You timed this just right for BioShock bundle was just on sale on steam and now free on epic. That's how I ended up here to learn more about the lore from the games I just got.
Great vid dude, tho i'm late to the party having just played Bioshock 2 this month. The real question is...was it Johnny Top Side that got him some Lamb Cake and is Eleanore's real pops? I mean her real-real daddy along with being her Mr Bubbles? If not who was Eleanore's biological dad????
Might be worth noting that Ryan actually opposed Lamb coming to Rapture from the beginning. He bemoans that some are getting depressed due to the lack of the sun and are clamouring for a remedy. He compares this to whether people miss the "state censor" or "police, gathering them up in the night" but he eventually invites her to "quiet the rattling of the Great Chain's weakest links"
No I'm the book he brings her down to assess the mental states of rapture workers and assured her she could open her own practice and not be called a "lady doctor". He didn't care about mental health either way he wanted to figure out who was an potential red aversive so he brought her down do us her. She had plan to use rapture
Lamb never really saw Eleanor as her child, as her family. She saw a legacy, a test subject, a thing that she could lord over everyone else. And that in the end was her undoing, because despite the fact the bond between Eleanor and Delta was created in a lab, it was a bond of love by the end. And that love pushed Delta forwards and fueled Eleanor's rebellion against Lamb. Delta loved Eleanor and she loved him, and you can see that in the endings. Even if Eleanor spares her mother, she leaves her inside the escape pod, unwanted and forgotten while she helps the man who she sees as family pass on.
Sofia Lamb: Is a highly acclaimed, intelligent, and a greatly influential physiologist with a vast knowledge of the human psyche. Also Sofia Lamb: separates her daughter from her father figure and has Elenor witness her ‘father’ being forced to kill himself right in front of her while she was still just a child…
@@Skeletontiger one would think that a child witnessing the death of their parent would cause some serious physiological problems, even in those times, but you’re probably right that I’m just seeing this with modern foresight.
i got a bit more for you Doesnt acknowledge the Evil of Supressing the Self As both Elenor and Delta were infact her "utopians" why ..they had Supressed Self Delta: kill anyone who harms Elenor do not even care about your own life Elenor is All that matter Elenor: Do not think about anything not the Sky or Sun or even other people Focus only on Gathering Adam from "angels" nothing else matters ((these two had their "selves" supressed as such they are the "utopians" Sophia wanted so why not embrace them after all))
Keep in mind I wouldn't say she looked at her as a mother looks at a daughter more like how a craftsman looks at a tool. If you read the novel she is WAY worse.
It's ironic that Sofia Lamb hated the surface for commiting atrocities for "the greater good" when she herself would commit comparable atrocities within Rapture itself for "the greater good." It's also pretty telling how Lamb dances the line between altruism and cynicsim when her ideal world is one where humans are little more than cogs in the machine. I know she isn't meant to be the anti-Ryan or anything like that, but it really is wonderful how those two could not be further opposite of each other and it still ends with Rapture being a living nightmare.
Pretty messed up how she saw Jack's "Would You Kindly" conditioning as a "good" thing. The idea of creating a human who has no self interest and is only interested in helping others seems good on paper but the more you think about the more of a bad idea it becomes. Since at that point, without self interest, you're not really human anymore or as we would defined them. You'd essentially just be a machine doing good not out of any real desire or want to help but simply because that's all you are capable of doing. Dispassionate, uncaring good. And if at that point there's no real choice between doing good or evil, can you really classify that as "good"? I feel Rapture was just an awful place that ultimately corrupted everyone it touched and pushed their ideals to such insane degrees that destruction and self destruction were the only real inevitabilities.
The ironic thing is that Jack seems to be a completely normal guy except for when he hears the phrase, then he loses free will, so he is not interested in helping anyone, his inner intentions never change, he literally can’t do anything against it
@@Skeletontiger eh nah, straight up incorrect, not once was jack commanded to harvest/spare little sisters, yet in the canonical ending jack saved all little sisters, indicating when he could, he DID help.
She should've stayed in Japan -_- but then again, she never would've came to Rapture and never would've gave birth to Eleanor and Eleanor never would've met Subject Delta and we would never have gotten Bioshock 2 :( So thankfully the nuclear bombings on Japan opened her eyes and made her go down that path towards insanity.
Honestly, if she survived my best guess is that Eleanor dragged her off somewhere and locked her up. A form of house arrest with Eleanor as her warden, the one person who can't be manipulated by Lamb
Can we get a video on Porter? He was a good man with a bad past personally a favorite character also don’t forget killing the reporter guy also would be revenge for Delta cause he did get delta turned into a big daddy
Is it just me or do all the famous leaders of rapture like Ryan, Lamb, Fontaine etc. ultimately try and escape from their own humanity and that around them by living in the utopian city? What’s ironic is that it was their arrogance, their ignorance and their ultimate humanity that led to their own downfalls.
I get what they were trying to do with her as a villain -create Ryan's equal and opposite. Show that going to the opposite extreme was just as bad as Ryan's ultra individualism. But I never found her as interesting or compelling as Ryan.
I completely get that. With Ryan I saw what he was saying as awful, but his general mannerisms and how strongly he valued his beliefs sorta made him admirable to me. With Lamb though, she was just so insufferably smug and “holier than thou” that I couldn’t stand listening to her.
I love these videos. I’ve watched all of them. Bioshock is my favorite franchise. I would be ecstatic to see a Bioshock series from a legit streaming platform
HATE HATE HATE HATE HATE SO MUCH HATE that's my feelings and thoughts towards this character. She to me is way worse then Fountain Ryan or The Father and she is the only one where if you kill her it's the "bad" ending like wtf. Respect and keep up the epic work.
Got to admit I didn’t like that if you kill specific people in the game you get the “bad ending” despite the fact that realistically why would you keep Stanley, Alexander or Sofia alive? Bit of a poor choice tbh
Honestly I never really get why they brought choices in BioShock two. sense your a big daddy so it makes no sense why choices really matter towards you. Since your only objective is to get your little girl back anything else shouldn’t really matter since you are a big daddy which means you’re neutral and the ending should’ve been decided on something else in my opinion.🐱
@@topcat59 It's explained in the audio logs that when Eleanor decided to go against her mother and revive Delta's body, she got into contact with Tannenbaum via the new little sisters Lamb kidnapped, and through Tannenbaum's theory of using ADAM's "recalling of past cells configurations to revert a patient's genetic changes", used ADAM to revert Delta's mind back to normal, giving him self-awareness and independence to choose when he was resurrected. It's like waking up from a sleepwalking trance. That's why they brought choices to BioShock 2; it's literally intertwined in with the writing.
@@thecircleoft.e.d2121 honestly that does change my opinion on how I view delta and them bring back choices but still they could’ve add better choices that affected how Eleanor views the world. Because some of the choices you make she shouldn’t be aware of besides the little sisters.🐱
@@WiseFish It's to prove that Delta is more than just a machine. It is also to act as a moral compass for Eleanor, who sees Delta as her father figure - killing people out of spite and indulging in your base instincts is not something who wamt to teach children, and more importantly it would prove Lamb correct.
Do a video talking about Frank Fontaine. Also one on Subject Delta. And i believe if you saved Sofia with the good ending she might actually attempt to rekindle the lost bond between her and her daughter Elanor.
I'm trying to think about what Eleanor would do once she reaches the topside world and how she would deal with "not" being subjugated , mutilated and experimented on. Delta, once being Johnny topside, knows about the world, and he can guide her, and that's part of the reason why I think she absorbs him if she feels he's a Righteous person. She could become a figurehead, a political spokesperson warning everyone against the horrible collectivism from Rapture, study philosophy, becoming an intellectual, but to no avail. Somewhere, someone again managed to create a dystopian ghetto, on land. While still having the powers that she has when she wears in her suit. I could imagine her in a Bioshock spin off as rapture's "wonder woman", in an open world game where she would use her bond with Subject Delta as a gameplay mechanic, dealing with the denizens of that newly created place.
Probably because she is worse than Fontaine or Ryan. Those two believed in their own ideaology. Fontaine is all about himself and acted accordingly. Ryan is all about ultimate freedom and making as much money as possible. She is a deluded fool who believes in an impossible dream that only creates hell where it is tried.
Beware the moral busybody, for they are the harshest of tyrants. Though the robber baron may be evil, his cruelty has limits, but the busybody will never relent. They will harass and destroy without end, for they do so with the approval of their own conscience.
Not getting to kill lamb was one of the biggest disappointments pf my BS2 playthrough (besides being a pale shadow of 1) as she seemed more deserving of it than Ryan or Fontaine, as to me she was the true face of evil in rapture.
Sofia is honesty one of the most evil characters I can think of, using the most vulnerable peoples fear to get power for herself, to sacrifice her own daughters free will out of her own misguided delusion. Having her drown the way she did in the game was far too merciful for the pain she inflicted on Rapture and it’s people. Ryan and Fontain at least knew they where monsters, Lamb believed she was doing good.
Sofia being disgusted of the US calling the bombing of Hiroshima and Nagasaki as an act of a greater good highlights the phrase of "the path to hell is paved with good intentions" how many times in History did we hear from tyrants say they were doing it for a good cause when they were murdering civilians in the streets and such.
@@GanymedeBoy agreed shes a hero but in the game she is antagonist, (villain doesn't equal antagonist) she is set as your opponent at points and as an opposing force I found her really interesting and compelling.
Bioshock 2 was fun but I feel like it lacked the political strength of the first. Andrew Ryan is representative of a very real and fairly common political philosophy. He's a realistic person. Lamb just felt like a caricature. I've never heard of anyone whose philosophy honestly resembled hers.
I remember the first time playing this and being, of all emotions, angry. The first had an amazing story but clunky gameplay, this had amazing gameplay but absolute shit for story. In the first Bioshock, you were unsure of who to trust...what words held weight and which were the drug addled ramblings of a broken-ass mind. The second just overtly and in a decidedly ham-fisted manner will repeatedly bash your skull in with "blonde lady bad. Kill bad. Save girl." It was a massive disappointment.
![Seungmin "그렇게, 천천히, 우리(As we are)" | [Stray Kids : SKZ-PLAYER]](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/kAzmhLHePqU/mqdefault.jpg)
Hope you guys enjoyed this video, it was a bit of a challenge to make but hopefully it paid off!! Let me know if you wanna see more
Could you something on we happy few
i always like your videos Wisefish also hello again
You timed this just right for BioShock bundle was just on sale on steam and now free on epic. That's how I ended up here to learn more about the lore from the games I just got.
That's just a normal psychiatrist.
Great vid dude, tho i'm late to the party having just played Bioshock 2 this month. The real question is...was it Johnny Top Side that got him some Lamb Cake and is Eleanore's real pops? I mean her real-real daddy along with being her Mr Bubbles? If not who was Eleanore's biological dad????
Might be worth noting that Ryan actually opposed Lamb coming to Rapture from the beginning.
He bemoans that some are getting depressed due to the lack of the sun and are clamouring for a remedy. He compares this to whether people miss the "state censor" or "police, gathering them up in the night" but he eventually invites her to "quiet the rattling of the Great Chain's weakest links"
No I'm the book he brings her down to assess the mental states of rapture workers and assured her she could open her own practice and not be called a "lady doctor". He didn't care about mental health either way he wanted to figure out who was an potential red aversive so he brought her down do us her. She had plan to use rapture
Lamb never really saw Eleanor as her child, as her family. She saw a legacy, a test subject, a thing that she could lord over everyone else.
And that in the end was her undoing, because despite the fact the bond between Eleanor and Delta was created in a lab, it was a bond of love by the end. And that love pushed Delta forwards and fueled Eleanor's rebellion against Lamb. Delta loved Eleanor and she loved him, and you can see that in the endings.
Even if Eleanor spares her mother, she leaves her inside the escape pod, unwanted and forgotten while she helps the man who she sees as family pass on.
Sofia Lamb: Is a highly acclaimed, intelligent, and a greatly influential physiologist with a vast knowledge of the human psyche.
Also Sofia Lamb: separates her daughter from her father figure and has Elenor witness her ‘father’ being forced to kill himself right in front of her while she was still just a child…
Her knowledge is like on the level of the 40s and 50s, a time where cocaine was freely available
@@Skeletontiger one would think that a child witnessing the death of their parent would cause some serious physiological problems, even in those times, but you’re probably right that I’m just seeing this with modern foresight.
i got a bit more for you
Doesnt acknowledge the Evil of Supressing the Self
As both Elenor and Delta were infact her "utopians" why ..they had Supressed Self
Delta: kill anyone who harms Elenor do not even care about your own life Elenor is All that matter
Elenor: Do not think about anything not the Sky or Sun or even other people Focus only on Gathering Adam from "angels" nothing else matters
((these two had their "selves" supressed as such they are the "utopians" Sophia wanted so why not embrace them after all))
Keep in mind I wouldn't say she looked at her as a mother looks at a daughter more like how a craftsman looks at a tool.
If you read the novel she is WAY worse.
Stone cold psychopathy/sociopathy
It's ironic that Sofia Lamb hated the surface for commiting atrocities for "the greater good" when she herself would commit comparable atrocities within Rapture itself for "the greater good."
It's also pretty telling how Lamb dances the line between altruism and cynicsim when her ideal world is one where humans are little more than cogs in the machine.
I know she isn't meant to be the anti-Ryan or anything like that, but it really is wonderful how those two could not be further opposite of each other and it still ends with Rapture being a living nightmare.
That’s the beauty of Bioshocks writing I find, a lot of depth in its characters!
Sofia Lamb is a huge hypocrite
Pretty messed up how she saw Jack's "Would You Kindly" conditioning as a "good" thing. The idea of creating a human who has no self interest and is only interested in helping others seems good on paper but the more you think about the more of a bad idea it becomes. Since at that point, without self interest, you're not really human anymore or as we would defined them. You'd essentially just be a machine doing good not out of any real desire or want to help but simply because that's all you are capable of doing. Dispassionate, uncaring good. And if at that point there's no real choice between doing good or evil, can you really classify that as "good"? I feel Rapture was just an awful place that ultimately corrupted everyone it touched and pushed their ideals to such insane degrees that destruction and self destruction were the only real inevitabilities.
The ironic thing is that Jack seems to be a completely normal guy except for when he hears the phrase, then he loses free will, so he is not interested in helping anyone, his inner intentions never change, he literally can’t do anything against it
@@Skeletontiger eh nah, straight up incorrect, not once was jack commanded to harvest/spare little sisters, yet in the canonical ending jack saved all little sisters, indicating when he could, he DID help.
@@imonke5303 what I wrote does not contradict that
A man chooses, a slave obeys
@@rhymenoceros3303 Sofia's utopia is an analogy of socialism in the USSR.
She lived in Japan during World War II, oh my god that explains why she behaves the way she does. hell it makes sense why she would work with Ryan.🐱
And why she would believe that humanity could only move forward without conflict.
She should've stayed in Japan -_- but then again, she never would've came to Rapture and never would've gave birth to Eleanor and Eleanor never would've met Subject Delta and we would never have gotten Bioshock 2 :( So thankfully the nuclear bombings on Japan opened her eyes and made her go down that path towards insanity.
Always wondered what happened to her once Elanor and the Little Sisters fled to the surface. Seems like a dangerous loose end to leave unchecked.
Honestly, if she survived my best guess is that Eleanor dragged her off somewhere and locked her up. A form of house arrest with Eleanor as her warden, the one person who can't be manipulated by Lamb
Well theres one person who can help fix little sisters who we know met eleanor due to the bond the sisters held
Can we get a video on Porter? He was a good man with a bad past personally a favorite character also don’t forget killing the reporter guy also would be revenge for Delta cause he did get delta turned into a big daddy
Is it just me or do all the famous leaders of rapture like Ryan, Lamb, Fontaine etc. ultimately try and escape from their own humanity and that around them by living in the utopian city? What’s ironic is that it was their arrogance, their ignorance and their ultimate humanity that led to their own downfalls.
they all are monsters, for different reasons, with different backgrounds, but yes, barely Humans in some ways.
I was really upset to find that there was only three Bioshock videos when I started watching your channel, thanks for making more of these.
Really enjoying your Bioshock lore videos! Please do keep making them!
Another amazing video!! Love your content mate!!
I get what they were trying to do with her as a villain -create Ryan's equal and opposite. Show that going to the opposite extreme was just as bad as Ryan's ultra individualism. But I never found her as interesting or compelling as Ryan.
Really ? I actually found both her and Ryan equally interesting. I loved to hear her recordings just as much as Ryan's.
I completely get that. With Ryan I saw what he was saying as awful, but his general mannerisms and how strongly he valued his beliefs sorta made him admirable to me. With Lamb though, she was just so insufferably smug and “holier than thou” that I couldn’t stand listening to her.
Hell yeah it's Christmas every time u post brother
Ah thank you dude!! I appreciate the love :)
I love these videos. I’ve watched all of them. Bioshock is my favorite franchise. I would be ecstatic to see a Bioshock series from a legit streaming platform
4:22 I could of sworn you said Rand for a second. Maybe because I just got done reading a few chapters of the fountain head
Can never get bored of your videos WiseFish!
Great video as always WiseFish.
Thank you dude!
Wisefish has made my day better with this vid
Thanks dude! Glad you enjoyed it!
An unpopular opinion, I like Bioshock 2 more then 1
I agree.
Your work is so good. I love listening to it on the way to work in the morning!
HATE HATE HATE HATE HATE SO MUCH HATE that's my feelings and thoughts towards this character.
She to me is way worse then Fountain Ryan or The Father and she is the only one where if you kill her it's the "bad" ending like wtf.
Respect and keep up the epic work.
Got to admit I didn’t like that if you kill specific people in the game you get the “bad ending” despite the fact that realistically why would you keep Stanley, Alexander or Sofia alive? Bit of a poor choice tbh
Honestly I never really get why they brought choices in BioShock two. sense your a big daddy so it makes no sense why choices really matter towards you. Since your only objective is to get your little girl back anything else shouldn’t really matter since you are a big daddy which means you’re neutral and the ending should’ve been decided on something else in my opinion.🐱
@@topcat59 It's explained in the audio logs that when Eleanor decided to go against her mother and revive Delta's body, she got into contact with Tannenbaum via the new little sisters Lamb kidnapped, and through Tannenbaum's theory of using ADAM's "recalling of past cells configurations to revert a patient's genetic changes", used ADAM to revert Delta's mind back to normal, giving him self-awareness and independence to choose when he was resurrected. It's like waking up from a sleepwalking trance.
That's why they brought choices to BioShock 2; it's literally intertwined in with the writing.
@@thecircleoft.e.d2121 honestly that does change my opinion on how I view delta and them bring back choices but still they could’ve add better choices that affected how Eleanor views the world. Because some of the choices you make she shouldn’t be aware of besides the little sisters.🐱
@@WiseFish It's to prove that Delta is more than just a machine. It is also to act as a moral compass for Eleanor, who sees Delta as her father figure - killing people out of spite and indulging in your base instincts is not something who wamt to teach children, and more importantly it would prove Lamb correct.
Do a video talking about Frank Fontaine. Also one on Subject Delta. And i believe if you saved Sofia with the good ending she might actually attempt to rekindle the lost bond between her and her daughter Elanor.
The thing about the poker games is pretty sweet.
I love your work!!
Lamb is like Ryan both are hypothetical
Being a lamb myself I'm real happy to see this come up lol
I liked that part of her
What would happen if Sofia work with Frank?
Probably would have ended the same way with Frank trying to kill her or get rid of her following
I adore the character Sofia Lamb. Expertly written.
Nice video
Ahh Rapture, where the scientist (or medical professional) would not be restrained by petty morality.
😢
I'm trying to think about what Eleanor would do once she reaches the topside world and how she would deal with "not" being subjugated , mutilated and experimented on. Delta, once being Johnny topside, knows about the world, and he can guide her, and that's part of the reason why I think she absorbs him if she feels he's a Righteous person. She could become a figurehead, a political spokesperson warning everyone against the horrible collectivism from Rapture, study philosophy, becoming an intellectual, but to no avail. Somewhere, someone again managed to create a dystopian ghetto, on land. While still having the powers that she has when she wears in her suit. I could imagine her in a Bioshock spin off as rapture's "wonder woman", in an open world game where she would use her bond with Subject Delta as a gameplay mechanic, dealing with the denizens of that newly created place.
Bioshock collection is free on epic right now
So when Sofia learned about Jack she immediately went completely bonkers and transformed into a cartoon character?
7:16 2 cults against each other.
review on the Speed Racer video game?
I alway dispised Sofia Lamb far more than any other antagonists from Bioshock. Not entirely sure why.
Probably because she is worse than Fontaine or Ryan. Those two believed in their own ideaology. Fontaine is all about himself and acted accordingly. Ryan is all about ultimate freedom and making as much money as possible. She is a deluded fool who believes in an impossible dream that only creates hell where it is tried.
Beware the moral busybody, for they are the harshest of tyrants. Though the robber baron may be evil, his cruelty has limits, but the busybody will never relent. They will harass and destroy without end, for they do so with the approval of their own conscience.
Dude you make these videos like art 🔥🔥🤘🏻great shit✌️🤙🏻🤙🏻🐐🐐
NGL, the cover made me think it was a Roanoke video
Not getting to kill lamb was one of the biggest disappointments pf my BS2 playthrough (besides being a pale shadow of 1) as she seemed more deserving of it than Ryan or Fontaine, as to me she was the true face of evil in rapture.
Sofia is honesty one of the most evil characters I can think of, using the most vulnerable peoples fear to get power for herself, to sacrifice her own daughters free will out of her own misguided delusion.
Having her drown the way she did in the game was far too merciful for the pain she inflicted on Rapture and it’s people.
Ryan and Fontain at least knew they where monsters, Lamb believed she was doing good.
Lol them psychiatrists be crazy on the DL
Bioshock would have been better if it was a book
it has one
Create a videogame is like a mix of a book and a movie even better
Sofia being disgusted of the US calling the bombing of Hiroshima and Nagasaki as an act of a greater good highlights the phrase of "the path to hell is paved with good intentions" how many times in History did we hear from tyrants say they were doing it for a good cause when they were murdering civilians in the streets and such.
and then she does the exact same thing in rapture
I loved this video. I always enjoyed her voice and found her philosophy interesting from a transhumanist perspective
The least shittiest antagonist.
Congratulations, Sofia. Lol
What about Daisy from infinite?
@@Cheesecake_666 I consider Daisy Fitzroy a hero. Comstock did her dirty...as well as the rest of the Vox Populi. She even died heroically
@@GanymedeBoy agreed shes a hero but in the game she is antagonist, (villain doesn't equal antagonist) she is set as your opponent at points and as an opposing force I found her really interesting and compelling.
@@GanymedeBoy I’d hardly call a pair of scissors in the back while holding someone hostage a “heroic” death
Nah she's pretty shitty lol. She's worse than Andrew Ryan and Fontaine in many ways.
🎉
Bioshock 2 was fun but I feel like it lacked the political strength of the first. Andrew Ryan is representative of a very real and fairly common political philosophy. He's a realistic person. Lamb just felt like a caricature. I've never heard of anyone whose philosophy honestly resembled hers.
Pol Pot?
I remember the first time playing this and being, of all emotions, angry. The first had an amazing story but clunky gameplay, this had amazing gameplay but absolute shit for story.
In the first Bioshock, you were unsure of who to trust...what words held weight and which were the drug addled ramblings of a broken-ass mind.
The second just overtly and in a decidedly ham-fisted manner will repeatedly bash your skull in with "blonde lady bad. Kill bad. Save girl." It was a massive disappointment.
The story of the second game is not as well developed as the first one, but it seems to me that many don't understand it, incredibly.
tbh, i found bioshock boring and repetitive. hack, hack, splicer, hack, hack, big daddy, hack, hack. not saying it wasn't creepy at times, but still.
I love Lamb and her collectivist worldviews.