Dan, you have here a simple and elegant explanation of what I have finally come to acknowledge as the essential nature of the golf swing, after decades of not even knowing what to *try to do*. All this with a simple aim stick, not even showing The Pro and what it can do to make leverage painfully visible. So easy to understand, but so hard to do with an actual club, ball and target.
Golf swing is an angular motion transferred thru a number of flexible mechanical levers, so shaft flexing is a necessity. Your hypothesis holds true if all the levers were rigid and the club head spun around like a centrifuge. How's that humanly possible?
Correct, his idea is like a car tire continuously rotating around a hub, that’s not golf. Golf starts and stops and needs that stop or change of motion to create the club head speed. Golf is more like flicking paint off a paint brush in a direction, you never just waive your arms in a circular motion and get the paint off, if so it would just fly off randomly. Also like snapping a towel same idea. I’m not saying this swinging idea doesn’t work, it’s just the wrong message.
How do you reconcile this with what Montie Sheinblum teaches and the statement from Jack Nicklaus that when he swung the club, it felt like he was trying to release the club as soon as possible?
found your video and see great interest here to help my game. I see other devices on the market with flexible shafts, they basically want you to hit it straight by moving your body together with the arms, in effect keeping the flexible shaft timed with the body to not flex or else the ball wont go straight. is the Pro device trying to train the same mechanics? thanks John
Exactly! Optimally you should be able to keep the shaft of a flexible golf club, such as the orange whip, as straight as possible for the entire golf motion. The problem is the same as a rigid club though - the flexible shaft is still rigid enough that it still sends impulses to your body to use it like a lever. When you use something inert like a rope to connect you to the weight that will only respond to the inertial flow, then you know for sure you are doing it correctly. Thanks!
I know this is an old video but I've been playing with the idea of leverage a bit and wondered about your thoughts regarding Mike Malaska and tipping the club through the hitting zone. It is a form a leverage but it seems to be mora about the left hand/arm slowing and turning around the body than it is the right hand/arm exerting pressure. Is the leverage from the left hand turning the corner simply part of the "swinging" motion or would that not be levering the clubhead through the strike? Yes...this is far to much information but I am very good at "over doing" little swing changes so getting it right in my head is important. thanks. :)
Remember that Mike's "tipping" the club is a feel, not real. It's a way of getting players to actually not apply too much leverage to the club shaft! Thanks!
I’ve heard it said that a faster backswing transitions naturally into a downswing that produces more leverage because of the increased force on the hands. Is this true? And, is this a good thing, or should we do a pause (ala Matsuyama) at the top? Thanks!
We don’t want to apply a leverage force to the shaft at anytime in an attempt to control the club head velocity or direction in the motion. As little as humanly possible is best! Whatever rhythm or tempo that achieves this best for the individual is best! Thx!
Yeah I always thought flex and torque play a role in the distance you create and accuracy, (I get more distance from a stiff shaft than a reg) with no shaft flex no pressure on my thumbs I’m 90-95mph when I feel the pressure on my thumbs creating flex I’m 105-110mph on the monitor, what am I doing different? Is it body rotation sequencing, the lack of? First video of yours I’ve seen! Thanks!
It's definitely possible to feel there is some pressure in the thumbs without actually using your forearm muscles to add the type of leverage I'm speaking of. I would guess without looking at your swing that you are likely sequencing very well when you are getting up to 105-110. It's also possible to get the club moving really fast even with some leverage applied to the shaft - i have lot's of students that do, but when it get's out of hand, the body reacts with compensations and the ball can get a bit crooked! Thanks!
Dan Martin Golf. thank you for responding! I’ve been an ok golfer since 2000 when I started. a year ago I started looking at RUclips instruction videos, time off because of an injury! I came across Steve Pratt, frustrated with this squat hold the lag stuff (for me was horrible) I started applying his Mike Austin swing and for me my friends notice the difference, I started workin in my backyard with a net and swing caddy I recorded the progress and feed back and feels I had, what was amazing was the swing speeds I recorded, effortlessly! 4 months of no golf third time out shot 77 I’m turning 59 and have never hit the ball further or straighter! I enjoy the instruction and information on RUclips, maybe some body type are better for different approaches, but it’s works for me, I’ll keep watching and always learning! Thank you 👍👍 thank you!
The shaft is merely a connection for the golfer to the club head - it doesn't transmit speed - that's a huge misconception that most golfer's have. Because it is virtually impossible to swing without accidentally applying a little leverage, shaft flex can help a player's distortions hurt them less. Faster clubhead speeds will have less deflection error from leverage with a stiffer shaft, whereas slow clubhead speeds can actually benefit from the lighter more flexible shaft when they apply leverage. But if the swing is "leverage" free, like a swing testing robot, shaft flex makes no difference! Shafts definitely matter mostly for the feel of the player - or as we say in fitting - "player & swing dependent" Thanks!
Interesting thoughts. But reality is, in a good golf "swing", there is leverage applied. It needs to be applied at the correct time. As the shaft gets to about parallel to the ground in the down swing, the grip end is moved upward which moves the club head faster down through impact. This leverage has to be applied not only at the correct time, but the body rotation and extension must also occur at the correct time, later in the swing at about the time the grip end is moving upward near the lead thigh. My 2 cents worth. Not worth much in today's economy! Lol!
Actually, no leverage need be applied - the hands are a part of the club, not two separate clamps that put opposing forces on it. The problem is the shaft allows us to apply leverage when none is actually needed. Albeit a very difficult skill to master!
If leverage on the instrument is so important, then how come the most powerful transfer of energy in tennis is the serve where the player holds the racket as close to the end of the racquet and only with one hand? If leveraging the racquet was beneficial, they would hold it with two hands and a split grip.
Agreed, but if your swing is really good, the extending of angular momentum is creating an illusion that your club is swinging around your wrists. It's actually extending simultaneously with your arms. So if you are "swinging" your club, you are using the club as a lever (crow bar like) and not allowing the transfer of momentum to do the job! This is explained better in some of my more recent videos! Thanks!
I'm enjoying this concept. I noticed at the end of the video you said there are leverage muscles and swinging muscles? I'm not quite clear on what that means? In my mind I'm seeing long drive people or people that hit it really far and I can't help but feel like there's a lot of Leverage being used there. Wouldn't you learn to use the levers first then learn to relax them? Or are you saying that it's actually different muscles being used?
Jacob Muscles are rubber bands Think of a bow and arrow Stretch the string-string suddenly stops-arrow catapults in a straight linear manner… Wouldn’t it be great if we could stretch to our max-release with no jerking or applied force (which throws our swing “off plane”)--ie trying to apply leverage LPGA girls have flexible muscles At 5’ 120 lbs 260 yards It is not size or strength ! Drop the macho and let your feminine side be elegant and graceful👍 Be pretty and hold that gallery pose😊
@@bobcunninghamgolf yes makes perfect sense that the muscles would be like rubber bands they stretch intense etcetera. You have the bones are the levers I am more referring to. Pelvis would move, the way the femurs would move, the way the shoulders would move, the way the wrists would move. Those levels are all very concrete! I am not talking about flexing a bunch of muscles I'm talking about using a bunch of levers along with smooth muscles.
![Felix "Unfair" | [Stray Kids : SKZ-PLAYER]](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/Oswujxm2Ag0/mqdefault.jpg)
Great explanation for an important concept. Thanks Dan.
Dan, you have here a simple and elegant explanation of what I have finally come to acknowledge as the essential nature of the golf swing, after decades of not even knowing what to *try to do*. All this with a simple aim stick, not even showing The Pro and what it can do to make leverage painfully visible. So easy to understand, but so hard to do with an actual club, ball and target.
Thanks, Bernard. I feel your pain! But understanding is the first step!
Golf swing is an angular motion transferred thru a number of flexible mechanical levers, so shaft flexing is a necessity. Your hypothesis holds true if all the levers were rigid and the club head spun around like a centrifuge. How's that humanly possible?
Correct, his idea is like a car tire continuously rotating around a hub, that’s not golf. Golf starts and stops and needs that stop or change of motion to create the club head speed. Golf is more like flicking paint off a paint brush in a direction, you never just waive your arms in a circular motion and get the paint off, if so it would just fly off randomly. Also like snapping a towel same idea. I’m not saying this swinging idea doesn’t work, it’s just the wrong message.
@@maeu59The paint does flick off of the brush it just does so without intent.
@@kendallarcher3889I agree, the swing is actually a circle my comment is 2 years old and I see it differently now.
How do you reconcile this with what Montie Sheinblum teaches and the statement from Jack Nicklaus that when he swung the club, it felt like he was trying to release the club as soon as possible?
Great lesson
found your video and see great interest here to help my game.
I see other devices on the market with flexible shafts, they basically want you to hit it straight by moving your body together with the arms, in effect keeping the flexible shaft timed with the body to not flex or else the ball wont go straight. is the Pro device trying to train the same mechanics?
thanks
John
Exactly! Optimally you should be able to keep the shaft of a flexible golf club, such as the orange whip, as straight as possible for the entire golf motion. The problem is the same as a rigid club though - the flexible shaft is still rigid enough that it still sends impulses to your body to use it like a lever. When you use something inert like a rope to connect you to the weight that will only respond to the inertial flow, then you know for sure you are doing it correctly. Thanks!
I know this is an old video but I've been playing with the idea of leverage a bit and wondered about your thoughts regarding Mike Malaska and tipping the club through the hitting zone. It is a form a leverage but it seems to be mora about the left hand/arm slowing and turning around the body than it is the right hand/arm exerting pressure. Is the leverage from the left hand turning the corner simply part of the "swinging" motion or would that not be levering the clubhead through the strike? Yes...this is far to much information but I am very good at "over doing" little swing changes so getting it right in my head is important. thanks. :)
Remember that Mike's "tipping" the club is a feel, not real. It's a way of getting players to actually not apply too much leverage to the club shaft! Thanks!
I’ve heard it said that a faster backswing transitions naturally into a downswing that produces more leverage because of the increased force on the hands. Is this true? And, is this a good thing, or should we do a pause (ala Matsuyama) at the top? Thanks!
We don’t want to apply a leverage force to the shaft at anytime in an attempt to control the club head velocity or direction in the motion. As little as humanly possible is best! Whatever rhythm or tempo that achieves this best for the individual is best! Thx!
@@danmartingolf Interesting. Ok. Thank you for replying!
was this recorded at the location where they filmed M.A.S.H.? J/K but it did remind me of the opening of the show, great information.
Yeah I always thought flex and torque play a role in the distance you create and accuracy, (I get more distance from a stiff shaft than a reg) with no shaft flex no pressure on my thumbs I’m 90-95mph when I feel the pressure on my thumbs creating flex I’m 105-110mph on the monitor, what am I doing different? Is it body rotation sequencing, the lack of? First video of yours I’ve seen! Thanks!
It's definitely possible to feel there is some pressure in the thumbs without actually using your forearm muscles to add the type of leverage I'm speaking of. I would guess without looking at your swing that you are likely sequencing very well when you are getting up to 105-110. It's also possible to get the club moving really fast even with some leverage applied to the shaft - i have lot's of students that do, but when it get's out of hand, the body reacts with compensations and the ball can get a bit crooked! Thanks!
Dan Martin Golf. thank you for responding! I’ve been an ok golfer since 2000 when I started. a year ago I started looking at RUclips instruction videos, time off because of an injury! I came across Steve Pratt, frustrated with this squat hold the lag stuff (for me was horrible) I started applying his Mike Austin swing and for me my friends notice the difference, I started workin in my backyard with a net and swing caddy I recorded the progress and feed back and feels I had, what was amazing was the swing speeds I recorded, effortlessly! 4 months of no golf third time out shot 77 I’m turning 59 and have never hit the ball further or straighter! I enjoy the instruction and information on RUclips, maybe some body type are better for different approaches, but it’s works for me, I’ll keep watching and always learning! Thank you 👍👍 thank you!
I know Steve - he teaches in my area! He gets it! Glad you are having success!!
Dan, can you explain how and why different shaft flexes play into this swing versus leverage concept? I found your video through BeBetterGolf. Thanks.
The shaft is merely a connection for the golfer to the club head - it doesn't transmit speed - that's a huge misconception that most golfer's have. Because it is virtually impossible to swing without accidentally applying a little leverage, shaft flex can help a player's distortions hurt them less. Faster clubhead speeds will have less deflection error from leverage with a stiffer shaft, whereas slow clubhead speeds can actually benefit from the lighter more flexible shaft when they apply leverage. But if the swing is "leverage" free, like a swing testing robot, shaft flex makes no difference! Shafts definitely matter mostly for the feel of the player - or as we say in fitting - "player & swing dependent" Thanks!
Interesting thoughts. But reality is, in a good golf "swing", there is leverage applied. It needs to be applied at the correct time. As the shaft gets to about parallel to the ground in the down swing, the grip end is moved upward which moves the club head faster down through impact. This leverage has to be applied not only at the correct time, but the body rotation and extension must also occur at the correct time, later in the swing at about the time the grip end is moving upward near the lead thigh. My 2 cents worth. Not worth much in today's economy! Lol!
Actually, no leverage need be applied - the hands are a part of the club, not two separate clamps that put opposing forces on it. The problem is the shaft allows us to apply leverage when none is actually needed. Albeit a very difficult skill to master!
Mmm k??
Semantics really here. It is the loose hinging of the wrist that allows the head to swing past the butt end to create speed. Dont overcomplicate it
The 'entire' golf swing consists of leverage. No different than hockey, baseball or tennis. No leverfe, no divot.
If leverage on the instrument is so important, then how come the most powerful transfer of energy in tennis is the serve where the player holds the racket as close to the end of the racquet and only with one hand? If leveraging the racquet was beneficial, they would hold it with two hands and a split grip.
@@danmartingolfDan, I think gravity may have something to do with it. The golf swing is just swing leveraging leverage.
Stop it..kind of, like..and sort of ..so.. so
You are "swinging" the club by leveraging your wrists 😆. The wrists ARE a lever.
"Leverage" is a very generic term and so is "swing".
Agreed, but if your swing is really good, the extending of angular momentum is creating an illusion that your club is swinging around your wrists. It's actually extending simultaneously with your arms. So if you are "swinging" your club, you are using the club as a lever (crow bar like) and not allowing the transfer of momentum to do the job! This is explained better in some of my more recent videos! Thanks!
I'm enjoying this concept. I noticed at the end of the video you said there are leverage muscles and swinging muscles? I'm not quite clear on what that means? In my mind I'm seeing long drive people or people that hit it really far and I can't help but feel like there's a lot of Leverage being used there. Wouldn't you learn to use the levers first then learn to relax them? Or are you saying that it's actually different muscles being used?
@@jacobr4558
Jacob
Muscles are rubber bands
Think of a bow and arrow
Stretch the string-string suddenly stops-arrow catapults in a straight linear manner…
Wouldn’t it be great if we could stretch to our max-release with no jerking or applied force (which throws our swing “off plane”)--ie trying to apply leverage
LPGA girls have flexible muscles
At 5’ 120 lbs 260 yards
It is not size or strength !
Drop the macho and let your feminine side be elegant and graceful👍
Be pretty and hold that gallery pose😊
@@bobcunninghamgolf yes makes perfect sense that the muscles would be like rubber bands they stretch intense etcetera. You have the bones are the levers I am more referring to. Pelvis would move, the way the femurs would move, the way the shoulders would move, the way the wrists would move. Those levels are all very concrete! I am not talking about flexing a bunch of muscles I'm talking about using a bunch of levers along with smooth muscles.