Living with the Toyota RAV4 PHEV - Nearly brilliant but is there a problem ?
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- Опубликовано: 30 сен 2024
- I have been living with the Toyota RAV4 PHEV for over a month now covering over 1500 miles. In that time I've got to really understand this impressive hybrid. With nearly 40 miles of EV range it makes a brilliant city car and then on the longer journey the hybrid gives both huge range and great fuel economy.
For me though the is one potential point of weakness, it's CVT gearbox. In the review I see how much stuff can fit in the boot, talk through it's extensive range of features and then put the CVT gearbox to the ultimate test.
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Sorry I used a generic description of a CVT to try and keep it simple and this isn’t the type fitted to this vehicle. In hindsight I should have explained it in more detail 😢 Thanks to those of you that pointed that out 🙏🏻
Have you experienced a CVT gearbox and what did you think ?
We have two Toyota hybrids one being a work corolla and the other being a Yaris . When I got the Corolla I thought the same as you , but now I don’t even notice the sound of the engine to be honest , it’s something you get used to
I’ve driven a petrol Toyota Auris with a conventional CVT and now own a hybrid Auris with the eCVT. In my opinion, they feel much the same and the technical differences don’t really matter. CVT suits a relaxed driving style but I can understand why a driving enthusiast wouldn’t like it.
17:30 I've driven a PriusV with CVT for 10 years now. I think your dissatisfaction is mostly a matter of perception. If you have driven a manual transmission, engine rev's and speed are linearly proportional. Increase the rev''s 50% and the speed increases 50%. My current motorcycle drives this way (as well as the last dozen I've had), so it is a very familiar sensation. Torque Converter transmissions allow a bit of "slip", rev's are mostly proportional to speed. Unless you have your foot to the floor, rev's increase with speed. CVT transmissions (yes, I know the T stands for Transmission) are different. The engine can very quickly speed up to the hp associated with the load without the car accelerating (much). So, the engine can put out 50, 100 or 150hp at almost any speed. The CVT then changes the gear ratio to accelerate the car. So, adjust the engine speed to match the load first and change the gear ratio to accelerate second. There is no "slipping clutch" or centrifugal clutch you remember from your mini-bike days. I come not to bury the quick revving engine, but to praise it!
I used to have a Lexus CT hybrid with an eCVT. It was very responsive, but it sounded horrible. It would've been an enjoyable car to drive if you're deaf...
We have an Audi SQ5 with a torque converter GB and we also have a new shape Yaris with the CVT GB. Two very different cars. You want to put your foot down a bit more in the Audi to appreciate the power but jump in the Yaris and you want to drive in a more relaxed style. I love both cars. For me personally when I'm in the Yaris I barely notice the CVT. I've just got used to driving steady and seeing 65-66 mpg (vs 35 in Audi). My opinion... CVT is fine if you drive in a laid back manner. It's what hybrids are all about (unless you're in a LaFerrari I suppose 😂)
In 60,000 miles in my 2019 RAV4 the noise really has not bothered me, ANY car when floored will make a lot of engine noise, the only difference with the CVT is its fairly steady note and not rising and falling note like a regular auto. Its overall volume is not intrusive IMHO and better than many non CVT cars I have had where as the revs get higher they sound pretty rough. The Toyota also has the advantage that the engine is held at its peak efficiency revs and the power delivery is seamless and continuous. Anyone considering the car do evaluate for yourself. If it were a real issue I wouldn't have another one on order!
Exactly. You either want it held at it's peak efficiency or you don't!
This year or the next I will definitely buy the Rav4 Hybrid and I was kind of worry about the Noise I started noticing reviewers talk about. So thank you for your comment.
The e-cvt with planetary gear set makes the PHEV brilliantly efficient. The PHEV is almost as efficient as a HEV when running on petrol. Stick a traditional automatic and it becomes grotesquely less efficient.
Totally agreed, XC60 T8 is an example of Not an efficient hybrid when the battery is low.
The question is, how many times a day do you floor the accelerator? I almost never do that. And these gearboxes are economical and very reliable. And you can reduce the noise by switching up the paddle shifters on the steering wheel. A normal automatic gearbox will be quieter under heavy acceleration, but it is more expensive, heavier, less reliable and less economical.
I just bought my Rav4 Prime a week ago. It's a great car. It does get a little noisy when the engine comes on though. But I drove a little over 700 miles and only used a quarter tank of gas! For most people, and you can check with a lot of other videos, the Rav4 is really fast. Remember, it does 0 to 60 in 5.7 seconds and that's been tested by a number of youtube videos. You should also point out that there are very few cars that have the quality build like a Toyota or the resale value which was one of the reasons I bought it. There's absolutely no substitute for reliability. Although you stated that you didn't like the car for 30% based on the transmission, I would suspect that over 95% of the people who bought are happy with it, hence it being the most popular car in the U.S. next to the Ford F-150. Buyers shouldn't be expecting that the Rav4 to have the power of an old school V8 GTO, but 0-60 in less in 5.7 seconds is good enough for the large majority of people. And btw, a GTO is not going to get you 92 miles per gallon! try like 8 miles to the gallon! lol.
You know what yr talking about hopefully Ped is
The Toyota RAV 4 is an International vehicle , enormously practicle , with excellent re sale value , standard of finish , serviceability and reliability . Your criticism is weak and unfounded , in a vehicle that does everything so well .
@@walterj.sutton.9860 Too right he's fussy let him stick to unreliable minis
The E-CVT in this car is a actually a technical marvel, fully decoupled drive chain from the engine to wheels using 2 motor/generators. I suspect the high rev nature with a heavy right foot is also about the tuning of the engine to make it more economic (atkinson cycle around 40% thermal efficiency compare to standard pertrol engines around 25% in otto cycle). Ford have licensed this system in the ford Kuga i believe.
There are no drive chains. Just gears
Great review, unbiased, and fair. Some of us would consider buying the vehicles you review; just hearing your thoughts on the vehicle gives us a fairly good starting point.
Let's be honest: when you test drive a car from a dealership, you just don't get enough time with it to make a proper judgement . Keep it up mate 👍🏼 👌
Thanks mate 👍
The noise of the CVT is a very minor drawback. You can live with it. The car offers practicallity, fuel economy, some off road capability, a spare tyre, and a strong motor.
i want this with a hinge wheel on the back
And it cost 10k or more than comparable vehicles. Toyota can kiss my ass until they update their features to match competitors. They have the most lacking features, the worst warranty of all the manufacturers except Chrysler, and they are still priced like they have it all. Unless you get the most expensive models they suck.
@@EtherealoNe1 The competitor you're comparing it too are ? Renault ? Go take a look at the prices at Mercedes GLB for example or any other fancy name Audi/BMW...we'll speak after that.
@@colonelcccccuh how about every crossover and mid sized suv? Do you live under a rock? Kia, Hyundai, Chevy, Honda, etc. all have great options for less.
A Toyota Rav isn’t in the same class as any bmw , Mercedes’ or higher end suv lol.
I have a Rav 4 Hybrid. The CVT box doesn't cause me concern, infact I embrace the sharp rise in revs when booting it in sports mode. Great review, honest and open
It's just the so called (media) experts who just go on and on about it.
My 2021 Civic has the CVT box, the way I get round it is use the flappy paddles to change gear to reduce the noise. After 18,000 miles you do get use to the sound or play musics a bit louder 👍🏻
I did do a piece to camera on the manual change feature but it didn’t make the final cut. To be honest it was that great 😬
I have a Toyota CH-R with the CVT transmission and the optional 2 litre engine. I watched as many RUclips reviews as I could regarding the car and quite a few mentioned the lag or if you like 'slipping' It doesn't bother me in the least but I think the technique is not to floor the throttle but to watch the power indicator and just let it get into the power section then allow the transmission to catch up with the vehicle motion then as the needle drops increase the throttle and so on. You might be surprised at just how much speed you are now travelling at. I'm not a boy racer and getting from 0-62 in 5 seconds doesn't interest me but the only time I do notice the CVT 'problem' is starting up a steep hill from a stand still and that doesn't bother me one iota. I think it's a case of technique. I do really enjoy your reviews BTW.
Actually, the Toyota e-cvt is purely mechanical with an electric motor through a planet gear, which is very durable and brilliant. The speed difference between the electric motor and the input shaft is what's doing the gear changes. So no chain or rubber band. If you run the car normally, the noise isn't really a problem. If you like sporty driving, it's the wrong car anyways.
The future hybrids with more electric power and bigger batteries will probably do ok with a small ice engine and a cvt. Maybe a lockup function would be a solution.
The CVT is not what you are describing. I drive a Subaru with CVT, and own a Rav4 hybrid, the hybrid gearbox is the brains behind system. I think it is unfair to even compare this gearbox to a normal CVT, yes there feel the same to drive, but are designed for two different things. I think the solution would be to make the Rav4 engine quieter. Driving the Rav4 normally I find I don't notice it that much
Just test driven the car this evening. Thought the car was amazing and particularly in Ev mode and driving in a relaxing manner round town in hybrid. The issue you mention only occurred when you started accelerating quickly and when you drove out of town. This so called issue would not occur on the motorway cruising and in town driving when you would either be going go slowly or in EV mode. An exceedingly high proportion of journeys are less than 41 miles. I must admit I never heard it later in the evening when the kids had the music on which as a family car would be most of the time. For you as a petrol head I think it’s and issue but I think the majority of the buyers will not worry about this. For me I am waiting for the Lexus NX 450 PHEV. That will be my next car. Thanks for the honest review,
As has now been pointed out, the transmission on the RAV4 PHEV isn't an old style CVT gearbox. Its far more advanced and efficient than that. I have been driving the Mitsubishi Outlander PHEV for 7 years , which also has the same electronic multimode transmission as the RAV4. It provides a continuous and seamless drive, very smooth and ,yes, when under hard acceleration or going up steep hills, the engine revs go up. But its designed to do that. The engine isn't under strain. And to be honest, it rarely happens in most normal driving situations.
We have this SUV on order, not sure what to do now 😒
Important to drive one and make your own mind up. As I said in the review there is a huge amount to like about this car 👍
You should learn about the CVT. It uses a planetary gear set with one part connected to the engine and another part by the motor/generator with the third part connected to the drive line. There are no “cones and rubber bands”. Perhaps you could learn how it works and do a video to explain it. It is clever but simple and with an understanding of the workings in the various modes you may enjoy this part of the technology a little more?
Please read the pinned comment 👍
💯
Very well done video Sir Pete!!
Just have to state that I’ve always appreciated your genuineness and honesty with all the car reviews you do. It’s part of the charm of your channel. Most youtubers don’t give completely honest reviews and I feel you always do.
Also here’s a we’re are you and what are you doing moment for ya: I listened to this whole video well shoveling my drive way that was covered in a foot and half snow ❄️ now that I’m done with that its off to get ready for a weekend long celebration for my wife’s 30th b day! Have a great weekend everyone!!
Thank you sir,enjoy your weekend too.Shoveling snow is hard work.
Weather looks amazing where you are mate. Happy Birthday Mrs C 👍
No electricity cars for me ! Haha
I think the E-CVT gearbox is truly the most briljant invention in car history. Yes, it takes some miles/time to get used to but it definitely grows on you. My brand new RAV4 Prime does 47 miles ev and then performs like a regular hybrid vehicle. Plug it in when you can and not when you want and you will have a smile on your face the whole day! You do need your own charger back home though to make it a true joy but if performance, comfort, handling and looks matter to you, the RAV4 Prime is the right choice. Put that together with Toyota's renowned reliabilty makes this car a very wise choice should you be looking for a fast, comfortable and nice looking ride!
Just a shame we spent 15 years w@nking up fear against it and the Prius, a car that can go well over 300,000 miles with basic maintenance if you wanted to.
Imports to note its a planetary gear system CVT not a belt/chain and cylinder/cone CVT
no es cvt
i believe they're using the e-cvt due to the reliability it has over a normal automatic gearbox....the entire toyota brand is built on simplicity and reliability.
they could easily add a turbo to their 2.5L lineup and a ZF gearbox which would make the cars rockets + less noise but also way less reliable.
The most important thing is that the cvt is the most reliable gearbox in this model and it’s just a case of getting used to it. Zero problems, turn the music up… problem solved 🤓
As a RAV 4 (2021) owner, I have used it limited on light trails here in the UK and it is absolutely fine. Even in EV mode it can tackle some steep inclines. But it is NOT an off roader. You're correct. But it can go off road if really needed.
I love the looks and it does stand out in a very striking way, IMHO. I think the exhaust thing is subjective, I like them as they are. The tailgate is okay, it is a bit slow but I can live with that. Love the bicycle thing as I also have a bike so that is a strong point for me too, so well done for illustrating this !.
The design by Toyota has given it a SUV look that ''means business''. The build quality, fit and finish is 100% top class. It may not compete with Land Rover or Volvo, VW etc. But it is snapping at their heels. I purchased a late 2021 model (basic spec but it has everything I need) with a silly low mileage and I bought it from a Toyota franchise near where I live so I have peace of mind that it is being serviced by them.
In the early spring / summer it will do 56 miles on EV . Yes 56 miles not 46 miles - it is that good. I have yet to go through winter with it, to be fair. I've not come across the sound thing when ''pushing on'' so for me no problem. I don't hear it. Arguably in ''sport mode'' it is being well, errr, sporty ? Arguably the noise might be for some a good thing. Not an issue for me. As also the infotainment system not an issue for me. To be fair the fact you say it like you think it is for you, that is being honest and that is all one can ask. So a great honest review. Well done PP 😀
First!! Evening all! Hope had a good week and has a lovely weekend.
It’s gonna be a great weekend! Celebrating my wife’s b day all weekend long. Hope you have a great weekend to Francois!!
@@coltoncleveringa8004 Ahhh that sounds lovely. Cheers.
Boom 💥
Unless they have a different CVT in the UK, the RAV4 Prime does not have a two cone CVT. It has a eCVT which uses a planetary gear with an electric motor controlling the sun gear and giving a CVT gearing action. I don’t think CVTs make any more or different noise than a automatic or a manual transmission. It just has no gear shifts. They sound the same in cars where they simulate gear shift (which probably reduces the fuel economy of a good CVT). In the car you have (top of the line) there are paddle shifters that would make it like a paddle shifted manual.
Please read my pinned comment 👍
Absolutely nobody is passing on this car because of the CVT, it's buttery smooth, efficient, and trouble free, after driving cars with CVT's I never want to go back, a multi speed tyranny makes total sense in a manual trans, but it's far more off putting when an auto jumps gears when it wants to, instead of when you want it to, with a CVT, it's just smooth accel/decel from 0-top speed.
I have a similar 2.5L in my Lexus RC. The revs of a CVT are the sounds of efficiency. Optimum torque and power at the time needed. No belts on an e cvt, it's a balance managed by motors and generators that manage the revs. Personally I like the system, wish my RC had plug in ability to. Car shoots off the line surprising many.
Ive had this car for 12 months it is great ,yes there are niggles but overall it is brilliant, very quick also! Think phevs are best overall option at moment , we average over 199 miles per gallon.
I had a Lexus IS300h for 4 years, basically the same engince as the RAV 4, but no plug in. You kind of adjust your driving style to a more relaxed style with the CVT, but it can be quite brisk especially from a standstill. The only downside I found was that sometimes in icy weather the braking could be a little strange, being rear wheel drive it would do the energy recovery so braking more on the rear until the system handed over to the proper brakes where you would expect a front bias, it would induce a skid quite easily albeit at a very slow speed. Overall a cracking car though I thought, effortless motorway cruiser.
I have owned a 2012 Honda Insight and my mom owns a 2015 Toyota Yaris Hybrid. The CVT gearbox in the Toyota is widely regarded as the best of all the CVT gearboxes. We have to remember that we don't buy hybrids for their performance and thus shouldnt drive them, thinking they should put our pants on fire with their performance.
Sensible
You need to watch WeberAuto analysis of the eCVT, no rubber bands in the Toyota implementation. It's an amazing design with two electric motors and a planetary gear set. Once you understand that, you can appreciate the way the engine stays in its most efficient RPM and transfers torque to the drive gears. It's cool.
I did after I made this video and then made a follow up video admitting I got it wrong 😜😂👍
I don't think you were the audience for this car. I don't think most folks will notice that it 'sounds' different.
I try hard to consider what ‘the audience’ would want and actually a practice, comfortable, economical vehicle for the miles I do makes this a car that I am the audience for 👍
The front looks miserable and sad, as if it's about to cry lol.
"That" revving noise is the engine operating at the maximum power rpm. That is exactly what you want, CVT gives that, other types of gear boxes do not.
That may be the case but it don’t like the sound 🤷♂️
I enjoyed your review thanks. Basically you're saying that the 30% you don't like is mainly the sound of the engine note. I've had mine (the Suzuki Across badge engineered equivalent) for about 3000 miles now and love it. I bought it because of the ecvt planetary/electric gearbox which, to my mind, removes all of the clutch/friction based compromises of alternative automatic gearboxes. It's designed to keep the IC engine within its maximum efficiency limited rev band as it's an Atkinson cycle. The combination of the two makes for very good mpg. If you want to cane it a bit (not the reason you bought one of these I suspect) then it'll raise the revs to a less efficient and noisier level. I do agree the infotainment system is dated, the cameras aren't the sharpest and the tailgate is slow. I'm also not entirely convinced that the collision avoidance feature works but how to test!? The real killer is £500 extra excise duty because it cost over £40k, if I'd bought the IC version I'd have avoided that - a perverse non-incentive from HMG.
Why are the Brits absolutely slating the RAV4 plug-in, when our American friends can’t get enough of it, seems like 2 very different expectations.
Too be fair that comment works for lots of different cars. America liked the Cadillac Escalade for a start 😂😂😂
I love no gears. No clutches to wear. A standard auto is a timer set to fail based on use and time. The Ecvt's are very reliable. I can floor it off the line and I dont feel like a slipping a Dual clutch. Solenoids wearing. etc. No torque converters to fail. I happily hear a little drone of the engine with no shifts to jackrabbit start to the speed limit for the life of the car with no failures. Standard cars shift weird until they warm up as well. This is coming from a Prius which I beat the wheels off of. Tow 1000lb plus regular. 255k. Just drain and fill new fluid every 50k or so. Drives 100% the same. I have never had a regular auto feel the same for this long. Now if you are mostly highway miles there will not be much difference as the transmission will outlast the engine and body.
No cones of rubber bands in the Toyota Ecvt Mr Ped, it’s a planetary gearbox.
Please read pinned comment 👍
I bought a new Auris hybrid excel! Brilliant car except for that CVT which is basically the same! I found that I just changed my driving habits completely as I really didn't like that sound of a stressed engine! I got used to it and accepted that a light right foot was de'riguir. 🙄🤔👍
Yep, you can adapt your driving technique to maximise how the car works 👍
Far too enthusiastic about the rubber handles and knobs Pete.......😁
😂😂😂
Surely since the CVT is so noisy when going up hill, and i know because ive tested the standard hybrid, switch it to EV instead and when you get to the top, switch it to engine mode. It feels quite obvious to me that you'd use the EV mode to do the accelerating and up hills, fuel/ hybrid mode for level road, and recharge mode when going downhill because it uses less fuel going downhill so may as well top up the battery from the engine. It depends on what route is being driven but I honestly don't see the cvt noise as being an issue if you engage more with the battery selection. But great video BTW I really want the pluggin Rav.
On our second rav 4 hybrid, to be honest you do get used to the cvt gearbox, because overall to many plus points about this car, and by the way it copes very well in snow and rutted countryside lanes as we live on a farm, overall good review.
Exactly 👍
Drive a cx-60 phev with 8 speed auto and an outlander phev with single speed transaxle and you will see how good the toyota planetary gearset CVT is
Sure the mazda sounds (much) better but it cant compete on smoothness or economy.
And the outlander isnt even in the game when it comes to performance, running out of steam before it even gets to highway speeds
These cars are in high demand at the moment. Purchasers must wait two ++ months for delivery. Being able to take a test drive at many dealerships is very limited to non-existent. Hence, these on-line reviews are critical. I liked this reviewer's candor. It helped me latch onto the "CVT" debate. I frankly don't think it's a significant issue at all, but thank the reviewer for his apparently unbiased views.
First of all, CVT working with rubber bands was used by DAF in the year 1960-1975. It has completely nothing to do with Toyota's eCVT, which is not a mechanical CVT at all.
CVT's are there in all kind of appearances, it can be mechanical, electric, hydraulic, etc...
Talking about rubber bands sound like a very shaky construction, while the Toyota CVT construction is just the opposite!
Don't do that!!!
Toyota hybrides don't really have a gearbox. A fixed set of gears in a planetary construction will spin-up an extra generator which will produce the electrical energy needed for the electric motor to produce more torc.
So torc conversion is not done on a conventional mechanical way.with changing gears ratio's.
The Toyota construction is mechanical very simple and therefore lighter and much more reliable than any other hybride with conventional shifting gears and clutches.
The CVT may sound weird, but remember that a CVT is the ideal gearbox, it can adapt to any rpm or torc of the engine in the most efficient way.
So not choosing the car because of the CVT sound, seems to me a very foolish decision!
We are looking to chop my wife’s 2.7 ltr twin turbo Edge in for the RAV 4 or Venza. Have driven both, Venza is more refined, but a PHEV is the way ahead. That and my F150 Lightning…
Sticky up bad design tablet touch screen and CVT box... Alright if your a bus driver.
Not like Toyota to launch a new model that is dated from the get go... and by Not i of course mean Always ... Mk2 mr2 window switches as standard?
trilby and blanket on parcel shelf ..
One wonders how all that external black trim will age, scratches and so on. Looks a bit close to piano black-like finish… Nightmare to polish, too.
And personally, even though I have wireless CarPlay, I’m happy with BMW’s standard system.
And after a year of plugging in our previous hybrid Porsche each night, I lost interest and never bothered for the next two years. Just couldn’t be arsed, late at night, cold and rain, I just wanna get in the house, not messing about with cables. Porsche always told me most owners are the same…
This is not a normal car that you have driven before !
This is the best efficient PHEV car, with the best and reliable transmission so far.
So, is better to start getting use to it...
EDIT: Sorry, I now see that you made a newer video addressing this, I also forgot the Atkinson thing that you included in that video
17:00 Keep in mind that *this is not a CTV gearbox* , It's an e-CVT gearbox. So basically there is not slipping or tear or wear or anything. What you feel there is the electric motor controlling the engine's RPM to match the power demand with the thermal efficiency, that is why you hear it like over revving or straining, but it's not. So, there is no way that Toyota changes that because the e-CVT is looking for the most efficient RPM range not the most pleasant range.
22:52 So, if you where to know that the mastery of Toyota's hybrids over the years is because they invented a very simple reliable and efficient e-CVT that suffers no wear at the expense of some noise confort, you could be more than happy with it's performance, so there is no way that they could put a Torque converter or other kind of Gearbox other than that e-CVT.
Had this car for nearly 3years now from new, absolutely brilliant car very fast when the engine is on and soooo economic when in electric. Honestly a fantastic car all round! even though a bit pricey.
For me I think 🤔 that Toyota makes the best cars in the world 🌎 no doubt.....I'll buy Toyota any day any time....
Hi I had a TOYOTA C-HR 1.8 and the CVT in it was awful absolute hated it.
I know ppl will say o you have to adapt your driving style with a hybrid.
Ended up getting rid off it and going back to DSG.
In my opinion these vehicles are all the same...Functional and Dull...I could find something for 47k a lot more fun...
I have the Rav4 and that CVT noise you don't like is the noise that I do like. Each to their own I guess. I love it when I accelerate and the sound kicks in. It's sort of comforting. It takes away the boredom of a normally very quiet car.
Indeed 👍
I like the RAV4 but those exhausts look like an afterthought. They really spoil the look of the rear, in my opinion. Needs a couple of twin pipe trims!
I also did the Cornwall trip in my HEV RAV4 over the New Year and agree that it is a comfortable long distance cruiser. This is my third Toyota HEV (a Prius and a C-HR) and agree that the CVT is very marmite. I have learnt to drive around it and it does prefer to be driven in a more laid back manner, with the extra performance in reserve. I presume that Toyota has set it up this way so that the engine runs in its most economical range, it does run the Atkinson cycle for this. It would be interesting to drive a hybrid with a more conventional automatic gearbox, but this will be academic in a few years when we all move to BEVs anyway. I just hope that they've added a few more charges points in Cornwall and elsewhere by then as when we stopped at Exeter services all the chargers were in use.
So the review ended on the negative side because the car "sounds different" than non-hybrid cars. It missed the important detail that this unique ICE car can accelerate 0-60 miles in 5.7 secs, 9.5sec on electricity alone and at the same time offer >40mpg ! Sometimes it is good when things are different ! There are plenty of old cars to choose from that sound "right" and your parents drove ;)
Ordered one of these to get out my Leon Cupra 300 early, hate it. It can sound like a squealing piggy or mooing cow for all I care. The draw of better fuel economy (+20mpg ag least), a "reliable" car, plus a great lease deal is too good turn down. If you look at the whole package and the purpose of the e-cvt it's quite the engineering feat I think.
Is the passenger seat adjustable... I knew someone who returned the car due to this, which I find very strange. I think their concern was the height adjustment..Was the drivers seat electric and passenger manual ? . Totally agree on the gearbox issue though. Thanks JB
You are way behind with the evolution of CVT stuff.
This just happen to be called eCVT but has nothing to do with conventional CVT's functionality.
I felt so sorry that you were very uninformed in this and went along with quite poor personal appreciation of this marvelous power delivery scheme.
Update: I have the Rav4 with CVT box and it's brilliant. In a manual car you have horrendous engine noise every time you accelerate up through the gears. How is that better?
This video has too much focus on the sound of the engine. The transmission gears the engine automatically to produce the optimal amount of torque/power for the situation. Its childish to claim you want the car to sound like its revving up at the cost of reduced power and fuel efficiency.
Absolutely love my RAV4 Prime. The so-called "CVT" is great and it does NOT have a rubber band and pulleys. It has planetary gears and is a brilliantly designed transmission. This transmission is used in the RAV4 Prime to maximize gas mileage and it is bullet proof. We are averaging over 90 mpg. and routinely get over 40 miles in EV range. We have timed 0-60 mph in 5.3 seconds. It is like a Chevrolet Volt on steroids, but with the added benefit of AWD and serious off-road capability. Fantastic vehicle.
Get what you're saying about the CVT. I have one in my Corolla and it isn't the best when pushing on but given how amazingly smooth it is in every day driving it is well worth the trade off.
have you compared this to the standard hybrid, the cost uplift for a 1 year old is around 8k, i see the towing capacity is lower and ive also seen the roller reviews showing the phev AWD-I implementation is next to useless
I really hope the new Mazda CX 60, using this drive unit, won't end up using the CVT gearbox as well
I am not in the market yet because I have a 03 Tundra that still runs like a top. But when I go to buy an EV or hybrid, sound will not be what I will care about. I want to get the smae quality and endurance that my Tundra has givn me. Toyo has been in the hybrid business for many years and they seem to be the best at it..IMO.. If sound is a top issue for you, I would not buy it but I think most are looking for something they can be confident about more than sound.. That is what music is for. LOL
i have rav 4 hybrid none charging one, changing in new year to a plug in one, so used to the box and wont bother me in the slightest, love the car and its reliability, driven most things over the years being in the car job myself, would not put anyone off buying the car because of the box, it drives fine with the cvt box but like you just my opinion, owned present one since april 22.
Try the Daf 33, 44, 55 ore the 66. From Holland. Variomatic inventor. Hihi
To appreciate that revving is better, he should have a stick-shift Ferrari as a second car. He'd then never complain about the engine noise and wanting to lug an engine (which is not good for it).
Teach your foot for more sensitive touching, then you will enjoy the e-CVT (machine learning AI LOL)
I’m really glad you have had this car as a long-termer. I’m now a big fan of Toyota, having a Corolla with the 2.0 Hybrid, after 5 years with a Golf R, and numerous GTIs prior. The ‘CVT’ transaxle is great - as you say if you drive it within its comfort zone. The big thing for me is the reliability, and the quality of the dealer network - this is a car you can run for 15 years, with just basic maintenance, no water pump leaks, coil pack failure etc.
This word reliability is often forgot when reviewers review cars. For a lot of people (especially as a family car) it’s at the top of the list way above the 0-60 time or how fast the boot shuts. Tue average RUclips review will compare a Toyota to some French or German car which you can’t really compare because of the reliability aspect.
My next door neighbour has an S reg corolla. The only real repair has been just brake discs and pads. Still has buttery smooth drive. Smoother than my 2 years old VW Tiguan.
Such a boring, mayonaise vehicle. Its pedestrian Pete. I'd never aspire to own this.
Great review as always. I am intrigued by these CVT transmissions and I think what you describe you hear under hard acceleration is what youngsters riding their rev ‘n’ go 50cc and 125cc mopeds sound like - they hit a constant sounding rev ‘limit’ but actually the engines is a peak power in its power band……….. Ask anyone who has ridden a Gilera runner fast and hard! Keep up the good work. 👍. PS I currently drive a BMW X1 with 190bhp diesel and auto transmission and can get 55-60 mpg on a long journey. I will test drive a Rav 4 PHEV and see for myself what it’s all about. I think it will suit my driving style. 🥴
I have driven CVT gearbox cars for the last 7 years and much prefer it to a normal automatic. The reviewer's problems with the CVT box appear to be entirely within his own head.
Personal opinion/preference 👍
The dealer says it’s normal for the aircon to cut out in when you’re in very slow moving traffic, in sunny hot weather and really need cooling down..
I’ve had mine for 18 months. I love it! I get 47-52 miles of range and have fueled up about 10 times total. I live in a mild climate which raises the range.
Nice 👌
My wish that it was just a electric car with big battery. Toyota makes a very nice car and I have got relatives that own a few different ones. They usually get the higher end models which make these smashing.
Am I the only one that plays music or podcast or radio while driving? Last thing I hear is the engine. Is it that much of a deal breaker? Lol
If you use this type of vehicle purely as electric constantly topping the battery up on short trips your asking for trouble. Fuel goes bad over time and needs to be refreshed by using it. Or when you need the engine you may find yourself at the dealers.
Toyota have been using this (non-pulley) type e-cvt since the first Prius in the 90s. It is a beautifully simply concept in the way it works. Very reliable. But I can understand why people don’t like it at first.
I find the best way to drive us in ECO mode, it reduces the way the engine seems to over rev when driving on the motorway when trying to maintain constant speed.
Having done 90000 miles in my 2018 RAV4, you get used to it, just drive more gently to get the best out of it.
The Suzuki Across version does have Eco Mode so I would think the Rav 4 does because they are virtually the same car.@@nicovl
Great review… can I just point out though that the gearbox is Toyota’s ‘e-cvt’ NOT a belt driven old school cvt and they use it in their hybrid drive train for it’s efficiency. I’m not an engineer but you look on line on RUclips there are some very good videos explaining how it works and it’s very clever and robust…… Anyway, I appreciate your honest reviews saying things as you find them. As someone who has recently traded my diesel Volvo XC60 with its ’geartronic’ auto box for the ‘self charging’ RAV4 hybrid, I find the CVT gearbox incredibly smooth and seamless in the way it drives. Now I always thought my Volvo’s gearbox was incredibly smooth but the RAV4 is an even quieter and smoother in normal driving, and I think that is the key here. Most people buying the RAV4 hybrid (either ‘self charge’ or PHEV) are not going to want to drive it like a sports car, they are simply going to want to waft along enjoying the comfort, (and it’s every bit as comfortable as the Volvo which is a great compliment) quiet ride and ultimately the great fuel consumption from what is a decent sized SUV. On the odd occasion when you need to put your foot down and use the performance to overtake etc, then yes it may get a bit ‘busy’ but it doesn’t detract from the other 99% of smooth quiet driving. For me personally I couldn’t justify the extra £10k for the PHEV over the ‘self charge’ and I love the fact that I can just drive and never give a thought to what the clever hybrid system is doing … until I stop at the pump to fill up and realise the great fuel consumption I’ve achieved 😊👍 ….. and PS, when I want sporty acceleration I just take the V8 SL500 out!! 😆
Thanks for this. I was trying to simplify things but thanks for the excellent explanation. As I said in the review, for town and relaxed driving this car is super smooth and I like it. It’s when you push on, go into charge mode or climb a steep hill the the high revving engine is not to my liking 👍
@@PetrolPed thanks I know it’s difficult keeping explanations simple. Like I said, great review as ever but just thought I’d let you know my thoughts. I think you’re right that hybrids are the way forward rather than full EVs with the current technology 👍
I have driven a CVT hybrid. I have a Kia Niro which is a much better match for the Hybrid
Hi, can you tell me if the Rav4 Plug-In comes with a spare wheel and if not can you fit one in?
No es una fragil caja cvt, aunque el motor se revolucione es un sistema mucho mejor
It's an ecvt.. no cones, but a planetary gearbox. Extremely reliable.. I think what road testers don't realise when they jump from car to car. Is that we learn to embrace when we understand how reliable and long lived toyotas are. Just look at how many 200,000 mile cars on Autotrader toyota have compared to other manufacturers have, who sold three times as many cars over the same period. This need to be though about when conducting road tests. I think you need to say.. instead of it really annoys you, and moreover. It really annoys me. I think you need to realise, you are letting your emotions getting in the way of logic to a certain degree. Having said that. Your road tests are pretty good, notwithstanding.😊
Watch my second video. I was just trying to simplify the explanation…
ruclips.net/video/X_CxHjK1Cn4/видео.htmlsi=Ryw1LdCRcd-mtnez
i think it's a bit exaggerated with the gearbox no one driving full throttle all the time and it's not at all close to ruining the good impression of the car.
A very well balanced review. Great for the consumer. Your points are all well made and very valid. I've had Toyota's and they are always well spec'd but a bit dull to drive in my opinion. Thanks Pete.
It's nice but nothing ever be perfect for everyone 👍
Very true 👍
I don't believe the RAV4 uses the cone and band CVT. Instead, I believe it uses planetary gears. Also, I understand that the infotainment system is getting a complete upgrade for the 2023 models, including digital dials too. I am on my second of the latest generation of RAV4s, albeit not the PHEV model, and I had a CH-R prior to the first RAV4. The CVT has not caused any concern at all for me. You have to think of the engine as more of a generator than being always connected to the wheels. It is just different from a conventional setup but I don't think it makes it worse.
Yep your are correct. My bad trying to simplify a description. I’ve done a video on how the eCVT works. It’s on the channel 👍
Your complaint seems to be based on the noise alone. How the car actually functions is brilliant to me!
Very expensive. Out the door price of a luxury car, but only a nice ordinary car.
I watched a lot of R4P reviews, and you are the only one who touched on what I felt when I test-drove this car. I drive a 240-HP 3.0-Liter 6-Cylinder 2008 BMW, and I never hear or feel any revving when I accelerate. I went to test drive this R4P with strong intention to buy it, as I was expecting to be blown away by the 302-HP. But was annoyed by this revving noise when I tried to accelerate. I thought it was because the battery was empty (It was not charged at the dealership), so the car is only running on the 177-HP ICE, and that is why it was noisy.
As I am trying to try driving it again with the battery charged, but now, if your battery was charged when you shot this video, you are confirming the noise is attributed to the CVT, not a depleted battery.
👍
My only crisis of Toyotas is how dark and gloomy they are inside.
Get a Pacifica Hybrid if you dislike the CVT sound.
I agree with the touch screen not being embedded in the dash. It looks like it was added after purchase.
Using your mobile is great till you have no coverage. Then you need maps on your car
Great review as always. I watched before I bought ….. and now, after I bought …. As I’ve recently bought the 2023 version of this after a remapped BMW X3 M40i … it’s a bit of a change to say the least but I love it ! You hit the nail on the head with mostly great except the gearbox and infotainment, They have replaced the infotainment for 2023 and it is hugely better. The car overall is so smooth and quiet in EV and hybrid, so comfy, that I can forgive the quirky CVT which I did have in a 71 plate Yaris so did actually know what to expect. My driving 90% of the time doesn’t need any more than a squirt of acceleration these days so the noise I can live with and laugh when it does it … as it is still pokey and 300hp ! It does shift when it wants but stopping is more of an issue than the BMW was. The economy is great and it is a lovely place to be for a normal if not spirited drive. I miss my X3 M40i but not the fuel bills one bit . The RAV4 phev is a lovely car and a ten year UK warranty was what swung it too. My battery is currently showing 51 miles purely electric so I wonder if they have slightly updated it for 2023 ?
Great to hear 👍
Hi Pete, was seriously looking at buying this exact model, think your review is harsh re the cvt, to be fair most people looking at a hybrid are not petrol heads, the car is designed for other things. I was just about to go to a Toyota dealer this morning however cancelled because just read the dynamic premium does not have a heated steering wheel, I'm of an age and once you've had this on a car you will always want it so it's a deal breaker for me. Bizarrely you can have a heated wheel on the Excel HEV but not the more expensive Dynamic HEV, this is nuts. Come on Toyota sort this out, who makes these decisions ?
By the way your model, unless I'm mistaken, was approx £51k yet now is approx £46k, any idea why and why it wasn't publicised ??