🧰 10mm Smith and Wesson problems FIXED 🔧 | VIEWERS solve 2 out of 3 4" & 4.6" M&P 2.0 issues 👨🔧
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- Опубликовано: 6 сен 2024
- Thanks to Chukes and my dogged, brilliantly astute viewers, (credits at the end!) a fix is in for the nagging Smith and Wesson 10mm issues with failure to feeds and light primer strikes. Maybe YOU can comment and help out with just what is causing the inadvertent magazine drop issues...
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Развлечения
S&W did something. I sent mine in and got it back running flawless. They said the same thing as others. Polished feed ramp/chamber. There’s no way that’s all they did. I didn’t realize if it’s heavier or not as I run the Wolffe 20# spring before. Shot 150 Ammo Inc 180 with the stock RSA and alternated between the stock mag that was sent in with the gun and one with a Wolffe spring. It seems to be perfect now thank god.
Great to hear! I find it very interesting that it seems they aren’t admitting they’re doing anything other than polishing feed ramp and chamber…very interesting. You’d think at this point this would perhaps rise to the level of a recall being issued? Glad it’s running for you though!🎉🎊
Update
Got 2 springer precision 11 coil mag springs and there’s a huge difference between springer and Wolffe. The Wolffe is literally the same as the stock spring. Higher quality I’m sure but not any stiffer it seems which may be why it didn’t fix anything prior to warranty. The springers are noticeably stiffer. A bit harder to load but not bad. The spring is also noticeably longer. The Wolffe is shorter than stock and springer is longer than stock. I’d highly recommend the springer over Wolffe as of now. The Wolffe is specifically for 45 though so maybe they’ll make a dedicated 10mm version.
@@Berserkable Great info, thanks for updating, going to pin this post thread 👍🏽
@@Berserkable Are you talking about the Recoil Spring or the Magazine spring,Thanks. you are saying coil Mag Spring in your Statement.
Such a pain that the gun has to come out of the box with issue. Cmon Smith.
These manufacturers would be wise to put more effort into their quality control. You're literally doing the work for them... they owe you a check bro!✊🏾
While I certainly appreciate the kind words I’m merely passing on the hard work that viewers have put into testing. Appreciate you guys!👏
Agreed. They should’ve have caught this before releasing it. Annoying that one has to acquire a bunch of aftermarket parts to get it to work.
@@unitedwestanddividedwefall3521 it seems like all the new guns (especially 10mm) are having issues that should've been obvious in basic testing during r&d, then the companies do nothing to fix it. Especially Sig Sauer
@@petersquatch wow. I went and ordered a heavier spring for mine, while awaited for clearance. Tested the factory spring for about 40 rounds. No issue switched to the 22lbs spring and wow made it a lot smoother. Still haven’t tried full power 10mm loads. Yet will when I get more.
@@unitedwestanddividedwefall3521 I have. And it broke my pistol. Now I'm going through HELL to get them to replace the broken/faulty pistol that's literally chewing up triggers.
Bought the 5.6" performance center 4 weeks ago 350 through it so far and not a single issue. Ran a mix of 180gr and 200gr ammo. Happy as a kid in a candy store. Added wolf springs just for the hell of it.
I HAD an MP 10mm 4.6. I could not get through a magazine of any ammo without feeding problems. Rounds were constantly getting stuck when chambering. I tried numerous types of ammo. Even worse, Underwood 200gr would cause the magazine to fall out every shot. I called S&W. They refused to acknowledge that these are common problems and would not comment as to wether they can be fixed. The customer service rep. Was unbelievably rude, cutting me off, talking over and even shouting at me. This began during the initial conversation during which I was nothing but polite. All I was told was to send the gun in and that any kind of refund was not possible. The turnaround time for a S&W gunsmith to inspect it was 6 weeks. I bought this POS for bear protection during bow season and a 6 week turn around was not acceptable. I ended up trading the gun in on a G20 and lost $300 doing so. The only good news is the Glock functions flawlessly with any kind of ammo. I hate that I am wasting time to post something like this, but I feel that it is my only recourse and I hope that others avoid S&W products after reading it.
I don't think it is wasting your time, in fact I think a lot of potential consumers are reading this comment thread. Appreciate you taking the time to inform us of your experience sir.
@@LWRoadabsolutely
Wow. And I was thinking of giving this smith a try. May just go with a Springfield xdm elite. Sucks. I have a MCK for my other M&P
@United we stand divided we fall Just fyi but palmetto has the 4.5 xdm elite gear up package for a good deal . Also they don't tell you this in the description but it comes with a free code for a optic plate of your choosing .
@@rickyricardo3551 yea I’ve seen that one. With the OD green color scheme. I love it. I have a Xdm elite osp in 9 very impressed
I can also attest to the Springer 11 coil spring fixing my 4” feeding issue. It ran like a champ. Even the 220g Underwood fed flawlessly. It now operates like it should.
So the magazine spring completely fixed any issues?
In your last letter Smith and Wesson sent it back with a heavier recoil spring not magazine. I changed my rod and spring to Wolff 22 pounds and shot the Underwood 220 cast, 200 cast, 140 grain penetrator, and 155 grain Hollow. No issues.
Great work! Thanks for sharing your experiences. Hope S&W will recognize this and fix it, most of us are buying 10mm for bear protection or self defense and there’s no point in buying a 10mm if we can’t rely on it. Hope the fix the issue from factory quick.
This is excerpted from a post I posted on another forum a few days back regarding the magazine dropping out in my M&P 10mm 4.6".
I have an M&P 10mm 4.6" pistol that was built on 2/9/2022, that I bought new in mid February 2022.
Mine has worked flawlessly with Underwood 155 grain JHP, 180 grain JHP, and S&B 180 grain JHP.
I love this pistol!
Then yesterday for the FIRST time (10/13/2022) I tested a full magazine of Doubletap 200 grain hard cast rounds.
These rounds are flat tipped and very wide at the tip.
After firing no more than two rounds, the magazine fell out and it stovepiped.
And it continued repeatedly jamming or failing to chamber a round at all with the magazine falling out.
I finally gave up trying to finish the magazine.
After I got home, I took three magazines and partially loaded them with Doubletap 200 grain Hard Cast, another with Underwood 180 grain JHP, and a third one with Underwood 155 grain JHP.
When I pushed the rounds down in the magazine that had the Doubletap 200 grain hard cast rounds, I noticed that as they passed the notch in the magazine that the magazine release holds the magazine, that the wide front end of the hard cast bullet came clear out to the edge of the notch hole.
This would push the magazine release tab that holds the magazine in the pistol out of the hole, THUS releasing the magazine.
When I did this same thing with the 180 and 155 grain JHP rounds that taper more quickly down to a smaller bullet tip, there was more space left between the bullet and the magazine notch opening when the bullet passed the opening.
THUS leaving more room for the catch to keep holding onto the magazine.
So I believe IN MY CASE that wide enough flat ended bullets caused the magazine to be released as the pistol is fired.
your comment should be pinned.
Mine hasn't drop a mag, but I don't use any hard cast.
Thanks for the update, very much appreciated. Here’s what I don’t understand: how is it Smith and Wesson, one of the nation’s oldest and most respected firearms manufacturers, released this model that ended up having so many problems? I know they have engineering, quality assurance, and testing/evaluations on any new model of gun they manufacture. How in the hell did they let this slip through the cracks?!!!!
My guess, mind you just a guess, is that the springs were sourced from a outside supplier. I don't remember where I read or watched it, it might have actually been Springer Precision where they talked about the variances in spring lb. weights. Unless you purchase from a reputable source that makes and tests their own springs, just because you buy a say 13 lb. spring doesn't mean that it is 13 lb. It could be 11 lbs. or 15 lbs or even a greater variance. And in this particular case it sounds like the metal is an inferior batch and settling up to an inch after 100 or so rounds. All Smith can do is correct it and move on...my .02 and best guess.
Well they did do that deal with the clintons, karmas a bitch
I've worked at an assembly plant for 11 years and have seen many issues slip through the cracks. Typically, there isn't a specific quality check in place until they find out that a specific quality check is needed. While it may appear obvious after the fact, it's not always before the fact. If there was never an issue with mag springs, it's reasonable to believe that one wasn't needed. Not excusing S&W, but it's not uncommon for issues to appear in full production that don't appear in R&D or T&E because they're production issues.
@@kevinherring9359 every spring should be checked. Mag spring, recoil spring, striker spring, mag release spring. It would only increase firearm cost by like a dollar. A worker can't do those four in one minute, pre assembly? Every warranty claim costs a minimum thirty dollars to the company. This is just bad management.
I suspect manufacturing quality in general since "the pandemic" has taken a turn for the worse.
I went to my local outdoor range today here in southern Arizona, it was a balmy 113 degrees, "humid" (for AZ), and windy, kind of like standing in front of a hair blow dryer. I ran 214 rounds of 10mm ammo, including several new types of ammunition, through my S&W M&P 10mm M2.0 4.6" pistol, using my Wolff Gunsprings steel guide rod and uncaptured 24-pound recoil spring.
1. 50 rounds - Sellier & Bellot (S&B - 180 Gr FMJ, 1164 FPS / 541 FtLBs of muzzle energy)
2. 50 rounds - Magtech (180 Gr FMJ, 1230 FPS / 605 FtLBs ME)
3. 50 rounds - Steinel Ammunition Co. (180 Gr FMJ, 1260 FPS / 634 FtLBs ME)
4. 4 rounds - Underwood (200 Gr HCL FN Hi-Tek Coated, 1250 FPS / 694 FtLBs ME)
5. 20 rounds - Underwood (220 Gr HCL FN Black Cherry Coated, 1200 FPS / 704 FtLBs ME)
6. 20 rounds - Underwood (140 Gr Xtreme Penetrator, 1500 FPS / 700 FtLBs ME)
7. 20 rounds - Underwood (180 Gr eXtreme Terminal Performance [XTP], 1300 FPS / 676 FtLBs ME)
In sum, my M&P ran flawlessly. I had no issues whatsoever while shooting today. This brings me to a new grand total of 750 10mm rounds downrange with only one malfunction of any kind, a FTF, in the early stages of my first shooting session with this new pistol. So this pistol has now been 99.867% reliable for me, which is vastly more reliable than my old Gen3 Glock 20SF was.
Of note - Underwood ammo is very satisfying to shoot, fast / powerful, accurate, clean. They are my go-to brand in both 10mm and 9mm.
Something else to report. I'm disappointed with the quality of my recent Wolff Gunsprings purchases:
1. I purchased a three-pack of Wolff +10% Extra Power magazine springs for the M&P 45 ACP standard 10-round magazine (same as the 15-round 10mm mags, except for the feed lips and followers). My stock OEM magazine springs are noticeably stronger than the "upgraded" Wolff +10% XP springs, which I've returned to Wolff for a full refund, including S&H.
2. When I got home today, after I'd cleaned my pistol, I noticed that when riding the slide it wouldn't go all the way back into battery with the muzzle pointing up. When I leveled off the barrel, it went slowly back into battery. This is a new development, as it functioned perfectly when I first installed it last month, and after my last shooting session a couple of weeks ago. I put the under-sprung stock OEM guide rod & captured recoil spring assembly back in my pistol and repeated this same exercise, the result was my slide consistently went fully back into battery. When fully racking the slide, it's clear that this 24-pound Wolff spring is much more stout than the stock OEM spring, yet now the Wolff spring won't fully return my slide into battery when ridden. Thus far I've not had any light primer strikes.
I've used Wolff springs in my Glock mags and SIG slides and mags as replacements for years, with never an issue, until now with my M&P 10mm.
Has everyone's QC gone down the toilet since COVID?
I had the same issue when I put the DPM systems recoil spring in my 29, it wouldn't return fully to battery either. I also didn't like having to switch springs to run full power and then to run range ammo.
I also had the same issue, my choice of dealing with it was to replace the recoil spring with a DPM recoil spring and new magazine springs. My 4" 10mm gun is runnimg smooth.
For anybody interested, I have the 4 inch model and it was plagued with issues (usual suspects, ftf ,light primer strikes, mag drops) . I have for the most part solved these issues. For the mag drops I switched the mag release to the left side and problem fixed( seems the release does not fit properly on the right side,doesn't seat all the way when a full mag is inserted) ...for the ftf issues I found a 22lb guide rod and spring assembly from galloway precision and now the firearm runs flawlessly, even seems to somehow fixed the light primer strikes. Maybe the stock spring was to weak to put the slide into battery every time?? Anyway, thought I'd pass this along to hopefully help someone out that is having issues themselves.
All semiautomatic pistols have a sweet spot that they operate in in relation to recoil and magazine spring tension. Some designs have broader parameters than others. I had a Kahr Pm40 that went back twice without resolution of its misfeed issue. The rounds would frequently nosedive into the feed ramp. Turned out they were under so much pressure from the mag spring, they were not being released as they should have been. Incrementally took off a total of 1.5 turns with resolution of the problem.
I got the 20lb wolff spring and extra power mag spring from springer precision and so far my 4.6 runs literally everything ive tried so far. Im about 550 rounds in without a malfuction. Ive run all kinds of hot underwood down to blazer brass fmj (which is loaded to 40 cal specs) and so far so good.
Got my M&P about a month ago, 300 rounds reliable to the T so far. Anything from S&B FMJ to Underwood 200 gr HC. Hopefully nobody else has issues, easily the most comfortable of the 10’s to shoot in my experience.
Mine has been the same as well. And I've got around 300 rounds through it as well. Thanks for watching👍🏽
Sadly my new 2.0 Performance Center had many issues with FTF and FTE on 4 boxes of S&B and 2 boxes of Magtech 10mm now. both magazines have issues. Off to S&W it goes.
Great idea to combine everyone's findings. In my personal testing I would confirm that weak mag springs and weak RSA are both an issue, but the mag chassis geometry is another issue - the channeling ribs are too shallow and begin too late, allowing thick bullets to push out the mag catch, causing a mag drop (or a stoppage, if partial). This happens specifically with 200gr and 220gr hardcasts, and has nothing to do with their power or pressure, IMHO. This is not my discovery, I just also observed and experienced it. There are a couple of places online with detailed explanations and photos of this. This occurs between where the 5th and 6th rounds sit in the mag, so those who test by loading only 5 in the mag will not experience it. Mine is a sample of two 4.6", one with a dot, the other with stock open sights, and they both manifest this issue, even with stiffer springs. I run Springer Precision mag springs (SP0436), a Galloway captured 24lb. RSA in the dot-topped one, and a Springer 26lb. uncaptured spring and rod in the open sight version. This also makes the recoil more manageable and keeps the frame from unnecessary wear. And they both cycle range FMJ's just fine. My only contribution/workaround was to resort to hybrid/mixed mag loads - first load 10 rounds with regular shaped bullets, like FMJ, HP or Xtreme Penetrators, then top off with 5 hardcasts. +1 in the chamber. This has always run for me 100% of the time, over a few hundred rounds. Since my only purpose for this is potential grizzly defense, I figure I can trust it if loaded like that. I'll have 6 hardcasts to start with, like a revolver, and in the remote chance I can get more off, the XP's should also be adequate.
I also installed the Morrigan trigger shoes from Galloway and like them so far. Someone pointed out that the skeletonized "dingus" on the trigger is a potential issue - if a pine needle or enough lint get into it, it'll render the gun "permanently safe", and the operator - defenseless. But the stock trigger shoes work great on M&P40 2.0, which is mostly just a range gun for me.
That's very useful info!
I know next to nothing about hardcasts (not personally a believer in 60" of penetration), but if I were around grizzlies, I'd be using the Swift A-Frame 200gr and loading that to near max.
Federal has an offering, but it's pretty weak @ ~1050 fps...although the expansion is the same, regardless of how fast you push it. And penetration to ~21" (in synthetic)
But I'd want the velocity for bone.
They are wildly expensive.
@@ShastaBean FWIW, the issue purely has to do with shapes. Heavy hardcasts just happen to have that wide meplat, which just happens to be able to engage the mag catch in these specific magazines. Had they tested them, they would've quickly noticed and would've been in position to fix the mag, which would be EASY. Even if they sacrificed 1 round of capacity.
I am not any kind of expert on this, but as I understand, grizzlies are so heavily built, that penetration is the main feature needed. Anything capable of expansion might just get stuck in the fat layers or be stopped by bones. And these beasts have so much oxygen in their tissues that even being fatally shot in the heart can still continue inflicting damage before they collapse.
Your report and explanation are very informative. I lost confidence in my 4.6 in model very quickly and dumped it for the Springfield Armory XD-M Elite Compact 10mm pistol. I always polish the feed ramp and chamber of every new pistol that I purchase, and then do a periodic repolishing. So it was very apparent to me that a simple polishing by S&W would resolve my failure-to-feed issues, since it was already polished. If I can't trust a gun in a gunfight, it won't remain in my home. I also appreciated the testing that you did with the Sig Sauer P320 X-Ten. I am very happy with both my Springfield Armory and Sig Sauer pistols. As for Smith and Wesson, I love their revolvers and will continue to buy them, but no more pistols anytime soon.
Appreciate the informative post, I don’t blame you one bit, that’s a reasonable position. Thanks for watching sir
While I am new to your particular blog, I greatly appreciate the feedback regarding the M&P 10mm.
I have been considering the purchase of a 10mm for quite some time. The observations shared by M&P 10mm owners deliver great insight for those considering the purchase of this particular pistol.
Thanks again, my friend and I look forward to enjoying your other blogs.
Have a great week.
Mark, get a Springfield XDM Elite. Rear grip saftey only comes w 4 mags, Im pumping 220 HCFP UNDERWOODS through mine for bear stoppers & not a malfunction yet. Shoots natural point of aim too w/o using the sights. Something youll need in a bear attack cause you wont have time to aim. I can pull from my side leg holster & do 2 double taps in just slightly over a second & put all 4 into a 5 inch circle @ 15 yards no problem. More than enough to blow a charging bears brains out in the few seconds youll have before it hits you.
@@tristantimothy1004 bro you are not going to shoot a bear
Proven Arms in NC had 3 extra factory mags to me in a couple of days for under $100 with tax and shipping. The third magazine cut the price by maybe $7 per magazine and qualified the order for free shipping.
Basically, the 3rd magazine was free if you ordered 3 compared to ordering 2.
Nice, thanks for the info
LWRoad I have finally sent my slide and barrel from my tricked out M&P 2.0 10mm to Mag-Na-Port for quad porting and some other work. Mine is 4.625 inch in barrel length. Just keeping you posted as you expressed interest in my porting idea.
Very nice presentation. I will have options if I ever have any problems. And springs are the problem in magazines and on the guide rod when running any semi-auto. Aftermarket magazine button upgrades can be found too so options are out there. Cylinder and Slide is a gunsmith company that troubleshoots S&W semi automatic and revolvers and once they agree to work on them they will guarantee for Life their work. I have used them for all my S&W revolvers and love the gunsmiths at Cylinder and Slide.
Appreciate the tip, I have not heard of them, I will definitely look them up @JeffreyLocke
Thank you for for posting your findings, along with the various comments from viewers. Because of your and other's reviews, the first thing I did when I bought my M&P 10 a few months ago (Sep '23) was to immediately replace the factory mag springs with the Springer Precision extended springs. I can report that, with 420 rounds through the pistol now (yes I do keep count), including 2 boxes of S&B 180gr, 2+ boxes of AAC 180gr, 10 rounds each of the SIG Elite Performance 180gr and Federal Fusion 200gr (hey, that crap is expensive), and a variety of hand loads using Hornady XTPs in 155, 180, and 200 grain, 190gr Lehigh Defense flat nose solids (30 rounds), and some Badman Bullets 200gr hard cast lead (polymer coated - also 30 rounds so far), I have had 2 FTFs - both of which came with the coated hard cast bullets. Needless to say, I won't be carrying with those. Aside from those, the gun has run perfectly - and it hasn't been cleaned since right before the first range session (it did get a few add'l drops of oil around 280 rounds). I did also change out the recoil spring after approx. 280 rounds to the Wolf 22 lb. spring, but that was more about trying to tame the M&P's snappy recoil than anything to do with reliability. Oh, and I did just pick up a 3rd magazine for it, and will try running that with the factory spring the next time I go out. All in all though, I am very satisfied with the pistol. The accuracy isn't stellar, but it is acceptable, and maybe if I do clean it at some point that may even improve.
Great to hear, glad this video helped sir
I just both this gun today, 6.17.23. I watched a few videos and none of this was mentioned. I'm hoping by now the new mags and other issues have been upgraded. We'll see.
Update on my 4" version of the M&P 10mm. I replaced the Factory magazine springs with Springer Precision Extra Power 10mm magazine springs, loaded up my magazines and let them sit for 2 weeks. Fired 110 rounds of Magtech 180 grain FMJ at 1230 fps. Zero malfunctions, Flawless performance. I also two hand limp risted the first 52 rounds with NO issues at all. The only problem with the Springer Precision Extra Power 10mm magazine springs is the fact that they reduce magazine capacity from 15 to 13 rounds. These magazine springs are Gigantic, they absolutely Dwarf the Factory magazine springs. For what it's worth, that was my test and now I'm out of 10mm range ammo.
WARNING! Whenever you replace magazine springs ALWAYS wear Safety Glasses, this is a vary Dangerous task to do without Safety Glasses!
You sir should be rewarded heavily by S&W!
I'd just settle for pre-new releases to test!
Great to hear they fix the issue of 10mm Smith and Wesson, have a great week bro!
They're working on it! You have a great week too!
I contacted s&w about feeding issues after noticing a newer magazine had a longer and stronger magazine spring. I asked for two of the newer springs, they are on the way. I polished my chamber and feed ramp when i got it. I do that to all of my new semiautos.
Interesting, let us know how the new springs are when you receive them if you don't mind 👍🏽
Any update?
I've had my M&P 4.6 inch for about 2 months. I've put 1,000 rounds of my 180 gr handloads thru it with zero problems. I was getting 175 fps spread between rounds, a 24 pound Wolff recoil spring took care of that. Now I get 50 fps spread
Nice, good info, appreciate it
Thank you so much for the great video I have the 10 mm 4.6 inch Barrel also failure to feed problems also I'm going to send it right back it's a brand new gun this is what their quality control is horrible not good for Smith & Wesson thank you again for all the information
Helpful and appreciated as I’m about to buy the 4” version. I suppose it is possible that the mag release spring may be inadequate as well. In a 9mm it may be fine, but the increased recoil energy in the 10mm may be enough to momentarily overload spring tension.
S&W may have been trying to keep production costs down by using spring stock that worked well in other caliber autos. Or spring materials are simply inferior. There may be a subcontractor involved in this. All in all, it’s a black eye for S&W. Having to rebuild a new firearm so it functions is counterproductive for maker and consumer alike.
If we have to pay to make the M&P work we open the door to buying from another gunmaker. Other 10mm’s cost more but come less frustration and appear to be more reliable.
Very good video. Subbed.
Thanks for the information. I don't have a 10mm M&P but the only problem I ever had on my M&P was dropping the magazine every second or third round. I sent it in to warranty repair and have not had a problem since. This doesn't really apply to my situation but I always enjoy your videos. Have a great evening.
Appreciate the support @KeithTate. Did they give you any explanation as to what was causing the problem or what they did to remedy it?
@@LWRoad On the repair order completion form the issue says "Mag catch not working" and under performed service it says"Replaced Grip Body". All I know is it did the job and I haven't had a problem since I got it back.
I have a shield 9 mm 2.0 and I bought the newer Shield 9 mm plus. The magazine release is extended on the plus and while it makes it easier to drop the mag, it is a little bit extended. This only really became a problem when I was using a holster that was for the older shield. Everyone will tell you they are interchangeable but they are not. It kept popping out the magazines. I have also talked to people that were unaware that the magazine release was a bit more extended and they were catching it with their support thumb.
I just got my 10mm the other day. I have not had the chance to go to the range with it. Some of the info that you were saying in my opinion is like talking Chinese. Mag well spring and light primer strike. The primer strike I understand. Basically the firing pin hitting the primer. I am going to.fins some 10 mm rounds or put some 40 cal through it very soon.
Well I just bought a new m&p10mm without reading on them. I jave Jerard nothing but good about m&ps and the 2 I own have been flawless then after I bought the 10mm I did some reading and was terrified. I'm hopefully taking this pistol into grizzly County and need it to be reliable. We will find out tomorrow haha
I can't imagine that S&W wouldn't get on top of this quickly & seriously. Fading Toaster referenced his gun had a heavier recoil spring not the magazine spring I believe. Either way I am glad for his sake his gun is running reliably.
He did, I misread it. I'd like to get some more first person reports on warranty work and find out exactly what they are doing currently to solve the issues.
I just got the springer precision magazine springs in yesterday and I've also got wolff guide rod with the 20, 22, and 24 lb recoil spring. I'm going to start with the 20lb spring and new magazine springs and see if I have any problems after about 300 round test.
Are they’re any updates ? Are the new batches coming from S&W corrected or same
Mine had issues, one of the main reasons I've stuck with my glock 20 gen 4 tried and true for woods carry. Also my Springfield xdm elite 10mm 3.8 has been very reliable. Can't say the same about my smith
Yes, I’ve been thinking of getting an MP 10 but was hesitant due to the reports that I had been reading. Thanks for the information, now I feel comfortable buying one them. I have no problems getting replacement springs if Smith hasn’t already done it.
I just got 1 yesterday and the gun is a complete POS 7 malfunctions in 30 rounds right out the box and it's the brand new model in FDE so anything fixed would be on this model.
I just ordered two new mags from Guns Mag Warehouse and are due to ship this Friday so we will see if the magazines have been fixed because I to have been having issue's in my 4 inch 2.0 of the same exact nature with various ammo and I want to love this gun but it's not ready to actually be anything but a "Range Gun" at this point in time unless it starts being reliable. Thank You Sir for all the follow up information. I also will keep you posted as soon as I get my new magazines and go shoot a couple hundred rounds through it.
Thank you very much for all the information that you’ve been providing. Much appreciated!
Thank you! But I’ve got to throw it right back to you guys, I lean so much from your insight. It’s a group project at this point and that’s just the way I like it
@@LWRoad I totally agree but at this point it has to have a leader and you’re one of them.
I have the 4.6. I keep waiting for it to fail. Especially after watching all the videos of failures. I just completed a thousand rounds. 80% of that was the Hot Stuff mostly Underwood. I had a failure to feed on the first magazine. After that it's ran like the top. But I feel like it's just a matter of time. Keep us posted very interested thank you
Thank you, very awesome... I've got the S&W 10mm 4.6", haven't fired a shot yet but I've already ordered a Galloway Precision 22lb Guide Rod assembly and Springer Precision magazine springs... I hike in the forests of PA., lots of black bear, It's just not the place you'd want these sort of malfunctions.
Nope, 100% or nothing in the woods. Let me know how that works out for you if you don't mind
When S&W came out with the 10mm, I thought finally, we're going to get a reliable great shooting 10. I personally had to go through 3 different makes of pistols before the 4th one actually worked (Tanfoglio Witness Pro). Even it needed a recoil spring change to make it run perfectly. I was surprised by all the reported failures out there since I've been shooting the M&P series pistol for years. They have an impecable reputaion for reliability and I've run thousands of rounds through mine without a single hiccup. Come on Smith and Wesson. Please stand up and do the right thing here. Own the issue an correct it. You have the engineers and materials to do this thing the right way. Be an industry leader instead of pulling a 'just polish the feed ramp cover up'.
I think the newer M&P 10s are coming with stronger mag springs. They're even hard to top off at first.
I've ran my 4in through 16+ different rounds ranging from 170g to 230g , hollows , hunting , everything Buffalo Bore , monolithic.... if you could get it in Anchorage over the last 30 years I have some . 10mm is a picky round do to it's flat face and I needed to make sure this thing was reliable.
Anyways I haven't had even one issue and now that I finally found a appendix carry holster it's now my everyday . Just wish they'd come out with some damn sights to fit this thing.
Reading some of the comments saying Smith & Wesson just polished the ramp and let it Go. in my opinion makes total sense with the 10mm round
When did you purchase yours? Is it one of the early release models (Dec 2021) or much later on
I have the 4, the 4.6, and the PC.
The 4 and 4.6 are flawless; downright Glockish. The PC has been uncooperative with all ammunition.
Will try Wolff springs and see if that remedies the issue.
It sounds reasonable that the slide speed is simply too fast on the PC for the magazines.
I would hesitate to say (at least in my case) that the recoil spring is an issue; every 10 load I've used except 200s and 220s feel like 115gr 9mm. Even the 200s and 220s feel like duty 40 ammo.
Im glad I dodged this problem. I have had a G20 since they was released back in 1995. I bought a Gen4 when I couldnt get a G40 then a Gen3 G29 (because of CHEAP cost) THEN a Gen4 G20 became available.
Ordered and WAITED for ever for a CONN Compliant S&W when I learned of issues and cancelled. Learned of Sig and waited. Now Im waiting more cause the FN is attractive but dont want a first gen anything today.
Smart, 1st gen is beta gen
Just brought home a gen 2 10mm 4.6 couple hundred rounds without issue. Nice to know about the springs. Thanks for the video
I own the 4.6" model, I just got back from the range after I installed the heavy duty springer precision mag springs and the wolff 22lb recoil spring and guide rod......the results.....I shot 3 full magazines of 180 gr fmj brass blazer and had 5 failure to feeds.......I loaded 1 magazine with 200 gr hard cast underwood.....shot 3 times and had 2 mag drops and called it quits ..needless to say I will be getting rid of this firearm......it feels great and is great looking but just doesn't function how it should
How did it run before the modifications?
@LWRoad pretty much the exact same....it's a bummer
Having the same issue M&P 2.0 10mm particularly with a fully loaded mag feeding the first round. Thanks for the info. New springs are on the way.
Same issues as most, I have a 4.6” for several months now that runs the round i to the top of the chamber and FTF at random right out of the box. Changed out mag spring, with and without extending the magazine to 18 rounds with and without the extra power springs. FTF continued at random. Added Galloway 20# 22# and 24# springs to the mix and the pistol continues to fail at random regardless of spring combinations. S&B, Hornady, sig, Underwood, Magtech, CCI, Federal, etc. ammo tried. 135 grain hp, 180 grain hp, 140 extreme hunters, 165 grain hp, etc, etc. it makes no difference…. It feels great, it’s plenty accurate, but ill never trust it. Half tempted to buy a newer one to compare.
👍👍 Thank you for all the info
Thanks for watching @ChrisFromThe740!
@@LWRoad I 2nd that, truly much appreciated info! Headed to the range tomorrow with my 4" 2.0 10mm, just loaded my 2 mags(1 with 220gr hard cast & the other with 200gr XTP) to see IF i have feeding issues.
Results?
@@free_range_jeeper9899 My results are posted below.
I want a 10mm, but in shopping around, seems many have issues. I can't feel good about buying a new pistol only to order parts to make it reliable. Isn't that what the manufacture is suppose to do before putting it on the market ? Guess I'll wait on the 3.0 :) Great information, thank you
I bought the S&W 2.0 10mm yesterday. springs are cheap
I just got my brand new M&P 10 mm when I first saw the gun at the gun shop I asked the counter guy how many rounds it held. He pulled the mag and told me 10! I thought damn they could only fit 10 in there? But I liked the way it felt in my hand so I came back the next day and bought it! I had a different counter guy this day, and I was shooting the shit with him and said all the reviews I watched said it was a 15 round gun and didn’t know if maybe this was some California mag or something? We looked at the mag and it said 45 on it! He went into some explaining that it’s probably the same mag so he grabbed a box of 10mm ammunition and we got 15 in it! Looked at the other mag it said 10mm and actually had 15 windows on it. I got it home and loaded both mags and i instantly noticed the angle the rounds we’re sitting at were different. Sure as shit the 45 mag would fail to feed. Called Smith and Wesson and they didn’t seem to believe me but said we will send a new mag! Got the new mag and it is insanely harder to load completely! The new mag feeds fine the old one doesn’t! All that to say yes they have a mag problem! Only other problem I’ve heard of is optics flying off (screws snapping off) don’t have an optic on it yet but just ordered one so we will see. Anyone else get mix matched mags?
I've had the same feed issue from brand new! Only with a certain brand ammo. Upgraded recoil spring to verify fix! Imo..... not the magazine spring but the recoil spring
According to the e-mail Fading Toaster said he received a stronger recoil spring, not magazine springs
I misread it, probably a good idea to install the stronger mag springs and the stronger recoil spring is what I'm thinking
Got my Galloway recoil spring 22lbs, springer precision mag springs. Hoping I don't need them but small price for an easy fix.
FYI I run a springer precision +3 extension with their 13 coil spring it is flawless just have to file down that nub at the base of the mag 4.6 inch version here
Nice, yeah I have a number of Springer Precision products for my competition setup, excellent quality
I definitely had this problem with my 4.6 with the heavier loads.
The mag drop is ftom too light of a spring. The slide hits the back to hard and flexes the grip. I think it's 17 lbs. I swapped mine for a glock 17, 22 lb spring and haven't had an issue since. 20 LB might work too
Thanks for the great vid. It seems to me that the mag spring would be the weak spot in cycling. Maybe swap the mag drop spring for the magazine spring? lol. I wish. It does seem on mine that the mag drop spring is quite strong compared to my other semi-auto. However, the mag drop button is where I would look. It seems to be as sensitive as a snowflake. While I haven't had a mag drop, I did at some point make mental note to stay off the mag drop button. The other thing I have heard is, it wants to be wet with lube at all times. I buy the 8oz CLP liquid, from break free. I have rehabed salty boat snaps, and on/offf switches with that stuff! It ain't cheap, but well worth it. All my tools love it!
i really wanted this gun but with the issues I will pass. thanks for the honest review
4.6 has fewer issues, I'd still wait until 2023 and revisit it
@@LWRoadstill issues you think ? I'm about to pull the trigger and get mine.
@@JuanHernandez-mo3ci You know as much as me, check out the most recent comments and go from there. All the best to whichever 10 you decide on
I had all the issues that you mention and I posted the videos on my channel, I ended up calling S&W and they told me to send it back but not to include the magazines just send the gun no mags. I sent the gun in and got it back 7 weeks later and it works awesome now and they said they just polished some stuff but considering it was nearly impossible to get the gun apart they did more than that. The recoil spring did feel heavier. The light primer strikes was caused due to the slide not going fully into battery which I caught on video, again video is on my site. Great video and good to know other people had the issues and it was not just me.
Not with the money you think ? Should I turn away immediately ? I mean I would love to own one 4" but ... Tell me what to do.
@@JuanHernandez-mo3ci Now that it's fixed I do like the gun, the feel is really nice and works great now. I would look at the Glock 20 which I really like and the Springfield XDM which is really nice too and both are cheaper than the S&W
I had to back up the intro to confirm that was Eklutna Lake from the Twin Peaks trail. I saw one of these at 3 bears the other day and it definitely caught my attention. That’s said given the issues I think I’ll come off a little more money and go with the new Sig P320 XTEN.
I've sent my 4.6" model back to S&W twice, yes you read that correctly, TWICE. The first time they polished the chamber and feed ramp. No improvement. Most recently they stated that they replaced the barrel. I've already tried the .45 ACP Wolff Guide Rod and 24lbs. spring with no luck. I also bought a third factory magazine with no luck either. I'm going to give the new magazine springs a try and after that I'm not sure what else I can do. I suppose I can call S&W again and send it back a third time? This is completely unacceptable.
Wow I may do a video on this, if you have any pictures and don’t mind I’d love to see them. Lwroadak@gmail.com
I’m about to chunk my 2.0 Compact in the sea. It started out FTF every 2-4 rds fired. I sent it to S&W and 7 weeks later received it back; they polished the feedramp and chamber. The FTF dropped to 2-4 times per magazine.
I replaced the extractor with one from Apex and swapped out mag springs with Wolff. (Also, I swapped the ridiculous trigger with an Apex flat face and installed factory standard height tritium sights). The gun now FTF 1-2 times per magazine. The only option left is to get a new barrel. I’d love to get a brushed stainless for it, but don’t know anyone making such aftermarket match 10mm barrels. Oh, the Galloway Precision 22lb RSA doesn’t seem to add much value, and I’m keeping to using the OEM RSA. I almost got a full mag to run through the gun, but had a FTF with only two rds in the mag.
Meanwhile, I picked up a XTEN Comp on Dec 10th, and from then to today (27th) fired 1,146 rds mostly through the comp, but some in the 2.0 Compact, my EDC XTEN, and FN510 to try it out. The XTEN Comp rocks! It’s my daytime EDC and my XTEN with TLR1-HL is my travel/night EDC.
BTW, reference the first Gen/batch of XTEN mags exhibiting known issues including mine, well, my first 9 magazines have been relegated to range use and run extremely well. I’m at about 5,500 rds fired just from my EDC XTEN (second one as my first had two FTF out of 700ish rds fired.) and new XTEN Comp without issues. In the lower 48, I have no need for bullet weights above 200, so I can’t verify if 220, 230 etc works or not.
Sorry to hear that, but glad your XTen Comp is running.
@@LWRoadThank you, and me too. Think I’m done editing my previous post, lol. The S&W is thinner and lighter, and IMHO, would make a nice carry piece if it ran well; something carried more than shot. Though it exhibits more recoil than any of my other 10mm pistols, it’s the nicest to carry.
You need the 24lb guide rod & spring. The wolf magazine springs aren't big enough. Get the 10mm magazine springs from Springer Precision or the 11 coil springs from Springer Precision also. Will fix everything.
I'd love to have one of these guns, but I'll be waiting until S&W corrects the problems down the road. In the meantime, I'll keep relying on my two XDm's. You shouldn't have to buy a new gun and then immediately begin replacing parts to make it work.
Thanks for the video, man! I just ordered 4 springs. I’ve been having magazine drops in my 10mm, and since I’m in WA with the mag ban, I didn’t want to send out the mags for repairs 😅 I might get 10-round mags back.
No worries, I hope they work out for you
@@LWRoad I installed the new spring, but now my mag only can take 14 rounds. Extremely difficult to load. Is there something else that needs to be done?
Stumbled on this video today. Bought a new S&W 10mm. Went straight to my range. Would not feed at all. Checked various things. Not feeding. Very disappointed.
Great info an help to our community, thank u all for your insight an experience
Thank you sir!
Glad I saw this. I’ve been looking at the 10mm at my local shop. I think I’m going to hold off a while
Wise move, wait another 6-8 months and see what shakes out👍🏽 Thanks for watching
People had the same issue with the XDM 10mm because they needed stronger recoil springs for hotter loads. It is not a magazine issue.
The new ones are doing good.
Usually takes around a year to iron things out, we're coming up on that now.
I got rid of both of mine. My 2 were the 2 most frustrating pistols I've ever had the displeasure of owning
Sorry to hear that
@LWRoad the 4.6" did get better after going back to smith for the 2nd time. The 4" was a total disaster with everything I fed it, from midrange ball to full bore buffalo bore stuff. Gotta say, the guns felt great and pointed very naturally, they just weren't reliable and the 4.6, in the end, would drop the mag by itself. I know what the problems are, guaranteed smith does as well, no idea why they won't come clean. If you've got a s&w 10mm mag handy, put it next to any other mainstream maker and caliber you like.. .the feed lips on the 10 are much shorter than any other caliber they chamber in their m&p line. Both my glock and springfield 10mm mags have more than 3/16" longer feed lips and the feed angle is shallower. Change the mags and the m&p 10mm will feed as well as any other model they offer. An m&p 9mm mag has longer feed lips! Why are they so afraid to control the 10mm round until it at leat begins to enter the chamber!
@@al01100 No idea, appreciate the detailed info update
@@al01100 great point. It's truly a shame that it's a great pistol, which has a sloppily designed magazine and weak springs, so easily remedied. I would add that the channeling ribs on the mag also need to begin compressing a little sooner. Wish a private business came out with aftermarket mags. S&W ought to reimburse you for all the ammo you wasted to do their job for them.
@languagesource355 their 10mm is a major disappointment and they seem unwilling to do anything about the engineering. I have a number of m&p's and they've been reliable, accurate, and they feel great in the hand, that's why the 10's are such a disappointment to me. Another major disappointment is their customer service! All they had on the work order was that they couldn't duplicate the malfunction and that they polished the feed ramp and chamber. The feed ramp and chamber had nothing to do with the problem and I know they replaced the recoil spring because it had red paint on it. They were deceptive and I can't stand that
I have The 9mm version works great
I experienced mag drop during my 50 rounds of my m&p 2.0 compact 10mm.
Absolutely fantastic video and extremely helpful. I have been planning on getting this S&W pistol to carry while hiking and camping in Western Wyoming and Montana but after listening to the reviews I think I may look into a Kimber. Misfeeds and magazine drops at the range are annoying as well as frustrating. In bear country they are deadly (for you). After watching this review I can’t imagine anyone carrying one of those S&W’s in bear country. Just saying.
One I have has fed rounds so far but went to clean and barrel has such tight tolerances it had to get tapped lightly with a wood dowel! WTHeck haven’t had time to contact s/w
In teresting , that's a new one to me huh
I’ve got a the 4” and had zero issues running blazer brass and aluminum cases 180gr round nose. Yesterday though I was shooting some S&B 180gr and finally had some feed issues. I’ve had a couple hundred rounds through it before this issues occurred
Good to know, how long ago had you acquired it?
@@LWRoad got it on release
Thank you for the info I need to look in to getting new springs for my m&p 10mm
Ordered 2 Springer 11 springs after watching this video, appears to have fixed my 4 inch.. no problems yet on the 4.6.. Thanks for your very informative video👍
Very glad to hear it sir
Anyone who bought a 5.6inch barrel pc version, the rsa is the same length as the 4.6 inch barrel version. I just changed mine to a 22ibs rsa, and the ftf problem seems to be resolved.
Thanks LW Road!! This is great to hear. Not sure this fixes lite primer strikes or the mag drop issue as you said.
Sounds like it has helped with light primer strikes, but I'd like to hear more feedback from viewers on that
A wild guess here: if they're sourcing their springs from the same company, isn't it possible they're getting the same sort of problems with more than one spring? Hypothetically if the spring company/division got hold of a bad batch of steel and used it to run off a large S&W order, it could be showing up in more than one place on the gun. Springs gradually losing their "springiness"?
I went with the XD elite 10 MM after all the smith problemsS
Same issue for me, 4 inch M&P 10mm, the mags were dropping out and jam after jam. Sent it back and it still jams. By far the worst pistol I have ever owned. Purchased for bear protection, so much for that.
hardcasts? If so, have you seen what some others have posted about those?
The only problem I have had is an occasional failure to feed the first round if I slingshot the slide. No problem when I use the slide release. No failures while firing the gun. I have recently produced example.
Good to hear I still have had no issues since the first mag with mine. The 4” apparently has been much more problematic. Thanks for watching sir
This was a very informative video, thanks.
Thank you sir, appreciate it, I do my best
Got mine back from S&W for nose up feed failure they 1 month turnaround and same issue with underwood 180 gr. Let them know, they sent me another RMA form... i requests more info on what was actually done the first time, and if they plan on doing anything different! I feel they will put their test ammo in their mag fire it and send it back. I dont think they really care.
Thanks for the update, it's crazy that this this has ongoing issues
Just got one in stock. Immediately had every single issue.
Co-worker thinks it's limp wristing, I'm going to try swapping springs in the magazines and also girpping it like a gay gorrilla at a bath house and see if that solves it
I'll also be taking a compressed cotton bit and some jewler's polish to the feed ramp and see if I can't smooth it up
It's not limp wristing, this gun has a few known, well documented issues (I've left links before, but I"m not sure if they get censored, if you search, you'll find the writeups, even with photos of the mag design flaw and explanations vs. other calibers of M&P). They are design flaws rather than production defects, and feed ramp is not one of them, there's nothing wrong with the feed ramp. Magazine springs are too weak and also have memory, so they become weaker. Springer precision has great springs. RSA is also way underpowered. I've tested 24lb. captured RSA from Galloway Precision and recently also the 26lb. non-captured rod and spring from Springer. They both work great on the spicy "bear" rounds and they still cycle the weak range ammo. I sort of figure a 24lb. RSA with an optic and 26lb. without an optic, although it's not scientific. And finally there's the issue of the magazine geometry. The "channeling ribs" (which compress the double stack into a single stack towards the feed ramp) begin too close to the mag catch holes, allowing bullets with a wide meplat (like those 200/220gr hardcast) to physically push out the mag catch, causing a mag drop. This being at 6th round and down in a fully loaded mag, so those who test with only loading 5 in a mag will never notice the issue. The only workaround I've found for this specific issue is to load 10 "any other" rounds (I've tested Underwood Xtreme Penetrators and various range rounds), then top off with 5 hardcasts, and even 1 in the pipe, and after testing this over several hundred rounds, I've had no issues. Mine is a 4.6". I like it, got it for a silly price, but not willing to give any free passes to S&W. They claim there's a "500 round break-in period" (or you could get another 10mm gun that costs $200 more, because that's the price of even just 500 FMJ's in 10mm). Mechanical problems have mechanical solutions, but S&W has a bigger problem - admitting to the issues.
The magazine is very loose in the mag well. Perhaps under recoil and when mag is pushing bullets upwards the mag catch is being upset causing mag drops. Pull your mag guts and slide to observe this yourself. I chose to do a couple things to the mags but probably the best was to add aluminum foil tape to one side of the mag and scotch tape to the other side. Result was mag catch isnt hanging into the interior of the mag to be it by some bullets and also the mag is not a sloppy mess but still drops free. Just plain irresponsible of S&W to release this. I also did 22 and 24 lb RS as well as Wolff mag springs. All had been good but not all that many rounds through the 3 in our family currently.
great news lw thanks for sharing this with us awsome sir
Just passing on what my amazing viewers have uncovered, appreciate you guys!👍🏽
Have had nothing but issues from my 4" MP10. Same as described in the video. Multiple FTF, FTE, Light strikes. Only one mag ejection. It's at SW right now. I expect it back soon as it's been 3wks or so. I'll try to remember to report back once I receive. This thing has been a supreme disappointment up to this point. I bought mine in May, so while it could be an original run 🤷🏼♂️. I have a converted to, 10MM Glock 30 (conv. Barrel) that will run 10x more reliable than this M&P...
Man, so sorry to hear that. Let me know how it goes and what they tell you on the customer service form. I'd be very curious to see what they doing to solve the problems. Appreciate you watching and sorry you have to go through this @JTaylor
@@LWRoad Finally received back...7weeks. It's better now, but still not 100%. New Slide & Polish Feed Ramp. Have replaced recoil spring(s) 22lb, 24lb. Replaced Mag Springs with Springer prec. Springs. Polished feed ramp, slide rails. Still chokes occasionally.
Does anyone know why Smith and Wesson hasn't addressed these problems at all? Thank goodness for this video and others that may be similar. I would love to know where Smith and
Wesson stands on these issues. They may be great at selling firearms, but this is truly ridiculous when you see the number of negative situations occurring. Their customer service
really stinks and people make them aware of it.
Maybe their customer service is sucking because they don't have a 100% definitive answer. I know I'd hesitate to contact a customer to tell them I know their brand new pistol they may be relying on for protection isn't working but that I don't know why yet, much less able to return it fixed. Telling customers you have a solution, and then having to backtrack and tell them you really didn't THEN but you for sure do NOW is not a path to commercial success. It's IMHO a worse look than just taking the time to do it right, even if that means a delay in responding. It's also less expensive than getting the same gun in for warranty repair over and over again.
@LWRoad Ok just got back from the range, I put 20 rounds of 220gr hard cast Underwood & 20 rounds of 180gr XTP Underwood. I let my wife shoot 1st with the 220gr hard cast all went well for her only 1 failure to feed. The 180gr Underwood she had zero issues. Now for me on the other hand shooting the 220gr hard cast I had no failure to feed but my magazine did start to drop out because I hit the mag release ever so slightly. I also had zero issues with the 180gr Underwood. I'm a left hand shooter and I did not move the mag release button, left it in the stock configuration. So I shot the 220gr hard cast right handed and I still hit the mag release ever so slightly and the mag released again. I also shot my Glock 19X had zero issues, I know one is 9mm and the other is 10mm but my thumbs forward grip is the exact same. So I think a Gen4 Glock 20 is in my future.
I forgot to add that I checked both my M&P 2.0 9mm i have, one is 4.25" & the other 5" FDE and the mag release does seem a little bit stiffer.
4.6 22lb guide rod/spring. Upgraded the mag springs. Failure to feed with SigSauer 180gr 1250fps ammo. The issue has improved but still get 2 to 3
failure to feed per box of ammo.
The mags lips that hold the round to be feed is not long enough. Hi speed camera showed the recoil is dislodging the round from the mag.
Which mag springs did you use?
I’ve been very slow to get a m&p 10mm with all the issues but I got it and I’m hoping they fixed the issues
I just went through this with S&W on my 10mm as it was having the high-angle FTF issue. I doubt it's the magazine springs because S&W does not want your magazines when you send the pistol in to be diagnosed for warranty repair. Whatever they're fixing, it's in the slide assembly. Mine came back with what appears to be a new recoil spring installed, although it's the same orange color as the original one. Maybe they got a bad batch of recoil springs?
It could be I know that the variations in some of the cheaper recoil spring manufacturers can be significant as Wolff states on their website
Great video .... I appreciate the info!
Thank you sir, hope it helps
My oem spring causes the bullets to shake in the magazine.
Some great info here. I have a 4.6" on order. Looking forward to seeing if this pig will run.
My 4.6" has had no issues, I have mainly heard it from the 4" versions
@LWRoad I have both and neither will feed reliably, especially with full power ammo. I sent the 4" back to smith and, like the other guys here, they said the just polished the ramp & chamber. Didn't change anything, it still sucks. Too bad, these are the lightest full size 10mms out there, that's why I bought them. I'm going to try the aftermarket mag springs now and see if that helps. If not, they're both going down the road
@@al01100 From my research, they run good w/the .40 Short and Weak powered loads. If you want to run the man loads, it seems that going to a 20-22 lb recoil spring is the fix. I'm planning on using the Wolff guide rod and springs.
@Czgunner don't bother. I bought an assortment of recoil springs from wolff, as well as their guide rod but it made no difference. I've got some different mag springs now, some from wolff, and some from springer. The 11 coil springer has much larger coil diameter than what was in the factory mag and they reduce the capacity by 1 round. I don't care about 1 less round as long as the damn guns work! When I get time to try them I'll come back and post the results
@@al01100 Man, that's really disappointing, but please keep us posted.
Haven't even been to the range yet and there was no trigger hump at the store... But once I got home... Yeah trigger hump
Heavier mag springs and 24lb recoil spring from Springer and Galloway Precision (i have the 4 inch) got it back going right. This gun has the springs of a 9mm, not a 10mm. Not sure what S&W was thinking by trying to be cheap and use flimsy springs in this gun. Even though it runs fine now (feel a bit more recoil) , thats 600 plus another 200 for an optic plus parts and about 200 rds of range ammo to troubleshoot this SOB. Every person who purchased this gun should receive a freakin rebate or huge discount for the inconvenience. I ordered a FN 510 just make myself feel better. What a let down S&W. You mean to tell me I could've bought a freakin sold out everywhere Hi-Point 10mm for $300 and had not one issue?? To add insult this was my very first 10mm ! What a joke!