Red Dot Camera Talk: Leica CL with Live Q&A
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- Опубликовано: 23 июл 2024
- David Farkas and Josh Lehrer turn their attention this week to the Leica CL. They'll be taking questions live during the stream and offering up tips on how to get the most out of Leica's lightweight, compact and travel-ready interchangeable lens mirrorless camera.
Timestamps:
=======================================
0:00 - Welcome to Red Dot Forum Camera Talk!
2:11 - Background on Leica APS-C (Leica X)
8:00 - What hardware do the CL & TL2 share?
12:34 - Will I see a difference going from a full frame sensor to APS-C sensor?
14:31 - Why David travels with the CL
16:38 - The CL vs. SL, M (Typ 240), Q
17:30 - Compact setups for travel, hiking, climbing
, cycling, etc.
20:39 - What do I give up going from an SL (Typ 601) to a CL?
22:43 - EVF comparisons
26:40 - The CL as a companion or backup to the SL
(Typ 601) or SL2
27:39 - Batteries
29:02 - Is it worth using SL lenses on the CL?
29:24 - Why is my image stabilization option grayed-out?
31:06 - A robust CL setup
34:15 - Is there a downside to the 18mm pancake lens?
37:51 - How does the image quality of TL Vario (zoom) lenses compare to the TL primes?
45:36 - CL with 18mm TL vs. Q with 28mm
46:38 - Firmware updates
50:41 - Leica FOTOS app and GPS functionality
53:05 - Why would I choose the TL2 over the CL?
54:25 - Built-in memory on the TL2
55:30 - The TL2 UI
58:42 - Is there back button focus on the CL?
1:04:30 - Can you enable zoomed focus assist for M lenses when using the Leica M-Adapter-L?
1:08:35 - Can you use vintage C-mount or screwmount lenses on the CL?
1:10:16 - Recommend accessories for the CL
1:23:10 - Macro
options for the CL
1:27:09 - Is there a difference between Made in Japan or Made in Germany CL lenses?
1:29:19 - What SD card do you recommend for the CL?
1:34:32 - How do you enable video on the CL?
1:37:30 - Because the sensor is exposed do you need to send the camera in for cleaning?
1:39:07 - Is there a new CL coming out soon?
1:40:45 - How would you compare the Summicron 23mm TL to the Q?
1:41:46 - Why don’t they make a Q with a compact 35mm?
1:43:05 - Can you do multiple exposures on the CL?
1:44:00 - New CL vs. used M240 vs. used Q?
1:52:01 - Why was the X-U discontinued and will Leica make another underwater camera?
1:56:25 - Why are there so many special edition CLs?
2:02:57 - If you are buying a CL would you get the 18-56mm or would you start with a prime?
2:06:05 - How would you compare the 35mm Summilux-TL to the 50mm Summilux-M?
2:07:40 - The original Leica CL analog
2:09:40 - Would you consider the S-Mount 120mm APO-Macro with the CL?
2:10:39 - Is the 40 Summicron -C compatible with the CL?
Leica CL Articles and Videos:
=======================
Leica CL Unboxing and Overview Video:
• Leica CL: Unboxing, Ov...
Leica CL Introduction and Overview:
www.reddotforum.com/content/2...
Leica CL Review: The Perfect Travel Camera: www.reddotforum.com/content/2...
Two Weeks in India with the Leica CL: Getting out of my Comfort Zone:
www.reddotforum.com/content/2...
Using M Lenses on the Leica CL:
New City, New Camera, Familiar Glass:
www.reddotforum.com/content/2...
Photokina 2018 - The Leica CL and Future of APS-C:
www.reddotforum.com/content/2...
Going Wide: Leica Super-Vario-Elmar-T 11-23mm Lens Review: www.reddotforum.com/content/2...
Special Editions:
===============
Leica CL ‘Edition Paul Smith’:
www.reddotforum.com/content/2...
Leica Announces CL ‘100 Jahre Bauhaus’ Edition:
www.reddotforum.com/content/2...
Leica CL ‘100 jahre bauhaus - bauhaus museum dessau’ Limited Edition:
www.reddotforum.com/content/2...
Lightroom Presets:
===============
Lightroom Presets for Leica Cameras: www.reddotforum.com/content/2...
David's CL Lightroom Preset:
reddotforum.com/Lightroom_Pre...
David's TL2 Lightroom Preset:
reddotforum.com/Lightroom_Pre...
Where to buy:
===========
New CL cameras: leicastoremiami.com/collectio...
Used CL cameras: leicastoremiami.com/collectio...
New CL Lenses: leicastoremiami.com/collectio...
Used CL Lenses: leicastoremiami.com/collectio...
Sign Up for Leica Store Miami Email Newsletter:
======================================
mailchi.mp/leicastoremiami.co...
Please keep doing this kind of live talks. Very fun (and pleasant) to watch.
Thanks fo the feedback. We're planning on it. We're having a lot of fun with these live shows.
David and Josh, I truly look forward to your weekly presentations. I have been lucky to get an M10 monochrom a couple months ago, the first available in my area. I have been into photography for quite a few years, since 1976. I have had some great photos with this camera, but am struggling a little with proper exposure at times. Needless to say I am eagerly looking forward to your M10 monochrom video on Saturday, please do not disappoint.
RedDotForum is first class. I learn something each and every time. Actually, many, many things.
Glad to hear the information was helpful.
Thanks for this. I moved from a Leica X-Vario in December to the CL. I love it and am glad to see it getting recognition.
I (David) used the X Vario as my everyday camera for a couple years and really liked that camera. The CL now serves the same role, but just with so much more flexibility and image quality.
Thanks for your video! I’m watching it multiple times over for its Information. Nothing else like it on RUclips.
Glad it was helpful!
Bcoz this video, i just bought it two days ago. Not regret at all. Awesome camera i can say
Thank for your very nice CL-Talk!
Glad you liked it! CL is a great system.
Regarding the Leica X1 (2009), which I'm a proud owner of, it was, actually, the first compact camera accepted for stock photo agency Getty in 2010 as it produced by that time sufficient high quality images to meet their standards.
Great review as always .Three M film bodies and for digital I`ve been using a Sony with my M glass. Just bought a CL .Great little camera but …. I`ve noticed that the focus peaking is considerably weaker with the CL than on my Sony bodies . I can barely see it and I`ve adjusted the dioptre and tried all the colours . Am I missing a trick ? Is there a control to boost it or is it a product of camera only having a contrast detect focus system rather than phase detect ?
Thank you for the CL review. Quite fancy getting a CL with the native TL lenes, in particular the 23mm but will not put a huge SL lens on it which defect the purpose of being small and light weight. My daily carry is a Panasonic GM1 with its kit zoom; very happy with the result. By the way, do you use a Lecia camera to film this video? Perhaps you may consider using manual focusing or another brand of camera with a decent AF-C tracking. The only time I will use a mirrorless camera for any fast moving object is when I have not got my Nikond D500 or D4s with me. Also will never buy a zoom lens for any of my leica cameras. All my zoom lenses are either Nikon or Sony which are my tools to generate enough cash flow for buying toys with "Leica" label.
Many thanks for this comprehensive overview. Can you please comment on the CL's floating focus point. I'm unable to centre it and after any shot, or application change in camera it wanders off to one of the edges of the view finder and LCD screen. I'm surprised there's not been a firmware correction for this. Is there a workaround you can recommend?
An interesting an entertaining chat thank you. I take issue with one throw-away comment, that the Vario Elmar TL 18 - -56 was based on the X-Vario lens. This is a nice idea, the X-Vario zoom was great but I think "based on" can only be true in the very loosest sense. The X-Vario zoom was physically shortest at the middle of the zoom range and longer at each end whilst the Vario Elmar TL 18-56 is shortest at the wide end and gets longer as you zoom in. So it's clear the elements within the two lenses move in completely different ways as you zoom. I own both and they are both great, but I suspect the similarity is only skin deep.
the silver version is such a beauty!!!
Agreed!
Any comments on the Summicron-TL 23mm f/2 ASPH? Size, packability, flexibility, and usability vs the 16mm and 35mm primes and the Vario 18-56? I love just a plain old 35mm Summicron on an M-10, but also love the EVF and autofocus of a Fuji 23mm f2. Obviously very different strengths/weakness for using, but any comments on the 23mm prime for the Leica CL?
Loved the video and commentary, instructive and entertaining. Thanks.
Now that the TL2 and CL are discontinued i as able to pick up a new one for a almost nothing. The camera works a treat. I wanted it to be a second camera or when I don’t want to bring my M9 along. I think I’ll have to get the 35mm TL lens and maybe the 18mm TL as well.
Hi guys. I thank you for sharing your presets but I tried to download one for my TL2 and I get a .xmp file... it's not an .lrtemplate . What do I have to do to make it work. I tried to rename it using the appropriate extension but it doesn't work. Thanks for your help.
Enjoyed the series . Hope the next show is on the S system
Unfortunatley, we don't have an S3 on hand at this time, so we're going to have to wait on that to do our S-System episode.
Totally agree the CL is underrated- I think it’s the digital Leica that Cartier-Bresson might use if he was around today...One question I had was that close to the 2 hour mark, the guy with brown hair says there are 4 CL special editions. I can only think of 3- Bauhaus, Paul Smith, and Pigozzi. Is there a fourth? Or counting the black and silver Bauhaus editions separately, perhaps?
Excellent job!
Thank you very much!
S System? Coming up?
Probably going to wait until we have an S3 in hand.
@@RedDotForum Thanks.
I recently purchased the SL2-S after shooting with the CL. I found shooting with the TL35mmSummilux works great on the SL2-S despite the lower resolution. How much more image quality do you think I'm giving up using the TL35mm1.4 vs the SL 50mmSummilux? I haven't purchased any SL lenses yet. I'm not a professional photographer it is only a hobby for me
Hi there. Not yet at the end of the video but I have a question regarding firmware update. Why don’t they propose update for the TL2? There is so many room for improvement...
I agree that the 18mm on the Leica CL is a top notch lens and great in the image quality along with the minimal amount of weight. I also use a Leica Q, which is a great performer, but twice as heavy.
Choices, choices.... Both are excellent options, but the CL with 18TL will fit into a pocket.
I bought a CL and wonder should I buy the 35mm TL 1.4 or the new 35mm SL 2.0 Asp?
great, can you do more with the cl and m lenses, please
~58:00 Pretty sure that the typ 701 released in black and silver; it was the TL which introduced the panda Titanium and beveled edging, then the TL2 reverted to black or silver models.
Another highly informative talk. I had not appreciated the strengths of the CL system (my ignorance) as both a carry anywhere and standalone system as well as a backup to the M or SL. It's a shame the UK pricing of the CL starter bundle compared to the CL body is not quite as favourable as it currently is in the USA!
Yeah, the CL is hugely underestimated, but is actually very, very capable. If you haven't done so already, please check out my full review on the CL here: www.reddotforum.com/content/2019/03/leica-cl-review-the-perfect-travel-camera/
And, you could always buy from Leica Store Miami in the USA. They ship internationally at no charge for orders over 3000 USD...
@@RedDotForum Thank you.
Thanks
Because I love so much my Q2, I felt the need to get a CL to have a chance to use other (M) lenses. I believe many photographers dislike the ragefinder system and don`t want the size of the SL, that´s why the APS-C cameras sell so well. Please consider investing on providing the best resolution and sensor possible for this kind of preferences, there is a huge market of photographers that love small, quality lenses and don`t want to use rangefinder cameras, the CL and TTL are the only available options. I understand that an APS-c sensor has limitations but if you offer 47MP on a FF camera, you can do better with the APS-C segment. I`m still waiting for my CL to arrive and already bought an APO Summicron 75mm F2 ASPH, so my expectations are high and will be looking for what Leica has to offer in the future. Thanks for your videos, quite interesting.
I thought the same as you but in the end I found the m lenses worked better on a cheaper full frame body like Nikon z5 and sigma fp. That being said, I’d still get the cl or tl2 just for the tl lenses because the tl lenses are that good 👍
Firmware updates for the TL2 ..........not there since v1.5 in 2018. Is there any hope?
What the comparison than someone using the Q2?
Great video. Do you or anyone around here have experience with comparing the Leica APS-C lenses to Fujifilm-X APS-C lenses? There is a considerable difference in price and I would be interested in how much better the Leica APS-C lenses are compared to Fuji's.
Haven't compared head-to-head, as you can't mount the Leica lenses on a Fuji, or vice versa. The only comparison would be camera vs. camera and we haven't done this. While I'm sure that Fuji makes some decent lenses, the Leica TL lenses are optical superstars. Have you checked out my CL review? Lots of sample images with all the TL lenses might give you a better idea of the image quality they offer. www.reddotforum.com/content/2019/03/leica-cl-review-the-perfect-travel-camera/
Why do we want to do back button focusing on a camera with poor continuous tracking?
I have a CL and am bidding on an M4 at a local auction. Will my CL lenses be compatible for use on the M4? Thank you
No. TL lenses are only compatible with cameras with an L mount: CL, TL, TL2, SL601, SL2. M lenses would be compatible, though, with an M-Adapter-L.
Hello from Chicago.
This was truly informative, thank you.
My beloved M-E (220) has developed sensor corrosion and is in the shop at Allendale.
My options are:
1. Replace the Sensor or...
2. "Upgrade" to a new CL - body only, at same cost
I am the second owner of this M-E, and I love the texture of the photographs I've made with it over the past few years. Using it always feels like shooting my film cameras, without having to wait to develop the film. A new CL is tempting. And while I have no interest in auto-focus, better low-light performance and dynamic range, and the ability to use a cadre of other lenses is a difficult package to ignore.
I'm confused.
Your thoughts, good sirs...
The CL is an awesome little camera. Very capable, flexible and fun. Yes, you can use M lenses on it, but I almost always stick to the native TL lenses, which are exceptionally good.
That being said, if you want to stick with M, I'd consider stepping up to a CMOS-based M body, like an M240 or M10. Did you have the option of upgrading to one of those choices?
@@RedDotForum Ha! Too late... "my Precious" is already back in my hands. They worked pretty quickly, despite being only partially open. I'm an M shooter, I had to accept that. I am considering selling the 220 for a 262. Looking at what's available now. Thanx!
1:17:15 late 2022 update, I wasn't able to find the web link for the printed manual, however if you call the office in NJ, they will get back to you and send you a printed manual.
New users may think those accessories like the hand grip and thumbs up are gimmicks to nickle and dime you, but oh my are they comfortable and make a heavy camera/lens combo feel like a fraction of the weight. It's worth it. If you think it's too costly, try to buy it used. Leica accessories can always be sold again years down the road.
DaDonFather Completely agree. Especially if you are doing street or travel photography, thumb support and handgrips are so comfortable and make shooting a better experience.
is the 23mm Summicron TL any good? I already have the 35 Summilux TL and the 18 TL, how does 23mm summicron compare?
All three are exceptional. I personally use the 18 and 35 the most, but the 23 is great if you want a 35mm equivalent.
@@RedDotForum Thank you, I need a 35 F2. I always use the 35 Summicron ASPH on my M240. I hope the 23 is comparable to the M 35 Summicron ASPH.
Will the CL accept an L mount alliance lens (Panny or Sigma) teleconverter? For example if you want to use your Panasonic 70-200 f2.8 with a teleconverter mounted on the CL body.
no, with limitation
I use a Nikon 800mm lens with a adapter on my digital Leica CL.
I totally subscribe to David's archival SD Card policy.
Nice to hear I'm not the only one...
I can get this for 1200 no lens is that a good buy? I have the x100v and shoot Sony but I honestly don’t enjoy shooting Sony after Fuji. Please help and what lens should I grab?
I bought mine for 1100 and I ditched all my Sony gear but the A9- next is the SL2
Hi there, is there any news on a inevitable replacement for the CL?
We haven't heard anything. No rumors. No speculation. Just really enjoying the CL as it is!
Can you talk about Leica discontinuing aps-c systems? Should we start thinking about using lumix camera body with leica lenses?
I currently use an SL2 with 50-APO SL lens as my daily shooter along with the M system. Between the systems I have a 28, 35, and way too many fifties. I’m looking to add an ultra wide angle like the SL 16-35. However, weight is a big concern for me. Do you think CL with the 11-23 is a good alternative? This way I can keep my SL2 married to the 50 and add a second EVF for wide angle work. My main wide angle use will be for environmental portraits and shooting brutalist architecture.
My main concern is if the 11-23 can draw out of focus areas similar to the 16-35 if used in an environmental portrait capacity. Any suggestions or recommendations?
You might also consider just using the 11-23 TL on the SL2. You'll drop down to 20MP in APS mode, but this isn't too far off the 24MP of the CL. In exchange, you'll have a better EVF and, more importantly, IBIS. That being said, the 16-35 is an incredible performer and a bit lighter than the 24-90, so I don't know if I'd rule it out completely.
seems I cannot find anyone that has tested and owns the Sigma 16 and 30 and 56mm L mount and use with them on the CL - why is that
Is a brand new (never used) fully boxed CL and 18mm lens worth 4,000usd?
very interested in Leica CL but not sure what lens to get. I am mostly a portrait photographer, but I'm photographing trees so a zoom is sounding good. Please Advise!
AA
Our favorite all-around lens is the 35mm Summilux-TL. Really depends what focal length you feel comfortable in. They're all very capable. Have you checked out my full CL review yet? I shot with every single TL lens during testing. www.reddotforum.com/content/2019/03/leica-cl-review-the-perfect-travel-camera/
The Leica TL mount 11-23mm lens will be ideal for photographing trees, but you'll need to get a separate prime lens for your portraits; all-in-one lenses are never a good option.
CL is a handsome camera, small, capable but pricy. For the same price of a CL with one lens you can buy a Sony A7C plus at least two or three lenses, about the same weight/size, better focusing, stabilized and it’s a full frame instead of APSC. The only thing you miss is the red dot. Don’t get me wrong, I like Leica and shoot Leica, but it’s very difficult to justify CL. If you have the money to buy CL plus a lens and don’t own SL and lenses already, you should consider Q2.
Is the Leica 23mm TL, any good? Thanks
The 23mm TL is a great little lens. Small, light, and optically excellent. If you want a 35mm equivalent for your CL or TL, it's a really solid choice.
@@RedDotForum Thanks again
I always thought CL look like lens interchangeable X2 with EVF
Basically, it is! The CL is the natural evolution of the X System.
Hope the next Gen of CL have usb c to charge and IBIS
The TL has to be a good street tool right?
Yes! It's quite capable paired with the 18mm Elmarit-TL or the 23mm Summicron-TL.
How do you clean dust off the sensor with the CL?
Mostly with a blower bulb and an Eyelead sensor cleaner if necessary. Thankfully, the CL sensor isn't very prone to dust, so the blower works most of the time.
First you will need to switch off your Leica CL camera, then remove the lens attached, then hold your CL upside down so that the camera mount is facing down, then insert the nozzle of the blower upto an inch into the camera mount and repeatedly squeeze the blower brush. Then place your CL on a dry flat surface surface right way up, use a magnifying glass to look inside your CL's sensor, if you spot dust on the sensor then use dedicated wipes.
Is a CL 2 in the pipeline?
We talked about this in the livestream, but basically.... we have no idea. No crystal ball here. The CL is amazing as is. And while we're sure that there will be an updated model *eventually*, we don't know when it might be introduced, or what a future CL2 would even look like. Right now, both of us (and Kirsten too) are happily shooting our CLs.
Hi Guys. It is now 2 years later, and, from various rumor sites, it appears that Leica APS-C product lines have been discontinued. Is that what you're hearing, also? Though potentially discontinued, it doesn't mean the CL and TL2 aren't still great little cameras, but it does cast doubt upon future firmware updates and continuing support for the system. Do you have any insight about these concerns? BTW, I really appreciate your channel. Great work.
So sad to see how Leica jumped off the APS-C train. A possible CL2 could have been the Fuji-killer and the best weight-to-performance-ratio camera ever built. I had a SL2 and sold it. What a heavy brick. Now I am buying back a CL, best APS-C ever made.
... Well, business decisions are business decisions.
*Does the job*
Leica M10M is my master camera and the Leica TL2 ist my backup camera. A very good combi.
Nice setup!
@RedDotForum 16:11 "the sl2 represents the cutting edge in terms of image quality"? what about the s3 then? I assumed that this is the premium leica camera atm.
Which brings us to this Saturday's topic of the Leica S-System. ;)
ruclips.net/video/jX7kucZiCro/видео.html
In all seriousness though, the SL2 is more of a technology platform than the S3 at this point. The S3 is focused mostly on absolute image quality, not on the technology per se. We will definitely get into these points in our next live stream.
@@RedDotForum how is a camera a technology platform?? not sure what you are arguing makes sense. looking forward to that livestream though.
Where did you get your PhD in complaining?
Waiting for the CL2....WR, IBIS...better sensor would be worth it.
Hope Leica can learn hotshot design form Sony, so user can add EVF or Mic.
Now why are the two fighting to speak to us? Guys. Chilled out
Not fighting, just enthusiastic. :) This was one of our first episodes - check out later ones where we figure out how to take turns. :)
whoever is in charge of that autofocus on the video - PLEEEAASSE switch to manual
We made this video over three years ago. A lot has changed, including how we handle focus.
So much waffle, I gave up after 12 minutes