Hey, so one thing I thought about soon after which I thought might be important or at least interesting to clarify concerning 4 stars and such. Why even is there any expectation for higher rarities ? Some gachas mix gods and childs into the highest rarity and there isn't any complain. So why is Limbus not the same ? I think the answer lies in two things: First, The City Power ranking, tied with Lore and Gameplay relationship. The City, contrarily to most universes, has a clear power ranking, in the form of hierarchy and fixer grades. Those aren't necessarily power based, but there is an expectation that the higher the grade, the stronger. Law of the jungle and all. And PM linking Lore and Gameplay at any occasion becomes a double edged sword, when that means that strong characters in lore are expected to be strong in gameplay. Hence any expectation for grade 1 to be way stronger than section 4s in gameplay too. The second point is the progression of the story regarding the ranks. In both LobCorp and Ruina, we've been used to growing through previously mentionned power ranking in the story, be it grades or abno rankings. Therefore there is a clear expectation for upcoming content to be gradually stronger. And again, stronger content has to be linked with stronger units, because of this lore and gameplay link. As for why those stronger units are supposed to be higher rarity, is because in gachas, creating too much imbalance in a rarity tier make the randomness of gachas when you pull something weaker really frustrating. There are always been stuff like power creep in gachas, but it was rarely to the point of like 4 stars completely beating 5 stars, and the reason is rarely ever lore related. And in our case, the power difference expectation between section 1s and 4s for exemple is supposed to be huge. That's why to fit the coherence, adding a rarity is the most coherent thing gameplay wise. As I said then they can still keep everything 3 stars, but that will cause problem, of either imbalance or missing expectations. So an interesting addition I thought would be good mentionning.
The lore and gameplay thing is such a weird project moon community feature, that's an essential part of any story based game since they were created doesn't make sense why they always say that. The thing about most verses not having a clear power ranking also doesnt make sense when the largest genre in last decade is power fantasy (which Pmoon games is perfect example of, all 3 games core mechanic being about becoming exponentially stronger by taking the power of your enemies be it EGO equipment, pages or mirror identities) and one of the most iconic parts of this genre being adventure guilds which give out S, A, B, C level quests with City having fixer system and urban legends, myths, plague, nightmares, stars of the city instead. The part about stronger units being higher rarity is obvious yes but it's not as straightforward. We have Pierre Ryoshu who should logically get her ass beaten by even low tier W corp cleanup crew members like W Faust but Ryoshu is 000 and Faust is 00. Its not because Pierre is a hidden urban nightmare it's because she is narratively more distinct character then random W corp mook. The power progression is described by a few things like us getting stronger the more golden boughs we get, uptying making them actually closer to their mirror world counterparts "in terms of experience and technique", and leveling up which makes them physically stronger (These experiences can make them even stronger than how they were in their original worlds at the time of extraction. (Well, that’s what the “relevant theories” say, according to Faust). and gives more experience outside of identity they use. Like remember how in Leviathan Garnet uses mirror tech he has access to ID of Black Silence Roland but he doesnt just overwhelm Maestro of the ring in fact he can't use Furioso (not high enough uptie level to use skill 3) and his body can't keep up with what black silence should be capable off (not high enough level) and he actually had more success with using Lulu and Yujin IDs cutting of his arm just before. The point being identities scaling with how strong the user is making weaker ones being able to perform of the level of higher tiers and stronger ones not being overwhelmingly stronger invalidating usage of lower tiers ones (adding higher rarity to portray power gap)
@@azchhn Very few games justify their gameplay mechanics on a close to meta level like PM, which is why they seem to do it more than others in all domains. (like resets being justified with T Corp tech/simulations). I checked Leviathan for Garnet's fight, and he was about to finish Jumsoon with Black Silence ID, but was overwhelmed by the feelings inside. Though his body indeed does not follow his will as much. The ID doing the most damage was Yujin's though, since it's the one cutting her arm. But anyway. I see the point, which as I mentionned is the reason that IDs are not 1 for 1 power levels. Maybe it's a question of mastery and mirror worlds, and they are limited by the user. But if they can outgrow their origin, even then their origin in their mirror world isn't necessarily the same than the ones we know. For exemple, maybe Ryoshu's Chef ID has more power in her mirror world than the Pierre we know. Though I do agree that story relevance is more of a factor for ID choices. But even then a section 1 is a section 1. I doubt that a section 4 at uptie X should have the same power than a section 1 at same uptie, unless we are never able to get something close to their potential. But yeah I guess IDs rarities could be the power that a sinner can get out of them. My main point still stands that previous games and setting have created expectations, and those might not be entirely met with the actual system. But well I can't affirm it either, I can just wait & see.
I think the issue your understanding of strength when 00 like shi association Ishmael is stronger than many 000 000 00 Isn’t strength or rarity But just how close they are to their counterpart sinners As we got yi sang 00 harpoon who is really strong compared let say 000 BL sang And 0 heathcliff beating all 00 of heathcliff in all ways Again PM never said these are used as similar to gacha games Yes some people still using gacha logic on PM when PM literally give you all IDs for free with their NBoxes PM isn’t using gacha stars system at all in power term when they just using it as This sinner have chance to be in some reality an fixer grade 1 00 This sinner doesn’t have chance in any reality to be chief 000
I'm sorry but if I've got 3 grades which have different chances to get pulled, I think we can call those rarities. Even more so if the lore explanation is the likeliness of x person being y. And that's not because PM is new to gacha games and decided to make a really generous one that "gacha game logic", which is their design, can't apply. If we can get any ID we want it's not because it's not a gacha game, it's because they are really generous. And I'm not sure if you say that to a newer player full F2P they are gonna agree with getting all the stuff. Just that at least you have some choice. As for why some 00 are stronger than some 000, it's because to get variety in designs there are various ones, and some are more or less balanced than some others. I can probably quote a dozen 000 stronger than 00 to counter your exemples. And 0 are very much close to abandoned rn, outside of self challenges (or favourites i guess). But that's because you have to reward your players for getting stuff that cost more/is less likely. That's why in design 000s are stronger to 00s, there is a cost/reward balance that should be somewhat respected. And it becomes associated with higher grades or that kind of thing in Limbus since IDs are referenced by their titles, and they are symbols of higher power.
A few things, 1. Project Moon said in the Q+A after the Limbus reveal trailer that the ending of Limbus will be one of the last things to happen before the release of the final game in the story of The City, so Limbus is planned to go on a while considering they so far have released 1 game every 2-3 years. 2. Another way to do 4 star IDs while keeping the Kabbalah theme is to change the color of the rarity to the white color of the seeds of light as opposed to the current golden color. Then it would represent a more pure version of the Ayin Al Soph. 3. There is already code present for adding more main chapters other than Inferno in the game, so Paradisio and Purgatorio are very likely (especially since the book Dante’s Paradisio has Dante meet a character named Roland). 4. There is also reference to a third type of coin called the multiplier coin in the game’s files with multiplication coin boost and coin drop having icons present in the files, so we could see this on future IDs eventually. 5. There is a possibility that some abnos we meet in the mirror dungeons might not get fights in Limbus, but instead other games in the series similar to how The Jester of Nihil and The Servant of Wrath were teased in Lobotomy Corp but never appeared until Ruina.
Thanks for the infos 1.Depends on how long they plan to make the series last, in 10 years they have time to release at least 3-4 games, if they manage to find a good pacing for Limbus. 2. I did want to do the color more white in my logo, but screwed up had to redo and got lazy. But they would need another name to differenciate it (which is why I put an X) 3. Nice to hear, I did know for Roland, but it's a fair while away 4. I remember sawing them. Though it might be a dropped idea, but we'll see, it could be good but also become extremely strong. 5. True they were hinted at, Though the Magical girl series was maybe not finished at the time. If Lobcorp was a live service game, we might have gotten them afterwards. So it's hard to say the same for Limbus, it doesn't have the same structure. Because of that, we need a steady stream of abnos for content, so we'll probably end up fighting a loooooot of them.
I think that we will get a second shot with some sinners at some point, mostly because Rodya (and maybe gregor) really need proper cantos, as Rodya didn't got any real character development during her canto and Gregor feels like his character development is unfinished, so maybe that's where purgatorio and paradiso come into play, probably
I’m expecting Gregor story will play a lot in outis as well But for rodion it’s definitely a very odd chapter to be hit with such an obtuse monologue then have rodion say no way faggg and then take the branch and leave Really hoping rodion sister pops up in the Christmas event or sooner since she’s really undercooked currently
@@tylerulfmann4586 Feel that canto 2 suffered from being the second canto. What I mean by that is that limbus company is the first game from PM that many will play, and thus Canto 1 had to showcase the kind of stories that happen on The City, so Canto 2 had the role of easing the PTSD of players new to PM and thus the funny casino canto was made as a speedrun therapy session, witch was nice in my opinion, but the character of Rodya suffered because of that. So yeah, I really hope that Rodya gets a proper canto for her.
@@LeafGreen250 yea Rodya will get a proper canto with some unfinished business related to Sonya and the Middle. But Canto 2 did a rly good point telling us Rodya still running away haven't dealing with her problem and still very much regretfull.
for ryoshu’s story, if we presume she has a daughter, it would be a little odd for her to go around carefree doing jobs to satiate her desire for art instead of caring for her daughter. so either, A: she is the daughter, taking after her parent’s artistic nature and is being hunted down by the fingers for the sake of making the ultimate art piece (likely the depiction of her being burned alive) or B: ryoshu had a daughter who ended up being burned alive to make the ultimate art piece. ryoshu never unsheathes her blade ever, even when using ego. she also is never seen without it for all her identities. so what if (this probably sounds crazy) ryoshu’s sheathe acts like a cremation ash container for carrying her dead daughter’s ashes? it would make sense for something so important to her be with her for every single mirror world. she even embraces it like one would embrace a child in forest for the flames. or C: something completely different idk
Interesting ideas, I especially like the possibility that her sword/sheathe represents something important to her. The link with her sword must be story related.
another thing to note is ryoshu’s relation to red string, seen from the trailer briefly. if you look very closely at fftf, you can see that the odachi looks to be fully bound with red rope, to the point where it makes it impossible to unsheathe. whatever the red string represents (likely the red string of fate), it’s preventing her from unsheathing whatever is inside. along with that, the background of fftf is burnt wood and cinders. this might hint that ryoshu’s story is chronologically after the burning of whoever the daughter is in the carriage.
I like the idea of 4 star being so strong that you cannot deploy more than one because Dante/system cannot handle it and it require some special team build limitation to deploy them as they require higher level of synchronisation like if you want to deploy Xiao Id, you need to have a certain amount of Liu IDs in the team.
I like it, however I don't think they can put too much restrictive usage in a gacha, because that would mean after passing the trouble of getting it, you have to get even more special requirements to use them, which is mostly frustrating. The trouble should be more getting it than using it. Also tying it only to some archetypes limits the "creative process", especially only being able to use it in specific teams. However only one 4 stars is a possibility, like you could only have one of objet d'art in your deck in ruina, which could be for balance purposes.
Heathcliff has the working of a typical type moon protagonist and his chapter will be giga kino additionally with manager once being a big shot is bound to have a lot of skeletons in the closet
It's worth noting that each sinner has at least one related character in either Demian or Hermann's group (or in Yi Sang's case both) with Gregor having Hermann, Rodion having Sonia (who may be connected to Demian as he might have the Mark of Cain and knew Sinclair would meet Demian again soon), Sinclair having Demian, Yi Sang having Gubo and Rim and Ishmael having Ahab (who we see getting requited by Hermann at the end of Canto 5) so it seems like each sinner will have at least 1-2 corresponding figure(s) that either work with Demian or Hermann
I like the theory that Heathcliff follows Hareton's story (or at least a mix of it) and the person inside the bodysack is the OG Heathcliff. That said, with Pequod ID saying Heathcliff got hurt by what Cathy said and that funeral CG scene, if Ishmael can't save Heathcliff then this canto will be the start of a very, very dark road for the guy.
Another way to do 4 star characters without making the grind/gacha for 3 stars worthless is to make them tied somehow. like if you want to get an R corp leader 4 star ID you need to own a full team of R corp members, that would also make 4 stars a bigger deal for players as getting them would require the ultimate investment/grind and be a way to cap off their collection for a faction.
Making them tied is the idea I had with upties, like they become 4 stars at uptie X, but I like your idea a lot, it would give a reward for the completion of mirror worlds (which is something I would like to see sometimes tbh) Though it would probably still need a cost, but could be like a blueprint or "a path in the mirror" to spark it in the dispenser for exemple
@@MagnetAlphaI was thinking something like a specific mirror dungeon event a few levels that ties the mirror world together And sorta caps out each ID in that world culminating in the 4 star being shown off and every character in that mirror world getting a bit more passives and utility out of it The caveat is that to use the 4 star and to get the benefits you have to make a significant amount of your team that mirror world with the mirror dungeon requiring a bunch of shards and thread
@@snipermagoo not quite what I meant, you'd just need to have them in your collection is all. besides I doubt we are ever gonna get 4 star IDs, it's just a fun thing to think about
With the 4 Star IDs case, they could make it so as they are being uptied the identity is moving up higher through the association or respective faction. So these 3 star identities aren't falling off rather then making a whole new tier of identities to keep up with the power scaling. Also, to keep from getting an absurd number of upties for these identities they can make so you can directly enhance one of their skills minorly, while leaving upties to be the major upgrades. Obviously these enhances can be unlocked as we progress through the cantos.
Getting higher grades through uptie was one of the idea I tried to tell, the problems though being that it ends ups removing lower tiers bit by bit and require the dev to put twice the amount of work on any ID that has it. I like the minor upties idea though.
It's a possibility. I think I've heard he dies in the original work somewhere around there ? Though why we would turn our back on Verg is a question I lack an ounce of answer for.
Not only is it that identities, and even Base Sinners, are weakened currently, but it means we will eventually hit a ceiling, where either the Identities will experience a progression of sorts in their respective Mirror Worlds, or be left behind and replaced with a different Identity as we progress, perhaps even linking the two Identities through progression, making it so the players' time not feel wasted while also allowing much stronger Identities coexist in the same rarity. Another thing that could end up happening is the Base Sinners growing in strength, maybe their E.G.O.'s will become a part of their kit, rather than be activated occasionally, to showcase a level of progression on the Sinners' part, and perhaps this would incite the aforementioned progression in the Mirror Worlds and their Identities.
Btw smth you missed, in the tgs trailer for 2022 we got REAL good hints for all the sinners stories, we got all the key artworks for all of them, Yi sang getting his wings, rodion slaying the tax collector, sinclair looking at damien, etc. so there may also be previews for future cantos, some key ones to note are ryoshu falling with some red strings around her, heathcliff walking to a grave with a notable red head woman (possibly Catherine), don supposedly waving to charge into battle or something. Stuff like that you could really analyze
I did remember the TGS, but didn't remember too much interesting stuff outside Hong Lu's pictures, which I quickly referenced but scraped out of the script, just saying that he doesn't care as much about money as he does for relationships, which I kinda already pointed quite a bit. Though after checking I agree about Ryoshu and Heathcliff. I don't think it grants a full analysis though, especially because without context they can mean a lot of different things, most images also have really few details (mainly zoomed in) and are purposefully rendered very vague. But if I had to hazard a guess rn about the 2 interesting ones, I'd say Ryoshu red string could be apparented to the red string of fate being cut (because scissors), possibily her ties with the ring (she also doesn't have a ring, but she has a glove), or it could go into the mother theory with an umbilical cord, referencing the carriage stuff. For Heathcliff since it looks like a funeral, I'd have said it'd be for Catherine's death rather. Though the main problem is there is no way of knowing if it's in the future or the past, like Yi Sang picture is one that happened during Canto IV. Otherwise it'd be an older event for his adoptive parents but I'd say it's Catherine's.
I dont see why there would be higher rarity for special characters. Like L corp didnt have another danger level for white night and apoc bird or red mist/garion battles same with library having Olga and Red Mist in the same Objet d'art tier
It's not an higher rarity for "special fights" but for stronger units. But the Objet d'art tier is a fair point, however I'd say the situation is different, because of the full gacha nature of the game. (and not small gacha like ruina) Imagine getting a 3 stars later with gacha as a newer player, but it ends up being an early game 3*, and that was overpowercreep'd. Plus as you advance in LoR or LC you have full choice of your units and system to get them with progression, the grade is mainly for number limitation. Limbus doesn't have that, when you gacha you gacha full random. Banners are limited time event too. They are generous so you could say you can spark them anyway, which depending on the situation is more or less complicated, and doesn't change the core problem. So that's mainly because of the gacha nature, and the meaning of rarity, which is not the same as in Ruina.
HI I WATCHED THE DON QUIXOTE SECTION OF THIS VIDEO AND HAVE SOME… COMMENTS. I am extremely ill over this guy I have written an almost 2k word essay about her which is kind of outdated. WHATEVER. One: the sancho = don theory is disproven. SO. it has been pointed out that on Don Quixote’s jacket in her chibi form “Miguel” is written. “Miguel” also has appeared on her jacket in even recent merch! Now Miguel obviously refers to Miguel Cerevantes which now just. Outright disproves the sancho=don theory. So what could this mean?? Now miguel cerevantes had a very extensive military career which could make me think Quixote was involved in the Smoke War somewhat. He was also arrested ATLEAST 4 times also possibly for manslaughter. NOW. what if we follow Man of La Mancha! Where the phrase “The impossible dream” comes from! While i have not watched the play, Cerevantes gets incarcerated and basically puts on a show with other prisoners of his OCS. At the same time, Cerevantes, if i remember, ALSO gets criticized for his extreme idealism.. personally i think Quixote here is just a character BUT one extremely close to who LCB quixote actually is. NOW ANYWAYS THE FUCKING SPANISH INQUISITION. Miguel Cerevantes had much trouble with the spanish inquisition AGAIN shown by the fact he has been arrested this much. AND NCORP! NCORP. Nagel und Hammer extremely obviously parallels the practices of the Inquisition… additionally their followers are outright called inquisitors. Additionally in Quixote’s 1* ID art you can see people getting stabbed by what could be assumed to be nails. While I only have a very rough outline of what her full plot could be I just think in general she would be so used to performing she is so used to being dehumanized to the point she just decides to dehumanize herself. “The death of don quixote” will occur but moreso the desth of a character who only lives to please other people and the creation of someone who truly lives for theirselves. OH I DIDNT MENTION MY TAKES ABOUT HER PERSONALITY SO THIS MAKES MORE SENSE. I think don quixote is hiding things. But not much. Accross most universes she shows an intense passion and vigor no matter WHAT even in shi section!!! She might just be making herself look more happy than she is, or more valiant and knightly but she is definitely not faking those things so core to her character such as her horribly black and white thinking, impulsivity, lack of emotional intellegence and vigor!! i think she is also hiding more signs of anxiety and percieved feelings of incompetancy and inferiority.. considering the way she doesnt even condemn her “friends” for treating her so inhumanely makes me think she has a very low perception of herself paired with her consistently being silenced and looked down upon consistently by many people. she seems to be someone who is. Overly-forgiving as well and when it comes to herself she really is a doormat. VERY valiant for other people just bad at protecting herself
Sorry this is so long. Also did you touch upon how faust may or may not parallel with Malkuth considering how she has had so far two IDS directly related to her + the fact she has a hex nail ego.
Thanks for the input, very insightful. I'm not sure how much Miguel being an inspiration invalid the rest. PM likes to mix up things. The name might just be for author reference. However that's interesting as an hint. Don might just be the name of the character than she is interpreting, like the one she has made, she is then "the author", which would then make sense for her to actually be a reference to Miguel. I'm not sure if we're gonna go into the smoke war or N Corp though. The smoke war is and will be already very brought up by Gregor and Outis, same for N Corp, and there isn't any hint of it anyway. I don't see nails in her 1* art, so if you're mentionning the whole poster, to me it seems more like the entrance of a gate than actual nails, the spear end seems more like a coincidence to me. I think we'll stay closer to Don's actual character story, though there may be some references. Or it ends up being a mix up. Concerning her personality, it is very clear than the cheerful personality is part of a persona. She is much more than some crazy gremlin. What she is hiding though isn't too clear. I'm not sure if it's incompetancy. It might be more like depression or responsibility than she is just trying to hide. Though I can understand the lack of self confidence, and doing an opposite persona full of it to compensate. I'm not sure if her "friends" treatment is so inhumane, if you're referencing to the beating to get her senses back thing. It's violent but desperate times can ask for desperate measures, and the City is already violent by itself a lot. Though I guess with the name of the EGO you could enter a whole theory that they were being "evil" and Don just snapped, said "Justice!" and empaled them, hence the name "The Blood of Sancho". Though there isn't much basis for this one. Regarding Faust and Malkuth I didn't. They might have a common thing of "the will to stand up straight" if you consider Faust is just following orders constantly, and her lack of control over her life, though I feel like it might just be the case for other sinners, so I don't know if they are taking back the thematics of the other games.
@@MagnetAlpha YEAH i think don quixote is surely hiding alot and is not as stable and happy as she seems though the same overly idealistic and impulsive basis of her character ARE still there. We can even see this in shi section where she still shows how valiant she is despite being under so much more pressure and being obviously unstable
Just an idea. Aleph Ego. Once used, Changes the the sinners ID during that combat encounter into a that Ego but as an ID. As a sort of tranformation EGO. This can work as a pseudo 4/5 star ID. That requires Resource generated in combat before being able to be used. Ego has lower Drop chance compared 3 star ID so it's basically already a 4 star XD.
That's a bit what I thought like with sinners "very personal" IDs and tzimtzum. But otherwise they can't just make 4* purely free, it undermines too much the gacha element of the game.
I want to say 000 is the last gacha rank Because it is in Kabbalah Suddenly adding 0000 make no sense Because 0 mean ain which is reality 00 mean ain sof which is possible reality 000 mean ain sof or which is impossible reality There isn’t 0000 in Kabbalah
@@renatotorreslopesrenato1716 Outis is a director so it's understandable, Don is the outlier rather, but it can be explained because of Shi image of being constantly exhausted. But even then as I said there are some exceptions. rn, they have to fill the 2 stars pool and don't want to keep giving us section 5/6s. We'll see if they keep the trend going though. For now as long as there is no high section director being a 2 stars it's acceptable I'd say, though 2 stars Section 1s would worry me (outside Shis)
My best guess there will be around 15-26 cantos each most districts (some may be side stories). New untie each 5-6 cantos. Game story probably will last 3-5 years. Color fixers will or not be playable as 3 stars (they may introduce IDs which will match ALEPH egos, but right they just drop better IDs every canto).
They already gave us some hint in recent update: in the future, there will always be 1 new Railway, 1 new Mirror Dungeon, 1 new Walpugris. Mirror Dungeon will only have 5 instead of 20 floors, but they will tweak it a little bit so that its mechanic changes from time to time. Also, uptie 5 is coming. There is an asset for it in the game already, so let's hope it will be the final uptie that truly balance everything (cuz right now, the Blade Linage crew still sucks). I do not think we gonna have uptie 6 or 7, because right now, if they put uptie 5 in, the shard cost to uptie WAW/ALEPH egos will equal to the price of them in Dispenser, so I do not think it's a good move. It's also unlikely to have 4 star IDs, judging how Walpugris IDs are not 4 stars. Also, pay-to-win players will hate it if you bring 4 star IDs into the game. That's not an option. About difficulty curve, it's very simple to solve. PM always uses mechanic overloading to increase their difficulty, and I will not surprised if they intend to do it again. Like, in Library of Ruina, when you get to Tiph's floor, there is a new mechanic called Mass Attack that increases the game's difficulty. In Star of the City, it's EGO Pages. For final bosses, it's Ineff. Resistence. You get the gist.
I agree overall, especially with the cost of upties. Though I don't think early walpurgis not having 4 stars throws it out of the possibilities. And MD3 doesn't have 5 but 4 floors, only the hard version having 4. My 20 floors idea was more for like a one time dungeon or something. The mechanic overload point is interesting, though it's not the only point in ruina increasing difficulty. However in Limbus, all those mechanics are already introduced, which is why the game seems complex from the start, when in ruina it was delivered slowly to ease the player into learning bit by bit. So I don't know if they can redo the same thing. Or if they do, I wonder what they can find for it. The only one I can really see is just reading checks with fight specific mechanics.
@@MagnetAlpha 20 floors dungeon could happen. Like, in end game, if they want to bring back the boss rush or something like that. The reason why I said Walpugris not having 4 stars means 4 stars is unlikely to happen is because Walpugris is a special exclusive gacha event for the P2W players to roll. They do not introduce 4 stars this time, so they could not do it in the future anymore. This is simply because the stars are the rarity, the symbol to seperate the premium stuff and the casual stuff. By introducing 4 stars, you degrade the 3 stars IDs, and the gacha whales will never like it. It's a very important rule in gacha game system. About mechanic overloading, it is the very reason why the difficulty in both early games are hard. It gives you the tool that completely break the game, to the point that normal game developers will never ever dare to do it in their game because it will become over-complex. Take Mass Attack as an example. Before Mass Attack, you need to 50/50 a lot of the pages because of Light economy and RNG. However, with Mass Attack, you completely stun or half stun the enemy, allowing you to sneak one-sided attack in. This is why when Queen of Hatred spams her AoE, it's always a game over because while normal pages deal around 10-20 damage, her AoE instantly deals 50 damage one-sided attack. And because of Smoke and other status effects, the final bosses of Library have to become HP-sponge so that they will not be instakilled. There are also many ways to overload the mechanics in Limbus Company as well. They can take Arknight's example of equipment (using EGO Gifts or something) or Awakened (will surely happen to our EGOs).
@@winslycan1309 I see what you mean about degrading 3 stars value, which I mention, however I'd think if wouldn't only affect whales. But that's one of the main problems of 4 stars. However I'm not sure if expectations will be met regarding lore to gameplay power relation if we keep all at 3 stars in the future. And if they do and hard powercreep comes up instead, the result will be close to the same than if they did 4 stars. For mechanic overloads I understand what you mean, but we'll have to see if or what they do for limbus. I agree awakening is a possibility, maybe with purgatorio, but I wouldn't want them to add stuff like equipment, especially if it becomes something to pull for. Something closer to farm would divide more the resources we get, but I guess it could be another way to spend thread and stuff without adding more upties. Maybe as another form of new additional MD reward in the future instead of more battle pass exp.
With the uptie 5 asset, I'm pretty sure that is for lunar memories cuz ego gift rarities uses the same asset as uptie levels and that is rarity 5. Although uptie 5 is still a possibility.
Hello, I cant remember where, but I recall there was a mention(prob reddit) that the rarity (2-3 stars) ties to the likelihood that the current sinners match with their alternate self. E.g. 3 star n sinclair is super unlikely, cause it needs 3 star n faust to manipulate him. Whereas 2 star mariachi Sinclair is possible as in canto 2, sinclair already had a knack at mariachi dancing, impressing and maybe gaining respect from the mexican guys Else, if we assume 3 stars are stronger than 2 stars. That would mean a 3 star tingtang boss from the j corp backstreets is "canonically" stronger than Liu association members Furthermore, Rarity ties with likeihood is more likely as it ties with gameplay: e.g. higher rarity = low likelihood to get = low likelihood the sinners are like their alternate self
Yeah I've heard about this, but I'm not sure how much I believe it tbf. PM has more infos than us, but deciding which ids are more or less likely is hard to define in the whole context of the city. For exemple, is Seven Outis really that unlikely ? Is W Corp Hong Lu more likely than K Corp ? Is Faust being a Seven Section 4 less likely than HEATHCLIFF ? I don't fully agree to it. Also doesn't change that Shi Don should be the only director ever being a 2 stars, and that's cuz of Shi. Or only Section 4 members managing to be both 2 or 3 stars. I said there might be edge cases, TT Hong Lu was one of them, like him being a 3 stars while Mariachi Sinclair being 2. (supposing he was taken from Aida) But I guess we just don't have a clear answer yet. If the trend continue I'll have to accept likeliness as the main reason.
There is no way we can go through purgatorio and paradiso. Limbus just cant survive that long and it will be longer then both l corp and library combined and City power structure just doesnt have that many tiers like we are already at waw tier abnos
They did put WAW pretty soon I think power wise. But it will come slowly and be more scarce, for now at least. However there are many structures and factions in the City to go through before Power Ranking. Ruina gave us a wrong impression I think by making us climb the tiers extremely quickly. But Limbus being a long time project I'm pretty sure they can manage to make it last.
@@MagnetAlpha Limbus is probably weirder power progression wise like Kromer was a HE and we couldn't beat her in original encounter then we go on to beat distorted and ego awakened Dongrang who is a Teth which makes sense but in Canto 5 we fight a dungeon where every boss is a WAW
@@azchhn I'll admit the abno ranking so far is weird. Though one could argue that the ranking is not necessarily linked to their fighting power, but more the potential of casualties they are likely to do, taking back the Lobcorp Manual.
I think it would be interesting if 0000 IDs get released, that you can only deploy one of them in your team at the same time, as to encourage to not just mash in the strongest IDs and instead build around the one 0000 ID you have.
I think there will be 12-3 chapters in inferno and paradiso and purgatorio will be 1 maybe 2 chapters We are getting stronger ids, newer 3* association ids have their section rank higher than earlier ones
Just a brainfart but what if the potentially 4 star ids worked like the transformation ego pages? There is already a aleph level which red mist or colours could go in, just a neat idea I had.
Given the English name, Ahab's general gaslighting and controlling behavior, and the literature Project Moon likes to reference? RR3: MirrorCLOCK ORANGEroad is likely a Clockwork Orange ref.
Crazy Curveball/Crazy Idea/FanTheory. Limbus is the bad guy, and Faust knows all outcome. Faust rarely ever use the "I" pronoun. Faust is being ordered around by an alternate universe version of Faust ownself, but as an overlord supergenius, through the mirror. --- Outis isn't from this version of the universe, but is a Trojan Horse from an alternate Universe to stop Overlord Faust. In a way, Outis is actually far from their original home. --- By the Time we finish Mersault's Canto, N-Corp would been defeated by us. Also, Mersault definitely gonna fight a collective consciousness type of entity.
I really, really don't want higher rarities. Mostly because the grind sounds absolutely insufferable. At first, it's just one or two, and that's okay, because the thread, shard, lunacy costs- they're whatever, right? You're paying for the strength, so all's good. But then more come out, and then some come out for walpurgisnacht, then suddenly there's tons of them and if you want to play the harder content you're going to need a meta team. I'm not a gacha gamer, I'm a project moon fan- and because of that I already find most of the game's grinding absolutely insufferable. I can't imagine it getting much worse and me still sticking around, considering I've already spent so many hours of my life on this game.
Hey, so one thing I thought about soon after which I thought might be important or at least interesting to clarify concerning 4 stars and such. Why even is there any expectation for higher rarities ? Some gachas mix gods and childs into the highest rarity and there isn't any complain. So why is Limbus not the same ? I think the answer lies in two things:
First, The City Power ranking, tied with Lore and Gameplay relationship. The City, contrarily to most universes, has a clear power ranking, in the form of hierarchy and fixer grades. Those aren't necessarily power based, but there is an expectation that the higher the grade, the stronger. Law of the jungle and all. And PM linking Lore and Gameplay at any occasion becomes a double edged sword, when that means that strong characters in lore are expected to be strong in gameplay. Hence any expectation for grade 1 to be way stronger than section 4s in gameplay too.
The second point is the progression of the story regarding the ranks. In both LobCorp and Ruina, we've been used to growing through previously mentionned power ranking in the story, be it grades or abno rankings. Therefore there is a clear expectation for upcoming content to be gradually stronger. And again, stronger content has to be linked with stronger units, because of this lore and gameplay link.
As for why those stronger units are supposed to be higher rarity, is because in gachas, creating too much imbalance in a rarity tier make the randomness of gachas when you pull something weaker really frustrating. There are always been stuff like power creep in gachas, but it was rarely to the point of like 4 stars completely beating 5 stars, and the reason is rarely ever lore related. And in our case, the power difference expectation between section 1s and 4s for exemple is supposed to be huge. That's why to fit the coherence, adding a rarity is the most coherent thing gameplay wise. As I said then they can still keep everything 3 stars, but that will cause problem, of either imbalance or missing expectations.
So an interesting addition I thought would be good mentionning.
The lore and gameplay thing is such a weird project moon community feature, that's an essential part of any story based game since they were created doesn't make sense why they always say that. The thing about most verses not having a clear power ranking also doesnt make sense when the largest genre in last decade is power fantasy (which Pmoon games is perfect example of, all 3 games core mechanic being about becoming exponentially stronger by taking the power of your enemies be it EGO equipment, pages or mirror identities) and one of the most iconic parts of this genre being adventure guilds which give out S, A, B, C level quests with City having fixer system and urban legends, myths, plague, nightmares, stars of the city instead. The part about stronger units being higher rarity is obvious yes but it's not as straightforward. We have Pierre Ryoshu who should logically get her ass beaten by even low tier W corp cleanup crew members like W Faust but Ryoshu is 000 and Faust is 00. Its not because Pierre is a hidden urban nightmare it's because she is narratively more distinct character then random W corp mook. The power progression is described by a few things like us getting stronger the more golden boughs we get, uptying making them actually closer to their mirror world counterparts "in terms of experience and technique", and leveling up which makes them physically stronger (These experiences can make them even stronger than how they were in their original worlds at the time of extraction. (Well, that’s what the “relevant theories” say, according to Faust). and gives more experience outside of identity they use. Like remember how in Leviathan Garnet uses mirror tech he has access to ID of Black Silence Roland but he doesnt just overwhelm Maestro of the ring in fact he can't use Furioso (not high enough uptie level to use skill 3) and his body can't keep up with what black silence should be capable off (not high enough level) and he actually had more success with using Lulu and Yujin IDs cutting of his arm just before. The point being identities scaling with how strong the user is making weaker ones being able to perform of the level of higher tiers and stronger ones not being overwhelmingly stronger invalidating usage of lower tiers ones (adding higher rarity to portray power gap)
@@azchhn Very few games justify their gameplay mechanics on a close to meta level like PM, which is why they seem to do it more than others in all domains. (like resets being justified with T Corp tech/simulations).
I checked Leviathan for Garnet's fight, and he was about to finish Jumsoon with Black Silence ID, but was overwhelmed by the feelings inside. Though his body indeed does not follow his will as much. The ID doing the most damage was Yujin's though, since it's the one cutting her arm.
But anyway. I see the point, which as I mentionned is the reason that IDs are not 1 for 1 power levels. Maybe it's a question of mastery and mirror worlds, and they are limited by the user. But if they can outgrow their origin, even then their origin in their mirror world isn't necessarily the same than the ones we know. For exemple, maybe Ryoshu's Chef ID has more power in her mirror world than the Pierre we know. Though I do agree that story relevance is more of a factor for ID choices. But even then a section 1 is a section 1. I doubt that a section 4 at uptie X should have the same power than a section 1 at same uptie, unless we are never able to get something close to their potential. But yeah I guess IDs rarities could be the power that a sinner can get out of them.
My main point still stands that previous games and setting have created expectations, and those might not be entirely met with the actual system. But well I can't affirm it either, I can just wait & see.
I think the issue your understanding of strength when 00 like shi association Ishmael is stronger than many 000
000 00
Isn’t strength or rarity
But just how close they are to their counterpart sinners
As we got yi sang 00 harpoon who is really strong compared let say 000 BL sang
And 0 heathcliff beating all 00 of heathcliff in all ways
Again PM never said these are used as similar to gacha games
Yes some people still using gacha logic on PM when PM literally give you all IDs for free with their NBoxes
PM isn’t using gacha stars system at all in power term when they just using it as
This sinner have chance to be in some reality an fixer grade 1 00
This sinner doesn’t have chance in any reality to be chief 000
I'm sorry but if I've got 3 grades which have different chances to get pulled, I think we can call those rarities. Even more so if the lore explanation is the likeliness of x person being y.
And that's not because PM is new to gacha games and decided to make a really generous one that "gacha game logic", which is their design, can't apply. If we can get any ID we want it's not because it's not a gacha game, it's because they are really generous. And I'm not sure if you say that to a newer player full F2P they are gonna agree with getting all the stuff. Just that at least you have some choice.
As for why some 00 are stronger than some 000, it's because to get variety in designs there are various ones, and some are more or less balanced than some others. I can probably quote a dozen 000 stronger than 00 to counter your exemples. And 0 are very much close to abandoned rn, outside of self challenges (or favourites i guess). But that's because you have to reward your players for getting stuff that cost more/is less likely. That's why in design 000s are stronger to 00s, there is a cost/reward balance that should be somewhat respected. And it becomes associated with higher grades or that kind of thing in Limbus since IDs are referenced by their titles, and they are symbols of higher power.
@@prokiller4860 is base heath better then N corp? Didnt look into his numbers
A few things,
1. Project Moon said in the Q+A after the Limbus reveal trailer that the ending of Limbus will be one of the last things to happen before the release of the final game in the story of The City, so Limbus is planned to go on a while considering they so far have released 1 game every 2-3 years.
2. Another way to do 4 star IDs while keeping the Kabbalah theme is to change the color of the rarity to the white color of the seeds of light as opposed to the current golden color. Then it would represent a more pure version of the Ayin Al Soph.
3. There is already code present for adding more main chapters other than Inferno in the game, so Paradisio and Purgatorio are very likely (especially since the book Dante’s Paradisio has Dante meet a character named Roland).
4. There is also reference to a third type of coin called the multiplier coin in the game’s files with multiplication coin boost and coin drop having icons present in the files, so we could see this on future IDs eventually.
5. There is a possibility that some abnos we meet in the mirror dungeons might not get fights in Limbus, but instead other games in the series similar to how The Jester of Nihil and The Servant of Wrath were teased in Lobotomy Corp but never appeared until Ruina.
when was Jester of Nihil and Servant of Wrath mentioned in lobotomy?
@@azchhn I got confused with Wonderlab, The Jester of Nihil was foreshadowed in Wonderlab.
Thanks for the infos
1.Depends on how long they plan to make the series last, in 10 years they have time to release at least 3-4 games, if they manage to find a good pacing for Limbus.
2. I did want to do the color more white in my logo, but screwed up had to redo and got lazy. But they would need another name to differenciate it (which is why I put an X)
3. Nice to hear, I did know for Roland, but it's a fair while away
4. I remember sawing them. Though it might be a dropped idea, but we'll see, it could be good but also become extremely strong.
5. True they were hinted at, Though the Magical girl series was maybe not finished at the time. If Lobcorp was a live service game, we might have gotten them afterwards. So it's hard to say the same for Limbus, it doesn't have the same structure. Because of that, we need a steady stream of abnos for content, so we'll probably end up fighting a loooooot of them.
50 years of limbus woahhh
@@gigablast4129 50 limbillions years of ryoshu...
I think that we will get a second shot with some sinners at some point, mostly because Rodya (and maybe gregor) really need proper cantos, as Rodya didn't got any real character development during her canto and Gregor feels like his character development is unfinished, so maybe that's where purgatorio and paradiso come into play, probably
We still don't know how Gregor connects to the Sehpirah, there definitely will be a second set of Cantos further fleshing out the cast
I’m expecting Gregor story will play a lot in outis as well
But for rodion it’s definitely a very odd chapter to be hit with such an obtuse monologue then have rodion say no way faggg and then take the branch and leave
Really hoping rodion sister pops up in the Christmas event or sooner since she’s really undercooked currently
@@tylerulfmann4586 Feel that canto 2 suffered from being the second canto.
What I mean by that is that limbus company is the first game from PM that many will play, and thus Canto 1 had to showcase the kind of stories that happen on The City, so Canto 2 had the role of easing the PTSD of players new to PM and thus the funny casino canto was made as a speedrun therapy session, witch was nice in my opinion, but the character of Rodya suffered because of that.
So yeah, I really hope that Rodya gets a proper canto for her.
that is for sure to happend but idk if PM gonna follow the book and give the players 33 cantos for each canticles.
@@LeafGreen250 yea Rodya will get a proper canto with some unfinished business related to Sonya and the Middle. But Canto 2 did a rly good point telling us Rodya still running away haven't dealing with her problem and still very much regretfull.
for ryoshu’s story, if we presume she has a daughter, it would be a little odd for her to go around carefree doing jobs to satiate her desire for art instead of caring for her daughter. so either,
A: she is the daughter, taking after her parent’s artistic nature and is being hunted down by the fingers for the sake of making the ultimate art piece (likely the depiction of her being burned alive)
or B: ryoshu had a daughter who ended up being burned alive to make the ultimate art piece. ryoshu never unsheathes her blade ever, even when using ego. she also is never seen without it for all her identities. so what if (this probably sounds crazy) ryoshu’s sheathe acts like a cremation ash container for carrying her dead daughter’s ashes? it would make sense for something so important to her be with her for every single mirror world. she even embraces it like one would embrace a child in forest for the flames.
or C: something completely different idk
Interesting ideas, I especially like the possibility that her sword/sheathe represents something important to her. The link with her sword must be story related.
another thing to note is ryoshu’s relation to red string, seen from the trailer briefly. if you look very closely at fftf, you can see that the odachi looks to be fully bound with red rope, to the point where it makes it impossible to unsheathe. whatever the red string represents (likely the red string of fate), it’s preventing her from unsheathing whatever is inside. along with that, the background of fftf is burnt wood and cinders. this might hint that ryoshu’s story is chronologically after the burning of whoever the daughter is in the carriage.
I think her line in her promo vid, about doing her "homework" hints to her being the child
I like the idea of 4 star being so strong that you cannot deploy more than one because Dante/system cannot handle it and it require some special team build limitation to deploy them as they require higher level of synchronisation like if you want to deploy Xiao Id, you need to have a certain amount of Liu IDs in the team.
I like it, however I don't think they can put too much restrictive usage in a gacha, because that would mean after passing the trouble of getting it, you have to get even more special requirements to use them, which is mostly frustrating. The trouble should be more getting it than using it. Also tying it only to some archetypes limits the "creative process", especially only being able to use it in specific teams. However only one 4 stars is a possibility, like you could only have one of objet d'art in your deck in ruina, which could be for balance purposes.
Heathcliff has the working of a typical type moon protagonist and his chapter will be giga kino
additionally with manager once being a big shot is bound to have a lot of skeletons in the closet
It's worth noting that each sinner has at least one related character in either Demian or Hermann's group (or in Yi Sang's case both) with Gregor having Hermann, Rodion having Sonia (who may be connected to Demian as he might have the Mark of Cain and knew Sinclair would meet Demian again soon), Sinclair having Demian, Yi Sang having Gubo and Rim and Ishmael having Ahab (who we see getting requited by Hermann at the end of Canto 5) so it seems like each sinner will have at least 1-2 corresponding figure(s) that either work with Demian or Hermann
I like the theory that Heathcliff follows Hareton's story (or at least a mix of it) and the person inside the bodysack is the OG Heathcliff.
That said, with Pequod ID saying Heathcliff got hurt by what Cathy said and that funeral CG scene, if Ishmael can't save Heathcliff then this canto will be the start of a very, very dark road for the guy.
Another way to do 4 star characters without making the grind/gacha for 3 stars worthless is to make them tied somehow. like if you want to get an R corp leader 4 star ID you need to own a full team of R corp members, that would also make 4 stars a bigger deal for players as getting them would require the ultimate investment/grind and be a way to cap off their collection for a faction.
Making them tied is the idea I had with upties, like they become 4 stars at uptie X, but I like your idea a lot, it would give a reward for the completion of mirror worlds (which is something I would like to see sometimes tbh) Though it would probably still need a cost, but could be like a blueprint or "a path in the mirror" to spark it in the dispenser for exemple
@@MagnetAlphaI was thinking something like a specific mirror dungeon event a few levels that ties the mirror world together
And sorta caps out each ID in that world culminating in the 4 star being shown off and every character in that mirror world getting a bit more passives and utility out of it
The caveat is that to use the 4 star and to get the benefits you have to make a significant amount of your team that mirror world with the mirror dungeon requiring a bunch of shards and thread
Imagine being told if you want to run Nclair you have to run NRodion too. How cruel.
@@snipermagoo not quite what I meant, you'd just need to have them in your collection is all. besides I doubt we are ever gonna get 4 star IDs, it's just a fun thing to think about
@@dumbino7745 I misunderstood, but having to run a whole team would help balance one of them being extra swole.
With the 4 Star IDs case, they could make it so as they are being uptied the identity is moving up higher through the association or respective faction. So these 3 star identities aren't falling off rather then making a whole new tier of identities to keep up with the power scaling. Also, to keep from getting an absurd number of upties for these identities they can make so you can directly enhance one of their skills minorly, while leaving upties to be the major upgrades. Obviously these enhances can be unlocked as we progress through the cantos.
Getting higher grades through uptie was one of the idea I tried to tell, the problems though being that it ends ups removing lower tiers bit by bit and require the dev to put twice the amount of work on any ID that has it. I like the minor upties idea though.
What if during the Outis Chapter we End up fighting Vergil with Faust marking the end of Purgotorio?
It's a possibility. I think I've heard he dies in the original work somewhere around there ? Though why we would turn our back on Verg is a question I lack an ounce of answer for.
Not only is it that identities, and even Base Sinners, are weakened currently, but it means we will eventually hit a ceiling, where either the Identities will experience a progression of sorts in their respective Mirror Worlds, or be left behind and replaced with a different Identity as we progress, perhaps even linking the two Identities through progression, making it so the players' time not feel wasted while also allowing much stronger Identities coexist in the same rarity.
Another thing that could end up happening is the Base Sinners growing in strength, maybe their E.G.O.'s will become a part of their kit, rather than be activated occasionally, to showcase a level of progression on the Sinners' part, and perhaps this would incite the aforementioned progression in the Mirror Worlds and their Identities.
Btw smth you missed, in the tgs trailer for 2022 we got REAL good hints for all the sinners stories, we got all the key artworks for all of them, Yi sang getting his wings, rodion slaying the tax collector, sinclair looking at damien, etc. so there may also be previews for future cantos, some key ones to note are ryoshu falling with some red strings around her, heathcliff walking to a grave with a notable red head woman (possibly Catherine), don supposedly waving to charge into battle or something. Stuff like that you could really analyze
I did remember the TGS, but didn't remember too much interesting stuff outside Hong Lu's pictures, which I quickly referenced but scraped out of the script, just saying that he doesn't care as much about money as he does for relationships, which I kinda already pointed quite a bit. Though after checking I agree about Ryoshu and Heathcliff. I don't think it grants a full analysis though, especially because without context they can mean a lot of different things, most images also have really few details (mainly zoomed in) and are purposefully rendered very vague.
But if I had to hazard a guess rn about the 2 interesting ones, I'd say Ryoshu red string could be apparented to the red string of fate being cut (because scissors), possibily her ties with the ring (she also doesn't have a ring, but she has a glove), or it could go into the mother theory with an umbilical cord, referencing the carriage stuff.
For Heathcliff since it looks like a funeral, I'd have said it'd be for Catherine's death rather. Though the main problem is there is no way of knowing if it's in the future or the past, like Yi Sang picture is one that happened during Canto IV. Otherwise it'd be an older event for his adoptive parents but I'd say it's Catherine's.
I dont see why there would be higher rarity for special characters. Like L corp didnt have another danger level for white night and apoc bird or red mist/garion battles same with library having Olga and Red Mist in the same Objet d'art tier
It's not an higher rarity for "special fights" but for stronger units. But the Objet d'art tier is a fair point, however I'd say the situation is different, because of the full gacha nature of the game. (and not small gacha like ruina) Imagine getting a 3 stars later with gacha as a newer player, but it ends up being an early game 3*, and that was overpowercreep'd. Plus as you advance in LoR or LC you have full choice of your units and system to get them with progression, the grade is mainly for number limitation. Limbus doesn't have that, when you gacha you gacha full random. Banners are limited time event too. They are generous so you could say you can spark them anyway, which depending on the situation is more or less complicated, and doesn't change the core problem.
So that's mainly because of the gacha nature, and the meaning of rarity, which is not the same as in Ruina.
HI I WATCHED THE DON QUIXOTE SECTION OF THIS VIDEO AND HAVE SOME… COMMENTS. I am extremely ill over this guy I have written an almost 2k word essay about her which is kind of outdated. WHATEVER. One: the sancho = don theory is disproven. SO. it has been pointed out that on Don Quixote’s jacket in her chibi form “Miguel” is written. “Miguel” also has appeared on her jacket in even recent merch! Now Miguel obviously refers to Miguel Cerevantes which now just. Outright disproves the sancho=don theory. So what could this mean?? Now miguel cerevantes had a very extensive military career which could make me think Quixote was involved in the Smoke War somewhat. He was also arrested ATLEAST 4 times also possibly for manslaughter. NOW. what if we follow Man of La Mancha! Where the phrase “The impossible dream” comes from! While i have not watched the play, Cerevantes gets incarcerated and basically puts on a show with other prisoners of his OCS. At the same time, Cerevantes, if i remember, ALSO gets criticized for his extreme idealism.. personally i think Quixote here is just a character BUT one extremely close to who LCB quixote actually is. NOW ANYWAYS THE FUCKING SPANISH INQUISITION. Miguel Cerevantes had much trouble with the spanish inquisition AGAIN shown by the fact he has been arrested this much. AND NCORP! NCORP. Nagel und Hammer extremely obviously parallels the practices of the Inquisition… additionally their followers are outright called inquisitors. Additionally in Quixote’s 1* ID art you can see people getting stabbed by what could be assumed to be nails. While I only have a very rough outline of what her full plot could be I just think in general she would be so used to performing she is so used to being dehumanized to the point she just decides to dehumanize herself. “The death of don quixote” will occur but moreso the desth of a character who only lives to please other people and the creation of someone who truly lives for theirselves. OH I DIDNT MENTION MY TAKES ABOUT HER PERSONALITY SO THIS MAKES MORE SENSE. I think don quixote is hiding things. But not much. Accross most universes she shows an intense passion and vigor no matter WHAT even in shi section!!! She might just be making herself look more happy than she is, or more valiant and knightly but she is definitely not faking those things so core to her character such as her horribly black and white thinking, impulsivity, lack of emotional intellegence and vigor!! i think she is also hiding more signs of anxiety and percieved feelings of incompetancy and inferiority.. considering the way she doesnt even condemn her “friends” for treating her so inhumanely makes me think she has a very low perception of herself paired with her consistently being silenced and looked down upon consistently by many people. she seems to be someone who is. Overly-forgiving as well and when it comes to herself she really is a doormat. VERY valiant for other people just bad at protecting herself
Sorry this is so long. Also did you touch upon how faust may or may not parallel with Malkuth considering how she has had so far two IDS directly related to her + the fact she has a hex nail ego.
Thanks for the input, very insightful. I'm not sure how much Miguel being an inspiration invalid the rest. PM likes to mix up things. The name might just be for author reference. However that's interesting as an hint. Don might just be the name of the character than she is interpreting, like the one she has made, she is then "the author", which would then make sense for her to actually be a reference to Miguel. I'm not sure if we're gonna go into the smoke war or N Corp though. The smoke war is and will be already very brought up by Gregor and Outis, same for N Corp, and there isn't any hint of it anyway. I don't see nails in her 1* art, so if you're mentionning the whole poster, to me it seems more like the entrance of a gate than actual nails, the spear end seems more like a coincidence to me. I think we'll stay closer to Don's actual character story, though there may be some references. Or it ends up being a mix up.
Concerning her personality, it is very clear than the cheerful personality is part of a persona. She is much more than some crazy gremlin. What she is hiding though isn't too clear. I'm not sure if it's incompetancy. It might be more like depression or responsibility than she is just trying to hide. Though I can understand the lack of self confidence, and doing an opposite persona full of it to compensate. I'm not sure if her "friends" treatment is so inhumane, if you're referencing to the beating to get her senses back thing. It's violent but desperate times can ask for desperate measures, and the City is already violent by itself a lot. Though I guess with the name of the EGO you could enter a whole theory that they were being "evil" and Don just snapped, said "Justice!" and empaled them, hence the name "The Blood of Sancho". Though there isn't much basis for this one.
Regarding Faust and Malkuth I didn't. They might have a common thing of "the will to stand up straight" if you consider Faust is just following orders constantly, and her lack of control over her life, though I feel like it might just be the case for other sinners, so I don't know if they are taking back the thematics of the other games.
@@MagnetAlpha YEAH i think don quixote is surely hiding alot and is not as stable and happy as she seems though the same overly idealistic and impulsive basis of her character ARE still there. We can even see this in shi section where she still shows how valiant she is despite being under so much more pressure and being obviously unstable
Just an idea. Aleph Ego. Once used, Changes the the sinners ID during that combat encounter into a that Ego but as an ID. As a sort of tranformation EGO.
This can work as a pseudo 4/5 star ID. That requires Resource generated in combat before being able to be used.
Ego has lower Drop chance compared 3 star ID so it's basically already a 4 star XD.
Why not make 4* Identities be acquired for free at the end of each sinner's canto in Paradiso? So it doesn't mess with the gacha?
That's a bit what I thought like with sinners "very personal" IDs and tzimtzum. But otherwise they can't just make 4* purely free, it undermines too much the gacha element of the game.
@@MagnetAlpha Another idea is, instead of 4* Identities, they could make 4* E.G.O based on the sinner's own E.G.O.
I want to say 000 is the last gacha rank
Because it is in Kabbalah
Suddenly adding 0000 make no sense
Because 0 mean ain which is reality
00 mean ain sof which is possible reality
000 mean ain sof or which is impossible reality
There isn’t 0000 in Kabbalah
Yeah PM is too much in love with its symbolism to do a 0000.
uptie 6 should be seccond awakening and art and 4th skill
16:18 nuh uh,he is adopted so i think that is fine
Fun fact: there is an Uptie 5 sprite in the game files, not sure when they will add it though
The Blade Lineage is Real, and oh boi you were right on that Kim ID (although yeah it was kinda called)
I still wish Dante becomes a combatable and playable sinner.
w corp mersaunt is actually three star
Yes, but he's a L2, so same rank in W Corp as the other 2 stars
@@MagnetAlpha yes, but it's strange how 7 outis is three star when 7 heatcliff is 2 star
and then there is don shin being 2 star
@@renatotorreslopesrenato1716 Outis is a director so it's understandable, Don is the outlier rather, but it can be explained because of Shi image of being constantly exhausted. But even then as I said there are some exceptions. rn, they have to fill the 2 stars pool and don't want to keep giving us section 5/6s. We'll see if they keep the trend going though. For now as long as there is no high section director being a 2 stars it's acceptable I'd say, though 2 stars Section 1s would worry me (outside Shis)
@@MagnetAlpha Yes, I agree, their distribution is strange
he even released section 4 being 2 & 3 stars at the same time
My best guess there will be around 15-26 cantos each most districts (some may be side stories). New untie each 5-6 cantos. Game story probably will last 3-5 years. Color fixers will or not be playable as 3 stars (they may introduce IDs which will match ALEPH egos, but right they just drop better IDs every canto).
They already gave us some hint in recent update: in the future, there will always be 1 new Railway, 1 new Mirror Dungeon, 1 new Walpugris. Mirror Dungeon will only have 5 instead of 20 floors, but they will tweak it a little bit so that its mechanic changes from time to time.
Also, uptie 5 is coming. There is an asset for it in the game already, so let's hope it will be the final uptie that truly balance everything (cuz right now, the Blade Linage crew still sucks).
I do not think we gonna have uptie 6 or 7, because right now, if they put uptie 5 in, the shard cost to uptie WAW/ALEPH egos will equal to the price of them in Dispenser, so I do not think it's a good move.
It's also unlikely to have 4 star IDs, judging how Walpugris IDs are not 4 stars. Also, pay-to-win players will hate it if you bring 4 star IDs into the game. That's not an option.
About difficulty curve, it's very simple to solve. PM always uses mechanic overloading to increase their difficulty, and I will not surprised if they intend to do it again. Like, in Library of Ruina, when you get to Tiph's floor, there is a new mechanic called Mass Attack that increases the game's difficulty. In Star of the City, it's EGO Pages. For final bosses, it's Ineff. Resistence. You get the gist.
I agree overall, especially with the cost of upties. Though I don't think early walpurgis not having 4 stars throws it out of the possibilities. And MD3 doesn't have 5 but 4 floors, only the hard version having 4. My 20 floors idea was more for like a one time dungeon or something.
The mechanic overload point is interesting, though it's not the only point in ruina increasing difficulty. However in Limbus, all those mechanics are already introduced, which is why the game seems complex from the start, when in ruina it was delivered slowly to ease the player into learning bit by bit. So I don't know if they can redo the same thing. Or if they do, I wonder what they can find for it. The only one I can really see is just reading checks with fight specific mechanics.
@@MagnetAlpha 20 floors dungeon could happen. Like, in end game, if they want to bring back the boss rush or something like that.
The reason why I said Walpugris not having 4 stars means 4 stars is unlikely to happen is because Walpugris is a special exclusive gacha event for the P2W players to roll. They do not introduce 4 stars this time, so they could not do it in the future anymore. This is simply because the stars are the rarity, the symbol to seperate the premium stuff and the casual stuff. By introducing 4 stars, you degrade the 3 stars IDs, and the gacha whales will never like it. It's a very important rule in gacha game system.
About mechanic overloading, it is the very reason why the difficulty in both early games are hard. It gives you the tool that completely break the game, to the point that normal game developers will never ever dare to do it in their game because it will become over-complex. Take Mass Attack as an example. Before Mass Attack, you need to 50/50 a lot of the pages because of Light economy and RNG. However, with Mass Attack, you completely stun or half stun the enemy, allowing you to sneak one-sided attack in. This is why when Queen of Hatred spams her AoE, it's always a game over because while normal pages deal around 10-20 damage, her AoE instantly deals 50 damage one-sided attack. And because of Smoke and other status effects, the final bosses of Library have to become HP-sponge so that they will not be instakilled.
There are also many ways to overload the mechanics in Limbus Company as well. They can take Arknight's example of equipment (using EGO Gifts or something) or Awakened (will surely happen to our EGOs).
@@winslycan1309 I see what you mean about degrading 3 stars value, which I mention, however I'd think if wouldn't only affect whales. But that's one of the main problems of 4 stars. However I'm not sure if expectations will be met regarding lore to gameplay power relation if we keep all at 3 stars in the future. And if they do and hard powercreep comes up instead, the result will be close to the same than if they did 4 stars.
For mechanic overloads I understand what you mean, but we'll have to see if or what they do for limbus. I agree awakening is a possibility, maybe with purgatorio, but I wouldn't want them to add stuff like equipment, especially if it becomes something to pull for. Something closer to farm would divide more the resources we get, but I guess it could be another way to spend thread and stuff without adding more upties. Maybe as another form of new additional MD reward in the future instead of more battle pass exp.
With the uptie 5 asset, I'm pretty sure that is for lunar memories cuz ego gift rarities uses the same asset as uptie levels and that is rarity 5. Although uptie 5 is still a possibility.
Hello, I cant remember where, but I recall there was a mention(prob reddit) that the rarity (2-3 stars) ties to the likelihood that the current sinners match with their alternate self.
E.g. 3 star n sinclair is super unlikely, cause it needs 3 star n faust to manipulate him.
Whereas 2 star mariachi Sinclair is possible as in canto 2, sinclair already had a knack at mariachi dancing, impressing and maybe gaining respect from the mexican guys
Else, if we assume 3 stars are stronger than 2 stars. That would mean a 3 star tingtang boss from the j corp backstreets is "canonically" stronger than Liu association members
Furthermore, Rarity ties with likeihood is more likely as it ties with gameplay: e.g. higher rarity = low likelihood to get = low likelihood the sinners are like their alternate self
Yeah I've heard about this, but I'm not sure how much I believe it tbf. PM has more infos than us, but deciding which ids are more or less likely is hard to define in the whole context of the city. For exemple, is Seven Outis really that unlikely ? Is W Corp Hong Lu more likely than K Corp ? Is Faust being a Seven Section 4 less likely than HEATHCLIFF ? I don't fully agree to it.
Also doesn't change that Shi Don should be the only director ever being a 2 stars, and that's cuz of Shi. Or only Section 4 members managing to be both 2 or 3 stars. I said there might be edge cases, TT Hong Lu was one of them, like him being a 3 stars while Mariachi Sinclair being 2. (supposing he was taken from Aida)
But I guess we just don't have a clear answer yet. If the trend continue I'll have to accept likeliness as the main reason.
There is no way we can go through purgatorio and paradiso. Limbus just cant survive that long and it will be longer then both l corp and library combined and City power structure just doesnt have that many tiers like we are already at waw tier abnos
They did put WAW pretty soon I think power wise. But it will come slowly and be more scarce, for now at least. However there are many structures and factions in the City to go through before Power Ranking. Ruina gave us a wrong impression I think by making us climb the tiers extremely quickly. But Limbus being a long time project I'm pretty sure they can manage to make it last.
@@MagnetAlpha Limbus is probably weirder power progression wise like Kromer was a HE and we couldn't beat her in original encounter then we go on to beat distorted and ego awakened Dongrang who is a Teth which makes sense but in Canto 5 we fight a dungeon where every boss is a WAW
@@azchhn I'll admit the abno ranking so far is weird. Though one could argue that the ranking is not necessarily linked to their fighting power, but more the potential of casualties they are likely to do, taking back the Lobcorp Manual.
This will be peak when we get QOH back
I think it would be interesting if 0000 IDs get released, that you can only deploy one of them in your team at the same time, as to encourage to not just mash in the strongest IDs and instead build around the one 0000 ID you have.
Not gonna lie. The idea of a 20 floor mirror dungeon that gives you a bajillion boxes does make me salivate a bit.
I think there will be 12-3 chapters in inferno and paradiso and purgatorio will be 1 maybe 2 chapters
We are getting stronger ids, newer 3* association ids have their section rank higher than earlier ones
Soon chapter 5.5???
does this video has Portuguese subtitles or i'm just crazy
Ryoshu's sword is 100% her daughter also we'll have to fight the monkey from her story who was the only being that tried defending the daughter
Ma sono matto o sei ita?
Mirrorclock orangeroad could be a clockwork orange reference.
Oh you referenced it right after I posted this…
Just a brainfart but what if the potentially 4 star ids worked like the transformation ego pages? There is already a aleph level which red mist or colours could go in, just a neat idea I had.
Given the English name, Ahab's general gaslighting and controlling behavior, and the literature Project Moon likes to reference? RR3: MirrorCLOCK ORANGEroad is likely a Clockwork Orange ref.
sympa de voir que je suis pas l'unique personne en France a aimer Project moon ^^
Haha, tkt doit y en avoir pas mal, faut juste les trouver.
Hear me out don's chapter bout to be depressing as hell since she always puts on a mask (the mask slipped off at canto 2) so yeah imma buckle up
🗣️
Crazy Curveball/Crazy Idea/FanTheory.
Limbus is the bad guy, and Faust knows all outcome.
Faust rarely ever use the "I" pronoun. Faust is being ordered around by an alternate universe version of Faust ownself, but as an overlord supergenius, through the mirror.
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Outis isn't from this version of the universe, but is a Trojan Horse from an alternate Universe to stop Overlord Faust. In a way, Outis is actually far from their original home.
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By the Time we finish Mersault's Canto, N-Corp would been defeated by us. Also, Mersault definitely gonna fight a collective consciousness type of entity.
I really, really don't want higher rarities. Mostly because the grind sounds absolutely insufferable. At first, it's just one or two, and that's okay, because the thread, shard, lunacy costs- they're whatever, right? You're paying for the strength, so all's good. But then more come out, and then some come out for walpurgisnacht, then suddenly there's tons of them and if you want to play the harder content you're going to need a meta team. I'm not a gacha gamer, I'm a project moon fan- and because of that I already find most of the game's grinding absolutely insufferable. I can't imagine it getting much worse and me still sticking around, considering I've already spent so many hours of my life on this game.