Melissa, have you considered doing a master's or doctorate in theology? You come so alive when you discuss the history, theology and doctrine of all the LDS churches. You would be a very good lecturer.
I agree! Melissa, you’ve jumped into this rabbit hole with gusto; why not make it your career? Do research, teach, write a book or two? An academic life is definitely not for the faint of heart, but it is definitely possible. You have so much potential!
Maybe I am wrong, but it was my understanding that the group you are talking about were sent to Mexico (to keep practicing Polygamyl)by the mainstream LDS church when the leaders decided to acqueise to the U.S. government to stop practicing polygamy. Jon Krakauer addresses this issue in his book "Under the Banner of Heaven."
@@EMoore-rf6cc You are correct that more people will watch a RUclips video than will enroll in a college theology class. However, I was commenting on how fulfilled Melissa seems when she discusses theology and doctrine. To see someone who loves the deep dive speaks to my scholarly heart!
Read “The Favorite Wife: Escape From Polygamy” by Susan Schmidt. (She was Verlan LeBaron’s wife.) She goes in-depth on the background of the LeBaron family.
OMG - yes - deep dive! I'm up for a 'Master's Class' on the lineage and course that all the LDS-S-s-s-es... Ya know with tree graphic and dates flashed on the screen! Please, Ya don't have to say much more that - we don't believe or endorse any of the beliefs of these folks but here is how we got here...... So many off shoots - all of which appear to be a litte too culty for us not to know.... most importantly cause we appear to have missing KIDS, family members and loved ones with in these branches of the 'churches'.......
Please do a video about blood atonement. I was just talking about blood atonement with my TBM friend yesterday and she never heard of it. As an exmormon I know way more about the history than when I was a true believer!
Love how your channel uses stereo. Could you do one more thing? Switch left and right. Sam on the left channel, and Melissa on the right channel. Thanks.
shelise from cults to consciousness has done a few videos with the main sisters in the show!! maybe you could see if they'd be interested in talking to you guys?
Hey guys great video! FYI when listening to your videos lately with headphones on Sam is only coming through of the left side and Melissa is only coming in through the right ear. ❤
I was wearing only one bud so I could keep an ear out for family and thought perhaps it was a mic issue. Thankful for your comment so I could plug both in my ears and hear Sam so much better 😊
I was listening to the podcast called “Deliver us from Ervil” and apparently Ervil Lebaron was unable to track down another brother of his that he wanted dead who was in hiding. That brother was friends with Rulon Allred, so the plan was to draw him out by murdering Allred and shooting the brother when he attended the funeral. There were assassins at the funeral ready to carry out the plot, but they backed out because of the heavy police presence at the event. (I can hardly believe that I know all that. 😮) Thanks for your podcasts. You two are so loving, you give me hope for the world.
that was verlin LeBaron. Verlin, married two of Rulon Allred‘s nieces. One of them wrote two books if you wanna know more about it, look up Irene Spencer, who was Verlin‘s second wife.
Maybe I am wrong, but it was my understanding that the group you are talking about were sent to Mexico (to keep practicing Polygamyl)by the mainstream LDS church when the leaders decided to acqueise to the U.S. government to stop practicing polygamy. Jon Krakauer addresses this issue in his book "Under the Banner of Heaven."
My sister, Celia, is appalled that she misquoted the origins of "the one mighty and strong." She KNEW it was the D&C, but inadvertently said the Book of Mormon.
It happens to us all! And where it is exactly from isn't what matters, the fact that it is used to cause harm is what matters. You both did a wonderful job in sharing your story ❤️
Hey Sam and Melissa, I’ll bet you never thought you would learn all this about polygamy, it’s a huge rabbit hole! I have read most of the books that have come out from this group, as well as the other groups from other colonies down there. It has been fascinating to finally have videos about these topics, we can never forget all the carnage suffered from those who demanded this lifestyle from the people
When was this happening. I met a girl around 2014-2015 in college who told me she left a polygamist group in Mexico. This was before I know anything about that. She had an aunt who was a lawyer and would open her home to girls who wanted to leave.
Did you guys review the Under the Banner of Heaven Book, hulu Drama series? I asked my LDS friend about it, and she acted like she had never heard of it. Our friendship has cooled since then.
Talking about these groups with main line members can be tricky. It involves church history and the members are generally spoon fed very sugary versions of church history. Also sharing with non believers they don't feel equiped to talk about it. I experienced this as a convert and my ex wife being a member. Hope you and your friend can reconnect!
I live in Independence Missouri and it is where Smith layed a Cornerstone for the "Temple" and said how big it should be. So now the RLDS, LDS and the Community of Christ ALL own a piece of that property. There is a giant spire building where Christ is supposed to return right next to the dome of the RLDS building which is a stones throw from The stone building of the Community of Christ. They fight all the time over the property!!! Not one owns all of the property to build the temple that Joseph Smith layed out. Independence is just south of Liberty where Smith was jailed!! All that history is not only in Utah.
Just sort of a clarification on where the authority comes from according to Anna Lebarron the authority comes from Benjamin Johnson a man who was spiritually adopted by Joseph Smith.
To be honest, your summary of this doc was so much more transparent vs the conversation I saw with the LeBaron women, who seemed to say only good things about their siblings
I think they just wanted to let the public to know that their siblings were forced to atone and are in prison for it. It was kill or be killed very sick cult 😢
I just finished watching all the episodes. They all looked so uncomfortable during the interviews. Any and all laughs sounded like nervous laughs. A few smiles here and there, but mostly it was very sad 😔.
Does anyone know of a video that talks about Mormonism spinning off of Christianity or even an overview of the restoration movement in general? Everything I can find is so boring am hoping for a channel like this :)
If you guys haven't already seen it, ya'll should watch the mockumentary "The God Makers". It's a film based on the Mormon church and some of the break off churches that stem from the original church. Sandra Tanner is in the film, and I'm sure you guys know that she's a prolific Mormon historian, and a 2nd great granddaughter of Brigham Young that has been exposing the Mormon church and their false doctrines for decades. The film also talks about the FLDS. and the LeBarons, I believe it was made and came out in the early 80s. There are a few members of the LeBaron family that were interviewed in the film, and were running from their family because they were afraid that they were marked for blood atonement, and they actually were. Some of them didn't survive long enough to see the film after it was released to the public. A very sad narrative indeed.
I was born in the Lebarron group and am quite familiar with their priesthood claims and history. I haven’t believed in Mormonism for years, but I’d be happy to talk to you.
Irene Spencer (Rulon Allreds niece), who is passed away now but has children and grandchildren maybe you could talk to? (her daughter Donna was in the show) she wrote a book on the history of the lebarons a little bit.. also her husband Verlan LeBaron wrote a book as well that dives deep into the family.. although i think thats a harder book to read, hes a bit rambly but irene was a great story teller. another one of Verlans wives was Susan Ray Schimdt.. shes done a few speaking engagements and also wrote a book about her life with the lebarons.. i think there are a few books out there about the history...possibly Verlans mother wrote a book as well (so the founder Alma's wife) Anna LeBaron is Ervil's daughter and she also wrote a book.. shes a great speaker but i dont know if she dove into the history or anything.
~ Thank you for your presentations. You answer so many questions for me. I’m glad to donate to the Dream Center & support however I can. You are both Angels, that walk amount us… ❌⭕️
I like the way Sam and Melissa allow each other to speak. 🙂 I'm a former member of a different type of cult like church (left in the 90s, not recent) but I really relate and am enjoying all the highs and lows of your stories 🙂 on the channel. I wish you both the very, very best together X 🙂
I find this so fascinating because Christina on sister wives is related to the LeBarons through her mom. Then her new husbands sisters married in that group.
The first book I ever read about fundamentalist Mormonism was Favorite Wife by Susan Ray Schmidt. She was married to one of Ervil LeBaron's brothers at the age of 14 and was in the group when Joel was murdered. She had a very epic escape with her 6 children, and the hardest part was being able to take the children along with her. A very eye opening read.
All those groups are scary, but last time I heard you guys mention anything about your own "journey" was quite a while ago I hope you have not totally given up on God in some loving form.
I believe the female singer in Adam's Road Ministry is from the LeBaron Group. The rest of Adam's Road came out of the Mainstream LDS. Get in contact with Micah Wilder.
Melissa, have you considered doing a master's or doctorate in theology? You come so alive when you discuss the history, theology and doctrine of all the LDS churches. You would be a very good lecturer.
Thank you so much! 😊
I agree! Melissa, you’ve jumped into this rabbit hole with gusto; why not make it your career? Do research, teach, write a book or two? An academic life is definitely not for the faint of heart, but it is definitely possible. You have so much potential!
I definitely agree but Melissa can reach more people on RUclips!
Maybe I am wrong, but it was my understanding that the group you are talking about were sent to Mexico (to keep practicing Polygamyl)by the mainstream LDS church when the leaders decided to acqueise to the U.S. government to stop practicing polygamy. Jon Krakauer addresses this issue in his book "Under the Banner of Heaven."
@@EMoore-rf6cc You are correct that more people will watch a RUclips video than will enroll in a college theology class. However, I was commenting on how fulfilled Melissa seems when she discusses theology and doctrine. To see someone who loves the deep dive speaks to my scholarly heart!
The Warren Jeffs photo suddenly appearing was such a jump scare. 😂
😂😂😂
Like, boo😂
🤣🤣🤣
Haha sorry about that!
It was!
The one to talk to is Lindsay Hansen Park. She was interviewed (along with me and my sister, Celia) as a Mormon Historian on the documentary.
Read “The Favorite Wife: Escape From Polygamy” by Susan Schmidt. (She was Verlan LeBaron’s wife.) She goes in-depth on the background of the LeBaron family.
Yes. I’ve watched several interviews with her and she explains things so well.
OMG - yes - deep dive! I'm up for a 'Master's Class' on the lineage and course that all the LDS-S-s-s-es... Ya know with tree graphic and dates flashed on the screen! Please, Ya don't have to say much more that - we don't believe or endorse any of the beliefs of these folks but here is how we got here...... So many off shoots - all of which appear to be a litte too culty for us not to know.... most importantly cause we appear to have missing KIDS, family members and loved ones with in these branches of the 'churches'.......
Please do a video about blood atonement. I was just talking about blood atonement with my TBM friend yesterday and she never heard of it. As an exmormon I know way more about the history than when I was a true believer!
I know this has been posted before but "Ervil LeBaron" sounds like a movie villain name 😆
a Sims vampire character
Because Ervil sounds like Evil
@@florecitadelcampo13
I grew up calling him “Evil LeBaron”
Love how your channel uses stereo. Could you do one more thing? Switch left and right. Sam on the left channel, and Melissa on the right channel. Thanks.
shelise from cults to consciousness has done a few videos with the main sisters in the show!! maybe you could see if they'd be interested in talking to you guys?
Hey guys great video! FYI when listening to your videos lately with headphones on Sam is only coming through of the left side and Melissa is only coming in through the right ear. ❤
Glad it’s not just me. It’s disorienting.
@@BuchsdrN Yeah. I'm not the type that ever wants to leave negative comments. But I myself found it really distracting.
I was wearing only one bud so I could keep an ear out for family and thought perhaps it was a mic issue. Thankful for your comment so I could plug both in my ears and hear Sam so much better 😊
I was listening to the podcast called “Deliver us from Ervil” and apparently Ervil Lebaron was unable to track down another brother of his that he wanted dead who was in hiding. That brother was friends with Rulon Allred, so the plan was to draw him out by murdering Allred and shooting the brother when he attended the funeral. There were assassins at the funeral ready to carry out the plot, but they backed out because of the heavy police presence at the event.
(I can hardly believe that I know all that. 😮)
Thanks for your podcasts. You two are so loving, you give me hope for the world.
that was verlin LeBaron. Verlin, married two of Rulon Allred‘s nieces. One of them wrote two books if you wanna know more about it, look up Irene Spencer, who was Verlin‘s second wife.
I’m so glad I was raised Methodist. I can’t imagine living in those types of conditions.
I would like to learn more about blood atonement from you. Please consider doing an episode about that.
Maybe I am wrong, but it was my understanding that the group you are talking about were sent to Mexico (to keep practicing Polygamyl)by the mainstream LDS church when the leaders decided to acqueise to the U.S. government to stop practicing polygamy. Jon Krakauer addresses this issue in his book "Under the Banner of Heaven."
My sister, Celia, is appalled that she misquoted the origins of "the one mighty and strong." She KNEW it was the D&C, but inadvertently said the Book of Mormon.
It happens to us all! And where it is exactly from isn't what matters, the fact that it is used to cause harm is what matters. You both did a wonderful job in sharing your story ❤️
Hey Sam and Melissa, I’ll bet you never thought you would learn all this about polygamy, it’s a huge rabbit hole! I have read most of the books that have come out from this group, as well as the other groups from other colonies down there. It has been fascinating to finally have videos about these topics, we can never forget all the carnage suffered from those who demanded this lifestyle from the people
Rulon Allred is Christine Browns grandfather
I have never been LDS but am very interested to hear about blood atonement. Thank you for your great videos! I learn so much from you both.
Us guys should listen to the podcast Deliver us from Ervil. It’s so well done and very detailed on the family history
Yes I would love to learn more about the history of Blood Attonement. Love your videos!
When was this happening. I met a girl around 2014-2015 in college who told me she left a polygamist group in Mexico. This was before I know anything about that. She had an aunt who was a lawyer and would open her home to girls who wanted to leave.
You should talk to Lindsay Park Hansen and listen to her podcast. She’s got an episode about this.
Did you guys review the Under the Banner of Heaven Book, hulu Drama series? I asked my LDS friend about it, and she acted like she had never heard of it. Our friendship has cooled since then.
We have not had a chance to review that one yet. We have recently talked about it though
Talking about these groups with main line members can be tricky. It involves church history and the members are generally spoon fed very sugary versions of church history. Also sharing with non believers they don't feel equiped to talk about it.
I experienced this as a convert and my ex wife being a member.
Hope you and your friend can reconnect!
omg ervil's photo popping up was such a jumpscare with my lights off watching this 😭 his smile looks so wicked and evil
This was so interesting. Please do more like this about other fundamentalist groups.
I live in Independence Missouri and it is where Smith layed a Cornerstone for the "Temple" and said how big it should be. So now the RLDS, LDS and the Community of Christ ALL own a piece of that property. There is a giant spire building where Christ is supposed to return right next to the dome of the RLDS building which is a stones throw from The stone building of the Community of Christ. They fight all the time over the property!!! Not one owns all of the property to build the temple that Joseph Smith layed out. Independence is just south of Liberty where Smith was jailed!! All that history is not only in Utah.
The caption calls you, Sam, an ex-polygamist. Actually you were born into this cult. You never practiced it.
Just sort of a clarification on where the authority comes from according to Anna Lebarron the authority comes from Benjamin Johnson a man who was spiritually adopted by Joseph Smith.
Did you change some sound settings? I've been listening to you on a headphone, and today I can't hear Sam at all!
I would like to learn about blood atonement. That was a shocker when you guys mentioned it.
To be honest, your summary of this doc was so much more transparent vs the conversation I saw with the LeBaron women, who seemed to say only good things about their siblings
I think they just wanted to let the public to know that their siblings were forced to atone and are in prison for it. It was kill or be killed very sick cult 😢
I'd LOVE an episode about blood atonement! I'm super interested in the theology.
From what I read in the Jurnals of Discourses, it primarily Brigham Young that pushed the idea of blood atonment.
Love the visuals!! So helpful - thank you!
I live near El Paso, Tx and I would love to hear more about the Lebaron history. I’ve heard that name growing up in this part of the country.
I could totally have you 2 as my Sunday school teachers as an adult. I need yall 🤣
I have read Irene Spencer 's Shattered Dreams and Cult Insanity. She was so brave to survive what she did in the LeBaron Group
I love hearing you two talk and provide truth 💘 I also love how you give others courage and hope. Love, Shauna from Cleveland ❤
The unbroken line of charlatanry lets you pull the world's truest rabbit out of the hat.
I would like to hear more about blood atonement
I just finished watching all the episodes. They all looked so uncomfortable during the interviews. Any and all laughs sounded like nervous laughs. A few smiles here and there, but mostly it was very sad 😔.
I love that you added the scripture for us to see! ❤
Have you listened to A Year in Polygamy with Lindsay Hanson Park? It’s amazing.
Here me out: get Christine brown.
Brielle Decker said that the FLDS were going to kill her when she was held in her brother's trailer.
I had to go watch the documentary part one. I like documentaries.
Break the silence. Break the cycle.
Yes please do a video on where blood atonement came from
Does anyone know of a video that talks about Mormonism spinning off of Christianity or even an overview of the restoration movement in general? Everything I can find is so boring am hoping for a channel like this :)
If you guys haven't already seen it, ya'll should watch the mockumentary "The God Makers". It's a film based on the Mormon church and some of the break off churches that stem from the original church. Sandra Tanner is in the film, and I'm sure you guys know that she's a prolific Mormon historian, and a 2nd great granddaughter of Brigham Young that has been exposing the Mormon church and their false doctrines for decades. The film also talks about the FLDS. and the LeBarons, I believe it was made and came out in the early 80s. There are a few members of the LeBaron family that were interviewed in the film, and were running from their family because they were afraid that they were marked for blood atonement, and they actually were. Some of them didn't survive long enough to see the film after it was released to the public. A very sad narrative indeed.
Please do a show on Blood Atonement in the early mainstream LDS church 🙏🏻😊
Yes, please discuss more on blood atonement.
love the long intro, it was really interesting
⚠️ Hi, priest & priestess mean magicians 🧙♂️& witches 🧙♀️ etc etc Jesus was a magician too, look this 🆙
‘His bowels shall be a fountain of truth’ - what does that mean?
He's full of shit?😂
I was born in the Lebarron group and am quite familiar with their priesthood claims and history. I haven’t believed in Mormonism for years, but I’d be happy to talk to you.
You guys thumbnail game is on point! They are cracking me up.
This whole documentary was wild. Each episode just give more shocks. It was well done though!
And an interesting fact Christine Brown is a granddaughter of Rulon Allred 😮
And Anna LeBaron’s second cousin
Irene Spencer (Rulon Allreds niece), who is passed away now but has children and grandchildren maybe you could talk to? (her daughter Donna was in the show) she wrote a book on the history of the lebarons a little bit.. also her husband Verlan LeBaron wrote a book as well that dives deep into the family.. although i think thats a harder book to read, hes a bit rambly but irene was a great story teller. another one of Verlans wives was Susan Ray Schimdt.. shes done a few speaking engagements and also wrote a book about her life with the lebarons.. i think there are a few books out there about the history...possibly Verlans mother wrote a book as well (so the founder Alma's wife) Anna LeBaron is Ervil's daughter and she also wrote a book.. shes a great speaker but i dont know if she dove into the history or anything.
Yes do a deep dive on the theology of blood atonement.
~ Thank you for your presentations. You answer so many questions for me. I’m glad to donate to the Dream Center & support however I can. You are both Angels, that walk amount us… ❌⭕️
Thank you so much! ❤️
I like the way Sam and Melissa allow each other to speak. 🙂 I'm a former member of a different type of cult like church (left in the 90s, not recent) but I really relate and am enjoying all the highs and lows of your stories 🙂 on the channel. I wish you both the very, very best together X 🙂
I find this so fascinating because Christina on sister wives is related to the LeBarons through her mom. Then her new husbands sisters married in that group.
They also killed her grandfather on her dad side Rulon Allred.
Christine Brown and Anna LeBaron are second cousins
They are all related!
Her mom is Ruth Anna Lebaron, but goes by Annie and her dad is Rex Allred, son of Ruland Allred. This is why they say she’s polygamy royalty.
Also she is a cousin of Robyn's first husband David Jessup.
I am curious about the doctrine of blood atonement.
and Christine Brown is related to both families. Father is Allred and mother is a LeBaron
no wonder why Kody wanted to marry Christine. SMH
I, like others, cut my polygamist teeth on this group and I'm so excited y'all are diving into them.
Melissa's microphone isn't switched on
Yes please do a video about blood atonement teachings 😮😢
First. It's so cold here, 14 degrees F.
The first book I ever read about fundamentalist Mormonism was Favorite Wife by Susan Ray Schmidt. She was married to one of Ervil LeBaron's brothers at the age of 14 and was in the group when Joel was murdered. She had a very epic escape with her 6 children, and the hardest part was being able to take the children along with her. A very eye opening read.
Same! What a rabbit hole!😂
Her sister wife, Irene, Spencer wrote two more books about their life
@@paulan7218 I read those books too!
All those groups are scary, but last time I heard you guys mention anything about your own "journey" was quite a while ago I hope you have not totally given up on God in some loving form.
I hate the topic of blood atonement but good to do a video on the topic but with warning for people
I would love to learn more about blood atonement cause ive never geard of it till just a few years ago.
I believe the female singer in Adam's Road Ministry is from the LeBaron Group. The rest of Adam's Road came out of the Mainstream LDS. Get in contact with Micah Wilder.
I would love to see a video on blood atonement. It’s such an interesting subject.
Are the La Barons the family of Christine Brown new husband ?
It was Christine’s grandfather that was murdered by his brother, her great uncle.