DON’T Choose By BRAND Name…
HTML-код
- Опубликовано: 29 ноя 2024
- What is the right way to choose an oil? Well, it doesn't start with choosing a brand name. Instead, the application will dictate the chemistry needed. A 750 HP race engine needs a racing oil, not a passenger car oil or diesel oil. A non-synchronized transmission needs a different fluid than a synchronized transmission does, especially if it has brass synchronizers. A hypoid rear gear may or may not have a limited slip differential, which impacts the choice of chemistry needed (limited slip differentials need a limited slip gear oil). As you can see, each of these applications requires a different chemistry, and none of these decisions begin with a brand name.
In this video I'll show you how I choose the engine oil, transmission fluid and gear oil for my Dad's vintage NASCAR race car. He's 76 years old and the engine makes over 750 horsepower, so I have to get these choices right. After making these choices, we will go to the racetrack and see how the car runs. Plus, we will see how much difference a smaller carburetor makes in terms of average lap time!
Here's one of the best FREE resources on lubricants: petrocanadalub...
For help choosing a viscosity grade, check out page 36 of the Driven catalog: drivenracingoi...
To get started with used oil analysis, check out: www.speediagno...
Want a Tribology T-Shirt? Check out the STLE spreadshop: stle.myspreads...
(I do not benefit from this financially, but I'd love to see fans of this channel support STLE)
Who is the Motor oil Geek? I'm a Society of Tribologists and Lubrication Engineers Certified Lubrication Specialist and Oil Monitoring Analyst (I've maintained both of those for over a decade). I also worked for Joe Gibbs Racing for 12 years as their lubricant specialist. During that time, we worked with Wix Filters (one of our sponsors) to test and develop filters for our race engines. We also worked with Lubrizol and Chevron-Phillips Chemical to test and develop oils for our race cars. Following that, I was the head of R&D for Driven Racing Oil. During that time, I formulated and tested over 50 products. We also worked with Cummins, Comp Cams, Oak Ridge National Labs and General Motors on various R&D products. Those efforts are recorded in peer reviewed white papers published by SAE International and ACS Sustainable Chemistry journals. I also own and operate SPEEDiagnostix, which provides used oil analysis.
#oilchange #motoroil #oilfilter #engine #syntheticoil #oilanalysis #gearoil #transmissionfluid
![The ULTIMATE Air Filter Test [Engineer Tested]](/img/1.gif)
Thank you for watching! This community of folks who are interested in oil continues to blow me away. To watch Dad wheel that race car, check out this video from Stapleton42: ruclips.net/video/W1uZCiY2hNQ/видео.htmlsi=8okFpETmEQ_s1fnp
Thank you for making these helpful useful informative videos. Over years I have been arguing with people over oil specs and brands due to variables and differences between all aren’t all made the same. All the videos you made has helped a lot to help people understand where I am coming from.
@themotoroilgeek. Advice please - My Toyota Yaris CVT really recommends their genuine Toyota CVT FE but could i use Valvoline CVT fluid for example? Or even maybe a real good name brand CVT fluid? Toyota price is £70 for a 5L bottle here in the UK, good thing my CVT uses 2.2L each drain. 😀
Whats the4 best oil to use for a 2015 Chevy ss stock engine 6lt with DOD or AFM system, please, i am using the new dexos 1 gen 3 licenced oil it it better than dexos 1 gen 2 oil, imo dexos 1 gen 3 licensed oil it far better. cheers would like your opinion in these facts.🦘👌✌
So basically your dad used mineral based oils all the time, till oil manufacturers started to make synthetic oils and hi friction and other additives in those oils, cheers, so all oils pre 1990's were mineral based with moly and other basic friction additives in the oils like zinc, i know because i worked for WYNNS and if you look at old elvis movies when he is in the race car you can see wynns stickers all over the race car and it all started the additives around the world meaning wynns did? 😎👍🦘👌✌
Lake mate, your not using the diff oil and manual transmission oil together, the diff oil is totally separate ,but i get what your doing, the manual transmission has more gears than the diff has thus will get hooter, but in saying that both will have external coolers attached which you do not mention especially a race car like your dads? 🦘🦘👌👌
I love the information about the oil but your pops driving a 700 horsepower car on a NASCAR track at 76 is 100% inspiring
And nerve wracking!
That was brilliant. I learned more about lubricants in 25 minutes than I have in 30 years.
Thanks!
Watch the rest of his videos, not only here but other sites as well. He's a oil guru!
Thanks.
I feel old, have just turned 70. Hearing about your father doing that at 76 is absolutely fabulous!
You're the only expert in this space who admits, openly, that oil companies are separated more by their marketing budgets than their product's performance. Kirkland oil meets the manufacturer's spec for all three of my vehicles and the cost is unbeatable when it goes on sale about every 4-8 months.
Thanks! I'm here for the viewers.
Remember to do oil analysis to see if the Kirkland works best for your engine.
Application dictates chemistry.
Some oils are better for different application.
@@themotoroilgeekbecause of you sir. I have recommended Valvoline restore. I let them know how good the oil is.
I don't put additives in my oil.
I see people buying the magic potion ...........to their oil and ask me, would I buy this? I say no.
You are putting a very flammable product in your oil. Instead of buying the can, you might as well put a can of gas into your oil. It's that flammable. That why you can add it to your gas tank too.😂😂😂
@@iFanchiyes
@@iFanchi just change more frequently for the money you save on analysis :P
Simple for me - I use the manual since I don’t have anything modified. I’m easy on the equipment since I typically drive the roads, keep engine hot, and usually cut my intervals in half of factory recommended OCF, and go early on trans, diff and transfer case (where applicable). Same with coolant. No issues with performance or “burning” oil in any of my vehicles which all have well in excess of 130k miles. My brand is whatever is on sale that is approved for the particular vehicle. Works for me. Great channel.
😂The oil actually far exceed what we need for daily driving. So, yeah, you absolutly right.
God bless your dad. Amazing 76🎉
Thank you!
Perfect timing for this video as I’m trying to figure out what to use in my 5MT 2002 WRX. These boxes are reputedly fragile. And, it’s been abused: I can’t engage first if even creeping. Plenty of home-brew blends posted on forums…a fair few followed up by, ‘yeah, it grenaded within 10k miles’.
I really appreciate the common sense, data-driven straight talk presented here
Thanks!
I love that you showed the results from the carburetor swap too. It just goes to show that mo’ powah ain’t always mo’ bettah. I know way too many people that just want to buy the biggest turbo, the biggest cam, etc. but don’t understand the relationship between power, top speed, drivability, and lap times is often a delicate balance and increasing power or top speed does not always mean faster lap times.
The fact you don’t have many subscribers shows how little people understand the importance of oil in an engine !
The amount of money one spends in a lifetime , to be able to travel should have you in the millions of subscribers !
Exactly
He gets loads of views; way more than many channels with more subscribers.
True relative to ChrisFix or other large RUclips channels, however acquiring over 100,000 subs is not easy and a relatively large channel, especially for a niche topic.
Or people don’t overthink it and just use what owners manual says 😂 That’s exactly what he says in this video lol. That’s still not going to stop oil fanboys to ask what oil to use 😂
The average person doesn't need to know the science behind motor oil. They only need to know to check the owner's manual for what type of oil to use.
Hi Lake, GM used to have its own branded Posi-traction gear oil it was green and it stunk so bad if you got it on your clothes just through them away! At the track you could always smell it about mid race and they used to call it SKUNK PISS , alot of sulfur I guess! Never did you have posi clutch chatter! Great show Lake, Dad looks good! Gotta keep movin!👍👍
This information about oil and mechanics should be an entire separate requirement for ASE cert.
Considering the change of how engines operate, the materials and specs engines are redesigned and designed, in the last 30 years, this wisdom is a MUST.
Especially about the FT lifter issue that have been occurring in the last 15 or so years.
It’s very interesting in its sciences and related engine/mechanical machining which cooperates with newer oil technology.
You’re a stand-out in A league by yourself sir!
Thank you for your wisdom ALL us guys do appreciate.
Thank you!
Lake, the info you feed us is absolutely gold. Thanks for the time and effort you put into all this!!!
My pleasure!
I'm 74 and mostly past the point where I am concerned about this as much I used to be, with some exceptions. This video was fun, informative, and brought back memories. Thanks.
I binge watched most or all your videos. Owning a car equipped with a possibly weak/sensitive engine, I became obsessed with finding/using the best oil/filter combo and transmission fluid. I always felt channels that covered that topic were un-scientific and were speculating on test results and visual cues.
I can’t believe how fantastic it is to benefit from your knowledge, experience and enthousiasm. Thank you so much!
Love it, Lake. You have the best oil channel, period!!!
Wow, thank you!
Thanks Lake and we pray for a safe and successful race for the Speed team!
My son raced motocross for years. Engines that delivered the power more effectively throughout the rev range were almost always faster on the track than the ones that had more HP and were hard hitting. So it's not surprising the older carb made for faster lap times. It's also worth noting how much work you had to do just to get to the point where your could go see how well the car ran on the track. Same in motocross or any form of motorsports racing I'm sure. Would have loved to see Lake Speed run some more laps, but thanks for the video nonetheless!
Having watched many of your videos, it's changed my way of thinking. I went from adding zinc to oils for my old flat tappet Jeep 4.0. Your zddp needs to be seen by the older car guys and I spread it all over the Jeep page when Oil comes up. Never thought you could have too much zddp until now.
I asked for a gear lube review and you delivered.
Hoorah ❕ for gear lubes👍 Thank you you Lake Jr. I'm 73, Near Loudon, NH 🏁
I saw your username and knew exactly why you requested this. I also own a John Deere tractor with several attachments.....gear oil....gear oil.....gear oil.....which one do I use?
You are welcome!
Absolutely LOVE your videos. I would appreciate some trans fluid advice. I have a Tremic TKO that has carbon fiber synchros installed and am using Tremic fluid. Shifting takes a lot of effort, like the synchros are not releasing enough to let thi go line up. Do you have a fluid recommendation? Thanks
greetings from Mississippi myself! It’s always nice to see a fellow MS member repping the state with knowledgeable and useful information and a great channel! I have an 1996 BMW 328i that’s stock so I put exactly what they say although it sounds a little bit too high at 15W-40, like you said, the engineers already did the work for me.
I switched to Pennzoil Ultra Platinum in my 3 Valve Mustang and it was a noticeable difference in how quiet the valvetrain was on a cold start.
Same with the 5.0 in my F150. That typical "typewriter" noise was cut in half after using Pennzoil Ultra Platinum 10w-30. Great oil!!
I used the Valvoline gear oil bag. They do make the job much easier.
I've used them too it's really a blessing. I believe Amsoil has the bag as well.
Same. Good price point too
Glad you touched on Synchromesh. I usually like running just a slighly higher viscosity in my manual transmissions to help smooth out the synchros but can't on my Jeep JK. But it seems to be working fine with the thin stuff.
I appreciate you oil test on the GP-1. My TJ 4.0 has never ran this good that I’ve owned it. I truly believe in ZDDP oil now.
Brands do matter, it's just that Specifications come first, then lab testing to make sure you are using the right lubricant for your application, and then choosing the right brand to deliver on the best quality to meet the specifications you need and the demands that application call for in a proper high performance matter. You can "meet" a specification and you can "exceed" a specification and the brand is what makes the difference. Some just care to "meet" it while others want to "exceed" it.
Great way to do things. I can for sure say the right gear oil helps a ton in a transmission. I got a "ran when last parked" motorcycle around a decade ago, was a moto guzzi with the dry clutch so the transmission was more of a dog box style. The transmission oil was..... well it could have been older than me, but I just had horrible shifts. The worst. after getting it running better I swapped the oil out and it was like a whole new shifting experience. of course I just used some rear gear oil since the manual called for 75-90 conventional agip oil which isn't easily procured here.
Heck I am used to seeing old japanese motorcycle manuals talking about how you can use oil from 10-40 up to 20w-50 depending on application/temperature. It's always a hotly discussed topic for wet clutch motorcycle engines on what shears quicker and shifts better/worse over time.
Amazing to see an 80 w syncromesh oil viscosity be almost 1/2 a 75-90 gear oil.
$200k + race car, tons of dyno time, oil analysis and tons of testing, so million plus overall. $0.50 lamp cord end to pre-heat the oil, yep, sounds about right!
What a terrific video, getting real answers from a real expert! Thank you so much!
IMO, this was one of your best videos yet. Thanks for sharing this info.
Thanks!
I have been watching Russian Oil Club for years, and all this time I couldn’t understand how there isn’t a similar channel in the land of the free. Those guys have been testing Western oils for well over a decade on RUclips.
And finally! Here it is!
Lake, you need to start with some motorcycle oils, beginning with Harley-Davidson. What is the absolute best oil for an air-cooled Harley? Nobody knows. U gonna have the whole country watch that one )
Also If You cold help me understand. Why 80-90s Mercedes cars use Dextron 2/3 in the rear end per OE shop manual? And why later cars and Daimler semi trucks use 75/85 vs 75/90? Whats uo with that?
I used to be friends with a Highway Tractor mechanic who was the head of transmission and differential repair and service.
We discussed oils in this service he said that the then new breed of transmission and said in some models 10W-30 was good. He switched his VW manual over to either 10W30 or ATF which is what he said was the new factory recommended for (synchromesh).
For average use not for racing.
Back around 1960 there was individual grades 75 80 90 with 140 for the differential in farm tractors. Looked and poured like Bunker Oil.
Like the trans fluid 'debates' with '90s era Honda manual transmissions - people will run ANYTHING in them, engine oil, synchro MTF, ATF, gear oil. Nice shifting transmissions though, they'll work fine with about any of them, but the GM synchromesh w/ friction modifier seemed to get the most positive reviews(at least all those years ago when I had a '90s Honda lol).
@@RyTrapp0 Some oils you wouldn't think are similar actually cross reference in certain applications.
150 Hydraulic fluid is a comparative 40 GL4 and used in speed reducers and large air pumps. So you could use that as well.
So the fragrance of gear oil, AKA mechanic's cologne, is sulfur. I learned something today. I have sniffed a fair amount of S, but never made the connection. Must be an organic sulfur compound in gear lube. I enjoy hearing about lubricant chemistry. It would be nice to get just a little more information, like what kind of sulfur compound, what form of Mg, etc., kind of like the treatment Zn got in this video. As someone with maintaining 1960's manual transmissions, it's nice to see the mechanic's perspective on syncro rings.
Sulfer actually smells extremely bad like rotten eggs on it’s own id say it’s definitely not the smell of a mechanic oil smell.
Yes 👍🙌, I agree with you because since I have a high mileage (HM) engine a engine with 114K mileage my application required 5W-20 but, that is when my engine was newer now, it is over 75K when I need a top off I need to use for my application 5W-30 to reduce oil consumption. My transfer case in my SUV 🚙 requires GL4 or GL5 and rear differential fluid on a Honda you have to use Honda fluid. It has to say Honda VTM-4 Differential Fluid the GL4 or GL5 is transfer case fluid which is a totally different type of fluid. 🙂
No, you don't "need" genuine Honda if it calls for GL4 OR 5 that's regular gear lube probably 80W90.
The thing about thicker oil is that is determined by tighter tolerances in your bearings.
Yes, AWD vehicles have a lot of different types of gear oil.
@@oneninerniner3427 The Honda rears need the OEM VTM-4 (Or Honda Dual Pump Fluid) for their unique limited slip system.
Great information. I will apply this to my new MT-82 trans. The new has carbon fiber synchros polished gears 1 thru 4 , The current MT-82 has 70k miles and is behind an 890hp crank hp engine, every bearing in this old trans is making noise. Lol, but still shifts perfect , I use BG oils in it. Keep the vids coming.
Great way to start my Saturday morning
Thanks for tuning in!
Lake,
Great videos and information regarding lubricants, rings, and engine dyno work. I have a question....you've made a few videos on how the total seal gapless ring increases power because it reduces blow-by. Have you ever done a video where you dyno a stock engine w/ factory rings and factory specified engine lubricants vs. an engine with the gapless rings + speed of air pistons + high performance lubricants? I would be interested to see the power increase [horse power & torque] & how clean the oil stays after several hundred [or thousand miles] w/ load. Thanks
Great suggestion!
It is not very often we get to see/hear/read any intelligent discourse about vehicle lubricants. I am just a little too excited, here, and posting my question just halfway through your video:
Have just had a Detroit Truetrac helical gear-type limited slip installed in my 1/2 ton pickup, along with a new ring and pinion, all new bearing and seals.
Since the Truetrac diff does not use any friction materials/clutches/springs and consists mechanically of only straight-cut side gears and helical-cut pinion gears we are told NOT to use any friction modifiers. This, I understand completely. In fact, it is also suggested by EATON to not use a synthetic! and to use only a mineral gear oil, and in the viscosity specification for the axle it is installed in, this case being 80W-90.
My installer used 85W-140 mineral for the 500-mile ring-and-pinion's break-in, which I am currently doing. When this is over and we change the gear oil I wish to use the factory specification 80W-90, but I also tow a very small, light trailer. May I create a viscosity blend? using 1 part 80W-90 and 1 part 85W-140 to create an 82.5W-115? Either way, a mineral GL5 is all that I know to use. Thank you for your time and for a great video. I will wait to post this comment and question until I have watched your entire video. Cheers.
Yes, you can blend the two as long as they are the same spec from the same manufacturer.
Custom viscosity blends FTW!!!@@themotoroilgeek
How else is a fella supposed to get 10w40 VR1 in Canada 😅 (lucky Aussies get all kinds of VR1 viscosities we don't, 10w40, 15w50)
I love the old lamp cord for the oil warmer.
Being able to get on the gas sooner in slow corners is worth more than a few mph down the straight. A little more top end will get you three tenths around the track, but great throttle response can gain you that in 3 corners, and VIR has a lot of corners. It's even more impressive if it's the full course.
We never hit the rev limiter with the big carb on the full course, but we did with the small carb...
Wow, look at those gear ratios (1.50, 1.23, 1.00, .88)! Talk about close ratio!! Yet, on a track like VIR, one cannot have a numerically high (4.11, 4.88 or short) rear gear and still hit potential max top speed without massively over-revving the engine, hence the huge clutch dump burnouts getting out of the pit box under race conditions with all that added stress on making those tall rear gears last.
Again, great information, Lake; it all depends on application and using your head. And yes, there are those of us who still miss the real “Speed Racer” on the track; good to see your Dad in such fine fettle.
As for me, I’ll take drive-ability over top speed/high horsepower every time. I can be hard on the throttle apex off and not lift as I drift out to the wall; they have to try and catch me, especially if I take a “defensive” line going into the next corner. And, with drivability, I can usually cross-over, get inside position, and the fun is on. Did that for a few years quite successfully in a very underpowered Mustang II. Bummer that the closest I can get to my version of a track day (and have a vague remembrance of what being on the track was like) is hoping there is no one in front of me on the highway on-ramps. Still scare the wife every time I get close to those Jersey barriers and I’m still sawing a bit at the wheel.
Nice eye for those details!
Track day here in the hills is driving 15 miles for breakfast.👍👍😎
Lots of signs say 40 or 35 corners.
LAKE and others: In this video you touched on one of the things I have struggled with for years having to do with oil viscosity. I feel, and tell me if I'm wrong, that manufacturers recommend the thinest oil possible that will maximize fuel economy over engine wear/life as long as the life is "reasonable" in their mind. I on the other hand dont give a rats butt about 1 or 2 mpg at the expense of a $70-80k vehicle. It is better value to me to make it last as long as possible and pay a couple dollars more in fuel along the way. What I do care about is the cost to clean/repair/replace $20k emmission control systems. When you look at the allowable viscosity charts in the owners manual it recommends viscosity based on ambient temps you will be operating in from lets say 5w-30 to 15w40 or higher. HERE'S MY POINT: When the engine is full hot it is always at the same known temp and you want the thicker viscosity right? So in the case of my 2023 Sprinter van with 2.0l OM654 4cyl diesel they recommend the thinnest 5w-30. I want to run 40 and do. I know that the "40" is what the oil becomes when full hot and not the true base oil wt which in my case is a 5 wt oil.I feel the the 5wt is the more important for cold start in the winter climate in which I live(NY) so I use a 5w-40 oil. Now that brings up another issue. Ive always been taught that you want the closet spread ( lowest amount of vicosity modifiers) possible so I would love to use a 15w-40 but that would destroy the emission systems because these oils are not formulated for their longevity, not approved by manufacturer and will void the warranty. And then I wonder if a 15 wt oil is just too thick for the tight tollerences (especially when new) because the engine was designed for 5w-30 in mind. Am I over thinking this? For the moment I have settled on Motul 8100 x-clean 5w-40gen2 over Mobil1 ESP 5w-30 that I started with as its one of the few aproved 5w-40 oils on MB's approved fluids list that is reasonably available to me. Temps in my operating area range normally from 10F-95F and I have a stand alone diesel fired coolant block/oil heater active at 42F and below which I use religiously. Am I wrong on the 5w-40 vs 5w-30 thing? Any recommendations? - THANKS
I'd rather replace a cat than replace an engine. You're mostly correct in that corporate average fuel economy (CAFE) requirements carry a good bit of weight with OEMs. The difference between a 0W-20 and 5W-30, of the same brand/chemistry, in terms of fuel economy is -1.0% at the very most. Realistically, it's closer to -0.5% in most cases once at operating temperature. To put that in perspective, with a car that gets 35.0 mpg with 0W-20, it'll get 34.8 mpg with a 30 grade. From the OEM perspective however, a +0.5% improvement in fuel economy is considerable for CAFE when we're talking about 100,000+ vehicles sold.
The increase in viscosity recommendation with higher ambient temperature from OEMs isn't wrong to follow, but just to note, I've been doing oil analysis and testing for many years, and the biggest difference I've seen in operating oil temp between 20°F and 100°F ambient is just +11°F. Most engines are just 7-10°F difference. In reality, the oil doesn't care much about ambient temp when it's surrounded by 200°F coolant, passing through 250°F bearings, and splashing on 450°F cylinder walls. In fact, I've frequently seen a bigger increase in operating oil temp going to a higher viscosity oil than caused by higher ambient temp just due to increased fluid friction from the higher viscosity. In any case, the temperature has stayed within normal ranges. The OEMs have to assume a worst case scenario hence the recommendation for higher viscosity as a CYA. If you use decent oil and not some off-brand gas station oil, this is largely a non-factor. All of this said, heat isn't necessarily your enemy depending on the application. Some race oils, for example, are formulated in such a way that they don't even see peak friction coefficient until 300°F, much less thermal breakdown.
You don't want to use a 15W-40. Many believe that a narrower spread means a more stable oil in terms of shear and heat which has some merit. The problem is many of the oil companies (the majors in particular) know that too and use it as an excuse to formulate that oil with cheaper, more volatile, and less stable base oils and additives that'll still meet the minimum spec. A 15W-40 is very commonly treated this way. Sadly, engineers at the major oil companies are more often tasked with finding ways to save 3 cents/gal on production cost over improving the product. You don't see this much with boutique blenders as they formulate to a performance point rather than a price point.
@@almizzyracing8004 I hear what youre saying but the CAT on these new diesels is not just some can in line down the exhaust pipe that you just cut off and slap a new on in. And what Im more concerned about is the DEF after treatment system whinch can be vary finicky. At any rate these systems are now packaged up along the side of the engine up inside the engine compartmentright there with the turbo and EGR and everything else. It's a cluster F"*k. I change the oil more than I need too and if I could only at least delete the EGR and DEF I would feel better.
"tight tolerances" is a myth. Engine's have never had "loose tolerances".
Luckily I ran into the GL-4 vs 5 issue from a Miata where it made a considerable difference in shift quality and was easily remedied with a fluid change.
I never believed it could make that big of a difference and it brought me to learn about the issues with brass parts in older transmissions too likely saving a couple older 3 speeds I'd have otherwise used my cheaper GL5 fluid in that isn't GL4 compatible
Yeah, the Nissan D21 pick-ups HAVE to have the GL-4 lube or the brass synchros will eat themselves! Watch for this people! 😳 I personally know at least one person that killed his Nissan trans by filling it with that damn GL-5! 😳
Your dad is going strong, don't let him over do it! My father (former Ford Engineer) is 99 and fully cognitive and still hanging in there. Lake, one item not covered. How often to change a manual transmission lube? I've got an Austin Healey Sprite with a Datsun 210 5 speed conversion. After experimenting with different gear lubes I finally found Nirvana with Redline's MT. I don't put many miles on this car. Less than 500 miles a year. How often must it be changed?
I discovered that Motul makes a 75W-90 GL4/GL5 gear oil that can be used in both a hypoid differential and in a synchromesh transmission and that's what I've been using for the last several years in my Nissan 370Z. I believe that Motul is using EP additives other than sulfur and phosphorus that are so corrosive to brass, aluminum and copper.
I also did early oil changes in the transmission and diff when the car was breaking in and swept the bottoms of the cases with a magnet to get as much of the steel particles out as I could.
No GL5 for synchros
Thanks for sharing! Motul makes some great products, so this is not surprising.
I am not surprised that people look for ways to get GL5 without as much sulfur. Subarus have a hypoid gear in their synchronized manual transmissions. As a result, many gear oil companies cater to the WRX/STI guys.
those bags are awesome when working at a shop that works on all kinds of different stuff, usually if the gear oil i need comes in a bag and i have enough room i dont even bother with the fluid pump i have
Agreed - I have a used bag saved for adding fluids that don't come bagged (Honda VTM , etc)
I’ve used synthetic for the last 24 years. Just because Mobile 1 was the first (or one of the first) I started with and have continued in my vehicles.
In 2000 had a ‘99 GMC 5.7 Chevy. Don’t recall if it was 5w or 10w-30. All highway miles and about 100,000 miles per year . Changed it every month or about 10,000 miles. Used either an AC Delco-Gold or a premium Bosch that had much better filtration. Something like 90% single pass at 5-10 microns and 99% multi pass. Got 421,000 miles before the transition failed. Engine was using just under a qt at 10,000 miles. Also put synthetic in the rear end.
What is a transition
I'll check on those filters.👍
I think a lot of people may not realise with OCI’s is how quickly they fall into severe service and are not servicing often enough. Owners manual is a good place to check.
Audi started using 0W20 in the 2.0 TFSI EA888, 3rd Gen from 2018 onwards. But the same engine took 5W40/5W30 Euro spec. Some worry that this is due to the government demanding better fuel economy. That's a big drop in HTHS!
Mopar did the same but changes where made
Indeed. I had a 2017 GTI which called for 5W-40 and never had issue with burning oil or anything sticking with 5K OCIs or every 2 track days, whatever came first.
I also worked as an Audi technician and I did see quite a few burning oil, with Audi claiming 1L per 1000 miles being acceptable.
few questions?
video maybe?
1. about switching oil from mineral to synthetic in old engine, are ONLY seals problem? what will happens to soft to hard what type do what and why not mix two base types synthetic oils (one makes to hard and second too soft)
2. changing viscosity for higher number than producer suggest. less wear? higher fuel consumption? higher temperatures? less power? better/worse rings seal?
3. producer suggest SAE 30 but engine barely reach water operating temp. will 0W-40 / 5W-40 be better option in those conditions?
4. producer suggest SAE 15W-40 is switching to 5W-40/0W-40 have any things against?
5. Are all API certifications always backwards compatible? (don't care here about old seals) like engine wants API SE can I use SF/SG/SH/etc. If not how much conflicts there are? are norms that is backwards compatible (example: assume SN do not cover SE, but SP cover SE)
5a. the same question but with diesel norms.
6. we have 0W-40 5W-50 10W-60, why winter rating don't go bellow 0? like -5W-20
with my understanding winter ratting means that oil in low temperature perform like straight oil at that rating ex. at 0degree C SAE 10W-50 perform (cSt) like SAE 10. Is oil less viscous than SAE 0 possible?
Thank you, Gilbert and/or Lewis...😀
Thanks for the link to petrocanada lubricants. It arms us tribology punters with the right information to decode the alphabet soup of oil classification. Having the older (obsolete) specs is super helpful for those of us with vintage stuff in our fleet.
Amazing video once again! Just wondering if you would make a video talking about different types of unconventional gear oils such as Redline Lightweight shockproof oil and their Heavyweight shockproof oils. Maybe compare them to regular gear oils and check the chemical differences through lab testing. I use the lightweight shockproof mixed with regular MT-90 gear oil in my 6 speed Subaru and it works amazing, the shifts are buttery smooth.
Great suggestion!
I should try that in my mitsubishi 5 speed F5M42 box that is notorious for eating input shaft bearings, was pretty beat when I got the car and I changed the fluid with half royal purple 75-90 max gear (gl4/gl5, kosher for brass synchros) and half redline MT90 iirc, made a decent different in noise when I changed it a couple months ago but it whines pretty bad in Decel in 1st and 2nd.... Still working on finding another trans to rebuild on the bench and swap in so I'll have to keep this one happy for just a while longer yet, I may try and get a bottle of the shockproof lightweight and maybe change it again 🫡
I appreciate this channel for helping to democratize real oil science. So much of the discourse about oil on social media, old forums, and just verbally around the garage prior to that has always been based on anecdote and perceived experience. "Daddy always ran Dinoco in his cars and never had a problem, so that's what I run..." etc. While there's certainly value in experience or trial & error, I'd really rather understand the science at even a high level to try and be a more informed consumer as oil and engine tech continues to evolve.
Thank you so much! That's why I make these videos.
Awesome. One might also want to adjust service intervals as well based on application.
Good call!
I saw the video of the vintage race with your dad. Pretty cool. We're the same age as well. 😁
I knew a guy with a dry sump racing car and he had a 5 gallon jerry can for oil with quick disconnects. An oil change was disconnecting the old and putting in a new. Took 20 seconds.
Many years ago I changed the transmission fluid in my Datsunt 720 pickup to Stalube GL4 transmission fluid. Imediately after changing the fluid it was impossible to get it into 2nd and 4th without grinding. I changed to valvoline GL4 and it corrected itself. Before anybody jumps on Staylube, this was decades ago and I'd bet the formula has been updated many times. My point is to point out another example of his 7 minute comments. Oil can make a WORLD of difference. I was young then and it boggled my mind at the time how oil is not oil, as the saying goes.
2:40 What about when your engine used to have one spec (5w-30) and still has that in the ROW, but the “engineers found” a “better oil” (0w-20) for the US, conveniently just when CAFE requirements were tightened?
SuperTech
Walmart sells SuperTech oil and transmission fluid. I use both for the past 10 years with great results.
All great videos!
Is there any videos that you have comparing/versus Valvoline Vr1 20w50 "VS" Driven Hr1 15w50? Would be a great video👍
Not yet! But I like that suggestion.
First, I would like to say thank you for putting out this excellent video and other no nonsense information on vehicle oils. There can be a lot of misinformation and snake oil salesmen out there, especially on vehicle internet forums.
With that out of the way I have to apologize for opening this potential can of worms by asking what kind of oil you would recommend for a Subaru manual transaxle? Since they have both synchronizers and hypoid gear sets (and some models also came with front and center mechanical LSDs) it can be very difficult to find an oil that balances those conflicting needs. The Subaru manual for older vehicles recommends a GL-5 rated 75w90 gear oil while newer vehicles are supposed to use a GL-5 rated 75w80 gear oil in order to protect the hypoid gear set on the front differential (which shares oil with the transmission). The problem (as you alluded to in this video) is that the EP and limited slip additives often found in GL-5 gear oils don't really play nice with the synchronizers, which leads to a not so great shift feel and potential damage to the synchros over time. Subaru used to make their own 75w90 GL-5 oil specifically for these transmissions, but it was very difficult to get outside of Japan and is no longer being made. This led to people on forums experimenting with different concoctions of gear oils to try and find something that works (like the infamous "Uncle Scotty's cocktail"), but the idea of mixing several different viscosities and types of gear oil doesn't sit well with me since you would be diluting the additive packages of each oil and would have trouble predicting the outcome.
Subaru does manufacture their own 75w80 GL-5 transaxle fluid for the current generation of Subaru vehicles, but the last time I checked you could only buy it in 55 gallon drums, which is overkill for a typical consumer, and even my local Subaru dealerships won't stock it because they don't get enough manual transmission Subarus in for service, so they just use the same generic gear oil they use for rear differentials in the manual transmissions.
So, any advice on a suitable gear oil for a 2017 Subaru Forester manual transaxle that a consumer like myself could actually get a hold of would be greatly appreciated. Thanks.
Thanks. That is a tough one. It might be best to start with a GL-4/5 rated 75W-90 and then start adding some limited slip additive until the shift performance is right.
@@themotoroilgeek Thanks, I didn't realize the limited slip additive helped with synchro engagement. I will have to try that.
very interesting, an LSD Gear oil can be adjusted by the LSD friction modifier package. I used to use Amsoil 75-90 in my rear of SVX, now I have motul with a sepparate additive bottle, all moxed in, and the wheel I noticed gets caught on dirt turns all the time, jerks alot. Something I can investigate now without simply changing oils. Very informative video, thanks.
Thank you!
About time Lake. Been waiting for another cracking video.
Thanks!
Have you ever discussed hybrid vehicles and any special needs their engines have? Engineering Explained recently discussed this in a video sponsored by Mobil One. It claims that hybrid engines are a unique application that requires different chemistry. Many commenters challenged that as marketing BS since it was a sponsored video. Any thoughts on this? Have you covered this already and I just need to find that video?
I actually watched that video last night. He was spot on.
Would you please do a video on which fuel additives are best for both gas and diesel engines? Or what brand of fuel Shell, Exxon, Sinclair, etc. has the best additives in their fuel?
Will do!
Thanks Lake! I love your channel. Have you ever seen super slick oil additives like SFR causing bore polish?
Brother Lake, you just don't know how much I miss NASCAR. Growing up in it camping out in the middle of the track. Unfortunately it's slowly fading away. It's a sport that appeal to only certain kind of people. The NASCAR pools we had in the pub. The elder generation of fans..and I could be wrong about the fading away of the art of NASCAR if someone wants to correct me I welcome that
I hear ya!
Please do a Harley oil video.
There are so many twin cam owners out there just guessing on oil type. I'm one of them. Been using Redline 20W50 and their transmission fluid. BelRay in the primary.
Please help us!
03 Grand marquis, runs 24/7 365 as my brother lives in the car for mental issues, not money issues, 475,000 road miles and he has been living in it 3 years. I am able to change the oil every 10-15,000 miles when he comes around. What oil should I use? It has had synthetic since the first oil change. Thanks
I have a Tremec 6 speed and changed fluid to the Royal purple synchromesh and it shifted terrible. I drained it and put in Mobil 1 ATF+4 and smooth as butter. I think it shifts better than the OEM fluid.
Why ATF+4? Is it a Mopar?
Perfect example of how each application has its own unique "appetite" for chemistry.
In my T5 I went from fresh Pennz to Mobil 1 as a same day test and there was an amazing difference. Mobil 1 is much smoother.
I'm not sure what oil it's speced for, but if it's for a gearbox factory filled with ATF then some oil mfg have manual gearbox oil for that. I've used Castrol Syntrans FE 75W, basically ATF but optimised for manual. 👌
And if you have a beater. It gets the oil it's given and it's thankful for it.
I have three questions:
1. What should you do if different manufacturers specify different viscosity grades and/or different specifications for the same basic engine?
2. Related to Q1, what's the difference between a passenger car diesel oil and a heavy duty diesel oil?
3. What should you do if the specification required plain doesn't exist anymore, let alone is obsolete? In one of my cars, the manufacturer specified a 10W-40 oil meeting API SJ/CF.
Penzoil and Quaker State both make 10w40 conventional style oils I've seen them at home depot
I thought API ratings were backwards compatible.
@@426envy Note I said API SJ/CF, not API SJ/CF-4 - key difference. API CF is the exception as it's aimed at indirect injection diesel engines and vehicles operating on high sulphur diesel above 0.5% (5,000 ppm). I find the API SJ/CF requirement funny, because the car in question is a common rail direct injection diesel and the UK at the time had a maximum sulphur limit of 0.035% (350 ppm) - now down to 0.001% (10 ppm).
The key issue I have is that whilst there's no way to validate the API CF claim, API-licenced oils themselves are a rarity here and oils claiming API SJ to SP (even from the big brands: Castrol, Shell and TotalEnergies) don't exist on the API's EOLCS register. I'm wondering if an ACEA A3/B4 oil (very common here) would work?
Used Royale purple gl 4 synchromax and BG synroshift 2 for my 21 Tacoma with RC62F manual trans.
My motorcycle has mods, deleted all the emissions stuff, mapped. UOA showed it was sheering the oil from a 50 to a 30 within 700 miles! Time to try some different brands, see how they hold up better/worse HTHS resistance
14:06 MT-1 is for heavy truck non-synchro manual transmissions. Not for any synchromesh transmission. Insider info - MT1 at some blenders, is simply HDEO.
Lake, I love VIR, I use to race my motorcycle there, and I hope you did more than one test. Your lap times usually get better as you go, so testing the big one first could be attributed to track knowledge improvement or any other adjustments to the car or tires, suspension, etc.
Ok quick question please, I thoroughly trust your opinions on this subject. I have a 2024 Ram power wagon 2500 with a 6.4 hemi HD. Ram recommends 0W-40, last oil change I put the Penzoil Ultra Platinum 0W-40 and my fuel miles seemed to drop. It just seems that 0W-40 for the Mississippi environment and heat as well as a work truck is thin. Penzoil Ultra does not make a 5W-30 which brand and weight would recommend. It's a 75K truck and I certainly don't believe in putting a $3.00 oil in her. I'm very miticulous about my vehicles. Do you also prefer Wix filters for her applications. Thank you brother and take care.
Another great video. Toyota recommends 0W-20 oil on both my 4Runner and Tundra, but that thin of oil makes me nervous and they recommend thicker oil for the same engines in other parts of the world. What are your thoughts of running a thicker oil, maybe 5W-30 in these engines?
Thanks for sharing!
IMO it wouldn't hurt at all to run 5w30 in the warmer months, long as you're the kinda person to let the engine get the blood pumping for 20 seconds or more before pulling out of the driveway 👍
lot of good 0w30s starting to occupy the shelfs in north America now too, Pennzoil platinum 0w30 isnt hard to come by if you're worried about cold start flow
@@snoofayy6150Thanks for the reply. I always wait until high idle lowers before I take off and I keep my RPMs down until the engine and transmission are up to temp. I also live in Phoenix where there’s no such thing as a cold start.
The best oil is the one that you change the more often.
Lots of people ask me the same question. "What's the best oil for my car". Because they go to the shop, there are lots of "bottles" of oil from different brands with exactly the same specs (and price), but they have to choose one. And the real reason they ask this is that the need to choose one, but they don't know what brand to pick up, and they, thinking about this, they think of other "useless" reason to choose something different.
But even while asking this question, they still often wait after they have to more than the kilometers (and time) that the owner manuel say for oil change. And some stupid people even tells them "now oils are long life, you don't need to change that often", and that's very stupid.
So my anwser is always the same: (among the oils that meets the requierement of the manual, like API-SN or ACEA-C3) the best oil is always the oil that you change the more often.
(given they all have the right grade, and right API/ACEA spec for the car), even an oil from a "bad brand" that has been inside the engine for only 2000 km, will alway be better than the best oil in the world that has already run 10 000 km inside the engine.
(and yes, there are brands that i like more than others, but compared to how often the oil is changed, that makes no difference).
i own a garage queen which is usually halted for 4-5 months. there are many rumors how to storage it right outside season window oil-wise. f.e. some people even recommend to top up engine with mineral oil (like truly top up till there is no more space in engine), so you prevent rusting process (even despite it's in warm garage and it runs on synthetic oil). also i'd really would love to know how to start such engine after a long break. this is yet another massive threat of oil fogging pistons through spark plug holes or lubricate via intake (?!). maybe you would find it interesting for some of your upcoming videos. all best from Poland
Do a video on transmission fluid
Yeah what's up with all the different mercon types and how do universal transmission fluids work and why do I avoid them
@@matt45540 that and if universal transmission fluids are good as oems or worse. And how long those fluids should last
I've use maxlife as a Toyota ws replacement and it seems to work fine .
Cvt fluid
Talk with Allison Transmission about an Automatic for Dad's 750HP Racecar.
No more manual clutching ever,
Just Drive It!!😁
The thing that sometimes frustrates me is that my newest engine is 12 years old, and my others are 42 to 58 years old. The requirements stated in the manuals applied to chemistries that are not even available today… and chemistries and additives change every few years so I have to somewhat stay on top of what is actually IN the oils that are available on the market. And I really can’t risk trying something that might radically increase wear, since my 55 year old engine is completely numbers matching to the car. It’s a challenge, but it’s interesting.
Probably time to drain and replace the fluid in the MT-82. Lots of room to work on that NASCAR engine...ahhh the good ole days.
Well I usually use Mobil 1 Extended Performance High Mileage (HM) or any full synthetic HM oil/Rotella Gas Truck or any Truck & SUV oil. Also, that GL4 or GL5 only applies to transfer case fluid; however, differential fluid must say VTM-4 fluid the only one that does is Honda Fluid. 🙂
My RAM 2500 6.4L likes to shear 0w40 PUP. Going to try Amsoil next to see if any better. Just a truck being a truck
Nice to see you doing some work to get your hands dirty. Oh and the oil lesson is ok too!
Thank you Lake for your post. Way more oils now than when I was a mechanic in the 70s and 80s.
That Ford engine in the video, is it a 385 based or a 335? It appears from the bell housing to be either a 429 type block or a modified block.
Thanks!
That's a Ford race block. 351 based. Stapleton42 has a great video on the history of the Ford NASCAR engines.
@@themotoroilgeek Thank you sir! I’ll have to look at the video and do some research. The bell housing looks like the 335 series engines is why I asked. I’ve been away from wrenching for teams since the late 70s and haven’t kept up with the changes.
I have 1.3 million miles on my semi diffs and transmission 50 in trans and 75,90 in diffs valvoline is what I've been using,and I hope they make it a hundred thousand miles more and I will be done. I've been using a different engine oil but thinking about going to premium blue,but fuel mileage with mobile synthetic is good, but oil temperature seems alittle high but boost temperature is a bit high.
The drop in calcium is evident on my most recent UOA for Mobil 1 FS Euro 0W40 when going to API SP from the old SN Plus.
Yup follow the manual just pick the brand like Valvoline restore & protect.
This applies to my motorcycle shifting, some great quality brands don't shift as good in my higher mileage bike. Nothing wrong, just the chemistry isn't there sometimes. Thanks!
Recently tried Mobil 1 0w40 Euro Car FS (full synthetic) it has no friction modifiers, so it's safe for wet clutch use. I dragrace and change the oil very often. Shifts better IMO than any other oil I've used so far, even when compared to Amsoil MC 10w40.
Bike is used for a good bit of street use as well, gets ridden to track then raced and ridden home too. It's a '23 with almost 12K miles on it.
@@QuicKurtZX14R Now that's getting great usage of the machine. Mine is only a Rebel 500 with 73k miles, trying to get 100k miles at this point.
@NoName-c4y7h you'll have no trouble in doing that, if the 0w40 Mobil 1 can hold up under what I'm putting it through, I believe you'll see improvements in shifting smoothness as well as quieter running
Lake, please review Motorcraft 5W-50. The owners of these HP Fords need another viable option when it comes to substituting the factory fill.
I didn't even know that Motorcraft made a 5w-50!
Try out some Redline Shockproof Heavy. Its my goto in trans that we break a lot. Redline says not to use in a synchro box, but 25 years of using them in sychro trans, the gears don't usually outlast the synchro.
Can you make a recommendation for the 3.4 twin turbo Toyota tundra? Or atleast turbo engines in general?
API SP rated full synthetic
I love these oil videos. Can't explain it lol. I just love learning about what keeps my car running and how to choose and dictate how often to change and what to lubricate everything with.
On a more comedic note:
Have a racecar driver have his son become a tribologist is like the tiger mom making their son become a doctor XD.
Working with cars is much more fun than ripping someone open though! (Well... Ig it might not depending on who you ask XD)
Thanks!
Can you please compare compare small engine & race oil???
I've used amsoil, stp, Kawasaki, Kohler, Honda, triax, and a few others. Some seem to burn up much faster than others bu I've always wondered if the non-api/race oil or api SL oil is better for my generator and zero turn than conventional Walmart 10w-40 or genetic SAE 30. Interestingly some engines like Honda's dont recommended anything past a 10w-30 while I run nothing but 10w-40 or 20w-50 in my Kawasakis. I just don't know if I'm doing worse or better with Royal purple HPS over a Kawasaki OE SL il or even a SN rated diesel oil like rotella 15w-40.
Lake, I have been told not to use automotive engine oil in my small engines, such as my 24HP Kohler lawn tractor and my 12,500 watt portable generator. I use synthetic oils in all of my engines. I have use Mobil-1 10W-30 and also Pennzoil Premium 10W-30. Pennzoil Ultra Premium is not sold in any of the stores locally here in Michigan. I purchase a couple of 5-quart jugs on Amazon for $29 each but now they cost $40+. Not sure what to use now.
VIR 👍 Talking about transmission oils there’s an interesting comparison you could do with the MT82 that’s in most manual transmission Mustangs. Ford fills it with DCT fluid but many folks, myself included, have found a synchromesh oil significantly cleans up the shifting.
I like to hear your thoughts about ECVT transmissions. I suspect the internal motors introduce new materials for the oil to deal with
The materials are not much different than what is used in automatic and DSG transmissions, more copper, but it is all coated, so need to be cognizant of the polymers. EVs are really similar in design, use what the manufacturer intended, likely a manual transmission lube like my EV, or automatic fluid for others.
Here’s a plot twist. Tremec T56 magnum manual trans calls for dex 3 ATF. Even the big shots that build them suggest NOT using synchromesh fluids in them. I believe they are a hybrid of CF and bronze synchros.