So I asked AirShaper what value his program gave for aptera, he replied he is not allowed to share. So from this answer I think you can deduce that cd of 0.13 is probably a bit too good. If AirShaper had got lower value then Apteras estimate I think Aptera directors would use that value as their new cd, but since its not allowed to be made public, I suspect its not as good as 0.13. I think that is pretty reasonable conclusion. That will mean all their data is over estimating efficiency, which isn't really surprising considering their public falsehoods thus far.
@@aussieideasman8498 Yes this is not an open company at all, these guys have been very successful in raising money, and they are not going to give up that cash cow easily. You might say they will do whatever necessary to keep the funds coming in. If they were honest guys all this research and commenting would not be necessary.
I don't think the trike they tested is close enough resemblance to final vehicle. Mirrors, ground clearance, wheel pants, solar install, cooling air, rolling tires, etc. So while they cheat a little to get close to 0.13, it will still be worse.
I was looking at another video and it was covering the major changes to that aluminum frame that I have been bugging people about for over a year. Yet it was all about the bink. It makes me wonder what other wholesale changes they will make. We are getting to about halfway through month 8 and no word on the ETA of the first frame. I do not want to hear from the ambassador that this is under NDA because they show us the renderings and thus, it's all for everyone to see. I will assume that the NDA means, we can;t tell you when we do not know for certain major key items. We all got to hear about the bink progress and tooling, yet for the frame, just renderings. No pics of it at all.
@@aussieideasman8498 - Awesome! Chris M, he's the fountain of awesomeness. I now wonder, what is considered a big or small change. I guess going to a completely different propulsion system is a small change.
Dear Aptera, Who is supplying the airbags? You will be doing crash testing (it's a fact you will do three of the Pi's for that), so it'll be nice to let us know how those work out. Since Aptera is all about safety, we really need to make sure you do those crash tests before you release any of them to the public. Again, who makes those airbags. Regards, BS
I probably should leave this for next video, but will say it anyhow. I like others had assumed that if you invested in the crowdfunding, those shares would automatically be converted to stock exchange shares when they list on the stock exchange. I've done just a little research, not much, but it appears the crowdfunded shares dont automatically get converted to stock market shares, but remain as crowdfunded shares, which are very difficult to trade ( you have to trade with another individual yourself not via stock exchange traders). I'm thinking that 99.999% of investors were thinking along these lines, and will soon realise their shares are pretty much worthless since they cant be traded on stock exchange!!! I could be wrong on this, but it appears to be the case. Next video by Aoc is on the convertible note, but I dont think he even realises how worthless the crowd funder investments are going to be. Hope I'm wrong for the sake of all the investors, but seems its the case. the crowdfunded shares might get the same price as stock exchange shares but I dont think they are tradeable on stock exchange...........so basically are worthless......scammed again folks.
I did not know this, and I doubt many of the crowdfunders do either. This annoys me even more when considering that they made a pitch for retirement funds.
@@JoeBManco Because we can't do research; then he would stop the conversation before answering more questions and pop up somewhere else to ply his deception. He's been doing that for years.
I've been saying this for a year or more. Warning Donators all they get are fun coupons. The issue is the Donator stock is not backed with any equity. What ever USCG will do will require equity as will the IPO. Thus far, the owners (~4 of them?) hold all the equity. It's detailed in their quarterly tax statement.
What other EV has the arrival of its washer bottle generated so much fanfare? Chris Mac has to take one home with him and Hillbilly Bill features it in a new video. I have yet to watch it, and I bet he doesn't show a few bays of them, or even 16.
solar electronics engineer for lightyear solar car was Tom Vocke, he has a couple of patents on how to detect a foreign object ( bird crap etc) on a solar string. Seems he also engineered lots of the solar electronics for lightyear. Title of patent is Foreign object detection in inductive power transfer field , solar cells act as inductors when shaded hence the title ( I didn't know that till maybe a week ago when looking at how shading is dealt with by mppt) video with tom vocke here ruclips.net/video/jfoyXlH4eNM/видео.html Also I just noticed in this video that solar cells on cars get can get hotter than normal due to the reflections from buildings, now that is new info, also solar cells absorb very strongly in the infrared region ( not used to make electricity ) just makes them hotter. I wonder if that is also a reason why nearby buildings make them hotter? Anyhow seems there is alot of unknown complexities in these solar cells.
It is true there are "a lot of unknown complexities in these solar cells" to you. For example, why would higher temperatures resulting from hitting solar cells with more light (reflections from buildings) be "new info" to you? It really is quite a basic idea.
I thought the three IWM design was really awesome. Not sure I like their hybrid approach to this much. But what do I know. Standardized tests say I am mentally retarded anyway. Money I had saved to pay for this has been spent paying down real estate debt. If this becomes available I will decide if I still want it after all the compromises are complete and the specs it actually achieves and how to pay for it then.
@@aussieideasman8498hey you should be applauding Aptera. You were critical of the IWM. and belly pan cooling. They are not using either now. It is disappointing that the launch edition is a single motor system but I still have the choice to not buy it.
@@williamread8186 You are right about them dropping two items that were shoddy, and it can only improve the silly trike, but you are talking as though something will be made. My talk is still saying there won't be anything made that someone can buy and register.
@@aussieideasman8498 Just watched a short video on musks robotaxi, it might land up being a three wheeler, but not much details out as yet. That would be very interesting........look out aptera.
@@aussieideasman8498check out my last RUclips post. You will see where my Aptera money is being spent LOL. I do hope they can get to production though but not holding my breath.
13th of August today..........that PI 2 should be ready to reveal in mid-august as Fambro said two weeks ago, that means mid august would be 15th August....only 2 days to go, cant wait to see what they come up with ..........probably........nothing.
Lightyear solar car, at production was in company name of Atlas Technology Holding B.V if anyone is looking for patents for lightyear, theres a few there. Its netherland based. One of their patents does run through in detail how they control the solar cell strings, via mppt. There is a novelty to their device allowing for a patent, will leave that for anyone interested to read it.
Sono motors was more honest with their solar range estimates, they were using 1200watt max solar and were predicting about 10miles per day range from solar. That seems more realistic than apteras claims. That would also suggest aptera might be more in the range of under 10 miles per day. I'm sticking with about 10miles per day on a perfect summers day in full sun all day for aptera. This video has those range claims in it ruclips.net/video/yq9s09r-pjY/видео.html
@@dsds3968 thats a tiny car, more like a golf buggy, hope its not another crowdfunded scheme, seems its only pre-orders for that also. they are saying a validated 22km ( 13.5 mile range from solar) but dont know any details on the panel output etc etc.
@@dsds3968 If he estimates Squad claims, that is a matter for Squad and has nothing to do with Aptera, nor does it excuse Aptera for any discrepancies they have. You are introducing a red herring that serves no purpose.
In the video of lightyear solar car, they try coast down test at 100km/hr you can see it is quite slow to loose speed, does seem to validate their low coeff drag claims, it quite interesting effect to see speed is lost slowly at high speeds.
one last: lightyear at bankruptcy, also continued in supplying solar to other companies, all I've found thus far..........this is also looking very familiar. They raised 200million, and got pretty damn close to production.
Ok I just noticed the original patent is also a design patent, its the weak form of patent just on the general appearance of the vehicle, I think they only last 15 years, so its due to run out 8th march next year. So aptera motors in the clear on that one! Thought they had a big problem for a moment there.
another video of lightyear solar car dash showing some numbers on dash at the 2 min 54sec mark ruclips.net/video/T-CDVj4IcTM/видео.html In this case the car is not moving, so the numbers shown, say for driving, in wh/km will be some sort of average over a period of time ( not sure how long that period will be). total efficiency including solar etc is 165wh/km ( but over what period is that average I dont know), I suspect these numbers will be pretty accurate simply due to the team being made up of solar race engineers with plenty of experience.
Take the ex skin cooling area and replace it with a solar panel. That way you get miles per night. With the 40 during the day, I will just make a prediction that you get 15 at night.
You'd know the answer to this question if you knew what specific wavelengths and power levels are being emitted by the ground at night and what the "quantum efficiencies" of the solar panels were.
@@johnreeves7261 or just point a solar cell at the ground at night is much simpler, like aptera can just read off the value of solar watts from the display and post the results, if they were transparent
Just something copied from Hyperno's latest nonsense: @aussieideasman8498 0 seconds ago You do know that flashing up "supply by 2025" means a production model has to be sold to a customer before January first? This vehicle has to have been built entirely off the 13 stations they only have a video of, out of a parts inventory they only speak of lining up the agreements, and not one PI of the 10-16 promised PI's has been finished. No frame; no US Cap money and no workers, and there are 4 months and two weeks to do do it all in. You have under 10 days to provide that PI.2 you said would be driving mid-August. You won't even make that assurance. Reply @andremcamara3120 23 hours ago Great job on this update thank you. Aptera never went Bankrupt, however. Reply @aussieideasman8498 0 seconds ago Still covering up their first failure. Aptera avoided the courts declaring they were bankrupt (as far as I know; maybe one has?), but in every other way they were bankrupt, and the term can be used generally - we don't need to have a court declare it. They had more bills than they had money to the point they could not continue operating so closed down. There are some public articles that wrote Aptera went bankrupt. Sounds a lot like being bankrupt, so why bother trying to deceive people? I notice you didn't offer a term for what they did, but if you watch Jay Leno's second road test video he asked the two CEO's what happened, and they told him they left earlier because they had better things to do. They were saying their interest had waned so much that things like hydroponics and forklift batteries were more interesting to them. They didn't mention the attempt to remove the head honcho they got from Detroit, nor anything about being shafted themselves. No mention of Aptera's demise - just covering their own butts with lies. Happy to delve deeper.
Yes, it's better to just act like Aptera 1.0 never existed. I will act like Aptera 2.0 never existed either since what they had from 2019 to today, is nothing like what they are going to build. So, better for us to sweep it under the rug.
@@billsmith5960 I think over the years they have discovered that they can say anything, and there are little negative consequences, but the falsehoods from their point of view aid them to get new investors. They cant of course be honest about where they are up to, or investors will be less interested. To be Machiavellian is Steve Fambros underlying philosophy on life. Its quite simple really " fake it, until you make it" comes to mind. The problem is, in the longer term there might be legal consequences for being visibly dishonest in trying to get investors. Its a very high risk way to operate, but the monetary rewards they have already found out, outway the risk of legal issues at a later date. For anyone that believes in Aptera and that they will one day have a vehicle, you have to understand that this dishonest behaviour has no bounds, and they wont all of a sudden be honest once people have a vehicle. So things like getting parts or the prices of parts, will be an absolute nightmare. Its not really likely they will make it to production of any volume apart from prototypes, so it wont be an issue. I just found out that lightyear auctioned off their prototypes on a dutch car auction site, the last price for a completed vehicle was $26,000 ( euro), not sure exact price they sold for. But there will be an opportunity to buy a prototype when bankruptcy occurs to Aptera, thats the only way you will get one of these, and the price will likely be online auction like lightyear did.
Atieva I believe supplies the F1 e-cars, and Lucid motors battery pack, not sure of the connection between the two companies ( via CEO maybe?), anyhow Atieva designed the pack and has intellectual property on it, same as aptera has IP on their solar cell design method, since there are issues put the IP number here, best thing is to just search the this: Battery module with high thermal conductivity and assembling method and add the word Atieva , that will get you to the IP which is currently active. I really thought aptera had done something innovative with battery design, but seems its just a copy. I really dont like the way the negative of the cell cans is connected, either in lucid/atieva or aptera, but seems it works for lucid and they are the head of the game. The other thing they do which is pretty minor they use a thin gauge wire on top of cell for fuse ( cant remember if its pos or neg they use). So is aptera going to pay Atieva for using their patented battery assembly design? Seems they might have just opened themselves up for the first legal battle, unless Atieva just lets them use it. Or Aptera will have to pay who knows how much to use the design.
Well done aussie ideas man on keeping up all the work for so many years, its about time these guys either come clean or just close up shop. They are looking for the pot of gold at the stock exchange rainbow, getting into production is secondary, but important they have nice shiny vehicle to showcase......hence a prototyping company is all this well ever be. They will need to produce half a dozen vehicles to get listed on the stock exchange, after that they need 3 to 6 months to clean up on the stocks...........then its all over folks, thanks for coming. Then they will use any patents to do the whole thing all over again in a slightly different area, or just retire off the proceeds of investors and stocks. Thats my prediction.
The new savings calculator start with sun exposure from "little or no exposure" to "very high exposure", these are not actual numbers..........very clever..........just relatively vague terms to select from.........you cannot from this do any of your own calculations its designed to be vague. If you select the lowest sun exposure, I got 22 miles a day from the sun and I will only have to charge 12 times a year.........this is absolute rubbish.....deceptive rubbish at that. They are spending money to be more deceptive on actual range calculations, they could spend their investors money in doing some actual measurements. Such as: put the vehicle in the sun and record on video the watts the solar produces, go for a drive and record the wh/miles. Those values are in the display on the dash board, but wont be for long........they will disappear as it allows verification of the actual data. Its time for new forms of deception rather than just being honest........crazy thinking on part of the directors. They will waste time now on thinking up ways to display the data in a qualitative way ( a vague way) to hide the actual numbers.......a clever way to be stupid.
Just something to save confusion: old aptera : aptera motors incorporated ( or aptera motors inc.) new aptera: aptera motors corporation ( or aptera motors corp.) Two very different entities old aptera: split into two entities: aptera motors inc, and zaptera motors inc. ( best as I understand it) Zaptera motors inc.........owned by jonway motors china............I think jonway motors china, was formerly Zhejain Jonway motors thats as I understant it at the mo
I mentioned previously there were hub motors than can have two speeds, there is two ways ( maybe more) to do it. Electronically ( wye/delta winding) via a switch, and also you can do it via planetary gear sets. Here is a small ebike hub motor that has 2 speed via gears, and its dead clever how they do it ( by reversing the internal motor direction), now this is a work of art ruclips.net/video/qzw8MKvErtw/видео.html I would imagine there are probably car size hub motors by now that have planetary gear sets in them, it would be pretty much near impossible to know everything that is out there, china manufacturing is so huge, no way to keep up with what is actually out there. Any how just for the viewers entertainment, it might be that hub motors have a long way to go until they are useful in cars, I'm still might impressed by lucid motors internal differential inside the drive motor......genius.
60 days and complete funding. They also get over 100 emails per day when it comes to investment. First 50 Apteras will be delivered by the end of march 2025. Looks like it's a done deal.
@@aussieideasman8498 - The Pi2 has been ready for a while. If you watch the videos, it's on a frame and 4 casters are on it. So, that's good enough for me and just shows they are making progress. Hopefully two of the casters are non swivel (especially, need to be on the rear). That way it'll be like a grocery cart. I know the Aptera is to be a three wheeler but that will be the next design iteration and thus an improvement on efficiency. Also, I bet they have an electric pallet jack. That can provide the propulsion around the parking lot. Awesome!
@@billsmith5960 That's the PI.1. There's the left-over display junk from the French show that nobody wanted, and that can't be used, so nobody has seen a PI.2; only Steve F. has said they are well into building it, but he could be lying. Nobody can get near seeing it.
Honestly, I am not concerned about front- or all-wheel-drive. I live in EU, meaning this small area, where 450,000,000 potential customers are, which will not get a chance to get an Aptera. Reason: the design is not road-legal in EU. It's simply way too wide among other problems like side or rear impact protection.
Even if you could get it in the EU, it would have so many limited uses. You can forget about any decent sized city. Then a small one. Better park it on the edge of town and walk home. I go to the EU and when I'm there, I think about what the Aptera would be like there. Just on my last trip where I was in Switzerland, I thought about how Aptera went there to look for investors. Let's see, a country that has an excellent public transportation system and then when you get to many areas, it's a car free zone. Great idea to try to sell them on the idea. Then I went and did the the Camino de Santiago. While walking that 800km in France and Spain, I had time to think about what would an Aptera be like here. In my mind, very limited use. Why buy something where you have a really hard time to park it or even just drive down many streets? Efficiency is one thing but people do want practicality. The Aptera is built just for the US. Plain and simple. We have big trucks, big highways, big houses and big driveways.
@@billsmith5960 Alternatively, EU market will be taken over by Chinese brands. It already started. German OEMs have no idea about efficient BEVs. We see currently a revival of fossile fuels in personal transportation and also heating. Nobody is interested in saving the climate and the human beings. Frustrating.
@@kapt.jayaubre942 - Aptera has no interest in saving the planet either. If they did, they would have been on the market a few years ago and designed it to for use in other countries other than the US. Yet they did not. So, don't pile on the hopes and dreams when it comes to Aptera. There are many other options. If you want to blame anyone, then blame Norway. They literally are feeding the petro industry for the EU. All while using those profits to fund EV for their country. Go there and you'll see.
@@billsmith5960 I suspect aptera started out being a little altruisic ( is that the word?), but after google gave over 20million? via ideaslab, it became a very different game, very quickly, and the game then became finance focused.....i.e. give me the money
@@namenotshown9277 - There's a thing called greenwashing. It's to make things look like they are going to save the planet and thus, you need to give them money. There is another version of it where existing companies just try to make them look "green" by making some sort of claim. Aptera needs money and the green part of it worked for a few years but that well runs dry if you can't make a product. We have an ambassador that is still trying to greenwash Aptera because of the choice of refrigerant that it will use. Too bad he has been out of the industry for a while because nobody uses R134a and haven't for about 5 years. Yet Aptera is somehow "green" because they are not using it. On a side note, I did call out the ambassador on his saving of the planet when it came to refrigeration. It had to do with the switch from R12 to R134a. He didn't know that the reason why R134a is not used today, is because it's a greenhouse gas and will never go away. We traded off one problem for another. Thus, not saving the planet at all. R134a is a blowing agent for foam too. Guess what, not used any more.
thanks aussie ideas man for letting me waffle along on your chanel, just a note about lightyear solar car. In there marketing videos, they do also play up the role of solar to get investors/customers, they are not immune to giving best case scenarios for range etc. But the difference to aptera is they actually tested and gave the results, so best case is actually achievable, compared to aptera who has unachieavable claims. Lightyear can be used as a benchmark for what is possible in reality. They have about 1100watts according to maxeon lab data, and were getting something like 50% of the predicted solar in real world. Aptera will be lower than that ( lightyear more advanced in the tech setup) so its going to be probably something like 1/3 of what they are claiming as 'real'.
"Aptera (solar)...unachieavable claims" and "...and (Lightyear) were getting something like 50% of the predicted solar in real world." and "...so its going to be probably something like 1/3 of what they (Aptera) are claiming as 'real'." ha ha. Once again showing your inability to interpret/model/predict solar panel performance.
This is not particularly relevant but seems the first ever mppt tracker was patented by an australian , Stuart Watkinson of AERL in 1987 in oz, 1991 in usa. His son has just restarted the company doing battery installations etc.......rather interesting. They supplied alot of the early solar race cars mppt devices....small world it is indeed.
It's not that small when you try walking across the Simpson Desert. Fun facts are always welcome; no need to stay on topic. Scatterbrains won't even notice if you don't mention it, lol.
AERL's patented "MPPT", as it turns out, was not a true MPPT in the sense that it didn't "track" the maximum power point. It periodically and temporarily disconnected the solar cell circuit from the load and measured the open circuit voltage (Voc) of the solar cell circuit then ASSUMED the maximum power point was at some percentage (between 75 and 80%) of that measured Voc. That technique worked well for flat and un-shaded panels but had trouble with curved ones and/or partially shaded ones. As true MPPTs came into existence, the AERL one's fell out of favor for, at least, solar racing vehicles.
@@johnreeves7261 Very interesting, I haven't read the patents, everything starts from somewhere I guess, first attempts will always be improved upon. thanks for that info
just going on abit about lightyear solar car ( its only two years ago they were puting out all these videos of the test drives etc), anyhow this video it shows the solar cells grahical disply, it shows the cells that are producing in yellow colour, the strings not producing are blank.......rather interesting concept...a long long way ahead of aptera. ruclips.net/video/xxUM16tskXk/видео.html at the 2min 25 sec mark you can see the display
The Lightyear is all about efficiency. They even went with hub motors because of efficiency. Did I tell you that it's about efficiency. I just want to make sure you know that as it's key to why they will be successful. People want efficiency and then getting power from the sun just improves that efficiency. Only thing missing from the Lightyear videos is the word "awesome". When they start selling in the US, they will need to start using that. As for the display, yes, another thing they were not close to having done. It's like with Elio Motors where they never had a functioning instrument cluster except for the orange one that literally used a 1995 Geo Metro as the donor car.
I hope Aptera will sue them and get a big settlement. As we all know, Aptera has patents and I'm going to assume patents for anything solar on a car. If they have skin cooling on it, that will be a record settlement and can get Aptera to production sooner.
I was just watching a video about lucid motors and saudi sovereign wealth fund, the saudis have put 6.4 billion into lucid since 2018. They just got 1.5 billion to keep them going another year or so. If this is what it takes to build electric cars, aptera doesn't have a chance. Unless the saudis invest in them too, it is possible there is alot of money to be at IPO, regardless of what happens to production.
@@aussieideasman8498 When you try to understand Aptera, why would they publicly announce the UAE limited gold edition plan to the general public before there were any buyers? Bragging after the first couple buyers makes sense. Exposing the possible failure before they have any feedback is so incompetent. That sort of thing is why I don't think they are as corrupt as you suggest. They are just completely incompetent and in over their head pursuing their dream.
@@artsmith103 Thats quite possible scenario, I assume the gold edition was just to get some UAE orders? I'm not sure if they are incompetent, they are very intelligent guys, and have actually made quite alot of progress, but at a great cost to investors. Perhaps its not corruption but a desire to continue the dream, I really dont know their true motivations. Certainly money is large motivator, a philantropic view of saving the world with solar cells gets the investors in, but they haven't done enough testing to know what the actual potential is.........they'll just peddle what sounds good for now. It has worked for them so far, and changing the speel is not good for business.......how will they get around showing what the actual range is and the actual solar input is .......that will be interesting to see how they handle that..........thus far being honest is not their method of choice, I suspect they will need a smoke screen method, hide the real world results as long as possible. Delays are actually quite useful for their narrative. The blatant lies to get investors is what I find disturbing, its really not necessary in my view, it might be aptera will do fine or even better if they decide to go down the " lets be honest' route.
Regarding original patent owned by jonway motors, its only a design patent, sometimes called a design registration as its not a proper patent. It only covers the form of the object..i.e. how it appears, the shape. The original design patent on the shape runs out in march 2025 anyhow. Aptera has their own design patent on their shape, but it only covers that exact shape, you can make some minor change and not infringe the design, its very weak form of patent.
Notice the glare on the windscreen from the solar cells at the 3min 21 sec mark in this video, it wont pass road regulations as it interferes with visibility quite badly. ruclips.net/video/zjsf1ApVFDo/видео.html
I did make a comment somewhere that a hub motor in rear would be good for high efficiency at highway speeds, and use front for hills/low speed, seems aptera owners club has made a video of that.......seems he does read our comments. anyhow I made a comment on his( aoc) site that a hub motor can be used in delta or wye winding type, and can be switched between them for high speed or low speed use. Anyhow just posting it here as a record for when he makes a video about that comment too. Seems he likes to take other ideas and pass them off as his own.
I have an idea, add wind power too. Take a fan, mount it on the roof and then put a sail in front of it. I watched a documentary on it and most of the parts came from Acme Corp.
@@billsmith5960 Okay hear me out. Put a wind generator on an Aptera so it can charge the battery while driving down the road, but also on a windy day it can still charge while parked and at the same time wind up large rubber bands that can be used to launch the machine from a stop. Talk about efficient, wouldn't even need a charge port.
@@Aspkkr there are stagnation areas at front of cars suitable for inlets for airflow ( wouldn't effect flow around vehicle much), lets just say some speed record holder vehicle used that, not going to give to much info as aptera will use it. Well they wont actually use anyones ideas in the long term, as production is not the goal of this scheme they are running. Anyhow I'm predicting at some point aoc use my information on delta/wye switching method to get a 2 speed hub motor without rewinding it, and pass it off as his own research. He wont acknowledge the source, I haven't looked but I doubt that info is on the net, could be wrong of course. Its certainly not common knowledge.
The more you go over this the more you see, he says " we wanted to simplify the number of moving parts for launch" well there are more moving parts in an e-axle than a hub motor, in fact alot less. So that statement is just incorrect........worrying that a director would get such a thing wrong. " for maximum efficiency....we moved to inboard motors" ok , that much is true, seems he is revealing what I've been saying for some weeks, hub motors are rubbish efficiency at low rpm. Just took them a few years to work out they had a problem.
This is what is going on. Aptera has found out that the motor manufacturer want money up front and a guarantee that Aptera will start production at a certain date. In the real world, Elaphe needed some promise (with money) so they can start buying the machines that make the parts that go in the motors and then the motor assembly machines. Since Aptera is running out of money, they balked at it. Then an investor looking at the company (who uses consultants) asked the simple question, "Can we just use an off the shelf component and use the money we save for something else and speed up this whole project?" The answer was, "Yes we can." Thus a new driveline. I will bet you this same thing happened to the skin cooling project. I would not be surprised if this happens with the battery. Haven't heard much about CTNS for a while. Seems that when they go silent on something, it means a change is in store. Also, Steve is just pandering to his fans. It's so obvious but they eat it up because it makes them feel special.
Anybody know what a convertible note is? I heard it has something to do with investing in a three wheeled solar trickle charger that converts your money into vapor. I could be off on that though.
@@JoeBManco I did post a similar comment but it didn't take. I really don't know why but seems like about 30% of the time I can leave a comment and then check back later and it's not there.
Heres a video updating the battery pack two years ago ruclips.net/video/0Klxngp4H8U/видео.html There is a bunch of engineers they have talking, the funny thing is, with all these people ( now all gone) they still haven't even finished one battery pack!! This is absolutely mind blowing ineptitude, 2 years half a dozen or more young engineers........and nothing!! At this very moment they are puting together the first battery pack with the honours given to steve taken from flux power.......I really cant get my head around the waste of time and resources of these people.
I really wished that I would have applied for a job at Aptera when the company was founded in 2019. I would have been able to get paid, do nothing and travel the world.
They are so proud of looking forward to the work that should have been done in ‘21. They had more than enough people, just the wrong ones working on the wrong things.
With lightyear the average driving efficiency is 192 wh/km, approx 200wh/km thats without accounting for solar charging. Converting that to 309wh/mile ( 192wh/km), so about 300wh/mile. I think aptera is claiming 100wh/mile, it will probably be closer to what the more advanced lightyear was getting once you get in the real world and away from made up ( sorry theoretical ) numbers.
this video at 5min 20sec shows a graph comparing sono motors, lightyear and apteras fund raising efforts ( it leaves out apteras first attempt) ruclips.net/video/EE2y5v8gE_g/видео.html so its two down and one to go.
I'm very dissapointed bruce nelson wouldn't engage in discussion about solar cell output figures being exaggerated, he cant of course engage in that as it goes against his narrative. Which leads to an interesting observation, why wont people like bruce be rational about this, well he has invested his money and time into it, and anything that challenges the 'wisdom' of him being an ambassador he just has to ignore it unfortunately. So it seems here will be alot of people with that thinking, they are invested and have to be blind to reality of the directors deceptions on aspects of the vehicle like solar watts, range and efficiency. The main selling points of this vehicle have no basis in reality, and if your supporting a company with false claims at is base, then you have to justify somehow to yourself that what you are doing is correct way to go. Anything that goes against has to be ignored, to justify his own position. This is how scams work, fool the gullible. He seems like a very nice man on his videos, but alas he will have to keep up his dance for the aptera directors until comes the time of bankruptcy, then he will take his nice little nest egg and disappear the same way as the directors will disappear from all media. thats might prediction, its a bit like talking to a religious zealot, doesn't matter what you say there is no chance they will even entertain what you are saying......rant over.
I watched the Elio Owners forums for years. The mods were "insiders" and had a personal line to Paul. Yet they could never tell anyone anything except for cryptic ones of how everything is going fine and new information is on the horizon. If you were questioning them on their source of info, they just banned those you. Same for the FB groups where just a few knew it all but never could tell you anything buy just for hope and dreams. In addition to that, questioning specs and other items, it just let to being banned. With this "Ambassador program" it seems to be like the "Insider program" with Elio. It's that when you find a few old white guys that are living their swan song, they feel special because they know more than anyone else. It's quite sad to see crowdfunders do this as they know the market and use them as free advertising and want them to do their best to choke out anyone that questions the company. Bruce has his own playground on Reddit and I find many just never post again and that tells me he's just banning them (plus I have seen some threats of banning people too). If they are softball questions, then they can stay. It's just like Elio Motors 2.0.
heres a video from sono-motors ( now defunct) and they have no problem showing their solar output data ( see 43sec mark) on the cars screen , aptera wont even show there display data ruclips.net/video/yYb3sw795sA/видео.html
in traffic, below say 35km/hr or so, there is not much wind resistance, so the aptera wont be any better than other evs, 3 wheels some effect but more weight on three wheels for rolling resistance, I think the difference will be minimal. I see fambro saying the aptera is very safe in cross winds, maybe, but I suspect they have never driven past a large truck going in the opposite direction at 60mph or so. LIke the solar, the reality might be very different to the predictions. It needs to be tested before he makes assursions on how safe is an untested vehicle.
@@aussieideasman8498 thats right, and now they are saying its not only the 4 pi builds, its another 50 fully paid for vehicles by first quarter next year........I can see their noses grow as they speak.
@@namenotshown9277 - Dear Aptera, I have a better idea, forget the Pi builds all together and just go right into production. With the design perfected and the simulations you have done, it's ready to go. Build the first 50 gold series for the UAE and send them over. When they see what you can do for such little money, they will start funding you to build all of those satellite plants and thus, start selling worldwide. Nothing could ever go wrong with this plan. Regards, BS
Talking about laughing along, if you go to the 35min 18 sec mark of the uscg webinar video on aptera owners club site, ruclips.net/video/0GgbnuABiZ4/видео.html there is a quite bizzare section where the girl hosting says "this round gets us to put vehicles in your hand" followed by the most bizzare laugh. It is that she cant really believe she is saying this crap out loud? Its very strange moment, sorry aussie ideas man, couldn't wait till you did a video on it......please note that time stamp moment very wierd.
This next week I have limited time available to watch anything, and I don't see myself able to make a video. When I saw an hour long AOC video, I didn't bother opening it. I'll see if I can just jump to 35 mins and watch her.
@@aussieideasman8498 its no problem, youve done a huge job over the last couple of years, I think you have a really good record of what aptera has been up to. And nothing is going to change in a hurry, its like a soap opera, you come back in two years later and its all the same thing.
I really like Frank. He looks like he's not buying it at all. Just sits there staring into his laptop. Plus the questions they get are obviously from superfans and not real investors. In general, the whole thing was really strange. I think it was done so it could be put out on the internet just in hopes some big investor sees it. I thought that USCG was to handle all of this and go to investors as opposed to yet another webinar covering the same exact points yet again. You do have to actually go in front of people for the amount of coin they are asking for. I'm just amazed that they seem to be going down the same path yet again. I wonder if they did this because they are starting to see that it's not as easy as they thought.
@@billsmith5960 It appears to me that the directors will outsource everything pretty much, not getting their hands dirty so to speak and allow others to do the hard yards. They are simply the mouth pieces and decision makers, setting themselves up for financial gain mainly. They are obviously highly intelligent guys, they have honed their speaking skills and rhetoric to a high degree.They have rattled off the same blurb so many times, and can in a small space of time produce alot of information, that sometimes you have to go over and see what they were actually saying in detail. They are extremely skillful in using language to skirt around the actual details. They have a very good knowledge of the technology, but these days its mainstream all these technologies are well known, so it should be getting harder to divert peoples attention from the details. To go on a webcast and say they have fully paid for another 50 vehicles that they dont have alot of the design finished ( just as one example the wiring loom, only a few weeks ago they were still measuring with ruler how long each wire had to be). Its not possible they have paid for things that haven't been finished yet. I think they have gotten away with this for so long they are not afraid to make up things in order to get more investors. I'm sure there will be laws covering this sort of dishonesty in attracting investors, but it might take a long time for the law to catch up, at some stage I suspect their overt dishonesty on long lived media might catch up and bight them on the arse.
Ha! I've been challenging Bruce Baby that it was a 10kWh battery. He denied or blamed an NDA that it was a closed topic. And i said that was no excuse for not demoing miles/kWh. They could weight the vehicle to match full size battery and drive around for 10 miles or so. And if they don't have regenerative braking, they could say they hope to increase miles/kWh by 30% when it's installed. Absolutely no excuse for not updating their critical performance data quarterly. So fanboys lectured me with their excuses for years.
Bruce the volunteer was all over the comments today. You'd better believe I will be asking more frequently about proof that the current prototypes can go 100 miles on a complete charge. Also, since Steve F has linked the entire history of Aptera together, that means 18 years without a production vehicle.
@@JoeBManco - Lets not forget that engineer that worked for Aptera, left and then came back. Only to talk about Aptera 1.0 too. So now we have at least three people that worked for Aptera 1.0 with a vehicle which looks quite the same. Aptera 2.0 now even has exposed axles just like Aptera 1.0. Only thing missing is a diesel motor hybrid setup. This would be like if you and I started Joe and Bills Pizza Parlor in Carlsbad back in 2006. We made Chicago style pizza. When that went out of business in 2011, we decided to start it back up again in 2019 with the same chef, same name and do NYC style pizza all along with the same area of the country. We are nothing like or even related to the old venture we had as we make a different style pizza today. I forgot, we still haven't sold a pizza to an actual consumer. Trust us, anyone reading this, it's the best and most efficient pizza out there.
@@JoeBManco I'm sure without regenerative braking, 100 miles on 10 kWh battery is impossible. In fact it would lead to 13 miles/kWh when it is installed. My PHEV weighs about 3,800 lbs and with older 7.6 kWh battery peaks around 60 mph in EV mode. That was the basis for my 10 kWh estimate. So lighter Aptera with 10 kWh should have done an easy 80 mph. Steve was full of sh!t suggesting excessive C rate.
Lucid motors has patent on its battery design, Atieva inc has the patent and aptera is exact copy of atieva battery..........oh well more trouble ahead........have tried to post patent number but posts keep getting not posted
That would be trouble. You need to get around YT foibles, like here's a pa no. , then here's a te No. and finally here's an nt No. , then people just combine the numbers. There are ways if you get inventive.
This video chris anthony says "confident we can start deliveries in the later part of 2022" Just for the record ruclips.net/video/vlNTyI_Fq7U/видео.html
At least Aptera is not like this company at all by claiming when production will begin. According to the date and the claim that they would be doing it in 18 months, It's just over 10 years when that was to happen. ruclips.net/video/0WmvbwXDX4w/видео.html
It is so cool, amazing and exciting that the little tyke has activities with Aptera. Hopefully his chores include taking Tom the CFO for daily walks in the park.
@@JoeBManco - Don't worry, Jerry might be training him too. Things like making sure the Chevy is full of fuel. When the apterdash service starts, someone needs to follow it around to make sure the deliveries are done on time.
If its ok with aussie ideas man, I might post here any of my posts that are deleted from other aptera related sites. Means I will have to save copies of my posts, but is interesting to see what types of post dont match up with their view of reality or they dont want to discuss. I did one very lengthy time consuming post to Bruce Nelson, it was outlining why the solar watts of aptera is impossible to ever achieve, it was hard to argue against it, so he just didn't post it. After that I keep a copy of any of my posts I think will be deleted to any of the aptera fanboys. Seems when confronted with reality as with other religious zealouts, they have no way to comprehend what is being said so they either ignore it ( delete the post) or become abusive, it is somewhat comical in a way. Regarding uscg webinar: You will notice that there is no discussion anywhere on fanboy sites on Fambro saying Aptera has paid for 50 cars to be built by mid next year.....its so obiously dishonest that they wont even bring it up or discuss it. How can you pay for 50 vehicles that have not been completed in the design stage? We saw there a no electrical looms done yet, connectors still being sources, and the list is long of what has not been done, electrical components are just stickers...........how can they pay for things that are not done yet? Any investors should take note of this statement and use it against Fambro in the bankurptcy or any other legal proceedings that might arise in future. Getting investment by deception is likely to be legal consequences at some stage. They have already done pretty well financially out of all this, and if IPO occurs will do very well indeed, they might land up loosing alot of in legal fees at some stage.
Go for it. Anyone is welcome to put here what has been blocked from other sites; just reference where and when so people can verify it's not there. YT can police vulgarities and disrespect, et al. I am up for freedom to say anything about the silly trike.
@@aussieideasman8498 Bruce loves to say Aptera never failed all the promised deliveries because when Aptera said they would do something and didn't, like 2024 1st quarter or 1st half crash testing, they didn't "promise" it.
@@artsmith103 - Everything is a target date. So it's just fine. Then Aptera is just making a better product and that's what we all really want. It's perfection. It's like the marathon projects I watched other engineers do. Never get to the end result, just keep working on making it better. All while the timeline keeps going on and on and on. Even Steve knows this as there will have to be a freeze. At that point they need to move onto the next phase. Right now they are just messing around. Lock the thing down and go with it. On the other hand, it could be like Arcimoto where they couldn't make a final decision until they did the IPO and then just ran with what they got. We see how well that worked out.
I'm excited that they are excited to be working with each other on this exciting project. This new exciting inboard motor along with the exciting solar cells is just very exciting. It was also exciting to hear in the tone of their voice of the excitement that is in the air. I think that Aptera needs a slogan: Aptera, We Build Excitement!
@@JoeBManco - Just wait until they do the team building exercise where they build excitement due to the In-N-Out Combo #3 that everyone will be getting in two weeks when the Pi is out doing durability testing in Carlsbad.
No....that's not what he said.... but instead of making constant hurt-butt comments....LET GO! If you lost money...it's a loss.... get over yourself. "It's not for you!" Cancel your order, cut your losses. The hyperbolic comments are really just showing off your hurt feelings, and not adding anything to this....
Try speaking English. Clearly reference what you're talking about. There's some pretty good experience here that's been offering a lot of help to better understand Aptera. Typical theme here is more accurate Aptera reporting especially with regards to finance and Mother Nature.
@@artsmith103 You are right about user-In... needing to reference what he was talking about; I had no idea and couldn't be bothered going over my own video to check. The reason being is that when someone does nothing more than disagree, it lacks substance, which I regard as foolish gossip. If anybody sides with such nonsense, they deserve to suffer Mother Nature's consequences. Those who know what he said (whoever he is and whatever he said) will do better for the knowledge. I am not needed.
Here's what I commented on the latest Electric Vouch rubbish (I'm up late watching the Olympics): @aussieideasman8498 0 seconds ago Having looked at your history of videos, I would suggest you are a plant from inside Aptera; you began 11 months ago and it appears like you have access to someone's Caddy and a Tesla, so you add a few of these videos to look like you are independent. You also threw in a few political videos to throw the scent off your being from Aptera Motors. The way you construct the palavering, I would say Jason Hill is probably writing your scripts. Reply @aussieideasman8498 4 minutes ago Give up the bull - it's riddled with mistakes. Reply
Thought I would just go over some of apteras old videos, first one I come across is this one: ruclips.net/video/XOOY42xnSHU/видео.html Called "driven by the sun/ never charge technology" In this video they say 43 miles per day from sun alone ( just over the 40 mile average drive per day in usa...how convenient). They are clearly selling the vehicle as something that doesn't require charging.....absolutely false and no real data ever shown to back this up. Also the 100wh/mile being spruked, surely with what we know now this is false advertising? They are also saying 1000mile range........they have never had a pack larger than 10kwhr installed........surely this is false advertising. They have raised money on false claims, and now the truth is slowly revealing itself. Another one ruclips.net/video/jbLQ6Z0u_qo/видео.html Seems they used to go down the line of never charge technology as an advertising slant. Fambro also says in this one " 1,000 miles range was an insane claim" well yes Steve it is indeed, its never been demonstrated and likely never will. It will remain an insane claim.
What you don't realize is all we need are just simulations today. No need to do real world testing. Startups love simulations and rely on them heavily for marketing. For example the Elio gives 84 mpg. How did they know? It was a simulation McLaren Engineering did for them back in 2010. Thus, they ran with those numbers and that was where all of the hype began. Here we are today and still doing simulations, yet products get released and they are not perfect or live up to the numbers. I will admit, it's getting better, but when you have a startup and a limited amount of resources (aka, ability to pay for top talent) then you just rely on those young folk who are dreamers. I don't have a problem with them but someone has to be the voice of reason. That voice of reason is expensive. Experience costs money.
@@billsmith5960 thats true, honesty is the best policy, there is way too much smoke and mirrors with this company. There last video they are saying verification of their claims is going to be done, but as i'm going through older videos from some years ago, they are also saying the same thing. I dont think we can expect any honest or open reporting of range data, especially when it comes to solar, there numbers just wont be close to the claims. They are caught in their own lies. This is not transparency at all.
They're so lost in their incompetence, I don't think there's anyway out for them. The trike price is now unmanageable and they could be a year or more from finished testing. Their chance was to sell an upgraded Arcimoto for $30K at what ever performance level could be squeezed into that price. I've been estimating ~8 miles/kWh and 17 solar miles/day. If someone drives 34 miles/day, 50% solar doubles the battery range. They could have advertised a 250 mile, 32 kWh battery having 500 mile range (industry high) in southern half of the country. Promote all the achievement based on milder weather and let northern residents do what they want. The efficiency marketing should include smaller motors with Honda Civic performance, say 100 kW single engine FWD with 85 mph govenor. External solar option would appeal to that market.
@@artsmith103 - Let's add into that. How about the warranty and service. How is that going to be handled. Right now, no warranty and for some reason people think that "right to repair" means it's super easy. Little do they know, the rest of the details on this are glossed over. For example, let's say the motor goes into limp mode. How is that going to be diagnosed? Do you tow it to any shop and tell them, "just scan the QR code and it'll tell you how to fix it, plus, Aptera (the company you've never heard of) will send you the parts and reimburse you for the work because it's under warranty (even though we have no idea what that is). Aptera has been super opaque on how they will handle this? How can you make a shop manual on a vehicle you have never even got to the pre production phase? If people think these will not have problems, then they are living in fantasyland. For these coming out in H1 2025, they better be prepared for warranty issues and how to deal with it. Last thing they need is someone on the other side of the US with a bricked Aptera that all of a sudden makes a video showing their displeasure.
@apterachallenge @JoeBManco You two have been debating the motives of Aptera on 'So, Now Are You Ready To Reserve Your Aptera? | New Vitesco EMR3 drivetrain.' Joe, apterachallenge is as big a cretin as Steve from AOC and many others. If you sort by NEWEST FIRST, you will see this: (all of 30 comments @JoeBManco 9 hours ago I will ask you the same question I have asked the other Aptera fan channels. What is Aptera's warranty? Reply Aptera Challenge · 1 reply @JoeBManco 1 day ago Am I ready to reserve an Aptera? No. Why should I? The company just did a bait and switch with the motors, and raised the price of the FWD they are offering. The price for the FWD with 250 claimed miles of range was $26K. Now the FWD is $31K according to the website with a claimed range of 400 miles. They lied about the motor when Sandy Munro knew in August 2023 that Elaphe motors would not be used in the launch edition. When this company goes IPO, it will be a pump and dump stock and the company will fail. Reply Aptera Challenge · 21 replies @user-jp2em5hy5f 2 days ago Vitesco EMR4 vs EMR3: - Weighs 25 percent less at the same power level. 66 vs 77 kg. - 5.6% efficiency advantage in the WLTP. - Smaller. So the big question (to ask) is WHY the EMR3!? Has Hyundai bought up all the EMR4s for the next 5 years or something? Reply Aptera Challenge · 2 replies @simonthedog7980 2 days ago Just to fully understand your motive for putting out this video. Are you compensated by Aptera in any way for each deposit Aptera reiceves for a vehicle? Reply Aptera Challenge · 1 reply @n.brucenelson5920 3 days ago I started dialing about 10 minutes before reservations were open, and got in for #10042 - a Paradigm Edition. I understand the impact of Global Warming, and am interested not just for personal reasons, and the well being of my own pocket book, but also the small contribution it can make to slowing our rush into global warming. 4 Reply That doesn't have my comment. When I sort I see this: (just the first few needed) @aussieideasman8498 3 days ago You are selling the snake oil. You should have wised up by now, but greed has got the better of you. The sole reason you recommend the preorder is because you think there is something in it for you, and nothing about the customer. The silly trike is not near production - they lie, and have lied consistently for many years now. It's nothing like an early Tesla investment and everything like an Elio investment - destined to fail. Reply @n.brucenelson5920 3 days ago I started dialing about 10 minutes before reservations were open, and got in for #10042 - a Paradigm Edition. I understand the impact of Global Warming, and am interested not just for personal reasons, and the well being of my own pocket book, but also the small contribution it can make to slowing our rush into global warming. 4 Reply @simonthedog7980 2 days ago Just to fully understand your motive for putting out this video. Are you compensated by Aptera in any way for each deposit Aptera reiceves for a vehicle? Back to my comment: The reason they are so different is because this Aussie low-life blocks people. He can't be fair, nor can he be trusted. His greed is way stronger than his ethics, and his arguments smack of abject st#p1d1ty. He is so weak that he can't go head-to-head with me - just like everyone at Aptera and their 800 ambassadors.
I took down my comments on that channel. Some people are not worth the effort to talk to. All he wanted to do was compare Aptera to Tesla, which is an old debate fallacy tactic. He even wanted to compare Elon Musk to Chris A and Steve F. When I pointed out that why use Tesla, when there was actual trike companies that tried and failed. His response, was because Aptera is not like those companies. No kidding, Aptera is certainly nothing like Tesla either! I like to engage people in legitimate conversation when we don't agree. Not to try to beat them down, but to try and understand how their faith and conclusions are made. This person even wanted to argue about if Sandy Munro really said what he said in August 2023 about the hub motors. It is on video for all to see. This reminds me of Bruce and his comments on this video denying that Chris M lied after Sandy Munro said in that video that the hub motors would not be in the launch edition vehicles. There are a few regular commenters on the AOC channel that I do enjoy talking to even though we clearly disagree about Aptera. For the ones that want to be awful, then I can give them that as well. Let's say Aptera does build some customer vehicles. What are the legitimate chances of them ever being sold in Australia? I live in the middle of the USA and actually inquired of Arcimoto how long it would be for them to set up a customer hub for where I live. I never got a response after several emails. It wasn't but a few months later that it became obvious the company was failing. I give Aptera about the same chances of success. They might have a few customers along the West Coast, but they're going to find out just how hard it is to maintain an assembly line. Once the production loan dries up; they will be done.
I compared it to my Elio. Driving 100 miles per day and little exposure. I will save $5300 in 5 years. So, I decided to outfit my Aptera because I'm going to be saving so much money. Mine came out to $51,000. I know I'll be getting it soon and can't wait to start saving money. It's cool to be able to compare two imaginary cars.
I think we're all giggling with excitement, because the bait and switched launch edition is so cool. Now that Steve F has said what size of battery is in each of the old prototypes, how about proving they propel the vehicle for 100 miles. Steve said it is a 10KWh battery and the vehicle gets 10 miles per KWh, then show us. I will be impressed if it made it 60 miles on a charge based on Chris M's behavior when fetching food in the livestream.
Even my dog was excited. So excited she even peed on the floor. It just shows the excitement is getting contagious. I'm excited where they have never tested any of their claims and the Pi will be the first time (except for the hub motors, AWD and skin cooling). The excitement is building when that Pi is moving under it's own power and Steve drives it 400 miles until it runs out of power. That tells me that it'll take 50 hamburgers from In-N-Out for it to run out of power. Better hope Jerry has an extended range second tank on that Chevy. Plus Jerry better make sure they have enough toilet paper in the restroom and the trash cans are emptied because of all of the wrappers, cups of soda. That tells me this test will cost about $450 for the hamburger combos and $175 in diesel. $20 in toilet paper then various other costs of maybe $100. $745 for full distance testing and feeding the employees shows how this is an efficient method of testing. Aptera: We Build Excitement ! (and cholesterol levels on our employees)
@@aussieideasman8498 - That might be covered under various costs. If not, we can add $50. I was also thinking that the employees can just pay for their hamburger combo out of their own pocket and use this testing like free doordash. Right there, it would be a $450 savings in testing costs. Now, the only major problem is this. How to schedule out the burger combo deliveries. Some will have to eat them for breakfast, others for lunch, others for dinner and others for a late night snack. With that, they will need to at least have three of those combos for Jerry. He does need to eat. We do know he is able to put up with issues, so lean on him a bit and just let him know, breakfast, lunch and dinner will all be a burger combo. He won't mind. Chevy trucks have lots of room in them for cups of soda and trash.
@@billsmith5960 They would need a minimum of 5 trips to In-N-Out Burger. It is only 8 miles round trip and they need to use the full potential of that free solar power.
@@JoeBManco - I disagree. They get 40 miles of solar per day. So the 400 mile battery is actually 440. So they can do an extra 5 trips because they measured that range because of the solar range in Carlsbad. I know it's a fact because they put Aptera automotive grade panels on top of the building in Carlsbad. Note to Aptera, the video will need to be like this as you are better than a German Sportscar. ruclips.net/video/A5DRCTW-Q7o/видео.html
The Electric Viking has shown us this option: ruclips.net/video/O6cxE_e4QPo/видео.html I think it's goofy, and not as good as it is presented, but there is a comparison to be made with Aptera - it produces 700 watts and Aptera claims that takes it up to 40 miles per day. Gosun's is 1,200 watts and they claim up to 30 miles. Of course, Aptera pretend it gets more from aerodynamics, but not in peak hour traffic. This oddball product may kill Aptera (if that was ever needed).
doing a bit of research on the gosun, , I think its a startup developing it, but seems there are some issues for charging, not as straight forward as plugging it into the tesla charge port. There needs to be a battery inbetween the solar and the charge port, it seems to be still in development stage. there is a video here, with someone who looks familiar (aptera devotee) interviewing the ceo gosun ruclips.net/video/ta_tZv31FtU/видео.html
This evil practice of blocking is still going on. This time it's by 'apterasolar'. I am so peeved I will copy this to my last five videos and to the Ninjineer's last video. He doesn't block, as yet, and more of the gullible 5001s read his comments. So this is what I see on my login (I see 3 comments and my first comment adds up to four). When anyone else reads they don't see mine. All are being deceived by apterasolar, as do many other pro-Aptera sites who sell the snake oil.
3 Comments Aussie ideas man Add a comment… @aussieideasman8498 7 hours ago Click bait title. Aptera didn't steal the show - they weren't invited and couldn't get in. They hung around outside. A couple of photos of a small crowd looking at it isn't enough to fool anyone but the extremely gullible. They pretended to drive to Carmel in a video, and when they were discovered to be on the back of a truck Chris makes a weak excuse in the video you copied. Reply @Rich1Rodriguez 3 hours ago Thanks for posting! 1 Reply @robinpettit7827 4 hours ago Glad US Capital is getting some funding for Aptera. 1 Reply @robinpettit7827 4 hours ago Good place to go. I suggested Doylestown, PA to Aptera. A lot of rich people around here too. 1 Reply
Think about this all their experience with flux power, the ease of buying a tesla battery pack, or similar ( theres tens of different car battery packs can be picked simply in usa). And as you mention they have only ever ( even with over 100 million in investment) had a 10kwh pack............what the? And it sounds like they were swapping the pack into different vehicles. Might be interesting to work out exactly what is in a 10kwh pack, I guess you could say its 25% or a bit less of the pack they are building now.If I remember correctly 26 cells in parallel, so that would mean 6 or so cells in parallel in the packs they have used up to date. The Beta build ( green machine) I suspect that aluminium box sitting in the back is actually the battery pack.........go figure!
You have hit on a simple concept that has been too difficult for all those highly intelligent disciples - swap out the small battery when some money comes in. I am sure the cost of the second and third Alpha's was much higher than the price of a 25kWh battery. If the CEO's didn't do that, then you have a pretty good sign they were scamming. The other Alpha's were barely more than different colours.
No Steve Fambro, the problem is that you misled Accelerators and everyone else with this motor swap. Sandy Munro exposed it back in August 2023 and it took you eleven months to tell the truth. Little Chris publicly declared Sandy was wrong but the truth is out now. You did it because you could not afford to pay anyone to make your hub motors or better yet the suppliers who could likely showed you that they would not work like you expected. The idea that a NDA existed where you could not even tell people how many wheels are powered is ridiculous yet Aptera actually made that claim. If Aptera were honest they would refund Accelerator investments.
I admit that I don't have any experience in the silly trike industry, but NDAs make no sense. In the aircraft industry, when we sell a product it is immediately announced (unless it is military). Why? It is good advertisement and it lets potential investors know what we're doing.
@@JoeBManco I have done QC work for both Ford and GM at the desert proving grounds in AZ, and visited many automotive factories in the US, Europe, and Japan. I have always had to sign an NDA before setting grounds on their properties. Otherwise I would have many interesting stories I could tell. Perhaps they "make no sense" to you but is common practice. Investors also often make everyone in a startup sign an NDA before they will invest.
@@n.brucenelson5920 Then why was the NDA allowed to expire before the silly trike was sold to customers? What you said makes sense for Ford and GM while testing a new design. It doesn't make sense when an NDA is only good for a set period without a product launch.
@@JoeBManco I had to sign an NDA when I visited Aptera regarding some details of the cooling system. In the case of the parallel testing of a potential alternative to the Elaphe wheel motors, the NDA was required of Aptera by the new potential supplier - this is not unusual at all.
Just a little bit more on sono motors bankruptcy. Its a little bit hard to find information on what happened after bankruptcy, there was a deal offered to investors ( crowdfunding) and those that had paid to reserve a vehicle. The offer was payments in 3 parts over 2 years, so they took their money but to get it back was going to be more difficult. Since its a german company also makes a bit hard to get info in english, but heres is a german guy that has captions which you can change into english on youtube. ruclips.net/video/QxdYfnFFBxI/видео.html It seems that getting your making back landed up not being a simple process as was first made out, I dont have all the information, but seems there was alot of investors not happy with the situation. Also there share price of course went down to less than a dollar us, and not sure if they got delisted or not. Anyhow this is a good lesson for any aptera investors of what might be the possible outcomes in the next year or two.
A strange similarity with Sono is that they decided to drop the Sion and stay in the solar panels for vehicles business, which Aptera is already going that way. I don't know if Sono has succeeded there, but Aptera won't. PolyDrop are going nowhere, too.
@@artsmith103 i read founders salaries were 300k euros per year and value of o.38% after insolvancy sale to yorktown, not sure what the 0.38% related to there was an investors meeting about the buyout i think dec 2023, but my memory might not be accurate on the numbers, there was large transfer of shares in sec filings just after bankruptcy
At the 49min 17 sec mark in the sono-motors video, one of the founders, is asking the people who made a deposit, to pay the whole amount of the vehicle and they will recieve teh car in 12 to 18 months. They really wanted the money, some ideas for aptera to use when they are at getting near bankrupt. This is so much like aptera its not funny. ruclips.net/video/yNLcwX3e60c/видео.html
@@namenotshown9277 - They did it wrong. Should have been non refundable like Elio did. They raised $26M with non refundable. They even got just over 21K people to sign a commit to buy (which means, anything Elio makes, they must buy it). That was a plan I thought was way better. Then you only need to give back the refundables and for the rest, it's yours to use.
@@aussieideasman8498 - I would ask them for the title to your house and then put a lien on it. I also think that they should require the Ambassadors to go to the plant and work for free. This way it would free up Jerry to do some real work as opposed to driving around the Chevy truck and whatever he also does to keep the place functional.
So I asked AirShaper what value his program gave for aptera, he replied he is not allowed to share. So from this answer I think you can deduce that cd of 0.13 is probably a bit too good.
If AirShaper had got lower value then Apteras estimate I think Aptera directors would use that value as their new cd, but since its not allowed to be made public, I suspect its not as good as 0.13. I think that is pretty reasonable conclusion.
That will mean all their data is over estimating efficiency, which isn't really surprising considering their public falsehoods thus far.
If Aptera are so transparent, why are they gagging others? A lot to hide.
@@aussieideasman8498 Yes this is not an open company at all, these guys have been very successful in raising money, and they are not going to give up that cash cow easily. You might say they will do whatever necessary to keep the funds coming in.
If they were honest guys all this research and commenting would not be necessary.
I don't think the trike they tested is close enough resemblance to final vehicle. Mirrors, ground clearance, wheel pants, solar install, cooling air, rolling tires, etc. So while they cheat a little to get close to 0.13, it will still be worse.
@@artsmith103 They don't cheat a little - it's a lot.
I was looking at another video and it was covering the major changes to that aluminum frame that I have been bugging people about for over a year. Yet it was all about the bink. It makes me wonder what other wholesale changes they will make. We are getting to about halfway through month 8 and no word on the ETA of the first frame.
I do not want to hear from the ambassador that this is under NDA because they show us the renderings and thus, it's all for everyone to see. I will assume that the NDA means, we can;t tell you when we do not know for certain major key items. We all got to hear about the bink progress and tooling, yet for the frame, just renderings. No pics of it at all.
Chris M (who appears to be controlling the company more and more) says to Motormouth that there are no more big changes.
@@aussieideasman8498 - Awesome! Chris M, he's the fountain of awesomeness. I now wonder, what is considered a big or small change. I guess going to a completely different propulsion system is a small change.
@@billsmith5960 Chris M is positioning himself for a good job not at Aptera soon. Full personal exposure.
Dear Aptera,
Who is supplying the airbags? You will be doing crash testing (it's a fact you will do three of the Pi's for that), so it'll be nice to let us know how those work out. Since Aptera is all about safety, we really need to make sure you do those crash tests before you release any of them to the public. Again, who makes those airbags.
Regards,
BS
Chris A. is their only airbag. Do you think Aptera reads comments from here?
@@aussieideasman8498 - It wouldn't surprise me.
I probably should leave this for next video, but will say it anyhow.
I like others had assumed that if you invested in the crowdfunding, those shares would automatically be converted to stock exchange shares when they list on the stock exchange.
I've done just a little research, not much, but it appears the crowdfunded shares dont automatically get converted to stock market shares, but remain as crowdfunded shares, which are very difficult to trade ( you have to trade with another individual yourself not via stock exchange traders).
I'm thinking that 99.999% of investors were thinking along these lines, and will soon realise their shares are pretty much worthless since they cant be traded on stock exchange!!!
I could be wrong on this, but it appears to be the case. Next video by Aoc is on the convertible note, but I dont think he even realises how worthless the crowd funder investments are going to be. Hope I'm wrong for the sake of all the investors, but seems its the case.
the crowdfunded shares might get the same price as stock exchange shares but I dont think they are tradeable on stock exchange...........so basically are worthless......scammed again folks.
I did not know this, and I doubt many of the crowdfunders do either. This annoys me even more when considering that they made a pitch for retirement funds.
I think it's time to ask Bruce baby to clarify this, lol.
@@aussieideasman8498 Bruce Baby would just say we're lying.
@@JoeBManco Because we can't do research; then he would stop the conversation before answering more questions and pop up somewhere else to ply his deception. He's been doing that for years.
I've been saying this for a year or more. Warning Donators all they get are fun coupons. The issue is the Donator stock is not backed with any equity. What ever USCG will do will require equity as will the IPO. Thus far, the owners (~4 of them?) hold all the equity. It's detailed in their quarterly tax statement.
Aptera just got washer bottles and they have in a built in pump! I bet nobody else has that kind of feature. Aptera is so efficient! Awesome!
What other EV has the arrival of its washer bottle generated so much fanfare? Chris Mac has to take one home with him and Hillbilly Bill features it in a new video. I have yet to watch it, and I bet he doesn't show a few bays of them, or even 16.
@@aussieideasman8498 - He never mentioned that the bottles had caps on them too. Maybe redo the video to mention that.
@@billsmith5960 New video to come, and they will TOP that with a final video that reveals the pump can make water from air and never needs to refill.
@@aussieideasman8498 really ? I'm in.
solar electronics engineer for lightyear solar car was Tom Vocke, he has a couple of patents on how to detect a foreign object ( bird crap etc) on a solar string. Seems he also engineered lots of the solar electronics for lightyear.
Title of patent is Foreign object detection in inductive power transfer field ,
solar cells act as inductors when shaded hence the title ( I didn't know that till maybe a week ago when looking at how shading is dealt with by mppt)
video with tom vocke here
ruclips.net/video/jfoyXlH4eNM/видео.html
Also I just noticed in this video that solar cells on cars get can get hotter than normal due to the reflections from buildings, now that is new info, also solar cells absorb very strongly in the infrared region ( not used to make electricity ) just makes them hotter. I wonder if that is also a reason why nearby buildings make them hotter? Anyhow seems there is alot of unknown complexities in these solar cells.
It is true there are "a lot of unknown complexities in these solar cells" to you. For example, why would higher temperatures resulting from hitting solar cells with more light (reflections from buildings) be "new info" to you? It really is quite a basic idea.
I thought the three IWM design was really awesome. Not sure I like their hybrid approach to this much. But what do I know. Standardized tests say I am mentally retarded anyway. Money I had saved to pay for this has been spent paying down real estate debt. If this becomes available I will decide if I still want it after all the compromises are complete and the specs it actually achieves and how to pay for it then.
I see a link between your tests and thinking IWM's are awesome.
@@aussieideasman8498hey you should be applauding Aptera. You were critical of the IWM. and belly pan cooling. They are not using either now. It is disappointing that the launch edition is a single motor system but I still have the choice to not buy it.
@@williamread8186 You are right about them dropping two items that were shoddy, and it can only improve the silly trike, but you are talking as though something will be made. My talk is still saying there won't be anything made that someone can buy and register.
@@aussieideasman8498 Just watched a short video on musks robotaxi, it might land up being a three wheeler, but not much details out as yet. That would be very interesting........look out aptera.
@@aussieideasman8498check out my last RUclips post. You will see where my Aptera money is being spent LOL. I do hope they can get to production though but not holding my breath.
13th of August today..........that PI 2 should be ready to reveal in mid-august as Fambro said two weeks ago, that means mid august would be 15th August....only 2 days to go, cant wait to see what they come up with ..........probably........nothing.
It may be the 12th still in the USA. This West side of the Pacific is a day in front.
Happy mid Aug 15!!
@@artsmith103 oh yes I'm guessing the big reveal will be later today sometime, as per the promise.
@@namenotshown9277 LoL Let the cretin do the guessing.
Aptera often says 100wh/mile is the efficiency, since often they seem to use miles/kwh in electric vehicles , 100wh/mile is same as 10miles/kwh
4 m/kWh is reasonable for an average EV.
Waiting for new video on the uscg video on aoc site, got some comments for that one!
Lightyear solar car, at production was in company name of Atlas Technology Holding B.V if anyone is looking for patents for lightyear, theres a few there. Its netherland based. One of their patents does run through in detail how they control the solar cell strings, via mppt.
There is a novelty to their device allowing for a patent, will leave that for anyone interested to read it.
Sono motors was more honest with their solar range estimates, they were using 1200watt max solar and were predicting about 10miles per day range from solar.
That seems more realistic than apteras claims. That would also suggest aptera might be more in the range of under 10 miles per day. I'm sticking with about 10miles per day on a perfect summers day in full sun all day for aptera.
This video has those range claims in it
ruclips.net/video/yq9s09r-pjY/видео.html
Sounds much closer than their claims.
You can make a similar estimate from the Squad Solar micro car. I too think 10 miles a day is a realistic upper limit.
@@dsds3968 thats a tiny car, more like a golf buggy, hope its not another crowdfunded scheme, seems its only pre-orders for that also. they are saying a validated 22km ( 13.5 mile range from solar) but dont know any details on the panel output etc etc.
@@dsds3968 If he estimates Squad claims, that is a matter for Squad and has nothing to do with Aptera, nor does it excuse Aptera for any discrepancies they have. You are introducing a red herring that serves no purpose.
In the video of lightyear solar car, they try coast down test at 100km/hr you can see it is quite slow to loose speed, does seem to validate their low coeff drag claims, it quite interesting effect to see speed is lost slowly at high speeds.
one last: lightyear at bankruptcy, also continued in supplying solar to other companies,
all I've found thus far..........this is also looking very familiar. They raised 200million, and got pretty damn close to production.
Ok I just noticed the original patent is also a design patent, its the weak form of patent just on the general appearance of the vehicle, I think they only last 15 years, so its due to run out 8th march next year. So aptera motors in the clear on that one!
Thought they had a big problem for a moment there.
another video of lightyear solar car dash showing some numbers on dash
at the 2 min 54sec mark
ruclips.net/video/T-CDVj4IcTM/видео.html
In this case the car is not moving, so the numbers shown, say for driving, in wh/km will be some sort of average over a period of time ( not sure how long that period will be).
total efficiency including solar etc is 165wh/km ( but over what period is that average I dont know), I suspect these numbers will be pretty accurate simply due to the team being made up of solar race engineers with plenty of experience.
since solar panels are very good at absorbing infrared, if you point one at the ground at night will it make electricity?
Take the ex skin cooling area and replace it with a solar panel. That way you get miles per night. With the 40 during the day, I will just make a prediction that you get 15 at night.
You'd know the answer to this question if you knew what specific wavelengths and power levels are being emitted by the ground at night and what the "quantum efficiencies" of the solar panels were.
@@johnreeves7261 or just point a solar cell at the ground at night is much simpler, like aptera can just read off the value of solar watts from the display and post the results, if they were transparent
@@namenotshown9277 Aptera already knows the answer to your question. You don't, because, well, you're not too bright. Go figure....
Just something copied from Hyperno's latest nonsense:
@aussieideasman8498 0 seconds ago
You do know that flashing up "supply by 2025" means a production model has to be sold to a customer before January first? This vehicle has to have been built entirely off the 13 stations they only have a video of, out of a parts inventory they only speak of lining up the agreements, and not one PI of the 10-16 promised PI's has been finished. No frame; no US Cap money and no workers, and there are 4 months and two weeks to do do it all in. You have under 10 days to provide that PI.2 you said would be driving mid-August. You won't even make that assurance.
Reply
@andremcamara3120 23 hours ago
Great job on this update thank you.
Aptera never went Bankrupt, however.
Reply
@aussieideasman8498 0 seconds ago
Still covering up their first failure. Aptera avoided the courts declaring they were bankrupt (as far as I know; maybe one has?), but in every other way they were bankrupt, and the term can be used generally - we don't need to have a court declare it. They had more bills than they had money to the point they could not continue operating so closed down. There are some public articles that wrote Aptera went bankrupt. Sounds a lot like being bankrupt, so why bother trying to deceive people? I notice you didn't offer a term for what they did, but if you watch Jay Leno's second road test video he asked the two CEO's what happened, and they told him they left earlier because they had better things to do. They were saying their interest had waned so much that things like hydroponics and forklift batteries were more interesting to them. They didn't mention the attempt to remove the head honcho they got from Detroit, nor anything about being shafted themselves. No mention of Aptera's demise - just covering their own butts with lies. Happy to delve deeper.
Yes, it's better to just act like Aptera 1.0 never existed. I will act like Aptera 2.0 never existed either since what they had from 2019 to today, is nothing like what they are going to build. So, better for us to sweep it under the rug.
@@billsmith5960 I think over the years they have discovered that they can say anything, and there are little negative consequences, but the falsehoods from their point of view aid them to get new investors. They cant of course be honest about where they are up to, or investors will be less interested. To be Machiavellian is Steve Fambros underlying philosophy on life.
Its quite simple really " fake it, until you make it" comes to mind.
The problem is, in the longer term there might be legal consequences for being visibly dishonest in trying to get investors. Its a very high risk way to operate, but the monetary rewards they have already found out, outway the risk of legal issues at a later date.
For anyone that believes in Aptera and that they will one day have a vehicle, you have to understand that this dishonest behaviour has no bounds, and they wont all of a sudden be honest once people have a vehicle. So things like getting parts or the prices of parts, will be an absolute nightmare. Its not really likely they will make it to production of any volume apart from prototypes, so it wont be an issue.
I just found out that lightyear auctioned off their prototypes on a dutch car auction site, the last price for a completed vehicle was $26,000 ( euro), not sure exact price they sold for. But there will be an opportunity to buy a prototype when bankruptcy occurs to Aptera, thats the only way you will get one of these, and the price will likely be online auction like lightyear did.
Atieva I believe supplies the F1 e-cars, and Lucid motors battery pack, not sure of the connection between the two companies ( via CEO maybe?), anyhow Atieva designed the pack and has intellectual property on it, same as aptera has IP on their solar cell design method, since there are issues put the IP number here, best thing is to just search the this:
Battery module with high thermal conductivity and assembling method
and add the word Atieva , that will get you to the IP which is currently active.
I really thought aptera had done something innovative with battery design, but seems its just a copy. I really dont like the way the negative of the cell cans is connected, either in lucid/atieva or aptera, but seems it works for lucid and they are the head of the game.
The other thing they do which is pretty minor they use a thin gauge wire on top of cell for fuse ( cant remember if its pos or neg they use). So is aptera going to pay Atieva for using their patented battery assembly design? Seems they might have just opened themselves up for the first legal battle, unless Atieva just lets them use it. Or Aptera will have to pay who knows how much to use the design.
If they don't sell a vehicle they don't have a legal problem. They know they won't be selling any.
So, the Aptera is getting more and more like an F1 car. It has F1 safety and batteries. Aptera is really knocking it out of the park.
@@billsmith5960 And F1 stolen IP, lol.
Well done aussie ideas man on keeping up all the work for so many years, its about time these guys either come clean or just close up shop. They are looking for the pot of gold at the stock exchange rainbow, getting into production is secondary, but important they have nice shiny vehicle to showcase......hence a prototyping company is all this well ever be.
They will need to produce half a dozen vehicles to get listed on the stock exchange, after that they need 3 to 6 months to clean up on the stocks...........then its all over folks, thanks for coming.
Then they will use any patents to do the whole thing all over again in a slightly different area, or just retire off the proceeds of investors and stocks.
Thats my prediction.
The new savings calculator start with sun exposure from "little or no exposure" to "very high exposure", these are not actual numbers..........very clever..........just relatively vague terms to select from.........you cannot from this do any of your own calculations its designed to be vague.
If you select the lowest sun exposure, I got 22 miles a day from the sun and I will only have to charge 12 times a year.........this is absolute rubbish.....deceptive rubbish at that.
They are spending money to be more deceptive on actual range calculations, they could spend their investors money in doing some actual measurements.
Such as: put the vehicle in the sun and record on video the watts the solar produces, go for a drive and record the wh/miles. Those values are in the display on the dash board, but wont be for long........they will disappear as it allows verification of the actual data.
Its time for new forms of deception rather than just being honest........crazy thinking on part of the directors. They will waste time now on thinking up ways to display the data in a qualitative way ( a vague way) to hide the actual numbers.......a clever way to be stupid.
My dad was a great predictor. He used to say it will either rain or go dark before morning.
Just something to save confusion:
old aptera : aptera motors incorporated ( or aptera motors inc.)
new aptera: aptera motors corporation ( or aptera motors corp.)
Two very different entities
old aptera: split into two entities: aptera motors inc, and zaptera motors inc.
( best as I understand it)
Zaptera motors inc.........owned by jonway motors china............I think
jonway motors china, was formerly Zhejain Jonway motors
thats as I understant it at the mo
I mentioned previously there were hub motors than can have two speeds, there is two ways ( maybe more) to do it. Electronically ( wye/delta winding) via a switch, and also you can do it via planetary gear sets. Here is a small ebike hub motor that has 2 speed via gears, and its dead clever how they do it ( by reversing the internal motor direction), now this is a work of art
ruclips.net/video/qzw8MKvErtw/видео.html
I would imagine there are probably car size hub motors by now that have planetary gear sets in them, it would be pretty much near impossible to know everything that is out there,
china manufacturing is so huge, no way to keep up with what is actually out there.
Any how just for the viewers entertainment, it might be that hub motors have a long way to go until they are useful in cars, I'm still might impressed by lucid motors internal differential inside the drive motor......genius.
60 days and complete funding. They also get over 100 emails per day when it comes to investment. First 50 Apteras will be delivered by the end of march 2025. Looks like it's a done deal.
5 days and they will be giving joyrides in PI.2, but only slowly in the carpark.
@@aussieideasman8498 - The Pi2 has been ready for a while. If you watch the videos, it's on a frame and 4 casters are on it. So, that's good enough for me and just shows they are making progress.
Hopefully two of the casters are non swivel (especially, need to be on the rear). That way it'll be like a grocery cart. I know the Aptera is to be a three wheeler but that will be the next design iteration and thus an improvement on efficiency.
Also, I bet they have an electric pallet jack. That can provide the propulsion around the parking lot.
Awesome!
@@billsmith5960 That's the PI.1. There's the left-over display junk from the French show that nobody wanted, and that can't be used, so nobody has seen a PI.2; only Steve F. has said they are well into building it, but he could be lying. Nobody can get near seeing it.
@@aussieideasman8498 - At least they can push it around the shop and let people sit in it and have them say, awesome.
Honestly, I am not concerned about front- or all-wheel-drive. I live in EU, meaning this small area, where 450,000,000 potential customers are, which will not get a chance to get an Aptera. Reason: the design is not road-legal in EU. It's simply way too wide among other problems like side or rear impact protection.
Even if you could get it in the EU, it would have so many limited uses. You can forget about any decent sized city. Then a small one. Better park it on the edge of town and walk home. I go to the EU and when I'm there, I think about what the Aptera would be like there.
Just on my last trip where I was in Switzerland, I thought about how Aptera went there to look for investors. Let's see, a country that has an excellent public transportation system and then when you get to many areas, it's a car free zone. Great idea to try to sell them on the idea.
Then I went and did the the Camino de Santiago. While walking that 800km in France and Spain, I had time to think about what would an Aptera be like here. In my mind, very limited use. Why buy something where you have a really hard time to park it or even just drive down many streets? Efficiency is one thing but people do want practicality.
The Aptera is built just for the US. Plain and simple. We have big trucks, big highways, big houses and big driveways.
@@billsmith5960 Alternatively, EU market will be taken over by Chinese brands. It already started. German OEMs have no idea about efficient BEVs. We see currently a revival of fossile fuels in personal transportation and also heating. Nobody is interested in saving the climate and the human beings. Frustrating.
@@kapt.jayaubre942 - Aptera has no interest in saving the planet either. If they did, they would have been on the market a few years ago and designed it to for use in other countries other than the US. Yet they did not. So, don't pile on the hopes and dreams when it comes to Aptera. There are many other options.
If you want to blame anyone, then blame Norway. They literally are feeding the petro industry for the EU. All while using those profits to fund EV for their country. Go there and you'll see.
@@billsmith5960 I suspect aptera started out being a little altruisic ( is that the word?), but after google gave over 20million? via ideaslab, it became a very different game, very quickly, and the game then became finance focused.....i.e. give me the money
@@namenotshown9277 - There's a thing called greenwashing. It's to make things look like they are going to save the planet and thus, you need to give them money. There is another version of it where existing companies just try to make them look "green" by making some sort of claim. Aptera needs money and the green part of it worked for a few years but that well runs dry if you can't make a product.
We have an ambassador that is still trying to greenwash Aptera because of the choice of refrigerant that it will use. Too bad he has been out of the industry for a while because nobody uses R134a and haven't for about 5 years. Yet Aptera is somehow "green" because they are not using it.
On a side note, I did call out the ambassador on his saving of the planet when it came to refrigeration. It had to do with the switch from R12 to R134a. He didn't know that the reason why R134a is not used today, is because it's a greenhouse gas and will never go away. We traded off one problem for another. Thus, not saving the planet at all. R134a is a blowing agent for foam too. Guess what, not used any more.
thanks aussie ideas man for letting me waffle along on your chanel, just a note about lightyear solar car. In there marketing videos, they do also play up the role of solar to get investors/customers, they are not immune to giving best case scenarios for range etc.
But the difference to aptera is they actually tested and gave the results, so best case is actually achievable, compared to aptera who has unachieavable claims.
Lightyear can be used as a benchmark for what is possible in reality. They have about 1100watts according to maxeon lab data, and were getting something like 50% of the predicted solar in real world. Aptera will be lower than that ( lightyear more advanced in the tech setup) so its going to be probably something like 1/3 of what they are claiming as 'real'.
You're welcome. Lightyear has a heavier car with worse aero, so I just concentrate on Aptera and make no comparisons, except with Aptera v1 and facts.
"Aptera (solar)...unachieavable claims" and "...and (Lightyear) were getting something like 50% of the predicted solar in real world." and "...so its going to be probably something like 1/3 of what they (Aptera) are claiming as 'real'." ha ha. Once again showing your inability to interpret/model/predict solar panel performance.
This is not particularly relevant but seems the first ever mppt tracker was patented by an australian , Stuart Watkinson of AERL in 1987 in oz, 1991 in usa. His son has just restarted the company doing battery installations etc.......rather interesting. They supplied alot of the early solar race cars mppt devices....small world it is indeed.
It's not that small when you try walking across the Simpson Desert. Fun facts are always welcome; no need to stay on topic. Scatterbrains won't even notice if you don't mention it, lol.
AERL's patented "MPPT", as it turns out, was not a true MPPT in the sense that it didn't "track" the maximum power point. It periodically and temporarily disconnected the solar cell circuit from the load and measured the open circuit voltage (Voc) of the solar cell circuit then ASSUMED the maximum power point was at some percentage (between 75 and 80%) of that measured Voc. That technique worked well for flat and un-shaded panels but had trouble with curved ones and/or partially shaded ones. As true MPPTs came into existence, the AERL one's fell out of favor for, at least, solar racing vehicles.
@@johnreeves7261 Very interesting, I haven't read the patents, everything starts from somewhere I guess, first attempts will always be improved upon. thanks for that info
just going on abit about lightyear solar car ( its only two years ago they were puting out all these videos of the test drives etc), anyhow this video it shows the solar cells grahical disply, it shows the cells that are producing in yellow colour, the strings not producing are blank.......rather interesting concept...a long long way ahead of aptera.
ruclips.net/video/xxUM16tskXk/видео.html
at the 2min 25 sec mark you can see the display
The Lightyear is all about efficiency. They even went with hub motors because of efficiency. Did I tell you that it's about efficiency. I just want to make sure you know that as it's key to why they will be successful. People want efficiency and then getting power from the sun just improves that efficiency.
Only thing missing from the Lightyear videos is the word "awesome". When they start selling in the US, they will need to start using that.
As for the display, yes, another thing they were not close to having done. It's like with Elio Motors where they never had a functioning instrument cluster except for the orange one that literally used a 1995 Geo Metro as the donor car.
Sorry Aptera, you are even behind some students - this one is registered: ruclips.net/video/IBsn_Vxh7-M/видео.html
I hope Aptera will sue them and get a big settlement. As we all know, Aptera has patents and I'm going to assume patents for anything solar on a car. If they have skin cooling on it, that will be a record settlement and can get Aptera to production sooner.
@@billsmith5960 Bad luck - the cells aren't stuck on at 45 degrees.
@@aussieideasman8498 - I think that just having cells on a car means, you need to pay Aptera lots of money.
I was just watching a video about lucid motors and saudi sovereign wealth fund, the saudis have put 6.4 billion into lucid since 2018. They just got 1.5 billion to keep them going another year or so. If this is what it takes to build electric cars, aptera doesn't have a chance. Unless the saudis invest in them too, it is possible there is alot of money to be at IPO, regardless of what happens to production.
Aptera lost money trying the UAE. Must have remembered Fambro.
@@aussieideasman8498 When you try to understand Aptera, why would they publicly announce the UAE limited gold edition plan to the general public before there were any buyers? Bragging after the first couple buyers makes sense. Exposing the possible failure before they have any feedback is so incompetent. That sort of thing is why I don't think they are as corrupt as you suggest. They are just completely incompetent and in over their head pursuing their dream.
@@aussieideasman8498 But he says he worked for 'the family' in uae, they must be best buddies.
@@namenotshown9277 Now trying to work for 'the family' in Italy.
@@artsmith103 Thats quite possible scenario, I assume the gold edition was just to get some UAE orders? I'm not sure if they are incompetent, they are very intelligent guys, and have actually made quite alot of progress, but at a great cost to investors. Perhaps its not corruption but a desire to continue the dream, I really dont know their true motivations. Certainly money is large motivator, a philantropic view of saving the world with solar cells gets the investors in, but they haven't done enough testing to know what the actual potential is.........they'll just peddle what sounds good for now. It has worked for them so far, and changing the speel is not good for business.......how will they get around showing what the actual range is and the actual solar input is .......that will be interesting to see how they handle that..........thus far being honest is not their method of choice, I suspect they will need a smoke screen method, hide the real world results as long as possible. Delays are actually quite useful for their narrative.
The blatant lies to get investors is what I find disturbing, its really not necessary in my view, it might be aptera will do fine or even better if they decide to go down the " lets be honest' route.
Regarding original patent owned by jonway motors, its only a design patent, sometimes called a design registration as its not a proper patent. It only covers the form of the object..i.e. how it appears, the shape. The original design patent on the shape runs out in march 2025 anyhow.
Aptera has their own design patent on their shape, but it only covers that exact shape, you can make some minor change and not infringe the design, its very weak form of patent.
Nobody has wanted it, anyhow.
@@aussieideasman8498 yes a design patent is pretty worthless thing
Notice the glare on the windscreen from the solar cells at the 3min 21 sec mark in this video, it wont pass road regulations as it interferes with visibility quite badly.
ruclips.net/video/zjsf1ApVFDo/видео.html
Also 15 and 27 seconds
The exterior glare will be a danger to other drivers around it.
I did make a comment somewhere that a hub motor in rear would be good for high efficiency at highway speeds, and use front for hills/low speed, seems aptera owners club has made a video of that.......seems he does read our comments.
anyhow I made a comment on his( aoc) site that a hub motor can be used in delta or wye winding type, and can be switched between them for high speed or low speed use.
Anyhow just posting it here as a record for when he makes a video about that comment too.
Seems he likes to take other ideas and pass them off as his own.
I have an idea, add wind power too. Take a fan, mount it on the roof and then put a sail in front of it. I watched a documentary on it and most of the parts came from Acme Corp.
But he adds articles from deep research. Good for a laugh.
@@billsmith5960 I don't suppose there was a Coyote and a Roadrunner in that doco?
@@billsmith5960 Okay hear me out. Put a wind generator on an Aptera so it can charge the battery while driving down the road, but also on a windy day it can still charge while parked and at the same time wind up large rubber bands that can be used to launch the machine from a stop. Talk about efficient, wouldn't even need a charge port.
@@Aspkkr there are stagnation areas at front of cars suitable for inlets for airflow ( wouldn't effect flow around vehicle much), lets just say some speed record holder vehicle used that, not going to give to much info as aptera will use it. Well they wont actually use anyones ideas in the long term, as production is not the goal of this scheme they are running.
Anyhow I'm predicting at some point aoc use my information on delta/wye switching method to get a 2 speed hub motor without rewinding it, and pass it off as his own research. He wont acknowledge the source, I haven't looked but I doubt that info is on the net, could be wrong of course. Its certainly not common knowledge.
Lucid motors just got 1.5 bilion a few days ago from the saudis to keep them going another year or so.
So that means Aptera will be getting a boatload of money from them too.
The more you go over this the more you see, he says " we wanted to simplify the number of moving parts for launch" well there are more moving parts in an e-axle than a hub motor, in fact alot less. So that statement is just incorrect........worrying that a director would get such a thing wrong.
" for maximum efficiency....we moved to inboard motors" ok , that much is true, seems he is revealing what I've been saying for some weeks, hub motors are rubbish efficiency at low rpm. Just took them a few years to work out they had a problem.
This is what is going on. Aptera has found out that the motor manufacturer want money up front and a guarantee that Aptera will start production at a certain date. In the real world, Elaphe needed some promise (with money) so they can start buying the machines that make the parts that go in the motors and then the motor assembly machines. Since Aptera is running out of money, they balked at it.
Then an investor looking at the company (who uses consultants) asked the simple question, "Can we just use an off the shelf component and use the money we save for something else and speed up this whole project?" The answer was, "Yes we can." Thus a new driveline. I will bet you this same thing happened to the skin cooling project.
I would not be surprised if this happens with the battery. Haven't heard much about CTNS for a while. Seems that when they go silent on something, it means a change is in store.
Also, Steve is just pandering to his fans. It's so obvious but they eat it up because it makes them feel special.
@@billsmith5960 Chris on the Tailosive interview said there are no more changes. Too bad he lies.
@@aussieideasman8498 Too bad you have been lying from the beginning and will be found out next year by all.
@@n.brucenelson5920 How many lies has Chris A and Steve F told? I've lost count.
@@billsmith5960 Interesting
Anybody know what a convertible note is? I heard it has something to do with investing in a three wheeled solar trickle charger that converts your money into vapor. I could be off on that though.
I hope you said this on today's AOC video.
@@JoeBManco I did post a similar comment but it didn't take. I really don't know why but seems like about 30% of the time I can leave a comment and then check back later and it's not there.
@@Aspkkr I am finding more of my posts disappearing too. Even one of my original posts I did on this video is gone.
Heres a video updating the battery pack two years ago
ruclips.net/video/0Klxngp4H8U/видео.html
There is a bunch of engineers they have talking, the funny thing is, with all these people ( now all gone) they still haven't even finished one battery pack!! This is absolutely mind blowing ineptitude, 2 years half a dozen or more young engineers........and nothing!!
At this very moment they are puting together the first battery pack with the honours given to steve taken from flux power.......I really cant get my head around the waste of time and resources of these people.
I really wished that I would have applied for a job at Aptera when the company was founded in 2019. I would have been able to get paid, do nothing and travel the world.
@@billsmith5960 oh it gets worse, their battery pack is a copy of lucid motors battery pack, and is under patent by atieva inc.....identical
They are so proud of looking forward to the work that should have been done in ‘21.
They had more than enough people, just the wrong ones working on the wrong things.
With lightyear the average driving efficiency is 192 wh/km, approx 200wh/km thats without accounting for solar charging. Converting that to 309wh/mile ( 192wh/km), so about 300wh/mile.
I think aptera is claiming 100wh/mile, it will probably be closer to what the more advanced lightyear was getting once you get in the real world and away from made up ( sorry theoretical ) numbers.
this video at 5min 20sec shows a graph comparing sono motors, lightyear and apteras fund raising efforts ( it leaves out apteras first attempt)
ruclips.net/video/EE2y5v8gE_g/видео.html
so its two down and one to go.
Pissive is another low-life cretin who blocked me very quickly. Like most pro-Aptera YT video makers, just a deluded f001.
I'm very dissapointed bruce nelson wouldn't engage in discussion about solar cell output figures being exaggerated, he cant of course engage in that as it goes against his narrative.
Which leads to an interesting observation, why wont people like bruce be rational about this, well he has invested his money and time into it, and anything that challenges the 'wisdom' of him being an ambassador he just has to ignore it unfortunately. So it seems here will be alot of people with that thinking, they are invested and have to be blind to reality of the directors deceptions on aspects of the vehicle like solar watts, range and efficiency. The main selling points of this vehicle have no basis in reality, and if your supporting a company with false claims at is base, then you have to justify somehow to yourself that what you are doing is correct way to go. Anything that goes against has to be ignored, to justify his own position.
This is how scams work, fool the gullible. He seems like a very nice man on his videos, but alas he will have to keep up his dance for the aptera directors until comes the time of bankruptcy, then he will take his nice little nest egg and disappear the same way as the directors will disappear from all media.
thats might prediction, its a bit like talking to a religious zealot, doesn't matter what you say there is no chance they will even entertain what you are saying......rant over.
I watched the Elio Owners forums for years. The mods were "insiders" and had a personal line to Paul. Yet they could never tell anyone anything except for cryptic ones of how everything is going fine and new information is on the horizon. If you were questioning them on their source of info, they just banned those you. Same for the FB groups where just a few knew it all but never could tell you anything buy just for hope and dreams. In addition to that, questioning specs and other items, it just let to being banned.
With this "Ambassador program" it seems to be like the "Insider program" with Elio. It's that when you find a few old white guys that are living their swan song, they feel special because they know more than anyone else. It's quite sad to see crowdfunders do this as they know the market and use them as free advertising and want them to do their best to choke out anyone that questions the company.
Bruce has his own playground on Reddit and I find many just never post again and that tells me he's just banning them (plus I have seen some threats of banning people too). If they are softball questions, then they can stay. It's just like Elio Motors 2.0.
@@billsmith5960 Interesting, it seems there is a repeating pattern going on with all these startups.
He might seem like a nice guy, but nobody is buying Bruce baby. People should focus on the product.
@@billsmith5960 It's a slick operation on a forum where nobody knows who's even real.
@@aussieideasman8498 agreed
heres a video from sono-motors ( now defunct) and they have no problem showing their solar output data ( see 43sec mark) on the cars screen , aptera wont even show there display data
ruclips.net/video/yYb3sw795sA/видео.html
in traffic, below say 35km/hr or so, there is not much wind resistance, so the aptera wont be any better than other evs, 3 wheels some effect but more weight on three wheels for rolling resistance, I think the difference will be minimal.
I see fambro saying the aptera is very safe in cross winds, maybe, but I suspect they have never driven past a large truck going in the opposite direction at 60mph or so. LIke the solar, the reality might be very different to the predictions. It needs to be tested before he makes assursions on how safe is an untested vehicle.
Five days and they are showing us the PI.2 drive, so should be some range data within a week, lol.
@@aussieideasman8498 thats right, and now they are saying its not only the 4 pi builds, its another 50 fully paid for vehicles by first quarter next year........I can see their noses grow as they speak.
@@namenotshown9277 -
Dear Aptera,
I have a better idea, forget the Pi builds all together and just go right into production. With the design perfected and the simulations you have done, it's ready to go. Build the first 50 gold series for the UAE and send them over. When they see what you can do for such little money, they will start funding you to build all of those satellite plants and thus, start selling worldwide.
Nothing could ever go wrong with this plan.
Regards,
BS
Talking about laughing along, if you go to the 35min 18 sec mark of the uscg webinar video on aptera owners club site,
ruclips.net/video/0GgbnuABiZ4/видео.html
there is a quite bizzare section where the girl hosting
says "this round gets us to put vehicles in your hand" followed by the most bizzare laugh.
It is that she cant really believe she is saying this crap out loud? Its very strange moment,
sorry aussie ideas man, couldn't wait till you did a video on it......please note that time stamp moment very wierd.
This next week I have limited time available to watch anything, and I don't see myself able to make a video. When I saw an hour long AOC video, I didn't bother opening it. I'll see if I can just jump to 35 mins and watch her.
I see what you mean, and I recognise Chris A. is back at the snake oil helm, lol.
@@aussieideasman8498 its no problem, youve done a huge job over the last couple of years, I think you have a really good record of what aptera has been up to. And nothing is going to change in a hurry, its like a soap opera, you come back in two years later and its all the same thing.
I really like Frank. He looks like he's not buying it at all. Just sits there staring into his laptop. Plus the questions they get are obviously from superfans and not real investors. In general, the whole thing was really strange. I think it was done so it could be put out on the internet just in hopes some big investor sees it.
I thought that USCG was to handle all of this and go to investors as opposed to yet another webinar covering the same exact points yet again. You do have to actually go in front of people for the amount of coin they are asking for. I'm just amazed that they seem to be going down the same path yet again. I wonder if they did this because they are starting to see that it's not as easy as they thought.
@@billsmith5960 It appears to me that the directors will outsource everything pretty much, not getting their hands dirty so to speak and allow others to do the hard yards.
They are simply the mouth pieces and decision makers, setting themselves up for financial gain mainly. They are obviously highly intelligent guys, they have honed their speaking skills and rhetoric to a high degree.They have rattled off the same blurb so many times, and can in a small space of time produce alot of information, that sometimes you have to go over and see what they were actually saying in detail.
They are extremely skillful in using language
to skirt around the actual details. They have a very good knowledge of the technology, but these days its mainstream all these technologies are well known, so it should be getting harder to divert peoples attention from the details. To go on a webcast and say they have fully paid for another 50 vehicles that they dont have alot of the design finished ( just as one example the wiring loom, only a few weeks ago they were still measuring with ruler how long each wire had to be). Its not possible they have paid for things that haven't been finished yet. I think they have gotten away with this for so long they are not afraid to make up things in order to get more investors.
I'm sure there will be laws covering this sort of dishonesty in attracting investors, but it might take a long time for the law to catch up, at some stage I suspect their overt dishonesty on long lived media might catch up and bight them on the arse.
Ha! I've been challenging Bruce Baby that it was a 10kWh battery. He denied or blamed an NDA that it was a closed topic. And i said that was no excuse for not demoing miles/kWh. They could weight the vehicle to match full size battery and drive around for 10 miles or so. And if they don't have regenerative braking, they could say they hope to increase miles/kWh by 30% when it's installed. Absolutely no excuse for not updating their critical performance data quarterly. So fanboys lectured me with their excuses for years.
Bruce the volunteer was all over the comments today. You'd better believe I will be asking more frequently about proof that the current prototypes can go 100 miles on a complete charge. Also, since Steve F has linked the entire history of Aptera together, that means 18 years without a production vehicle.
@@JoeBManco - Lets not forget that engineer that worked for Aptera, left and then came back. Only to talk about Aptera 1.0 too. So now we have at least three people that worked for Aptera 1.0 with a vehicle which looks quite the same. Aptera 2.0 now even has exposed axles just like Aptera 1.0. Only thing missing is a diesel motor hybrid setup.
This would be like if you and I started Joe and Bills Pizza Parlor in Carlsbad back in 2006. We made Chicago style pizza. When that went out of business in 2011, we decided to start it back up again in 2019 with the same chef, same name and do NYC style pizza all along with the same area of the country. We are nothing like or even related to the old venture we had as we make a different style pizza today.
I forgot, we still haven't sold a pizza to an actual consumer. Trust us, anyone reading this, it's the best and most efficient pizza out there.
@@JoeBManco I'm sure without regenerative braking, 100 miles on 10 kWh battery is impossible. In fact it would lead to 13 miles/kWh when it is installed. My PHEV weighs about 3,800 lbs and with older 7.6 kWh battery peaks around 60 mph in EV mode. That was the basis for my 10 kWh estimate. So lighter Aptera with 10 kWh should have done an easy 80 mph. Steve was full of sh!t suggesting excessive C rate.
@@artsmith103 - You forgot that it did a "ton of laps" in Dubai. So, it did just fine.
Lucid motors has patent on its battery design, Atieva inc has the patent and aptera is exact copy of atieva battery..........oh well more trouble ahead........have tried to post patent number but posts keep getting not posted
That would be trouble. You need to get around YT foibles, like here's a pa no. , then here's a te No. and finally here's an nt No. , then people just combine the numbers. There are ways if you get inventive.
@@aussieideasman8498 ok will try that in a new post
This video chris anthony says "confident we can start deliveries in the later part of 2022"
Just for the record
ruclips.net/video/vlNTyI_Fq7U/видео.html
They were still saying that Q1 2022.
At least Aptera is not like this company at all by claiming when production will begin. According to the date and the claim that they would be doing it in 18 months, It's just over 10 years when that was to happen. ruclips.net/video/0WmvbwXDX4w/видео.html
I think Chris M. went to Aptera on a “bring your kid to work” day and was abandoned there.
They are training him to be the next Elon. So, he will be living there and end up becoming part of the trifecta of CEO's at Aptera.
@@billsmith5960 That's nice, I'm excited for the little guy.
It is so cool, amazing and exciting that the little tyke has activities with Aptera. Hopefully his chores include taking Tom the CFO for daily walks in the park.
@@JoeBManco - Don't worry, Jerry might be training him too. Things like making sure the Chevy is full of fuel. When the apterdash service starts, someone needs to follow it around to make sure the deliveries are done on time.
@@billsmith5960 Apterdash and Ubertera will be certainly keep the little guy busy.
If its ok with aussie ideas man, I might post here any of my posts that are deleted from other aptera related sites. Means I will have to save copies of my posts, but is interesting to see what types of post dont match up with their view of reality or they dont want to discuss.
I did one very lengthy time consuming post to Bruce Nelson, it was outlining why the solar watts of aptera is impossible to ever achieve, it was hard to argue against it, so he just didn't post it. After that I keep a copy of any of my posts I think will be deleted to any of the aptera fanboys. Seems when confronted with reality as with other religious zealouts, they have no way to comprehend what is being said so they either ignore it ( delete the post) or become abusive, it is somewhat comical in a way.
Regarding uscg webinar:
You will notice that there is no discussion anywhere on fanboy sites on Fambro saying Aptera has paid for 50 cars to be built by mid next year.....its so obiously dishonest that they wont even bring it up or discuss it. How can you pay for 50 vehicles that have not been completed in the design stage? We saw there a no electrical looms done yet, connectors still being sources, and the list is long of what has not been done, electrical components are just stickers...........how can they pay for things that are not done yet? Any investors should take note of this statement and use it against Fambro in the bankurptcy or any other legal proceedings that might arise in future. Getting investment by deception is likely to be legal consequences at some stage. They have already done pretty well financially out of all this, and if IPO occurs will do very well indeed, they might land up loosing alot of in legal fees at some stage.
Go for it. Anyone is welcome to put here what has been blocked from other sites; just reference where and when so people can verify it's not there. YT can police vulgarities and disrespect, et al. I am up for freedom to say anything about the silly trike.
@@aussieideasman8498 excellent thankyou
1:50 Promise, he wishes he hadn't said that...
He's still doing a good job of leading them by the nose, judging by the sites that sell the snake oil. Just tell them they are intelligent.
@@aussieideasman8498 Bruce loves to say Aptera never failed all the promised deliveries because when Aptera said they would do something and didn't, like 2024 1st quarter or 1st half crash testing, they didn't "promise" it.
@@artsmith103 He must think we imagine Steve and Chris are giving dates.
@@artsmith103 - Everything is a target date. So it's just fine. Then Aptera is just making a better product and that's what we all really want. It's perfection.
It's like the marathon projects I watched other engineers do. Never get to the end result, just keep working on making it better. All while the timeline keeps going on and on and on. Even Steve knows this as there will have to be a freeze. At that point they need to move onto the next phase. Right now they are just messing around. Lock the thing down and go with it.
On the other hand, it could be like Arcimoto where they couldn't make a final decision until they did the IPO and then just ran with what they got. We see how well that worked out.
@@billsmith5960 If musks robotaxi is a 3 wheeler, its going to be interesting to see how manufacturing is actually done.
I'm excited that they are excited to be working with each other on this exciting project. This new exciting inboard motor along with the exciting solar cells is just very exciting. It was also exciting to hear in the tone of their voice of the excitement that is in the air.
I think that Aptera needs a slogan: Aptera, We Build Excitement!
I'm excited that you're excited that they are excited to be working with each other on such an exciting project of building excitement.
@@JoeBManco - Just wait until they do the team building exercise where they build excitement due to the In-N-Out Combo #3 that everyone will be getting in two weeks when the Pi is out doing durability testing in Carlsbad.
Like, um, I'm excited because it's neat, cool and amazing. Let's see who can add to the sentence?
@@aussieideasman8498 Don't forget it's tripendicular
@@aussieideasman8498 - We will need to pull out a thesaurus and find more words for excitement.
Got it. All of the hubbub for Aptera is amazing.
No....that's not what he said.... but instead of making constant hurt-butt comments....LET GO! If you lost money...it's a loss.... get over yourself. "It's not for you!" Cancel your order, cut your losses. The hyperbolic comments are really just showing off your hurt feelings, and not adding anything to this....
You have no idea what's going on. I have never put money on that silly trike, so no reason to have hurt feelings. Try not to be such an 1d10t.
Try speaking English. Clearly reference what you're talking about. There's some pretty good experience here that's been offering a lot of help to better understand Aptera. Typical theme here is more accurate Aptera reporting especially with regards to finance and Mother Nature.
@@artsmith103 You are right about user-In... needing to reference what he was talking about; I had no idea and couldn't be bothered going over my own video to check. The reason being is that when someone does nothing more than disagree, it lacks substance, which I regard as foolish gossip. If anybody sides with such nonsense, they deserve to suffer Mother Nature's consequences. Those who know what he said (whoever he is and whatever he said) will do better for the knowledge. I am not needed.
Here's what I commented on the latest Electric Vouch rubbish (I'm up late watching the Olympics):
@aussieideasman8498
0 seconds ago
Having looked at your history of videos, I would suggest you are a plant from inside Aptera; you began 11 months ago and it appears like you have access to someone's Caddy and a Tesla, so you add a few of these videos to look like you are independent. You also threw in a few political videos to throw the scent off your being from Aptera Motors. The way you construct the palavering, I would say Jason Hill is probably writing your scripts.
Reply
@aussieideasman8498
4 minutes ago
Give up the bull - it's riddled with mistakes.
Reply
Thought I would just go over some of apteras old videos, first one I come across is this one:
ruclips.net/video/XOOY42xnSHU/видео.html
Called "driven by the sun/ never charge technology"
In this video they say 43 miles per day from sun alone ( just over the 40 mile average drive per day in usa...how convenient). They are clearly selling the vehicle as something that doesn't require charging.....absolutely false and no real data ever shown to back this up.
Also the 100wh/mile being spruked, surely with what we know now this is false advertising?
They are also saying 1000mile range........they have never had a pack larger than 10kwhr installed........surely this is false advertising. They have raised money on false claims, and now the truth is slowly revealing itself.
Another one
ruclips.net/video/jbLQ6Z0u_qo/видео.html
Seems they used to go down the line of never charge technology as an advertising slant.
Fambro also says in this one " 1,000 miles range was an insane claim" well yes Steve it is indeed, its never been demonstrated and likely never will. It will remain an insane claim.
What you don't realize is all we need are just simulations today. No need to do real world testing. Startups love simulations and rely on them heavily for marketing. For example the Elio gives 84 mpg. How did they know? It was a simulation McLaren Engineering did for them back in 2010. Thus, they ran with those numbers and that was where all of the hype began.
Here we are today and still doing simulations, yet products get released and they are not perfect or live up to the numbers. I will admit, it's getting better, but when you have a startup and a limited amount of resources (aka, ability to pay for top talent) then you just rely on those young folk who are dreamers. I don't have a problem with them but someone has to be the voice of reason. That voice of reason is expensive. Experience costs money.
@@billsmith5960 thats true, honesty is the best policy, there is way too much smoke and mirrors with this company. There last video they are saying verification of their claims is going to be done, but as i'm going through older videos from some years ago, they are also saying the same thing.
I dont think we can expect any honest or open reporting of range data, especially when it comes to solar, there numbers just wont be close to the claims. They are caught in their own lies. This is not transparency at all.
They're so lost in their incompetence, I don't think there's anyway out for them.
The trike price is now unmanageable and they could be a year or more from finished testing.
Their chance was to sell an upgraded Arcimoto for $30K at what ever performance level could be squeezed into that price. I've been estimating ~8 miles/kWh and 17 solar miles/day. If someone drives 34 miles/day, 50% solar doubles the battery range. They could have advertised a 250 mile, 32 kWh battery having 500 mile range (industry high) in southern half of the country. Promote all the achievement based on milder weather and let northern residents do what they want. The efficiency marketing should include smaller motors with Honda Civic performance, say 100 kW single engine FWD with 85 mph govenor. External solar option would appeal to that market.
@@artsmith103 - Let's add into that. How about the warranty and service. How is that going to be handled. Right now, no warranty and for some reason people think that "right to repair" means it's super easy. Little do they know, the rest of the details on this are glossed over.
For example, let's say the motor goes into limp mode. How is that going to be diagnosed? Do you tow it to any shop and tell them, "just scan the QR code and it'll tell you how to fix it, plus, Aptera (the company you've never heard of) will send you the parts and reimburse you for the work because it's under warranty (even though we have no idea what that is).
Aptera has been super opaque on how they will handle this? How can you make a shop manual on a vehicle you have never even got to the pre production phase? If people think these will not have problems, then they are living in fantasyland.
For these coming out in H1 2025, they better be prepared for warranty issues and how to deal with it. Last thing they need is someone on the other side of the US with a bricked Aptera that all of a sudden makes a video showing their displeasure.
@apterachallenge @JoeBManco You two have been debating the motives of Aptera on 'So, Now Are You Ready To Reserve Your Aptera? | New Vitesco EMR3 drivetrain.' Joe, apterachallenge is as big a cretin as Steve from AOC and many others. If you sort by NEWEST FIRST, you will see this: (all of 30 comments
@JoeBManco
9 hours ago
I will ask you the same question I have asked the other Aptera fan channels. What is Aptera's warranty?
Reply
Aptera Challenge
·
1 reply
@JoeBManco
1 day ago
Am I ready to reserve an Aptera? No. Why should I? The company just did a bait and switch with the motors, and raised the price of the FWD they are offering. The price for the FWD with 250 claimed miles of range was $26K. Now the FWD is $31K according to the website with a claimed range of 400 miles. They lied about the motor when Sandy Munro knew in August 2023 that Elaphe motors would not be used in the launch edition. When this company goes IPO, it will be a pump and dump stock and the company will fail.
Reply
Aptera Challenge
·
21 replies
@user-jp2em5hy5f
2 days ago
Vitesco EMR4 vs EMR3:
- Weighs 25 percent less at the same power level. 66 vs 77 kg.
- 5.6% efficiency advantage in the WLTP.
- Smaller.
So the big question (to ask) is WHY the EMR3!?
Has Hyundai bought up all the EMR4s for the next 5 years or something?
Reply
Aptera Challenge
·
2 replies
@simonthedog7980
2 days ago
Just to fully understand your motive for putting out this video. Are you compensated by Aptera in any way for each deposit Aptera reiceves for a vehicle?
Reply
Aptera Challenge
·
1 reply
@n.brucenelson5920
3 days ago
I started dialing about 10 minutes before reservations were open, and got in for #10042 - a Paradigm Edition. I understand the impact of Global Warming, and am interested not just for personal reasons, and the well being of my own pocket book, but also the small contribution it can make to slowing our rush into global warming.
4
Reply
That doesn't have my comment. When I sort I see this: (just the first few needed)
@aussieideasman8498
3 days ago
You are selling the snake oil. You should have wised up by now, but greed has got the better of you. The sole reason you recommend the preorder is because you think there is something in it for you, and nothing about the customer. The silly trike is not near production - they lie, and have lied consistently for many years now. It's nothing like an early Tesla investment and everything like an Elio investment - destined to fail.
Reply
@n.brucenelson5920
3 days ago
I started dialing about 10 minutes before reservations were open, and got in for #10042 - a Paradigm Edition. I understand the impact of Global Warming, and am interested not just for personal reasons, and the well being of my own pocket book, but also the small contribution it can make to slowing our rush into global warming.
4
Reply
@simonthedog7980
2 days ago
Just to fully understand your motive for putting out this video. Are you compensated by Aptera in any way for each deposit Aptera reiceves for a vehicle?
Back to my comment:
The reason they are so different is because this Aussie low-life blocks people. He can't be fair, nor can he be trusted. His greed is way stronger than his ethics, and his arguments smack of abject st#p1d1ty. He is so weak that he can't go head-to-head with me - just like everyone at Aptera and their 800 ambassadors.
I took down my comments on that channel. Some people are not worth the effort to talk to. All he wanted to do was compare Aptera to Tesla, which is an old debate fallacy tactic. He even wanted to compare Elon Musk to Chris A and Steve F. When I pointed out that why use Tesla, when there was actual trike companies that tried and failed. His response, was because Aptera is not like those companies. No kidding, Aptera is certainly nothing like Tesla either! I like to engage people in legitimate conversation when we don't agree. Not to try to beat them down, but to try and understand how their faith and conclusions are made. This person even wanted to argue about if Sandy Munro really said what he said in August 2023 about the hub motors. It is on video for all to see. This reminds me of Bruce and his comments on this video denying that Chris M lied after Sandy Munro said in that video that the hub motors would not be in the launch edition vehicles. There are a few regular commenters on the AOC channel that I do enjoy talking to even though we clearly disagree about Aptera. For the ones that want to be awful, then I can give them that as well.
Let's say Aptera does build some customer vehicles. What are the legitimate chances of them ever being sold in Australia? I live in the middle of the USA and actually inquired of Arcimoto how long it would be for them to set up a customer hub for where I live. I never got a response after several emails. It wasn't but a few months later that it became obvious the company was failing. I give Aptera about the same chances of success. They might have a few customers along the West Coast, but they're going to find out just how hard it is to maintain an assembly line. Once the production loan dries up; they will be done.
Lets call the Aptera 'savings calculator" the 'bs calculator' thats more accurate description of what it is.
I compared it to my Elio. Driving 100 miles per day and little exposure. I will save $5300 in 5 years. So, I decided to outfit my Aptera because I'm going to be saving so much money. Mine came out to $51,000. I know I'll be getting it soon and can't wait to start saving money.
It's cool to be able to compare two imaginary cars.
@@billsmith5960 funny
You can save $30 off the $100 preorder amount, but I chose to save the $100.
@@aussieideasman8498 - At least you didn't put down $1K on an Elio. So consider that using Aptera math, you save $930 by just reserving an Aptera.
I think we're all giggling with excitement, because the bait and switched launch edition is so cool. Now that Steve F has said what size of battery is in each of the old prototypes, how about proving they propel the vehicle for 100 miles. Steve said it is a 10KWh battery and the vehicle gets 10 miles per KWh, then show us. I will be impressed if it made it 60 miles on a charge based on Chris M's behavior when fetching food in the livestream.
Even my dog was excited. So excited she even peed on the floor. It just shows the excitement is getting contagious.
I'm excited where they have never tested any of their claims and the Pi will be the first time (except for the hub motors, AWD and skin cooling). The excitement is building when that Pi is moving under it's own power and Steve drives it 400 miles until it runs out of power. That tells me that it'll take 50 hamburgers from In-N-Out for it to run out of power.
Better hope Jerry has an extended range second tank on that Chevy. Plus Jerry better make sure they have enough toilet paper in the restroom and the trash cans are emptied because of all of the wrappers, cups of soda.
That tells me this test will cost about $450 for the hamburger combos and $175 in diesel. $20 in toilet paper then various other costs of maybe $100. $745 for full distance testing and feeding the employees shows how this is an efficient method of testing.
Aptera: We Build Excitement ! (and cholesterol levels on our employees)
@@billsmith5960 You missed the cost of all those stickers Chris hands out the window.
@@aussieideasman8498 - That might be covered under various costs. If not, we can add $50. I was also thinking that the employees can just pay for their hamburger combo out of their own pocket and use this testing like free doordash. Right there, it would be a $450 savings in testing costs.
Now, the only major problem is this. How to schedule out the burger combo deliveries. Some will have to eat them for breakfast, others for lunch, others for dinner and others for a late night snack. With that, they will need to at least have three of those combos for Jerry. He does need to eat. We do know he is able to put up with issues, so lean on him a bit and just let him know, breakfast, lunch and dinner will all be a burger combo. He won't mind. Chevy trucks have lots of room in them for cups of soda and trash.
@@billsmith5960 They would need a minimum of 5 trips to In-N-Out Burger. It is only 8 miles round trip and they need to use the full potential of that free solar power.
@@JoeBManco - I disagree. They get 40 miles of solar per day. So the 400 mile battery is actually 440. So they can do an extra 5 trips because they measured that range because of the solar range in Carlsbad. I know it's a fact because they put Aptera automotive grade panels on top of the building in Carlsbad.
Note to Aptera, the video will need to be like this as you are better than a German Sportscar.
ruclips.net/video/A5DRCTW-Q7o/видео.html
The Electric Viking has shown us this option: ruclips.net/video/O6cxE_e4QPo/видео.html
I think it's goofy, and not as good as it is presented, but there is a comparison to be made with Aptera - it produces 700 watts and Aptera claims that takes it up to 40 miles per day. Gosun's is 1,200 watts and they claim up to 30 miles. Of course, Aptera pretend it gets more from aerodynamics, but not in peak hour traffic. This oddball product may kill Aptera (if that was ever needed).
doing a bit of research on the gosun, , I think its a startup developing it, but seems there are some issues for charging, not as straight forward as plugging it into the tesla charge port. There needs to be a battery inbetween the solar and the charge port, it seems to be still in development stage. there is a video here, with someone who looks familiar (aptera devotee) interviewing the ceo gosun
ruclips.net/video/ta_tZv31FtU/видео.html
This evil practice of blocking is still going on. This time it's by 'apterasolar'. I am so peeved I will copy this to my last five videos and to the Ninjineer's last video. He doesn't block, as yet, and more of the gullible 5001s read his comments.
So this is what I see on my login (I see 3 comments and my first comment adds up to four). When anyone else reads they don't see mine. All are being deceived by apterasolar, as do many other pro-Aptera sites who sell the snake oil.
3 Comments
Aussie ideas man
Add a comment…
@aussieideasman8498 7 hours ago
Click bait title. Aptera didn't steal the show - they weren't invited and couldn't get in. They hung around outside. A couple of photos of a small crowd looking at it isn't enough to fool anyone but the extremely gullible. They pretended to drive to Carmel in a video, and when they were discovered to be on the back of a truck Chris makes a weak excuse in the video you copied.
Reply
@Rich1Rodriguez 3 hours ago
Thanks for posting!
1
Reply
@robinpettit7827 4 hours ago
Glad US Capital is getting some funding for Aptera.
1
Reply
@robinpettit7827 4 hours ago
Good place to go. I suggested Doylestown, PA to Aptera. A lot of rich people around here too.
1
Reply
Think about this all their experience with flux power, the ease of buying a tesla battery pack, or similar ( theres tens of different car battery packs can be picked simply in usa). And as you mention they have only ever ( even with over 100 million in investment) had a 10kwh pack............what the? And it sounds like they were swapping the pack into different vehicles. Might be interesting to work out exactly what is in a 10kwh pack, I guess you could say its 25% or a bit less of the pack they are building now.If I remember correctly 26 cells in parallel, so that would mean 6 or so cells in parallel in the packs they have used up to date. The Beta build ( green machine) I suspect that aluminium box sitting in the back is actually the battery pack.........go figure!
You have hit on a simple concept that has been too difficult for all those highly intelligent disciples - swap out the small battery when some money comes in. I am sure the cost of the second and third Alpha's was much higher than the price of a 25kWh battery. If the CEO's didn't do that, then you have a pretty good sign they were scamming. The other Alpha's were barely more than different colours.
No Steve Fambro, the problem is that you misled Accelerators and everyone else with this motor swap. Sandy Munro exposed it back in August 2023 and it took you eleven months to tell the truth. Little Chris publicly declared Sandy was wrong but the truth is out now. You did it because you could not afford to pay anyone to make your hub motors or better yet the suppliers who could likely showed you that they would not work like you expected. The idea that a NDA existed where you could not even tell people how many wheels are powered is ridiculous yet Aptera actually made that claim. If Aptera were honest they would refund Accelerator investments.
"The idea that a NDA existed ...."
This comment shows that you have zero experience with industry.
I admit that I don't have any experience in the silly trike industry, but NDAs make no sense. In the aircraft industry, when we sell a product it is immediately announced (unless it is military). Why? It is good advertisement and it lets potential investors know what we're doing.
@@JoeBManco I have done QC work for both Ford and GM at the desert proving grounds in AZ, and visited many automotive factories in the US, Europe, and Japan. I have always had to sign an NDA before setting grounds on their properties. Otherwise I would have many interesting stories I could tell. Perhaps they "make no sense" to you but is common practice. Investors also often make everyone in a startup sign an NDA before they will invest.
@@n.brucenelson5920 Then why was the NDA allowed to expire before the silly trike was sold to customers? What you said makes sense for Ford and GM while testing a new design. It doesn't make sense when an NDA is only good for a set period without a product launch.
@@JoeBManco I had to sign an NDA when I visited Aptera regarding some details of the cooling system.
In the case of the parallel testing of a potential alternative to the Elaphe wheel motors, the NDA was required of Aptera by the new potential supplier - this is not unusual at all.
Just a little bit more on sono motors bankruptcy. Its a little bit hard to find information on what happened after bankruptcy, there was a deal offered to investors ( crowdfunding) and those that had paid to reserve a vehicle. The offer was payments in 3 parts over 2 years,
so they took their money but to get it back was going to be more difficult.
Since its a german company also makes a bit hard to get info in english, but heres is a german guy that has captions which you can change into english on youtube.
ruclips.net/video/QxdYfnFFBxI/видео.html
It seems that getting your making back landed up not being a simple process as was first made out, I dont have all the information, but seems there was alot of investors not happy with the situation. Also there share price of course went down to less than a dollar us, and not sure if they got delisted or not.
Anyhow this is a good lesson for any aptera investors of what might be the possible outcomes in the next year or two.
A strange similarity with Sono is that they decided to drop the Sion and stay in the solar panels for vehicles business, which Aptera is already going that way. I don't know if Sono has succeeded there, but Aptera won't. PolyDrop are going nowhere, too.
@@aussieideasman8498nope not succeeded, the directors gone completely sold bankrupt company to someone else.
@@aussieideasman8498 yorkville is company that bought defunkt sono motors, probably a way to get on the stock exchange is the theory.
@@namenotshown9277 Any info how much the owners received for sale?
@@artsmith103 i read founders salaries were 300k euros per year and value of o.38% after insolvancy sale to yorktown, not sure what the 0.38% related to there was an investors meeting about the buyout i think dec 2023, but my memory might not be accurate on the numbers, there was large transfer of shares in sec filings just after bankruptcy
At the 49min 17 sec mark in the sono-motors video, one of the founders, is asking the people who made a deposit, to pay the whole amount of the vehicle and they will recieve teh car in 12 to 18 months. They really wanted the money, some ideas for aptera to use when they are at getting near bankrupt. This is so much like aptera its not funny.
ruclips.net/video/yNLcwX3e60c/видео.html
Did they ask for crypto and retiree nest eggs?
@@aussieideasman8498 yes and first born child also
@@namenotshown9277 - They did it wrong. Should have been non refundable like Elio did. They raised $26M with non refundable. They even got just over 21K people to sign a commit to buy (which means, anything Elio makes, they must buy it). That was a plan I thought was way better. Then you only need to give back the refundables and for the rest, it's yours to use.
@@aussieideasman8498 - I would ask them for the title to your house and then put a lien on it.
I also think that they should require the Ambassadors to go to the plant and work for free. This way it would free up Jerry to do some real work as opposed to driving around the Chevy truck and whatever he also does to keep the place functional.