How Good is the Houndmaster?
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- Опубликовано: 11 сен 2024
- Darkest Dungeon class guides are here! Filthy discussing the strengths and weaknesses of the various DD classes both in general and with the Crimson Court DLC.
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I love the fact that when Houndmaster is attacked, he guards his dog.
I do too! Nice little detail.
Six legs are far superior than two
That's my question, why when he is get dead the dog desappear??? The dog still alive!!!
@@DanielCruz-te4nf She can't follow orders anymore
Laughs in Abusive
I didn't realise before now that the icon for Man's Best Friend shows the Houndmaster's hand on the doggo's head. I always thought the dog was wearing a Scottish hat.
When your dog is capable of killing an elder god, he can wear whatever kind of hat he wants.
I was so confused about that
@Afqwa
I thought he was French
My houndmaster got rabies... but was it the man or the doggo?
NeutralGuyDoubleZero Both
NeutralGuyDoubleZero The Man. U gotta put a dog with rabies down, and the Houndmaster always takes the hit for the dog in his animations.
You said my hound master so it would be the hound master not the hound
"Steady, girl. If we're called, we answer."
I died a little on the inside when I saw that line during that boss fight.
funny how all of the guys are "come at me monster!" while the females (except the helion) are "no please dont"
I think the bounty hunter cries he doesn't want to die actually
usantio he says "hmph"
Classic bounty
WHO'S THE GOOD GIRL
YES YOU ARE
YES YOU ARE
Wilson Kelvyn I was legitimately worried about using this class till I saw that in his animations hes throwing himself in front of the doggo
I can get along with the hound master
Hound's Harry is dope against the flesh tho
Before I even watch the video imma tell y'all fools the answer:
Godlike.
Calling it before I watch the video, this is your best/favourite class Filthy
Save it for the Vestal.
+CidGuerreiro1234 nope nope it is the hound
It was an easy bet wasn't it?
I like the Houndmaster because I am a dog person. And dogs rock. So having a dog is good.
FlippyRobot SkippyRobot - 0:42
tob doog
naM sdrawkcaB I think you meant "dog toob", matching "stekcaj" and everything.
Anyone elses houndmaster miss like 9 out of every 5 attacks he makes?
He usually hits in mine
For the whole video, I was looking at the icon for Man's Best Friend and mistaking the hand on top of the dog's head for a Scottish bonnet.
FYI Filthy 90% chance to hit on the UI = 100% chance to hit, it's written in the rules.json file in the game's folder. It's the 2nd line if you want to check it for yourself.
Also, HM did receive a nerf in CC.
Health gained per armor level changed to 21/25/29/33/37 (down from 21/28/35/42/49).
Hound's Rush changed to 2 bleed damage at rank 5 (down from 3).
Hound's Harry changed to 2 bleed damage at rank 5 (down from 3).
Hound's Harry damaged modifier changed to -90% (down from -80%).
so they nerfed his worst ability? lol wth?
I mean they did nerf the Jester and let the Flagellent/Hellion untouched so I doubt they know how to balance. Still, the HP nerf is quite noticeable in no light.
because it was actually a "decent" ability before. definetly still his worse, but was VERY reliable at finishing off stuff in the warrens. and bleeds are just OP in general, so the nerf from 3 down to 2 was a good idea. (also, old houndmaster made the fight against the flesh even more of a joke than it is now)
Double Houndmasters in positions 3 and 2, one with stun and the other with mark. Stun and mark the first round, then shred the enemy with double Hound's Rush.
I use this comp with an Arbalester and a Bounty Hunter to wreck bosses because they all get bonus for marked enemies.
CidGuerreiro1234 Nice strat...
*Too bad mark only last 3rounds*
I don't see what you're trying to say, you can just reapply the mark and would've done a lot of burst damage in that time
A simple FISH This strategy only takes 2 rounds...
A simple FISH Rinse and repeat? If two heroes benefit from the mark it becomes mathematically beneficial to use it, especially considering that the Houndmaster's mark applies a PROT debuff as well, which means even more damage. In short, the turn you spend marking the enemy pays off in damage.
I find the houndmaster very useful for Warrens and Weald where you see a lot of beasts. Having said that, I like pairing him with the bounty hunter, even if I cannot mark in every fight, because I find that the two synergise pretty well. However, while you can take the bounty hunter to the Ruins or Cove, it is not recommended to do so with the houndmaster. There are hardly any beasts in the ruins and enemies in both of these areas have high bleed resist.
Protip: the houndmaster can single-handedly carry you on the Flesh boss encounter in the Warrens with Hound's Harry. It is perhaps the best use for this ability in the game because he hits and bleeds all slots and the Flesh has a single health bar for all 4 slots. This means that it doesn't matter where the heart is, or if there is even a heart at all - he will still bleed 'em all. My brother went from a miserable, agonizing party wipe "wow, this boss is impossible to beat" with an inflexible group to a "wow, this is so broken" after I told him to just take the houndmaster and pick Hound's Harry.
I quite like these videos, though I am a little annoyed at the reasoning for debuffs being bad; you need to roll for accuracy and you need to roll so the debuff is applied. That's also how stuns work, so that being the main reason for debuffs being bad doesn't make sense to me. I think it would be better to say that debuffs aren't as reliable as stuns, which is a far more accurate criticism. In that sense debuffs are like dodge and stuns are like hp; the first is useful but not generally reliable whereas the latter is more practical to invest in.
Because stunners stack a lot of stun% from trinkets, but there is nobody who stacks +debuff chance so their mark applies it's debuff.
Gentle Ice also, the benefits of a stun are far superior to those of a debuff. You are basically completely denying high threat target's abilities, while with a debuff you are merely mitigating.
I'm not denying that stuns are better (although who really cares about better if worse is more fun?). I'm saying the reasoning is flawed.
"although who really cares about better if worse is more fun?" People watching a video about how good something is.
You got it right the first time; stuns are like HP while debuffs are like dodge. You can't rely as much on the debuff/dodge; even stacked, they realy kinda suck. I look at buffs/debuffs as icing on the cake. Do I need to lower the target's accuracy or kill them? Killing works great, but how often do you all get a mob left with one freakin HP? All the time, right? So why not at least have a chance that they will do less damage or miss their target or be easier to hi/damage. I just wish there was a better way to emphasize that the buff/debuff ACTUALLY did something useful.
For instance, I like the +Acc move from the graverobber and the +dodge moves from the antiquarian. But how often did jacking my acc or dodge really impact that fight? Don't know but everytime I hit them or dodge one of their attacks, I assume my buffs had something to do with it. Can't say for sure, but I'd rather have it than not, ya know?
"I don't like Marx in general" Me too, man
what do you know dude?
I think there might be hidden surprise and scouting bonuses in this game. I've been running a low level party with Hound Master, Grave Digger and Bounty Hunter and Occultist. It's not the strongest party but it seems to generate an unexplainable increase in my scouting and surprise frequency. These characters all have skills that can increase this chance so I decided to get a base line reading and run them without any +scout or +surprise modifiers and they still got an unusually high ratio of scouting and surprise instances over the course of several dungeon compared to the other party I decided to compare them against which was Flagelent, Man at Arms, Vestal, Antiquarian. I ran both parties in the dark to remove torch modifiers. No +surprise or +scout skills, quirks, trinkets or other modifiers were used although the Hound Master party was built for speed and the other party was built for the slow grind out of necessity since several of the characters had bad speed quirk penalties. I mention this because one of my possible postulations is speed effects +surprise chance.
I know these are poorly built B teams, but that's not the point. The point is one team seems to consistently get more surprise and scouting instances than the other for no visible reason. I know my sample size was small, but have your noticed anything similiar to this in your own exploration? I'm very curious what you think. There are a lot of hidden bonuses and modifiers in this game and I am starting to wonder if some scouting and surprise modifiers are also hidden.
Right now I'm thinking what I am seeing is either the result of hidden modifiers or randomness in a small sample size, but the entire reason I did this little experiment was because I saw an unexplained bias in the surprise and scouting frequency to begin with. I would love to know what you think.
Things I will try and test in the future is if character speed might have an effect and resolve level. The Man at Arms and Antiquarian party were complete green horns vs the Bounty Hunter party which had more experienced level 1s and 2s although this obviously changed as they all leveled up over the course of the testing. That's actually what ended my experiment, the fact they leveled into medium tier. It's possible certain classes have hidden scouting bonuses. It's also possible this is all just luck which has not had time to even out over a larger data set.
I don't understand your negativity against marking abilities. Houndmaster and Bounty Hunter with Vvulf's Trophy are sooo good. My highest damage was a crit for 92 on the Collector with Bounty Hunter. :D
I'll be doing a response video at the end of the how good are series and attempt to explain that a bit better, you're not alone in finding my initial explanation a bit confusing.
For marks to work well it needs to be a very specific setup that is normally good, but sometimes not as good for boss fights that do better with bleed and blight ticks.
Thats exactly the point, ya dont NEED 92 dmg. You just need enough to kill the enemies you want dead. Marked is far too much setup for the same reward you can get with less setup. Take for example the arbalest, the dmg the arbalest can dish out compared to the PD in the backranks just makes me never really take arbalest anywhere. PD also has that double stun, so there's little to no reason to take the Arbalest over the PD. And thats just one example.
@@gabrielkerne9175 mark is a reliable kill on both the BH and the HM.....marks are often paired with protection/dodge debuff to make sure you get through...frankly not utilizing a mark ability when you have 2 mark guys in a team is a joke unless the target has multiple actions per round. Though the dodge debuff is less useful since its hard to hit on high dodge targets which is kind of funny. It dominates against size 2 targets since they will probably laugh at the BH or HM doing their attacks separately instead of one using their mark and the other laying some real dmg on them as well probably 2 other attacks from your dudes on him with the debuff that comes with the mark which you aren't taking into account. It actually makes a massive difference in the weald(high dodge/prot) which is one of the hardest dungeons to deal with if you aren't properly marking with these types of squads. A lot of the champion dungeon monsters can get up to 50 prot the dmg dealers aren't dealing any real dmg without proper marking. Frankly if you are playing these characters without their marks together Its simply less effective.
I think we can all agree that at least someone on the dev team really loves dogs. Missed opportunity for a Cat Tamer, who goes around with a panther or tiger.
That is because any dog under 25 lbs is a cat, and cats are useless
Jay Blodget ??? Have you ever seen a lawman with a super well trained cat of any kind? No you haven't. They want the characters to have good flavor, just because they added a dog in the game for a character that makes sense to have a dog doesn't mean they are biased towards dogs.
If they do, they should make sure that you can't have one on the same team as a Houndmaster. :)
Yes, and at the same patch they can add a warrior princess and a Sailor moon... Are you serious or can't you see how hard a flowery high fantasy design would go against the intent of the game?
A good idea for a new class in the future, maybe?
This games mechanics are so refreshing i can't get over it
Hp info is outdated. He has recieved a huge hp nerf bringing his hp down to 37 at lvl5 armor which is only 2 more than Jesters. Kinda funny he is not informed about this. I am also not sure when was his hp 49 at any point ? Unless i am missing a huge thing because it was 46 before the nerf and it is 37 now at lvl 5.
Just found your channel have to say these vids are class really helpful game been kicking me ass on the highest levels.
Thanks!
Mark parties are actually one of my favourite party comps just because of how fun they are. I usually run bounty hunter houndmaster occultist and graverobber
Hey guys its me coming with another comment. Before we look at the quality of this video, lets get the usual stuff out of the way: This comment is written expecting that you read the comments on the highest difficulty level. But no worries, most of the heavy stuff you read in this, will also be applicable to the easier viewer contributions. Ok, now let's settle this question: Is this video good?
Yes.
This comment was completely unhelpful because you forgot to remind me that most comment threads have two stages, the fight where you clear out high priority targets (trolls, flamers, ect) , and the recovery phase where you check your grammar and spelling, apologize for offending anyone, and upvote yourself.
With that out of the way, it was a pretty good comment.
Lundah I love this channels memes
YES! Houndmaster rules all. Bout time he likes one I like too.
Wait, but the things you said about Marks were wrong. You said that Mark was its own roll (which it isn't) and that marking a target isn't cost effective bc only one character benefits from it, which doesn't have to be the case. This is especially relevant with the Houndmaster because he can be your stress healer. Having either HM or your damage dealer carry a mark means that BOTH characters benefit from the increased damage.
Mark always lands if the attack itself lands.
I think he was saying that about "-dodge" or "-prot" part of the mark
the hit is a roll, and the debuff is a roll. And a mark without the debuff is kind of disappointing on most enemies, only worth it on bosses, and building around a mark for bosses isnt always the best strategy.
Yeah, but I think its worth mentioning that its a pretty great ability for bosses.
only good vs bosses with 1 move per round. (pig, necro, stupid cannon thing)
But yea with a mark team bursting down low protection bosses is super easy.
Against cannon its still the fastest way to kill it since its immune to everything anyway.
I love these videos, but I don't agree with your mark reasoning. Marks are best used when multiple characters can take advantage of the mark. For instance a bounty hunter would mark, then the target would be attacked by say the hounds rush and sniper shot. That is definitely worth it. Would love to hear your thoughts on this.
Occultists also make good markers as they are pretty fast, letting your Bounty Hunter and Houndmaster both reap the benefit should the speed roll be kind to you. Then again this is Darkest Dungeon so you can be screwed at the drop of a hat if the game decides, but that’s half the fun.
"You don't typically care about crits on stun moves..." what?? Crits up your stun chance by 20% that's huge!! You can argue it's not as big of a deal as on a damaging move, but it's still important.
Also, one thing I like about bleeds and DOTs in general is that they can give you an extra turn to recover. Like if you nearly kill a medium speed frontliner that already had its turn at the end of a fight, the rest of your party gets extra heals off next turn before the bleed kills the final enemy.
He didn't say it here but hes gone over that many many times. A 1 point bleed is unlikely to to be the cause of the extra turn to recover because its so small.
Also you don't build a houndmaster for crit or most stunners but specifically filthy doesnt go for crits he goes for consistency. If you want something to stun you build for stun, if you want something to crit you build for crit, not both.
Hound's Harry is pretty good against The Flesh what with the numerous targets sharing one health bar. With the treat, the repeated use very quickly stacks up a lot of damage and bleed.
...but that's about the only use I can really justify it for.
As I go through your videos, I’m thinking marks would have been better if they were more of an effect on another move, rather than just the mark and the debuff as almost a side thing. Like maybe a move which adds a dot, or stuns, or something to that effect. Even if it was mainly on characters that couldn’t really take advantage of it to encourage party combinations.
Wow, didn't know until this video that you can't get surprised in a fight you scouted
Best analysis on the market for DArkest Dungeon ...this guy is nailing it
0:42 to skip the disclaimer
You've thought the heart of darkness was a DD god? No fucking way. Behold the true god of DD's world - The Houndmaster!
Occultist next please.
I really don't like that Guard Dog only lasts for one round. That dog needs more training. You can't guard your third spot and spend the next turn or two licking wounds while the squishy is guarded.
really liking this how good is xxx
just think you can maybe explain a bit more into each class itemization! sometimes you do that (like on grave robber) but sometimes you don`t even comment, lke here on the houndmaster
anyways kudos and keep making those =D
Filthy, when is the 'all characters, no stress healing' coming to youtube?
3:00
FilthyCapitalist
what skills do you prefer on the houndmaster? you said 6 out of his 7 are great, but since you can only have 4 active at a time, I'm really struggling to choose which one should I use which one I shouldnt
Pál Huruth position 2 runs blackjack and pos 3 houndmaster runs cry havoc. Hounds harry is the only one you generally don't want to run. You can generally pick and choose between target whistle or lick wounds depending on the situation.
Pál Huruth oh yeah, and hounds rush is kinda mandatory, and guard dog is good to have too, so a pos 2 I use is hounds harry, blackjack, guard dog and target whistle
You can run a pos 2 HM with Cry Havoc if you play him along someone with abilities to move forward (Grave Robber, Jester, Highwayman) or simply move pos 3 forward when their rank 3 and 4 are dead. This is my favorite HM as you have an attack that can damage any rank and DoTs, a stun, a group stress relief and the choice for guard, self heal, mark or aoe as last. He is so fucking versatile even after nerfs I think I would put him on tier 0, better than FL, Hel, PD, Ves, GR.
Fl/Hel - Hm - Ves - GR is one of my fav comps, really versatile as all of them can hit any rank, good damage, stuns, survivability, they can do anything (though PD and CR farm ruins and cove really easily so I recommend those characters for those 2 locations).
Oh and his camping abilities are just the nuts as well, stress heals, prevent ambush, scout, just all around awesome.
thanks a lot man
i dont like complaining about rolls like , thats what trinkets etc are for to make those rolls in your favor.
Awesome guide, commenting for the algorithm
What ya sippin on Filthy (10:45)??
In my opinion, Marks should be usable 1/battle but always hit. So give them like 500% debuff percent chance but only allow one enemy to be targeted.
'Why not bring a hound?'
Because if you don't, you don't have to go through the guilt when it dies.
1:40 ... so, He has every skill above average (except damage, but he can boost it with dog-treats, marks and DOT) AND he can do EVERYTHING you need in the game ... ok. maybe i go a team with several houndmasters :P
4 doggos is a very fun way to play, especially in the Warrens.
RIP Arbalest stress healing
occultist i think is a good combo with houndmaster cause when you don't heal and have some beefy enemies occultist can just mark someone making houndmaster essential in weald (for me)
Occultist is the best character to have on marking duty in a mark party because he doesn't sacrifice damage that benefits from marks in order _to_ mark, but the HM has the best mark statistically. HM has a protection debuff which is usually more valuable than a dodge debuff, and of the available protection debuffs it's the both the biggest and least likely to be resisted.
Leper is still better kappa
They realy need to rework the leper...in his current state he is useless...
I like how somehow the heal is good on the hound, yet the lepers heal is a straight upgrade but considered useless
coldeed , hound master can guard, so you can rotate guard + heals
@@coldeed the heal itself isnt useless, its the lack of options Leper has. Its too focused on front line damage, but then has low accuracy . They should give it either more accuracy to satisfy that role or rework a couple of its skills to let it have more flexibility. For example, a stun to backline or mayne even tie stuns into crits, something to add more "oomph".
Leper is strong enough early on, but as resolve level goes up it becomes much, much weaker. By champion levels, Leper is weak and NG+ is useless.
so houndmaster is confirmed Filthy's favourite character, well rather its the best one in his opinion :D
What about a mark against a size two mop enemy. I mean an enemy that takes up two spaces. Like the crabs from the cove and that tree branch smackdown dude. U see more of those in the higher levels and a mark can make short work of him. I removed marks from my play style but found that the houndmasters mark is useful in those situations. I optimize for speed dmg and crit except houndmaster who I focus on dodge tanking. I usually put put his mark on a hellion and as well have my flagellent mark himself after round one. Usually the back ranks are dead by then. And helli N has stunned the first two rows. But if I come across a size two enemy specifically ones with prot I can mark them. I see that as efficient
I put guard not mark on the hellion
Do the occultist next please. Love the vids btw
What 3 quirks would you suggest?
0:41 Okay you owe me 40 seconds of your life :D No problem guys no problem !
Thanks for the great content! Every evening there is a new class analysis waiting for me.
So far Filithy's dream lineup seems to be X-X-Hound-Hellion
Probably has a Vestal somewhere in there, he stated that the AOE heal makes her pretty strong, especially helping battle death's door.
HM's actually used to be quite a bit stronger when their bleeds were more prevalent, I believe Hound's Harry used to stack up to 4 Dmg per round which was a little broken, especially if you brought two HM's, totally ripped apart The Flesh- Bleeds are much weaker now making him an amicable damage dealer with great versitility
i do have to say that while the hounds harry is only a 1 damage bleed, bleeds stack in this game, and every time you use hounds harry you're applying a (keep in mind it's 120% bleed chance, pretty hugeimo) 4 points of damage to the entire enemy party, not a lot on its own, but stacking on the jesters harvest, the plaguemasters ability to apply blight AND stack more bleeds, AND applying the hellions bleed, that shit is a boss killer, and bleed/blight is really reliable for taking out all of the respawnable minions at relatively the same time.
also this synergizes well with the bounty hunter and arbelist, mark the backline with bounty hunter, then you wipe it out with hounds rush and sniper shot, i know you're missing an opportunity to deal damage, but if the enemy backline is wiped out in one turn then you can immediately move on to recovery phase by repeatedly stunning the front line. Idk, maybe its me, but playing this game for the first time and losing some really favorite characters of mine, i've had to come up with interesting ways to shred down bosses (that first time I went after the hound prince and unwittingly one shot the little pig, dooming my entire party to stunlock until death)
I love this game, but it freaking hates me
Love your guides, man! Looking froward to Occultist analysis, keep going!
I've run quad HM before and I honestly would do it again. Insanely versatile character.
And now the jester's turn, easy to judge...?
I suddenly feel like I'm playing the game wrong.
Great video but one question , what difficulty modes does this apply to?
I have had bad experiences with houndmaster...
Hound's Rush allready got nerfed, iirc.
You didn't rank him in your tiers
Hey guys filthy robot here
one of the few overpowered characters in DD
Turn out he's preeetty good
Turns out he's preeeeeettttyy good
Honestly I never use houndmaster because I don't want the doggo to die:(
If you choose to sacrifice him in the final boss fight, he says something on the lines of "Steady now, if we are called, we answer" and the dog howls. That's just heartbreaking
Never itemize for bleed
(Enter Flesh stage right)
Give me my bleed guys!
Also, Houndmaster probably is the best for mincing the Flesh with Hound’s Harry (Maybe mix with a DoT trinket to further cheese?)
Applicable
Maybe it's just me but the dog misses lots of attacks, maybe the same as the leper.
It's just you, but I can guess as to why that is. Because of his lower damage and range, I find the Houndmaster is pretty dang good at striking the back-line for a quick kill. Problem is that's where the dodgy enemies are, so if you're primarily attacking them with the Houndmaster it's not a surprise that he seems inaccurate
Maybe your char have some debuff on it when you miss, or some diseases or negative quirks that give you less acc.
How good are mod characters!
MARK PARTIES ARE STILL THE SHIT
Makes fight 5 v 4 cuz of doggo
Is potat
Does anyone know why the skill cry havoc seems to be unusable? The skill is chosen but it's always greyed our in combat for me, I have no clue why and I have tried everything to change it so I can use it in combat.
Typical Jack-of-all/master of none
c.3:00 "I don't like Marx in general." Pff. Typical uninformed rhetoric. Name three theses in Das Kapital
OP
No lover for Hound's Harry = no love for this video!
Maxed out Harry inflicting 3 bleed on every target really does good work.
Lick Wounds, on the other hand, is trash. Very easy to swap Harry in for it.
I dont like Marx as well.
I know that these were all recorded at the same time, but I'm still disliking every video without an annotation where you mislead people about marks
7:50 incorrect. the antiquarian also has guard
he mentions that she has a reverse guard like 2 seconds later
H I D O G G I E !
Lel and i thought Houndmaster is the worst class xD Nvm but in my opinion there are better classes for the jobs the Houndmaster wants to fit
Stress Healing: Hmm i guess the jester is a bit better cause he ALWAYS heals the stress and you can choose who you want to heal
DD: In my opinion he is ok in DD but The Grave Robber or Bountyx Hunter are more usefull to deal dmg. Also the Highwayman. Arbalest is also strong but only if you apply the mark first. But if you do she wil crit the shit out of thes f***ers
Tanking: Well i guess the man at arms is the better way cause if he shields someone he gets a Def Bonus which is in my opinion more meaningfull as a Dodgebonus.
Every raid i made with the Houndmaster he kinda entrusted me. Dmg was ok but not high, he often gets hitten and the bleeding is nice to have but applies quit to less to be strong. My all time Favourite grp is: Abomination with Transformskill on rank 1, Hellion or Man at Arms rank 2, Occultist Rank 3 and jester rank 4. I like the debuffs and the huge amount of heal from the occultist the jester has decent buffs an Stresshealing for the Transformation. Abomination has lots of dmg and can heal himself if its needed and man at arms. Well he is just tanky af and can shield others. But o prefer hellion cause of the huge amount of Dmg she deals :)
Anyway thx for the video! I will try the Houndmaster more often maybe he isnt that bad i thought first^^
Ausitm
When your tips apply for all levels, why do you point it out every time?
Andi Keucher to stop people saying 'oh but this and that works, why didn't you mention that?' Etc, if said 'this and that' is only applicable at easier levels
So you can spam all of them with inane comments? He even pointed out at the start of the vid WHY he says it each time, but I guess you were unable to understand something even as basic as that.
it works from the highest level down is what he tries to say.
lol
12:44 because I personally hate dogs :D in general. So my dog will be the Crusader or Jester xD
Was a useful video
He's my bread and butter tbh, i raped the new knockoff wendigo bling blig boi by chain stunning and aquarian pokes.