The History of the Demiurge - An Ancient Alternate God?

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  • Опубликовано: 24 дек 2024

Комментарии • 1,5 тыс.

  • @CosmicSkeptic
    @CosmicSkeptic  3 месяца назад +109

    Get all sides of every story and be better informed at ground.news/AlexOC - subscribe for 40% off unlimited access.
    For early, ad-free access to videos, and to support the channel, subscribe to my Substack: www.alexoconnor.com

    • @japexican007
      @japexican007 3 месяца назад +1

      god of this world = satan
      It’s in the Bible as well

    • @Metso-ateco
      @Metso-ateco 3 месяца назад +2

      That tash is criminal, its got to go.

    • @robertmahaney9147
      @robertmahaney9147 3 месяца назад +4

      this pope ain't even catholic .

    • @rob_7775
      @rob_7775 3 месяца назад +3

      I love this I’m glad you’re doing this.

    • @finnjake6174
      @finnjake6174 3 месяца назад +1

      I dont get it, why does he wear the kippa when he is not religious?

  • @TheEsotericaChannel
    @TheEsotericaChannel 3 месяца назад +1008

    Great to be back on - thanks!

    • @MythVisionPodcast
      @MythVisionPodcast 3 месяца назад +40

      I'm really glad Alex had you back brother!

    • @folee_edge
      @folee_edge 3 месяца назад +33

      Esoterica is a FANTASTIC channel

    • @Godisandrogynous
      @Godisandrogynous 3 месяца назад +14

      your work is really cool

    • @japexican007
      @japexican007 3 месяца назад

      god of this world = satan
      Sincerely the Bible

    • @888_vav
      @888_vav 3 месяца назад +3

      Yall know how to kick ball.
      🙏✌ ✝️

  • @averageatom
    @averageatom 3 месяца назад +360

    Justin Sledge is one of the few RUclipsrs that discovered very early when he had just a few hundred views and it’s been astounding and gratifying to see him rise. So well deserved. Much respect to you both. I discovered this channel much more recently and the blending of two worlds is so very satisfying.

    • @Mutantcy1992
      @Mutantcy1992 3 месяца назад +16

      Plus his name is badass

    • @willmosse3684
      @willmosse3684 3 месяца назад +1

      @@Mutantcy1992Sounds like a Sledgehammer of Justice or something! Hero name!

    • @ElyonDominus
      @ElyonDominus 3 месяца назад +4

      I am a fairly recent viewer of his content. It's some of the best on the breadth of religious and cultural topics he covers.

    • @nayrtnartsipacify
      @nayrtnartsipacify 3 месяца назад

      Its too bad he is an insufferable leftist.

    • @Rabbithole8
      @Rabbithole8 3 месяца назад +2

      He's amazing.

  • @highdesertbiker
    @highdesertbiker 8 дней назад +8

    This is one of the most interesting videos Ive ever seen about the history of Christianity. I grew up Catholic, went to catholic school, was an alter boy, studied the bible, studied it in college...I never learned any of this. This information is so important for people to know. Im literally mind blown right now writing this. Thank you so much Alex for having these interviews. You have one of the best RUclips channels and are so cool for me to listen to. I feel like we would be friends in another life. These really help me understand more of whats really going on in the world

  • @Rydonattelo
    @Rydonattelo 3 месяца назад +235

    ESOTERICA! My main man. The black metal wizard/ rabbi. I absolutely adore his work. He finds the perfect middle ground to talk about religion, necromancy, the occult but with a logical way that is more of a study. He's an expert on the subject, not a preacher. Great collaboration Alex. Fantastic teacher to anyone interested in learning about this history of these subjects.

    • @Rydonattelo
      @Rydonattelo 3 месяца назад +19

      @jordancrago5129 He's Jewish but as far as I know he's agnostic. He's an absolute expert on theology of religion and the the history of esoteric practice. He has a PhD.

    • @josifcekic5772
      @josifcekic5772 3 месяца назад +2

      @jordancrago5129 If I remember correctly, I stumbled upon something he said on reddit and I remember reading that he said he was a Marxist anti-theist. Pretty laughably ironic

    • @Mamba4.8
      @Mamba4.8 3 месяца назад

      ​​​​​@@josifcekic5772 All Gnostic are Marxist and it's all deception.
      It's the antichrist which was written originally "pseudo Christ". In place of Christ, inverted Christ. " Subtle" like the serpent.
      Where Christ taught a communist style brotherhood that looks up to God, this teaches a communism that man is God.
      It acts 50 percent as Christ, while being 50 percent inversion.
      . it's why they brought out Dionysus at the Olympics acting like the last supper. It's why the assassin (where the Templar's learned gnosticism and brought it to the west) brought the torch (light bearer) carried the torch.
      That was the new order shouting out " we have now came to the surface"
      Gnosticism is what the story in the garden of Eden and the Serpent is about. The first serpent lie of "did god tell you this, I tell you that".
      Most of us that studied this deeply for years have warned a gnostic explosion is going to come around 2020, as it's the deconstruction of Christianity and the old world and ushering the new world and religion of the new age, humanism, man as God, to easier usher in Marxism. It'll be a psuedo form. It's literally the new order.
      It's why there's an explosion of gnosticism all over the Internet simultaneously while Marxism gripped and took over politics and entertainment.
      Those who warned of this, to the T, were silenced in the 90s and Early 2000s.
      It's the biggest deception yet. As it was written in the new testament, this pseudo Christ was always in the earth, since the beginning.
      Of course Christians don't understand their religion either, and we can all argue whether they think it was a good religion or not, but objectively this is what it is.
      Which makes me wonder deeply, as an agnostic objective person, if Christ predicted this so perfectly along with the new testament writers and came at the exact perfect time at the end of the age, and they are so hell bent on undermining him since the start, people need to question to themselves. He may be real, and it's the most important thing anyone will ever question. Spiritually and politically. And even with that, everything mainstream Christianity gives us was perverted as well.
      But it's the fact that Christ prophecies and the writers alleged as Peter and Paul so perfectly predicted this, that should give anyone cause for concern. Over 2000 years ago, it was written this would come at the end of the age. And that's where we are right now

    • @JohnnyKooter
      @JohnnyKooter 2 месяца назад +6

      ​@@josifcekic5772Highly doubt he said he was anti theist, he probably said non theist.

    •  2 месяца назад +3

      Figures the guy making fun of Christmas would be a literal fking Necromancer.

  • @RodencyRoyalist
    @RodencyRoyalist 3 месяца назад +378

    I am beginning to fear that moustache is the demiurge... We protest and protest yet it endures in its malevolence.

    • @Britishboi303
      @Britishboi303 3 месяца назад +11

      Literally

    • @rech3771
      @rech3771 3 месяца назад +8

      😂

    • @justacanofbeans8217
      @justacanofbeans8217 3 месяца назад +11

      Exactly, please Alex, please.

    • @Wetstache
      @Wetstache 3 месяца назад +6

      That stache is weak.

    • @willmosse3684
      @willmosse3684 3 месяца назад +26

      It’s definitely not the perfect platonic form of a moustache - That’s the evil worldly bodged version 😂

  • @jeffh2166
    @jeffh2166 3 месяца назад +94

    Justin was your best guest so far on these biblical deep dives episodes

  • @thefrostyscoop
    @thefrostyscoop 3 месяца назад +88

    Dr sledge was one of my professors at MCA, really made me interested in esoteric history before he even had a channel! Stoked to see you sit down with him 2 of my favorite channels collabing!!!❤

  • @ShatteredWindowpane
    @ShatteredWindowpane 3 месяца назад +26

    Please do 50 more episodes with Esoterica! These are the best episodes

  • @maryc9919
    @maryc9919 Месяц назад +27

    'The most dangerous thing to scripture is to simply read it.' That is an enduring truth. At 13 yrs, I read the Bible as preparation for my confirmation sacrament. It reenforced every doubt I'd ever had about god and the church. I've been an atheist/humanist ever since.

    • @michaelvess6507
      @michaelvess6507 Месяц назад +4

      Now explore NDEs (Near Death Experiences) and discover a perfectly loving “God”, and it will liberate you from all of the lies of religion.

    • @ruirodtube
      @ruirodtube Месяц назад +7

      I also found that people who call themselves Christians never read the Bible and don’t know the stories in it. 😅

    • @michaelvess6507
      @michaelvess6507 Месяц назад +5

      @
      Mark Twain said “the best cure for Christianity is reading the Bible “.

    • @ElDogeRenacido
      @ElDogeRenacido 29 дней назад +1

      Let me guess. You started from the Old Testament and now think God is some cruel and evil entity due to a dangerous presupposition YOU walked in with, in reading Scripture. Inevitably found the unapologetic historical narrative, then mistakenly took those cruel acts done by sinful men to be the perfect will of a merciful and loving God...
      Sister. I say this with love. Scripture isn't "cut and dry." It is far more nuanced, esoteric, and intentional in its language than you can possibly imagine.
      And you realize, Bible=collection of books?
      Written years apart from each other. Centuries, even millenia apart, depending on which book of Scripture to which.
      Come to your local Eastern Orthodox Church with all of your inquiries. It sounds like(and please correct me if wrong) you were a Roman Catholic. Please, genuinely pause, and reflect on this.
      The value of a human soul is a human soul; we are all the image/icon of God, and He does love us, even as we are unfaithful. The sun does shine, and rain falls upon the righteous and wicked still, is this not true?

    • @doktordumb
      @doktordumb 22 дня назад

      ​@@ElDogeRenacido so, the Bible doesn't say what's cle
      Arly written in it, but every whishy washy thing one can imagine to feel better about it.if it's so, why don't you just ditch it?
      Also, in the gospels, Jesus keeps saying that he came to fulfill the old testament, the way it was understood in 1st century A. D., i. e. the literal way.

  • @IfYouSeekCaveman
    @IfYouSeekCaveman 3 месяца назад +37

    Been waiting for this. The last podcast with Justin Sledge is my favorite you've done. His breadth of knowledge, and his ability to recall and communicate that knowledge is incredible.

    • @mikeluns
      @mikeluns 25 дней назад

      You’re a lost idiot

  • @Stoneworks
    @Stoneworks 3 месяца назад +94

    I love Esoterica, fantastic channel. Can't wait to watch

    • @kapasian9009
      @kapasian9009 3 месяца назад +1

      The legend is here!

    • @jooseppielleese7156
      @jooseppielleese7156 3 месяца назад

      I remember that dude too was suprised he ended up on here, is he jewish?

  • @AnonymousAlcoholic772
    @AnonymousAlcoholic772 3 месяца назад +115

    I never understood why, given their history, Jews insist on believing that their God is benevolent. One would think that all the evidence points to the opposite.

    • @rodrigomachado5291
      @rodrigomachado5291 3 месяца назад +42

      It’s a kind of spiritual Stockholm Syndrome. Just look at Leonard Cohen’s last album. His bitterness towards his God.

    • @SineN0mine3
      @SineN0mine3 3 месяца назад +24

      It's fairly simple, within religious thought things like benevolence, goodness or love are defined by God's actions. Benevolence just means whatever God would have done so whatever God does is automatically benevolent. If it appears to you to be cruel and that appears to contradict benevolence that's due to your failure to understand God, benevolence or cruelty.
      A lowly human cannot understand God's plan or why the things he does out of love appear to be cruel, and to try to prove God wrong is a fool's errand if he defines what is right.
      I think that's why, as the guest says the history of Yaweh is nore compelling than philosophical and logical arguments.
      Philosophy and logic are ultimately tools for thinking and they can be used or abused for good or bad, the history is what it is for good or bad.
      Ok maybe God invented all the stories that came before his story, but why would a god do that? Of all the cryptic things God has ever done, telling us all the ither gods existed was probably his biggest mistake...

    • @Neognostic-pk5wu
      @Neognostic-pk5wu 3 месяца назад +26

      ​​​@@SineN0mine3it's like you're so close to making that philosophical leap, but your dogmatism has just prevented you from quite landing it yet.
      You even illustrated the complete inconsistent nature of divine morality that a lot of apologists tend to skirt around in philosophical discussions about morality being objective because they know how utterly circular it becomes when God becomes the arbiter of an "objective" standard. But unlike them, you fly into it head-on. Bravo 😅

    • @arturhashmi6281
      @arturhashmi6281 3 месяца назад

      Yeah, cause Leonard Cohen's album is theologically representative for Judaism and the problem of evil, because Cohen was Jewish.
      Atheism is kind of cosmic nihilism, just look at Lovecraft and his books.
      Atheism is kind of comical rationalism, just look at Ricky Gervais and his comedy.
      Anecdotal evidence is a common logical fallacy, It is better to be aware of that.

    • @arturhashmi6281
      @arturhashmi6281 3 месяца назад +12

      The Book of Job is lit. their answer for that, this book is a poem about the Evil in the world and why it exists. Is it a good explanation? Thats not for me to say. Im not Jewish nor Christian, but It is clear that they were asking themselves that question about 2,5k years ago as well and I recommend you to read it, It is undoubtly one of the classic books of western culture.
      We need to remember that Yahwe starts his career as one of the bronze age patriarchal Gods representing particular tribe and later he is transformed into monotheistic God of all, probably during Babylonian exile, because we can see that shift clearly in the Book of Isaiah, where the God is eg. said to be the creator of good and evil as well.
      When the multiple people creates one canon of books during more then thousand years, It would be surprising if all of their beliefs were completely compatible.
      Sorry for my poor English. Cheers.

  • @Fearia6
    @Fearia6 3 месяца назад +31

    I'm loving the gnostic deep dives, this is one of my favorite topics.

  • @spiralsausage
    @spiralsausage 3 месяца назад +7

    Dr Sledge is brilliant and I'm so grateful that you are both making high quality discussions public and accessible ❤

  • @eM_Wu
    @eM_Wu 3 месяца назад +24

    What a delightful theme for Sunday evening

  • @MythVisionPodcast
    @MythVisionPodcast 3 месяца назад +45

    Perfect guest for a not-so-perfect world! Great conversation so far ‎@CosmicSkeptic & ‎@TheEsotericaChannel ! This should be an ongoing series of conversations. ❤

    • @pilotnamealreadytaken6035
      @pilotnamealreadytaken6035 3 месяца назад +4

      Agreed
      I love getting to listen to Justin actually conversate. He is very well spoken and carries a convo on a pro level

    • @willmosse3684
      @willmosse3684 3 месяца назад +3

      Two of our finest thinkers! And explainers! And for a bonus - Mythvision in the chat! What a team!

    • @markbell9973
      @markbell9973 3 месяца назад +1

      ​@@willmosse3684
      Agreed! Love you two. ...to the point of hanging on every one of ya'all's words. Here comes a case in point. Alex: I "got hanged" (read: ya killed it / sick, man!) when you advanced a word we all knew was not quite "le mot juste." Then ensued an atypical pause, which was beautifully respected by your interlocutor.
      (!Bravissimo¡❤)
      But finally you resorted to a 3-fold gradation, which made your mind clear as language can be. All in the space of about 3 seconds. Mad respect!
      I just ditched a much longer comment. Why?
      I had re-become a doctoral student pounding out my dissertation. Had I continued with that tack, what I originally intended as a validation plain-n-simple would have become ... hmm: idk. And that would have taken me the better of a week. Ugghh. IVORY.tower-ism.
      ===
      So. Just 1 random quip from my aborted dissertation.
      RE: the construct named trinity/Dreifaltigkeit/la trinité
      Your critique of/take on this construct would have earned you the death penalty by slow roasting at the stake with wet wood and a public orgy of ridicule as the roasting dragged on. Where? In Calvin's Geneva.
      Was about to say that we as a worldwide civilization have made progress since then. BUT. Have we?? Now in 2024 we are "making America great again" which in some highly influential circles is code for a return to Geneva, 1500s style. Sounds insane? That's bc it is. Crudely, wildly, savagely insane.
      Thanks for your work, men! Mark (rural Arizona by birth and upbringing)

  • @roylaufer9233
    @roylaufer9233 3 месяца назад +20

    I realize that this is not a zoological discourse, but donkeys are fertile (where do you think we get donkeys from?). He is getting donkeys confused with mules, who are cross-bred donkeys with horses, that are very rarely able to reproduce.

    • @kiefersands720
      @kiefersands720 2 месяца назад

      This man is an idiot, he is making claims about beliefs that are way to specific and controversial to be said without giving a direct source.

    • @TylerJames-yu5hf
      @TylerJames-yu5hf Месяц назад

      Lots of facts they don’t have straight in this episode…

    • @vec0013
      @vec0013 День назад

      @@TylerJames-yu5hfcan you point out a couple?Im just curious,because Im not so well informed in this topic.
      Im not religious,but I am interested in learning it.

  • @foppishdilletaunt9911
    @foppishdilletaunt9911 3 месяца назад +15

    Thank you @Esoterica Dr Sledge for your learning, sophistication and humour. Always interesting and edifying.

  • @zevkurtzman8108
    @zevkurtzman8108 3 месяца назад +20

    Ive been waiting for Dr. Sledge to come back

  • @samwillard5688
    @samwillard5688 Месяц назад

    Glad to listen, thank you for having this conversation.

  • @danielmcdonald6227
    @danielmcdonald6227 3 месяца назад +43

    This is exactly what I needed right now. Just been reading a similar wiki article only for this to pop up

    • @AndrewHill-ly2mh
      @AndrewHill-ly2mh 3 месяца назад +8

      That’s a sign from some version of some version of some god or other. REPENT TO ALL OF THEM NOW, TO COVER YOUR BASES! 😂

    • @danielmcdonald6227
      @danielmcdonald6227 3 месяца назад +8

      @@AndrewHill-ly2mh haha oh shit you’re right. Well, I’m off to commit self-flagellation now then…

  • @davidkeller6156
    @davidkeller6156 20 дней назад +1

    Just an excellent discussion/interview. I am so impressed by Dr. Sledge.

  • @drdre3903
    @drdre3903 2 месяца назад +5

    Hello. I have been a "marcionist" for almost 15 years now and i really enjoyed this talk. Glad to see that the world is more and more interested in this topic. This is not a faith but an onthological way of understanding the foundations of morality, thats why we call ourselves gnostics. The only real reason for suffering can be boiled down to simple ignorance, and this ignorance we inherited from the demiurge (The one who plays with people). As Jesus said " forgive them for they do not know what they are doing".

    • @johdewit9327
      @johdewit9327 Месяц назад +1

      Not trying to be argumentative but looking at the original Greek, it seems to suggest that not everything is forgiven.
      (Koine Greek had no commas)
      "Father forgive them not for they know what they do".
      "We reap what we sow."

  • @llireficul
    @llireficul 19 дней назад +1

    Everything Dr Justin Sledge talks about is so fascinating.

  • @joshuas9236
    @joshuas9236 3 месяца назад +4

    Your videos are never short. But these feature length interviews are great.
    Dr. Sledge is such a smart dude, I’ve been excited for this video since you announced it in your QnA.
    If I ever learn his secrets in how to find buried treasure I’ll cut you in too.

  • @NIMM_VOID
    @NIMM_VOID 2 месяца назад +2

    i'm an ex-christian going on 12 years and you two are my favorite to engage with philosophically & religiously.

    • @drunvert
      @drunvert Месяц назад

      Jesus is still Jesus, sent by Sophia, in the gnostic texts

  • @misterOphilies
    @misterOphilies 3 месяца назад +16

    These are great conversations you have with Dr. Sledge. Thank you.

  • @kameelffarag
    @kameelffarag Месяц назад +2

    Justin Sledge is a treasure of knowledge. Thanks Alex for connecting with a great academic

  • @Vampyr_000
    @Vampyr_000 3 месяца назад +30

    Alex o Connor and my favorite occultist

    • @I-am-Hrut
      @I-am-Hrut 3 месяца назад

      Dr. Sledge doesn't believe in any of the occult knowledge he studies

    • @zacharylong7717
      @zacharylong7717 3 месяца назад

      Right!!!

  • @brendanwiley253
    @brendanwiley253 3 месяца назад +86

    Empiricists: "That's an interesting theory on how the world was made Plato, care to back it up with a Source?"
    Plato:"My Source is that I made it the fuck up!"

    • @Nick-ij5nt
      @Nick-ij5nt 3 месяца назад +16

      theists: can you empirically prove empiricism?
      empiricists: we can prove empiricism if you grant us empiricism

    • @Anon-f6j
      @Anon-f6j 3 месяца назад +8

      Almost as good as him literally just flexing his muscles as his counterargument.

    • @CatastrophicDisease
      @CatastrophicDisease 3 месяца назад

      @@Nick-ij5ntDing ding ding

    • @BennyAscent
      @BennyAscent 2 месяца назад

      ​@Nick-ij5nt i mean, the proof of the pudding is in the eating. The computer you sent this from was made using the discoveries of empiricism. So is any medicine you take, any vehicles you use to get around... it all requires observing the way that the world works, taking data points and building relationships between those data points.
      Unless youre a solipsist, in which case, like, whatever, continue your navel gazing philosophical masturbation ad nauseum.

    • @NorbertNahumEvreuklovic
      @NorbertNahumEvreuklovic 2 месяца назад

      Ok Brendan. You know MORE than a greek philosopher😊 Mitigate your f ego you prat...

  • @yurironoue5888
    @yurironoue5888 3 месяца назад +3

    ESOTERICA is one of my favourite RUclips channels on RUclips! Dr Sledge is brilliant!

  • @WolfoxBR
    @WolfoxBR 3 месяца назад +2

    Dr. Justin Sledge is such a treasure. So glad to see him here again. Thanks for this!

  • @24kanthony
    @24kanthony 3 месяца назад +7

    Great guest.
    His videos are so informative and he doesn't present any of his assumptions as if they were hard facts, that should be considered in a more dramatic way then appropriate

  • @Phantasmeels
    @Phantasmeels 3 месяца назад +2

    I'm absolutely psyched that you guys filmed a follow-up episode

  • @petebrennanmusic6939
    @petebrennanmusic6939 3 месяца назад +61

    'Demiurge' is a great name for a Death Metal band and that thumbnail would be the perfect artwork for their debut album.... 🎸

    • @RepublicofGilead-br4uv
      @RepublicofGilead-br4uv 3 месяца назад +26

      Meshuggah does have a song called “Demiurge”, which is my favorite song by them.

    • @pilotnamealreadytaken6035
      @pilotnamealreadytaken6035 3 месяца назад +4

      I agree this is death metal material 100%

    • @onimusha13
      @onimusha13 3 месяца назад +7

      Demiurge by Meshuggah, although a song - not an album, fucks

    • @raz0rcarich99
      @raz0rcarich99 3 месяца назад +9

      ​@@RepublicofGilead-br4uv Badadum badadum badadum badadum badadum badadum badadum badadum badadum badadum badadum badadum badadum badadum badadum badadum

    • @deathmetalglenn
      @deathmetalglenn 3 месяца назад +2

      ​@@raz0rcarich99😂😂nice

  • @athosgomesfonseca
    @athosgomesfonseca 2 дня назад

    I’ve found a few interesting channels of late but yours is specially S tier. Tremendously intellectual discourse, food for the mind and spirit. 👏🏼

  • @Greg29
    @Greg29 2 месяца назад +9

    Donkeys aren't sterile, otherwise there'd be no donkeys. Mules which are the offspring of horse and donkey are sterile.

    • @UncleMick
      @UncleMick 25 дней назад

      “Mules aren’t sterile, otherwise there’d be no mules” - your argument makes no sense… You’re right that donkeys aren’t infertile and mules are, but your argument doesn’t make sense

    • @Greg29
      @Greg29 25 дней назад +1

      @UncleMick Take a deep breath and think about it really hard.

    • @jhlagado1
      @jhlagado1 День назад

      ​@@Greg29give Uncle Mick a bit longer. He'll get there eventually.

  • @Hotshot2k4
    @Hotshot2k4 2 месяца назад +2

    The funny thing about Plato's desired perfect form of, for example, Triangle or Beauty, is that the reason for them being perfect is because perfection is the simplest and easiest to understand version which we can compare things to. We invented those words to communicate our observations or feelings, and however many years later here we have Plato arguing that the fact that we have the idea of perfection but no perfection is emblematic of something missing from our world or something being flawed. It's us, Plato. We're the something flawed.

  • @Newcras
    @Newcras 3 месяца назад +3

    Two of the RUclips philosophy channels I respect the most collabing? I'm here for it

  • @thenobody9755
    @thenobody9755 3 месяца назад +7

    I love the myth of the demiurge - having Alex ask all the best questions and esoterica having the most knowledge on the topic - this is a treat 😝🦔🇿🇦🖤

    • @JACK-OMARI
      @JACK-OMARI 2 месяца назад

      Where in SA are you from ?

    • @mikeluns
      @mikeluns 25 дней назад

      The most knowledge? Lol ahahahahha

  • @tompatterson1548
    @tompatterson1548 3 месяца назад +7

    If it weren’t for the syncretism with El, I think Yahweh’s history wouldn’t be quite so problematic to some people. It could always be that “oh, this region is just where he first revealed himself” until he’s two gods combined.

  • @cathymelanson7119
    @cathymelanson7119 3 месяца назад +8

    Two of my favorites together AGAIN!!!🎉

  • @nikibankov1218
    @nikibankov1218 3 месяца назад +114

    I cannot get over the fact that I love and hate Alex's moustache at the same time

    • @okktok
      @okktok 3 месяца назад +4

      Are you 14

    • @GOG-KING
      @GOG-KING 3 месяца назад +20

      Are you?​@@okktok

    • @pilotnamealreadytaken6035
      @pilotnamealreadytaken6035 3 месяца назад +9

      That's the definition of art 😂

    • @joshuakohlmann9731
      @joshuakohlmann9731 3 месяца назад +14

      He's gone from Oxford philosopher to Freddie Mercury with a few strokes of the razor.

    • @DickRarrah
      @DickRarrah 3 месяца назад

      Its a cock sucker moustache

  • @johnmejia4428
    @johnmejia4428 3 месяца назад +2

    This was such a great conversation!

  • @MicahBuzanANIMATION
    @MicahBuzanANIMATION 3 месяца назад +10

    If the Demiurge is real, then that solves the problem of pain and suffering from a perfect God paradox: evil MUST exist if the creator is inherently evil.

    • @patrickday4206
      @patrickday4206 2 месяца назад +5

      It's why masonic beliefs end up teaching at the highest levels that God and the devil are the same thing.

    • @virilian
      @virilian 2 месяца назад

      And good must also exist to be able to contrast evil, it doesn't solve the paradox it flips it on it's head

    • @patrickday4206
      @patrickday4206 2 месяца назад +1

      @@virilian or it's a super powerfull creator as flawed as us

    • @kho7491
      @kho7491 2 месяца назад +1

      @@patrickday4206 absolutely not the father of jesus is not the demiurge

    • @nugzly6304
      @nugzly6304 Месяц назад +1

      Is the "optimal but imperfect world" angle also a plausible explanation for the existence of pain and suffering? Or did I miss something?

  • @tomo2807
    @tomo2807 3 месяца назад +7

    The Legacy of Kain has a great Demiurgesque idea explored paired up with a great determinism vs free will topic, amazing video game series

  • @Thumbs81
    @Thumbs81 3 месяца назад +8

    Wicked, this is perfect Sunday evening viewing

  • @dead4419
    @dead4419 Месяц назад

    i love this collab. been watching esoterica for ages and its really cool to see my man getting some exposure!

  • @psicologiayneurocienciaoficial
    @psicologiayneurocienciaoficial 3 месяца назад +3

    Awesome conversation! 😮
    Thank you, both of you.

  • @JonathonPawelko
    @JonathonPawelko 2 месяца назад +2

    The Yahweh episode was so interesting, I listened to it again just to catch some of the nuances. If others haven't listened to it yet, it is well worth it. Cheers from Canada

  • @elephantsface
    @elephantsface 3 месяца назад +12

    Commenting on the first part cause I haven’t watched the whole video yet, the Yahweh video stuck out to me in a weird way like you guys were talking about. I think because growing up catholic I had often heard atheist arguments against religion, like the problem of evil, so the rebuttals were known to me. But I had never heard of a recorded beginning of Yahweh and recorded changes to how he was defined so the idea I had that god has always been around and always been the same being contradicted with evidence was a very new thing to think about and with how entrenched I had been in religion, it was jarring to be introduced to the new way to think about it.

  • @miniwheatz93
    @miniwheatz93 3 месяца назад +2

    One of the main ideas that brought me away from a belief in god was that I did not see his proposed effect, and I instead occasionally saw people that I believed to be good doing 'bad' things. This led me to the idea that an 'evil' being is more likely to exist than a wholly 'good' being; didnt know it had a name!

    • @drunvert
      @drunvert Месяц назад

      The real GOD "source" is inside you.

  • @hefti2459
    @hefti2459 3 месяца назад +5

    At 1:03:10 - His comment seems to be quite fallacious and I would like to hear the elaboration on how this passage is xenophobic. The passage he is referring to is Matthew 15:22-28.
    "And behold, a Canaanite woman from that region came out and was crying, "Have mercy on me, O Lord, Son of David; my daughter is severely oppressed by a demon." But he did not answer her a word. And his disciples came and begged him, saying, "Send her away, for she is crying out after us." He answered, "I was sent only to the lost sheep of the house of Israel." But she came and knelt before him, saying, "Lord, help me." And he answered, "It is not right to take the children 's bread and throw it to the dogs." She said, "Yes, Lord, yet even the dogs eat the crumbs that fall from their masters ' table." Then Jesus answered her, "O woman, great is your faith! Be it done for you as you desire." And her daughter was healed instantly."
    A very common intrepretation of this scripture is:
    "Christ is not insulting her, or her people, but pointing out that He has an obligation to offer His "bread" to the children of God. In response-showing both great wisdom and great humility-she answered that the Master, Jesus, can choose to allow the dogs to eat the crumbs. In other words, that which was offered to "the children," and either wasted or rejected, is something the master would happily let others take. In all this, she has never wavered in being convinced that Jesus is truly the Messiah and that it is within His power to cast the demon from her daughter." - BibleRef.com

    • @TheSyndrrome
      @TheSyndrrome 16 дней назад +1

      Was looking for this comment - totally agree, feels like a reach to interpret it the way he does

  • @veganostra7388
    @veganostra7388 3 месяца назад +1

    My favourite people on youtube talking about my favourite subject, what a treat!

  • @danielmartin7505
    @danielmartin7505 Месяц назад +4

    Rather than evil demiurge, what about a god who is well intentioned but incompetent? Ive often thought the universe is a botched job.

  • @thcbenji42069
    @thcbenji42069 3 месяца назад +1

    You two are my two favorite channels, estatic you guys collabed

  • @EVERBLACCK
    @EVERBLACCK 3 месяца назад +9

    Just subbed yesterday. This channel is fascinating.

    • @felixmidas2020
      @felixmidas2020 3 месяца назад

      It's not good to let yourself be dominated. You should definitely reconsider.

    • @EVERBLACCK
      @EVERBLACCK 3 месяца назад

      @@felixmidas2020 you’re projecting brother. I love you.

    • @felixmidas2020
      @felixmidas2020 3 месяца назад

      @@EVERBLACCK I appreciate it. Just don't be a sub. If you must be anything, be a dom.

    • @EVERBLACCK
      @EVERBLACCK 3 месяца назад

      @@felixmidas2020 lmao ahhh bdsm pun. I get it
      😆🖤🙏🏼

    • @felixmidas2020
      @felixmidas2020 3 месяца назад +1

      @@EVERBLACCK Now we're talking, buddy. Have a great Sunday.

  • @nancinyols8015
    @nancinyols8015 3 месяца назад +3

    Re: Truth about Santa: I felt unbelievably sick when I was finally told Santa wasn't real. I think I was about 8. So, when I had my two sons, I never lied to them. Ironically, my eldest took it well while my youngest heard us and then went off for the next 5 years ignoring what we said and believing in Santa because he chose to. Nice outcome, I think.

  • @renaissanceman9168
    @renaissanceman9168 5 дней назад +2

    @32:59 Seth does not belong to the Greek pantheon, but to the Egyptian pantheon.

  • @ZaiDrizzleDrop
    @ZaiDrizzleDrop 3 месяца назад +32

    I honestly find it amazing that even thousands of years ago, people read the bible and went "Huh, this sounds pretty evil doesn't it? No way the god of love would do this stuff, it has to be a lesser, evil god who created the world and commands all this genocide." These guys were so far ahead, the god of the bible really does line up with the demiurge.

    • @adamplentl5588
      @adamplentl5588 3 месяца назад

      The Bible hasn't existed for thousands of years.

    • @sowersass2
      @sowersass2 3 месяца назад +11

      Crazier to me is how anyone reads the Bible now and thinks oh yeah that makes sense.

    • @robotaholic
      @robotaholic 3 месяца назад +9

      ​@@sowersass2exactly...like Adam and Eve getting punished for disobedience when they haven't eaten the fruit from the tree of knowledge of good and bad yet or how did God make day and night before making the sun lol or planting vegetation before making the sun lololo - why worship someone who admits they killed everyone on earth except 8 already and they will tell the story he wants, too....

    • @SavannahEasom
      @SavannahEasom 3 месяца назад +3

      @@sowersass2god loves you beyond reason. The older you get, the more sense it makes.

    • @SavannahEasom
      @SavannahEasom 3 месяца назад +4

      @@robotaholicgod loves you too! Try looking at the Bible with softer eyes. This world is not as He intended, which is a byproduct of giving free will to man and his angels and demigods. Which also ties into the Flood and the slaughter of canaanites.
      Micheal Heiser really tied this together for me.

  • @douglasperry8211
    @douglasperry8211 Месяц назад +1

    This has got to be the most random subject to stumble across that i found almost impossible to NOT watch. I quickly got the feeling Dr. Sledge knows what he's talking about, and is very interesting to listen to.

  • @TheOneTruePatriot
    @TheOneTruePatriot 2 месяца назад +3

    The Demiurge sounds very human centric and unscientific until you consider that theoretically most other parallel universes may be virtually unstable and hostile for the growth of life, whereas the odds of our universe already being inhabited are incredibly high

  • @minahana1112
    @minahana1112 3 месяца назад +1

    This was really great! Thank you Justin and Alex and I hope you can talk again!

  • @Orikon25
    @Orikon25 3 месяца назад +6

    Holy hell what a magnificent fucking podcast, especially towards the end when you touch upon all the meta truths and universal principles that the Gnostic Christians seem to have been be pretty close to and the various influences stemming from philosophical and cultural machninations on a local level. Each time I think I know a lot about this entire topic, I'm proven wrong.
    Thank you so much Alex. This kind of insight, knowledge and wisdom used to be reserved for the few, but here we are listening to it for free from the comfort of our homes.

  • @ozone20rulez
    @ozone20rulez 2 месяца назад +2

    Eyy. Esoterica channel. Im a huge occult nerd so I've seen this guy around. This is a pretty good collab!

  • @Philusteen
    @Philusteen 3 месяца назад +13

    So happy to see Dr. J back. Caffeine engaged. 🖖☕

  • @Johnathonswift
    @Johnathonswift 3 месяца назад +1

    Excellent, I'm rewinding this back to the beginning immediately.

  • @AnonymousAlcoholic772
    @AnonymousAlcoholic772 3 месяца назад +11

    Δημιουργός can mean craftsman, but it could also mean creator, and further, it could also mean instigator.

    • @Pootycat8359
      @Pootycat8359 3 месяца назад +1

      Hmmm...Might it ALSO mean the "Architect," as the Masons might put it? 🙂

    • @AnonymousAlcoholic772
      @AnonymousAlcoholic772 3 месяца назад +1

      @@Pootycat8359 i dont think so. That is Αρχιτέκτονας. Or Αρχιτέκτων in ancient greek. Its own specific word BUT… implication is more important i think. In any case, it means one who makes something come into being, whether that is a universe or a riot.

    • @Pootycat8359
      @Pootycat8359 3 месяца назад +1

      @@AnonymousAlcoholic772 At any rate, it's an interesting coincidence. An architect IS a "craftsman," of a sort, and he IS "[O]ne who makes something come into being..."

    • @BoogieMurder
      @BoogieMurder 2 месяца назад

      @@Pootycat8359 not really a coincidence, while its correct that in modern greek they have become their own words. In greek, the Masons are called, "Τέκτονες". That comes from Proto-Hellenic *téktōn, from Proto-Indo-European *tetḱō (“carpenter”), from *tetḱ- (“to create, produce”). Cognate with Sanskrit तक्षन् (tákṣan). Αρχι-τέκτονας (Architect) Literally means the Great Creator, a synonym "Δημιουργός", hence the Masons phrasing it like that. Though I doubt most know why.

  • @robgrabowski2572
    @robgrabowski2572 2 месяца назад

    Absolutely love these collaborations with Dr Sledge, thank you so much! I hope to see the two of you again in future episodes 😊👍

  • @TheAnnaK74
    @TheAnnaK74 3 месяца назад +3

    Thankyou for this video and for letting Dr Sledge talk freely because he has filled in a lot of gaps and answered a lot of long term questions for me.

  • @johdewit9327
    @johdewit9327 Месяц назад +1

    Beautiful podcast.
    It hits me at the core.

  • @ggunnelspct
    @ggunnelspct 3 месяца назад +3

    It’s interesting how we modern Stoics do not care about (for the most part) anything related either Stoic physics or logic.

  • @pablokagioglu2546
    @pablokagioglu2546 29 дней назад

    Thanks Alex and Justin. 👏👏
    Another amazing talk on religious perspectives that totally escape the public discourse. So much context that is totally missed.
    Bonus: we walk away with a clever quote from Justin that reflects the sad state of affairs in the world.
    “People don’t respond to philosophy, they respond to mythology”

  • @chriswilliamsCKG
    @chriswilliamsCKG 3 месяца назад +2

    Watching the last conversation led me to subscribe and enjoy @TheEsotericaChannel content. Let’s see where this one leads me.

  • @993LD
    @993LD 3 месяца назад +1

    Great guest, great discussion, great mustache 👍 this was a win

  • @folee_edge
    @folee_edge 3 месяца назад +7

    Thanks for bringing the Esoterica Channel to my attention. I love his topics, his humor, and his delivery. Dense but delicious!

  • @jdm5570
    @jdm5570 2 месяца назад

    I'm loving these collabs, and Dr Sledge is a freaking national treasure.

  • @TheAmericanAmerican
    @TheAmericanAmerican 3 месяца назад +4

    As a former catholic now atheist, the more I learn about the beginnings of Christianity the more of what I "learned" in church makes sense on a historical level. The idea that early Christians used aspects of the ancient Egyptian religion to form the origins of Christianity is so fascinating! And all the talk of the Old Testament God being pretty much evil makes so much more sense when learning about how the early Christians wanted to distance themselves from Judaism. The lore is so incredibly deep!

  • @Maldo_DJ
    @Maldo_DJ Месяц назад

    I pay internet only for this kind of content, thanks to both, what an enlightening podcast

  • @angelasutherland7479
    @angelasutherland7479 3 месяца назад +5

    Why "yeah right" concerning the Trinity? Many Gods are able to take on different forms especially the Greek Gods. And if you are a God existing in 3 forms must be super easy. Your cynicism seems strange to me.

    • @mtklaric
      @mtklaric 3 месяца назад

      His mask fell off right there in that moment...

    • @xXSCDTXx
      @xXSCDTXx 16 дней назад

      Because it defeats the purpose of monotheism.

  • @MrEvasto
    @MrEvasto 3 месяца назад

    Thank you very much for this deep dive!
    I'm a more or less Christian believer. Have been agnostic most of my life since two years ago.
    And I have to say that Alex's channel is one of the place from which I learn the most precious philosophical bricks, so to say.

  • @siriusthecat
    @siriusthecat 3 месяца назад +6

    Your last video with Dr. Justin was also my favorite of yours so far!! I had a renewed interest in gnosticism at a similar time to your series beginning. What a treat

  • @loganperry5669
    @loganperry5669 Месяц назад +1

    I hope he has this man on again

  • @askers_
    @askers_ 3 месяца назад +5

    Why is everyone talking about this so much in the last couple months? Everyone and their mother learned the word demiurge recently.

    • @Neognostic-pk5wu
      @Neognostic-pk5wu 3 месяца назад +4

      I noticed that Gnostic philosophy was very much a niche interest until recently.
      I think James Lyndsey recently pushed it more to the front with his bizarre reach to link a dead Judeo Christian tradition to modern day wokeness via conflating Hegel with Gnosticism.
      Perhaps the resurgence of interest in it is an unintended Streisand Effect from people who have heard what Lyndsey has to say and wanting to find out what it actually is as a result?

    • @christopherhamilton3621
      @christopherhamilton3621 3 месяца назад

      @@Neognostic-pk5wuI think it’s been a topic even before Lindsay started with his stories.

    • @Neognostic-pk5wu
      @Neognostic-pk5wu 3 месяца назад

      @@christopherhamilton3621 it's always been a topic but it always seemed to be in fairly obscure circles. It's still not exactly mainstream, but there's seems to have been a noticeable upsurge of interest in just the last couple of years.

    • @AshAll3469
      @AshAll3469 3 месяца назад +1

      Really? I myself happened to hear of it these past couple months while researching things on Christianity. Perhaps it’s due to all the religious political stuff going on right now? People are looking at alternative forms of Christianity? 🤔

    • @CaptainTitforce
      @CaptainTitforce 3 месяца назад +1

      The Gnostic Gospels have just been brought up in the last years and more people are learning about them, so the popularity of the subject has surged high right now.

  • @poeticjustice1611
    @poeticjustice1611 3 месяца назад

    So many great points were made in this entire discussion. I especially like the way it was wrapped up with recognizing how much speculative philosophy was instrumental to early Christianity’s theological development. This particularly resonated with me because it surprised me when I learned about this in college while studying to be a Christian pastor. So much so that I stopped pursuing this endeavor and chose to walk away from the Christian faith. It was enough for me to realize a lot of the core theological beliefs of Christian orthodoxy were heavily reliant on Ancient Greek philosophical concepts. I mean there were many other reasons why I chose to stop believing in Christianity, but this was one of the main reasons why I couldn’t maintain a belief in this religion any longer. This isn’t something that the normal church layman is taught at their Sunday service. And so finding out how it was all developed over time in detail made me feel like I was being lied to this whole time. I found it all to be disingenuous.

  • @nono9543
    @nono9543 3 месяца назад +13

    Any God that demands worship from its followers is not the one true God. Why desperately crave the validation of your servants? That's not love.

    • @SawarimHaqq
      @SawarimHaqq 3 месяца назад

      He does not demand worship because He seeks validation, rather it's the proper state of affairs. The dependent and insufficient should depend on the Independent and Self-insufficient.

    • @randomguyoninternet1183
      @randomguyoninternet1183 3 месяца назад +6

      @@SawarimHaqq I've heard both Christians and Muslims refer to God as independent and self-sufficient, but that just begs the question: Why would he even create the universe and humanity to begin with? What use is humanity to a perfectly self-sufficient being? Do we exist to fulfill some need or desire? If so, then God is not self-sufficient. If not, then what motivation could such a being have for creating anything?

    • @patrickday4206
      @patrickday4206 2 месяца назад +2

      Look at the hideous nature of the angels surrounding God and you will realize that he is a scary monster just like the angels covered in eyes and mouths

    • @jenathent4840
      @jenathent4840 2 месяца назад

      ​@@patrickday4206 Yup he is the host of all demons, the container and the master of all demonic.

    • @KBird204
      @KBird204 2 месяца назад +2

      I really enjoy the idea of Tulpas across works of fiction and some belief structures. They are autonomous, conscious beings born from collective thought or belief.
      I enjoy it as a narrative device, because it would be cool to see a world where the world’s god(s) only continue(s) to exist and draw power from continued belief. This can lead to lots of different possibilities for narratives- where a god is necessarily despotic and forceful (because it wishes to guarantee its existence/power). Then, when the people become aware of this belief condition, some rise up to try and overthrow the system and presumably free humanity from this status quo.
      Do they try to have an ideological war, where they try to wane and shake belief, thus making the god weaker? Would it be safer to leave things as is? Or, do they create a tulpa of their own? Would that be wise- after all, that tulpa may come to the same conclusion.. Maybe the reigning god isnt even the original one, and was overthrown in a previous war? Or, what if the real deity was killed or subdued by a tulpa who became sufficiently strong, and now feasts on humanity as a false, parasitic god?!
      I love that idea for something: a game, a book series, comics, anime. The possibilities are endless!

  • @Maldo_DJ
    @Maldo_DJ Месяц назад

    Dr. Justin with his alchemical lab in the background, this guy is amazing.

  • @MaleINTP
    @MaleINTP 3 месяца назад +5

    So... Apologetics has always existed since ancient Greece...
    This reminds me of the excuses such as "slavery back then wasn't as bad as today's slavery... They had rights. God isn't immoral for allowing it..."

    • @tactlacker
      @tactlacker 3 месяца назад +1

      And those same people will denounce and deny they participate in historical relativism!

    • @DJWESG1
      @DJWESG1 3 месяца назад +2

      They also offered a very good critique of slavery and bondage , as we do today.

    • @tactlacker
      @tactlacker 3 месяца назад +1

      @@DJWESG1 reminds me of Parenti's remarks about the majority of the populations were often slaves and it's a safe bet slaves would've generally been opposed to their own suffering/or that any defense would originate from those aggrandizers who dynastically stood to gain from its perpetuation

  • @ramonacevedo356
    @ramonacevedo356 3 месяца назад +1

    Heck yea. My favorite u tubers!!! Looking forward to the discussion bro... Doogie

  • @maureen-paulbarnes-vonkulm480
    @maureen-paulbarnes-vonkulm480 3 месяца назад +4

    Your allusion to the Demi urge being a craftsman caught my attention. Is that similar to the idea of Jesus bring a “tecton?“ Well at least Joseph was and Jesus is also described as a carpenter.

    • @phaethon3124
      @phaethon3124 3 месяца назад

      perhaps it is a play on the word tekNon meaning infant/son.nearly every time the bible says tekton the next word is 'son'..this may go back to sumerian astrology where the meaning of their name for the star regulus is infant/son

  • @docbauk3643
    @docbauk3643 3 месяца назад +1

    Very, very interesting conversation. Thanks.

  • @bl3df0rdays
    @bl3df0rdays 3 месяца назад +3

    What a treat! Thank you Alex and Justin!

  • @oliverjamito9902
    @oliverjamito9902 3 месяца назад

    Students shared "i" AM will say, Lord is so delightful seeing thy shared having sincere conversations! Indeed!

  • @Brownyman
    @Brownyman 3 месяца назад +5

    In other word, Yaldabaoth 🦁🐍

  • @JumpingNoodleSquad
    @JumpingNoodleSquad 2 месяца назад +1

    As a Christian I've never heard anything like this. I watched the whole thing.

  • @hissupremecorrectfulnessre9478
    @hissupremecorrectfulnessre9478 3 месяца назад +5

    I clicked this so fast, I ripped a hole in the fabric of the spacetime continuum and caused the Tunguska explosion.

  • @neilclaypoole7529
    @neilclaypoole7529 День назад

    Alex another great show one of many

  • @ToMegaTherionXCIII
    @ToMegaTherionXCIII 3 месяца назад +4

    Another interview with these two 💕. This is the best age to live in.

  • @souldancer7389
    @souldancer7389 2 месяца назад

    Great channel. I am so glad I found people who use their own mind to reason. 👏👏👏