Cpap turbo remote cooling system for 3D printer tutorial
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- Опубликовано: 14 мар 2022
- Klipper MCU : www.klipper3d.org/RPi_microco...
STLs/BOM: github.com/VzBoT3D/Vz-Printhe...
CAD: github.com/VzBoT3D/Vz-Printhe...
-CPAP 15mm hose: amzn.to/3zQNYSi or s.click.aliexpress.com/e/_A9rUYd
-CPAP fan: s.click.aliexpress.com/e/_Dl1...
If you wish to support: ko-fi.com/vez3d
Full VzBoT Printer project: (BOM, cad, stl): github.com/VzBot3D/
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Or use this code: SIMOV5 
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Sorry for the re-upload ! I had a missing information on the wiring. Forgot to mention or show the use of a relay if want to use a heater port to control 24V to CPAP board.
@Manuel Sterbizzi you can connect it to the psu negative.. or any negative terminal on the 3d printer board. which ever is closer.
You building completely custom, or you using parts off other moded printers
@@odeball22 custom. Though it has a x5s donoer for the 2020 frame
@Vez3D dope man you gunna release all your parts. Or schematics?
Hmm, think it'd be powerful enough to split the hose to cool the hotend and the print? then I could get all the fans off the effector...
Bravo! Love the speed on that thing!
thank you Vez, i remixed your CPAP construction to fit on my Delta printer - i rly had a lot of fun! :)
I was playing around with this idea today. Glad to see you got it to work
Thanks for the video!
Ive been wanting to upgrade my cooling on my Delta, this looks very promising 👍
This channel deserves more people to watch
Man you're such an inspiration, you do such great work. I've recently built a 500mm RatRig and I just ordered this fan to impliment it on it, as well as a carbon fiber X gantry. Keep up the great work, thanks!
ooft what an amazing set up!!! May be a little bit too much to do for a first timer but it definitely looks like something to aim for in the future!!!
my lord the more i dig into your channel the more my to build list gets HOLY CRAP I WANT ONE
Wow that’s awesome power. Thanks for sharing your wonderful built.💕
You are crazy but Awesome, my pal 🤣! Keep it up😎! Freaking cool setup and it gets literally cooler as time passes. I'm eager to see it in full blast action 👀🤓
great progress! 👏😎
Im always happy when I see you commenting my stuff mate :) thanks for the kind words
@@Vez3D my pleasure, love to see your progress, would love myself to work on something similar, but no time :)
there's an enable_pin definition available in klipper in the [fan] section, saves the additional pin definition for power (this functionality might have been added after this video was created):
[fan]
enable_pin:
# Optional pin to enable power to the fan. This can be useful for fans
# with dedicated PWM inputs. Some of these fans stay on even at 0% PWM
# input. In such a case, the PWM pin can be used normally, and e.g. a
# ground-switched FET(standard fan pin) can be used to control power to
# the fan.
Love the unique stuff you put out! If this was an option on a Voron I'd switch in a heartbeat.
People allready adapted this on voron 2.4
"NEWS JUST IN 3d printer enthusiast arrested and charged with murder after ripping the fan out of his grandmothers CPAP device"🤣
I got one from my mom. Does that count. She had a new one, but may not have fully understood what im usuing it for
Testing my fan upgrades with ‘minimum layer time’ tests has proven to be a good metric. As performance improves, shorter layer times become achievable. Just need the part to be large enough diameter so the fans aren’t continually blowing on the same surfaces after it’s already been printed.
Very nice! I think most of the noise is coming from the suction port of the fan, perhaps an acoustical dampened chamber over the input would help, without sacrificing a lot of flow. For these higher frequencies, I like 25mm thick Akotherm dampening. (recycled PET, the low density, 20kg/m3) But i'd say any form of damping would improve the noise. I don't know how they are normally dampened when they are mounted into a machine that should help you through the night.
You've probably already come across this... But I suspect the 50khz in the datasheet is really meant to be 50hz - which is common for a lot of PWM controlled brushless speed controllers. That would be why you you had better luck with a cycle time of 0.002. Sometimes you can push it down to nearly 500hz (e.g. 480hz) as the actual signal is a pulse from 1ms to 2ms to indicate off to full power.
I'm not sure if Klipper does this (although I suspect so, maybe not well), but using the microcontroller to run the fan signal with hardware PWM is generally the best for performance.. A timer peripheral on the chip will generate the PWM signal on the pin instead of using the CPU to time and flip the pin states. Aside from being more accurate, there is virtually zero processor overhead (aside from adjusting the timer registers and any comms overhead). The caveat is you need to ensure that the pin you want to use supports a hardware PWM output, and if there are no free timers, you might be hosed anyway. That is all very microcontroller dependant, but I use it extensively in other projects for brushless motor control.
You could also add an Arduino. They come in native 5v logic versions, and the you would have some extra gpio for other stuff. It will use another USB on the pi though.
This is a brilliant design. I wanted to try this approach for myself. Nice to know it would have worked out! You pulled it off splendidly!
Also-subscribed! Can’t wait to see your next trick!
Edit: what I wanted to do in mine is have an insulated flexible conduit which all the wires, cooling tubes, etc run thru to the print head. I would have cooling running thru the conduit as well so the wires and other sensitive components stay cool.
nice video!
@Vez3D it would be very nice if you could make a video howto use the steppers with 48V and the maze powerbrr bridge...i think this is a topic that many people would like to know
keep on makeing!
I Agree
very good video
Glad to see you finally joining the CPAP party! Great implementation, too. I like the external hose clamp, seems like a smart solution for max flow. I've been using barb-type fittings for weight savings, but they do eat some inlet area.
This is awesome, thanks for sharing. One question, is there a reason why you attached the fan outside (even if you cut a whole for the inlet), versus keeping the fan's body inside the enclosure?
Ok, that's it. Was on the fence whether to build a Voron Trident or your VZ Bot, surely going with the VZ Bot now!.
Only wished it had the Z-axis setup like the Trident or a Ratrig, in terms of levelling.
Got a c pap from rummage sale for a dollar or two for this exact purpose. I once saw a guy using condoms for hoses to keep things light weight on his Delta. I have always wanted to use two ball screws or some type of scara arm to have a "flying" extruder and fan assembly like this. Something that is essentially sent the same g codes in X and Y but uses its own steppers and all decoupled from the printing gantry/print head. Maybe tune it to be a little softer on starts and stop.
I was literally just looking at cpap fns yesterday. Diaphragm pumps have potential, but they get kinda hot and not sure they'll cool enough for my needs. They do however pull air through a respirator filter without any significant resistance, so they will work for my enclosure filter. Wonder if the cpap would be choked by one.
Wow!!!!! Nice ! Holly molly!
Really cool design! Hows layer adhesion at that amount of cooling?
pressure and volume are two different beasts. You cant just add a cpap to the same ducts on printhead and enjoy max efficiency. Needs to be engineered as a system imo. You are making leaps in progress for all tho. ty
Great video! Really like the ideo of good airflow at low volumes for everyday use, while still having the option of massive airflow when needed.
I have one question though.. I like to use 10% part cooling with a 5015 fan when printing ABS to help with bridges and overhangs. I fear the CPAP's minimum airflow would be a little too much.. Do you have an idea to mitigate this? I am currently thinking of adding a restrictor plate that could be moved in or out of the airflow path with a servo.
I was able to setup a PWM signal from the Neopixl pins on my BTT 1.4 turbo.
I've made a hotend silicon sock fused on the blower fan duct (it's a single piece). Accidentally I've discovered that the silicone gets hot enough to heat the air coming from the blower to +- 60c. So I could be a bit more aggressive cooling ABS without cracking it.
So I wonder if it would be beneficial to heat the air from the blower to a temperature closer to the ABS glass transition temperature. In that case you could turn the fan at full on ABS.
Does it make sense?
Modern Cpaps are virtually silent as long as the mask is on properly. In this setup, still way quieter than a 3D printer fan.
This is awesome! I thought about this idea myself, and then I found your video. One question: I am trying to make a corexy ender3 which will be VERY modded. My goal is for it to be a high speed printer. I think the stock cooling fan is 24v. Could I connect the 24v input directly to the board or should I make another connection via the power supply?
Wow. Great progress. Only ten years to go and 3D printers will find compressed air.
What about putting the wires inside of the tube? That would look slick as heck
Why would you go with this system over Berd Air system? Have you tested the difference etc? I'm upgrading this on all my printers and I wanted to go the right way
Shall I suggest positioning the air intake at the bottom of the enclosure 🙂. That way you would be taking the coldest air possible. At least on paper.
As far as hooking up the wires to the cpap. With modern mcu boards coming with selectable voltage fan headers do you still suggest using gpio pins? I can select 5v on my mainboard.
@Vez3D is that cooling you have on the side walls blowing in too? What do you run that on? another ws7040? Or some 5050s or what? would love to see the stl for that side cooler too. does it help?
what are your opinions on running the linear rail on top of the gantry versus the front side like the Voron 2.4? Im thinking about changing my Voron into a Vzbot. With the stealth burner and tap and the weight of all the parts I feel like the Voron struggles to sling the printhead around. I can't get rid of the minor z banding issues. my prints look good but I also like the design off the VzBot. Great Job.
@Vez3D not sure if someone said this yet but you should be able use the EN pin on the motor controller and if you set that pin low it should stop the motor completely. Instead of using the relay you can just use the pi gpio to turn off the motor using that driver board.
You mean an EN pin on the cpap controller board ? I didnt know there was one
@Vez3D correct if your using the 5th pin "vsr" for pwm control you should be able to use 3rd pin "EN" to turn the motor on/off says to connect to ground or low signal.
i cant help but wonder if it could be used to cool the heat break and the part off the one fan and be lighter then having the fan on the heatbreak
gotta love the cackles
You may have addressed this somewhere but what are your thoughts on the LGX Lite? Did you try it and go back to the Orbitor?
Is there any way we could make a mount for this rear fan mount for the original X5SA v-slot bracket?
I have Gamma28 7530 which I would like to mount on my 3d printer, but to reduce weight instead of using cpap hose what would you think about using heat shrink tubes? They are lightweight and are shrinking above 90°C so they should be fine in chamber that tops around 45-50°C.
For the sake of it, please do a #speedboat Benchy with CPAP and RSC. I finally want to see a good looking sub 10 min Benchy.
Awesome Video. I was wondering what build plate do you use?
Creality pei powder coated for cr10
does the tube need to be that wide/can you use thinner tubing?
Is it time for a new Speed benchy / Speed benchy at Quality ?
Hi, (bit late to the party, I know...) is there a reason to use three exits on the hotend, not more / one circular one around the whole nozzle?
I kinda want to see a speed benchy with this cooling.
Has anyone been able to get the rpm readout working to get the speed precisely?
Can you also share the P/N of the driver board alone?
Besides noise, what are the downsides of using CPAP for part cooling? Could there be a problem with having too much air flow?
I wish to employ this to my printer...can you please tell me which motor controller to look for? I have a fan from an old CPAP, but no controller
As somebody with sleep apnea I do have a CPAP machine which I use frequently. But where did you get those parts ? My machine cost multiple thousands of dollars.
Can you update the link in the description for the hose? Not working anymore
I’ve always wondered about these really strong part cooling fans. Do they not cool off the nozzle to a significant degree? I guess you probably have to run a PID on the hotend depending on how much part cooling your using for a particular print?
you need to aim the flow a bit under the nozzle
An Anemometer / Air Flow Meter like they use for wind / HVAC may be a good purchase for quantitative measurements of cooling system performance. They are about 30 USD or so, so it shouldn't be too crazy of a purchase. Not 100% needed, but more data is always good.
Keep up the great work!
A Venturi flow meter is pretty easy to make too
From what I see i think the cpap tube you use is a 22 mm version. Resmed (one of the machine manufacturers) uses 16 mm tubes which they claim to be 40% lighter than the standard 22 mm tubes. Maybe an opportunity to save another few grams.
This tube is 15mm ID
@@MirageC Great so you already have the smaller diameter tube, so the look deceived me in thinking it was 22 mm.
@vez3d did you update the step file for the back panel with the hole for the CPAP blower? Because it would be much easier to plug the hole with a printer part in case it's not needed than to punch it in the aluminium in case it is needed. As usual, amazing job!
I have not. I figured people could drill it the hole like i did?
@@Vez3D it's ok, it's only because anybody with a printer can plug the hole, not everybody has the drill bit to do it though... Easy fix in any case, but having the hole pre-drilled is just easier. Thanks for the quick answer!
@@Controllore777 ill see if we can add that the next panel sets
@@Vez3D thanks!
you should add a filter on the intake
Just a nice aquarium pump would be lighter and work fine.
a lot of watts the power supply?
or to use the full potentional of the CPAP fan: you can use the 3.3V pwm from RPI (like you already do), connect it on arduino nano and map it to 5V pwm output. Its working like a charm and the CPAP blows at the full strength instead of this. I can provide you the arduino code if you want
@@Vjeko2404986 we now drive it from a 5v pwm pin on the mcu board :)
@@Vez3D Well, I didn't want to change the whole mcu just to gain 1,7V more :D
@Vjeko2404986 ahh ok .yeah then its a good idea :)
This method of control will only get max 66% speed :( WE need more power Scottie!
the other option is to use a 5v pwm pin if your board has one.
i wonder if printing in a constant vacuum will effect the print for better
Both intake and exhaust of the cpap are in the same column of air. Therefore, there is no pressure differential
If you are attempting to cool the print head with recycled air to maintain the temperature, then how can you do that while simultaneously exhausting and filtering the air?
If you are constantly exhausting, then you are constantly pulling new air in from the cracks which would be ambient room temperature. In that case there is not that much recycling of air done with the CPAP motor (which is also effectively pulling in fresh air through the cracks in the enclosure).
Am I missing something or making wrong assumptions?
Who said i was exhausting during print? 😜 im not. Exhaust only runs when print is done. However next step is adding another filter during print that will recirculate. I already have a recirculate fan at the bottom thay will be replaced by that
@@Vez3D I wondered because you didn't say in the video (thus the confusion).
You mentioned the toxicity of ABS so I couldn't imagine the wisdom of not filtering.
@@KarlMiller yeah maybe i should have specified hehe :) thanks for the comment mate
Neg legible?
Whats the material and print temp on that thanks :)
I am new to 3D printing, instead of powerful fan why not inject slower cooled air stream maybe thru 4mm hoses to the head? Will it affect any plastic properties. Don’t know if anybody done that? CNC kitchen Stefan not yet.😜
cpap produces warm air.. and its better for my need. Too cold air would probably cause issue. Also.. you dont want to cool enclosure
Next step remove the fan also for the hotend ? ;-)
I keep getting a "Unable to open out GPIO chip line" error no matter what I try. Seems like I'm stuck with a fan i can't use.
What board are you using?
There are 12mm CPAP tubes, it should be even lighter..but it's a bit more expensive
Its already super light :)
@@Vez3Dthere are no limits...
Great work Vez3D,
I had a question, I'm using a 5v fan socket on the MCU (not using RPI to run Klipper). In this schematic, I understand that I only need to connect the signal wire (grey) to the negative of my fan socket. So the positive of the fan socket is not used?
Thanks in advance.
If you use a fan port.. its reversed . The pwm pusle is on the neg pin..so you have to use an optocoupler.
50micron?
Awesome idea. btw - the thumbnail when sharing this video looks terrible.
mmm sorry about it. because text is too small ? or ? where did you share it? FB ?
@@Vez3D yes.
Ask yourself this: What would be the optimal temperature to have on the incoming air? ;)
same as enclosure temperature :) so you dont cooldown the enclosure. With PLA.. I just open the cover and doors
@@Vez3D Would it, though? I'd bet on "just below the glass-transition temperature of whatever polymer you're printing". Granted, this would take a lot of energy, and would mess with your enclosure-temperature, but it would make for the least inter-layer stress while printing, no?
@@AdityaMehendale mmm i dont know. Yeah that could be right. I dont think it was ever experimented :) ...please dont give me more work hahaha
@@Vez3D saw an academic group use air just under the glass transition temperature for cooling a few years back. They got massive gains to layer adhesion but they weren't printing with PLA or ABS.
The affiliate links are not working any more. Could you please update them.
Ill check
The only one broken is the tube right? The other 2 for fan are working for me at least
Yes, could you please update the hose link or add it to the BOM
@@GrimmChristopher done
What do you think about calling this style of setup a "blowden"? Haha
hahaha
FIRST, why the reupload tho
Thought I was imagining I had seen the video a few hours ago ahah
Hi Vez, already seen on the MirageC channel for 6 months. On this shot, you were left behind ;-)
All respect to Hevort (MirageC), but it wasn't him testing 1st this fan :) As I remember it was Wayne Dalton ... Correct me if I wrong.
Wayne is also my buddy. I think Olivier tested before wayne. But I can ask them . Or maybe they will show here
do I hear a Montreal accent?
Hell yes!!!! Un castor francophone ici
Link to blower fan?
in description
-CPAP 70mm fan: s.click.aliexpress.com/e/_AEsHxz or s.click.aliexpress.com/e/_AAzQAX
@@Vez3D thanks. How about link to the board between the printer and the blower? EDIT: nvm it comes with the fan. Thanks
Cpap? they really need to call it something else.
read it as crap tubo cooling first
great video but it might be worth writing yourself a script or notes before recording.
You really took your time explaining everything to the point it made me skip past multiple parts
You can just say "and this also helps keep the fumes in" without going into a big aside about filaments