YariNoHanzo Katanamart practical Musashi katana sharpening process with Grinder Shan Zu Whetstones
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- Опубликовано: 29 сен 2024
- Hello dear Ronins,
HERE HOW TO CUT WITH A KATANA COURSE
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This the second sharpening episode
with a 1060 maru katana :
I used
240/600/1000 grit from Grinder whetstones : HSTOPHILE.COM
www.histophile...
and
3000/8000 grit from Shan Zu whetstones : AMAZON
www.amazon.fr/...
1/ the angle
2/ the pressure
3/ the number of passes
4/ keep your stone wet
5/ paper check
Please be careful when using whetstones for yourself and others
and handling kitchen knives or swords.
Stay focused mind sharp and body healthy
Sincerly budo
RH
1* keep the angle at 15⁰
2* apply 4-6lbs of pressure
3* moisturize the stone(s) every 3 swipes
4* whatever many swipes you do on one side it needs to be the exact on the other
5* check sharpness with paper to determine if it's duller or sharper.
How many swipes do we do on each side altogether?
3 times on each side then you check with paper, 20-30 mn by whetstones grit, until the result become significant.
So do you have to use multiple different types of wet Stone?
And what wet Stone should I get and what grade?
@@johnnyboi8769 Yes different type of whetstones as the tutorial & description below
Thanks man, you have no idea how much you helped people like me. I really appreciate it.
Hello dear Ronin, thank you for your comment, I’m glad it can help, good luck for your practice
Thank you for showing me how to do this it really help me to sharpen my sword and I am making a little bit of progress cos my sword is really blunt but showing me this experience really help me thank you
Dear Ronin, thank you for your comment and appreciation, I’m glad it could help, be careful blunt sword most of the time are not made for practice only exposition
I will make an episode about that from my travel in Tolède, their blunt or sharp sword has very bad balance or not balance at all as just reproduction it is steel but without the « magic shape » and appropriate weight distribution created by the swordsmith this is just metal with « decoration » and can be really bad for your arms elbows skeketon if you praticz with it (from my experience in Tolede).
Thank you for this tutorial! One question: When will I know when to change the grindstone to a finer grit during the sharpening process?
Dear Ronin, thank you for your comment and question. This is a really good question, I will try to answer the best way I can. Each whetstones if the process of sharpening is well made (very sharp/razor) will transform the edge. The 200-600 grit remove a lot of metal and create a first raw edge (repair/first raw grit), 1000 grit a correct basic edge (sharpen grit), 3000 grit a finer edge (sharpen grit), 8000 grit (finishing grit). I would say 20 mn per whetstones for an expert, 2 hours for a good (96 hours experimented) beginner. The moment to change of whetstones should be when ( between 20mn and 2hours) without any mistake of passes (5 on the left and 9 on the right of the edge for exemple) you will feel with the paper than the sharpen of the edge is not improving anymore (but had a significatively improvement of sharpen and transformation of the edge after each whetstones work). If there is not any transformation after your start on a whetstones it is not a good sign. An edge is two angles of 15 degrees glued together. In theory the best sharpener is the one who is the more precise at every passes (on the right and on the left) with same pressure, quality but not quantity. As swordsman ship, that is why I think sharpening helps a lot to improve tameshigiri skills (understanding and practicing). This is the best I can answer for the moment, I didn't achieve such level (razor sharp), I wish you good luck, sincerly budo RH
@@RoninHood That was a really helpful answer, thank you very much.
@@daybreakshooter Dear Ronin, you are welcome, I'm glad it can help, Sincerly budo RH
@@RoninHoodso why can you not just go to the last wet stone, what is the benefit in building up to higher wetsones
@@johnnyboi8769Without writing an essay, if you were to start with a vrry fine grit stone, it removes so little material that you could spend hours and hours and _hours_ on a dull blade and you'll never get it sharp. Each stone gets the edge of the blade to a finer and finer point.
Nihonto Stones, Namikawa Shoten. Carbide does not polish the same as natural silicates which break down in the slurry with each pass making a finer and finer polish with each pass. Although that is a reproduction and generally they don't have Niei, Utsuri, Ji Niei, etc.
This was the only tutorial I could find on the internet to help me decide to even purchase a sharpening whetstone let alone actually doing the process. I recently acquire a Damascus steel 40 inch katana. It's brand new but it is not sharp. Do you recommend I start off using 240 then 600 then 1000 then 3000 then 8000? I saw a 1000/6000 for $40. Thank you very much for doing this video as I'll use it to guide me during my first effort to sharpen my sword.
Thank you for your comment, I'm glad it could help you. It's true there is no so many information about sharpening shinken. and there is no sharpening guide for katanas only for sharpening knives. My advice is to buy first something with a serious brand as hanwei with good balance and sharp edge (1060 or 1095). The look is less important than sturdiness and efficency in my opinion (for a ronin) : 1/ Size 2/ Edge 3/Steel 4/Balance 5/Grip 6/Design. My second advice would be to use a shan zu or grinder whetstone (japanese stones later) 400 or 600 grit/1000 grit/3000 grit/8000 grit. You will need 1 or 2 quiet week ends to have a good result (angle/thumb muscles memory). With your hanwei practical (for exemple) you will check if you sharpening process is good comparing with a sharp Hanwei edge (use paper). If you like damascus there is the sea wave of dragon's king that is really beautiful. Good Luck
@@RoninHood Thank you!
you have to soak the stones in water for a certain amount of time before using them tho right ?
Yes you have to soak whetstones 20mn before using them
Thank you so much Ronin, helped me a lot! Far the best tutorial on the whole web. Congratulation Man!
thank you very much !
you are very welcome !
I suppose that this will technically "sharpen" the blade but it absolutely diminishes it to sharpen it in this way.
Yikes
What do you mean exactly?
@@mundog5217 it's added a severe secondary bevel that shouldn't be present on Japanese blades.
In order to add that, significant amounts of the original blade were removed.
Walter Sorrells did a video on sharpening katanas that addresses this issue specifically.
Ideally, it should be done in the same vein as a togishi but he does a mild cheat that isn't as evident or damaging as this was.
thank you for your comment, yes the purpose was just to make the blade sharp because the crack on the blade was 1,5 or 2mm it was impossible to sharpen it without significatively changing width of the blade. It is not the traditional way but the blade had at least a second life. We improve ourself each day of practice, it will be better for the future sharpening process with 1095 carbon steel without cracks on the blade (john lee hannya). Thanks for your reference about Walter Sorrells.
A secondary bevel is actually not that bad. You remove more material from the blade when you sharpen by the primary bevel (its why a primary bevel is difficult to do). A good secondary bevel is much much better than a bad primary bevel. The quality of katanas that can actually retain a significant benefit from a primary bevel are those expensive enough to send in to sharpen. Chances are most of us are sharpening sub 1K sword and cutting objects with sub-optimal edge alignment.
Thx Bro!
you welcome 😊
Hello Ronin Hood great video! My question is I saw in the comments that it take 48 hours to sharpen a sword without experience.
1. Do you need to do it all in one sittting?
2. If you do take breaks should you re apply choji oil to prevent rust and pick it up again when able?
3. I have T10, 1095, 9260, and 1060 if it not too much trouble what would you recommend when dealing with these metals? (I plan on doing the 1060 mainly)
Thank you
Hello dear Ronin, thank you very much for your appreciation, yes the
first time a week end with 12 hours by day from my experience for having the correct angle and pressure of sharpening and feeling with paper when to change of whetstones. the second time a week end for making two swords I did the tanto on saturday and the maru 1060 on sunday. I think that if you follow correctly the instructions that I proposed 12 hours will be enough (my first week end was without these 5 rules of sharpening).
If you pass 3 time on each side and then check you will avoid to loose the center of the « edge aline by the sharpening process ».
The fact that I think a week end dedicated just to sharpen one or two swords will avoid to not have the proper vigilance and focus for this delicate meditation that is sharpening.
An other thing I use a head set for my hears because the scratchy noise is unhearble for me so I need to be alone in a large room for 12 hours (without any sounds). For delicate precised thing we need time to not think about other thing to do to have a good « zanshin » vigilance and be « here and now » from my personal opinion.
1/ yes I think 12 hours following 5 rules proposed should be enough no interruption and just a lunch, no problem of rusting for a such short time from my experience
2/ no problem of rust for 12 hours
3/ I would recommend to start with middle steel 1060 or 9260 (almost the same 0,6% of carbon)
waiting one or two months between week end of sharpening
because such intense work need then to have more relaxed activities until you get back to your second week end
and check the results of your work.
And then when you will be sure of the quality of the results on 1060/9260
you can process with T10/1095.
As just a beginner and had just 2 swords sharpening successful results, these are my advices. I’m sure a professional sharper would have a different way but for the moment I am quite happy with this way. I hope these answers will help you. Sincerly budo RH
I tried it once and had a wicked sharp Katana then, but it felt weird, a bit like the edge of broken glass and not like a razor. The edge went dull in no time even due to sheathing.
What did I do wrong?
Yes, I probably didn't have good alignment and consistent pressure, but that doesn't quite explain it...
thanks for your comment
sharpening process is quite difficult
on this video the major ideas are presented
at that time it was my first way and result for saving a broken edge
now after 4 years i have all the stones
from 100 grit to 30000 grit
and i have correct muscle memory
so able to sharpen to very very sharp with 3000-8000 grit a dull edge in 30 mn with 6 swords this year
or to razor sharp with 3000-8000-12000-16000-30000 grit
why i sharpen now often my shinken
because i cut bamboo and plastic bottle very often and that reduce fast sharpeness on the edges
i will publish a new edition on how to sharpen a katana with all the stones up than 8000grit for razor sharp
and for members CRAFT my special technic very precise for muscle memory for sharpening in 30 mn any katana to razor sharp
in any case craft ask dedication and time to have serious result and i understand not fun when not having great result, the key is practice and dedication and time it is always working at the end
for sheating if your edge touch the saya when you draw that is incorrect
the saya shouldn’t touch the edge when you draw
best regards
Ça se sens l’accent français 🤣🤣, possible de te mp ?
Yes indeed, vous pouvez poser vos questions concernant votre pratique de budoka ici on Ronin Hood
@@RoninHood merci !
Pour ma question, je possède une lame en acier composite 1095,1060 et 1045 et je souhaiterai faire des tests de coupe mais je n’ai pas l’argent pour acheter des tatami omote pour le moment, as-tu des conseils sur ce que je peut couper (bouteille d’eau, bambou etc ...) ? Je ne veut juste pas abîmer ma lame, je ne sais pas si l’eau des bouteille pourrai l’endommager même si les coupes sont bien faites et là lame essuyer directement.
@@667ѕня Cher Ronin, merci pour votre question, votre shinken est-il de marque fudoshin ? ou si autre marque/modèle lequel est-il ?
je vous conseil et ce n’est que mon avis
de prendre un professeur de iaido et une licence (cours en visio+licence sportive) car la pratique de la coupe n’est pas sans risque...
La bonne vigilance (attention mentale continue) et condition physique pour maintenir la sécurité prend 5-7 ans à acquérir pour tout art martial de ce que j’ai pu observer sur ma pratique celles des autres pratiquants ou celle de mes élèves au cours des 12 dernières années en karate / boxe pour le mental et la condition physique (vos muscles tendons cardio).
Pour le Iaido cette attention est quasiment dix fois plus importante du fait du shinken et de sa dangerosité.
Couper sans avoir eu d’enseignement martial avant serait comme monter sur un ring de boxe face à un compétiteur pour 5 rounds... Cela me semble être un risque inutile.
Pour vous maintenir en sécurité et bonne santé voici mon conseil :
- s’entrainer avec un professeur de Iaido/kenjutsu/ninjutsu certifié qui vous montrera les bonnes postures et gestes.
- Commencer la pratique (posture angle swing) avec un boken 500g ou plus environ 30€ (voir histophile.com) et un iaito a votre taille environ 800g (150€ chez histophile.com) (www.seidoshop.fr/pages/guide-iaito)
permettra d’entrainer vos muscles tendons et articulations progressivement sans détériorations sur des mois/années.
Un shinken du fait de son poids ou taille inadaptée (trop long et mal équilibré (mauvaise marque)) risque de vous endommager les coudes du fait du geste mal exécuté.
La taille et le poids du iaito/shinken sont des facteurs très importants pour ne pas vous blesser le coude ou générer des contractions musculaires.
Le protocole de sécurité pour la coupe que je vous recommande est celui-ci :
fei-iai.ch/enseignement/technique/tameshigiri/
Ce protocole de sécurité rappelle la nécessité - une fois qu’on a un bon professeur le bon matériel et la bonne technique - de faire très attention (10m sur 10m tout seul sans photographe ni amis ni animaux) (en ayant dormi 8h et mangé convenablement)
pour ne pas se blesser ou blesser autrui.
Je comprends que toute cette « préparation » semble laborieuse mais malgré le nombre important de videos qui démocratisent l’art de la coupe en jardin ou avec des fruits
cet art « tameshigiri » n’est pas sans risque et nécessite une « sérieuse » préparation pour votre sécurité celle de la lame (si elle est adaptée) et pour les autres.
Pour répondre à votre question la coupe de jardin dit « backyard » très démocratisée aux USA avec des bouteilles d’eau, revêt certes un intérêt économique, mais ne présente pas a mes yeux un grand intérêt technique.
L’eau est un élément précieux (mon opinion) qui se fera de plus en plus rare dans les temps à venir (écologie) et le plastique ne me semble pas idéal pour une lame.
En tant que budoka je préfère la tradition, car quand c’est fun on baisse sa vigilance et c’est là que l’on risque de se blesser ou de blesser autrui.
Il existe une alternative les frites de plage a 2,5€ chez décathlon
(de nombreux youtubeurs les utilisent (mathew jensen)) mais après plusieurs séances ai pu vérifier que les lames qui ne coupent pas arrivent a couper les frites de plages, donc n’en utilisent plus.
Il existe les omotes a 6€ piece chez Katanamart ou histophile.
Un iaito serait pour vous la bonne alternative (sabre non tranchant) car s’il « swing » cela veut dire que votre geste est bon et que quand votre professeur de iaido validera votre séance de tameshigiri, vous arriverez a couper
en sécurité sans abimer la lame.
Si le iaito swing cela veut dire qu’avec un omote cela fonctionne lors de la coupe (seulement un ajustement de puissance peut être nécessaire).
Effectivement essuyer la lame après chaque coupe me semble indispensable
(quand on coupe des omote ou bouteilles d’eau) pour éviter la rouille sur l’acier et la coupe de bouteilles d’eau accroit le risque car l’eau peut aisément s’insérer entre la habaki et la lame.
Nécessitant donc un demontage complet et nettoyage complet après la séance si l’on veut éviter la rouille.
J’espère avoir répondu à votre question
et vous souhaite bon courage dans votre pratique.
@@RoninHood merci pour vos réponses et conseils !
Concernant ma lame, elle vient de chez www.katanas-samurai.com/ donc les mêmes vendeurs que histophile, je n’ai malheureusement plus la référence du katana sur le site étant donné que c’était le dernier en stock.
@@667ѕня Je vous en prie, merci pour votre message, il s’agit probablement du modele K46 de chez Fudoshin que Histophile.com/katanas-samurai.com (même vendeur effectivement) vendent sous l’appellation lame composite car c’est une lame composite soshu kitae. 1045/1060 et 1095. Il est prévu qu’elle soit testée dans les années à venir par Ronin Hood (nagasa 70 cm adaptée pour quelqu’un d’1 m 65)
mais cette marque n’a pas très bonne réputation chez les Iaidokas apparement...
l’équilibrage ne serait pas idéal...
A mon humble avis je pense que fudoshin doit se situer dans la même gamme que katanamart (pour l’esthétique pas pour la pratique)
j’espère que votre shinken a une lame qui parvient a couper du papier vue le prix qui est un prix de practical (360€)
Ne l’ayant pas test je ne saurais dire s’il est de bonne facture.
Je ne saurais que vous conseiller d’utiliser un Iaito pour vous préserver.
Les meilleurs seraient les Tozando.
Even original Katana sharping by Japanese smith would not that difficult as yours :xd hahahaa
did you try it or have you ever sharpened a sword ?
I would love to get you sharpen my katana. You re a perfectionist. Pure art. Cheers from Australia 🙂👍👍👍
Dear Ronin, thank you for your kind comment and appreciation, I feel really as a beginner with this art of sharpening. The horizontal technic (traditional: every 10-20 cm you sharpen step by step) didn't work for me (the story of the broken blade ruclips.net/video/blpfltBP3_E/видео.html))... the vertical ("untraditional" proposed here on this video for broken blade or to be sure not failling with the "horizontal" one or to not disassembled the shinken and lose the fit between habaki and the blade by reducing too much the width of the blade during the sharpening process) worked for me, but I hope one day I'll be able to make a correct one with the traditional way on very sharp or better. I hope you will be successful with your sharpening process, on one way or the other, Sincerly budo RH
cool thanks man
Thank you I'm glad you enjoy it
Why is he staring at the tip first???
My off-topic comments... If and when the Zombie Apocalypse occurs, ( after all, the American and Chinese teamed up to breed monkey-men from embryos ) and you run out of ammo, the next beat self-defense weapon is a sharp samurai sword.
for sure, it will just need whetstones if many many zombies for being still effective
Hello, my friend. =) Before you start sharpening and polishing the katana! The Kata must be disassembled! 1. Remove Mekugi. 2. Remove Tsuka. 3. Remove the back Seppa. 4. Remove Tsuba. 5. Remove front Seppa. For disassembling and removing the parts, you must use, a dry towel! Hold the blade carefully while removing the parts. It's simple =) You must feel the blade when your pressure. Do NOT press at different ways, this is the tricky part of the sharpening, and IMPORTANT - for the polishing! But this is another hard thing =) DON'T CHANGE THE ANGLE FOR SHARPENING! 15⁰ - 17⁰. It depend of the blade! ;) Just like @anthonyy4345 told you! Don't break your Katana, respect the blade! Good luck and Best Regards!
thank you very much for the advice,
I already did it when this video was captured (3 years ago)
(1st step of sharpening not efficient on my first try)
but I prefer the sharpnening process without disassembling
because :
- cheap katana made in asia/china
are not totaly well built for disassembling
when re assembling it is taking so much time to try to make fit every peaces because not made in japan with enough craft time
- I made not a really good job on this process because I changed too much the blade geometry and weight distribution because removing the crack
but it was sharp enough to cut
- on these present days I would sharpen a cheap sword the exact same way with 1000-8000 grit trying to remove the less material as possible
- on correct fitting crafting katana (1000-12000€) I would disassemble the traditional way and would try to remove the less as possible
I think cheap shinken from china are really difficult to reassemble from my craft skills and not 100% safe after reassembling (musashi prac)
Best regards
Bro I went to Japan and they make it like hamer it and sharpin the katana and they lend me one and broooooooooo it was reallly sharp like razor sharp
Omg how lucky you are, indeed blade in japan for battodo are really razor sharp !
Nice Video - i have also a YT Channel about Katanas and I like your Style - Stay on and bring good content - greetz from Musashi 🤘
Thank you for your support @Miamoto Musashi
Thank you so much for this video! It's easily the best and one of the only ones talking about sharpening katana instead of kitchen knives. I want to learn how to do this so I can maintain my katana for tameshigiri. For a fairly blunt blade, starting at 240 is best? I plan to practice sharpening with some old, cheaper katana I have before attempting any of my quality katana haha.
Hello dear ronin, thank you for your comment and appreciation,
it is a good idea to start with a cheap steel sword to start this craft art process. low grit to medium to high grit for blunt peace of metal is recommended. Sharpening monthly is more necessary for 1060 cs with not correct technicity. With 1095 with correct technicity no ncessary even with bamboo cutting (episode coming soon) to sharpen too often, I think for dojo batto correct practitioner once a year is enough. I wish you the best for this crafting art (really difficult) and a safe craft and practice (in dojo for best safety conditions).
some recommend not to sharpen the blade's closest 20cm to its tsuba for the reason not to cut into the saya introducing the katana into it. when used for cutting =zhagiri, the sharpness near the point is more important than near the handle. thanx for your advice, i'll be carefull with our kitchen knjves too, such as caddie f.e.
Dear Ronin, thank you for your comment, it is true, hanwei shinken are not sharpened on the 10-20 first cm from the tsuba for exemple. It is also true the point of cutting is 20 cm under the tip, so if a place on the blade has to be sharpen it is precisely there. For my practice - it is just my opnion - I prefer a very sharp edge every where and always focus on all the parts of the shinken blade, to not reduce my zanshin (vigilance) on a specifical part. That is true a kitchen knife is really dangerous when you cook every day with it (precisely if you know to sharpen it and you had very sharpened it) your vigilance get low because you get confidante by repetition, and one moment stopping being present in your move/cook and we can get hurt ourself. So zanshin for cooking and zanshin for practicing can be useful.
I just bought three stones, 300/1500, 4000/8000 and 10000/12000. 👍💪 My T10 Katana is pretty sharp, but I want it razor sharp. Thinking about beginning with the 4000 stone, what do you think? Or should I start with the 8000?
I recently had to resharp 2 katanas : sea wave and musashi prac v2
I used 2000/6000 grit the result was amazing in 15 mn (without disassembling fittings) with the vertical way of sharpening as the tutorial
so I will make a second video asap about HOW TO SHARPEN YOUR SWORD IN 15 mn with news technical details
for your sword you can start with 1500 or 4000 if no issues on the blade
(I do not recommend any more to save a chip or crack removing so much materials with 400 grit
because it change weight balance as with musashi prac YNH on the tutorial)
and your muscle memory/angle precision/general motion with your two hands will do the job then 8000 and 12000
and it should work pretty good
@@RoninHood Thank you for the answer. There's nothing wrong with the blade, I just want to make it razorsharp. I would love a new video on the vertical sharpening method. I'm getting my stones next week, so a new vid before that would be fkn great 🙏
I understand, good luck with your shaprening process, I will be able to make new sharpening video sadly not before 2-3 months (i will try to include 12000 20000 grit) because it takes times to shot videos and edit with proper adventure enjoying every detail
Good luck
@@RoninHood when you do it vertical, how many swipes do you do on each side and how often do you wet the stones? Same pressure? 3-6lps?
I just shot today the first shot of "sharpening whetstones in 15 mn"
we are on this stuff together...
3 times on each side
then you can wet again the whetstone,
same pressure, same motion, same muscle memory, same 15° angle
difficult with 3000 & 8000 grit today
on my WHITE custom from artkatana to go higher than very sharp
close than razor sharp in 15-30 mn but doable
most of the time (I re sharpen 3 swords this month) I do better on the 15-30 first mn
then I go wrong for 30 mn (muscle memory/focusness)
Precision and quality (not quantity of passes) : 3 on the right edge side then on the 3 times on the other side
very difficult to keep the same quality motion on these 6 passes (3+3)
it depends on muscle memory (half of the thumb/full two hands motion/pressure/keeping well parallel to the stone & angle not 7,5° or 30° but 15°
Good luck
I ruined my sword, mine is t10 steel. It has scratches now and hamon is disappearing… help
hello dear ronin, I'm really sorry for you, what did happen ?
Do you think a wetstone with 1000 and 6000 will do the Job? I olny want to buy one.
Hello dear Ronin,
from my beginner experience it depends of the blade.
If it is too dull (and a little bit chipped/damaged) you need all the stones.
If it is already sharp and you want to go to very sharp, maybe.
But I wouldn't take the risk to not follow properly the protocole, you will maybe lose lots of time and money.
You can easily find on amazon for 35 box :
400/1000 stone + 3000/8000 stone
What if my sword has chips on the edge from heavy use? Do you still start on 240?
Dear Ronin, thank you for your comment, I am not an expert in sharpening (only one tanto 1045 sharpened from non sharp edge (it worked fine for tameshigiri) and one shinken 1060 twice sharpened, the second time it worked for tameshigiri) but my advice would be: if the chips are not important (just nornal use after many cuts in tameshigiri without accident (edge against metal or hard wood) 400-600 grit could be fine to start (a good kitchen knife after use can start for sharpening process with 1000 grit) but if the edge has between 0,5mm to 1mm chips on it, start from 240 grit (raw grit). It will be very difficult to make it sharp and cut again between 1mm to 2mm chip on the edge (all the weight distribution is changed, sori the same, handling change to). I do not recommend to dismantle the katana for seach big chips on the edge for sharpening because then you will have issue with habaki/sori/tsuka when you will reassemble the shinken. The part of width of the blade that touch the habaki has to never be reduced by sharpening process (240 grit whetstones remove so much steel so please be careful). Good luck RH
It's very important that I make it super sharp. It wasn't very sharp when I first purchased it. I've purchased a few stones. The chips are small, but noticeable if your run your fingers across the blade
Dear Ronin, if there are chips it will be difficult to remove them without changing geometry and measurements of the blade. You can try with low grit stones to remove all the chips first and then changing stones remake all the edge. A not very sharp edge when buying the product is not a good quality sign from the seller/swordswith/brand. Even with 48 hours the result will be half satisfying when practicing tameshigiri because removing chips reduce the blade from 1 or 2mm and change the balance. It is a good exercice to understand the double 15 degres angle of the edge on a cheap sword but for a good sword it is a serious art work (without any chips) to have a very sharp/razor edge remake without changing balance for a correct practice, like new sword.
Amazing video. It's easier if you take the Handel apart first . FYI
Thank your for your comment and appreciation, I had already practice sharpening a little bit without tsuka (first experience disassembling shinken musashi YNH horizontal sharepning technic)
but with low quality craft I prefer not disassembling shinken
(too complicated to reassemble it then) for sharpening low quality craft (200euros first price musashi YNH), thank you for the advice.
Really awesome instructions, this restored my blades edge beautifully!
Thank you very much, a new video is in preparation soon about how to sharpen razor sharp a katana
Thank you for the excellent video brotha, ima about to sharpen a friend/local martial arts teachers katanas, i have a total of probably 9 stones so i should be good. Been sharpening blades for quite some years now but this these im definitely gonna be patient lol usually blades at machete length it will only take me a few hours but gonna spend extra time on the katanas cause they're going to be in an demo in 6 days so they will have to fly through tatami mats haha
Hello dear ronin, thank you for your comment appreciation and sharing your experience journey, it looks like you have quest challenge with the sensei swords for their demo, good luck, sincerly budo RH
So, how'd the blades perform, Matt?
How many times do you have to run the sword on each side to the slab?
Hello dear Ronin, thank you for your question.
So this video is about sharpening not the traditional way.
On the video « the broken blade » you will see how I tried the traditional way of sharpening (without successful result on the 2mm crack).
This first traditional way of sharpening was about 48 hours of work.
Neither not successful I applied the safety protocole with such tool (shinken)
alone in empty room, always focused 100% and being « present » in every sharpening move.
This first experience gave me a good first way to get in touch with the blade.
The second way this video (more effective and simple in my opinion)
was about 48 hours (2 days 12 hours in a week end).
12 hours for sharpening the tanto
12 hours for sharpening the musashi practical katana.
In my opinion it take 48 hours to become familiar with the blade whetstone and safety. Then you start to be more precise between 12 hours and 48hours on a second 48 hours session (of the second experience).
More longer you are focused more you are precise.
The precision of each pass is the key (in my opinion) not the number.
Working with 3 passes seems to be the best way to check the evolution of the process on your shinken.
@@RoninHood wow I did not expect it to take that long to sharpen! I plan to order a dojin pro katana from Ronin Katana. The blades come sharp but will it take 48 hours to reshapen a blade if you want to sharpen further
@@jimmylim5015 Dear ronin, thank you for your message, indeed it is a long process from my opinion and experience, that’s why it is expensive to make re sharp your shinken by a craftman (atelier du sabre japonais) around 150-300€ for a good job (very sharp/razor sharp).
From my experience it is close from an ashram meditation experience, it takes a really serious patience and dedication.
But we don’t have all the same skills capacity of sharpening (muscle memory).
I think my skills are average so my time indication seem realistic.
When you understand the process
4h-8h should be enough (after 3 swords sharpened).
Ronin dojo pro have really good reputation I think it is a good start with 1060 carbon steel. Please check your blade size and weight on seido website for a better choice dynamic healthy good measurements shinken.
And for the sharpnening I think it is good to start with a kitchen knife first (easier) or tanto (and safer (size)) and then a not expensive sword (100-200€) to see the result.
A bad result will make a sharp edge (kult of athena classification)
a good result a very sharp edge
a excellent result a razor sharp edge (I didnot had such result).
Every cut has to be perfect (in theory) because sharpening is really long (in my opinion.
1060 endure better cut less well than 1095 (in my opinion).
1095 easy cut but really fragile.
You know when they have a thicker accent like this they know their stuff. Now I know how to sharpen my katana. Gotta make sure to get that muscle memory.
😅 I’ m glad this video helped you !
Dose this work with any real katana because I would like to get one and use for practice.
Hello dear ronin,
thank you for your question and comment,
first what is a real katana :
- a nihonto = antique sword made in japan ? (not a good choice for practice)
- a gendaito = antique sword from post WWII or 1970's usable for tameshigiri ?
- a modern shinken = shinsakuto made in japan usable for tameshigiri
the best choice in these present days ?
- a practical sword made in china with the shape materials design of a katana as a japanese shinsakuto
but less expensive ?
The answer is not so evident, in my opinion a "real" katana would be a shinsakuto
as french wine it has to come from the soil of original creation place as a peace of art.
I think you mean a practical katana made in china.
Of course it works with carbon steel (katana made in china practical) but it is better to have a good dojo and correct steel than spending months sharpening on whetstones to have the skills to fix a broken blade or damaged edge.
sincerly budo
RH
Oh I see thank you very much
Is there a link to order them stones
I think depending on your country location
your amazon will provide you some whetstones of different grit
I think chinese brand are all close the same
here an exemple :
www.amazon.com/Complete-Knife-Sharpening-Stone-Set/dp/B08CXQ2SLS/ref=sr_1_2_sspa?crid=2DJSI1T0ANMCV&dib=eyJ2IjoiMSJ9.0qHfyLr3UJMd95tagF3Bvhnr7q29pq_4O6YBAKo8fl8LsTi-4WNncm2MNrB3R9vsWCHgFrRPSIWK2UPpqAYhqfMhL5n1rmnerGtq9exRrW4YUX0_HWttxQcGr9W2asJ2y04Oghtnd3K818_YtEoutbGp9fOzm32rLF_WObmckzY.R9xaPAiNDeUP_KXxp72deMeQ02aU38h3_AvdTfniiF4&dib_tag=se&keywords=shan+zu+whetstones&qid=1715186736&sprefix=shan+zu+whetstone%2Caps%2C180&sr=8-2-spons&sp_csd=d2lkZ2V0TmFtZT1zcF9hdGY&psc=1
hey does your blade get scratched up doing this or would that suggest theres something wrong with my technique
scratches on the side of the blade are quite normal even with correct angle
polishing the sides of the blade after sharpening would be great for visual aspect (I never experienced yet)
If you are making some cracks or cheaps on your edge by sharpening on whetstones your are on the wrong way on your sharpening process
@@RoninHood thanks for the response, i have mothers metal polish which ive heard suggested and it does a good job of removing rust and making it shine but for scratches doesn't seem to do much.. i appreciate maybe you havent tried but do you have any suggestions for making it clean and scratchless? ive heard you can use a whetstone for that too
you welcome,
I have heard the same that whetstones can be used for polishing,
I didn't start polishing yet but I will probably soon
and it will be on the youtube channel on CRAFT member
(special members on ronin hood channel : SUPPORT members/ CRAFT members/ TAMESHIGIRI & SHURIKEN learning members)
where I will put now all my high craft knowledge tutorials for japanese sword
> sharpening razor sharp (full detailed very precise learning) > (video already shot)
> how to change fittings with japanese ones
> polishing and other craft
I will maybe open an e-shop for craft member and ronin hood community with all sageo fittings that I have from Japan & bo shuriken made by very good black smith that I know
You could try tool polishing paper (cheap prices) and see what it will be
I will include polishing stone from japan on the shop but they are really expensive and you need the complete set for polishing properly your blade.
Hey Ronin, what katana did you use in this video and where did you get it from because the one I have looks the exact same as the one you are using in this video.
Hello dear Ronin, thank you for your comment, this a musashi practical from yarinohanzo (description and title), the brand YNH and seller katanamart box/invoice are the only way to be sure it is the same model, because musashi tsuba is used by many brands and the koshirae is really common too. If you have the same it is maybe unsharp as my shinken was when I unboxed it.
razors are sharpened to a minimum of 22000 grit
so if your stone only goes to 6000 defo not razor
(edit i meant 8000 grit accidentally wrote 6000)
Dear Ronin, thank you for your comment, I didn't know and will try with a 22000 grit whetstones as soon as possible, thanks for sharing this information.
@@RoninHood thats a minimum so some razor companies can go well above but the average is 22000 grit (fun fact 22000 grit in sand paper is not actually could grit its calculated in microns 1 micron is 0.001 of a millimeter)
😯😯
How did samurai sharpen katanas without access to a blacksmith and while at war or conducting military operations?
Hello dear ronin,
it is an excellent question,
i have absolutely no idea...
The only thing that i know is that dotanuki forged blade were known for being more resistant on the field of battle and for primal samurai life.
@@RoninHood Thanks for reply 👍
you are welcome 🙂
Goodbye yokote!
yokote is fine :)
I recently bought an antique sword in Japan, can I used these stones and technique on an older sword?
Dear Ronin, thank you for your comment and question, I absolutely not recommend to sharpen or polish a nihonto by your own. A Nihonto is a master piece of art, an historical object and a precious cultural symbol and swordsmith achievement of japanese culture. The fast technic (48-96 hours) used for a low cost shinken (katanamart) made in china (200dollars) can't be applied to a nihonto (6000-20000 dollars), in my opinion. You can ask them www.atelier-du-sabre-japonais.com/ where to find in your country a craftman who will restaure your nihonto (polishing and sharpening) and to check your NBTHK certificate (they are members of the NBTHK). From what I know (safety protocole review on Ronin Hood ruclips.net/video/qmIkvpoj5qM/видео.html) European Federation of Iai recommend to use a shinsakuto (tozando 7 500 dollars shinken at your size made in japan) for tameshigiri, instead of a nihonto that is a historical object and work of art. I hope this will help. RH
Question: is the Musashi ( when they deliver you it ) already sharp?
hello dear ronin, this musashi prac from ynh was just sharp when I receive it. Not enough sharpen in my opinion for tameshigiri or battodo, very sharp as minimum or razor sharp are really better (even sharp is enough for simple cuts).
@@RoninHood thanks for replying.
you are welcome 🙂🥋
nice
Thanks
Thank you👍☝️🙏😮😊
you are welcome
this way of sharpening doesnt destroy the geometry of the blade? i want to sharpen mine a 1060dh but i hear a lot that if you dont know how to sharpen properly the geometry gets destroyed
Hello dear ronin,
excellent deduction and huge subject indeed, you are absolutely right I will have to do an episode about this to compare : with a new sword (I already check with a similar sword than the weight balanced has been transformed for really worse) how my two first sharpening process transformed the geometry and weight distribution of the broken blade (YNH musashi 1060).
The answer - in my opinion and experience - the traditional horizontal sharpening is extremely difficult for me and because of the cheap in the broken blade asked to transform it too significatively with a non uniform way on the shape of the blade by sharpening. That means that my two first day horizontal technic were wrong because not uniform with the exactly same number of passes/pressure on each cm of the blade. But the vertical non traditional technic is really effective in my opinion (not necessary to disassemble the shinken to keep habaki motohara original fitting) and the swordsmith of joel sparge use it too. It is simple fast if you are good and experienced with correct muscle memory angle / number of passes and correct pressure. At least you can reduce as minimum the materials from the blade for improving the edge sharpen.
At this day this is my opinion : traditional way needs serious instruction (for me i wasn’t able to do it but katana fanboy for exemple looks successful with this technic...) and vertical is just simplier and faster for me (I prefer practicing than crafting I m not crazy spending week-end on crafting only).
@@RoninHood I saw that video from katana fanboy too, where he sharpens the Katana with sand paper it kinda makes sense that if you do it that way, like you are sanding all the material from de sides evenly you don't change the structure a lot but I kinda worried to try it because even tho my sword isn't the greatest it's almost all I can get in my country and it's pricey so don't want to mess it bad.
Also I have another question I would love if you can answer!
My katana is not totally blunt it is sharp the kissaki in particular is the sharpest part it cuts paper without problem, but all the sword apart from the kissaki can't cut paper alone or at contact if I pierce the paper it cut no problem and when I touch the edge it feels almost as sharpen as the kissaki.
so I was thinking about stropping first, what do you think? You think it would work? Apart from destroying the polish and the possibility of letting the edge blunt there is another risk?
@@RoninHood sorry for the Bible I writed I'm pretty new at this :c and probably my English.
you and fanboy helped me a lot with your videos! I would love to see that comparation video!
Good luck and thank you
I understand your situation. You have only one precious first katana almost blunt and you don't want to break it ... For the sand paper I dont know I didn't try it... You are like me before ronin hood stuck with a first blade maybe not knowing how to use it on paper or omote because maybe you don't have sensei/dojo/proper instruction...
Your best option is to find a dojo class if you can do it for knowing how to use it with paper or omote. For sharpening you can train yourself with sand paper or whetstones with cheap kitchen knives first. Then when you feel ready you try to sharpen your precious first shinken... Or you can buy the cheapest blade you can find to train your sharpening process with whetsones first. For the polish I don't know I am a practitioner so the polish doesn't change the practice so I m not receptive to this detail.
My advice is : don't forget you only need correct practice/posture/safety protocole and because of that you need a dojo instructor (even iaido instead of battodo)
a shinken is just a peace of metal (joerg sprave) ruclips.net/video/2t4ojjzJJZ4/видео.html
ruclips.net/video/mTsfPPR91qc/видео.html
Any peace of metal with a sharpen edge can cut omote.
what it make it special is :
quality of the swordsmith
quality of the materials
quality of your practice
quality of attitude to your shinken
this make it an art
You are welcome,
thank you !
めちゃ苦ですな。
なぜこれ?刃のネジ山が切れてしまったので、残念ながら抜刀道に再利用する必要がありました。敬具
Thank you much for this I actually sharpen a tanto shirasaysa like this and it worked fantastic 😊
Hello dear ronin, thank you for your comment and feed back, I’m glad it could help. It looks nice to start with a tanto shirasaya. Good luck with your omote cuts.
@@RoninHood yes I've already sharpen two of them with a water stone all came out superb thank you again
You are welcome, your work/result look great
Hey so I only have an 150€ katana from Amazon so I would like to know if I could actually sharpen that one because I don't know the quality
Hello dear ronin,
technically any peace of metal can be sharpen,
the type of metal or steel will change the "impact" of cut (because of different level of density brings by different carbon level into the steel : 0,45/0,6/0,95/1,05/1,2) from my experience/knowledges/opinion and will keep more or less longer the sharp on the edge depending on carbon quantity present into the steel (steel = iron + carbon). So any peace of metal sharpen can make a kesa giri. But the shape of the object will change the easiness to use it (weight distribution = swordsmith work).
ruclips.net/video/mTsfPPR91qc/видео.html
thank you
you are welcome
merci pour cette superbe vidéo , a ton accent je suppose que tu est Fr , donc un grand merci pour cette vidéo très précieuse , j'ai un wakizashi magnifique et d'excellente qualité , mais j'avais besoin de l'affûter grandement afin que celle ci soit bien tranchante afin qu'elle coupe le papier , un pouce bleu bien mérité :) contunu comme ça je m'abonne :)☺️🙏
Bonjour cher Ronin, merci pour votre commentaire et pour votre appréciation, il est très appréciable de savoir que ce contenu ait pu vous aider dans votre pratique en tant que collectionneur ou pratiquant de dojo et qu’il ait pu être apprécié au point de vous donner envie de vous abonner à la chaine. Bienvenue à Ronin Hood. Sincèrement budo RH
milles mercis , vous êtes super ☺️🙏
Bonjour cher Ronin, merci pour votre commentaire, je vous remercie pour votre appréciation et vous souhaite le meilleur pour votre pratique, sincèrement budo RH
So the water doesn't rust the carbon steel. I'm still confused about this
hello dear ronin,
not for one or two days of sharpening
but for days weeks months carbon steel is really fragile to skin touch or water contact and can rust easily
So we apply after sharpening or tameshigiri camelia oil to protect the blade.
I have a pratical yarinohanzo katana i would like to sharpen, since the sword originally wasn't and it has a slightly round kissaki (point), do you think your method would also be effective in making a proper point?
If not, how does one do that?
Hello,
i think it would work but i would remove the less material as possible to not change the blade geometry (weight distribution)
I have a Musashi 41 inch Katana, I believe it is 1060 steel. The blade came to me extremely sharp. After a lot of 2 liter and bottle cutting the blade has become dull. Any suggestions on where to obtain the proper wet stones as well as what grits are needed at the bare minimum?
Hello dear Ronin, I think you may mean that your musashi prac YNH is about 70-71 cm nagasa (28 inches) 104 cm tsuka+nagasa so 41 inches... Yes the musashi prac YNH is 1060 cs, it keep less longer the edge sharp than the 1095 (but more resilient with shocks when edge not correctly alined), specially when the edge is not cleanly alined on bamboo plastic bottle it can be dull really fast... 400 or 600 or 800 as low low grit 1000 grit intermediate then 3000 then 8000 grit, removing less materials as possible to not change the balance/weight distribution of the blade (mistake that I did on this sharpening process with the musashi prac YNH > balance became really worst for cutting > ruclips.net/video/zUPM6M-NXyY/видео.html)
Do you need to go forward up and then left down to get x burrs I read that in an artical
Sorry I don't understand the question could you be more specifical (details) it helps for me for understanding
1060 is too soft for a real katana the real katana is made of a special steel from Japan
Yes indeed, tamagahane 1,2 % of carbon able to cut a kabuto during a cutting test.
Hi, how close is this to the traditional method? Some says that katana should be polihed rather than sharpened.
hello dear ronin,
this is really far from the traditional method. First disassembling the katana, then sharpening horizontally (and not verticaly). Polishing and sharpening are two different process. From what I know polishing can be esthetical (mirror polishing) but can also be a way to extract rust from a blade.
Was hoping for some grid selection advice...
Hello dear Ronin, with 600/1000/3000/8000 grit on shan zu whetstones you will have the same result than the video with just good number of stones/grit. Good luck
Dude.. disassemble your katana first?
Hello dear ronin, already did it on the first sharpening process (The story of the broken Blade + Musashi practical YNH reviews) but the results was not efficient. The crack on the blade was too important. If you disassemble your shinken with a crack of 2 mm and sharpen it until the crack dispear your habaki won't fit anymore with the shinken and it will change the sori (tsuka/habaki/nagasa). It is better in that case - in my opinion - to sharpen without disassemble the shinken to keep the habaki/blade fit and save the blade for a practical use even the dynamic/sori/balance will be changed and not for the better of course.
Naw this is how you raw dawg life man
Dude why you ain't have a damn thing to say back?😂
Some croquet hoops will keep your tatami stand from falling over 👍
Dear Ronin, thank you for your comment and for this excellent idea, sincerly budo RH
Having the proper technique and sharpness of blade will also keep it from falling over.
can we sharpened a stickered replica katana
any piece of metal (maru=block) can be sharpened 1045 or 1060 or 1095 it exists decades of tool steel
heat treatment improves a lot (clay)
tsuka (gard)
and weight distribution (shape)
for cutting omote (battodo)
how do you know which bricks to use and when
Hello dear ronin, you will find the answer in the comments with questions proposed by other ronin.
Thank you for this video.
Hello dear ronin, Thank you for your nice comment 🥋
I couldnt find 240/600 grit whetstones can i replace them with something else
Hello dear Ronin, you will find easely on amazon a shanzu 400 or 600 grit, if you want to make the sharpening process from A to Z with a good result I suggest to have all the tools.
Hello Ronin i am from the middle east and we dont have much variety even in amazon here i found and ordered 240/400/1000/3000/8000 would that suffice? Or is it necessary to get the 600 grit
Hello dear Ronin, 400 or 600/1000/3000/8000 are enough in my opinion for sharpening a shinken.
200-400-600-800 grit repair chipped edge (one stone of 400 or 600 is enough)
1000-3000 grit give back a sharp edge to the blade (for dull blade)
8000 grit is finishing grit for sharpening the edge
less the number grit is important more is important the size of steel particules removed from the blade
So becareful with your first stone 400-600 you can remove too much steel if you press too much too long time and the shape of the shinken will be no longer harmonious and efficient.
@@RoninHood thanks Ronin i will be starting on small feats like sharpening knifes before i go anywhere near my shinken🙏🏻
This is a wise idea starting small and proceed step by step getting closer to the result (staying focused and safe) on 12-24 hours sharpening session (1 day a knife sharpened, 1 day a sheap shinken or tanto sharpened)
Why are you wearing a mask out in the woods?
Hello dear Ronin, on the beginning I was not sure to present my face and was imagining the character of ronin hood with a shinobi mask look, but after seeing the video result I decided to show a simple budo practitioner as I am without any mask even I like very much the shinobi style of this mask for Ronin Hood.
@@RoninHood ohhhhh that kinda mask ok sweet yea I totally like it. I thought it was a covid mask.
you can use it for dojo inside if you want, but I think it is awesome as shinobi ronin show, and nobody in zanshinwood so masks are not so useful 😅
if my katana have that waves in it i need to have any special attention?
hello dear ronin, thank you for your comment, what do you mean by « that waves in it »?
if you mean by « wave in it » : the hamon (clay treatment) you will probably scratch the surface of the blade during the sharpening process, so eventually if you want a clean result after sharpening, polishing the blade will be necessary for refresh the surface from scratches (whetstones).
@@RoninHood ohhh thank you, yes, I meant the hamon, I just didn't knew the name, thanks a lot
you welcome 😉
if you have a decent quality blade. how long will it stay sharp? if chopping branches for example
Hello dear Ronin, 1060 carbon steel keep less longer time the sharpness than 1095 carbon steel because it is a less strong steel. From empirical experience 1060 doesn't have the same swing sound and sharpness than 1095 (that is really better). For the cuts that I mess (mistakes) and have touched the stand (wood pine) it create quickly a dull edge on the points of impact on the edge (just with one cut). But the 1095 keep a better and longer sharpness than the 1060. 1095 can break on impact with a too strong wood target. I do not recommend chopping branches because the blade will become quickly useless (it depends on the number of cuts and size sections of branches) and it will take time for sharpen the blade properly.
it is mostly about tecnique, one bad cut can kill most Katanas on hard targets
@@way2dumb yes, but cutting wood even with proper technic will destroy the edge (dull) on 1-10 moves, shinken is not design for cutting wood (exception made green bamboo)
@@way2dumb I think you mean sharpening instead of polish (polishing is the process for making mirror effect on the sides of the blade, removing scratches when you remake polishing)
@@way2dumb Ok, I thought you were meaning sharpening (the subject), that is true too for polishing after 500 mats.
Demain mon premier katana arrive par la poste, Nanbu shinken de chez Katanamart.
En vous souhaitant la meilleur pratique martiale possible (en dojo) avec ce shinken 1060 cs, n’hésitez pas a pratiquer en dojo le iai ou battodo pour éviter toute mauvaise posture ou mauvaise coupe pouvant blesser inutilement. Sincèrement budo RH
@@RoninHood thank you. I am on a rehabilitation quest for a body I used to cherish more. Martial arts will give me the framework I desperately need to get back to myself.
I can understand it is important to get back to personal and healthy training to feel alined (shin=mind and tai=body)
you have iaito (unsharp blade) for preserving yourself from uncorrect posture/use with shinken. wish you the best for your budo journey.
@@RoninHood thank you! (...would you be able to suggest me an elbow rehab exercise that you know?..)
Sure, i have the project to create a program on teachable for physical preparation (weight training full body, cardio basic, stretching basic, postural exercices) before starting battodo with iaito (basic cuts - 2nd program)
Did you have an injury or accident with you elbow (if yes which type) to give you an appropriate rehab exercice.
Can u use a angle guider?
Hello dear ronin, from my experience it doesn't work on katana because not the same angle for the edge, 15 degrees (half of your thumb) instead of 20 degrees for knives, from what I know and had experienced... It worked with angle guider on sharpening process with the tanto, maybe more close than a knife for the edge angle for sharpening...
@@RoninHood I saw a RUclipsr do it though? ADHD’s world
Interesting ... it didn't work for me on my shinken sharpening with the guider... good luck
@@RoninHood ok ty IL try that if not IL do it in a 15 degree angle
What grit do you start out with then finish with ?
you start with low 400-600 then 1000 then 2000 then 3000-5000 then 8000