Here's a Trick to Predict What Cars Will Rise in Value
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- Опубликовано: 26 июл 2024
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Want to know what cars will rise in value? Here's a trick to help predict it! People are always asking me what cars will rise in value, so today I'm letting you know a trick I think will help predict what cars will go up in value.
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I like the videos where you can tell that Doug could talk for hours and hours about a certain topic and it would still be interesting
Wow, no offense but your comment comes off sounding really pathetic!
I’d love if he did a podcast for things like this
Did anyone else notice he had a new Z in his Cars and Bids ad?
Agree i like this guy called doug the coolest car reviewer that I watch 99% of his videos till the end I swear
I’d watch it
My theory on the ‘undesirable’ bit: when new they were undesirable from those who could afford them..but were wanted by those who couldn’t afford them (specifically young people).
Fast forward ten or twenty years and now those young people have careers and money and can acquire them
THIS!!!
Thank you!!!! I was too lazy to type all that out. 1,000,000 percent agree!!!
this is strong
In many items (like boomboxes) there is a similar "Nostalgia Wave". Look up the price of a JVC M90 if you don't believe me.
That’s the same for most young car guys. But the thing is that not everyone will be rich. Just so you know
the LC 500 is one of my obtainable dream cars right next to the 997. I would love to own one before they stop depreciating. I got lucky with my S2000 before they really started taking off, and the 997 is next on my list. I definitely agree that the LC is gonna take off at some point!
I sold my AP2 w/ ~50k miles on it 7 years ago for $17.5k. I definitely miss it. Been looking at 997 cabs more recently, and I really like the LC 500 as well.
I also have a s2k and am looking to sell it for a 997 😂
LC500 is such an amazing car. If I could afford one, I’d get it in a heartbeat
I believe the Inspirational Series LC500 are the ones that will appreciate the most… I actually own a 2021 coupe (#29) and 2021 convertible (#43) LC500 Inspiration Series
Bought a 2018 LC500 for (prices all in CAD) $102k , sold it a couple years later for $79k to a dealer. They in turn sold it for $98k... oops. For what it's worth, with the LC dough, I bought a 2007 Porsche c2s 997 cabrio for $48k, pocketed the difference; the 997 is now worth $70k, which sort of makes up for me getting rid of the LC. Though that LC convertible looks mighty fine.
Doug doesn't seem wrong a lot...
And it continues here. He's great at giving good auto predicitions and I wish I could get his advice on my next purchase
Mercedes GLC 63S Coupe. Hated rn. But it's super fast and sounds great.
@@joshvanassche6061 It will fall apart at 60k miles.
@@aaron-fauth fax everyone should just buy a 05 civic like you so it can go 500k miles
The things enthusiasts look for in a new car are not the same as that they want in an older one. With new cars, you want the most horses, latest tech, coolest looks. This is evident even in Doug's reviews, where he makes a big deal about whether the new WRX has enough of a power bump or how well the latest hot hatch compares to its competitors on features and price.
But all of that ceases to be a factor in 20 years. Then it doesn't matter if the car had 250 or 280 HP at when it was new, and the competitor had more. It doesn't matter whether it looks cooler than its contemporaries, because nobody even remembers what it was competing against. If you buy an ugly M3 today, your friends will make fun of you for not buying something better looking. In 20 years there will have been dozens of uglier cars. Even if the M3 is still thought as ugly, it'll be cozy ugly, not offensive ugly.
In 20 years, people want good vibes. They want something they new cars don't have anymore. Something that speaks to them.
When buying a new car, you can choose from a handful of models in the segment you're looking in. Brand A, B or C. You want this year's model, or maybe you'll settle for last year's if there's a good discount. And you want a good deal, so why would you pay 10% more for a car that reviews say has less power or lacks some tech feature? But buying an old enthusiast car, you have so much more choice. Different years, different segments. Just pick your budget and go. Find something that's you. Buy something that nobody else has. Something from a past videogame. Something your mom drove you to school in. Something with flaws, character, stories, soul. Something worth loving.
An old car doesn't have to compete anymore. It can be appreciated for what it is.
This is such a good comment, very perceptive and true, bravo arantala
This is beautiful
Exactly what I thought. Once a car no longer has to compete with others for being the most efficient, most cutting edge, most powerful, etc. all that's left is the car's character.
Cozy ugly is my new favorite term
As a yellow '94 Fiat Coupe T16 owner, I couldn't relate more. Don't get me wrong, I love the way the car looks and feels, but the fact that it's been forgotten and hated by people and it's not competing today (cuz 200bhp on fwd with zero technology to make it really sporty), and all the things you said make me love this car much more !
And Giallo Ginestra, and oh boy do I love turbo lag
There's a big difference between loving one of these cars and being one of the people that was actually in the market to buy one when it was new. There could be a million people who love a car but if that group does not overlap with the people that can afford it, it's not going to sell well.
I always wanted a Lotus Elise, but couldn't afford one. Now that I could actually afford one, they no longer sell them, and the used market is 2-3x the price they were brand new.
Yes, used car appreciation prices out a lot of enthusiasts, which sucks.
Exactly right. Most of Doug's picks are cars that I couldn't afford then and I still wouldn't want to pay for now haha
I also believe modern cars that you can purchase “without” all the safety features will go up in value. A vehicle that doesn’t have automatic emergency breaking, road keep assist will have value in the future. Once the government mandates these features, and makes them impossible to turn off, older cars without them will go up in value.
Good point!!
I owned an '07 Lotus Elise for 11 years and sold it for $5K more than I paid for it. Recently bought an Evora. Hopefully it does the same. The irony is that I could've bought a boring everyday car and lost all of its value in that time.
I did the same, Heavily modified Exige I had I sold for 47K now worth around 75-80K I bought an Evora GT and I am hoping it holds strong.
How cool to see you on here! It’s so funny that neither of the two comments (and seriously, only two? Haha) seem to have any idea who you are.
Thank you so much for the work you do🙏🏽 your videos have been integral to my journey leaving organized religion and finding true liberation and embracing science🙌🏽
You are truly a Lucking Fegend👌🏽
Cheers!
Kudo to you that daily an Elise, how is your back feeling?
I was surprised he didn’t mention Lotus!
The Lexus LC500 is a gorgeous car. They definitely will shoot up in value once people realise it looks ahead of its time, has the NA V8 and the stylish interior fit and finish.
The LC500 is slower than a Genesis G70, has 2 less doors, and costs twice as much.
EDIT: Shit, I just helped prove Doug's point
@@Jasa12265 because its A GT CAR ITS NOT A SPORT CAR AND ACTUALLY ITS FASTER THAN THE G70 ESPECIALLY IN THE TOP END
Absolutely gorgeous cars. I still break my neck whenever I see one around where I live...it's one of the most concept car-like vehicles I can remember.
@@Jasa12265 ok stop right there it is not faster than the lc500 lol
Completely agree. Every time I see one I can’t believe it came out in 13-14
When the LFA came out I made $15 an hour. If I could have bought one I would have. Jeez Doug I couldn't afford 95% of those examples even if I had a time machine and knew they raise by 1000% in value.
re-evaluate your life choices
@@khanhhien06 you have a anime song playlist and listen to britney spears. what the fuck are you talking about?
@@khanhhien06 That's not how it works.
Like Doug said, a house is a better investment. Around here it surprises me how many owners of £1million + houses have cars like a well maintained ten year old Ford Focus.
That’s the worst thing about cars artificially inflating in price. Sellers and owners get excited when their cars goes up in price but buyers have a high anxiety about spending $500k in a car. When Doug bought his Ford GT he felt the same. He can’t sleep at night knowing that he’s about to spend $200k on a car.
Anyone watching in 2046 ???
2045 sorry 😞
No!
I always wanted an LFA from the day I saw it featured on Top Gear. I was never a fan of the Lexus badge, but I fell in love with the digital display (back when it was new and cool) and the amazing engine sound.
I still can’t afford a $400k car, but given the option back in the day, I honestly probably would’ve opted for a Lamborghini or Ferrari over the LFA, regardless of how much I liked it. I never realized that sales were that bad, but I guess it’s not surprising, there were just better options.
Maybe the biggest mistake with it was labeling it a Lexus. 4 times more expensive than any rational person would be willing to pay for an up-badged Toyota.
I have a real world experience regarding the LFA. A friend of mine who was in the market at the time, went to look at the LFA. The dealer was extremely arrogant and treated us very badly. The price on the car was $350,000 at the time and that was it. My buddy decided that buying a Ferrari F430 for $250,000 which had better performance and known resale value was just a better deal. What made LFAs unpopular were that even as far as supercars go, they represented poor value. Add to that the unwarranted arrogance of some Lexus dealers...
The same goes for the Porsche GT which was overpriced for the time.
I agree on the LFA. I was 16 when it came out and it was still a pinup car for me. But I have to think.. if I had the financial means to purchase one new, I don't think I would have. I'd go straight to a Ferrari dealer and order a 458, and save some money in the process.
But your 458 might have appreciated as well, or in the future will, or if you get the Speciale it definitely will continue to appreciate
@@EL8888 Maybe not a 'regular' 458 but any of the special editions would be worth more now for sure
Dude the LFA was a 375.000$ car limited to 500 cars, so very very expensive. A 458 was like 220k maybe?
And they had rhe exact same amount of power 570hp.
When it dropped, I loved the LFA because of the Top Gear piece on it. Always used to argue for it in conversation. However, around that same time, I 100% would have bought a Lambo, McLaren, or maybe even an Aston, assuming that was ever my market. It isn't now and probably never will be lol.
A Friend of mine was a Seller at a Lexus in Frankfurt am Main here in Germany and they have the LFA and when it came out they had this event t show it off to Lexus Customers and their Friends with Champagne and all.
We all loved it and when the Sales People and Customers were allowed to rev it inside on the 2nd Floor of the Showroom it was insane!
Yet... it never sold, She told me they had interested Customers with the necessary Funds and looking for a Super Car like that, but they all decided against it because of the Price!
Now in 2022 it's still for sale, but now they ask 700.000 euros but looks like despite Price Increase and Demand, it still isn't selling. But i bet it would sell quickly now for the Original Price
Prost & Cheers from the Bavarian Alps
I agree with most of the predictions, especially with the "new" NSX, I have always liked that car and it blows my mind that they aren't popular.
They ARE popular lol. Most people can't afford them is all and the cars appeal to younger people anyway.
Definitely agree with the NSX. It's a very lovely car but because of its price and the fact that people kept wrongly comparing it with the original NSX, it goes unnoticed. I hope it becomes more popular, now that its going out of production, but at the same time I also don't want the prices to skyrocket the way they did for some other previously unpopular cars (ex - 996 Porsche).
@@longtailgt How is it wrong comparing it to itself? It shouldn't have been called an NSX, same thing with the new Zupr4.
💯 Absolutely! This car was amazing for the price. I’ve seen 1 on the road. It’ll do well down the road.
Doug didn't mention today's 3G NSX (he did mention the OG and 2G), but I know for a fact that 3G is ready to become a COLLECTIBLE (right now the cheaper ones maybe the ('22) NSX Type S if you got the chance to order / buy one and the '20 and '21) just as the OG and 2G are now...
Know there's likely to be a 4G, but that will be a BEV in the late '20s, so the ICE'd ones will keep their exclusivity.
Collectors always want the rarest versions of something. As long as the demand stays consistent, as time goes along the supply available decreases and the price to acquire them increases. The cars mentioned have great fundamentals, are more scarce than normal due to poor sales, and provide nostalgia for those that were there during the production days. Great video, I love hearing about these kind of topics.
One of my favorite Doug videos. He came correct and I could listen to him talk about this for hours
Congratulations you have been selected among the shortlisted winner's for the ongoing Ps5 giveaway What'sapp the number above 👆..
I was surprised when Doug mentioned the “Lj” two door wrangler unlimited, I bought mine in 2012 for 8k and it was my first car. It had 94k miles and looked like it hadn’t been off-road in its live. I still own it and have modified it a little bit (suspension, tires, steel bumpers, winch, lights) it currently has 122k and I’ve been offered up to 25k for it. I was surprised for the number and even tempted but it was my first car and I plan to keep it for ever
No
I had a 2004 Rubicon that I bought brand new, and that thing was such an awesome vehicle. Even the base 4-cylinder TJs were great. Having the extra room of the Unlimited would have been awesome but they weren't on sale just yet when I bought mine. I wouldn't mind getting my hands on one now, but with prices the way they are it's not likely to happen.
The JK Wranglers never appealed to me. They tried to make the interior more upscale, which made no sense from a utility perspective, and it just looks tacky and overstyled. Not to mention the vehicles themselves are just way too large. And a 4-door Wrangler? Please! Half the fun of being a rear passenger in a Wrangler is climbing into the damn thing!
My friend got one for $5K in 2013, someone T-boned and wrecked it in 2015 and insurance gave him $10K for it. I really wish he could’ve still had it, cause it was a really sweet thing to ride in, standing up in the back seats holding that bar in the middle
Doug: “Let’s get started”
Without even half a second:
Doug: “Before we get started”
VEHICLES AND AUCTIONS
When will you people get it? This guy is sick. He's getting worse by the day.!
These kinds of videos are interesting to watch, if for nothing more than a change of pace from the typical reviews. 👍
I actually liked this opinion. I forgot all about the BMW i8. The whole time I was thinking that the Acura NSX will definitely come back and I was thinking about the Lexus GSF. Impractical new but can really bring the nostalgia from an era with turbos, bi-turbos and superchargers becoming popular. The LC500 is another great one and I'd def like the opportunity to own one someday.
Those track Lexuss will be the next famous jdm cars
I’m glad someone else said the GSF, it ticks every box. Not desirable, couldn’t compete, outdated tech, last of the sport saloons when everyone basically went to SUVs and hatchbacks, and super rare with less than 2500 produced. I think once we are in the thick of the coming recession it will be at rock bottom and a perfect time to buy.
I agree with your assessment, two additional points:
Many of these cars sold poorly originally because they cost too much for what they were.
Then because they were unpopular they became cheap and modified or abused, and even further reduced their numbers.
“They cost too much for what they were” same can be said for cars that are “valuable”. Idk why people get upset when a brand increases price on their products but used things being more unaffordable day by day. Is there something I’m missing?
@@tedolson2775 makes me believe in the mc20cielo.
I remember in the mid 90’s going with my dad to a BMW dealership and seeing a purple 8 series on the lot. It was the first $100k car I ever saw. I was probably 9-10 at the time and couldn’t comprehend a car costing that much since at the time the family car was a manual escort wagon. Always been a dream car of mine.
I remember the first time I saw the BMW 8-series, it was in an issue of Car Audio and Electronics magazine. I don't remember which one, but it had to have been something from the mid-90's as I was into car audio long before I ever was even into cars. But I saw this gorgeous-looking 8 series, a BMW unlike anything I had ever seen before, and I was blown away by how awesome it looked! Of course, Doug is absolutely right, the reason why I hadn't seen one before is that they were NOT selling well and there were none in my area.
Then later on, when I was living on Guam a friend of mine actually bought a V12 8-series and I got to drive it. It was a lot of fun. That was a very cool car even with an automatic, and I would still love to own one myself. Unlike a lot of cars that you eventually get to experience years after having lusted for it, this car really didn't disappoint me in any way. It was quick, but certainly not fast, but that wasn't really the point anyway.
I bought an 850i 6MT when they were about at the bottom of their depreciation, in the late-'00s. When new, it was a really nice car, had amazing styling, and had several industry firsts and many features that felt modern almost 20 years later. However, BMW had the unfortunate timing of launching a halo car right at the start of an economic recession. Since the 2 previous owners of the one I bought had split the ~$85k depreciation hit, my $14k got me a car that had a mix of coolness and performance that was almost unmatched at the same price. The only car I wish I had gotten instead is a 928...
I belive Doug missed the Ferrari GTC4LUSSO/Ferrari FF but mainly the Lusso. It's a Naturally aspirated V12 with close to 700hp and 4 SEATS! It has a quirky design and isn't liked by that many. I truly belive that the lusso will become an incredibly desired Ferrari in the future.
They also ended production for it to make room for their new Ferrari SUV. Rumoured to be named ”Purosangue”
Agree a lot. It’s really a great car but it’s definitely not been very popular
He already mentioned the BMW M Coupe which was the 90s version of the Ferrari. I think it applies.
Personally I have always hated the design of that one, there’s a couple in my city and they’re oddly proportioned for a Ferrari. But certainly one day just like Doug’s RS2 it’ll be worth much more than retail
Agreed, always have fancied that model.
Is it manual?
Is it in any good computer games?
Has it featured in any film/TV?
Does it look good?
Is it rare?
My predictions have all jumped in value.
Eh
Was it reviews by Doug?
R34 Skyline is 4 of those 🤣
@@bestmillimeter1858 i mean the bnr34 while not as rare as some other cars is the rarest among the GTRs so i guess that ticks half the box
@@Postbus22 Good point. Doug has enough power to swing the market.
The OG Tesla Roadster deserves a mention. Not widely bought when new, got a lot of hate, mostly forgotten now. Prices however have climbed back up a lot recently. I predict low mileage examples will fetch close to a million in 10-15 years. Why? An entire generation of kids love electric cars because of how fast they are and the tech they have. That same generation of kids are growing up with SpaceX, seeing them blast a Tesla Roadster into space and changing the way we look at space travel. The OG Tesla Roadster will be seen as the beginning of a new era in technology.
I like those a lot too! Would be a lot of fun
doug approved comment, nice
Not a nice car to drive. Not a lot to enjoy behind the wheel and won't fetch big money.
He did mention the OG Roadster in earlier videos though.
I think once he was wondering why they weren't more popular/expensive, and in another video he notices that they have started to come up in price.
Probably one of the Cars & Bids videos about his predictions or recent sales.
If anything the O.G Roadster also serves as proof that you can make EVs lightweight (although it’s still about 400 kgs heavier than the Elise it was based on).
The 124 spider. Is one of the most severely underrated turbo roadsters.
Great video dug, the "car market" is such a fun part of being a car enthusiast. It's like watching how pokemon cards go up in value for us people who don't care for them we all ask "why is that valuable? It's just an old card?" But for the people who are into the game, they get all excited about it.
How do you get excited? I just get sad looking at how i wont be able to afford cars i like
@@remu6841 true true, I meant in that many cars are "valuable" but when people see them on the street it's one of those things where "if you know, you know" and if not then they're just old cars to most people. The saddest part for me is that the latest sports cars are among the last generations of gas powered sports cars. And I likely won't be able to get them new or enjoy them long used before they get totally phased out.
I feel like with the new enthusiast cars the tech will play a bigger role. with those older 90s and 00s cars the tech wasn't significantly different from say the late 70s, with the difference being maybe the type of music interface. However, with cars released in the last couple of years you get screens and features that might seem extremely old in only a decade, and when 25+ years rolls around might even be unusable save for really dedicated enthusiasts. With those cars that have just a giant screen for most of their controls, would it become necessary to be a hobbyist programmer in order to work on them?
Uhm, 90's cars had computer controlled fuel injection with oxygen sensors, air bags, crumple zones, etc. Sure now you have a computer system in your dash, but don't say 90's cars weren't that much higher tech then 70's cars.
There gonna be looked at the same as the touchscreen crt oldsmobile had. Quirky and junque (classy junk)
Cominities could form around them to keep them running as normal... like a video game that lost support and even offical servers.
I kinda get what you are saying and I kinda agree. The cars with the humongous tablets to do everything will be less desirable than the ones with a smaller (8-10 inch) and physical buttons and dials. The whole layout of the tablet dashboards won't age well and they will all look the same (like a community).
Its hard to predict what will heppend in next 25 year.... There is possibility you will have AI smarter then you and communities like xda, but for cars not phones with cutom "roms" for cars. Or nuclear winter...
Around here, the LFA's were bought by dealers and they refused to sell them due to allocations. To this day I bet there's at least five dealers that own one in the showroom.
I bought a new 4Runner a few years ago down in San Francisco and they had one hiding in the back next to the office where I signed all of my paperwork.
All of the so-called dealer LFAs were sold as of late 2020. There is no unsold unit anymore.
@@BadaBing.UCF30 There is a Lexus dealership here in the Philippines that has a white LFA that's been sitting on the floor for years. Perhaps not 100% of the LFAs have been sold yet.
@@superspec4177 who's to say the dealer didn't buy it outright?
I think if they called it the Toyota Supra people would of bought it
What always blows my mind about Doug is that he can read off stats, quirks, and features in a review without reading from anything.
When it comes to a video in his garage, he’s constantly looking at his laptop when talking about things coming from what he knows
Congratulations you have been selected among the shortlisted winner's for the ongoing Ps5 giveaway What'sapp the number above 👆..
I saw a 4C today, I always think of at it as a significant car, one of my favorites for how light it is
Sales numbers don’t lie. Most Doug has mentioned are higher end expensive vehicles. Not so many average priced vehicles. The Superbird I remember on a dealership lot up on a pedestal with a ramp. Set in the front corner of their lot. Thinking was great NASCAR car but who’d want to have that huge wing? I could not talk my father into purchasing one, not a businessman’s car and you have to realize young people didn’t have that $$ , no making $ on non existent internet
And some of these were during the recession when most people didn’t have money to buy these
One of my bold predictions is the 350 and 370z. They are dinosaurs during their own product run, manual, analog, very reliable and most of them will be modded and destroyed by kids, so in 15-20 years they will be very desirable and hard to find cars that are the last of the “old school” gasoline sports cars of their time.
My dad had a 370z 50th anniversary edition. He had to sell it because of the size of our family. Beautiful car, and while the Blackwing that replaced it is wayyyy faster, that car was really special. Nothing like the analog gauges on the dash.
Yup. Kinda going off this the 2005 generation mustang. Especially the bullit edition. Those cars will be higher regarded than the later generations due to the classic look. Also heavily modified and will be rare in good condition with a manual and V8.
350's are already starting to climb in value here in central Europe. Somewhat decent condition ones start at 15k and some owners ask up to 25k for low mileage, mint condition cars. Even the GT86 is still a very expensive car if you consider that the earliest models are already 10 years old, prices start at 20k for these ones. What do both have in common? RWD coupe, manual transmission, NA engine and Japanese and both cars weren't sold that much so there is the rarity aspect as well.
There aren’t enough
I had a 370, it’s crazy how little it was improved over the run, but it was an incredibly fun car to drive, and there are a good amount of manuals.
my predictions on future classics:
1) Fiat 124 Spider
Regardless Abarth or not, its basically a MX-5 underneath so it’s gonna be reliable and could be easy to maintain. I know it’s a unpractical car but it wasn’t meant to be anyway, and my unpopular opinion is that it looks better than the MX-5 equivalent.
2) Lotus Elise/Exige
It’s simple and reliable with the Toyota underpinnings. Prices are not extremely expensive but eventually it will be one of the all time greats.
3) Mercedes S63/65 AMG COUPÉ
Yes, specifically the coupé as when it came out, no one really bought one coz it was too expensive but with the space, power and amenities, they WILL be appreciated in times to come
The Exige and Elise have already increased in value a bit. I actually almost bought an Exige S at a local dealer back in 2015 or 2016 (It was the only one I had ever seen anywhere near me and I was going to trade both of my cars for it because I’d always wanted one) and it sold while I was out of town for the weekend. It was listed for sale at $52k. Nowadays it’s hard to find a similar one for less than $75 or $80k.
124 abarth is my favorite too, it is very beautiful and stand outs a lot.
Going to piggyback here - anyone have views on the Ferrari California T?
Would love to own any of those cars one day, sure a lot of enthusiasts will feel the same
I agree with the exception of the power train being Fiat sourced not Mazda so it won't be as reliable as the regular MX5.
When I read the title, I knew the Honda/Acura NSX must be on the list! Great talk Doug 💯
Personally, I think any V-series Cadillac with a manual transmission will appreciate in value.
Still can't afford one now but hope springs eternal.
“Still can’t afford one” then why are you praising a cars value? What a stupid point smh
Whut?
All I have to say is CTS V Wagons that are manual
Im going to argue doug on this to a degree, while a lot of the cars may have been unpopular in their day saleswise, to a lot of people who grew up with them in games and by watching top gear and stuff, they were extremely loved and popular culturally, they didnt sell because most of us weren't old enough to buy cars, now that we are older and have jobs that pay us decently enough, the prices have followed along as more and more of us are getting old enough and earning enough money to buy these cars
I agree, back in the day I had nothing against the Lexus LFA as I knew it from watching a lot of Motor Trend and seeing it in Forza. Though, 12 year old me would have zero idea of the actual climate and tastes of the car market
@@geronimowindow same here, for me while Forza and Gran Turismo introduced me to a lot of cars, Top Gear is one of my biggest introductions to cars like this as a kid
Well that is exactly what makes all these cars go up... new Supra, NSX and all the other cars mentioned are being idolized by younger kids now, while people who can afford them go and buy their childhood dream cars instead. Makes them rarer, they stop production, children get older and start buying them driving the prices up, and the cycle continues with next generation of kids and new cars. You're agreeing with his point, just coming at it from a different angle
@@davidsucks922 Doug is saying these cars were unpopular and not desired back then. This is blatantly false they were not bought in the hundreds because people couldn't afford them. Not because of the reasons Doug is saying.
Yeah when Doug said "don't say those cars were popular because they weren't", I disagree with that to an extent. Many of the cars mentioned in the video were popular, just that they weren't selling because they weren't popular with those who could afford them. That doesn't mean they weren't popular at all. I still remember back in 2013 or 14, I watched the Top Gear episode where Jeremy drove the yellow Lexus LFA, and I got an LFA myself in NFS World and I so badly wished I owned one in real life but obviously, I wasn't rich enough to afford one. And even right now I wish I owned a new gen NSX but again, still not rich enough to afford one.
Edit: the LFA point I made could be applied to many other cars as well.
If I remember correctly, you couldnt just buy an LFA. You had to be selected, at the time Lexus would not sell you the car outright. You had to lease it for certain amount of time, then they gave you an option to buy it out. I think that would be a big factor for poor sales
That, and the fact they were $300K out of the gate. Now they're a Million dollar car.
Another example of this anomaly that I've seen is the Ford Excursion. When it came out, they were hard to sell because no one wanted such a large truck that got such horrible gas mileage. Now, with SUV's being so popular, even really worn out, rusting Excursions sell for over 10 grand, and I expect their price will just keep increasing. There's simply nothing else on the market like it that fills the same space it does.
Hard to mention manual 355 / 360 without also including the Gallardo with a manual. Fewer Gallardos were produced than 360s and believed to be only 300 of the gated V10s in the US.
The ultimate flex would be to pull up in a manual 599. I’ve been hearing that there are less than 10 ever made in the entire world, and one sold for 700k a couple years ago.
I'm really happy the Chevy SS is finally getting some love from enthusiasts. My father got to take a test drive in one, and man that car was absolutely stellar. He didn't end up buying it due to not being able to get a good deal with the dealer, though.
That’s a shame, wasn’t a good deal back then, but unaffordable now.. He must be kicking himself, as it’s the one that got away...
Holden sleep er 💯
It's a Holden Commodore
Awesome performance but it sure is a boring looking car. Looks-wise it does nothing for me.
@@rickhunter6513 you guys don't know. It's a mainstream sedan. The SS is the powered up version. It's a legend in Australia. Kind of what the M5 is to the normal 5 series
I remember a S2000 CR at a local dealer that sat there for almost a year. It wasn’t that they weren’t appreciated. It was really expensive when at the time you could get used ones for far less. People didn’t buy them because of the price to benefit. Now that’s the one people want because it is the best version they made.
The LFA was always desirable. It was the $400,000 price tag that kept them from selling quickly.
desirable not to the people who were actually in the market to purchase one
The problem with the LFA was the skyline matched its performance for less than half the price
@@alexli5279 Yep, the crowd willing to drop that kind of money typically wants a badge that carries more prestige.
yep, i vividly remember the top gear review where Richard Hammond said it was a great car but crazy overpriced. they were double the price of Murcielagos which is crazy.
I’ve been in sales at a GM dealership for 10 years. The SS had a 20% discount at one point. Yep, $10k off. That one hurts!
Good. It should’ve been that way.
The few cars I can imagine this happening to - Lexus F cars and LC500. The NA V8 with insane reliability, and the LC500 is pretty undervalued already.
Also the Prowler. Moderately low mileage examples regularly trade for $30k. Bonded aluminum experiment with a decently reliable 3.5 V6 that can sound ok imo (or hemi swap it). Very few open wheel vehicles that are street legal.
Also eventually/hopefully the 944 Turbo's Japanese counterparts. I have a blast in my Mitsu Starion - $7k for a turboed 4cyl, leather, manual, under 100k miles, no major issues. I prefer the 944 in looks but mine is not far behind.
I think this happening to the Plymouth Prowler was always pretty inevitable, and they weren't sales bombs when new, so probably not the best examples for this list. He missed the eternally overlooked Cadillac Blackwing models though, none of which have sold well and I think should have been included here.
What about the Lexus IS500?
2018 LCs are still listed on dealer sites for $72-85k.
@@CarShopping101 Ok...Chris..
I believe the Inspirational Series LC500 are the ones that will appreciate the most… I actually own a 2021 coupe (#29) and 2021 convertible (#43) LC500 Inspiration Series… a $121K MSRP 21 inspirational series convertible just sold for $182K on BaT, $192K at Barrett and $179K on autotrader…
Thanks Doug, that was very informative. A solid theory I agree with.
Thanks for sharing your insights. I'd add to your list the Alfa Romeo Giulia Quadrifoglio. It was a halo car, costing more to make than they sold for, but what a fine car.
That car is the most interesting and beautiful FR sport sedan made in the last 20 years.
Lexus LFA sitting for years is an understatement. In 2020, there were still ones that were never sold in the US.
Honestly as an enthusiast I really did always love the BMW 8 series. My problem was that I was too young and too poor to actually buy one
The problem is not that you couldn't afford buying one, but who could they didn't either.
Future classic: Audi TTRS
It's in the last year of production, it's the last generation of an iconic model, it has the legendary 5-cylinder engine that sounds great, low sale numbers mean it's a pretty rare car, the build quality is very good, it's reliable, unfortunately a lot of people are modifying them, so finding a good one will be pretty hard.
Also on my list: Porsche Cayman GT4, Lotus Elise, BMW M2, Ford Focus RS, Jaguar F-Type
Facts, I have a mk2 TT vr6 with relatively low miles so I’m hoping one day it will go up in value as the v6’s are rarer!
I agree wholeheartedly with the BMW 8 series!! I found one of those less than 4 years ago for less than $19k and in fantastic condition truly I knew it was one that would eventually skyrocket... Agree especially on the Chevy SS I had no idea what it was equipped with until I watched your review and I was blown away with the options, driver aids and goodness, the power that it was hiding under the hood!! I also wonder if the last BMW NA M3(I think like '08-'13 not straight six) could be a big one that becomes desirable.. In a world of everything Turbo'd from sports cars to minivans, a High revving, 4.0liter, NA V8 with 414HP, 6-speed manual (DCT was optional) seems like just the ingredients for something that'll be cherished... Last, but not least, the 2011-2014 Cadillac CTS-V Sport Wagon with a manual!!!!!! Bro, the epitome of limited run with only 514 were built in that 4 year span I honestly cannot in good conscience believe this one got left off your list.... But, def a fantastic and thought provoking list!!!!
I really hope this doesn’t bite me in the future. I’m just 17 but I still want my own 1987 C4 Corvette with less than 50k miles before their prices soar to the moon
Those will not soar value. You're going to want to stock pile unique parts like interior and exterior parts. The hard part will be to find parts for those as they are not desirable and lack aftermarket support.
@Steven Shorts 🅥 i hate these comments so much.
@Steven Shorts 🅥 i hate these comments so much.
Pre lt1 youre safe bro, go get ur 200hp icon
Don't lose hope!! You'll get your dream car. They seem super rare and hard to come by, but there is almost an incomprehensible amount of every car out there. That is not a far fetched goal and within a few years I know you'll end up finding the perfect one!
Last generation Toyota Celica with the TRD kit and 6 speed manual with the high revving Yamaha engine.
These look really cool and sound great. Also the last generation MR2 Spyder
As long as people fix the oil pump issue should be fine...
My friend recently picked up a last gen manual mr2 spyder for 4k in fair condition, i think theyll definitely be valuable one day as one of the last affordable mid engine sports cars.
There's a difference between "unpopular at the time" and "I liked that car at the time". Several on Doug's list appealed to me then and now - just wish I had a place to keep such animals and keep them in good shape / maintain them. "Collector car" speculation is usually a loosing game - only collect cars if you can afford to loose on them - sometimes though you do win.
Always have loved the BMW 850i.
My own story: looked at a few 997 Turbos going stupid cheap early in the lockdown. Couldn’t get wife approval. Like to remind her how quickly their prices jumped back up.
Last year I found a 1998 Supra RZ-S manual with 83K miles for $40K. wife said no. Right now its worth over $100K-120K!!! This is after I bought my R34 GTR Mspec Nur 2 years ago, shipped it to Canada which has more than doubled in value.
C7 Zr1 prices are insane right now.
And it's my realistic dream car 😭
Because c8s are trash and not Corvettes
I have one theory of prices: When a car is relaunched, there will be a lot of interest about the original. Bronco is a good example. When collectors buy a new car, it is cool to have the original one beside it. The 911 speedester is also a good example, the old increased in value when the new came.
Integra 🤭
“The enthusiast cars that aren’t popular now”
Laughs in Alfa Romeo.
Really interesting view and I do mostly agree. And I even would go so far (at this point of the economy) that some of the cars have for sure the potential to outpace the stock market and real estate.
However one part hasn’t been touched which will have a huge impact: environments legislative!
If there is a dramatic shift what kind of cars you will be able to (reasonably) drive, you will feel a huge difference in cars which will be desirable. It won’t have so much an impact in collectors cars (like the Acura NSX) but it will have an effect in rather cars which are produced in greater numbers. Like Lexus’ etc.
also something like a luxury goods tax might be a killer for the values.
i8 still looks insane for a car made in 2013. It will probably be as cool and fresh as other cars in 2030+.
One noticeable characteristic many of these share: they were made before the 2008 financial crisis. so their value absolutely cratered along with house values, the stock market, gold, petroleum, and even “safe” bonds. It was an excellent buying opportunity - but only if you had ready cash to step up and take the car from the desperate seller.
The lesson: build up a cash reserve and be patient. The next time there is a financial crisis you’ll be ready to shop with confidence.
Their value never cratered lol. The value of money did that's why their price went down cuz it was a RECESSION.
Many years ago at the Reno auto museum, the tour guide said that they predict future value largely on survival rate. The idea being not reliability, but that people go to greater lengths to keep special cars from getting scrapped.
The biggest thing, I believe, with the 'tHeY wErE hUgElY pOpUlAr WhEn ThEy WeRe NeW...' is that the people that they truly were desired by just couldn't afford them while those who actually could afford them didn't want them.
I’ll have to throw a car in the list there. The 2016-2020 Lexus GSF. I recently just bought one as a new daily but I noticed that all the ones listed for $40-45k during the pandemic in 2020 are now 60-80k for a 2016-2020 with some as high as $100k used. I only got lucky with mine with my work discount. Def more fun and sexier than the IS500 F Performance.
Yeah only 127 2020 GS Fs were made and I found one in Flare Yellow. Only one Flare Yellow was sold in 2020 so it's the last one ever made/sold. They want $82,999 for it which is pretty high. It has only 7,812 miles and has full PPF already.
@@CarShopping101 yeah it’s crazy, I really wanted a Ultrasonic Blue Mica colored one but couldn’t justify paying $15-18k more for one. So I settled one a black one through my work and with my employee discounts I got it down to $45k for a 2016 GSF.
I had been eyeing them for years. When I was ready to buy recently the prices has gone up $10-20k. I got my 2016 for $52k where it should’ve been $40-$45k. But that can be said about any car. Used car market has gone up 30-40% in general. However, the hope is the the GSF does go up in value. My concern is though with low investment in oil and gas exploration due to policy, politics,and the shift to greener energy, oil and gad prices will continue to increase due to low supply and governments will also continue to discourage ICE cars while pushing EVs. Who knows there might be a carbon tax on gasoline as well. That means it’s going to be very expensive to run V8s and they might become less desirable. I don’t know…
@@bilalsiddiqui3329 yeah, that’s the one reason I pulled the trigger on getting my GSF, got it through my work discount for $45k out the door with 60k miles. Loving every minute of it
Everybody when Doug was listing examples: “please say my car, please say my car”
GTRs have already gone up in Australia. Was looking to get one of these a little later on, 08 models were going for 80K but now are about 120K. With no more GTRs being allowed in Australia I think the price of them will keep going up.
I have a feeling that the Kia Stinger is going to be one of these cars. I will be holding on to my 2018 Sunset Yellow Limited GT for sure!
It’s similar to the chevy ss
So basically it's cars that are cool and rare, making the connection from poor sales to rarity I guess is the key
My prediction for a future classic: Abarth 124 (sales fail, over-shadowed by MX-5, didn't make many, but is still a great fun RWD, manual, lightweight sports car- something that wont exist in years to come!)
Good pick!
Here in Italy those Abarth 124 never really depreciated. In 2018 , new those were between 32 and 44K Euros depending on the spec. I can still see low mileage 2016 ones trading for 33K.Only Higher mileage low spec ones trades for less then 30K. Also I am not so sure how much more they will appreciate as Fiat have a bad history of just discontinue spare parts after 10-15 years, which it will make it hard to repair and sure it will break. On thing that some of the cars Doug mentioned have in common and a reason why the are appreciating is because they are baked my the manufacture in terms of replacements parts (Ferrari, Porsche, BMW, Honda, Mercedes) or they have a strong community around them.
@@giovannifacci You make a good point! We have a 124 Abarth in our family, a late 2018 model- its had 3 exhaust backboxes, a roof and the turbo recently blew 😅 so not the most reliable
@@giovannifacci It's a Mazda, though. FIAT is not the company making these parts, so no need to worry, there will be a ton of parts for decades to come
@@Scisca1a2a the engine is totally different. Body panels as well. Fiat supplies the parts. Mazda run the assembly. It's not just a rebadge MX-5 like for example a BRZ and a GT86
Soon as this video started I thought the LFAs gotta be on this list! I expect the CT5 blackwing manual will be well desired in the future
The blackwings are selling for 200k now.
So all you need to do is buy an expensive enthusiast car, that’s down in value, preferably during a recession when no one has money, and hold it, store it, and sell it a decade later? Fantastic trick.
This is so true. I remember Lexus still trying to sell new 2014 LFAs in 2018. I never thought it would ever be appreciated. Lexus already lost money on every LFA they sold so it must've been brutal when very few customers were buying it.
Doug The type of dude to wear a District Of Columbia shirt
next he'll be wearing a Marion Barry shirt
Doug you are wise beyond your years. The issue is we don't all have extra money and garage space to stash a "depricitiating" asset.
But man if we did 👌
Great epizod Doug , thank you.
*One I think you might have missed or maybe they’re not sold in the US market: the previous gen/current Audi TTS/RS. Small, tossable, great power and they’ve been threatening to cancel them for years.*
And they are still at a good price. I've seen TTRS on the used market in EU for 30k ish euro. The RS3, more practical car with same engine/drivetrain, trades +5k-10k euro more. And the 2.5L 4cylinder engine is insane. You can easy get 500-600hp on them! I think once the R8 goes up in price, the TT-S/RS will go as well since most people nicknamed it "the baby R8".
Absolutely agree. I've been saying this about the W210 chassis Mercedes. A clean one today is rare let alone a clean one 10 or 20 years from now. This car was iconic and widely emulated and people still hate it.
Therefore I would partially extend this theory to include cars that began a new era for the brand and an attempt to capture a wider market share, but not purchased by the type of buyer that cared enough to preserve them.
Particularly the non-AMG V8 W210s, still kicking myself for passing on a $4500 2000 E430 and going for a arguably tamer X5 3.0i instead.
Any naturally aspirated V6 V8 and I6 Mercedes are going up in Value. I have an SLK 320 6 speed manual and a C280 5 speed manual. They will shoot up simply because of displacement downsizing. Same with the CLKs 208, especially the convertibles. They all rust like hell but values will go up
what u guys think about a regular 190e 92, shall i keep it, rust free
@@Retexz Depends on the model and year but 190Es are deffo rising, albeit slowly. The Inline 6 models and the 16 Valve 2.3 and 2.5s are worth the most but clean ones are worth keeping for now. The first Baby Benz🔥 and they're over engineered so strong af and will last for years to come if you look after it
@@BadaBing.UCF30 Why the non-AMG's? The original E55 AMG's sold in very small numbers and had the same severe rust issues as all the other W210's, so likely not many left that are clean, unmodified, and still roadworthy today.
The Toyota FJ! Of all the cars Doug listed, these are still relatively modern, affordable and have proven Toyota reliability as well as good parts availability.
I agree with Doug's viewpoints. I remember hearing a story where a man bought Hemi Cudas, zr1 Camaro's, Boss 429 etc, when they were just used cars in the early 70s and now they trade hands for millions!
I'm buying up a few cars I'm predicting will go up in value.
@@andydhillon1977 Best of luck
The first gen Ford Raptor, with the 6.2, will be really desirable in a few years from now when everything is switching to smaller displacement engines, turbocharging, hybrids, and EV. The first gen raptor is the only generation that came with a NA V8. Then they started switching to the 3.5 ecoboost. And it was the introduction to the offroad bias pickup.
I agree with this one for sure
Yay more people praising cars they will never buy because they will be overpriced and unaffordable
Will it? Gas prices aren’t coming down
As long as it’s not abused then yes, it will. However they’re supposedly going to offer a V8 in the Raptor R.
A lot of these only became desirable BECAUSE they were cancelled. So saying "I bet the company regrets cancelling it early" is just wrong 11:48. A lot of rich people don't really care much for good cars. They care about unique or rare ones.
We are starting to see rise in value on 82-92 Firebird and Camaro. Although it seems the current crop of owners wants to do everything to keep their value down but the really nice ones are going up
This gives me hopes for my is250 manual. Was pretty hard to find a manual version, but the better mpg, better engagement and acceleration i feel will keep the value a bit higher. Keep in mind we didn't get the 350 in Europe, so it was either 220d, 250 or isf much later
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I like how he mentioned the Alfa 4C , it’s a sweet car you can and still get one for a decent price. A lot of people need to understand that without Alfa Romeo they’re would have never been Ferrari and this story goes way back.
He mentioned the ‘Alpha 4C’ (see the text in the video). I wonder if that’s another car… 🫢
I own the Alfa 159 ti tbi sportswagon. This version has the same 1750 tbi engine as the 4C, as well as all the end of run bells and whistles.
Here in Australia, they only brought 2 wagons into the country and the rest were all sedans.
With a manual transmission and the rarity in this spec, nostalgia with the 4C engine and desirable wagon, I've anticipated it will rise in value too.
It truly is Alfa's last great sports orientated wagon.
Great video! I truly feel nice higher end examples of the current Dodge Charger will be collectible in the future. It’s such a polarizing vehicle because it’s a four door (not true to the original) and people either love them or absolutely hate them
How do you think the move towards gas alternatives play into the values of some of the cars mentioned as potential value gainers in the future?
Interesting video, thanks for making great content. I think there's a nostalgia factor in there - I thought the BMW 8 series was cool as can be when it was new, but at the time I could barely afford gas money for my 79 Cutlass so my opinion really didn't help the fine folks at BMW. Now I'm in a place where maybe I could buy myself a modern classic, and yep that's a car I would still love to have. I suspect a whole bunch of today's muscle cars will become collectible as the last gasp of internal combustion performance - Chargers, Challengers, Mustangs, Camaros - even the Durango. And I'll bet the trend of the end of the run being most valuable will continue, as the tech has improved immensely over the past 10 years.
Most of the cars listed were never really accessible to common ppl. Maybe the S2000 but things like the Ford GT and LFA were always cool to ppl that couldn’t buy them. I’ve personally had a long love affair with the LFA and the BMW 8 series but could never really dream of owning one. Even the new NSX and M3 are currently to expensive for most ppl.
Yeah his remark "yeah well why didn't you buy one" he seems to forget that not everyone has his youtube money 🤷🏻♀️
Normal people can't buy a 3 million dollar car, that's true, but we also couldn't buy one when it was a 100k
True but people that could afford those cars were always like “Why would I get X when I could get Z, which is cheaper and cooler”. Yes, LFA was a tech marvel and sounds GLORIOUS, but you could get GTR at the time for 1/4 the price that before Hellcats, were smashing everything on the road. 400k could buy two Mclarens lol. And the 8 series was accessible to the average BMW customer, it just didn’t fit the “Ultimate Driving Machine” feel and Audi and Benz had more luxurious offerings.
Remember Doug is in very different world than us. Then again I remember a couple people in my JDM circles who were basically buying and storing the little 25-year cars right before they became legal in the US and then when they were able to import them were able to make a little bit of money but that niche only lasts for so long
True. I always wanted a Ford GT ever since they came out. Never could afford one, even when dealers were knocking $20-$30k off the $150k msrp.
@@80PercentAshamedOfU LFA was overpriced for its badge. Old 8 series didnt really matter that it didnt fit the "ultimate driving machine" moniker, extremely few BMW customers care about that. Big GT cars have always been a hard sell and BMW rarely offer anything special in this market, with a not super premium badge. Combined with bad economy, thats likely why it tanked.
Would like to get Doug's take on the 350Z Nismo...I remember people talking about how ugly the Autech bodywork was, at least the rear specifically. Still, it's a limited production run, first USA offered Nismo car directly from Nissan in an analog, stick shift package.
350Z in general are ugly cars. Seeing them in person is 10x worse
@@drippgxd the Nismo version isn’t though, it was just really out there for its time
@@Nash_Nismo I looked it up and yeah it is hideous. It’s a ricer like many 350Z trumpet owners 🤦♂️
I suspect that most 350Zs will be trashed eventually as they're becoming pretty accessable. Similar to S chassis, the ones in nice condition and cool colors will shoot up in value. Limited production / nismo versions of pretty much anything will be collectable anyway.
This is one of the best car videos I’ve ever watched! Thank you!
The i8 for sure will be a icon. A sort of Delorean from the 2010's
I always liked the LFA and the i8, Doug has to realize most of us are car geeks and watch his videos because their amusing and informational, however if I could have afforded any of these cars I would have gotten one...
Doug is saying things that make no sense too. The car plummeted jn value! He says as it sits at 300k, now its 600k. Like these numbers don't matter to normal ppl
A common trend I notice is that most of the cars he listed are at a relatively high price compared to the competition during their time. I remember that being a common complaint about a lot of the 90s JDM cars that became tuner legends. Then around 2008/2010, they became worthless. I remember seeing NSX's and Supra's go for under $20k. Now you can't get them for under $50k in bad condition lol.
@@danieljones8706 That is true the 90s NSX were going for 30 grand or under, I dont even remember 2cnd gen going for under 60/75 grand tho, and I know because I wanted one really bad and kept tracking them. I thought eventually they'd reach around 50 and I could afford them and then they shot up again lol.
same i always loved the LFA and always knew it would be something special. people at the time were so hung up about the HP and 1/4 mile time.
thanks for the video Doug, just what we need more and more people hyper focused on buying cars for pure investment purposes instead of driving them. thanks again!
My neighbor has an M4, drives it about once a month. In 20 years it'll be one of those low mileage/worth a fortune cars
Is this like an artist's work skyrocketing in value after the artist's death?
Popularity should not be equated to sales volume. I would have been more than happy to buy a LFA if I had $400k or a Viper ACR for $130k when new.
This video makes me feel like the Audi TTs (especially the 3.2 models) will be appreciated down the line. The first gen Audi TTs are pretty underrated but decent cars. Its got looks, the engine is a great sounding and quirkily displaced V6 paired up to one of the first dual clutch transmissions in a road car and all wheel drive. It was overshadowed by alternatives like the 350Z for pricing at the time. Great cars but they’ve really have brought the TT a reputation of being an overpriced underperformer when its actually a pretty fun and peppy car.
Audi's very rarely appreciate lol
The V6 models especially. I've ridden in a few and it reminded me of a BMW but I liked it and even the interior design.
@@jebril Audi 80, Audi 80 coupe, Audi Ur Quattro and sport Quattro all are going up in value
@@robingoessler4628 Totally out of Doug's thoughts are appearances in Film and TV. TV series Ashes to Ashes has to have pushed up the values of RGD Quattro's in the U.K.
Why do people praise cars that’s getting more and more unaffordable? Are we supposed to be against this?
I think limited production numbers is an important indicator. When popular enthusiast cars continue to shoot up in value, people look for a substitute. If they were limited, any demand Hoovers up the supply. Adam Corolla has also talked about the “little brother” syndrome. If the big brother with the bigger engine, etc., is too expensive, people look to the little brother. The big brother pulls up the value of the little brother
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People should buy the McLaren MP4-12C. Why? Carbon Fiber MonoCell, Proactive Chassis Control (PCC), Brake steer, Single wiper, active air brake, twin-turbo V8 flat-plane crank making 600HP (can easily make 800HP with some basic mods and tune), optional carbon ceramic 6-piston brakes, hydraulic suspension, dihedral doors, and only about 4,000 total units world-wide from around 2011-2014. Only 1,500 in the US. The 12C outperforms any car from its era, and even ten years later, it still performs well against modern sports cars. The DIY community is growing, alternative repair and maintenance shops are growing, and alternate replacement parts market is growing, making ownership and reliability better. For example, compared to the Ferrari 458, they have made between 25,000 and 30,000 units, if not more, and look how strong the market is for the 458. The 12C is very special, very rare, and it was one of the last cars Ron Dennis designed from start to finish and the 12C is the car that put McLaren back on the map. I predict that in 2-5 years the 12C will be 2-3x more expensive than the crazy bargain price it is today.
yes this, and when people realize that the engine came from a japanese race car, it will blow up in value for sure