The State Of Mercy & Spilo’s Rework Ideas! | Niandra
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- Опубликовано: 19 июн 2024
- Let's talk about Spilo's recent video where he discusses the state of Overwatch 2 supports, including Mercy! We'll be going through the rework ideas he brought up and her state in general!
Watch Spilo's video here: • MERCY & MOIRA FIXED: t...
00:00 - Introduction
00:49 - 1. Damage-Boost
04:20 - 2. Movement
10:55 - 3. Resurrect
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I get straight up bored when I can't zip around and tend to teammates as needed. If they just want me to hide behind walls and pocket I change to a different support. The movement is what makes Mercy fun and is part of her utility. She barely puts out any damage at all so nerfing her movement further would make her damn near pointless.
Literally, her movement is the only reason I play her. I love flying around
Same here I loved her movement and when the GA changes came it seriously changed how much I enjoyed Mercy. I’ve been playing more custom games instead with other characters like Lifeweaver
@@e2m3same
I feel like the only thing that would be bad is the movement speed increase. Because with the previous dps passive that made them faster, no one enjoyed it because it throws off your aim. I can’t imagine trying to shoot people and then suddenly being off target because mercy blue beams you 🦑
Right and it decreases lucio’s value, who is already on thin ice
Lucio: *exists*
In all honesty, I'm more against the CD reduction. It'd be super counter-intuitive to play with and especially frustrating - against.
[before someone mentions kitsune rush - it is a predictable time-limited Q, which either results in a won fight anyway, or the enemy completely disengages and CD doesn't matter that much]
@@iriselle1918 I mean more as you don’t expect it from Mercy. Lucio has had that since the beginning. Plus I just think it’d be interesting if we didn’t have another thing that gave a movement speed buff
@@iriselle1918 imagining a pocketed kiriko with lower suzu reduction is ahem, awful
kiriko ult throws off aim
Quick hit notice for people that haven't watched Spilo's vid and don't intend to: Throughout this wherever you see "Spilo's" this or that, it's actually from surveying his community, so the ideas were generated with hundreds of feedback points and Spilo's just presenting them in his vid.
Imagine the dmg boost changing so it can lower players cooldowns. That would 100% feed into more of the pocket play style. Ashe dynamite on a lower cd and imagine the genji dashes! Like no way, people would hate that way more imo 😭
This is very true!
5:56 Personally, I think that Mercy’s OW1 movement skill was mostly about _how_ the movement tech was used than simply being able to perform the mechanical inputs anyway. There were a bunch of niche techs, but simply knowing the basic slingshots and superjump got you like 95% of what you needed to master Mercy’s movement. People say that superjump differentiated the good Mercy players from the bad ones, but there were literally bronze players who could superjump consistently and still couldn’t get out of bronze. What made good Mercy movement, then and now, was using the various GA options along with positioning and gamesense to go where needed, dodge abilities, etc. There was mechanical skill in curving slingshots and controlling the early-release lower superjumps, but I think that’s basically equivalent to, for example, using the directional GA to clear corners and ledges efficiently without extraneous floating, or to make it over a rooftop with just enough momentum to slide to the other side.
Yes and this is why I miss it so much. It felt so good to make split second decisions on whether to horizontal GA into a sideways GA, or prop bounce off something, or medium superjump over a ledge, etc.
Really fair criticisms all the way through- my goal was mostly to spark conversation as I'm really not sure what would be best for Mercy in the future. Thanks for sharing your critiques!
Thank you for your video!
Damage boost is a pretty simple mechanic so any change seems over complicated in comparison
It's unfortunately also got a stranglehold on DPS design and balance. Things that would overtuned but not OP become oppressive and mandatory bc of damage boost, as well as the problem of the noob stomper heroes feeling even more stompy bc of it as well.
Its overtuned. Nerf it down to 15%
Bro that just eliminates any depth with the character, you'd just be encouraged to healbot even more and it'd limit more playstyles with the character @@Vastspartan
@@TheRealSoravyoure buggin fr brodie.
15% is actually solid breakpoint, but I also think that there's a bigger issue than damage boost which is the 55 HPS.
I would have to find the video that was recently posted which showed visuals and time frames to prove that Mercy's healing is actually more effective at keeping her target up than damage boost is at improving the selected players kill potential.
If you drop the healing it will make DPS have to be more methodical about their approach or peeking.
Rather than standing boldly on main while my Junkrat Phara gets cooked on Circuit Royale and im on Support...
@@InfernoZX5idk if you know this but you can switch between dps boost and healing, so if a player is at max health theres no reason not to dps boost at that specific time- regardless of what the average of some test said.
I get nervous every time I hear something about rez being reworked, but I like the ideas put forth here! Rez for me usually feels like a quick teleport from spawn rather than a team fight changer, as most rezes I actually successfully do are when the fight is over, so we can prepare quicker for the next one, or before the fight really begins, which just usually evens out the fight again.
I have an unhealthy attachment to dmg boost n it’s primarily because of the little ticks you hear when dmg is being done,, literally a mini asmr session
I know. What if Mercy could just rez an entire team with her ult? Wait...
I feel like mercy rez just cannot be ever removed, because mercy is just way too popular of a character and by connection resurrect is way too iconic.
Like, if you asked someone with surface level knowledge about ow, specially if we think back to 2016-2017 when it was everywhere, one of the first things that person would have probably mentioned is mercy and "HEROES NEVER DIE". Her identify already took way too much of a blow when rez got turned into a normal ability (specially in that period of time where her ult DIDN'T EVEN SAY THE LINE), I think removing it entirely is just never happening, and tbh I'm not sure if it should, regardless of balance.
It's a "suffering from success" that other problamatic abilities like high noon and widow one shot suffer from as well. Barely anyone shed a tear when Orisa shield got sent to the farm, but when you're talking about IP defining heroes and abilities, the conversation becomes a lot tougher and I'm not sure balance has the last word.
Tbh mercy is passive in terms of balancing and it all depends on the state of the game overall. I feel like mercy isn’t the problem. 5v5 really hurt a lot of characters and mercy’s no exception, especially with everything getting sped up. Of course mercy will have more time to blue beam when there’s around 500 hp subtracted from the teams overall health pool. And she has to be more stationary with an entire tank being off the field to hold and create space for her to move. I just feel like a lot of characters are struggling with the same thing just in different shades bc they just weren’t designed for 5v5.
If mercy gets a rework this will just exaggerate other issues with other characters and throw off the game even more.
@@justinkunheeyi i feel like a good chunk of mercy being in the spotlight after the 6v6 to 5v5 change is because people are so upset at a character that they perceive as easy to use/play/get value out of shouldn't be in an FPS game, 'cause like you said there are totally other heros suffering from this and imho, support role as a whole is hella overtuned to shit (yet somehow it always comes back to mercy). she touched on the type of people like that lightly in the video, plenty of them on reddit, in the comments, and living on the OW servers themselves. she got all of the shit she's getting now in OW1 but it wasn't as intense, now after losing a tank, she's constantly being mentioned (meanwhile the only other heros you hear about are the ones that are glitch/buggy levels of broken like doom). moira being a close second. these are both not aim intensive heros and get value out of having other skills they bring to the game but the FPS bros aren't havin' it. the FPS bros also need to realize that this isn't your typical CoD or Tarkov clone, it's its own little beast.
If 1 shots are removed I wouldn't mind if res was something that could only be exclusively used during valk. Not a huge AOE res like before. Just 1 res. It would make Valk feel a lot more impactful without being busted
But then what would they replace Res with when not in Valk? Maybe an ability that allowed the beam to chain up to an additional ally? That way, swapping it out for Res during Valk wouldn't feel like your ability was snatched away... Because you get a version of it that chains up to everyone by default during Valk anyways.
But if a heal chain ability is a viable option for a Res replacement they'd have tweak both beams values to compensate.
Still, 1 shots gotta go first.
Ohh if they made Rez exclusive to Valk not only would that make Valk feel more impactful but also they could buff Rez so that it doesn't send the Mercy back to spawn half the time. That's the best Rez rework I've heard so far. As far as what the ability would do outside of Rez, they could use the same animation sped up and make it a powerful single-target heal maybe. So before Valk = back from brink of death, after Valk = back from literal death.
@@user-et3xn2jm1u I REALLY like that ideia.
Niandra videos always make it a nicer day. I feel like you hit on what's wrong with Spilo's ideas: He's forgetting that Mercy is supposed to be new player friendly. So changing her to be more difficult would require changes somewhere else to keep the support category from having too steep of a learning curve. And I guess that's not too surprising considering he's a coach, and likely isn't thinking of any character from the perspective of new player accessibility, It's just not something a coach would ever have to consider.
In regards to her movement, I think they should revert the ability back to its state in season 1, but increase the cooldown to 2 seconds. She should also be able to cancel the ability mid-use. She just hasn't been as fun to play since they made changes to her movement in season 3..
you can still cancel ga.. or what do you mean by that?
@@user-kw9uf4of8mWell, she can cancel the ability, but it doesn't start the cooldown any sooner like it used to in season 1-3.
@@fernando5230 ahh okay i see what you mean now thanks :)
@@fernando5230 i believe it starts the cooldown right away when you don't use any tech (slingshot or superjump) after the ga so cancelling does it too.
Why tf would they ever revert it and nerf it.. The reason Mercy's GA was ever reworked come OW2 is because of how unimpactful it would be in 5v5. The only reason to ever revert Mercy's GA is to give her the 1.5s second CD at all stages. I'd rather her current GA than that and I absolutely despise Mercy's GA right now.
I commented this on Spilo's video.
I had an idea for Mercy years ago that you give her staff an "overheat" mechanic, which locks you out completely for a few seconds. The closer you push it towards "overheating" the higher the healing or damage boost you get, but they would be on separate meters, healing targets would lower the damage boost "heat" and damage boosting would lower the healing "heat"
Neglecting healing or damage boosts for long periods of time would lead to the staff healing/boosting low amounts, this would mean that you have to balance using both aspects to get the most out of her while also doing it at the right time.
I love your calm and level headed approach to all of this. The skillshot res does honestly sound pretty fun, but I'm also so fine with a whole new ability instead. Have a good October!! 🎃
Was literally watching a Spilo video when I got a notification of your video and RUSHED over!
Omg, the entire time I was watching his video I just kept thinking "I wonder what Niandra thinks of this 🤔". I didn't expect to actually find out! 🙏
Niandra, I just wanted to say that your videos are so helpful because now I'm actually ranking up and knowing what I'm doing, absolutely love your videos and how much they help me.
One change I would make is to GA that gives her a burst heal, while you GA, you would charge up the meter; when you do the slingshot, you will bust heal yourself and your current target, but doing the superjump, it will burst heal in an AOE way similar to Lucio's Amp.
Negative IQ take
See switching valk and rez just makes sense to me tho, it just feels right. Rez feels like an ult and valk seems like a tool, an ability to help with a specific situation (longer beam, longer ga distance, ga reset etc). And the idea of a halo that you have to apply before they die and expires is a good idea but it has been done before in smite, on a god called kephrii. Basically it's his ult to apply and it gives someone extra speed and if they die in the time they have the buff they get slowly moved to kephrii in orb formation. This requires kephrii to be in a good position so that when the rez happens it's not wasted immediately. Now it is also an ultimate to stop people from abusing it. If it's just on an ability cool down then people will ask for the buff and be allowed to run in recklace knowing they are safe and will either be killed and rezzed or not be killed in order to be kept in a bad position, but someone with the power of immortality will do what ever they want with little punishment. Check out kephriis god guide on smites RUclips and it shows abilities, he is like a big beetle 😊
My biggests beef with mercy rez is that some heroes have a max dps that is too slow to kill a mercy in the time it takes to use rez (Especially during valk with the constant regen, I really wish it took like 0.2 seconds to kick in rather than being constant). Its most prominent at long ranges when you have damage drop off/ a shotgun/ are restricted to just a few long range attacks but its especially painful on winston. I often find you will often dive a sniper in a spot where your team cannot support you and theres basically no reason to guard rez unless you think the mercy wont be able to get back to her other support in time after the rez (and even then its still trading one support for one dps, who might be hard carrying that match).
If taking 100 damage cancelled rez, kinda like how sunstruck activates, I would be much happier.
You need to realise that going for rez takes mercy out of the fight for 3-4 seconds, this leaves the other support very vulnerable (unless they are kiriko or Moira) the 2nd support is a very good target after you get a pick because it put mercy in a position where she has to let somebody die
@@bigfudge2031 If during the time it takes for rez I cannot kill a mercy with no ability to move and no self heal option then I sure as hell cannot kill another support who has multiple self heal abilities, escape options and support from their teams. Espeically when even if I do get the other support low I cannot block mercys healing with a shield for some reason. I get that its a trade of abilities, and that the resources they use means my team has an advantage, but it still feels awful. I just feel like a glorified punching bag who jumps in to let my teammates have the actual fun.
@@BagelBoi4000I don't want to sound mean, but if a Mercy is using Rez out in the open and you can't kill her standing still that is a skill issue. If you get a pick, you know Mercy will want to go for the rez, you shouldn't react when she presses the button, you should be proactive, put pressure on her before she even goes for it, ping her, even if you know you can't kill her just putting damage on her will make her far less likely to go for rez.
@@bigfudge2031 oh yea a skill issue, I should just increase my DPS on fucking Winston, the character with a set DPS unless I waste my ultimate to cancel 1 ability.
@@BagelBoi4000Also, Winston has jump, melee and secondary fire combo to do 130 burst damage, so yeah you can increase your damage.
My point was awareness is also a skill that people need to learn, instead of just making excuses.
I think a 12 or 10 second, but more impactful, Valkyrie would feel a lot better to use. Valkyrie right now basically gives you a 5 HP/s buff, which is not noticeably faster than your normal heal. And Rez cast time needs buffed during Valk to make it feel better to use.
Agreed. Like what even is valk as an ultimate. There’s no use to healing that much during it and it has zero defensive capabilities. It doesn’t feel like an ult, like yay 5 extra healing. AND a slow ass res during it. It’s just kindve there as an ult and adds nothing. The only thing it’s good for is of course mass dmg boost. I wish they would fix mercys ult tbh
Always love the content. Send them to a mercy main friend of mine and they usually send me ways back of how not to die as support, the best duality known to support players
I think it would be cool if mercy could attach her beams to enemies to nerf them. In my mind it would be something like if she beams an enemy with damage buff it becomes a damage nerf instead, allowing her to kind of heal before having to actually heal. For the other beam, healing, I was thinking it would work like ana's anti-heal grenade or would reduce healing. This would allow her to make strategic plays in the downtime when she isn't healing team-mates and would give her more impact in the team fight without just damage boosting your hanzo or whatever. She would have to take a risk doing this because the enemy could easily target her since she is giving away her position to beam them and has to be within beam range to lock on
I've also been having the thought that a longer retention time on the beam would make things so much better....they changed GA without even thinking of this small consequence even though it makes a huge impact on how she feels to play. I think something similar to different CD for omni directional and SJ would be an acceptable compromise, but even just them fixing bugs, collision, and potentially the inconsistency with the GA CD would make things much much better.
I'd also be completely fine for them getting rid of rez at this point as long as they put in something of value. People are always going to complain about it no matter what you do. I don't know exactly what they could replace it with, perhaps a couple second beam buff or something. Anything decent really.
Except this would just make it even more encouraged for Mercy to avoid combat and abuse LoS with her beam all game which isn't interesting or fun
@@SirenRyan I'm aware, but I find it annoying that they made these changes without considering this part of her kit. I don't personally think it would make much of a difference in playstyle though, as long as it was simply changed to be better in line with her typical GA CD
YES I'm so glad u responded too this👌🏻👌🏻
A rez with a short cooldown that revived the target on 25% health instead of 100% could be interesting. Maybe give them a 1 second healing buff. This could let rez be used more often but make it much easier to counter if used poorly.
I like it in theory but it would mean a lot more standing still while waiting for each res to go through.
Nah, that would feel shittier for the one getting rezzed. No one likes getting rezzed just to immediately be killed again. I'd rather just wait for respawn
@@windcats i feel like if the removed the long cast time (or reduced it) it would feel better
I love rez tho I will feel so sad if they removed it 😢
that’s why it’s never gonna happen
Hope it does. Good riddance. I hate it when mercy just rezzes right in front of me knowing full wellas a support I cant kill her and my visually impaired teammates wont do anything.
@@jacobsotorios8886mad
I feel like rez is too iconic for mercy to ever be removed, she would lose a big part of her identity imo
I love having all of the effort I put in as a dive to be completely undone because the mercy pressed one button in the enemy back line.
I just watch the videos so I can hear Niandra say "have a nice, day."
12:12 If its gonna be a projectile, it would be very good to have an extra sense just for this cooldown, bc just like the pistol, you usually have a standard high sense for ga/movement, which could make it "interesting" to hit these shots.
People at the high level already complain about Lamp and Suzu despite the fact they require skill to use, Making Rez a projectile will just generate way more hate towards the ability and Mercy players.
An idea I had for a way to make superjump less powerful was to make it so that the longer you go without touching the ground the less height you can get. You would have to land for a couple seconds for the height to reset which would give the enemy team an opportunity to kill her more easily while still keeping the overall movement the same (the duration extension from doing GA tech would be removed of course).
As for rez I do like the halo idea but I feel like it needs to have some other effect that can be used outside of that situation like a small heal over time or a burst heal at the end of its duration if its target doesn't die. Additionally you could make the duration run out slower when the target takes damage in a similar way to Ram ult.
Ok ive been thinking ...what if instead of Rezz being a basic ability its on her ult. Now hear me out - when you use valk during its duration you can recast the ult near someones soul and bring them back? No additional buttons needed, they can make the rez a little bit faster and it would be fair since its an ult and we can potentially get a new ability?? I know the idea is kinda like how when she ulted she reset her rez BUT this time you dont reset it cause its only available during the ult. This would achieve a couple of things - Mercys ult feels more impactful , rez isnt such a problem cause its a part of an actual ult so its fine to be impactful and it opens up possibilities for a new ability that could redestribute her power budget
As a fellow Mercy Main myself i must admitt it always a pleasure watching your content, since you have such a thoughful way of explaining and reasoning different topics without being biased too much (lets be honest, no overwatch player is completly free of that). I feel despite of not being the biggest chanel i think all of your supporters like you for what you do :) keep up the great work! ♥ and as always, have a nice day :3 (also: GIVE MERCY BLUE HAIR ALREADY D:)
Honestly, mercy is fine as she is. I think it would be cool (if not game breaking) if when she ults her rez cooldown resets or the cooldown is reduced from like 30 or 45 seconds whatever it is to like 10 seconds
Valkyrie used to reset the rez cooldown, which means Mercy was able to rez 2 people within the span of 10 seconds. (The cooldown is 30 seconds by the way)
this used to be a thing way back in ow2 and it would be even more busted now in 5v5
Do you think giving mercy the current 3 second cooldown or maybe a longer cooldown for GA would be alright if Mercy didn't need to target an ally? What if she was just able to target an area within the current range she can fly toward?
Niandra briefly touched on this in their video
Mercy would be a sitting duck and permanently stuck on the floor especially since her kit is not built like ana, bap, or moira. She needs her mobility on a lower cooldown since her whole play style is mobility.
Ehh she needs the short cd. If that kind of GA were to be added then they could do smth like this:
•Using GA to fly to an ally has a 2 second CD.
•Using GA to fly to a targeted direction has 2 charges and a Cooldown of 3 seconds for each charge. Maximum range for targeted GA's can be extended by holding down the ability which will use 2 charges at once.
i think i might be the only person that doesn’t think there’s any issues with dmg boost… people only see a dps with a blue beam attached to them and forget there’s a whole other person behind that beam. every fight against a boosted dps means there’s two players focused on damaging the same target. the one thing mercy is doing to contribute to the fight is amplifying someone else’s damage. that’s HER way of doing damage, in a way.
i constantly see people complaining about losing "1v1"s against pocketed heroes as if mercy is just a floating entity and not an actual person that is, in her own way, fighting them as well.
that being said i do love the idea of a suzu like rez. that sounds incredibly fun.
I really like the idea of a projectile rez that would be so much fun
I remember that Reddit post...
I feel like the people who complain about Damage boost forget that a Damage boosting Mercy IS the 5th player doing damage.
Damage boost to me is meant to compensate for Mercy directly doing damage, like every other support. To me, it makes sense for it.
I agree with what you said about nerfing the distance of slingshots and not crouch superjumps, and keeping them as separate CD-wise. In OW1, slingshot only took you about 10-12 meters. In OW2, you can slingshot legitimately like 20m, more than enough to cancel your own beam range. I think that's part of what makes it so strong, because it's almost 2 entire GA's in one. If they removed the charge meter for slingshot and capped the max distance to 10m to basically be an omni-directional version of OW1 slingsho with 1.5 sec CD, and then kept Crouch-Superjump on a charge meter with a longer CD, I think that would be the perfect solution.
It's kinda baffling that the mercy rework is even being discussed while widow and hanzo one shots are still in the game
Exactly.
God just learn to play
@@michaelpurdon7032 I mean I'm most likely higher ranked than you will ever be, so your argument is BS. I can see how widow and hanzo aren't a problem in your gold/plat lobbies when they have like 5 - 10% hs accuracy
Mercy makes both of those characters even worse to go against lmao. Hanzo is crazy when boosted and widow vs widow mercy just needs to rez their widow for easy win.
This. Imo rez is fine as long as 1 shots are a thing it’s fair
I think one point of mercy is that instead of being a support that is also a threat that takes up space, instead mercy damage boosts another character to make up for the lack of presence I think thats her point so at least I think ppl should keep that in mind
so i got into overwatch earlier this year and mercy was one of the first characters i picked up. soon after that, they made the change to the GA cooldown and now i rarely play her. my only reason for playing mercy before was for the fun movement (ive had the most fun in games where i zoom around from teammate to teammate). all i want is for mercy’s GA to still be fun, i literally don’t care about anything else that happens to her kit honestly.
i know im newer to the game than a lot of people, so i don’t have the same connection or nostalgia tied to her abilities, but that’s just my perspective idk!
I’m not sold on the skillshot idea, because Mercy is the prototypical low-aim hero by design. And, she’s one of very few low-aim-required heroes who hasn’t had their kit moved towards more aim emphasis since their release. The most recently-released low-aim hero (Lifeweaver) is also kinda physically taxing to play, so he’s unfortunately not really suitable for many folks with physical disabilities. They already lost Sym; it would suck for Mercy (or Moira) to become less accessible too. That said, maybe making Resurrect a throwable that is aimed at a stationary target might be okay from a physical accessibility standpoint, I dunno.
Regardless, I _do_ like the idea of disentangling Resurrect counterplay from Mercy’s personal survivability, which the skillshot idea would achieve. I think the tight coupling of those things is a big part of how Resurrect manages to be frustrating to both Mercy players and those playing against Mercy. Separating them creates room to make Resurrect more consistently counterable without making it unusable. I think it could also make Resurrect more consistently usable too, instead of being somewhere between “trivially easy to get value with” and “impossible to use without dying” depending on the comp matchup.
Damage boost doesn’t need replacing. The nerf has already made it much less impactful than it was before and removed a lot of the issues with it. I think people also forget the characters abilities need to also reflect their personalities and stories too. Her enabling others to do dmg fits her pacifistic, more reserved nature. Mercy having a more complicated damage boost or a boost that does speed (etc) instead doesn’t fit this nor her simple play style.
simply not true lmfao. delusional mercy players.
@@griffenchildress9627 Yeah its crazy lol
Dmg boost is neither fun to play against, or fun to play. Pocketing one hero the whole game isn’t fun but it’s the only way to get value out of mercy
I’ve had an idea for a new ability to replace Rez called Blessing.
It’s a auto target ability kind of like a Zen harmony orb. Mercy blesses a team mate with a halo shown above their head. It would last on them maybe 3-8 seconds. (I don’t know balance numbers lol). But when a teammate that has mercy’s blessing health hits 1 or 0. The halo shines a flash of light and They get bursted back to 20% health. They’d still be in the same position, so if they’re over extended or being focused they still may not survive. But she could save a single team mate from an ult. Or give an advantage to a widow/Hanzo/Ashe in a sniper battle against an enemy sniper.
For me I feel like valk could also get an improvement as well, they could give it some utility like I don’t remember where I saw this but someone said combine both beams when ur in valk so u can heal and boost at the same time or they can make it so that mercy’s beams in valk provide a dmg reduction
I think damage boost being replace with simply an increase in fire rate and reload would be awesome.
Increasing cooldown speed would probably feel broken. And sporadically being speed boosted when not expecting it could also be confusing and mess players up.
I think mercy being able to have “downtime” where she can pull out her pistol and help damage is definitely a good idea, and not a bad idea.
The biggest issue I head from people who don’t like playing mercy is that they don’t have time to use pistol and they don’t like just being a Utility hero who buffs team mates. They want to be able to support the team with damage if the situation calls for it
Make mercy's kit distance based with things. Rez can be started at 5m, but not cancelled at any distance, cast time based on how far from soul - e.g. 1m = 1sec, 5m = 5secs to rez - >5m would pause rez until back within 5m. Same for dmg, 1m to linked hero gives full (25%) boost, 5m would be 5%. 6m is still linked, just no boost at all.
Hate the static pocket playstyle, used to love rez but honestly now I want it removed, so I do kind of want them to rework her, but I am also very unsure how it could work. I personally assume that Blizzard isn't gonna rework her at all and just keep adjusting her numbers, but if they do, I think damage boost is probably gonna be removed or nerfed so hard that by defaulting to it, you are basically throwing.
I am pretty curious how the idea with her staff could work in game. Considering the last time we tried a resource meter on her staff it was a complete mess, I am a bit concerned that it's gonna be a pain, but I really do want her to be all about making smart usage of her tools and using her movement to be at the right place at the right time.
Really, I just want Blizzard to dare and experiment with her kit a little, but I guess considering the really long times between patches will make that impossible.
i think mercy is fine how she is apart from the inconsistent cooldown. just make it consistent, the suggestion about having the cooldown start after you touch the floor is also great. res and damage boost are literally fine, they have been part of her kit for a LONG time and damage boost even got nerfed this season. i wish people who dont play mercy would stop talking about her
She would be fine if the game was fine... but it's not.
She's a part of a bigger overall problem with the direction the game has gone in...
For balance sake, a hero like her should not be as staple as she is in this game...
It feels horrible to play against and ofc people like us who have mained this character (or at least put significant time into her) have multiple things we DON'T enjoy... but in reality she HAS to be changed.
She is not fine and im tired of people lying about it... but the game is also not fine as a whole.
@@InfernoZX5hitscans like me love playing against mercy tf u mean
@@Darrakkii I cut out a whole paragraph about hitscans cause the comment got too long but obviously since this is you're second comment trying to son me, I guess I HAVE to address it.
Hitscans are the only thing that consistently dunk on that hero... Fortunately a lot of the hitscans in the game are strong rn.
Cass isn't but he also isn't unplayable.
I won't say too much but they loaded too much of his value into Hinder Nade and now he suffers for it which really keeps him off of a lot of people's roster now.
If you're not a hitscan main, how easy is it to dispatch a Mercy while trying to predict the future?
It's not... unless the Mercy is just bad or unaware and NOT flying... which is more common now with how fucked up ladder is.
They're not learning the same lessons we had to learn in OW1.
I would love for Rez to return as an Ultimate. It was so cool. I don't think it would be that problematic today with only a max of 4 teammates rather than the previos five (Including 2 tanks).
So I think I've got something that might be a solid idea for a light mercy rework that covers a lot of these issues.
First: Damage boost. I feel like the solution to damage boost is potentially so simple, have the bonus damage from mercy's damage boost apply as a damage over time effect over... 1-2 seconds rather than immediately when the damage is dealt. This mitigates a lot of the break points problems by giving characters a chance to use defensive cooldowns, find a health pack or receive help from their support before the extra damage kicks in and kills them.
Second: We're replacing ressurection. OK, that's not entirely true. I know a lot of mercy mains are hungry for some kind of rescue-type ability, so here's my take. Caduceus Staff Overcharge, a cooldown that would give Mercy's beams additional properties for a short duration. Maybe 3 seconds?
For the healing beam, if your patient dies while your staff is overcharged they are resurrected after a few seconds. Maybe you have to keep your beam locked on the target while they rez or something, I dunno. The point of all this is to give your opponent clear indications of when mercy *can* rez someone, lowering frustration a bit. If mercy isn't currently beaming widowmaker, she can't rez her if you snipe her, for example... and because the overcharge is essentially two abilities on a shared cooldown you don't have a situation that a lot of Mercys would find themselves in where they just have a button they press once or twice a match... speaking of other abilities sharing a cooldown... (Edit: So this is basically the halo idea from the video. Oop. Still I think it's interesting)
For the damage beam, maybe this is stepping on Lucio's toes, but a speed boost/cooldown reduction/reload speed amp could be a way to go. Naturally the struggle here is going to be balancing this beam out with Valkyrie spreading it to your whole team... somehow I think a full team-wide speed boost might be more powerful than instant rezzing anyone who dies in an area for 3 seconds. I'd love to hear some alternatives for a damage boost overcharge, though.
Of course, numbers would have to be tweaked, as well, but I think this could actually solve a fair number of problems people have with current mercy.
I kinda like the idea of the projectile rez but more than anything I love the idea of valk becoming a primary ability instead of an ultimate.
What I think could be fun to make mercy more offensive and be able to use her mobility more is if they increase her dmg during valk with her pistol and her bullets speed for a sacrifice for a little less ult charge when healing and dmg boosting, since the ult already build quickly (I think at-least) it would be cool to see mercy being able to carry fights with her blaster while her normal as of rn ult is easily deterrable due to high dmg team comps
I will always pray for season 1 GA 😭
I wish they do some bugfix with lifeweaver. When I think I'm in danger, I hold shift to fly to an ally asap. When lifeweaver thinks I'm in danger he grips me while I'm still holding shift and I've had buggy interactions where I instantly cancel grip and put ga on cooldown (with no lockout period to realize I need to release shift).
If they can't implement the lockout period properly, it would be nice if lifeweaver is unable to grip mercy if she's not cc'd and her ga is not on cd.
12:50 i see it as kind of like sombras poison throwable thing where you shoot it at souls and it does a res, maybe if you stay in a certain range
I also really wish that they kept the idea of the hero mastery unlocking new abilities you could usw for heroes so you would have multiple play styles for the same hero
you know, i wonder how it would be if they implemented Renata from League's W into Mercy's kit. A revive that rewards you for persuing an enemy and killing them but bringing you back at 35% health. Id like to see someone make a simulator of it
Do you think the Resurrect should be separated from the long arm/hand animation length? Can you do a video on this?
I’ve been interrupted or bumped at the last millisecond after doing the already-long animation and cast time. Ability lost too easily.
What if you resurrect still succeeds long as you did 95% of the cast time or animation? If you get bumped before your hand closes back on your staff/your gun, it’s lost.
10:51 i feel like i should be offended that you called me a crackhead but like, fair enough
what if rez for mercy would be similar to doing a generator in dead by daylight, just as soon as you press E the circle opens and you have to recast at a certain point, for an instant resurrection, if you miss the point you would have to wait for the circle to close and only rez than. The Idea is just for making the Ability more interesting to use, as everyone can decide on which resurrection speed they prefer. I don't know, in my head in sounds fun.
Why exactly don’t you like the idea of Rez being an ult again? It was removed because of “Hide and Rez” but there’s a great video by Titanium about how the math shows that Hide and Rez actually just made mercy less effective and wasn’t even that commonly used. It’s like saying that Tactical Visor shouldn’t be an ult because 1% of players choose not to shoot when they use it. I think Rez either needs to be an ult again or be removed because the current version feels horrible to use, requires about as much skill as using a microwave and remembering not to put metal in there, and it forces mercy players to just sit there patiently before they can get back to the high mobility character they chose to play.
What if instead of just instantly tacking on the damage, damage boost would add that extra damage as damage over time? Like placing an effect like junkerqueens bleed onto the bullets shot by the damageboosted hero? I feel like that would remove similar issues to the soujourn-mercy meta since damage over time can be still counteracted instead of having a one-shot just because mercy is boosting someone.
I appreciate your level headed reaction to these ideas. In regards to the "mercy mafia" I posted this video on the forums and got some mean comments lol. In my experience mercy mains tend to react more negatively to outsiders suggesting changes to her kit but it's understandable. She's a very unique hero that doesn't have any real crossover with other heroes so it makes sense you guys are more protective of her identity than others are with their mains.
Okay, so we tried both the Mercy suggestions. When we had the decay on the healing, it felt like absolute shit and made her highly ineffective. As to the rate of fire, again, it was tried previously and actually really fucked the DPS up. It works with Koriko's ult, because it is consistent and not always available. It could also be very oppressive. Can you imagine Sojourn or Zen with a majorly increased rate of fire? What about Soldier and Sombra? The speed boost and reload buff have both been tried as DPS passives and again, they were found to be really oppressive. If they really want us being more mobile and switching targets more than I feel the very first thing they need to do is a massive debug on GA. It is currently suffering from multiple bugs which are making me nervous to even try to do the crazy repositions I used to do. Secondly, bring back the buff to heals under 50%. Not only did it solve the issue with her not having a burst heal, it made it more viable to rapidly swap healing targets.
If they were to keep dam buff, I feel the best way to change it is adjust how it damage buffs other heroes depending on how powerful their weapon is and how and fast it fires
idk how to fell about the mercy rework idea, if there is a big heal at the start of the yellow beam you can just spam it and out heal most heroes. and the new blue beam means more bugs for heroes like the infinite brig shield cuze of kirikos old ult that made the cd lower
NIANDRA UPLOAD WOOOO
the potential 3 second cooldown on current ga wouldn’t feel as bad if ga wasn’t as buggy and just stop mid flight lol
what if blue beam spread a percentage of the direct hits damage to enemies nearby the target?
I think the rez could be a skillshot you can do from any distance that puts a halo around a soul orb that gets insta rezed as a ghost form and can gain ult charge do dmg and stall point until they respawn in respawnroom so 6 second ghost form. Ghost forms should not be able to die (again) but they give enemy ult charge. Ghost forms should not be able to use their ultimate. I think that way mercy can keep her rez somehow but make it a ability she has to aim for but also she can do from a saver position (but with los) and not locked down in the animation for so long. And yeah I agree with spilo that her ultimate is boring af. I think to make it a bit better she has to deside at the start if she wants to dmg boost or heal her team and the beam connects atomatically on teammates in her los while she can simultaniously use pistol and shoot.
i think if Mercy's heal beam applied a brief lingering effect after detaching, it could enable this sort of teammate juggling playstyle without punishing you for pocketing someone when necessary. it's important that you have to detach the beam fully and not just switch to blue beam to get that effect otherwise pocketing just gets even stronger and we don't want that. as for damage boost, mercy has to contribute some kind of lethality or powerful utility to a team fight in this fast paced 5v5 world we live in. here's a couple ideas: first, i like the blue beam as a resource idea from Spilo's video, so these ideas are with that change in mind. either 1) dramatically reduce blue beam's damage boost percentage or 2) change blue beam to a damage mitigation effect (with recent changes to mitigation stacking this would be annoying but not overpowered on tanks), then give the target a heal boosting effect a la biotic grenade that, like with the heal beam change, lingers briefly after beam disconnect. by design mercy won't be able to take advantage of her own heal booster (reattaching a beam ends any lingering effect early) but a coordinated team could make great use of it. for res, i think it needs to stay until one-shots get dealt with, and i think i might actually buff it a little bit? here's my pitch: reduce the range on res by a lot but make it basically instant cast. this makes it more viable mid fight but more demanding on your movement and game sense. also, maybe make it so the target doesn't res at full health (maybe half health is a good break point) and make it disable blue beam usage or drain blue beam energy briefly. that way the enemy has an easier time dealing with the res'd target and there's a resource cost to using it mid-fight.
i think these are huge Mercy buffs overall, but she's not great outside of a dps pocket playstyle which this nerfs a little bit so i think it's warranted. if these changes came a little bit before or after a general support nerf that reduced everyone's (including Mercy's, obvs) healing output, i think that would be best. that way the heal-focused playstyle wouldn't feel too overwhelming to overcome.
If you rez a target at half HP you are most likely going to just heal them back up to full anyway, so disabling damage boost is kinda redundant.
I play since 2017 ... and I never once considered playing Mercy ...
But I really love your content, and you make me see how complex she is ...
Mercy’s rez being a projectile you can throw is an interesting idea and adds a bit more skill to her kit but I think it’s too boring and doesn’t involve Mercy enough, like it doesn’t put her in any danger or require her to divert her attention from the team/fight. It also sounds like it be difficult to block/deny.
Having it be an object like Baps frisbee would help because it could be destroyed before it rezs someone, but it still brings no risk to Mercy herself. I like having to fly to and kinda stick with the dead player as i’m rezzing them because it makes me vulnerable to counterplay and it opens up the opportunity for a skillful rez.
Rez is powerful but currently it can be cancelled by different abilities by different heroes: boop, stun, hack, kill.
As a projectile it can only be prevented (not cancelled) by a shield/Mei wall or a projectile eating ability like Sig, Dva or Orisa. Make it like Bap’s frisbee and it can now be cancelled as well but the enemy can still either only block it or shoot it.
Personally I'd like to try having blue beam add some damage resistance as well as damage boost, but be on a resource meter.
It'd just be more favourable to heroes who close in to shorter range instead of just hitscan pockets.
You people are so weird haha
make her beam range alittle shorter so u have to really keep up with the team (being in the fight rather than sitting on the side) decrease ga cooldown to like 1.5 and make her super jump 2 that way she can move around easier. have her d boost be similar to morias heal bar (u have a limited amount of blue beam before ur staff overheats?). make rez faster but make her vulnerable. instead of 200 hp while rezing make it like 150 (give some life to bring life back sorta thing) so shes easily killable but if done right can still rez pretty easy. and make her heals do more per sec instead of 45 make it like 50 so she can keep up with the higher dmg comps that are aften run (bap, sojurn, bastion, etc)
I feel like if they ever rework rez or something they should replace it with an ability that shorten respawn timer on the hero mercy used her ability on
we're getting mauga sooner rather than later counting the details on the next map
I feel like if they keep the ga nerf as is then mercy should at least be able to follow teammates around corners or etc without getting stuck on the map. Yes the beam goes through the wall but an easy fix would be having the beam bend around the wall and have mercy follow that as the flightpath
i've been a gm mercy main since pretty much the launch of ow1 and ever since ow2 came out and they changed GA, ive been finding her so incredibly boring to the point where i barely play her anymore, and when i do i find myself wanting to switch off to something else. and its not that i hate her new movement; i actually really like it in theory and its honestly EXACTLY what i wanted when ow1 was around, but now that we have it i see why they didn''t touch sj or ga for such a long time. i loved her new movement when ow2 came out and i thought it was so fun, but like after a while its just not as fun as ow1's movement. anyone can just shift + jump and be obnoxious to get value now (aka what people call no skill) but in ow1 you needed to actually dedicate the time into learning all of her little nuances/tricks and that just made her so fun. like learning all the different superjump heights depending on your flight length & learning all the prop bounce spots was SO fun, but now we dont have any of that. she can do a lot more now compared to ow1 mercy, which is good, but its just not as fun and it doesnt feel as satisfying to pull off, which was mainly the whole reason i played her. no other overwatch character had small little tricks like that you could master and it set her apart. all the cool fun things we spent so long mastering that set a good mercy apart from a newer player are just completely gone. they made the one thing about her that we prided ourselves on into basekit and now that they did that, it just made it more of an issue that they cant seem to fix. they took something that wasnt broken and tried fixing it and it just came back to bite them in the ass. theres basically no skill expression with her now and its just not the same. i've tried my best this past year to really have an open mind about this whole issue every single time they keep changing her, but its to the point now where i dont even launch the game anymore, and thats coming from someone who played like 12+ hour days for years. idk, its a tough subject for me since ow/mercy was my hyperfixation for YEARS, and i still want to love it, but its just so hard to play her how she is currently. unless they completely change something up and give her another rework or something i genuinely dont know anymore lmfao
I do wonder what your take would be now since the video has been up
i miss her old mobility before the GA nerf. right now it feels like i am playing spectating simulator and i get really bored, lol
For blue Beam replacement, I would change It to ultimate boost, same as now, you get more ult charge doing damage but removing the extra damage, so mercy and the pocketee get more ult charge when doing damage but without the extra 25% damage, to compensate make It so blue beaming a support gives them more ult charge while healing, so Mercy helps the team helping to get ultimates faster (like now xD) but without the extra damage.
This would be fine if mercy’s ultimate was more powerful. But as it is now it’s probably very weak
@@vbnm193 I think it's fine, you can even change it so blue beam reverts to damage boost on valk to keep valk powerful
But then what should she do when every team member that’s alive has ult? Pull out her pistol? Heal full hp allies?
Mercy is good as she is ! Man this is overwatch not call of duty... heroes are unique and more approchable by new player... and still i play mercy almost everyday since like 5 years... so i mean what else to say except "its all good spilo" 😂
In overwatch 1 i played a ton of mercy. shes without a doubt in my top 3 if not #1 most played hero with easily over 1k hours on her. i absolutely adored the feeling and skill expression of GA and its techs. i loved zipping around the map and being unkillable. my value came from that. later into the games lifespan around the addition of ashe. she became more and more static. especially during poke heavy or one shot heavy metas. *death glare at widow* this version of mercy where im attached at the hip to one person in horrible. i find it incredibly boring and it doenst feel impressive. i want to feel like i have done something even if that something is to be annoying and hard to kill. flying around and healing and flicking damage boost on and off of people (which us mercy players KNOW there is a system to it and it's not just a brainless holding of a button) is incredible. hearing all of the little ticks of damage and the chimes of full health is really gratifying. i started to like Rez a lot at some point im 6v6 because it felt like a puzzle. i saw a soul and thought "hmmm how can i res that, should i? can i even?" or even better when there are two souls "which one is safer, which one is more valuable. do i go safe or do i go value" and to make those on the fly decisions was fun to me. in 5v5 rez and oneshots feel like complete overkill. i hate them both equally. ive almost completely stopped playing mercy in OW2 as when i play her i feel bogged down by the new GA slingshot meter and her boring play style of pocket bot. i dont get to fly around as much anymore because they have literally forced me not to. so i dont play her anymore. i despise rez, i despise OW2s meter amd was agaisnt it from the very beginning. it feels like i am being punished for being good at her movement. all of that time that i put into not only learning how to do all of the techs but also when to do them is just gone. i only really ever slingshot now and then if i do sometimes a smart person will realize i cant go anywhere for 3 seconds and just chase. i get punished for something that used to be a form of expression. I quite liked the Valk on CD and rez on Ult experimental but feel like ML7 dropped the ball by nerfing valks movement. (i love him dont attack me) but with the way the game is now i would be totally ok with outright removing rez. i just dont know what would replace it that wouldn't be just as bad if not worse. same thing for damage boost. honestly if i can keep GA (preferably OW1s version), her healing beam, and Valkyrie (hot take) ill play whatever she ends up becoming. i like valkyrie i think it's a swiss army knife ult where i can do a lot of different things much better. chase kills, make callouts, keep my team up, mass damage boost, safer rez, GA reset, regeneration. its a nice ability. but i wish it was just that. an ability. shorter cooldown shorter duration weaker chains but everything else is the same. I love mercy and miss playing her but every time i select her i remember why i play other heroes now.
Love her res love the ease of movement I love how mercy is I do like being mobile as mercy her blue beam is okay a slight boost wouldn't hurt too bad but also keep this in mind she is so easy to kill and her pistol is ...weak weak weak
I looked his video as a Moira and Mercy main and i just think that they wanna make new Kiriko,like why is everything has to be a "skill shot" or have insane amount utilities. And plus Moira is in a good spot right now, it's just most of the people do not understand how to play her
I personally think Mercy is fine rn. The problem with damage boost is some heroes damage thresholds are already bs like Ashe Sojourn or Echo, and damage boost makes their already broken damage more broken. Then blizzard buffs heals too much and it’s a never ending cycle. I think all heroes need a universal nerf to damage/healing or a universal buff to hp numbers because the battle between absurd damage and absurd healing is ridiculous rn.
Mercys rez as an Ultimate would feel too underpowered if its only for one person, but if it goes 'more than one' then we'd be back at pre-rework mercy complaints. hell, people hated the idea of valkyrie even resetting rez cooldown because of the two people rezzes. I feel its perfectly fine as an ability on cooldown.
Making it a skillshot however sounds like an interesting idea, even if people complain already just about suzu and i fear the complaints would not change anyways. People just hate when their damage output gets blocked in any way by a support.
💙
another idea for rez: make the target she rezed come back with low health, like a certain percentage. that way it'll make us think more about if rezzing someone will be worth it and will force us to stay and really commit to the person we rezzed and heal them up.
But then rez is even more of a "win more button" It is already hard enough to get a rez off in a fight your team is losing. all this would do is just make it even less useable than it already is.
genji main here, I like the thinking
I like ow1 ga because the movement had such a high skill ceeling. I will say as a dps main i used to respect mercy as a hero way more in overwatch 1.
Valk should last 7 seconds but it lets you Rez two people instantly (like og Rez) then get rid of normal Rez
The problem with reworking mercy is finding a solution that is balanced, but also matches the character. Mercy is meant to be a pacifist character, which is why her staff is her main weapon. The staff is kinda a perfect symbol of her pacifism, she heals and enables others without causing harm herself. It's even reflected in her melee where she walks them with the back of the staff as if she was unprepared to have to hit. And when she has to put her staff away and pull out her gun it's like her putting her personal beliefs down physically in order to use a weapon.
So taking a part of her kit and reworking it completely could harm character designs. That's my personal reason I think the weapon swap speed is fine where it is
I would give mercy a pulse that's onna like 2 or 3 second cool down that gives dmg and dr for a brief moment and omits a burst of healing in exchange for dmg boost, and than give her.
And than I would make the ult a revive that gives the revived target a second life for a brief moment, so they can escape or make a play after being revived, and than give her another movement option, this way mercy is more about movement and trying to time her pulses to get maximize value, like maybe you predict a shot or see your bastion just went into turret form and is about to murder a defenseless tank, just pulse at that exact moment and you'll increase their dmg alot of you can time it but you cant just sit there with the dmg boost on for an hour.
I vote for the applying res before they die. If you have good game sense, it would kinda be a buff in disguise.
Make her blaster hitscan 🤠