This level of carbon buildup on a car with so few miles and so well maintained, whilst not a 1st world problem, is still worriesome for an owner. If you want your engine running it’s absolute best this a constant time effort and cost that most ‘normal’ owners would never factor into its ownership.
Lynx Star Automotive Yeah it’s interesting on the gen 3s versions. My bro’s 15 S3 always had a rough cold start idle like miss fires from new, my 16 R (24k miles atm) never had any of it like my bro’s. My friends 16 R is at 63k & it sounds literally the same like mine. (Plans to diy at 65k). From what I’ve seen & witnessed, the gen1/2 would carbon deposits like no other ~30k while the gen3 being more reliable seems to be having carbon issues anywhere from 60-80k. Luckily we don’t have timing chain issues but the dreaded water pump remains the same.
In europe volkswagen even puts rear torsion beam suspension on the entry levels golf while they didn’t on previous generations. They really cheap out on every generation if you look into it. In terms of reliability they do really good here honestly in America they are probably not build as well or have a different tune because the only people complaining about Volkswagen seem to be Americans.
@@JMNTN ın europe all mqb platform cars under 150 hp sold with torsion beam rear end until mk 7.5 i dont know the new generation. I have a 2016 seat leon 1.6 tdi 110 hp 5 speed manuel with torsion rear. Seat is the cheaper brand of vag group and leon is more sportier design golf. Beside all other design and engineering flaws worst one is rear suspension. Comfort level is lower than all rival cars. Thats why i will never buy a vag group car again. Fuel milage is very good around 40 to 45 mpg diesel but there is a clicking bomb comes standart with new tdi engines. Emission equipment. You must be sure your egr system dpf etc gonna hurt your wallet.
I have TSI engine. Okey it's not 2.0 Golf R. It is 1.2 but still I have driven 110 000 kilometers and I have zero issues with the engine. I usually use regular 95 octane gas. I used maybe 3 full tanks of 100 octane in my life with this engine.
@@Romif_SK early 1.2 tsi engines are prone to timing chain failure resulting engine replacement. 1.2 get better later. Now i wonder what will happen to 1.0 tsi
Got memes? I believe it’s because 1) they aren’t as well made here, 2) parts cost more here, 3) people don’t know how to work on them here so it costs more, 4) we drive WAY more then you guys do so you wear out cars faster if they aren’t as well made. For example a car in the US should make it to 200+ thousand miles with minimal problems for it to be considered reliable. Whereas in Europe it seems like most people only go for 100 thousand ish.
I am absolutely appalled at how carbon-fouled the intake runners, cylinder heads, injectors, and especially the valve stems are. I've seen old engines with 150K with less carbon deposits. Is this progress? GDI is an inherently flawed design, regardless of the power/efficiency gains. When an expensive service like de-carboning is required maintenance, that offsets any efficiency gains, at least from a maintenance cost perspective. VW and other makers need to put catch-cans and part-time upstream injectors to clean the system out! Ridiculous! BTW - great video as always Charles - keep safe brother!
This is mainly an European car manufacturer problem. Not an issue with Japanese and some domestic cars i.e 2019 Mustang GT 5.0 actually has 16 injectors using multi-port injection. Uses port injection for cruise and low load, direct for high rpm high loads
Mike TeeVee this is more a problem in the US, because of EPA standard, the intake manifold has four holes for four extra injectors THAt are supposed to spray fuel over the valves to clean them but unfortunately we don’t get that in the US
@@d1zguy864 The euro spec golfs get dual injection, for some reason we don't get that system in North America. Maybe because of emissions or something.
What's interesting is I did the same thing to my Australian delivered Golf R Mk7. Thankfully, we have Multi-port Injection (Direct and Port Injection). After 66,000 Km there was basically no carbon build up at all!! Crazy how the US market only got direct injection. Anyway, nice to confirm MPI works to correct any carbon from building up
BC of the few communist states we have and their laws on emissions like California the whole country has to suffer many stupid things that don’t make sense. And the dealerships over here make a fortune to do anything especially carbon cleaning. Its all rigged to be flawed
Well in this engine the fuel doesn't come in contact with the valves so, yes treatments won't have any effect in this engine because it is direct injected. If you had a port injected engine then those things may help.
@@Cimone90 Using CRC GDI Intake Valve cleaner through the manifold helps a great deal. I own a 2015 Golf R @ 52k and have never had a misfire. Have only done that treatment twice though. I drive my car hard as well.
No. They still clean as advertised but the injectors are "directly" in the cylinders, hence the name Direct Injection. A catch can to minimize oil contaminants in the intake system and CRC intake manifold/valve cleaner will be your easiest solution to keeping the valves clean.
From what I understand, Toyota uses 2 injectors per cylinder (D4-S) for some engines. One direct injection and one port injection, just to avoid this exact issue.
Toyota is also the few manufactures that pretty much skipped the Direct injection phase and went straight to dual injection. I guess it wasn't reliable enough for their standards to justify the power gains.
@@sl0907 Lexus learned their lesson with the 250. My GS 350 has D4-s. I did a bore-scope and it looks new after 100K. I do use techron but probably not needed.
alb12345672 I do not work on Toyotas, but I read an article on their dual injection system, and it is much more intricate than just spraying to keep the valves clean. The system switches between both injection types depending on many factors. Load, a/f ratio readings, throttle position, temperature, etc. Seems at idle the system mostly uses the port side. Under heavy load, and cold start it uses the GDI. While cruising, the system varies.
I used easy off on my B7 let it soak ........ cleaned it with a tooth brush and re installed my intake and did a Wins intake foam cleaner and after the clean sweep through the vacuome hose of the purge solenoid , 20 km road test and finished with a oil change and filter...... haven’t touched my R yet because I’ve only done 3K km so far, but it was worth all that work........ but I do have to say that it sad to have to do all this work on a higher end vehicle after spending so much for the car........ when you have cheaper cost vehicles that don’t require any of this in there lifetime, and we have to use fuels the don’t have ethanol....... I like the way you work, I am the same way and I love detailed work....... nice video
I found it very interesting to see "dirt" patterns on the fuel injectors, and I agree with you that it is likely related to the in-cylinder airflow. I used to observe something similar (in my case, dirt from unburnt fuel) on a transparent single-cylinder research engine I worked on. Carbon build up occurred every time we fired the engine, it was visible on the cylinder wall, head, etc and would change patterns slightly between port-injection and direct-injection systems.
The only way to stop this is to route the blow-by to a separate collection reservoir that is removable for maintenance of emptying and cleaning on a regular basis. Like oil changes with a warning system in case of overfill or clogging. That goo should never be introduced to the intake ports.
Wow.....here is the best VW tech.....doing everything possible with his extensive knowledge. The carbon build up is dramatic at such early mileage. Those of us who are just car enthusiasts don’t have a chance. Charles what mileage would you recommend for those of us who have to pay a professional and balance cost vs the preventive maintenance interval? 2019 R Thanks....John
@@Nick-GR VW is ok. Its that theyvlike to stick in the past and have to obey the EU like a good little dog. Port injection shouldn't have been phased out
Ive used seafoam through the intake air temp sensor of my wifes car since the last carbon clean 30k miles ago. I use it every 3 months or so. But i dont want to pull the intake to see if it works
I would be interested to see how this differs from the eurospec multiport injection engines, or with an aftermarket multiport kit such as the one offered by APR.
@Matthew Dunlap do you know how EFFECTIVE is the EU multiport injection system ? does it completely solve the carbon build up ? ( I'm asking you this because I'm aiming to but a 50K miles Passat B8 here in Argentina which comes imported from Germany plant and I already confirmed that it DOES have the direct+indirect injection manifold... but... is it 100% EFFECTIVE against carbon buildups ?
@@opablo_gm I can't say for sure how effective it is. Most fuel has additives for cleaning, and fuel itself can act as a solvent on the carbon. It may not be 100% effective, but it should be much better than direct injection.
@@MatthewGDunlap Yes its 100% efektive! Even on high milege cars intake is clean, i speak about 250k km cars! Its clean because of that system inject the fuel in intake valve, if carbon wich is not burn in cilinder goes in intake then fuel wich is injected in intake clean it and then no problem, its self cleaner(mpi). But speaking of Golf R even the European version of 2019 post WLTP emision regulation doesnt have mpi, it have just like american golfs direct incjection! So the problem is the same! Only pre WLTP cars version with 300hp prefacelift and facelift version with 310hp in Europe have mpi. Favelifted version with 300hp(post WLTP) doesnt have one! Its a shame on VW to do this in order to cost saving!
trader 247 Although high mileage is relative, higher mileage in the states means 250k miles. That’s only around 156k miles. It’s still a lot but it isn’t as much as we consider high mileage.
@@shadowthesi Yeah u r right! But because here is video of Golf R wich is performance car, 250k km is a high mileage! So if in that condition doesnt have a problem, thats it problem is solved with mpi!
@@MrTheHillfolk I own a 5-door 1987 pre facelift MK2 golf 1.6 with a Weber carb ,and a 3-door facelift 1988 MK2 golf GT 1.8 also with a Weber carb 😁 Both are great!
There's a part of me that's drawn to VWs and occasionally I think that maybe a Golf or a Jetta would be a good new car, but Charles does a pretty good job of bringing me back down to earth and remembering why I shouldn't do that. :D I'll stick with my '68 Beetle and if something like a Scirocco or a MkI or II Rabbit/Golf/Jetta comes my way I wouldn't say no, but other than that....
Direct injection is garbage other than marginal fuel efficiency which is sacrificed by users demanding more power and bigger, heavier vehicles. Change my mind. Sold my other car to buy a 1st gen Insight. 60 to 80 mpg, 995cc, 1800 lb, can go 400,000 to 800,000 miles without a rebuild.
@@VndNvwYvvSvv Agree completely about GDI...that's why I'm either considering one of the handful of MPFI cars left on the market or restoring something older for my next daily driver to meet my rather modest needs
Thank you for showing yet another argument to not buy a VW. My father bought a second hand Passat recently and the parts cost and complexity to repair basic things like a water pump are just a hard pass.
life in plastic, its crack tastic . god if they could make the block out of plastic they would, as much as i love the mk7 once it goes past 250k or a a few years, id imagine its going straight to the junkyard :
All those plastic parts though are soon available as cheaper pattern parts, simply because of that. Even the dealers buy them as well, especially for older vehicles.
they sure are lighter weight, though! Man when I pulled the dual-runner intake manifold off my Integra, even though it's aluminum, that thing was a BEAST!
HumbleMechanic Every VW/Audi should have this cleaning acknowledged as part of interval service manual. Plus be upfront that these vehicles will need this procedure done every ~20k to maintain its function and reliability at owners expense.....or they could just fix it in entirety by fitting direct and port injection for the future vehicles.
This and the ridiculous oil consumption due to poor seals just gets ignored by them. They don't care because by the time it goes bang the warranty will have expired.
@@BlatentlyFakeName Audi did a rering job on my 2.0 TFSI free of charge nearly 20K after waranty was up. I also did not qualify under the bad piston class action suit but they did it anyways. Audi does care.
Humble, as always thanks for all wonderful insight and details. Getting ready to media blast (on your recommend) on the old b7 before I load her up with a new set of rs4 injectors.
Seems that VW's have lots of issues these days. It's a shame because my first car back in the mid 80s was a 72 VW beetle. I drove it for 6 years. I learned a lot about cars during that time. Ended up rebuilding in on the back deck on an old coffee table. Enjoy your videos.
This is very eye opening! I love watching your videos because i get so intimidated to attempt this type of work on my own vehicle's. Your skills and knowledge are priceless.
Could it be something in the design i got to say Hyundai GDI engine didn't seem to have nearly as much issues with carboning or starting related carboning issues.. Run one 90K seems it have as much power as the day i got it.. cheap gas, lots a short trips engine not fully warmed, 3rd coldest region in the world, 4000 feet above sea level, mountainous full throttle climbs.. seems to be holding together, got another turbo GDI and a V6, my neighbour bought a high mileage one and his is doing well also no issues
Ridiculous considering how much development the engine has had over a century..and yet we get carbon buildup like this due to eco considerations..and not enough thoughtful engineering regarding this known problem..
Aftermarket catch can should take care of it nicely. Once you see how much gunk collects every 3-5k (empty mine with each oil change) it’s no wonder you get so much build up in there. Anyway great video as usual!
93K on my 2011 Gti and can't imagine how mine are. Used the CRC stuff through the air mass meter along with Techron for the injectors(pre-oil change) and I've managed to convince myself that I can feel the difference.
The benefits of direct injection petrol are outweighed by the disadvantages in my opinion. After 10k miles that’s way worse than I’d have hoped if it was my car, and this issue could probably easily be avoided just by something as simple as having an extra rail of indirect injectors that are set up to inject during cold starts, or something along those lines. It’s not even like it’s a new design that’s got teething problems, this has been an issue on just about all GDI engines since they were introduced.
Damn... This guy was super careful with all those treatments and WOT pulls to keep his low mileage engine as clean as possible and still there was significant build up... I'll keep running my port injected engine. No direct injection for me for as long as possible, thanks.
I have seen a lot of theories about what causes most of this carbon build up, and lot of folks believe it is contaminated oil from the PCV and try using oil catch cans to prevent it. However, I have seen where these catch cans are used and still they see the same level of carbon deposits. Then I also see where cars that are driven lightly seem to get a lot more carbon build up compared to cars that are regularly driven hard, and folks attribute the difference to the so called "Italian tune up" believing that the higher heat/velocity cleans out the system. However, I can't help but think that most of these carbon deposits are caused by the EGR system. It seems to fit with the light vs hard driving differences many have observed given that the EGR is only open under light driving conditions and closes under boost. Also if you have ever seen how badly those EGR valves can get clogged with carbon build up... I know it helps emissions, but how much of a difference is it really? I don't think there is any easy way to switch it off or bypass it without the CPU throwing alarms, but it would be an interesting test if there was a way to do it. I am curious what you think about all of this?
Thanks Charles, for highlighting the carbon buildup problem with these GDI engines. GDI has always seemed to me like a superior fuel induction technology for gasoline engines in theory, but the practical aspects of its maintenance drawbacks seem to nullify its advantages to a large degree. The hybrid injection systems, like on the gen 3 Ford Coyote 5.0 engines, seem like a good solution. I do like the more precise fuel metering capabilities with GDI NA engines being able to run higher compression ratios. I think it would be interesting to test the effectiveness of oil catch cans in reducing intake tract deposit buildup on engines with and without the cans over a prolonged period. It might give some insight into the contribution that cylinder blowby vapors are making in the formation of carbon deposits on the intake valve faces.
My Shop has been using the 3C machine by ATS Carbon Clean for a few months now. It way faster than walnut blasting and super effective. VW engines are the worst for carbon build-up.
I think the fuel quality plays a big role in here. we in germany have 1.2 ltr turbo toyotas with direct injection. most of them run perfectly fine. some are terribly bad. completly gunked up, it even cuts out. with 40.000 km's these engines need some catch cans or like an old scool central fuel injector, just for cleaning. but its a toyota. you remove the intake in 5 minutes.
I'm glad and saddened you took the time to do this. I was hoping for less buildup at 10k but I am a firm believer in low VOC synthetic and periodic highway drives of 3-4 hours to minimize in these powerplants. Great work sire.
Elmo Villaseñor They make additives that slow down the buildup and help clean some of it off. Check out ATP AT-100. You add it to the vacuum line and it doesn’t result in smoke like CRC or other products do.
DigBipper188 apparently European models do not have this problem but vw is made cheap in Mexico for the North American market I’m guessing they try to save every penny
Its surprising VW still designs their engines to buildup so bad. I have an '18 Chevrolet Colorado and luckily GM redesigned the engine for '17+ and added an oil catcher/seperator in the LGZ engine. Got a guy on a forum giving updates and the egr system is bone dry with no oily mess. I do want to shove my camera scope down the intake to check mine now that Im almost at 30k.
Good video!!! I think the problem with this type of engines would be resolve with an oil catch cam instalation. In my opinion vw isn't interested to put it OEM because you have to empty it in a more or less period of time, and this isn't glamorous for your reputation like brand.
I remember pulling the intake manifold off my MK6 GTI at 240,000km and the carbon was caked on! Cylinder 2 suffered the most because airflow from the PCV port is closest to that cylinder. Mind you the car has probably never had carbon cleaned off before.
It only surprises me because the gen 3 EA888 isn’t like the one before. Had tons of low mile intakes off for the fuel line recall. This is probably among the worst.
Oh man. I have a 2017 GTI that has just ticked over 45k miles. Now I'm curious how much carbon has built up. It's got a track day and numerous autocrosses under its belt and I've done all my oil changes around 5-6k miles with Liquimoly. Luckily, I haven't had any idle problems or misfires. I was hoping the carbon cleaning wouldn't be needed until 100k miles or until symptoms arise. Thanks for making this video!
Great video, looking forward to the intake removal/install video. Any concerns about carbon deposits inside the combustion chamber? If the injectors are in the combustion chamber, and they looked dirty... I have a 2017 and at 27K I used a bore scope through the intake temp sensor hole and they looked similar to what I see in your video. I just used a can of CRC intake valve cleaner and sprayed it through the same temp sensor hole per the instructions. They cleaned up almost as good as yours, i posted some pics here: forums.vwvortex.com/showthread.php?6926800-What-did-you-do-to-your-Golf-R-today&p=113536637&viewfull=1#post113536637
Your comments and pictures are very useful, i appreciate that. Been driving really short distances for the past year and done almost 3500 miles. It is time for my annual service (oil and oil filter change, air filter...) and probably will use the CRC next year when i will be at hopefully 10000 miles. BTW i own Tuscon 1.6 TGDI 6spd Manual.
So I'm using Ceratec on my new Porsche 992 .. I put it in right at new, and have been doing it for every 5K... now the car, even though it's direct injected, doesn't really cake up the intakes... but do you think modifying the oil content with our Ceratec could worsen this since oil's now are being designed for GDI engines specifically? How did your oil analysis come back with the Ceratec?
I'm surprised when anyone mentions Shell as a top tier fuel since back in the late 90's, they were some of the worst according to my father. He was a mechanical engineer and did extensive testing and quality control related tests for different chemical companies and testing products ranging from household products like shampoos to products like gasoline. He was always a fan of Exxon. Of course, over time, things may have changed. Maybe now, Shell IS top tier. I don't know. He retired in the early 2000's. Just an interesting thought.
In the tank cleaners are a waste of money. I use crc turbo and intake valve cleaner. You spray in before the turbo, it cleans off oil residue on the turbo. The spray also clean the carbon on the intake valves. I use the spray every oil change which is 7k miles.
Gen 3 pcv when working correctly doesn’t need a catch can. I’ve had one for 2 years and it’s been dry the whole time. It’s also bad for your seals, it’ll increase crankcase pressure
1kleineMax1 yeah it will, the line bottle necks. I installed it from pcv to the turbo inlet pipe. I know how it works. The only people who have had oil in their catchcans on the ea888 gen 3 either deleted the pcv or they had a failing one.
Anthony RS What do you mean by “line bottle necks”? The catch can is simply a chamber inline. Does nothing to crankcase pressure. Gen 3’s still carb up the valves. I’ve done induction services on Gen 3’s a plenty. Plus look at this very video. Charle’s car has 10k miles, and the valves were sooted up nice!
Great video. I am surprised that at 10k that you had carbon buildup. That seems soon to me. I have been told that usually happens at around 3 years or 30k. Has your car been driven locally or on long drips or a combination of both? Maybe it has to do with that it is not Port injected and a GDI engine. But I guess this video shows that fuel cleansers don't work.
My '02 Audi A4 1.8T with 225k km has no carbon on the valves at all, literally. MPI with good gas (I use Shell V-Power) shouldn't have any carbon on the intake valves.
If you haven’t seen this link, it is interesting to see how the EA888 engine actually seems to run on regular gas just as well as premium fuel. ruclips.net/video/mN6Yz8I7Gyo/видео.html
lol 10k miles? There's literally almost no carbon in there. Try cleaning your head at 130k like I did. My MKV GTI still ran fine and got good mpg, the only thing wrong was *slightly* sloppy cold starts. You don't have to worry about carbon under 80k miles because its FORCED induction, the air is gonna get pushed in there no matter what, and the only time you have to worry about carbon is when its literally looking like a cave with large stalactites and causes turbulent flow, and even then, the car will still run fine. Carbon buildup inst that big of a deal. Look at this link to see what i mean: www.reddit.com/r/GolfGTI/comments/aamrgx/before_and_after_carbon_cleaning/
I’ve seen plenty of engines WAY below 80k with severe cold start misfires. Just because it’s not enough to cause a noticeable issue doesn’t mean it’s not causing an issue.
You should just go on the Autobahn ;-). 250km/h for 5-10km and it‘s clean. An Engine like this is Designed to work hard and Not to deliver the Full power for just 5sec. Just like the TDI‘s, these engines produce tons of carbon during Heavy, Short acceleration.
This is super interesting... thanks for taking the time to open up the intake side on a virtually new engine. I wonder... with DI fuel delivery, will there ever be a way to prevent this sort of build-up from happening? Unless you add manifold injection to your DI-engine (as some manufacturers are doing AFAIK), isn't this sort of behaviour "built into" the very concept of direct injection? All the cleaning properties of all the fuel and of all the V-Power additives in the world won't do you any good if the fuel never even touches the intake and intake valves ....
Does this only apply to North America cars? I have a Europe built Golf R -18. I think it has something called MPI that has both direct injected and port injected?
@HumbleMechanic Do you think 🤔 stage 2 tune is contributing to the carbon buildup? (extra boost = extra blow by = extra crankcase gunk through the intake?) Catch can time?
I would think the Italian tune up would help prevent the carbon build up by going with a stage 2. Looks like the carbon build up is simply just still an issue since we don't get dual port injection in the US. Sad...
Do not use scotchbrite. Please. It gets embedded in bearings and causes wear you will never see. Just move the engine until the intake valves are closed then soak, use the nylon brush or zip ties and suck with a vacuum. Quite honestly, regular use of ventil sauber per bmw/vw group process will have you keeping them intake valves clean. Justmy .02 (Bosch auto engr. GM journeyman, L1 master since '96.
Good video bro and always love the work you do!! Keep it going. Also just did my injectors and a carbon clean on my 2015 gti at 43k miles. One injector was bad so I figured do the carbon clean while your there.
I believe something such as CRC would be perfect for an application like this. There's such a thin layer of carbon I believe it would be able to clean those values very well. Too many people use CRC at such high mileage that there's no hope but to use something such as walnut blasting. Also It's funny because just the other week I was looking for information on low mileage carbon build up and this video was just want I needed, thanks for the quality content!
@@HumbleMechanic exactly, once I get my GTI in the next couple months I plan on doing intake cleaning every 5-10,000 miles so hopefully I'll never need to take the intake manifold off
@@garrettbundy1810 not same brand, but I've used CRC spray on my GLA since 2015 to 2020, and did not have issues. I have a GLC300 now and continue the same trend, every 6 months 1/2 can CRC let it soak, drive it. I WOT a lot too and always use quality oil meeting the specs. Again, different 4 cylinder brand and design, I know the Mercedes PVC system is far superior to others on the market. But I've never had an issue, and intakes were always clean enough.
Charles #1 "You are the Man" ! Thank you for the always fantastic and helpful content. As for preventing carbon build up do you think any of the following would help? #1 a manifold introduced cleaning such as Seafoam introduced into the manifold through say the sensor hole on top. Running vehicle while introducing the cleaner ? #2 a meth injection system as it to also is dispersed into the manifold to mix with the air being introduced into the cylinder #3 is there a "fix" design to say split the injectors, 8 instead of 4. Where 4 are intoduducing fuel in traditional injection while the other 4 are introducing fuel via direct injection? If I am not mistaken I thought the Golf R sold in Germany for a period of time had the 8 injectors instead of just the 4 direct injection.
Lets give credit where credit is due....although the phrase has been around for a long time, Eric O is the youtuber who made it what it is today! And as far as that carbon build up goes, I can think of another DR. O idiom..."Theres your problem lady"
Although it might me just poor engineering, but open throttle at 5000 rpms, staying at 200 km/h for 2 hours here in Germany on the autobahn does wonders for all types of engines.
0W-20 is what most performance FI motors recommend and it's not an issue in terms of carbon build up, oil dilution would be my biggest concern which can be mitigated by frequent oil changes or going to something like 5W30.
@@Irishluckily BMW typically recommends 0W20 for their motors but I'm not sure about Mercedes. Either way the weight of oil can change depending on your location, recommended oil manufacturer and what type of oil you pick up by a small amount. The most important is location however, up here in Canada we tend to recommend thinner oils for winter starts when it's -30 outside.
@@Irishluckily Hah yeah your pretty close to the boarder so you get similar weather, my roommate has a Mk6 GTI he runs almost exclusively 5w40. He did try 5W30 this winter but was actually starting to develop some noise on cold-starts, swapped back to 5w40 and ran as normal. So thinking his generation of motor was just very particular about oil weight.
54k on my 17’ GLI. Probably don’t want to know what the inside of my crank case looks like. Of course I’m overdue for a DSG service too. So I’m batting .1000 on owner responsibility lol.,.
I sometimes use a maglite through the sparkplug channel which can highlite the valves being fully closed prior to cleaning the ports. You can easily spot any signs of light between a partially closed valve & it's seat.
@@HumbleMechanic absolutely, wasn't being critical my friend, just adding a little to the thread, especially if any of your viewers were going to say that they filled the ports with cleaner & it all vanished! 😄
I would love to see you do a video on some of these additive products, specifically the Liqui Moly stuff. Would be interested in seeing pros and cons and if they really are even worth it.
Canadian viewer. I am an office jockey for work so humbly admit my knowledge of vehicles can be described as basic, at best. This is likely a simple question to most of the viewers but when the oil is changed it is darker than when it was put in. What makes the oil dirty over time? Is it from carbon, or? Thanks.
This level of carbon buildup on a car with so few miles and so well maintained, whilst not a 1st world problem, is still worriesome for an owner. If you want your engine running it’s absolute best this a constant time effort and cost that most ‘normal’ owners would never factor into its ownership.
I am currently working on the Injector and Manifold DIY!!! Should have those up for you guys soon
I'm holding my breath for it......don't kill me!
@@tonijohnson09 LOL I am working on it now. It's a big in-depth video
@@HumbleMechanic thanks so much for all you do! I've been waiting for this video!
@@HumbleMechanic 😳🤤.......you will not understand how 'on-time' these videos are. Blessings 🙏
This engine is 2.0 TSI?
My 2018 S3 is approaching 30K miles.
This amount of carbon buildup is alarming.
Rob L. If you haven’t done any type of autox you won’t see heavy build up. Autox is a real issue with the oem pcv valve...
@@markd3891 You don't know what you're talking about do you?
Olle Jansson I own a 16 R dsg. Maybe the way I explained wasn’t too great. All DI engines will built up carbon eventually.
At 30k you are close to beginning stages of clod start misfires. I always push the induction service on my customers every 30k.
Lynx Star Automotive Yeah it’s interesting on the gen 3s versions. My bro’s 15 S3 always had a rough cold start idle like miss fires from new, my 16 R (24k miles atm) never had any of it like my bro’s. My friends 16 R is at 63k & it sounds literally the same like mine. (Plans to diy at 65k). From what I’ve seen & witnessed, the gen1/2 would carbon deposits like no other ~30k while the gen3 being more reliable seems to be having carbon issues anywhere from 60-80k. Luckily we don’t have timing chain issues but the dreaded water pump remains the same.
Truly shocking engineering. Going back to the 70s when we had to pull the cylinder head off every 10-20 k miles to do a decoke. Not progress.
In europe volkswagen even puts rear torsion beam suspension on the entry levels golf while they didn’t on previous generations. They really cheap out on every generation if you look into it.
In terms of reliability they do really good here honestly in America they are probably not build as well or have a different tune because the only people complaining about Volkswagen seem to be Americans.
@@JMNTN ın europe all mqb platform cars under 150 hp sold with torsion beam rear end until mk 7.5 i dont know the new generation. I have a 2016 seat leon 1.6 tdi 110 hp 5 speed manuel with torsion rear. Seat is the cheaper brand of vag group and leon is more sportier design golf. Beside all other design and engineering flaws worst one is rear suspension. Comfort level is lower than all rival cars. Thats why i will never buy a vag group car again. Fuel milage is very good around 40 to 45 mpg diesel but there is a clicking bomb comes standart with new tdi engines. Emission equipment. You must be sure your egr system dpf etc gonna hurt your wallet.
I have TSI engine. Okey it's not 2.0 Golf R. It is 1.2 but still I have driven 110 000 kilometers and I have zero issues with the engine. I usually use regular 95 octane gas. I used maybe 3 full tanks of 100 octane in my life with this engine.
@@Romif_SK early 1.2 tsi engines are prone to timing chain failure resulting engine replacement. 1.2 get better later. Now i wonder what will happen to 1.0 tsi
Got memes? I believe it’s because 1) they aren’t as well made here, 2) parts cost more here, 3) people don’t know how to work on them here so it costs more, 4) we drive WAY more then you guys do so you wear out cars faster if they aren’t as well made. For example a car in the US should make it to 200+ thousand miles with minimal problems for it to be considered reliable. Whereas in Europe it seems like most people only go for 100 thousand ish.
VW needs to have a dual-fuel injection for the USA. This is an unnecessary headache left for the customer to deal with.
I am absolutely appalled at how carbon-fouled the intake runners, cylinder heads, injectors, and especially the valve stems are. I've seen old engines with 150K with less carbon deposits. Is this progress?
GDI is an inherently flawed design, regardless of the power/efficiency gains. When an expensive service like de-carboning is required maintenance, that offsets any efficiency gains, at least from a maintenance cost perspective.
VW and other makers need to put catch-cans and part-time upstream injectors to clean the system out! Ridiculous!
BTW - great video as always Charles - keep safe brother!
No, it's moronic engineers who thought they had a great idea. A liberal college education at its best...lol.
@@icanfartloud wellllllll i'd like to see you design an engine. or would you need a "liberal college education" for that? lol
This is mainly an European car manufacturer problem. Not an issue with Japanese and some domestic cars i.e 2019 Mustang GT 5.0 actually has 16 injectors using multi-port injection. Uses port injection for cruise and low load, direct for high rpm high loads
Mike TeeVee this is more a problem in the US, because of EPA standard, the intake manifold has four holes for four extra injectors THAt are supposed to spray fuel over the valves to clean them but unfortunately we don’t get that in the US
@@d1zguy864 The euro spec golfs get dual injection, for some reason we don't get that system in North America. Maybe because of emissions or something.
This is what I like about the Toyota system, a cross between direct direction and port injection to keep the valves clean.
Yep extra injectors to keep the valves clean and use more fuel
Europe gets a secondary fuel rail(with lots of other perks) which eliminates carbon buildup problems, idk why US still not worthy...
Doesn't the Subaru BRZ/Toyota 86 have both direct and port injection in the US?
You would think they would make it dual injection considering how they might payout if something big happens within the 6 year warranty period.
Aleksander Rysiewicz yup it has Toyota’s D4S so both port and direct
Yeah i have a 1.8tsi ea888 gen 3 in my car in the uk and it has dual injection, 2 per cylinder.
@@calm7677 They also make like 140-150 to the wheels.
What's interesting is I did the same thing to my Australian delivered Golf R Mk7. Thankfully, we have Multi-port Injection (Direct and Port Injection). After 66,000 Km there was basically no carbon build up at all!! Crazy how the US market only got direct injection. Anyway, nice to confirm MPI works to correct any carbon from building up
BC of the few communist states we have and their laws on emissions like California the whole country has to suffer many stupid things that don’t make sense. And the dealerships over here make a fortune to do anything especially carbon cleaning. Its all rigged to be flawed
So v power and treatments are a waste of money. Save it for a carbon cleaning.
Well in this engine the fuel doesn't come in contact with the valves so, yes treatments won't have any effect in this engine because it is direct injected. If you had a port injected engine then those things may help.
@@Cimone90 what about pistons heads and injectors? They benefit from Vpower and cleaning treatments
@@maxdruciak2724 yup. You're right they do a bit.
@@Cimone90 Using CRC GDI Intake Valve cleaner through the manifold helps a great deal. I own a 2015 Golf R @ 52k and have never had a misfire. Have only done that treatment twice though. I drive my car hard as well.
No. They still clean as advertised but the injectors are "directly" in the cylinders, hence the name Direct Injection.
A catch can to minimize oil contaminants in the intake system and CRC intake manifold/valve cleaner will be your easiest solution to keeping the valves clean.
I have a MK6 GTI and live close to you. Any interest in taking a look at that for a video?
You should do an induction style cleaning at the next 10k to see if it makes a difference.
I'm lucky I live in Europe. And these engines have Port injection also.
2019 onward don’t have MPI anymore in EU/UK.
Do you know if the 1.8 engine in Europe are mpi?
@@KasamS I believe so.
@@cfbm125 lucky mines 2016 😉
Alan Ton Same here, my GTI is a 2016 also🙂.
>laughs in port injection 1.8t
*laughs in throttle body injection*
Thank you for making this nice video surprise how carbon can get build-up this much even the car being taken good care of.
From what I understand, Toyota uses 2 injectors per cylinder (D4-S) for some engines. One direct injection and one port injection, just to avoid this exact issue.
Euro market ea888s have that also
Toyota is also the few manufactures that pretty much skipped the Direct injection phase and went straight to dual injection. I guess it wasn't reliable enough for their standards to justify the power gains.
0812rs VW uses dual injection on the new 3.0
@@sl0907 Lexus learned their lesson with the 250. My GS 350 has D4-s. I did a bore-scope and it looks new after 100K. I do use techron but probably not needed.
alb12345672 I do not work on Toyotas, but I read an article on their dual injection system, and it is much more intricate than just spraying to keep the valves clean. The system switches between both injection types depending on many factors. Load, a/f ratio readings, throttle position, temperature, etc. Seems at idle the system mostly uses the port side. Under heavy load, and cold start it uses the GDI. While cruising, the system varies.
I used easy off on my B7 let it soak ........ cleaned it with a tooth brush and re installed my intake and did a Wins intake foam cleaner and after the clean sweep through the vacuome hose of the purge solenoid , 20 km road test and finished with a oil change and filter...... haven’t touched my R yet because I’ve only done 3K km so far, but it was worth all that work........ but I do have to say that it sad to have to do all this work on a higher end vehicle after spending so much for the car........ when you have cheaper cost vehicles that don’t require any of this in there lifetime, and we have to use fuels the don’t have ethanol....... I like the way you work, I am the same way and I love detailed work....... nice video
I found it very interesting to see "dirt" patterns on the fuel injectors, and I agree with you that it is likely related to the in-cylinder airflow. I used to observe something similar (in my case, dirt from unburnt fuel) on a transparent single-cylinder research engine I worked on. Carbon build up occurred every time we fired the engine, it was visible on the cylinder wall, head, etc and would change patterns slightly between port-injection and direct-injection systems.
The only way to stop this is to route the blow-by to a separate collection reservoir that is removable for maintenance of emptying and cleaning on a regular basis. Like oil changes with a warning system in case of overfill or clogging. That goo should never be introduced to the intake ports.
A simple oil catch can is a must on a direct injected engine.
Water meth injection is also an option when looking for power and longevity.
Water meth, will look like new after a few hundred k of spirited driving with that squirting :)
Wow.....here is the best VW tech.....doing everything possible with his extensive knowledge. The carbon build up is dramatic at such early mileage. Those of us who are just car enthusiasts don’t have a chance. Charles what mileage would you recommend for those of us who have to pay a professional and balance cost vs the preventive maintenance interval? 2019 R Thanks....John
That's crazy that this cleaning even has to be done.
@Private Eyes No, VW sends their crap all over the world. That's because vw are crap in general.
@@Nick-GR VW is ok. Its that theyvlike to stick in the past and have to obey the EU like a good little dog. Port injection shouldn't have been phased out
In US what type of fuel to you get? Euro4 standard and above? I.e 50 ppm of sulphur?
Ive used seafoam through the intake air temp sensor of my wifes car since the last carbon clean 30k miles ago. I use it every 3 months or so. But i dont want to pull the intake to see if it works
I would be interested to see how this differs from the eurospec multiport injection engines, or with an aftermarket multiport kit such as the one offered by APR.
@Matthew Dunlap do you know how EFFECTIVE is the EU multiport injection system ? does it completely solve the carbon build up ? ( I'm asking you this because I'm aiming to but a 50K miles Passat B8 here in Argentina which comes imported from Germany plant and I already confirmed that it DOES have the direct+indirect injection manifold... but... is it 100% EFFECTIVE against carbon buildups ?
@@opablo_gm I can't say for sure how effective it is. Most fuel has additives for cleaning, and fuel itself can act as a solvent on the carbon. It may not be 100% effective, but it should be much better than direct injection.
@@MatthewGDunlap Yes its 100% efektive! Even on high milege cars intake is clean, i speak about 250k km cars! Its clean because of that system inject the fuel in intake valve, if carbon wich is not burn in cilinder goes in intake then fuel wich is injected in intake clean it and then no problem, its self cleaner(mpi). But speaking of Golf R even the European version of 2019 post WLTP emision regulation doesnt have mpi, it have just like american golfs direct incjection! So the problem is the same! Only pre WLTP cars version with 300hp prefacelift and facelift version with 310hp in Europe have mpi. Favelifted version with 300hp(post WLTP) doesnt have one! Its a shame on VW to do this in order to cost saving!
trader 247 Although high mileage is relative, higher mileage in the states means 250k miles. That’s only around 156k miles. It’s still a lot but it isn’t as much as we consider high mileage.
@@shadowthesi Yeah u r right! But because here is video of Golf R wich is performance car, 250k km is a high mileage! So if in that condition doesnt have a problem, thats it problem is solved with mpi!
Wow, not what i would wan't my 10k mile engine looking like. I love Volkswagens but i think ill stick with my 2x MK2 Golfs.
Love my 91 Jetta coupe yoe ,and the 79 round eye diesel 😁 that's in 1000 pieces in the corner
@@MrTheHillfolk I own a 5-door 1987 pre facelift MK2 golf 1.6 with a Weber carb ,and a 3-door facelift 1988 MK2 golf GT 1.8 also with a Weber carb 😁 Both are great!
There's a part of me that's drawn to VWs and occasionally I think that maybe a Golf or a Jetta would be a good new car, but Charles does a pretty good job of bringing me back down to earth and remembering why I shouldn't do that. :D I'll stick with my '68 Beetle and if something like a Scirocco or a MkI or II Rabbit/Golf/Jetta comes my way I wouldn't say no, but other than that....
Direct injection is garbage other than marginal fuel efficiency which is sacrificed by users demanding more power and bigger, heavier vehicles. Change my mind. Sold my other car to buy a 1st gen Insight. 60 to 80 mpg, 995cc, 1800 lb, can go 400,000 to 800,000 miles without a rebuild.
@@VndNvwYvvSvv Agree completely about GDI...that's why I'm either considering one of the handful of MPFI cars left on the market or restoring something older for my next daily driver to meet my rather modest needs
Thank you for showing yet another argument to not buy a VW. My father bought a second hand Passat recently and the parts cost and complexity to repair basic things like a water pump are just a hard pass.
life in plastic, its crack tastic . god if they could make the block out of plastic they would, as much as i love the mk7 once it goes past 250k or a a few years, id imagine its going straight to the junkyard :
Let's hope not LOL
All those plastic parts though are soon available as cheaper pattern parts, simply because of that. Even the dealers buy them as well, especially for older vehicles.
I say the only Golfs that's worth buying is the Diesel one :D no VW gasoline engines for me thanks...
they sure are lighter weight, though! Man when I pulled the dual-runner intake manifold off my Integra, even though it's aluminum, that thing was a BEAST!
@@Patrick94GSR better made though
That’s why some manufacturers added a set of injectors to clean up the valves constantly
Yep. Sad we never got it in the us for vw
I just love how VW doesn’t believe it’s a real issue. It’s just a shame.
They do now. They have a special tool. LOL It's been known for a long time in the service side. both at the dealer and higher up
HumbleMechanic Every VW/Audi should have this cleaning acknowledged as part of interval service manual. Plus be upfront that these vehicles will need this procedure done every ~20k to maintain its function and reliability at owners expense.....or they could just fix it in entirety by fitting direct and port injection for the future vehicles.
This and the ridiculous oil consumption due to poor seals just gets ignored by them. They don't care because by the time it goes bang the warranty will have expired.
@@BlatentlyFakeName Audi did a rering job on my 2.0 TFSI free of charge nearly 20K after waranty was up. I also did not qualify under the bad piston class action suit but they did it anyways. Audi does care.
It's not a real issue to them when there are no problems during the warranty period.
Humble, as always thanks for all wonderful insight and details. Getting ready to media blast (on your recommend) on the old b7 before I load her up with a new set of rs4 injectors.
Dang do I feel good now about having MPI on my 1.8T now 😂
Is that the 20V engine?
Seems that VW's have lots of issues these days. It's a shame because my first car back in the mid 80s was a 72 VW beetle. I drove it for 6 years. I learned a lot about cars during that time. Ended up rebuilding in on the back deck on an old coffee table. Enjoy your videos.
This is very eye opening! I love watching your videos because i get so intimidated to attempt this type of work on my own vehicle's. Your skills and knowledge are priceless.
Could it be something in the design i got to say Hyundai GDI engine didn't seem to have nearly as much issues with carboning or starting related carboning issues.. Run one 90K seems it have as much power as the day i got it.. cheap gas, lots a short trips engine not fully warmed, 3rd coldest region in the world, 4000 feet above sea level, mountainous full throttle climbs.. seems to be holding together, got another turbo GDI and a V6, my neighbour bought a high mileage one and his is doing well also no issues
Ridiculous considering how much development the engine has had over a century..and yet we get carbon buildup like this due to eco considerations..and not enough thoughtful engineering regarding this known problem..
Aftermarket catch can should take care of it nicely. Once you see how much gunk collects every 3-5k (empty mine with each oil change) it’s no wonder you get so much build up in there. Anyway great video as usual!
102,000 miles on my GTI without a clean. Wonder how lovely that looks. No misfire issues and still getting 33mpg 🤷♂️
Well, that's good. My R is at 8800 miles and this video was making me get worried. Still think I might clean it, maybe at 20k or something.
93K on my 2011 Gti and can't imagine how mine are. Used the CRC stuff through the air mass meter along with Techron for the injectors(pre-oil change) and I've managed to convince myself that I can feel the difference.
K C Shhh it'll hear you!!!
@@chris746568462 same here...
How long have you owned it? If you bought it used, I’m willing to wager it has been done by previous owners before you.
Blasting with dry ice pellets works well. No mess.
The benefits of direct injection petrol are outweighed by the disadvantages in my opinion. After 10k miles that’s way worse than I’d have hoped if it was my car, and this issue could probably easily be avoided just by something as simple as having an extra rail of indirect injectors that are set up to inject during cold starts, or something along those lines. It’s not even like it’s a new design that’s got teething problems, this has been an issue on just about all GDI engines since they were introduced.
Forreal
Damn... This guy was super careful with all those treatments and WOT pulls to keep his low mileage engine as clean as possible and still there was significant build up... I'll keep running my port injected engine. No direct injection for me for as long as possible, thanks.
I have seen a lot of theories about what causes most of this carbon build up, and lot of folks believe it is contaminated oil from the PCV and try using oil catch cans to prevent it. However, I have seen where these catch cans are used and still they see the same level of carbon deposits. Then I also see where cars that are driven lightly seem to get a lot more carbon build up compared to cars that are regularly driven hard, and folks attribute the difference to the so called "Italian tune up" believing that the higher heat/velocity cleans out the system.
However, I can't help but think that most of these carbon deposits are caused by the EGR system. It seems to fit with the light vs hard driving differences many have observed given that the EGR is only open under light driving conditions and closes under boost. Also if you have ever seen how badly those EGR valves can get clogged with carbon build up...
I know it helps emissions, but how much of a difference is it really? I don't think there is any easy way to switch it off or bypass it without the CPU throwing alarms, but it would be an interesting test if there was a way to do it.
I am curious what you think about all of this?
Thanks Charles, for highlighting the carbon buildup problem with these GDI engines. GDI has always seemed to me like a superior fuel induction technology for gasoline engines in theory, but the practical aspects of its maintenance drawbacks seem to nullify its advantages to a large degree. The hybrid injection systems, like on the gen 3 Ford Coyote 5.0 engines, seem like a good solution. I do like the more precise fuel metering capabilities with GDI NA engines being able to run higher compression ratios.
I think it would be interesting to test the effectiveness of oil catch cans in reducing intake tract deposit buildup on engines with and without the cans over a prolonged period. It might give some insight into the contribution that cylinder blowby vapors are making in the formation of carbon deposits on the intake valve faces.
My Shop has been using the 3C machine by ATS Carbon Clean for a few months now. It way faster than walnut blasting and super effective. VW engines are the worst for carbon build-up.
ATS has been asking me to test. I need to have them bring one by.
@@HumbleMechanic Highly Recommend it given the opportunity.
Now the test is if those “spray in the intake” carbon cleaners do anything.
Exactly
If they work, all the carbon gets into the cylinders then into the filters but if you use it like once a month may be ok
SHOPDAP.COM did one and it didn't really do a lot. Berrymans was the one they used.
I used my wet dry vac with a MCDs straw taped to the end to suck out the scraped off bits of carbon. it even pulled most of the carb cleaner out too.
NICE!!!
Its vomit worthy when i see plastic intakes, or cam covers like on the c63 amgs!🤮
Hope you realize that plastic intakes have smoother runners than the casted aluminum ones. Also does not act as a heat sink for the motor
Why?
RIP SIC58 its not conducive to longevity , and has a heat cycle limit.
Great DIY tips dude. I would use the rifle barrel cleaning brass brushes to attack the hard carbon muck on intake valves.
Those work GREAT! In fact if my shop wasn't upside down from building the new place, I would have used that. LOL
I'm so glad I still have port injection.
Those are the best videos by far, thanks for your very detail explainings...👍🏼👍🏼👍🏼
I think the fuel quality plays a big role in here.
we in germany have 1.2 ltr turbo toyotas with direct injection.
most of them run perfectly fine.
some are terribly bad. completly gunked up, it even cuts out. with 40.000 km's
these engines need some catch cans or like an old scool central fuel injector, just for cleaning.
but its a toyota. you remove the intake in 5 minutes.
😮😮😮 i really didn't expect it to look that bad..
I'm glad and saddened you took the time to do this. I was hoping for less buildup at 10k but I am a firm believer in low VOC synthetic and periodic highway drives of 3-4 hours to minimize in these powerplants. Great work sire.
My GTX mk5 has cold start misfire, and worry about this. Since then I keep in mind to do full throtole for flush once a day
I don´t want to take apart my intake manifold, so, there´s a way to clean the back of the valves on a TSI engine? my 1.4T getting close to 12k miles.
Elmo Villaseñor They make additives that slow down the buildup and help clean some of it off. Check out ATP AT-100. You add it to the vacuum line and it doesn’t result in smoke like CRC or other products do.
It's also a turbo so that is really not too bad .
VW - Proof that not all German engineering is *good* engineering.
DigBipper188 apparently European models do not have this problem but vw is made cheap in Mexico for the North American market I’m guessing they try to save every penny
Its surprising VW still designs their engines to buildup so bad.
I have an '18 Chevrolet Colorado and luckily GM redesigned the engine for '17+ and added an oil catcher/seperator in the LGZ engine. Got a guy on a forum giving updates and the egr system is bone dry with no oily mess.
I do want to shove my camera scope down the intake to check mine now that Im almost at 30k.
Converted my A3 8P TFSI to port injection. Good bye direct injection misery!
Good video!!! I think the problem with this type of engines would be resolve with an oil catch cam instalation. In my opinion vw isn't interested to put it OEM because you have to empty it in a more or less period of time, and this isn't glamorous for your reputation like brand.
I remember pulling the intake manifold off my MK6 GTI at 240,000km and the carbon was caked on! Cylinder 2 suffered the most because airflow from the PCV port is closest to that cylinder. Mind you the car has probably never had carbon cleaned off before.
Yep 2,3 are usually the worst. That is why I did 1/2 for cleaning. Also the valves were already closed. LOL
Even with all the Extras you did,
Shocking.🇨🇦👍
You’ve been working for Volkswagen for a long time, and that surprises you? Your love for those cars must be large
It only surprises me because the gen 3 EA888 isn’t like the one before. Had tons of low mile intakes off for the fuel line recall. This is probably among the worst.
Oh man. I have a 2017 GTI that has just ticked over 45k miles. Now I'm curious how much carbon has built up. It's got a track day and numerous autocrosses under its belt and I've done all my oil changes around 5-6k miles with Liquimoly. Luckily, I haven't had any idle problems or misfires. I was hoping the carbon cleaning wouldn't be needed until 100k miles or until symptoms arise. Thanks for making this video!
Great video, looking forward to the intake removal/install video.
Any concerns about carbon deposits inside the combustion chamber? If the injectors are in the combustion chamber, and they looked dirty... I have a 2017 and at 27K I used a bore scope through the intake temp sensor hole and they looked similar to what I see in your video. I just used a can of CRC intake valve cleaner and sprayed it through the same temp sensor hole per the instructions. They cleaned up almost as good as yours, i posted some pics here: forums.vwvortex.com/showthread.php?6926800-What-did-you-do-to-your-Golf-R-today&p=113536637&viewfull=1#post113536637
Your comments and pictures are very useful, i appreciate that.
Been driving really short distances for the past year and done almost 3500 miles. It is time for my annual service (oil and oil filter change, air filter...) and
probably will use the CRC next year when i will be at hopefully 10000 miles.
BTW i own Tuscon 1.6 TGDI 6spd Manual.
So I'm using Ceratec on my new Porsche 992 .. I put it in right at new, and have been doing it for every 5K... now the car, even though it's direct injected, doesn't really cake up the intakes... but do you think modifying the oil content with our Ceratec could worsen this since oil's now are being designed for GDI engines specifically? How did your oil analysis come back with the Ceratec?
This is why I got rid of my tiguan, too much carbon build up and random missfires due to it.
I'm surprised when anyone mentions Shell as a top tier fuel since back in the late 90's, they were some of the worst according to my father. He was a mechanical engineer and did extensive testing and quality control related tests for different chemical companies and testing products ranging from household products like shampoos to products like gasoline. He was always a fan of Exxon. Of course, over time, things may have changed. Maybe now, Shell IS top tier. I don't know. He retired in the early 2000's. Just an interesting thought.
Love hate relationship with all these GTIs man smh
In the tank cleaners are a waste of money. I use crc turbo and intake valve cleaner. You spray in before the turbo, it cleans off oil residue on the turbo. The spray also clean the carbon on the intake valves. I use the spray every oil change which is 7k miles.
You have a catch can installed on there too, right? Can't wait for the step by step. My Golf Wagon is probably due for this at 70k.
I dont see a catch can here. He installed one in the Tiguan of his wife a while back. ruclips.net/video/1hvgwXKVdYw/видео.html
Gen 3 pcv when working correctly doesn’t need a catch can. I’ve had one for 2 years and it’s been dry the whole time. It’s also bad for your seals, it’ll increase crankcase pressure
@@Irishluckily A catch can will not increase crankcase pressure, It is just a sepreator that you put in the vent-line that goes back to the intake
1kleineMax1 yeah it will, the line bottle necks. I installed it from pcv to the turbo inlet pipe. I know how it works. The only people who have had oil in their catchcans on the ea888 gen 3 either deleted the pcv or they had a failing one.
Anthony RS What do you mean by “line bottle necks”? The catch can is simply a chamber inline. Does nothing to crankcase pressure.
Gen 3’s still carb up the valves. I’ve done induction services on Gen 3’s a plenty. Plus look at this very video. Charle’s car has 10k miles, and the valves were sooted up nice!
My Mini Cooper S with the new 2.0 BMW engine performs just fine.. 83k miles on the clock and stage 2 with 300hp. Should i be worried?
or...design a good engine from the start
Great video.
I am surprised that at 10k that you had carbon buildup. That seems soon to me. I have been told that usually happens at around 3 years or 30k.
Has your car been driven locally or on long drips or a combination of both?
Maybe it has to do with that it is not Port injected and a GDI engine.
But I guess this video shows that fuel cleansers don't work.
This is Exactly why I have NOT bought a petrol direct injected engine yet. That 10k mile engine looks like a MPI engine with 120k miles
Honestly... I've seen 200k Honda D series engines with less carbon in the intake ports than this.
My '02 Audi A4 1.8T with 225k km has no carbon on the valves at all, literally. MPI with good gas (I use Shell V-Power) shouldn't have any carbon on the intake valves.
120K miles?
Oh you meant 320K miles, easy typo to make.
As always Charles - great video and very helpful.
If you haven’t seen this link, it is interesting to see how the EA888 engine actually seems to run on regular gas just as well as premium fuel. ruclips.net/video/mN6Yz8I7Gyo/видео.html
The only 100% fix for carbon build up, oil consumption and timing problems for all TSI engines is NOT buying one.
Nice video as always! Is there a way to check your valves with an endoscope?
lol 10k miles? There's literally almost no carbon in there. Try cleaning your head at 130k like I did. My MKV GTI still ran fine and got good mpg, the only thing wrong was *slightly* sloppy cold starts. You don't have to worry about carbon under 80k miles because its FORCED induction, the air is gonna get pushed in there no matter what, and the only time you have to worry about carbon is when its literally looking like a cave with large stalactites and causes turbulent flow, and even then, the car will still run fine. Carbon buildup inst that big of a deal. Look at this link to see what i mean:
www.reddit.com/r/GolfGTI/comments/aamrgx/before_and_after_carbon_cleaning/
I’ve seen plenty of engines WAY below 80k with severe cold start misfires.
Just because it’s not enough to cause a noticeable issue doesn’t mean it’s not causing an issue.
You should just go on the Autobahn ;-). 250km/h for 5-10km and it‘s clean. An Engine like this is Designed to work hard and Not to deliver the Full power for just 5sec. Just like the TDI‘s, these engines produce tons of carbon during Heavy, Short acceleration.
Thank you for 60FPS
this is why I don't want to mess with GDI
This is super interesting... thanks for taking the time to open up the intake side on a virtually new engine.
I wonder... with DI fuel delivery, will there ever be a way to prevent this sort of build-up from happening? Unless you add manifold injection to your DI-engine (as some manufacturers are doing AFAIK), isn't this sort of behaviour "built into" the very concept of direct injection? All the cleaning properties of all the fuel and of all the V-Power additives in the world won't do you any good if the fuel never even touches the intake and intake valves ....
Does this only apply to North America cars? I have a Europe built Golf R -18. I think it has something called MPI that has both direct injected and port injected?
@HumbleMechanic Do you think 🤔 stage 2 tune is contributing to the carbon buildup? (extra boost = extra blow by = extra crankcase gunk through the intake?)
Catch can time?
That is possible. Most of the miles were at just stage one or stock. But its possible.
That’s a good question? Forgot you have stage 2. I gotta hunch it might be
I would think the Italian tune up would help prevent the carbon build up by going with a stage 2. Looks like the carbon build up is simply just still an issue since we don't get dual port injection in the US. Sad...
SaraK There is no avoiding it then. Guess I will have to do some Italian tuning on my own VW
Do not use scotchbrite. Please. It gets embedded in bearings and causes wear you will never see. Just move the engine until the intake valves are closed then soak, use the nylon brush or zip ties and suck with a vacuum. Quite honestly, regular use of ventil sauber per bmw/vw group process will have you keeping them intake valves clean. Justmy .02 (Bosch auto engr. GM journeyman, L1 master since '96.
Good video bro and always love the work you do!! Keep it going.
Also just did my injectors and a carbon clean on my 2015 gti at 43k miles. One injector was bad so I figured do the carbon clean while your there.
Overlay is the best!!!
Not sure if the shops around here offer that type of cleaning. The last shop I had it at said "valve job".
I believe something such as CRC would be perfect for an application like this. There's such a thin layer of carbon I believe it would be able to clean those values very well. Too many people use CRC at such high mileage that there's no hope but to use something such as walnut blasting. Also It's funny because just the other week I was looking for information on low mileage carbon build up and this video was just want I needed, thanks for the quality content!
RIGHT! If you do those intake treatments as PM you might prolong the issue. but if you have carbon build up symptoms, it will not fix it
@@HumbleMechanic exactly, once I get my GTI in the next couple months I plan on doing intake cleaning every 5-10,000 miles so hopefully I'll never need to take the intake manifold off
@@garrettbundy1810 not same brand, but I've used CRC spray on my GLA since 2015 to 2020, and did not have issues.
I have a GLC300 now and continue the same trend, every 6 months 1/2 can CRC let it soak, drive it.
I WOT a lot too and always use quality oil meeting the specs.
Again, different 4 cylinder brand and design, I know the Mercedes PVC system is far superior to others on the market. But I've never had an issue, and intakes were always clean enough.
Charles #1 "You are the Man" ! Thank you for the always fantastic and helpful content.
As for preventing carbon build up do you think any of the following would help?
#1 a manifold introduced cleaning such as Seafoam introduced into the manifold through say the sensor hole on top. Running vehicle while introducing the cleaner ?
#2 a meth injection system as it to also is dispersed into the manifold to mix with the air being introduced into the cylinder
#3 is there a "fix" design to say split the injectors, 8 instead of 4. Where 4 are intoduducing fuel in traditional injection while the other 4 are introducing fuel via direct injection?
If I am not mistaken I thought the Golf R sold in Germany for a period of time had the 8 injectors instead of just the 4 direct injection.
Give it the beans? I'm calling Sarah N Tuned
LOL I got that from my dudes at Apex Tuning. Does Sarah say that too?
@@HumbleMechanic She does in all her car reviews, LOL
Lets give credit where credit is due....although the phrase has been around for a long time, Eric O is the youtuber who made it what it is today!
And as far as that carbon build up goes, I can think of another DR. O idiom..."Theres your problem lady"
she stole it from james may
Don't, a dude may show up.
Although it might me just poor engineering, but open throttle at 5000 rpms, staying at 200 km/h for 2 hours here in Germany on the autobahn does wonders for all types of engines.
Why is no one talking about 0W-20?! When I heard that i huh’d like scooby doo
0W-20 is what most performance FI motors recommend and it's not an issue in terms of carbon build up,
oil dilution would be my biggest concern which can be mitigated by frequent oil changes or going to something like 5W30.
BigHeadClan not in the euro world. My main reason was because it’s the same engine as the last generation which takes 5w-40
@@Irishluckily BMW typically recommends 0W20 for their motors but I'm not sure about Mercedes. Either way the weight of oil can change depending on your location, recommended oil manufacturer and what type of oil you pick up by a small amount.
The most important is location however, up here in Canada we tend to recommend thinner oils for winter starts when it's -30 outside.
BigHeadClan yeah I’m in NH and drop down to 0W to be safe on coldstart when it’s that cold. Sounds better too lol
@@Irishluckily Hah yeah your pretty close to the boarder so you get similar weather, my roommate has a Mk6 GTI he runs almost exclusively 5w40.
He did try 5W30 this winter but was actually starting to develop some noise on cold-starts, swapped back to 5w40 and ran as normal.
So thinking his generation of motor was just very particular about oil weight.
54k on my 17’ GLI. Probably don’t want to know what the inside of my crank case looks like. Of course I’m overdue for a DSG service too. So I’m batting .1000 on owner responsibility lol.,.
I sometimes use a maglite through the sparkplug channel which can highlite the valves being fully closed prior to cleaning the ports. You can easily spot any signs of light between a partially closed valve & it's seat.
True, but that is tough to film to show you guys. :)
@@HumbleMechanic absolutely, wasn't being critical my friend, just adding a little to the thread, especially if any of your viewers were going to say that they filled the ports with cleaner & it all vanished! 😄
Now review my 2007 eos at 130 thousand miles bet it’s crazy probably gonna pick on it soon lol
I would love to see you do a video on some of these additive products, specifically the Liqui Moly stuff. Would be interested in seeing pros and cons and if they really are even worth it.
B Fielder Project Farm style
Charles you are awesome son of a gun thank you for all you do
Was looking at golf R's until this video. Im good.
It’s still happily buy the car. Not a deal breaker
@@HumbleMechanic VAG must not like Americans. Every other country get updated versions of the engines we keep fixing.
Canadian viewer. I am an office jockey for work so humbly admit my knowledge of vehicles can be described as basic, at best. This is likely a simple question to most of the viewers but when the oil is changed it is darker than when it was put in. What makes the oil dirty over time? Is it from carbon, or? Thanks.