higher than thou flow after bribing his way to a career on youtube and its become a race and battle of the “best” and it really shows in the community of braindead echo chambers.
@@justsomeguy2142 Exactly why I can't stand watching videos by Aztecross anymore. Most of his content seems like the ramblings of a guy who is too sucked into milking the game for profit than someone who actually enjoys playing the game. For real the dude posts like four videos a day every content drop and it's just lazy cut and paste stream clips. Like if I wanted to watch you be boring on stream, I'd watch your stream, but every time I used to tune in he's just silently playing the game with zero audience interaction.
@@justsomeguy2142 Frost and Wallah are on your "they do it for the money" shit list? Like, your go-to shit list content creators are Wallah - one of the best players to ever touch the franchise - and Frostbolt - probably the biggest pubstomper in Destiny? I mean, I get Cross because he's basically just doing reaction content, but those two dudes are OGs and Wallah did this shit for years while he was average less than 200 viewers at 3AM while he was literally the best player in the game. Like, it's their job, sure, but you can still love your job.
@@endlessgl its not like aztec is trash himself, they are good in pvp…but thats all wallah and frost have and can offer….im not one to just outwardly shit on folks but frost is a bot with 0 personality and his content for a while now despite being OG’s is more suited for high school hype beasts….the way they all present their videos, thumbnails and titles are all the same….that would kind of make your standpoint on them being OG’s a negative one because instead of them being who they were and built themselves up to be they are just as shallow and shamelessly trendchasing as the rest of em
For someone who plays nothing but pvp frost cant even tell you crap about optimal weapon performance or creative and good rolls that arent already posted on the web. Him and zk talk and you can hear and tell they dont have extensive knowledge in the game they play. Eventually like frost and wallah watching someone be nice or play with specific weapon loadouts with no other forms of entertainment and personality and flair gets old. I can be nice by myself and be a whole ass vibe you know?
Wallah is just cringe, the dude spent a good chunk of his career crutching ttd warlock because folks like him, frost and aztec all make videos and play pvp around “the meta” and even that gets boring to watch. Different strokes for different folks but i just dont see the novelty in liking frost when hes all about trying to be first to post new weapons (Bungie WTF this is my new FAVORITE weapon!) to then forget all about and not even breakdown the weapon itself because thats it its just one and done….its not up until more info is out on the web that he even follows up on it or something…quite the easy job there
@@justsomeguy2142 This is how I know you know nothing about Wallah. He never mained TTD Warlock. That's Panduh. Wallah almost exclusively played Goldie until Strand came out. He has around 4300 hours in PvP and 3800 of them are on Hunter. I wish people like you actually took the time to learn what they're talking about.
As far as Frost goes, he was an OG from D1. He was a top 10 player in that game and that's where a lot of his following comes from. You claim that him and Zk don't know a lot about the game they play because they don't spew numbers out of their mouths... The fact of the matter is they don't have to worry about that because the people who watch them do so for gameplay reasons. Barely anybody cares about their opinions on weapons, they just want to see some of the best players in the game perform.
I'm not saying you have to like these people or support them, you just have to show people the respect they deserve. It's absurd to dismiss people's hard work just because YOU don't like it or because you don't know anything about them. It's honestly insane how people on the outside of content creation feel about people who genuinely just play a game and upload it.
Great insight TV. Never really thought about it from your prospective or the communities perspective before. Great video! 👍🏻
Can I be honest? Listening about “your origins” has been pretty good! Thanks for sharing 😊
I agree with you 100 percent TV. Yes im also a creator...but the reason I started creating is because I missed the communities from D1. I over, the last two years have created a community called the pond. Its like jakes Jungle. Because hes inspiration of mine. But I know Ill never be as well known as him, but I can still try to make a difference. Im proud of my little community and they've been huge boon to me and to each other. Theyve helped me while ive dealt with cheaters, stream snipers, people being hateful because of my autism, and more recently they've helped me while my dad who is currently in the ICU. I do not know what id do without them. The part that resonated the most with me, is every time ive tried to collab with other creators they are ximming or toxic...which seems to be the norm for smaller creators, and im not big enough for larger creators to even know who I am, so collabing with them is also out of the question. So I too usually avoid collabing. The only two creators I have collabed with and its worked out is a tik tokker named rave and streamer named Jingelhymer. Both are great people! Thank you for the topic Tv... you've been one my favorites and a pillar in this community for years.
The single biggest issue for the community not being where it is…is Bungie dividing the community due to the real world political scheme. Even then it was excusable as long as they were putting out great content. Then Lightfall came, the rest is history. Maybe Final Shape can rejuvenate the community
TV...i always thumbs up my favorite people, and share those videos to my buddies who play, and i always tell people like CoolGuy "thanks for gettin nerdy with it" and say things to you like "YO, YOU NEED TO REVIEW THAT I.W. HARPER 15 YEAR BOURBON ON YOUR DRINKING CHANNEL"..thanks for always being entertaining buddy, and making hitting all your shots easy looking. 👊
Content creation is the best and worst thing for the community I’ve seen. On the one hand are all the things you’ve mentioned, but on the other I feel that the “base” knowledge of your average player has been elevated drastically by the availability of information!
One of the things I struggle as a content viewer, is being able to parse genuine frustration from sensationalism. I try, very hard to avoid sensationalism because consuming it actively effects how willing I am to engage with the "thing." But it is so difficult, thanks to the way YT titles and thumbnails are constructed, to decide what to watch and what to expect sometimes.
I understand impassioned content creators need to be able to express their worries. But it can be difficult to figure out what is genuine and what is a drama-farm. Add in the tribalism and such that you discussed and its super easy to understand why Destiny community content always feels like an absolute minefield at the worst times.
Hey just glad you can stay with us. Thank you and your family for sharing your time here.
I dont think id like the game as much if it werent for content creators like yourself, Cross, Rick K, Heli, Gold Eagle, Maven etc. I had the busiest year of my life recently so I didnt play for 14 months or so but I still watched to stay engaged.
I am here for my heart for making it to the end of the video 😏 I did not know that facebook 3 second thing. It has caused me to have to block soooo many ads lol
I think there is one other issue with content creators - that "love too much" trap.
Ascendant Nomad's video is a great example of that - where iit's easy to fall in the trap of toxicity from being too invested.
I think we are all in uncharted waters as we navigate the internet and how it has changed us and gaming. I’m a new player and your videos are one of the reasons I keep playing, so thank you.
I think a lot of people want to blame someone for a shift in the focus of the game that does not align with theirs, so they blame content creators who have had similar stances.
Sometimes content creators bring awareness of certain issues that the game has to the devs, sometimes its already in the pipeline before the creator makes a video on the topic. I just know that when I started playing the game in D1 vanilla, my idea of where the game was going to progress through was very different than where it has. Even by the time I finished the first season of D1 I realized that my initial thoughts were different. Content creators can reveal truths to the community that some are too stubborn to accept, and sometimes they are simply entertainment to pass time until we can get behind the controls and run through some encounters.
All in all, I think that there was a greater sense of a Destiny community in D1. There was also a lot more youth. The game was young, fresh and new, the players were younger and more optimistic about life in general. Now a decade has passed and the game is now starting to wind down and come to a conclusion of its saga. This makes people reflect more on what it should have been than what it is.
All of the thoughts about where we could be going, are now memories of where we have been, and who we have lost in the process. Much of the pain of the losses is placed towards content creators who made the devs change the game and pushed away their clanmates, fellow guardians and friends. I lost my whole clan, even my twin brother who I started the saga with no longer plays because he is in a cancer battle and doesnt have the strength and will to play, I stream on twitch so he can watch along with me. So, I guess I am a content creator too?
I remember the first video that I saw from True Vanguard, it was a video about the Three Little Words pulse rifle, and the focus on precision. Much of it was on Shores of Time. You were a very small creator, and a big forum member at that time. I remember a lot of the discussions in the forum where the community would talk about encounters, and builds, and developing strategies for the NF's or raids... now the forum community basically trolls and complains, very little constructive conversation there anymore.
Thanks for sticking with it, you are one of the few creators who I feel has just been themselves and tried to increase positivity in the game.
Great video dude! Thanks for your perspective and effort in trying to make the community better for everyone!
i think world in general is rotting and we're just seeing that reflected in the things we do or hobbies we have. Still, makes me really happy to see folks like you address these issues and show other people how great being kind can be. love u TV thanks for all the vids n stuff
hope to catch a live stream one of these days. I'm missing this community.
I made it to the end my friend, and I agree with everything here. It’s sad how divided we are when it comes to, well, anything really but it hurts more in the gaming community. I remember when Witch Queen released and my clan at the time was just running Vow with their inner circle that no one else got a chance to learn the raid until they had done everything in it. So I decided to LFG and I met a really kind group of gamers to run me through it for the first time and it went great! I wish we had more interactions like that, just helping each other grow in a game we enjoy. It was awesome seeing that D1 montage TV, great video 👍.
Top notch video here, TV. Always appreciate your balanced outlook/analysis. Also-great NTB reference. Love your content and thankful to have you in the community!
I don't think it was creators. I think it was bad apples in general. Bad creators make it hard to collaborate, and even harder, the smaller you are because no one big knows you too vouch for you. Bad apples ruin sub communities, like the stuff with a creator's partner last year. The creator did a good job getting rid of their problem, but now they probably struggle to trust others moving forward. The examples are endless. I blame bad apples, ruining everything else for everyone else.
I made it to the end of your video. I won’t plug my channel(s) but I got into attempting content creation from the perspective of potentially using it as a way to help people and spread the love of Christ to those who have less. Destiny 2 was the game that made sense to me as I enjoy playing it a lot. Your content in particular was a big inspiration. I don’t think content creation killed anything, it’s the rampant negativity and toxicity of a lot of people in communities. For the sake of not typing up a novel I’ll leave it there. Good video.
I made it to the end, and as someone who’s played Destiny since Day 1, it’s always been about having fun. No matter the builds and weapons, it was about enjoying a good time with friends. A lot of content creators made it about THEM and their own personal gameplay, not about the tips. I still play the way I want, but I really do appreciate some of the ideas content creators have. But I NEVER looked for a content creator to determine whether I will play or not. Great video!
Hey man this was an awesome video I watched all the way till the end like every other video on this channel and on dram guard. This conversation made me really nostalgic for back in the destiny 1 days. Its crazy to think how whole and happy and supportive the D1 community was with groups like Planet Destiny and all the collaborative twitch streamers. I feel I share a sentiment with most when I say I miss that Community a lot and the feeling of camaraderie being a part of it. Content creators like you have continued to keep my interest because of your genuine interest in the game and in the community with your positive attitude regardless of how much I'm playing Destiny your videos draw me back every time and I just want to thank you for keeping me interested in a community that I have felt like I'm not much of a part of anymore because I don't play. I hope one day I can sit and have a drink with you and pick your brain about content creation and the world space of Destiny and all the amazing things that you've accomplished in your career. Don't ever change who you are man this community loves you
Mandatory D1 Alpha Vet comment who is also a Day 1 Clan Founder & we are still 100 strong a decade later. You hit the nail on the head!! Destiny 1 was only on console & the community was cohesive. Once it was available on PC in D2, but not on Day 1 of D2, the CC's bailed to PC and their content ceased to be really relevant strategically to the bulk of regular players. It is also severed friendships and clans. Of course being able to play where you want, with an enhanced mode and easier ways to stream to CCs made sense, but it no less hurt the community in a huge way. Your points about the really sleezy dudes that were CCs and how unoriginal a lot of their "content" really was, just lazily reading TWABs, etc caused a glut of valueless CC's. ADD addled video styles and unauthenticity spread like Thorn across the Destilands. I have been following you a long time even though I suck at PVP just because you have always been on the up and up on a personal level so I feel good saying I'm a TV follower and that matters to me.
Thank you for this information, I've been wondering where all that GuardianCon related magic had gone
Made it to the end. Some really good points. Thanks for the video.
I think destiny going f2p hurt the community a lot. The community started complaining 2x as much and started a trend of wanting stuff handed to them instead of grinding for it. Content creation usually helps and hurts in different ways but mostly helps.
I don't think you're on the same page as the video, but A for a effort sport.
@Kreau well it's about if content creation hurt the game. Im saying what i think hurt it.
@MrMultiPlatform well it was a double edge sword. It increased numbers but the community got unbearably whiney about everything.
It didn’t.
Bungie hurt d2 stop licking their boots
The coda at the end of this video is fantastic. Thanks for that.
TV, thanks for putting this video together. The message you offer is one that I think most of our country, not just YT, should hear in terms of the political scene now... thoughtful, respectful, and evidence-based debate and conversation is so lacking now and I find it hard to be the guy in the middle ground but that's who I am. Thanks again and I wish you nothing but the best going forward
I’ve watched this happen numerous times. I watched as a similar thing happened with the Call of Duty and Battlefield communities. At the start the creators were a cohesive group and fractured as information seeped out about various content creators private lives. The after effects are always the same as people either stay with the creator or move onto other content.
After 15 years of watching and previously creating content on RUclips I have seen both sides of the fence and this part of the ebb and flow of these platforms and communities.
I've played from the very beginning and was not aware of the existence of any D1 or D2 community.
I feel like we now need a book on the history of the Destiny content creator community.
You managed to put to words what I have been felling for a while now. It also seems to me that the intensity level of everything has gone through the roof. Every activity is a sweat fest...lol
I don't think I've ever left a comment on RUclips but you sir, have been inspiring, not just as a great gamer but a great human being. I agree with you wholeheartedly and though I may never catch you in the crucible (you're way above my league 😂), I try to take your advice with me to be a better PVP -er and a better person!🙏
Dude that D1 montage at the end really hits a soft spot lol.
Miss the days when that was a creator's magnum opus.
The worst algorithm experience was when my wife told me she wanted a divorce. It came after she inherited an enormous amount of money and can only be described as an ambush divorce that seemingly came out of nowhere. Guess what popped up on Facebook the very next day. Divorce attorney ads. It was salt in a very open wound.
CCs have only added to my overall understanding and enjoyment of the game and you’re one of them TV!
I remember fetting destroyed by tou back in D1 trials. Great memories. Good stuff man.
King Goth was streaming Fallout 76 the other day and talked about how great it's community is, someone asked him about the D2 Community and he said it is no longer a solid inclusive community
"money is the root of all evil" it will make or break you if your not responsible with it. Content and Gratitude help you stay humble. Everytime in any industry you only focus on the gains you lose what made you special in the first place. Don't sell your soul stay humble and enjoy my friends 😅 Thanks TrueVan 🤝
I think the one of the most damning thing content creation as a whole did was leak secrets. I love seeing perk breakdowns, opinions on guns and their respective godrolls to chase. I like seeing people take a gun and use it in Crucible.
I don't like how we lose the surpise of secret missions, events etc because of leakers. Granted leaking isn't explicitly the fault of content creation, but the cat's out of the bag because of it. I enjoyed the video TV, a good breakdown overall.
at 2:33 this is why i think bungie should go all out on final shape then have us lose to the witness and the game be finished.i know this is a bit extreme but it would be the best possible ending to the final shape
Been subbed for awhile with minimal notifications, you earned a bell click sir. Great vid 👍
@TrueVanguard : Made it to the end my brother. I wholeheartedly agree. Having seen and ridden this rollercoaster from the early days, it's been a heart wrenching journey watching the downward spiral of things. All the while seeking to remain encouraged and uplifted myself. One thing is for sure. Folks like you, @CoolGuyGames and several others have remained as staple grounding points for me and many others in the vast community. Whether that is for Destiny in it's many iterations, or just gaming and content creation in general. My solemn prayer is that you and all of the truly healthy members of the community will rise to the forefront, and remain a beacon of light in the midst of a whole lot of dark that is seen. Without you guys being present, the darkness truly would prevail! Keep pressing forward my brother, and thank you for all that you do! May your heart stay true, and your tribe increase!
I think that Bungie catering certain aspects of the game towards content creators like with the raid date for TFS. It just feels like a lot of major events are just for content creators and it breeds contempt. I get why that makes sense but it does alienate a portion of your playerbase that feels like a lot of decisions are based on the very, very small minority of the population.
The “leaders” of the community have also begged for a lot of decisions that don’t line up with the average player’s opinions and you get a lot of contempt building over time. The tribalism has also turned me off from most Destiny creators as a lot of them can be welcoming until any opinion that isn’t parroted by their favorite streamer and then the attack dogs are released. I do appreciate your honest dialogue on this and many other issues
I don't remember the name of the streamer that was married but was being gross with female content creators. I remember I really liked his stuff and thought he was a great broadcaster. That's high praise from me who's made broadcasting his career for the last 25 years. When we all found out what he was doing, the trust I had in most all content creators died. You TV, along with Fallout and Coolguy, are my trusted circle, and I'm okay with that going forward.
Made it to the end TV. I appreciate all you do for the community and this video had great opinions.
Yes because people care more about hot takes and getting their vid out first than the effect that can have on morale. Peoole just parrot any rumour, good or bad, and think they somehow know better that their unsubstantiated claim is true. Then all this leads to is people being disappointed and starting hate mobs that dont do anything besides give the devs and social media manager a headache and morale drop. Happens all the time, and is an issue that plagues the internet in general, its just much more prevalent and normalized in the Destiny 2 community. Criticism is no longer based on what actually needs to be changed to make something better, its just whatever take gets the most attention.
If I ran a video game company I'd not even have community managers. The Internet is great as everyone has a voice. And at the same time the internet is horrendous because everyone feels the need to share their opinion.
Video games were better before the internet when we got demos on disks with magazines. Things peaked with the Dreamcast imo.
I still use the subscription feed and go to channel pages to watch videos, and I feel guilty sometimes because I feel like I'm watching videos 'wrong' and hurting clickthrough rates.
Fantastic video sir. This needs to be broadcast to the masses, not just the Destiny 2 community.
I think a great comparison is skateboarding. There’s a lot of debate on if social media is killing the sport and killing the classic video part. A lot of hobbies feel more driven by views than love of the content itself. Idk
I made it to the end Ryan. This was maybe my favorite video you have made, and I have been watching your content since early D1 days. I even wound up making my own RUclips channel for a different game using your family friendly values as a basis for my own creation. I have always been less interested in the crass or sometimes pompous nature of some creators and I was inspired to see someone become so successful while also maintaining their values. Thank you for sharing your creator journey. It gives a lot of room for thought for how to succeed as a creator moving forward and what some major challenges are that stand in the way of that goal. I have run into Hovey in game, but never you. One of these days, it will hopefully happen. Catch you in crucible!
Different creators have pushed personal agendas getting things nerfed, changing matchmaking, etc. That annoys the pve only and pvp only crowds a creates a rift in the community.
Welp, made it to the end. The tombstone on the strand hunter around 15:30 was great and too many good D1 map clips are breaking my heart! The end of D1 when you had the medallions and could self res instantaneously without the animation or sound, haha. Have some good and bad changes been influenced by Content Creators, absolutely. Has the community gotten better as a whole, I do believe so also. The folks that have stuck it out or taken breaks and come back are genuinely here because they care and have an attachment to the game and community. I'd find it hard to believe that there isn't a committed player that doesn't have at least one streamer they trust and enjoy watching. Content Creators keep me engaged when I'm on my lunch break at work or when my wife is sleeping and I am thinking about playing but maybe played too much that week instead of finishing my house remodel lol. I'd consider myself an average PVP player but even I used to help friends do carries in D1. I wouldn't say I carried much, I was barely positive so not a liability but I guess a character to have on. My experience doing that for almost every Friday night for 2 years was incredible. Raffling a random dad, mom, squeaker, young adult and just talking about life while playing for fun and the self enjoyment of helping someone open that lighthouse chest for their first time. There was nothing more fulfilling to me in D1. BTW my friends that streamed on twich or youtube channels were never paid carries, free raffles. My little experience just being on the stream was educational because you had the fun, you also had to moderate the very few random inappropriate folks dropping lines. Doing that at the same time as playing was not always easy so I have respect for Content Creators that are legitimate honest folks whom I believe to be good characters and have good values. TV/Dramguard (I watch both), Coolguy, Matics, Jake, Fallout and Shadow are my go to's. You keep up the good show. BTW if anyone read this paragraph of reminiscing, my thoughts on Bungie's future is that it's bright and that's honestly how I feel. Remember Halo Reach, end of Bungie era's when they experimented with all the Armor Abilities. With what's coming next season crossing class's and exotics essentially, that's that trial for what's next, just like Halo Reach was. My two worthless cents. Take care
Thanks TV, I didn't play D1 so seeing that was cool. Well thought out video.
I made it to the treasure room (d1 clips) at the end....off topic, but I really miss some of these D1 pvp maps
Made it to the end. I think you have great points about how it's not necessarily the creators changing it, but the higher ups forcing their hands to engage differently.
Absolute fire. It starts with us, to be kind and to at least be willing to have the conversations and hear each other out.
Super grateful to have had the chance to meet you and really grateful for you using your voice in a way that will hopefully have a positive impact. Great video TV! Hope to game with you sometime soon.
Destiny 1 had a different community and vibe because it was a brand new game and everyone saw the potential. Now we're 10 years in and things are just tiring now. We need a Destiny 3. But will essentially a Destiny 3 that is just Destiny 2 with better graphics and engine and new enemies/story be enough?
A lot of the points you made go well beyond one game or one community. The constant chasing of attention and money fosters an awful state of mind for people and continues to further isolate individuals. TV is dropping some serious nuggets of wisdom ☮&❤
I thought this was really interesting and thought provoking TV. I definitely agree that the way the world is now, division is rife and the community isn't as joined up and unified as it used to be. We see this in politics, TV, hobbies, every day life. It's a shame.
Made it to the end. Excellent analysis of the landscape. And thanks for the D1 clips at the end :)
I made it to the end and I agree with you 100%. The current social media landscape has caused a portion of society to stick to their views like their favorite sports team without remotely attempting to understand the viewpoint they are arguing against. Smartphones being so accessible and social media ads being strategically tailored creates insane amounts of confirmation bias and separates sub-communities even further.
What you describe about the shady secrets of other creators is real, but it's not all on you. Companies figured this out a while back, which spawned the emergence of being 'values led'. It's how you respond once you do find out that is important. Plus the upfront due diligence and background checks.
TV i quit during Season of Seraph. I saw the writing on the wall (quality drop), it wasnt anything specific but small things here and there.
I was a high level PvE player (not top) but i did my GMs, raids and so on. Even after 1.5 year & 2 big Raids i missed, my RaidTracker has still not dropped (top 30% raider).
I raided with LFG, never had a dedicated group. I knew some raid roles very well (some roles even mastered, offering tips to other raiders) & could cover for every role if needed.
I never liked the fixed light in Seraph & the proposed Light changes in Lightfall.
I did my Bounties every season and used the high light level every to make things easily for myself & my teammates for GMs, Raids, Wellspring etc.
You know TV, in GMs, Raids, every high level activity there all sorts of people that enter. And not everyone has the top level gear. And lets not say about people who barely make an effort (i had a few hardcore PvPers who enter long-range GMs with their hc, shotty loadout. I specifically mention GMs because you dont really need comms, just for joking around. So they got the boot.
So eventually, the high-level activities, dungeons, raids essentially became BIS (best in slot) or at least serviceable gear. Because me wouldnt be bothered to carry deadweights.
Also i always had the position from Season of the Black Armory (for me LFG was really a thing with Arrivals), that i could transition to low-end content, like i used to do back then.
No TV, with the story having cracks, i just quit.
Been wondering this for a while now. Can’t wait to listen in.
I think a large part of it is as soon as any content comes out, it's covered by so many CC's and there's no real...figure things out. Not that that is a bad thing and it's only natural especially in our digital age and a nearly decade old game. But there was definitely something about the mystery of Destiny's first years when it was all new.
Loved those closing thoughts, man, and appreciate you bringing your thoughts to our attention. Lots to think on, good stuff.
18:03 I am so traumatized by youtube I literally thought you were segueing into a Division 2 ad lmao
I made it to the end. You're not wrong about the island nations of our community.
This happened to Halo 2, 3 and Reach.
You're right though, individuals coming together, will help our community, if we hear what others have to say.
My experience is pretty telling. Literally discovered, documented and have long supported a type of movement tech that no other big youtuber has ever covered or discovered for themselves. I got decent views and retweets, but not a single big name would respond to me when asking if they wanted to do a feature video on it. Some never finished the conversation but most never answered the messages I sent out 😔
I had a pretty decent sized clan based around destiny 2 that eventually one of my admins was able to take away essentially because I got so beyond frustrated with how Bungie was making everything silver and bright dust and not putting everything in the actual game this frustration I always kept light and I would make jokes but eventually they got their feelings hurt because I would point out the fact that they were contributing to the game being in my opinion worse off. This was a year and a half ago it still makes me sad then I lost my entire destiny community I really loved teaching the raids and hanging out with those guys I feel like I lost a friendship when they left
I made it to the end my friend. ❤ I agree with ya on all the points there, you made perfect sense.
Made it! That was an interesting foray into your experience throughout the years in Destiny. I've been playing since the D1 beta and had a much different experience and perspective (different console, different gender lol, and not a streamer) but I can still agree on or at least see how your outlook of the game today came into being. Thanks for sprinkling in these deeper thinking types of videos among the more nuts and bolts, but also awesome, gameplay videos and weapon overviews etc. Enjoying all of it!
Thank you for your thoughts listening to you and your true opinions oftentimes make me not feel so alone in this world
Made it to the end. It is sad the people who hold the keys to the content we want to consume make more money by pushing other stuff onto us that we may not necessarily want to see. I love watching the creators I like, I like supporting new creators if they're doing something cool. But I don't want things pushed on me, I rarely watch ads or recommend content if it's not someone I already watch.
I'm glad you're still here through it all tho TV, much love.
Quality over quantity all day long. Honesty is underrated and you're always honest.
Content Creators that make videos regarding news about the game or weapon reviews or build videos are actually helping the community. Its the ones that specifically only play pvp and stream that offer no value to the community as a whole.
Thats why people like Aztecross, Lucky (who used to only do pvp, but switched up), khakis, fallout, datto, etc, are still relevant. Whereas you hardly see guys like Frostbolt and insert any other pvper on RUclips much.
Content creation is a benefit to that particular games community because it causes engagement between us. Perfect example: this video. A discussion about content creation. Thats interesting. More interesting and relevant to the community than some guy doing trials carries for a check. We dont care about that.
I mean good for them for making money, but they're irrelevant in the grand scheme of the game. Even small time channels that do weapon reviews and build videos are more relevant than a big name streamer playing crucible all day.
Edit: i forgot Byf. Who provides in depth lore content on destiny. Without him and that other guy, i forget his name, we wouldnt be as interested in the story and deep lore of Destiny. Again, more relevant as content creators for the community than a pvp streamer. And id definitely say someone that dives that deep into the lore, loves the game way more than someone who just cares about pvp streaming. Any day of any week. Those guys may have map awareness and superior skills, but byf can tell you why that map exists and the story behind the factions that made it. Thats content creation. Cross doing damage testing, thats content creation. True Vanguard asking questions to have a discussion, thats content creation. Khakis with his tutorials and overlong introductions, but very precise step by step instructions and walkthroughs for how to do something... thats content creation. Byf with lore videos. Even Esoterick with his amazing solo god tier gameplay is content creation because it helps you plan out how to get through content. Chablo with his master nightfall strategies. I could go on and on. You get the point.
It definitely did bith good and bad
There were people who were "heads" of the community who no longer play, and others who are just a detriment to the game.
It's a very nuanced issue imo