FWC: Overreach or Justified? You Be the Judge!
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- Опубликовано: 14 окт 2023
- Capt. Dan, Elizabeth, and a good friend set out for an epic day of lobstering. But, as the sun sets, a storm looms, and an unexpected encounter with the FWC leaves them wondering: Is this overreach or justified? Let us know your thoughts by leaving a comment!
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I personally don’t make conversation with those guys during a stop, from their prospective it makes you seem nervous. Also, as a USCG licensed captain I am the only one that talks to the FWC during a stop. I get my safety gear out right away, all those things together speeds it up. Also, if they want to check my fish they can get on the boat and do it themselves. Just my opinion.
True
Yeah, I was surprised Dan didn't see if one of them didn't want to come on board and poke around. I would have.
Yup, great advice that I will listen to with future stops. Appreciate the comment. Hope to see you out on the water sometime.
There's so many careless people on the water these, they have to be this thorough now.
Doing their job, 100%
You were lucky to get only a warning re: fire extinguisher.
I wish our Texas, Arizona borders were this protected.
Ha! How about that! GREAT COMMENT!!! 👍👍👍
Right😂😂😂
I’m not sure I understand. As a fellow veteran we swore to uphold and defend the constitution, so did the cops yet they have no problem when it comes to “just following orders”. We have heard that line before throughout history.
Another veteran in Florida as well was arrested for BUI even though he was absolutely sober and no drugs in his system.
Cops have proven way too many times that they are fragile people and admit they “enforce the law” based on how they feel about someone, or what they are told to do.
I used to believe they were good guys, but there is ample evidence that prove they will pretend to be nice to get you to talk. There is nothing weasile when it comes to recording all encounters with police. They have cameras that they deliberately mute, turnoff, or the video disappears.
Just recently a police lieutenant arrested a teenager because he didn’t like the way he looked at him as he was walking home from school! Both the school district and the police tried hiding the video evidence for a year before it just became public. Imagine it was something where a man’s life was on the line. Go to the institute for Justice YT channel as well as The Civil Rights Lawyers YT channel to see just a handful of the criminality that happens and is almost never handled correctly.
So what is the answer here? True not all LEO are honest or good cops but that can be said of any profession.
Yes. I fully agree. These officers are not our friends and they don’t care about our safety. Their mandate is to generate revenue and overreach, just like their counterparts on land, the cops.
There are criminal on both side i have family and friends in the law enforcement departmen just be carefull.
That was a full textbook inspection, in part for the benefit of the younger FWC guy, but likely mostly because they were being filmed. My boat is only 18.5 ft so not so much space to look through. One day we were fishing outside Channel 5 and were checked by 2 different FWC boats within 20 minutes. I was tempted to ask if they don't talk to each other when on the water, but I kept my lip zipped. FWC used to give you an inspection sticker to put on your boat (pre-Covid) if you passed the inspection, but they don't seem to do that any more. One guy even told me it was illegal to display an expired inspection sticker........not sure about that, but the 3 year old sticker is still on my boat. Once they see you have everything up to date they pretty much leave you alone. Enjoy your videos....they're always a treat!
If not doing anything to worry about, just provide what they ask for, try to be polite, easy on the small talk if at all, everything should go faster & smoother ?
I am law enforcement and I agree with the one comment. It seemed like this was possibly a training video, and the FTO usually let's the trainee run the stop/call/ investigation 99%. They make sure they don't violate anyone's rights and or SOP. Training by the book. Once released, he/she can use discretion and judgement on how far they think they need to go. Good job on both parts during this encounter. Nice video, and yes, what a monster lobster.
As law enforcement you have failed to protect our good citizens from real crime, while generating revenue for the gang responsible for it!
Stockholm Syndrome - Positive feeling toward their captors and sympathy for their causes and goals
Well, there is a little more to it than that. Thats a bit of an exaggeration. 👍
100% on point
Dan, great educational video to show others what is needed when boating and lobstering (nice behemoth lobster). I was confident that you would pass without any issues as you are a responsible steward of our fisheries and always encourage others to do the right thing. It's never a comfortable feeling when the USCG, FWC or Park Rangers conduct their safety checks, eventhough you know your stuff is tight. At least they were polite and professional, it looks like it's a field training exercise for the younger officer. Like you, I don't keep barely legal fish and don't limit out so that there are more for tomorrow. Oh, I was an 11B20 in the late 70's and also a retired LEO. And yes it's a pain to go through these full body searches, but I understand it has to be done. Congrats to you and Elizabeth for the excellent content on your channel, and thank you for service SGM. Verdict: Standard Thorough Search
Thank you for your service and special thanks for the comment and for “Following Us!” We are proud to have subscribers like yourself! 🫡
dan as new lic six pack cpt I thought you and fwc both handle your self with respect.And also when i get my l the saltwater plastic I will send you some home made saltwater lures to use next summer @@FloridaFishingCouple
That would be awesome! Thanks!!
People often rely on the police because they are the only option funded and mandated by the Government. Similar to the Mafia, people must pay for police services whether they want to or not, and the Government discourages competition. Additionally, Government laws/policies restricting firearms in one way or another contribute to the perceived necessity of police services, making the Second Amendment less effective.
I've received the full inspection from USCG, the US Army Marine unit (Aberdeen Proving Grounds) and MD Department of Natural Resources in a period of 3 hours.
APG didn't like one of my flare guns, (Mossberg Marine 12 gauge and the 20mm). They called for USCG as they were out of their element. USCG didn't know squat about the Chesapeake Sport Fish License for the boat, so anyone fishing from the boat is covered, so Maryland DNR to the rescue. 2 hours later, good to go.
The military needed better training on where their property is located, CG Curtis Bay learned about the Sport Fish License. DNR were the most professional of the bunch, they knew the regulations, and I was cut lose 3 hours after the stop.
Continue to video everything Dan. It keeps everyone honest. There is their story, your story and video evidence. And video doesn't lie.
That big spiny lobster looked amazing. I'm accustomed to the 1/2 pound cooked weight spiny lobsters, almost not worth eating at the table.
It almost seems like it was training. And had to do whole thing. What impressed me is the way you guys handled with professionalism. You guys rock as always.
That’s a possibility. There was lots of chatter back and forth between the officers, so that may have been the case. We always remain respectful, so appreciate the comment on that too!
That was my exact thought"training"... notice how the experienced guy had no humor?I've also been stopped by all 3 in the same day so his comment isn't a big deal!
Same here, I think the officer was in training and he was being evaluated by the other officer to see if he missed anything. You all had everything to be legal and found out that you needed another fire extinguisher. No harm no foul.
Appreciate you guys joining in with your perspectives
Captain Keith here, Captain Dan we did basically the same thing while I was in the Coast Guard with our small Boston Whaler, (14'), and all we did was do a safety check in the marinas. Our three rescue boats were out doing their thing. Er, Dan, don't be afraid to do some modeling with the skins, let your subscribers figure out the best ones for you ! Have a nice Day.
Aw, your making me blush! 😊
To me what would be the most agitating thing is they stopped you not becuase you where suspicious or doing something wrong, but just because they could. Which I know is within maritime law but the law that allows them to do that is from the 1700s and was intended for commercial use
That my issue here. Not with the officers but with a law that allows for American citizens to be subject to search and seizure without probable cause a crime has or is being committed. Can’t do that on land, why can it be done in the water?
If that were the case on water, then wouldn’t many (maybe most) take undersize, oversize and exceed the limit knowing there’s no good way to develop suspicion or reasonable cause of a boat running across the water. This is not analogous to land. Most criticism of marine patrol that I see is from people wanting a better chance to get away with something illegal. I think what we have here is nice boat with a crew of people full of themselves. Officers were entirely professional and respectful.
@@FloridaFishingCoupleThey do it on land to. I got pulled over 30 miles from the gulf pulling my airboat. Did the same search on me. We had out limit of trout . One was over 22 inches which your allowed one oversize. They questioned me about how I caught it due to they didn't see any hook mark in it's mouth. They went through every compartment even every tray in my tackle box..I was a law enforcement officer at that time. I'm retired now.
Definitely seems this like a rookie with his FTO, doing a thorough check by the book as they should.
Thanks for sharing. What they were doing (and even more so with your video) is extending the perception of "omnipresence". Other boaters see the stop (myself included here) and it serves as a reminder to check my gear for compliance because I might be stopped too. Everyone was professional and compliant. No issues with the stop.
Hoping this video will help others who are coming down to boat to remember to bring and have all their safety gear serviceable and on board. Thanks for sharing your thoughts.🤣
I had a 36' Tollie cabin cruiser in Puget Sound Washington. We , 2 adults and 2 children on board , were stopped and inspected by Coast Guard and the Washington Fish & Game, in the same day.
Coast guard came on board and did an inspection. They checked the head, fire extinguishers, radios , lifejackets , and E- purb. Took about 45 minutes.
Fish & Game stopped us and checked for licenses, fire extinguishers, and all the paperwork that the Coast guard did. That took about 30 minutes also.
I found out later if you have a coast guard inspection on The dockside they will give you a sticker to put on a window.
The Coast guard came on board and did a physical check. Fishing game stayed on their boat and we just hand it off paperwork.
Sometimes it seems excessive but they are protecting our Waters and our fisheries.
The bigger the boat the more fire extinguishers you have and I found it's best to have extra everything
Instead of trying to curb fentanyl smuggling by illegal aliens they harass honest fisherman enjoying the few things we have left!
Grow a pair.
@@COWBAYOUBADASShaha
@@jackspinner4727 For real, this dude worried about catching on fire when he surrounded by water.
USCG is only agency that can board your vessel without permission, on or off the water. No other state or fed agency can do so legally.
Unfortunately there are many who put the keepers in one bin and the shorts in another which hurts our our fisheries. In a way its very good that people see this. Was it frustrating? Yes! Was it all necessary for you ? No, but it is necessary for many out there so they are doing there job. Great Job Capt! You passed and we’re on your way.. that’s all that really counts. Those guys see the best of em out there as you can only imagine
Great comment and perspective. Thanks for watching, commenting, and especially for “Following Us!”
Yes I totally agree with this comment. They were doing their entire job.
I'm in Louisiana and they rolled up on me one time when I was fishing. their excuse was they thought I was stranded and having issues with my motor. I always carry a sidearm, showed them my CCW permit, and they left.
Whew! Glad that went ok for you! Appreciate you taking the time to comment!😁
Great video. This has been a typical experience for me out on the water. Yours went very well. Stay safe
Thanks, you too! Appreciate the comment!
Nice lobster you're so fortunate to enjoy these waters. The downside is...Inspections are part of it. They're like your frequent storms-they're inevitable and you need to be prepared. This FWC crew was pretty professional. I think you got lucky with only a warning. The stop is a good reminder for us to review the regs once a season. I'm a retiree that fishes all around the country and its quite a patchwork of regs and Florida is crazy complicated-especially the conservation stuff. The fish and state apps are pretty handy to help but if you have cell issues you can be screwed. Enjoy the sea my friends.
Yes, it sucks getting stopped, but they were very professional. You guys did everything right and went home with a great catch!!!
I had two "inspections" years ago with the NJ Marine police. Their egos were injured when I wouldn't allow them to board my boat. They think they're GODs ! (IMHO)
In my opinion they were that thorough because they knew they were being recorded. 37 min for a safety check is excessive. Is there a limit? Can they "safety check you for 6 hours?" When does it become a detainment/arrest? I once was stopped 3 times in 90 min by 3 different agencies without any violations. Sometimes it takes the fun out of boating and makes you want to sell everything. I definitely would not encourage anyone I know to be a LEO nowadays. Especially FWC. Low pay to be an agent for the gov't and take people's $$ to fund a fiscally irresponsible gov't and ruin people's days on the water.
You’re right, it must be tough to be in law enforcement these days. I really appreciate the comment. You raised some very interesting questions. Thanks for supporting the channel!
While I agree this was mostly a professional stop, there were a few issues including blocking a highly active channel.
It seems like FWC has been "extra" focused since Sept. Got to keep the water safe and that revenue generated 👍
New follower here, Florida native and commercial fisherman for years. We have seen the lightest of checks and the most thorough of checks known to man. My honest opinion it seems like the officers were doing a safety check (while training) and doing their best to be nice at the same time. FWC doesn’t have to have a reason to stop you. Therefore a safety check gives them the opportunity to catch the bad guys doing bad things so to speak. With that being said you passed with flying colors. They gave you some key info for future safety checks and had the courtesy to give you a warning for the secondary fire equipment needed because of the size of the vessel you are operating. So in my honest opinion, operating waters from Ponce inlet all the way to sugarloaf key, I think they were just doing there job, observing you coming in from a fishing/snorkeling day and making a routine/simple safety check. You guys are amazing and gained a new follower. I look forward to more awesome videos!!
Really appreciate the comment and your experience on the water. Also, thanks for “Following Us!”
@@FloridaFishingCouple thank you all for making RUclips a place to watch high quality videos that are not only amazing but entertaining as well!! Honored to follow a great channel!!
I once had NY DEP hop on my boat as I was reeling in a fluke. They were busy checking my ice box in the stern. The fish I reeled in was short. As I was getting the hook out to toss it back, the Capt of the DEP boat shouted, " SHORT ON THE BOW...SHORT ON THE BOW!". 😂😂😂
The 2 officers on my boat ran from the stern to the bow as I released the fish.
The look of disappointment on their face was priceless. 😂😂😂
That’s hilarious!! Great story.
We had a house in the keys but a lot of our boats had Md registration. We had to change it after a few years bc we were a magnet for the law. Never got a ticket but we rarely went a day or two without being stopped. I think out of staters are an easy mark.
Very thorough. Nothing wrong with that. FWC can now use your video as a training video. Stand up guys for giving you a warning and not a ticket. Also giving you an education god forbid you ever need a 2nd extinguisher
That second extinguisher is on board now!
I agree, they did a full inspection. Down here on the Texas coast that's usually done late afternoon on the way in of course, much like yours was.
I really enjoyed the video and the lobster and you have a new subscriber from Texas.
Awesome! Welcome to our RUclips family and thank you for”Following Us!”
That looked like a new officer in his FTO phase being trained and showing that he can do the job on his own and going through all the motions during a stop.
Dude’s feelings got hurt. Then pretends he wants objectivity. “Not a hit on LEO at all. Now…watch this and tell me it’s not overreach!!!”
So, that’s another vote for overreach.
100% that was a rookie getting trained
That would explain the depths they went to during this stop.
I am a law enforcement officer in Florida. This definitely seems like it was done for training purposes. Also I can say supervisors and uppers will always want officers to be proactive. Love the videos and keep up the great work!
What does proactive mean in policing?
@@Southern_Taurus_they're both law enforcement
@@arnoldjohnson3317 It’s the exact opposite of reactive policing. Not even sure if your question was sarcasm.
You had a good trip! I actually had a FWC boat cut my line with their prop as I was reeling in a monster fish. My friend told them to wait until I landed the fish, the officer did not listen or care.
The problem is so many people try to beat the system any way possible. Keeping illegal size lobster, too many fish, etc. I'm sure they see it all and hear it all. Persona;lly, I am glad to see them out on the water doing their job as they are supposed to do it.
Thanks for the comment and for joining the conversation! 👍
Good Monday morning. Quick comment on your stop by FWC. I heard you talk about the time they kept you during the stop being long and excessive, possibly even overreach. The reason they dug so deep on all safety equipment, catch, and compartments is that you were in violation of the fire extinguisher. If they find one violation, that is a red flag that there could possibly be more, hence the full inspection. On another note, your throw cushion should have some line tied to it to aid in pulling the person in distress back to the boat. One more thing is that your horse collar life vest is no good in a heavy sea. Anything over 3 ft sea will rip those clean off of you. Safety in paramount on a boat. I'm sure you are aware of that. Be safe and happy boating. CaptainTing
Thanks for the good advice and words of caution. We are always trying to get better and think this video will help a lot of good people who come down to visit and need to know what to expect and how to remain safe on the water. Thanks for posting! 👍
Great observations Captain.
I would say this was a very professional stop. I have been stopped many times by the FWC and they are always very professional. I was once stopped 4 times on the same day, twice by the same officer (early and late). At his second stop, he laughed and just asked me to show him what I had kept since he first stopped me. I am very thankful those guys are out there doing their job!
I was checked 3 times once by two different wardens. They have always been courteous but to stop someone to check fishing licenses when they are not actively involved in fishing is a violation of the law.
To stop someone with a properly registered vessel committing no violations is wrong.
They must have a clear reason for the stop.
I was a California Fish and Game Warden. From my perspective, the young Warden was on field training and was being evaluated by his field training officer and that is why he was so thorough.
That does make a lot of sense. Thanks for the comment and follow up. 👍
The FWC officer should have just gone ahead and boarded your vessel when performing such a comprehensive inspection(search). Sergeant Major, perhaps those years serving in the Army with all of the "hurry up, and wait" SOP, made the FWC inspection "somewhat" less annoying. Have to give you a big thumbs up for maintaining your sense of humor.
I'd have to agree with this statement. If you're going to search and be that thorough, a boarding should be SOP
Nope less work let them do it all for them very smart work smarter not harder dookie
I doubt they care if your annoyed or happy or sad
Holy hell, if they stopped me I would have either gotten 20 tickets or they would have impounded my boat and locked me up. Way too much time especially that late in the evening. It made it more dangerous for you to drive home in the dark.
My brother in Christ perhaps you should look into the negative effects on your own safety if you've got that much wrong going on with your boat. If you mean wildlife violations then I can only hope you've already found out how karma works.
Ya, was it an over the top boat inspection...think so...but is a good refresher on what FWC is looking for. Commend you on staying patient. In May of this year (Marathon) we were stopped and the focus seemed to be safety gear, registration, fish in the box, etc. Was issued a warning due to expired (1 month!) flares. Also have the FWC mobile app to purchase and store licenses. In my case, FWC crew was friendly and one of the crew was new so I suspect it was more of a training exercise for them. Remember, you don't get a pass if you are good at conversation so just follow instructions, yes/no responses, and have a good evening ; ).
Great advice and worth listening and abiding by. Thanks for the comment!👍
Awesome video guys!!! Great trip for sure.
Thanks so much! We had a great day in the water all and all and dinner was delicious!
Great vid
What are the rod storage mounts you have those spinning rods stored in under your t top. I def need some of those
I think you handled this very well,I've seen people stash 😂and hide fish and lobster. Which by the way is the very reason these guys are checking every nook and craneie,there's always lawbreakers out there. ALL OF YOU handled it very,very well. Also loved the tank sized lobsters you guys got,wish Darlene and I were there to help you eat them,good content Dan,you should always expect an inspection like that,and if it's not that intense, it's your lucky day.
Thanks for taking the time to comment. You guys were welcome for dinner! 😁 we definitely agree with you that there are a lot of poachers out there and hope every one of them gets caught and pays the price. I think what we were looking for from this particular stop was a little more leeway and discretion on the part of the officers. There’s due diligence and then there’s over reach. This felt like the latter.
I have to agree,when every thing checked out, THEN is when they started asking you to open everything else,as if you were hidden something. I think they took your honesty and cooperation too far. Must have been a quota they were trying to get, go figure 🤔
As a former police officer, and licensed Master, I say that was a clean professional stop. The safety inspection was obviously needed, and you learned the Regs for vessels over 26ft. What I sensed was that the quiet officer was either the either the senior, or a training officer. So this was a training stop, which is another reason the second vessel was standing by during the stop, or he wasn't busy and just stoodby. There is another reason, but it's tradecraft. I give them a 100% in each section of the stop. Also, giving you a written reminder about the fire extinguisher, (and about having a day flag if you are going to use an electric flare) was thoughtful. Remember Captain, you are the operator of the vessel, and are responsible for the safely of your passengers, including their safe return, along with having all required safety gear easily accessible. In fact, every trip should be begin with where the life jackets are, (adult and child), the throw ring, fire fighting equipment, first aid kit,, and MOB procedures. Spot, Yell, Point and keep a Visionual, how to make a distress call and channel to use, and where to find your location. The Captain will know how to😮 reposition for a MOB based on sea and wind conditions, or execute a Williamson turn. Running drills so you don't waste time, is great to do, especially if you have your regular crew or team you fish with. REMEMBER SECONDS CAN COUNT! if everyone knows what to do, and their role, you reduce having A 2ND MOB, or people panicking, getting in the way or causing injures. Being on the water as much as you guys, this preparedness could save someone's life you encounter in your voyages. Just remember, in Admiralty Law, the safety of the passengers and vessel operation squarely fall on the Captain. When operating, you are law, and in command, passengers are going to turn to you for direction, so be educated and know what to do Captain! Safe boating and tightlines. - Captain Ed
Thanks for the all the professional advice Captain Ed. Appreciate the comment and support. 👍
Fell asleep reading your post 💤 🛌
@@bigjohn7057Sleep apnea can be treated, treatment often includes lifestyle changes, such as weight loss, and reduced alcohol use, along with a breathing device. The interruption of breathing causes a reduced flow of oxygen to the brain, which impacts brain cells, which in turn leads to the inability to think clearly, in addition to falling asleep during waking hours. I wish you the best.
@@edwinostrand1003 thanks doc. I’m sure you are a real physical specimen
@@bigjohn7057 My pleasure, glad I could help.
Big ups from Jamaica! Love the Jamaican style shout out. Those FWC guys are definitely more thorough than our authorities are here!
That’s for sure! Never did see any law enforcement on the water when we visited last month. Love your country by the way!!
@@FloridaFishingCouple awesome to hear! If you are ever back in Montego Bay would love to take you guys out fishing.
We might just take you up on that invitation!! 😀
You mentioned that you asked to video them - my guess is they had no choice to "give you a break" or "go easy" - if I'm their CO, and I see that on RUclips, then I have no choice either than to ream them for anything less than exactly professional and complete inspections. My take is - you got exactly what you asked for (and maybe a rookie in there as well :)
As someone stated probably a rookie getting trained on his first stop. Dan this may have been annoying but they were doing their job man. Nothing here was unwarranted. Just let them do their jobs and be on their way if you truly support them that's all you need to do the less grief you give them quicker they can be on their way.
However I understand it sucks that you got stopped by the rookie who had to do the entire full inspection as a Captain myself I have dealt with this and man does it suck.
Yup, I’m with ya! I’m not sure why, but this particular stop just left a bad taste in my mouth. We’ve been stopped many times as you have I’m sure by the Coast Guard, Sheriff’s Office, and by the county, and none of them ever felt like this stop. Most of the time the interaction is friendly and helpful. Thanks for your perspective. Hope to see ya out on the water. 👍
Yeah gota train them to use their big thumb and the boot on us Lol we need more 🐑like you
I feel like they were doing their job and we both learned something’s and maybe some day what we learned will save ourselves lives. Great video, thanks
Thanks! I learned a couple of things I need to tighten up on my boat since we just moved to Florida.
One of the best benefits of our channel! We started it to shorten the learning curve on boating, fishing, and lobstering for people new to or just visiting Florida. Thanks for “Following Us!”
New Years Eve 2002 - The wife and I were partied-out from the holidays and decided we'd stay home, eat a late hearty meal and watch the ball drop. I got us 2 huge live Maine Lobsters (3.5lb and 3.25lb) cause we also wanted to make lobster rolls the next day. That night we also grilled clams and oysters. It was so good we ate mostly just lobster. At around 11pm we sat by the fireplace and started drinking champagne.
About 20min later my wife said, "My stomach feels bloated" I said yeah mine too. Holy crap 10 min later we were so miserably bloated from the champagne reacting to the lobster, we were both in bed passed out and missed the ball-drop!! 😳😵💫 We never mixed Lobster and champagne ever again!!🤣
Wow! That’s crazy. Wonder what that was about? Maybe too much butter interacting with the champagne?
@@FloridaFishingCouple I don't know. It wasn't a "gassy" expansion. Lol my wife described it as going from 0months to 7months pregnant in 10min!! I think the champagne normally causes the lobster meat to expand somewhat. Only thing I can figure is, that night we spent so much time prepping that late-night meal, we over indulged in lobster too quickly, so we could just relax, drinking till the ball dropped and have sexytime afterwards. Lol that didn't happen!! We've eaten lots of lobster since then (without champagne) and it hasn't happened again.
Maybe I can test it in a bowl using some cooked lobster-meat with some butter and champagne to see what it does. 😎👍
@@MAGGOT_VOMIT yes, please let us know. We love both lobster and champagne and hope to “over indulge@ this New Years!
@@FloridaFishingCouple Will do!!
It does appear to be a training event for the younger guy, and learning occured for you. I guess my feeling is If I have to pay for a license, I also want to see the enforcement. I think that they were professional, just as you were.
Dan & Elizabeth, this was a great "training" video for us Key boaters. Reminder to check all our expiration dates on flares, etc. We will be down next month & I'm going to double check all safety requirements and items before we go boating, SO, from that perspective your Channel & video were very important. Great job on the lobstering & way to keep the energy on the boat positive during the inspection. Im my opinion, your attitude helped to flip the citation into a warning. Let me know when you and Elizabeth are ready for a new vehicle! Thad
Hey brother, thanks for reaching out! Really appreciate the thumbs up and for highlighting the video for being a “learning tool” for others boating in the Keys. It’s the main reason we started the channel. Hope to see you guys when you visit. Don’t forget the hot dogs!
You should "double check" if you still got balls.
Looked like a normal stop and inspection to me. For me the less conversation the better but you guys are into content so you got some.
These were the coolest FWC i have seen on video but the Capitan and passengers i am sure set them at ease as well with their interactions. All in all great respect from both party`s involved and I want at least two of those monster lobsters shipped to me in Michigan on my dime. End of this video has me drooling for lobster on my grill.
You have had the best comment so far out of hundreds! May people felt very strongly one way or another but you seem to give credit to both sides. Well done!
Thank you
If you aren't a business engaged in commerce, i dont understand how any of these 'Routine safety stops' are even legal. Without probably cause of a crime. Why would anyone cooperate in any way shape or form with them.
If you don’t they can take your boat…
@@FloridaFishingCouple i live in PA, and have had those types of run ins with coast guard auxiliary n the fish and boat commission. And i refuse to even talk to them.
@@shanestamball1886 the CG Auxiliary are not law enforcement. Not sure about the boat commission….
@@FloridaFishingCouple yeah coastguard aux, thinks they are law enforcement. But there isn't coast guard inland. Fish n boat are law enforcement, but they act very tyrannical here. Deputies are volunteers and typically the ones who write the most tickets are then selected for full time positions
I think the fish police should head to the marina and hand out updated regulations before people head out for a day of fun. It would help keep boaters safer and save them money avoiding fines.
That is a nice idea. Wish they would do that too!😀
It seemed like they were hoping to get you for something, as far as needing to have 2 regular fire extinguishers or one ++ one for a boat over 26 that was news to me.
PS that was one hell of a monster lobster, congrats
I think Heiko got hassled by the same guys, either the same day or the day after your encounter with them.
In Minnesota the Game Wardens are always that way. My favorite memory was when my Mom yelled at the Wardens for ruining the fishing. They didn't want to stick around any longer.
We should have had my Mom with us that day!! 😂🤣🤣
An unlawful search in every regard...
Dan, love the videos! They definitely went full force on you. I think y’all handled it great.
Man, thanks for that comment. Felt like I was getting beat up by most of the postings! 👍👍👍
I’ve never really thought about it but why is it that FWC or Coast Guard can literally search your boat but not your car. What makes one vehicle different than the other?
EXACTLY!!!!👍
i had a warden check my fish that were in a bucket-i had 7 specks-he got into my boat and asked if i had any catfish and stuck his hand in the bucket to ck-whatttttt kinda water do they drink???-got into a confrontation w a fed warden at a state campground during hunting season-she said we needed to change out camo clothes to street-we said nope and why-she said was so as to not offend the other campers-this year i came to my car during bow season and there were 2 sheriff deputies ckn my car out-i asked what they were doin-they said suspicious car-really-suspicious of what being a car
😂🤣😂 Ha! “Suspicious of being a car!” 😂🤣😂
Actually the Constitution says that this is a violation of our civil rights! They don’t have reason to believe that you have committed any crime just because you have fishing poles!! This is an illegal search!!period!
Absolutely!
@fisch69 I am just going to say it - - You don't think you're the first person to bring this up, do you? The fourth amendment protects you against unreasonable search and seizure. Courts have a long history of holding these types of inspections to be reasonable.
As much as it sucks being held up they seemed professional with a sense of humor. Look at that amazing dinner I want to try to FL Lobster soon.
FWC is going beyond harassment. They should need probable cause to be making these stops.
Yes, we completely agree! 👍
Our only Coast Guard stop was in our dinghy in Fort Myers beach at night. We had an eleven foot Whaler, and we passed. The funny thing was I was putting a whistle in our kit box that we took with us on it just a couple of days before and my wife asked why I was putting a whistle in. I said, I think we have to. She didn't believe me and sure enough, they asked for the whistle on the stop. I think even the Coast Guard guys were surprised when I pulled one out.
Hey Dan, Just be happy with it, all in a day's work for them. And if Heiko was on the boat, they would of stripped searched ya. 😀😀😀
🤣😂 That’s probably true!
As a retired LEO, and a boater, I have to agree with some who said the small talk makes you look nervous. Once the camera came on, they were almost obligated to go by procedure in checking everything. As it was you learned some things you need to take care of the they could have cited you for, but didn't. You didn't get a citation, you didn't get arrested and you survived with a learning experience. Good thorough stop. I am a hunter and I fish, when checked by the Game Warden, I keep the conversation to a minimum. Helpful hint.
Good info. I have heard that quite often from a lot of LEO on this post. But surely as a professional LEO did you or anyone really think we posed any type of threat or had broken any laws here? As a retired military member, a current active duty Air Force colonel, and Elizabeth; did anyone in the law enforcement community watching this really think we posed some type of threat here? We are obviously locals, they ran our licenses and found no outstanding warrants or open tickets, our fishing licenses were current. Did they really have to go through all the motions here? As Clarence Thomas of the Supreme Court said “any American citizen in the U.S. with all the current laws we have in effect could be guilty of at least 6 broken laws at any time”. We were having a nice day on the water on a Sunday afternoon before my friend had to report to a new duty station. Hardly a group that posed any threat to the national security of of our wildlife here in Florida. 🤔 Overreach? Yes, I think so for sure….
Arrested? For what??? And if this guy can’t talk, what is he a retired first Sargent? Who can?? They just want a BUI, he ruined their day by being sober. They could care less about a 2nd throwable. They are looking for signs of intoxication, for promotion.
They are just doing there job to make sure every one is safe
ok, as a former police officer, when encountering someone with it seems, nervous laughter, they're usually hiding something, but you guys were great
You must have a Masters in psychology don’t pat yourself on the back.. maybe we just don’t like you or care what you think ..
As a former police officer you have a share in the crime wave destroying our Nation!
Dan, you did everything but drop your underwear for those guys. If they want to look at the lobsters and measure them shouldn't they board your boat and have their own bucket? Plus, they stopped you right in the middle of the channel entrance. Maybe you should have put the hazard light on. So much for them being for safety.
What is a boat hazard light?
Yes, we thought the whole ordeal was a bit over the top. Stopping us in the channel as it was getting dark was ridiculous and unsafe at best.
Didn’t see anything wrong with the stop. 37mins. is really not that long and you learned you were not compliant per FWC, but only received a warning😊
Okay, thanks for the comment and for watching!
IMO, that's normal, until they asked for you to start opening all your compartments.
The other boat was probably their supervisor grading them for regulation procedures.
Your taxes at work.
Capt. Dan, bring more buckets... lol
Hahahah! Yes, I def need more buckets! Thanks for the comment! 🤣😂🤣
Holy shit Batman that lobster is giant!
Hahahaha! Very funny 🦞
Seems like one of the officers is going through training.
That may have been. Good thought!
With as many people that travel to your area not surprised by the thoroughness of the stop. Im In Clearwater Fl. Our stops are much quicker and like posted below if they wanna start checking coolers. they can do it themselves.
Thanks for commenting and adding to the conversation. Seems there are many different perspectives here and I appreciate the diversity of ideas and approaches. Thanks! 👍
unfortunately I cant eat lobster anymore but know the area where your first spot was I was waiting for them to check your pockets and take your hat off LOL
I hate to see people trying be all friendly and joking with cops in situations like this. It’s amazing how many people don’t realize that the joking is only going one way and the cops aren’t there to socialize. They are there to cite you and/or arrest you if they can find a reason/excuse. Being too friendly and talkative can and will be used against you as evidence you were intoxicated or they’ll take it as you being nervous because you’re hiding something. It’s crazy how many people will actually tell cops they’ve done something wrong that they think they can’t get in trouble for at the time because they’re trying to show that they’re honest but it only makes them think you’re a criminal. And joking about breaking a law or having illegal fish or giving the cop a hard time about them nit having two fire extinguishers on their boat isn’t going to work in your favor. They aren’t going to think oh he’s got a good point, we don’t even have two on our boat. No that’s not how cops think. You’re only going to piss them off and encourage them to get you for something else. That seemed like a rookie and his field training officer or maybe just a young guy trying to prove himself to a more experienced officer. Always a bad situation when one cop is trying to teach another or one trying to prove himself in front of another.
Somewhat controversial takes incoming:
I know that this interaction is an extreme example of enforcement. Some departments / enforcement officers will take this approach, the idea being that rather than stopping 100 boats a day, and spending 3-5 minutes on each doing a quick check looking for things that are obvious, they'll instead go after 10 boats a day very diligently covering nearly every possible area of enforcement. The theory is that it can be significantly more effective use of limited resources, with a better long-term return on time/resource investment when compared with the traditional quick stop and check methodology, by going to an extreme level of scrutiny, word can spread that stops like this are now common and fewer people will be willing to risk breaking / bending the law, and there is data to back up this theory.
If you look at states where the state police/highway patrol have a reputation of pulling and ticketing over every car that they clock going >5mph over the posted limit, the people driving there who eventually became aware of this fact tend become far less likely to risk speeding over time because they know that the odds of them getting away with it if they do get caught are slim to none.
This here was probably a combination training scenario or part of a new strategy to dig as deep as they are legally allowed to every X number of boats they check in an attempt to alter reputation/perception and hopefully modify behavior as a result as word gets out.
I personally am torn, because up here in New England, we know that the agencies don't nearly have enough resources for enforcement, and many anglers/poachers are well aware of that fact and will risk it, rightfully believing that the odds of them being stopped and checked with enough detail to result in them getting caught are probably 1000 to 1. I'm not alone in my belief that a major factor in why the North Atlantic Cod population has yet to truly recover is poaching, especially by non-local commercial/semi-commercial boats who know that there aren't remotely enough resources to catch them in the act. I know this because I've seen ice trucks on the side of the road or in parking lots selling enormous amounts of fresh local NA Cod fillets when the commercial fishery is still closed and the rare times it temporarily opens for personal/charter anglers but with a strict 1 fish per person limit, not only not nearly enough to support the 5000lbs of fresh NA Cod fillets you see on each of these trucks every time, but it's pretty easy to tell when a looking at a filet that the fish itself did not remotely meet the size limitations when the fishery has allowed limited non-commercial rod and reel line angling. In this case, I know that we have issues with not having nearly enough resources causing them to only have enough time to stop and check less than 0.1% of vessels, and even those they only do a quick check looking for major obvious violations or obvious evidence of poaching, coupled with their desire to be respected by the fishing community with hopes of cooperation rather than animosity.
On the other hand, sometimes it really is a power trip with some law enforcement personnel, and I absolutely hate that, but I don't think this dude was doing that, as he could have still legally fined Capt Dan for the lack of 2nd fire extinguisher violation and instead gave him a warning.
It's easy to witness these events and get angry seeing them as excessive and over-reaching, but it's important to also take a step back and think about the bigger context as to why they may do this, it's not always overreach, it's not always power-tripping or fine revenue farming, most of the time these policies aren't meant for us directly, they're the result of other assholes that drive these agencies to alter how they interact with the community. Enforcement is complicated and difficult.
~Sean
Sean, thank you for your interesting and well researched perspective. When looking at the bigger picture it does seem an impossible task to enforce the laws with a reduced staff of officers. What we were looking for was some discretion in the part of the officers. We obviously are not poachers, our paperwork was in order and presented, and our logo plastered across our boat. I wonder how people might react if the same laws and powers were applied to their vehicles in the name of “Highway Safety”. Do you think the public would be accepting of being stopped and searched randomly? We are not blaming the officers in this case but the laws and rules that empower them to act in such a manner that citizens do not have to be breaking the law and there is clearly no probable cause for a stop other than being in possession of fishing gear. Maybe the laws should be reviewed so enforcement of the law does not feel like harassment. That being said, we really appreciate the comment. Been awhile since we have seen you down here. Hope you and your family are doing well. 👍
@@FloridaFishingCouple Hey Capt Dan & Queen Elizabeth!
I agree wholeheartedly! Enforcement tactics like this are a double edged sword. I personally am a constitutionalist, which means that even though I don't believe that our constitution is remotely perfect or effectively aligned to our world in 2023, I deeply believe that it represents the absolute fundamental rights in which all other laws and policy must be based upon and adhered to. There is little I dislike more than an authority figure prying into my personal life without just cause, or going to extremes simply because historic precedence or lack of consequences allows to do so with impunity. For example, qualified immunity has in many cases given law enforcement the ability to break laws, injure or kill civilians without consequence, which gives the bad apples a mechanism of escaping justice at the high cost of loss of public trust and cooperation.
I personally probably wouldn't have been able to remain as lighthearted and understanding as you guys did after the first 15 minutes here, even though I know that they're just doing their job, even though I know that their policies aren't meant for me specifically, because I know I'm a law abiding citizen and believe in innocence until proven guilty, and, as such, I assume that by "adequately" cooperating and providing evidence during the initial events of an interaction with authorities that gives them zero reason to suspect that I may be breaking the law, that the interaction will remain reasonable and just. I have to remind myself constantly that others are not me, that the policies of enforcement agencies aren't developed and implemented with you or I, those who make all reasonable attempts to abide, in mind, those policies nearly always evolve as a direct result of those who continue to take advantage of any opportunity to ignore or violate laws and regulations if they think they can get away with it.
I think a big mistake we often make is our presumption that law enforcement and other rule enforcement agencies approach their charter from the basis that they exist to protect, whether protecting us, our property, our land, resources and environment, but the problem is that in action, their actual charter is protect by enforcement, which means that they instead approach from the basis of "these are the rules and laws that our established system has determined must be enforced, and now we must ensure the public is aware of these rules (mandatory education as part of licensing), and then enforce them by finding those who would break them while following rules and regulations that dictate our processes".
Enforcement is meant to be the primary deterrent component of protection, the consequences of breaking the agreed upon rules and laws, and as such, all law & rule enforcement agencies are tasked with the enforcement components of protection, which unfortunately results in their primary goal being looking for those breaking the rules, and subsequently properly obtaining viable evidence of any violations as to ensure that violators face the consequences that are meant to act as the primary deterrent. This results in many of our interactions with enforcement officers feeling as though they're treating us as guilty until proven innocent, that even in the absence of any evidence of wrongdoing that they search for any reason to find us guilty of some type of noncompliance, and only deepens the "us VS them" mentality that both civilians and enforcement officers tend to have.
I have no solutions, only the conviction that the current state of affairs is not a result of any actions by people like you or myself, instead it is 100% the result of the actions of our peers, our fellow citizens that believe the rules only exist for those who get caught, those who believe that their needs and desires trump all others and that they shouldn't be forced to follow any rules.
Lastly, I cannot ignore the the reality that nearly every organization gets measured in some way or another, and therefore many policies tend to evolve with the core need to justify the organization's existence, which creates a scenario where their actions become heavily influenced with that goal in mind, leading to their interactions with us being an ends to a mean, their actual goal becomes the organizations ability to report effectiveness, to demonstrate growth, produce results. We see this in corporate America every day, especially in publicly traded corporations, where company goals are focused on showing revenue and profit growth to appease investors, and departments only focus on the metrics in which they are measured, resulting in a feedback loop where leaders and managers from top to bottom are forced to continuously decrease costs, increase revenue/profit/efficiency, every single quarter or face some sort of consequences.
If I recall, Capt Dan has a background in training and management. I'm sure you are no stranger to encountering policies that have become perverted by the need to always demonstrate improvement forward movement of some kind, often at the cost of ethics, fairness, empathy, logic and/or common sense...
@@FloridaFishingCouple also, it's been a strange and challenging three years, but family is doing well, thank you for asking!
Tight lines, and your days be blessed with ample Mutton Snapper, Hogfish & lobster!
Worked in law enforcement for 30 plus years. All in all I think they were training. The second boat that pulled up was observing the whole thing. You guys were very professional.
Thanks for commenting and giving us your honest opinion. Now that you mentioned it, the younger officer did seem inexperienced. I think you are correct. Thanks! 👍👍👍
@@FloridaFishingCouple you’re welcome 😊. Tight lines😊
Great content for education. In Minnesota, the conservation officers will sometimes follow you back to your cabin and make you thaw out every fillet in your freezer to make sure you don't have more than your limit of walleye.
They were nice and doing their job
37 mins seems a bit long but
They gave you a good check out all to your favor
They treated you well.
What I see is attitudes
Your retired , enjoying a carefree lifestyle and having a great day.
They interrupted that bought you off your " high".
Relax it's just nothing more than that.
You my man handled the situation very well.
Retired florida deputy
Just keep on keeping on
Enjoy yourself you earned it.
Love the comment, sentiment, and the addition to the ongoing conversation. Thanks for “Following Us!” And your perspective….
Actually, I believe they did a heckuva job. Yes, it is aggravating, but without them doing their job to the fullest extent no telling how many illegal lobsters or fish would be taken.
@@glenngray1201spoken like everyone who doesn’t remember or see that the lobsters are as plentiful. Stick to your second amendment arguments. The fishing itself isn’t nearly as good as it was. Just a fact. Especially in shore
Dan, three points on this. As prior Law Enforcement I can tell you the FWC Officers were extremely professional. Their interactions with you were polite and to the point. As retired senior enlisted soldiers you and I both know that following standards and attention to detail are critical. Which leads to my third point, as someone involved in recreational boating safety. Had you taken a boating safety course you would have known about the fire extinguishers and daytime emergency signals. Just because you are older and the course was not mandated does not mean it is not a good idea.
Took the course quite a few years ago with the Coast Guard Auxiliary in Sarasota. Of course we had the smaller boat then. Might be time for a refresher course! Thanks for the comment and thanks for your military service! 👍
Agreed, and yall were recording. So if they did cut a corner or didn’t lift a hatch, check paperwork, they could have gotten written up for it.
police state!
Luckily they didn't check any extra cavities, great experience with the fwc and those huge bugs, would like to see you guys targeting cubera fish in the future keep sending.
That is def a bucket list fish to catch. Just have a hard time using lobsters for bait because I want to eat them!
Once a year I respectfully approach the Coast Guard for a safety inspection. Once completed they give you a dated receipt( copy). That doesn’t cover the DNR inspection but presenting inspection with paperwork shows initiative and usually saves time.
PS. That stop was nothing compared to the DNR on Lake Michigan. I had a Hawaiian sling ( from Florida excursion) in one of my lockers and it became a huge issue for some reason. Anyway- I enjoyed the video. Dinner looked fantastic.
Appreciate the perspective - and dinner WAS fantastic!
I think that the overall inspection was educational for some boaters. Learned about needing 2 fire extinguishers for boats over 26' as well as getting a distress flag. Thank you for the video.
Question; i noticed on your hardtop the fishing rod holders, i liked them. Can you share what type they are and or model make? i would really appreciate it. thank you
Absolutely agree, we learned something as well that day. The distress flag is not a requirement if you also have actual flares in addition to the electronic one, which we did have on board. The rod holders we found on Amazon. Click here to order/view them: www.amazon.com/gp/aw/d/B004WZH8OK?psc=1&ref=ppx_pop_mob_b_asin_title
Well even though it took so long, they were doing their job and were pretty nice about it and at least they didn't board you and check everything them selves. Nice lobster dinner, and yes you need to get some jerk seasoning, it goes on chicken very well also. Love you guys keep it up and god bless and don't forget the second extinguisher...lol.
Ha! That second extinguisher went on board that night when we got back to port! Thanks for reaching out! 🦞👍
As a deputy, I would say they did their jobs, however they were a bit "stale and dry" and maybe a bit too "official".... However, maybe that's just their personalities and you all did get a warning, so at least they were able to show they are able to exercise discretion -- as they should on a simple stop like this. As far as how long they took, I can only tell you that I always attempt to get my stops back on the road asap, because I know it's an inconvenience to the driver. Great catch on the lobster and I enjoyed your video! Stay safe!!
Thanks for adding to the conversation John! 👍
100 percent justified, we are all human and I respect the maturity of your channel asking the question. I have read a lot of great comments below as far as an explanation to this. It comes down to the officers that enforce these laws to have the discretion to be as thorough as they want, given the circumstances. They appeared to be respectful and clear with Their instructions and educate on the non compliance items. I hope that education was the lesson.
Well said. Appreciate you joining the conversation. 👍
Here’s my take Captain Dan. The officers were thorough, very thorough. I didn’t see any overreach and I’m fairly sensitive to that sort of thing. It appeared there might have been a training exercise underway. It looked like the one officer did all the work while the one with the sense of humor mainly observed. The one performing the search seemed to be quite serious as if he was demonstrating the thoroughness of his efforts. It’s damned inconvenient when you get targeted this way, especially on the way in with storms approaching. You passed, they got the search they needed, education took place on camera, a bonus in my view, perhaps that had something to do with why they targeted you? Everybody won. No harm, no foul. Great lobster, one to remember. Thanks for a fine video.
Lots of comments about training a new officer. Looking back, that’s probably the situation. Thanks for commenting!
I think that because you have a popular RUclips channel it was the perfect time to educate many people at once so yes it was an inconvenience but worth it in the end imo. Ps great videos
Thanks! I agree with you. This video will be a great help to those who visit the Keys and show them what to expect if stopped and what safety equipment they should have on board. Appreciate the comment!
😂
How can you treat this high seas pirates like they are your friends? good god Dan, grow a pair.
It doesn’t do much good to have a huge set in prison. The problem here is the law the way it is written and enforced. What needs to happen is a reform of the stop and search laws. We don’t expect you to be checked for a “Safety Check” in our vehicles so why is it permissible on our vessels?
Great video! Thanks for sharing.
Thanks for watching and commenting Stan!
I am an ex wildlife officer and trust me when I say they are pushed real hard for ticket quotas! So many of the guys I worked with had the attitude if you can write 1 ticket you can write 2 tickets! I didn't play that game!
Thanks for the comment and the transparency! Really appreciate that!
Pretty standard and a good check. I didn’t think it was overreach or over the top. Less chatting with them and getting what they ask quickly will get you on your way sooner. They also want to get it over with quickly :) Cheers
Appreciate the comment. What I’ve learned is less conversation is best. Thanks!
Want viewers make your video about FWC. Want a long FWC stop? Turn on your camera film it all and be chatty. Want a short stop? Yes sir, no sir, thank you sir, no RUclips footage. Retire L/E and ex Uscg from the the keys. God speed to you sir 😊
Govern me harder daddy!
that was a lite stop,up here in new Smyrna beach they will in every orifice on your boat ,then try to get you on BUI.
I once had Hargrove take 3 fish and I had measured everything twice, He then refused to take the fish to the biologist that was requesting them. I had marks in my cutting boards, I was sure I had measured right and even added a half inch. When I put my boards on his measure they were short. Both off them. Scratching my head, a few days later measured again with tape measure and they are correct. Make sure you measure their device. So many stories, had them empty 4000 pound cooler to bottom when they could do at dock, had lee county sheriff stop me over 15 miles offshore. Down in the keys though a lot seen people take everything that moves
I have heard stories of measuring discrepancies from other fisherman as well. I guess it is a good idea to monitor the measuring of both fish and lobster to be sure. 👍
Wow! That was a very thorough check! Annoying for sure, but it is their job. So what can you say, other than I wish they would have been a lot quicker. Buy you all had everything right, except for two small extinguishers vs one large. But who the heck would have known that. Those lobsters looked amazing! Great video as usual. You just keep rocking with great content!
I have lost all respect for the fwc after being ticketed twice myself this past year ! They have really stepped up there game finding any little detail to make money for the state !😢
The reason we have crime is all of the cops are out giving tickets...
That’s freaky that those bugs are cut in 1/2 and still trying to cruise around 😳
Huh? Bugs cut in half?
Justified 100%, typical safety stop. I don’t see what the issue was, they did not even board you. So many poachers in the keys and just because you are clean doesn’t mean so many others are not. You can also request a safety check early in the year from the coast guard auxiliary that covers you for a year on the safety check. Still have the checking of the catch and potentially boat search. Also almost all the flare replacement lights come with the daytime flag.
I’m surprised mine didn’t, but because I had the actual flares that don’t expire until 2026 I guess we are good till then. Appreciate the comment and you for “Following Us!”