@@classicmodeltrains Yep, they call them technicians NOT tradesman. Australian Navy went down this path to cut costs. Mechanical guys are still OK because the old school guys are still teaching them the right way to do things. Unfortunately the same cant be said for the electronics guys. If a PCB fails they replace it. It might fail three more times before they say why is the PCB failing.....
Love the motor explanation. When you visualise the motor like that you realise the simplicity and genius of a DC motor. Excellent. In the past, I was almost seduced by the promise of the neodymium magnet but never quite trusted them. This is the best demonstration I have ever seen. 😊👍
Excellent video! Your persistence and patience is amazing. I already understood how an electric motor works but never heard or saw anyone explain so simply and clearly as you did. Great job as always. Thank you and keep up the great work.
I was anxiously waiting for this video Ron. So, thank you so much for posting it! I was surprised with the results too. The fact is that Mr. Dodd’s magnetizer proved to be a stupendous tool, mainly for whom have many old motors equipping his/her locomotives. I can imagine what you are going to do with your many Tycos… at least the ones equiped with the good MU2 motors… Great work my friend!
Thank you Regis. After reading many comments I dont think I successfully accomplished this experiment. I shall attempt it a few more times with other loco/motor combinations. The re-magger was very nice. I hope the alnico's hold there "charge"
Once again - we are deep in the weeds, magnetism now .... Love it !! Just so you know, I am a pro at tearing down locos and cleaning and lubing them thanks to your channel. Just did a Rivarossi bought off ebay advertised as "non-running" - cleaned it up - runs smooth as a swiss watch. The grease they used turned into chewing gum .... keep it coming Ron. -Always fun. Those graphics boys will need to report to HR dept ... LOL.
If the ebay ad says "not running/parts" I want it even more!! The Graphics Dept Boys left for Tijuana early this morning. Probably have to save up some funds to get them out of the "clink" ;-)
As always Sir Great Video! Never say never with the "train whisper"! Another lesson learned Thanks for taking us along for the ride! Love that Hat Sir!
That's a Classic model (loco) with a Fatal Attraction! Much better with a solid juice flow. Those rare earth magnets, i use just one, 5mm to start, packed out with washers, and +/- them until its not overpowering. Never used more than two in any motor. Now i have the re-magger, old magnets live again! Great vid as always.
Ron, That is a great video. I have several motors which need the magnets re-done. I was always debating if I should get a re-magnetzer. Thanks for experimenting. Love your sense of humor.
glad the remagnetizer worked so well....great explanation of dc motor operation...hats off to the animation department...Kinda makes me want one of them there locos now... Keep up the great work Ron.... Rich...
Feeding the beast, I'm a firm believer in neodymium magnets. I've redone all my Pittman motors with neodymium magnets and it made a huge difference. Cheers from eastern TN
Ron, we must be thinking alike.. I also ordered and bought myself one of Ronald Dodd's re-magnetisers last month it arrived less than a week later. My Video will be available next week. Yep you explained it well and Kudos to you for correctly saying that the electrons goes from negative to the positive whereas other people think and say it goes from the positive to the negative. It is all about electron flow and electrons flow from the negative to the positive where as current is flow is from the positive to the negative. I did electronics at school and then worked in the electronics industry for many years and I still do electronic repairs and upgrades. Neodymium magnets are a great alternative but as you found out they are not as strong as the original magnets due to their composition.
Great video Ron…keep on teaching so we can keep on learnin’…never seen a remagnetizer gadget before…nice find, and great addition to the tool box…hope you had a happy turkey 🦃 day…cheers from Canada 🇨🇦
Hi Ron. As always you never gave up, solved it in the end. I also learned something about magnetism, tell the art department great job. Give them a beer break 😜. I think you will get lots of use for your new magnetizer. Great job 👏👍. Chat again soon buddy. G
An excellent and usefull video thanks. I am surprised at the poor performance of the Neo Magnets as I use them all the time. I have had great success with them especially on pancake motors such as Lima, Bachmann, Hornby and Tyco. I don't even replace the old magnet. I just place the small Neo Mags on the outside of the motor housing held on by the magnetism of the original motor.
Well Dang Ron! A great recovery and enjoyable finish to that earlier project. I was guessing Nicole Kidman.luckily watched all the way to the end. I had never heard of that tool. Sweet that it works so well! I’m anxious to see the GG-1 follow-up!
Great video. Yes, you were right to put the light in with the motor. I was thinkin bout getting one of those magnet machines for myself, but decided that some of the newer motors and some that are brushless would be more economical for me. I have not yet taken a motor apart and had the magnets loose there magic... but I will take your word for it. As a retired auto tech I had learned to mark everything as I took it apart. Guess I've been lucky. Thank you for sharing. 33%er saying have a great day.
This motor and others from the same era are the first ones Ive encountered that loose there magnetism. The other 100 ive took apart never did. I need a magnetometer so I can do some more testing on stuff
Great Video thanks. I got one of those Tyco AT&SF Pacific train sets for Christmas in 1975. Ran the daylights out of it for quite a while, as I recall it finally gave up the ghost about 1994. Had no clue you could re-magnetized the motor magnet. I Guess ya can teach an old dog new tricks.
Bought a Ronald Dodd remagnetizer a year ago. It cost me about $280 dollars to get it last year. Now it'll cost around $150 shipped and you get a multimeter included on ebay! It was worth every penny though! I absolutely love buying old, worn, battle scarred and tired locomotives, thoroughly servicing the mechanism, which includes remagnetizing the motor, and watching them fly down the track as if they were brand new again.
You did a GREAT job on his Ron! Your explanation was totally clear and understandable. Long Live the 80’s animations!! 👍 Tom Oh, by the way, your Classic Model today is Sharon Stone!
Fantastic video Ron, great comparison and really informative. I can use your explanation of electromagnetic motors when teaching the kids. Also those re magnetised should make some kind of cool sci-fi noise when they work, kinda disappointing when there's no crackle or zap.
Very nice! Loved the outcome. Keep up the good work! Last time I checked, a Pound was only worth 79 cents U.S., however the dollar has been sliding. - Johnny from Texas
I'm so glad you did this video Ron I've been debating on buying that same magnetizer for the last month this will be my next tool purchase!!! Awesome video
Nice! Well that goes to prove if it works don't fix it... very nice runner. ...a word of caution from my experience with those neominimmiumm magnets to be careful handling them. The ones I have are dangerously strong depending on size and can move in unintended ways if not secured. Very nice motor diagram seriously!
Those remag tools are brilliant from what I’ve heard, they’re popular over here in the UK for remagnetising the motors in Triang, Hornby Dublo, Airfix, etc, I need to get one myself since all my models probably need a recharge, so if that tool can save a notoriously bad model then I’m confident it’ll do what I need it to do Great video as usual, keep it up!
You have the same exact magnetiser as I have neodymium magnets are effective from the ends mostly hence why the loss of magnetism the older ferrite magnets hold a force all round the magnet great job ron
I just got a 30 pack of Neodymium N42 1/8"x1/4"x1/2" magnets from TotalElement to replace the magnet in my 2-8-2 Mantua locomotive. It was running poorly, so per one of your earlier videos I replaced it with four of these new magnets. I pulled out the old one with a pair of pliers and used the pliers put in the new ones. It runs terrific now but I noticed it ran opposite to the setting on my transformer. Ah, reverse the polarity of the magnets! Now it works like it should. However, I had put in a new LED headlight which now only works in reverse, so I'll have to re-solder the wires so it'll come on when running forward. I'll do that as soon as I finish watching this video. I've got lots more Mantua locos that I intend to re-magnetize since this was such a success. Thanks again for another entertaining and instructive video!
Yeah! Ronald Dodd's Remagnetizer really needs more attention, I have one myself and it's great! Probably one of the best model railroading purchases imaginable!
Those neodymium magnets may have been too strong for the motor. Using a too strong a magnetic field will cause the motor to have a higher torque. But, it will suffer speed reduction and higher heat across the commutator. It will also cause erratic speed control. So, the amount of neodymium magnets stacked together may cause too strong of magnetic field… Ouch…I had to search back decades in my memory banks to remember this information….then I checked my memory against Google… Another excellent video that made me think!!! Thanks Ron
Great experiment Ron, I thought you knew about the re-magnetizer because it came out in 1964 with Hornby so I'm sorry I didn't say anything. You could have left the motor together, but you also needed the two little plates in so that the energizers touched them from the re-magnetizer, but you solved it anyway with your own brand of tenacity. I'm happy to see how excellent the locomotive runs after all that work and research you put in and with some help from England Bob's your uncle, lol. Great two videos with an outstanding result. Jersey Bill
I did leave the motor assembled at first. I was not getting the results I hoped for. The metal bars were being held away from the stator pieces by the thickness of the Zamak motor frame. It did come out better than I hope for thats for sure.
Great video Ron, been after one of them there re magnatizers at a sensible price for the last year as i love my old triangs etc, and they could all do with a boost .seem to be rare when they do pop up for sale then go for a pretty price as everyone seems to want them
Ron, something to consider is that neodymium magnets are sold in different strengths too. Your multi-pack of magnts probably didn't specify the strength, but if you ever get bored and want to try neodymium magnets again I suggest you measure the space available, find the biggest ones that will fit your motor you wanna re-juice, and then try and get them in a couple different strengths and compare which magnet strength works best. Note that Lionel used Alnico magnets for their magnetraction. You should see sometime if any of your old Lionel postwar locos can squeeze into your new magnetizer, give em a good zap, and find out if it makes em stronger. I know a lot of those old magnetraction magnets probably have lost a little of their umph over the years, it'd be neat to know if it would work. When Lionel was making HO trains in their factory from 1959 to 1966, they soon realized that service stations needed to take apart the motors to perform work on them. This was all well and good, but well, you know what happens when you pull the magnet out! So Lionel came out with the ST-393 HO Motor Magnetizer, available to authorized Lionel service stations to purchase. I managed to find one for a real bargain and use it to re-magnetize my Lionel HO locos. It works fine, but unlike your slick machine from Ronald Dodd it is not adjustable, so either a motor fits in it or it doesn't. Lionel warned service stations that the HO motor magnetizer would not be able to re-magnetize O gauge magnetraction magnets. The old Lionel magnetizer was supposed to run off a car battery. Neat little bit of trivia for you.
Thanks for the info, but I have a question. I heard Lionels first run of HO was actually from Athearn. I've heard Lionel never made any of there HO scale stuff themselves. Attempting to Re-Mag a Magna-traction sounds like a dang good idea to me. I will give that a go next time I have one apart. Pretty cool you have a original piece of Lionel repair tools!!
What a terrifically informative video, and how good are your graphics!!! I thought it was an informative pic then you went all crazy with that stop motion magitrickery Along motor lines: I'm sure you're familiar with that terrific pioneer Ernst Planck 2 rail loco from 1882. But have a look at that motor concept, with its electromagnetic bobbin arrangement. Neat how an electric toy train appeared just 3 years after the first electric demonstration, and before the real thing, hence a motor with a wound armature wasn't a given
I own this engine my self and there was supposed to be 2 wires connected to the tender and the draw bar does not pick up power but the person who had it originally own this engine must have heavly modified this engine also great job you got it running
Yes, a few Fellers mentioned the missing 2nd wire in the comments of the last video. That drawbar has a lot of Rivarossi styling to it. The 2nd wire really brought that around though!!
The P-4 was strictly designed as a moderately high-speed passenger locomotive by Lima. It was the largest designed before changing to a 4-6-4 Hudson type. The P-4 has better performance than the NYC Hudson type where shorter distances between stations were encountered. The trailing truck had a booster that quickly got the P-4 with train out of stations in a hurry. Fortunately, there is one B&M P-4 still in existence and under restoration at Steamtown in Scranton, PA.
Hi - suggest you keep the compass away from the demagnetizer while in using it ... the magnetizer can reverse the polarity on the compass if it is in close proximity. Great video btw.
Now that's a result I wasn't expecting either. I also noticed the original magnet offered a smoother start and the Neo magnets were more jerky. I noticed the same thing on the engines I put neo magnets in. This might translate oddly to the audio world- many people like the old ALNICO speakers, they have a warmer sound. And the Neo speakers don't sound that great to me. You also must be doing well with the RUclips, being able to hire those first rate production teams! Makes me laugh every time!😄
It was an interesting journey with unexpected results. I'm Looking into some Sesame Street former actors for some stagehand work. Imaginary creatures are hard workers ;-)
I play with American Flyer and had an old DC Motor from AC GIlbert. It was Alnico I believe but it was so weak. I ordered rectangular magnets to replace it and it was amazingly stronger and very low Amps to pull. In time I learned I could not find very many of the DC Field designs to convert. So i tried to 3D print a field shape to hold Arc Shaped Super Magnets. After several design changes and prototypes I had a good shape to replace the entire old AC Fields With a 3D Printed form that help Arc shaped Magnets one on each side but they were a little weak with the larger engines, So i got a rectangular magnet that fit on the outside of the Arc Magnet for a boost. Ah AH now it pulled like a train. I had a Northern S Gauge pulling 20 cars until the rubber tire rin peeled off. The DC Field Assembles work great replacing the original AC wire wound fields. Amp draw is below 1 Amp from the 3 amp of the AC Field motors. And power can be tuned with smaller or larger Booster Magnets. Sharing to confirm the Super Magnets seen to work but better in the Arc Shape deleting the metal arcs. Good educational video, Thanks Dennis
There are different strengths of neodymium magnets. The ones I've used were pretty strong. I get them at K&J magnetics, and they have all different sizes and shapes. Without using the intensity of the magnets used here, it's hard to say for sure if you could do better, but my guess is that you can.
Great video as always Ron. I hope you and the misses had a great Thanksgiving in big sky country. I had the typical thanksgiving with the usual degenerates but most of us railroad guys are degenerates anyhow. lol.
Yes. the metal plates will have had residual magnetism polarised to the old magnet. If you installed the new magnets the other way round then you will have opposing magnetic fields and the overall magnetism is poor.
Sounds like a good theory to test out. I didnt notice any magnetism in the stator plates but also I did not look for it either. Back to the Lab I must go!!
There are different strengths to the magnets, your garden variety of neodymium magnets will be the N32 strength while the ones you might want will be the N52. Ask me how I know as I'm making dumb fridge magnets to use up the tiny n32's...
I wish yourself would talk to myself because myself lies to myself ALL THE TIME! "You can lift that" "One more beer won't hurt" "No way she heard that" - All LIES. Marking the magnet to make sure it always goes together the same way is smart. On the neodymiums, they could be too "strong", but they should never be worse than the old magnet. Once the iron parts saturate with magnetic field the remaining field is essentially wasted. The original parts are surely designed to be just big enough for Alnico magnets, you would have to make new iron parts with a larger cross section to get all the power of the N magnets.
Love the first part of your comment! Too FUNNY!! Now I guess ive lied to myself as well! You make a good point with the second part of your comment. Very interesting!!
The problem with the Neo (Yeah I can't pronounce it either) magnets is that when smaller magnets are used and stacked. As you stack them you get diminishing returns from each of the separate magnets (So 1 = 1, 2 = 1.9, 3 = 2.7, 4 = 3.2....) . Also the field does not expand, it stays about the same. This field is what is "transferred" (not scientifically accurate but will do) to the 'wings'. The field is also narrowed by the width of the magnets meaning less of a field is available. So in this application the stacked Neo magnets is far less efficient than they should be. The screw driver test confirmed this. I quick search shows single magnets of 1/2 x 1/2 x 1/2 cube with 27 Pounds of force. Way to strong of a magnet, will probably uncouple any magnetic couplers within a foot or two. :) Ideally you would want to get one that is sized correctly and has reasonable force. Anyways, I am in favor of using the original and vintage magnets with the re-magnetizer!!!!!
Try putting a neodinium magnet on the outside of the moter, see if that would charge up the alnico magnet. Maybe ? If you put the magnet in the cage backward, the cage would take away some of magnatisem untill it fully changed polarity. Happy Thanksgiving.
The first video I put the neo on the outside of the stator pieces. The Alnico did not hold the charge. The tin stator pieces do not hold any magnetism without a magnet in place. I really thought the Neo's would be much better than the results I got.
That is really interesting. I have often thought of buying one as I have many older Triang/Hornby locos with three pole motors but thought it was too expensive to get it over the pond. How much did it cost all in? Thanks
Ron, there are more beautiful, fully functioning trains sitting in attics and basements, doing nothing, than the entire production of manufacturers this year. This hobby needs someone who can agglomerate all of these beautiful trains and redistribute them into the hands of young railroaders and their dads nationwide, while keeping the collector vultures out of such an endeavor.
Sorry, but the setup between the pole pieces of the neodymium must be a bit suspect. I use neodymium (rare earth) magnets in my Triang and Hornby Dublo locos. The magnets are purpose made to the correct size and just slot straight in. I gave up on having the alnico magnets remagnetised as they wouldn't hold their charge. Have had no problems with these magnets and the locos run like they were brand new, and it's a lot cheaper than buying a magnetiser.😁
I'm a little puzzled by the performance of the Neodymium magnets. They are supposed to be the most power magnets that can be found. I question whether the magnets genuine neodymium magnets since they were purchased from the big "A" seller which sometimes gets questionable products to sell, or the magnets do not give the right magnetic flux field due to being round. I'll expand on the second part of my theory since the first part of my theory is self-explanatory. The round neodymium magnets may be causing a narrow flux field on the steel expander bands causing a weaker magnetic field for the motor to use. I did see the big "A" seller have square and rectangular neodymium magnets which may expand out the magnetic field for a motor. I would try those next time instead of the round magnets. This may be a critical difference in performance. Aside from the round neodymium magnets being a bust, the magnetizer worked this time, but I've seen them on other channels have marginal performance. I guess it depends on the quality, age, and deterioration of the original magnet whether it can be brough back to life.
im glad you never gave up looks like a 3 beer job to me
I never give up on a repair. Might take a while, but it always gets completed ;-)
It’s nice to see you go deep into the nuts and bolts of the hobby. Many people are not that dedicated to fixing and just want to replace.
Ive always wanted to know exactly whats broken by diagnosing it. I worked in too many shops with so called "mechanics" that all they do is swap parts.
@@classicmodeltrains Yep, they call them technicians NOT tradesman. Australian Navy went down this path to cut costs. Mechanical guys are still OK because the old school guys are still teaching them the right way to do things. Unfortunately the same cant be said for the electronics guys. If a PCB fails they replace it. It might fail three more times before they say why is the PCB failing.....
That was very interesting from start to finish. Thanks Ron.
Thanks Mike
Love the motor explanation. When you visualise the motor like that you realise the simplicity and genius of a DC motor. Excellent. In the past, I was almost seduced by the promise of the neodymium magnet but never quite trusted them. This is the best demonstration I have ever seen. 😊👍
Thank you very much!
@@classicmodeltrains Did you see my video on my re-magnetiser?
Once again, I learn some new techniques and had a good time doing it. Thanks Ron!
My pleasure
Great you have seen the light with the Re-magnetizer😀. It totally transformed my Athearn 4-6-2. And great video as always Ron!
Yup! Now all my oldies can run like spring chickens once again.
Excellent video! Your persistence and patience is amazing. I already understood how an electric motor works but never heard or saw anyone explain so simply and clearly as you did. Great job as always. Thank you and keep up the great work.
Thank you.
I was anxiously waiting for this video Ron. So, thank you so much for posting it!
I was surprised with the results too. The fact is that Mr. Dodd’s magnetizer proved to be a stupendous tool, mainly for whom have many old motors equipping his/her locomotives. I can imagine what you are going to do with your many Tycos… at least the ones equiped with the good MU2 motors…
Great work my friend!
Thank you Regis. After reading many comments I dont think I successfully accomplished this experiment. I shall attempt it a few more times with other loco/motor combinations. The re-magger was very nice. I hope the alnico's hold there "charge"
Once again - we are deep in the weeds, magnetism now .... Love it !!
Just so you know, I am a pro at tearing down locos and cleaning and lubing them thanks to your channel.
Just did a Rivarossi bought off ebay advertised as "non-running" - cleaned it up - runs smooth as a swiss watch.
The grease they used turned into chewing gum .... keep it coming Ron. -Always fun.
Those graphics boys will need to report to HR dept ... LOL.
If the ebay ad says "not running/parts" I want it even more!! The Graphics Dept Boys left for Tijuana early this morning. Probably have to save up some funds to get them out of the "clink" ;-)
As always Sir Great Video! Never say never with the "train whisper"! Another lesson learned Thanks for taking us along for the ride! Love that Hat Sir!
Thanks for watching Eric
That's a Classic model (loco) with a Fatal Attraction! Much better with a solid juice flow. Those rare earth magnets, i use just one, 5mm to start, packed out with washers, and +/- them until its not overpowering. Never used more than two in any motor. Now i have the re-magger, old magnets live again! Great vid as always.
Good idea with the washer-spacers, I will try that next time.
Neodidummmm lol I love it. Glad to see it run like it did. Always to the end 👍🏻
:-)
Ron,
That is a great video. I have several motors which need the magnets re-done. I was always debating if I should get a re-magnetzer. Thanks for experimenting. Love your sense of humor.
You bet! I hope the video helps you make a decision about a remagnetizer.
Very cool! Very fun! One of your best! Cheers!
I appreciate it!
I have a Ronald Dodd remagnetizer I use it for my old vintage slot car motors. It's brilliant. He"s also a really clever and nice guy.
Right on!
glad the remagnetizer worked so well....great explanation of dc motor operation...hats off to the animation department...Kinda makes me want one of them there locos now...
Keep up the great work Ron....
Rich...
Thanks Rich, Better hurry and start looking for one of these old athearn steamers. There kinda rare
Feeding the beast, I'm a firm believer in neodymium magnets. I've redone all my Pittman motors with neodymium magnets and it made a huge difference. Cheers from eastern TN
I’m glad you got good results with those magnets.
Another great video. Good to see the engine running good. My grand daughter got a kick out of watching your video. Thanks for sharing.
Thanks John
Thank you for sharing. Nice👍
Glad you enjoyed it!
33%er here Awesome job remagnetizing that magnet from that athearn motor.
Thanks Matt!
Hi Ron & it's Randy and i like yours video is Cool & Thanks Ron & Friends Randy
Thanks Randy
Ron, we must be thinking alike.. I also ordered and bought myself one of Ronald Dodd's re-magnetisers last month it arrived less than a week later. My Video will be available next week. Yep you explained it well and Kudos to you for correctly saying that the electrons goes from negative to the positive whereas other people think and say it goes from the positive to the negative. It is all about electron flow and electrons flow from the negative to the positive where as current is flow is from the positive to the negative. I did electronics at school and then worked in the electronics industry for many years and I still do electronic repairs and upgrades. Neodymium magnets are a great alternative but as you found out they are not as strong as the original magnets due to their composition.
Makes me wonder if all mail that goes continent to continent is air mailed. Must be.....
Great job 👍 and definitely worth all the effort that is a very nice runner now wow 🤩
Thanks 👍
Thank you again for the knowledgeable video! You are able to break it down so even us laymen can understand.
Thanks for watching Mark :-)
good to see the remagnatizer worked for you
Like a Champ!
33%'er, Great Science experiment. WELL DONE.
@@lynnmccurdythehdmmrc2561 Thank you Lynn!
I absolutely love your videos. They make me happy. I always look forward to seeing them 😊
Thank you Very Much David
Great video Ron…keep on teaching so we can keep on learnin’…never seen a remagnetizer gadget before…nice find, and great addition to the tool box…hope you had a happy turkey 🦃 day…cheers from Canada 🇨🇦
Thanks David
Hi Ron.
As always you never gave up, solved it in the end. I also learned something about magnetism, tell the art department great job. Give them a beer break 😜.
I think you will get lots of use for your new magnetizer. Great job 👏👍.
Chat again soon buddy. G
Hello G, Yes I hope to get more classics magged up and showing better performance. Them Graphics Boys went to Tijuana right after the shoot was over.
An excellent and usefull video thanks. I am surprised at the poor performance of the Neo Magnets as I use them all the time. I have had great success with them especially on pancake motors such as Lima, Bachmann, Hornby and Tyco. I don't even replace the old magnet. I just place the small Neo Mags on the outside of the motor housing held on by the magnetism of the original motor.
Cool idea!
Another good one thanks Ron keep them coming
Glad you enjoyed it.
Pretty cool knowing you are international!….itsgood to know the world is watching!..lol..enjoyed the video!
Yup my signal is getting out to everywhere! Thanks for watching!
Well Dang Ron! A great recovery and enjoyable finish to that earlier project. I was guessing Nicole Kidman.luckily watched all the way to the end. I had never heard of that tool. Sweet that it works so well! I’m anxious to see the GG-1 follow-up!
Thanks Steven
Great video. Yes, you were right to put the light in with the motor. I was thinkin bout getting one of those magnet machines for myself, but decided that some of the newer motors and some that are brushless would be more economical for me. I have not yet taken a motor apart and had the magnets loose there magic... but I will take your word for it. As a retired auto tech I had learned to mark everything as I took it apart. Guess I've been lucky. Thank you for sharing. 33%er saying have a great day.
This motor and others from the same era are the first ones Ive encountered that loose there magnetism. The other 100 ive took apart never did. I need a magnetometer so I can do some more testing on stuff
Great Video thanks. I got one of those Tyco AT&SF Pacific train sets for Christmas in 1975. Ran the daylights out of it for quite a while, as I recall it finally gave up the ghost about 1994. Had no clue you could re-magnetized the motor magnet. I Guess ya can teach an old dog new tricks.
The day you quit learning is the day you start pushing daisies ;-)
Hi Ron, another great and interesting video as usual.
Thanks
Glad you enjoyed it
I loved the Graffic boys ...fun times
There a crazy bunch
Hi Ron, great video, Love your animation department, my type of co workers to hang out with.
Thanks, Them Artsy Fellers wont let me hang out with them. They say I aint "cool" enough or something ;-)
Awesome diagram and explanation Ron ! Time for a beer !
Yay BEER!
Congrats!
Thanks
Bought a Ronald Dodd remagnetizer a year ago. It cost me about $280 dollars to get it last year. Now it'll cost around $150 shipped and you get a multimeter included on ebay!
It was worth every penny though!
I absolutely love buying old, worn, battle scarred and tired locomotives, thoroughly servicing the mechanism, which includes remagnetizing the motor, and watching them fly down the track as if they were brand new again.
I like the way you think
You did a GREAT job on his Ron! Your explanation was totally clear and understandable. Long Live the 80’s animations!! 👍 Tom
Oh, by the way, your Classic Model today is Sharon Stone!
Thank you Tom!
Fantastic video Ron, great comparison and really informative. I can use your explanation of electromagnetic motors when teaching the kids. Also those re magnetised should make some kind of cool sci-fi noise when they work, kinda disappointing when there's no crackle or zap.
That's what I was thinking! I wanted noise out of the re-magger, something original star trekish :-)
Nice to see you, like me, use MRC Control Master 20s.
I love it. I have a O gauge AC version as well
Very nice! Loved the outcome. Keep up the good work! Last time I checked, a Pound was only worth 79 cents U.S., however the dollar has been sliding. - Johnny from Texas
Thanks for the info.
I'm so glad you did this video Ron I've been debating on buying that same magnetizer for the last month this will be my next tool purchase!!! Awesome video
@@dalefraschetti1874 thanks Dale. If you have a lot of old locos to do a re-mag on then yes it’s worth it.
I have a few that could use a good zapping ⚡️
Been looking for a remagnetizer for awhile now. Thanks!
You bet!
Sharon Stone I believe! That’s so cool to get it to run so well!! Have seen UK OO collectors use the demagnetized.
Yup you got her!
Nice! Well that goes to prove if it works don't fix it... very nice runner. ...a word of caution from my experience with those neominimmiumm magnets to be careful handling them. The ones I have are dangerously strong depending on size and can move in unintended ways if not secured. Very nice motor diagram seriously!
Thanks, Glad you enjoyed the vid. :-)
Those remag tools are brilliant from what I’ve heard, they’re popular over here in the UK for remagnetising the motors in Triang, Hornby Dublo, Airfix, etc, I need to get one myself since all my models probably need a recharge, so if that tool can save a notoriously bad model then I’m confident it’ll do what I need it to do
Great video as usual, keep it up!
Place an order because there worth it
You have the same exact magnetiser as I have neodymium magnets are effective from the ends mostly hence why the loss of magnetism the older ferrite magnets hold a force all round the magnet great job ron
Thanks Peter !
I just got a 30 pack of Neodymium N42 1/8"x1/4"x1/2" magnets from TotalElement to replace the magnet in my 2-8-2 Mantua locomotive. It was running poorly, so per one of your earlier videos I replaced it with four of these new magnets. I pulled out the old one with a pair of pliers and used the pliers put in the new ones. It runs terrific now but I noticed it ran opposite to the setting on my transformer. Ah, reverse the polarity of the magnets! Now it works like it should. However, I had put in a new LED headlight which now only works in reverse, so I'll have to re-solder the wires so it'll come on when running forward. I'll do that as soon as I finish watching this video. I've got lots more Mantua locos that I intend to re-magnetize since this was such a success. Thanks again for another entertaining and instructive video!
Glad you got it figured out, I've been playing with magnets lately and it's been a real learning curve.
love watching n learning\watch on tv and now
ill like on pc
Thanks for engaging the comments William
Yeah! Ronald Dodd's Remagnetizer really needs more attention, I have one myself and it's great! Probably one of the best model railroading purchases imaginable!
I agree!
Sharing this vid with my fellow hobbyist!!(sp?)
I Miss (sp?) all the time, Sometimes so bad the auto spell check cant even figure out what im typing :-D. Thanks for sharing this vid Brock !!
Thank you Ron,
Thanks for watching!
Great video ron
Thanks Dave
Great video! Been waiting on this one for a while. Get those graphics boyz to work on the benefits of a 5 pole armature vs a 3 pole armature. :)
Thanks Tim. Trying to animate a 5 pole would certainly lead to a strike from the Graphics boys ;-)
Those neodymium magnets may have been too strong for the motor.
Using a too strong a magnetic field will cause the motor to have a higher torque.
But, it will suffer speed reduction and higher heat across the commutator.
It will also cause erratic speed control.
So, the amount of neodymium magnets stacked together may cause too strong of magnetic field…
Ouch…I had to search back decades in my memory banks to remember this information….then I checked my memory against Google…
Another excellent video that made me think!!!
Thanks Ron
A Few fellers have been mentioning the way to strong of field taking place. I think your on to something.
Another great video 👍🏻
Glad you enjoyed it
Remagnetizer, how clever. It sounded like it was running on gas for a while. You know, from beer, eggs and navy beans. Nice fix, as usual! 😎👍
I wished it made a noise when it's turned on. It's so cool that it needs a noise all its own ;-)
Glad to see that Pacific running like a champ! Wonder how fast some old Athearn Hustlers would go with remagnatized motors!
Makes me giggle just thinking about it.
Great experiment Ron, I thought you knew about the re-magnetizer because it came out in 1964 with Hornby so I'm sorry I didn't say anything. You could have left the motor together, but you also needed the two little plates in so that the energizers touched them from the re-magnetizer, but you solved it anyway with your own brand of tenacity. I'm happy to see how excellent the locomotive runs after all that work and research you put in and with some help from England Bob's your uncle, lol. Great two videos with an outstanding result. Jersey Bill
I did leave the motor assembled at first. I was not getting the results I hoped for. The metal bars were being held away from the stator pieces by the thickness of the Zamak motor frame. It did come out better than I hope for thats for sure.
Great video Ron, been after one of them there re magnatizers at a sensible price for the last year as i love my old triangs etc, and they could all do with a boost .seem to be rare when they do pop up for sale then go for a pretty price as everyone seems to want them
This is the first time ive been exposed to one. I paid $200 w/ shipping.
@classicmodeltrains that's a pretty good price, especially with the shipping 👍
Ron, something to consider is that neodymium magnets are sold in different strengths too. Your multi-pack of magnts probably didn't specify the strength, but if you ever get bored and want to try neodymium magnets again I suggest you measure the space available, find the biggest ones that will fit your motor you wanna re-juice, and then try and get them in a couple different strengths and compare which magnet strength works best.
Note that Lionel used Alnico magnets for their magnetraction. You should see sometime if any of your old Lionel postwar locos can squeeze into your new magnetizer, give em a good zap, and find out if it makes em stronger. I know a lot of those old magnetraction magnets probably have lost a little of their umph over the years, it'd be neat to know if it would work.
When Lionel was making HO trains in their factory from 1959 to 1966, they soon realized that service stations needed to take apart the motors to perform work on them. This was all well and good, but well, you know what happens when you pull the magnet out! So Lionel came out with the ST-393 HO Motor Magnetizer, available to authorized Lionel service stations to purchase. I managed to find one for a real bargain and use it to re-magnetize my Lionel HO locos. It works fine, but unlike your slick machine from Ronald Dodd it is not adjustable, so either a motor fits in it or it doesn't. Lionel warned service stations that the HO motor magnetizer would not be able to re-magnetize O gauge magnetraction magnets. The old Lionel magnetizer was supposed to run off a car battery. Neat little bit of trivia for you.
Thanks for the info, but I have a question. I heard Lionels first run of HO was actually from Athearn. I've heard Lionel never made any of there HO scale stuff themselves. Attempting to Re-Mag a Magna-traction sounds like a dang good idea to me. I will give that a go next time I have one apart. Pretty cool you have a original piece of Lionel repair tools!!
What a terrifically informative video, and how good are your graphics!!! I thought it was an informative pic then you went all crazy with that stop motion magitrickery
Along motor lines: I'm sure you're familiar with that terrific pioneer Ernst Planck 2 rail loco from 1882.
But have a look at that motor concept, with its electromagnetic bobbin arrangement.
Neat how an electric toy train appeared just 3 years after the first electric demonstration, and before the real thing, hence a motor with a wound armature wasn't a given
I'm not familiar with that Feller or his electric train.. Is pretty neat how fast that invention showed up
Interesting experiment there Ron. I would have thought those replacements would have done better. That magnetizer seems to be the ticket for sure!!
I agree Ray, I thought it would pull like .25 amp and just creep along for days. More research is necessary....Where's my grant application!!
I own this engine my self and there was supposed to be 2 wires connected to the tender and the draw bar does not pick up power but the person who had it originally own this engine must have heavly modified this engine also great job you got it running
Yes, a few Fellers mentioned the missing 2nd wire in the comments of the last video. That drawbar has a lot of Rivarossi styling to it. The 2nd wire really brought that around though!!
You got me with Sharon Stone, I forgot all about "Basic Instinct"...
I get Fatal attraction & Basic Instinct mixed up sometimes
The P-4 was strictly designed as a moderately high-speed passenger locomotive by Lima. It was the largest designed before changing to a 4-6-4 Hudson type. The P-4 has better performance than the NYC Hudson type where shorter distances between stations were encountered. The trailing truck had a booster that quickly got the P-4 with train out of stations in a hurry. Fortunately, there is one B&M P-4 still in existence and under restoration at Steamtown in Scranton, PA.
Thanks for the background info, I love hearing about steamers getting restored!!
Hi - suggest you keep the compass away from the demagnetizer while in using it ... the magnetizer can reverse the polarity on the compass if it is in close proximity. Great video btw.
Good point, thanks!!
now that's a RUclips video isn't it nice job
Thanks
🎶 Real men of genius 🎵
I miss them commercials
Did you have to do any rewiring or use some sort of plug adapter to get the ReMagnetizer to work on a 110 volt US outlet?
It came with both kind of plug in cords
Now that's a result I wasn't expecting either. I also noticed the original magnet offered a smoother start and the Neo magnets were more jerky. I noticed the same thing on the engines I put neo magnets in. This might translate oddly to the audio world- many people like the old ALNICO speakers, they have a warmer sound. And the Neo speakers don't sound that great to me.
You also must be doing well with the RUclips, being able to hire those first rate production teams! Makes me laugh every time!😄
It was an interesting journey with unexpected results. I'm Looking into some Sesame Street former actors for some stagehand work. Imaginary creatures are hard workers ;-)
Having a glass of bourbon with this one
NICE!
I play with American Flyer and had an old DC Motor from AC GIlbert. It was Alnico I believe but it was so weak. I ordered rectangular magnets to replace it and it was amazingly stronger and very low Amps to pull. In time I learned I could not find very many of the DC Field designs to convert. So i tried to 3D print a field shape to hold Arc Shaped Super Magnets. After several design changes and prototypes I had a good shape to replace the entire old AC Fields With a 3D Printed form that help Arc shaped Magnets one on each side but they were a little weak with the larger engines, So i got a rectangular magnet that fit on the outside of the Arc Magnet for a boost. Ah AH now it pulled like a train. I had a Northern S Gauge pulling 20 cars until the rubber tire rin peeled off. The DC Field Assembles work great replacing the original AC wire wound fields. Amp draw is below 1 Amp from the 3 amp of the AC Field motors. And power can be tuned with smaller or larger Booster Magnets. Sharing to confirm the Super Magnets seen to work but better in the Arc Shape deleting the metal arcs. Good educational video, Thanks Dennis
Thats a pretty cool mod you did there Dennis.
There are different strengths of neodymium magnets. The ones I've used were pretty strong. I get them at K&J magnetics, and they have all different sizes and shapes. Without using the intensity of the magnets used here, it's hard to say for sure if you could do better, but my guess is that you can.
Lots of hypothesis are coming at me
Great video as always Ron. I hope you and the misses had a great Thanksgiving in big sky country. I had the typical thanksgiving with the usual degenerates but most of us railroad guys are degenerates anyhow. lol.
Thanks Jdubs, just had a quiet day here. nothing special
Yes. the metal plates will have had residual magnetism polarised to the old magnet. If you installed the new magnets the other way round then you will have opposing magnetic fields and the overall magnetism is poor.
Sounds like a good theory to test out. I didnt notice any magnetism in the stator plates but also I did not look for it either. Back to the Lab I must go!!
There are different strengths to the magnets, your garden variety of neodymium magnets will be the N32 strength while the ones you might want will be the N52. Ask me how I know as I'm making dumb fridge magnets to use up the tiny n32's...
They sure seemed to have a lot of magnetism until it came time to do real magnet stuff :-)
I wish yourself would talk to myself because myself lies to myself ALL THE TIME! "You can lift that" "One more beer won't hurt" "No way she heard that" - All LIES.
Marking the magnet to make sure it always goes together the same way is smart.
On the neodymiums, they could be too "strong", but they should never be worse than the old magnet. Once the iron parts saturate with magnetic field the remaining field is essentially wasted. The original parts are surely designed to be just big enough for Alnico magnets, you would have to make new iron parts with a larger cross section to get all the power of the N magnets.
Love the first part of your comment! Too FUNNY!! Now I guess ive lied to myself as well! You make a good point with the second part of your comment. Very interesting!!
Hi Ron you got me with Sharon Stone. I couldn`t figure it out. lol Great video. What was the name of those magnets again? LOL😂
Thanks Dennis, Ive just decided to call them Neo magnets, the rest of the word is too hard
OOBill uses a magnetizer just about every video. I believe DarthSantaFe did an in-depth video on Neodymium magnets.
I will have to check them out
The problem with the Neo (Yeah I can't pronounce it either) magnets is that when smaller magnets are used and stacked. As you stack them you get diminishing returns from each of the separate magnets (So 1 = 1, 2 = 1.9, 3 = 2.7, 4 = 3.2....) . Also the field does not expand, it stays about the same. This field is what is "transferred" (not scientifically accurate but will do) to the 'wings'. The field is also narrowed by the width of the magnets meaning less of a field is available. So in this application the stacked Neo magnets is far less efficient than they should be. The screw driver test confirmed this.
I quick search shows single magnets of 1/2 x 1/2 x 1/2 cube with 27 Pounds of force. Way to strong of a magnet, will probably uncouple any magnetic couplers within a foot or two. :)
Ideally you would want to get one that is sized correctly and has reasonable force.
Anyways, I am in favor of using the original and vintage magnets with the re-magnetizer!!!!!
Thank you for the information Wendell :-)
Try putting a neodinium magnet on the outside of the moter, see if that would charge up the alnico magnet. Maybe ?
If you put the magnet in the cage backward, the cage would take away some of magnatisem untill it fully changed polarity.
Happy Thanksgiving.
The first video I put the neo on the outside of the stator pieces. The Alnico did not hold the charge. The tin stator pieces do not hold any magnetism without a magnet in place. I really thought the Neo's would be much better than the results I got.
That is really interesting. I have often thought of buying one as I have many older Triang/Hornby locos with three pole motors but thought it was too expensive to get it over the pond.
How much did it cost all in?
Thanks
2 hundy w/ shipping each between me and the other feller who bought one as well.
Ron, there are more beautiful, fully functioning trains sitting in attics and basements, doing nothing, than the entire production of manufacturers this year. This hobby needs someone who can agglomerate all of these beautiful trains and redistribute them into the hands of young railroaders and their dads nationwide, while keeping the collector vultures out of such an endeavor.
I hear you Joe, and completely agree!
That's kinda wild, that they used the wheels meant for rubber band drive diesels/RDC's on the tender
Probably had a ton of them and needed to use them up
@@classicmodeltrains I think you are correct. I'd do the same to unload extra parts,lol.
They say pounds if it is relatively expensive and they say quid if they trying to play the cost down , , THE Brits are Kings of slang 😊
Thanks for the info
I here that cordless motor are better than the old ones could you try one of those 😮
Cordless Motor?
Do you mean "coreless"?
Sorry, but the setup between the pole pieces of the neodymium must be a bit suspect. I use neodymium (rare earth) magnets in my Triang and Hornby Dublo locos. The magnets are purpose made to the correct size and just slot straight in. I gave up on having the alnico magnets remagnetised as they wouldn't hold their charge. Have had no problems with these magnets and the locos run like they were brand new, and it's a lot cheaper than buying a magnetiser.😁
Interesting, I'll have to see if I can find some purpose-made neo magnets.
You have a link for that remagnitizer? I want one now
I showed them in the video
I'm a little puzzled by the performance of the Neodymium magnets. They are supposed to be the most power magnets that can be found. I question whether the magnets genuine neodymium magnets since they were purchased from the big "A" seller which sometimes gets questionable products to sell, or the magnets do not give the right magnetic flux field due to being round. I'll expand on the second part of my theory since the first part of my theory is self-explanatory. The round neodymium magnets may be causing a narrow flux field on the steel expander bands causing a weaker magnetic field for the motor to use. I did see the big "A" seller have square and rectangular neodymium magnets which may expand out the magnetic field for a motor. I would try those next time instead of the round magnets. This may be a critical difference in performance.
Aside from the round neodymium magnets being a bust, the magnetizer worked this time, but I've seen them on other channels have marginal performance. I guess it depends on the quality, age, and deterioration of the original magnet whether it can be brough back to life.
I was unable to find the proper rectangular Neo's on the A-site. I do plan on doing more research on this, I hope my grant get approved ;-)
Neet stuff. Little deep for me but I'm just a painter. I do like new information though
New Good info is always a good thing. Poor info makes me upset
Michelle Pfeifer! LadyHawke!
Oops! My bad!
Sharon Stone
Sharon Stone
Yup!
I also heard that the neo magnets can be too strong and cause the armature shaft to wear the bearings out quicker in old open frame motors.
Thanks for the input as well :-)
Don't hold that button down longer than 1 second. You will get a stronger magnet.
OK
Just found your channel, great topics and a great interest of mine but do you need to talk like that?
Talk like what?