7045 Milling Machine - Spindle Refurbishment & Bearing Replacement
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- Опубликовано: 20 май 2022
- in this video (part 1 of the mill upgrade), we strip down a second hand INT 30 mill spindle, assess it, make it good, install new bearings and re-build.
Channel artwork: Ryan Toomey 
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I enjoyed the series you put out when you updated it last time, this will be the icing on the cake Jon.
Hi My old landy, thanks for the comment and continuing support. I really hope so lol, we are going to be straying into the "no going back" territory this time round, let's hope it all works out. Cheers, Jon
Google's algorithm is really good. I'm in preparing to do similar work to a ZX50 mill I recently purchased. Like yours, it came with a MT4 spindle. After extensive queries, I was able to locate the actual manufacture and purchase a R8 spindle. So I greatly appreciate the information that you're providing because I intend to follow your path ;-)
Hi E Designs, thanks for the comment. Glad you found us and are finding the content useful. Good luck with yours! Cheers, Jon
great work Jon .. Those bearings have just the right end play .. ENJOYED !!
WhenI rebuilt mine, I found the upper cup was screaming tight and I had to use a hydraulic press to get it out. Now the fun began, the bore was way undersize for the new bearing. And the housing had become belled from the bearing being pressed in, and the bell was eccentric due to the thinner wall by the rack. There was sufficient material that I could rebore to the correct diameter and centre it with the cartridge. I had to remove about .004” to get rid of the outer bell.
The bore in the head was oversized by .007” so I had the quill hard nickel plated. It was now too tight for the head so careful polishing of the quill got it round and taper free. The head bore I touched up with a cylinder hone. It was slightly tapered also. I called it quits when I had .0005” to .001” clearance. Initially it was pretty tight but with lots of oil and exercise it moves smoothly now.
With the preload I used and running the spindle at 2200 rpm the top bearing was warm, but the lower was Round 140f. I now have a couple hundred hours on it and the lower bearing still warms up but not so much. I probably over greased the lower bearing, and the shaft seals don’t allow much grease to escape.
Overall it was worth doing. I used precision tapered bearings and made sure I lined the dots up. There is a lot less play in the quill assembly and a lot of chatter has been eliminated.
Hi Glenn, thanks for the comment and your own experience, very useful for others. Sounds like you had some fun with the top bearing....... I got lucky. When I ran my new bearings in on my Mt4 spindle, I got about the same temperature behaviour. Will report back on this one when we get to the big switch on. Cheers, Jon
Well done Jon.
Great public service highlighting what was lurking in the spindle bore. That seems to be a theme in certain production environments. Might as well strip your new machine or tools and deal with it before it shows up later.
Thanks for showing spindle preload. I agree with the approach you took especially outside a laboratory it will be absolutely fine. When I did my surface grinder spindle and mill spindle it was much easier than described. Perfect - nope making good parts yup. Next project…😁
Hi Dan, thanks for the comment and feedback, much appreciated mate. Cheers, Jon
What a very interesting video, can’t wait for the rest of the episodes, nice one Jon
Hi Terry, thanks for the comment and feedback, much appreciated. Cheers mate, Jon
Future job for our mill also. For now the mill is just setting during the Brides crises with terminal bone cancer, but your video on all it's parts will be great to come back to when I do ours,,Bear.
Hi Bear, thanks for the comment, sorry to hear of your troubles, awful disease, been through similar with my mum. Chin up mate. Cheers, Jon
A very interesting and informative start to what will be an enjoyable series. 👏👏👍😀
Hi Andrew, thanks for the comment and feedback, much appreciated. Cheers, Jon
Great Outcome Jon. Glad it is going according to plan. Regards from Australia.
Hi Dave, thanks for the comment. So far so good lol. Cheers, Jon
Hi Jon, my Zay 7032 Mill Drill had 55mm of unsupported bearing surface fully retracted around the Quill dia.
Machined a 55mm thick block of aluminium to make precise bore to suit Quill and JB weld epoxied the block into the casting with the Quill in situ, self aligning around the Quill, oiling the Quill to prevent the Quill glueing itself.
I filled the voids with super strength Araldite around the block and casting to the top of the block.
Nice tight Quill for the first 55mm 2 years later.
I try and plan my work with minimal Quill extension but sometimes difficult with a round head mill drill but it does the job.
Max Grant idea is the best chroming and grinding but I don't have a Churchill cylindrical grinder!
Hi Willem, thanks for the comment. Interesting insight into your mod, sounds good! I have a spare head so if I get bother from the slop, I will swap heads over, and use the spare head to bore my head casting out to take bronze sleeves (assuming I can fit it all into the capacity between table and head in the highest position). Alas, I too don't own a cylindrical grinder! Cheers, Jon
Jon it is a wet and windy day down under so I have lit the open fire a Gin and Tonic for atmosphere and a informative video thank you.
Christopher from Down Under
Hi Christopher, thanks for the comment. It's a wet and windy day up over as well (as usual), we are still having the wood burner on in the evening. Our summer was in April when we had two weeks of sun and 17 degrees lol. Cheers, Jon
very good job jon..thanks for your time
Hi Tr, thanks for the comment, much appreciated. Cheers, Jon
Gday, nice job, great tip on cleaning out the inside of the spindle, this is going to be a great series, take care mate, cheers
Hi Matty, thanks for the comment and feedback, much appreciated mate. Cheers, Jon
Hi Jon, Great video and looking forward to the next episode. Regards Kevin
Hi Kevin, thanks for the comment, much appreciated. Cheers, Jon
Excellent good work Thanks for the video
Hi Frank, thanks for the comment, much appreciated. Cheers, Jon
Hi Jon
very thorough in your approach, and enjoyable watch, and a dozen eggs bonus!!!
i've got to take my spindle out soon for some tlc, keep putting it off for other jobs though.
see you next time
take care
Kev
Hi Kev, thanks for the comment. All going well so far. Eggs lol, what a clown I am sometimes! Cheers, Jon
Nice idea on painting inside of quill, geometrics looked very good overall, it's my understanding that Taper roller bearings don't like too much pre-load, ref large area of contact when compared to angular contact, or ball thrust types, but a good stepped heat and load cycle will settle them in, maybe run a suitable tool on some thrust bearings on the table, and measure for hot points, but it all honesty, the maximum rpm in use is well below the bearings specification.
Glad the eggs weren't of an alien nature, nice colour provided by the oils. Lol.
Thanks for sharing and stay safe all
Hi Bosted Tap, thanks for the comment. Yep, agree. I will run these in the same as my Mt4 I did I think (20 mins with zero load in each speed range starting at the slowest and working up). Probably going to get myself a digital pyrometer so I can be a bit more scientific about thermal effects. I just guessed on my Mt4 by using my hand and comparing to a hot cup of tea lol. Cheers, Jon
Always worth doing these jobs in the shop. Once done you can just get on with machining components just what you are there for.
Hi Dermot, thanks for the comment. Very true indeed. Cheers, Jon
Wonderful video. Very good info. Thank you. 👍
Hi James, thanks for the comment and feedback, much appreciated. Cheers, Jon
Further thought Jon, you only need to take into account the diameter error on the lower half of the spindle, when you make the collar as the rest will be up inside the head. Regards from Australia.
Hi Dave, spot on. As it happens, it won't make any difference I don't think as the largest diameter on the quill cartridge is at the bottom. Good it is this way round meaning maximum rigidity with the quill fully retracted for milling ops etc. Cheers, Jon
Indeed, even a bit too much preload will kill the bearings in no time.
Hi Rusti, thanks for the comment, I hope I avoid this lol, at least I measured it this time as opposed to my guesswork on the last spindle lol. Cheers, Jon
Rite Jon, Nice tips on the painting the bore and on the preload! The only preload I know of is for bike suspension! Stay safe n well Dude! TFS, GB :)
Hi Graeme, thanks for the comment and feedback, much appreciated mate. Cheers, Jon
Looking good Jon. After watching this first video I think I’m going to take out my spindle cartridge and check the bearings on mine. Although I’m going to wait till you do the video on the steady clamp to see how you tackle that, then I can do mine at the same time.
Hi John, thanks for the comment. Glad you are finding some useful content in my ramblings lol. In this weeks video, you might spot something you recognise!!! It has changed shape a bit though lol. Cheers, Jon
Great interesting video Jon, pity the bearings were different sizes. Nice job cleaning, plugging and painting the spindle bore. Also admiring your unusual (to me)V blocks. Can you show us a quick look at them sometime in the future with any history if possible. Cheers Tony
Hi Tony, thanks for the comment and feedback. Regarding the V Blocks, they were my Dad's and would have come from a company called Clayton Dewandrer in Lincoln (made air compressors for wagons). They are in a sorry state and they will definitely be part of a future surface grinder project to bring them back from the brink! They will be from the 1960's / 1970s and shop made I think, no markings on them. Cheers, Jon
That's coming on really well Jon. Going to be a very rigid machine , once done.
Regards.
Steve.
Hi Steve, thanks for the comment and feedback. Much appreciated. Cheers, Jon
Well done mate 👍🇦🇺
Hi Mark, thanks for the comment, much appreciated. Cheers, Jon
Good vid Jon You thought them polystyrene balls were spider eggs didn’t you 😂
Hi Steve, thanks for the comment. Lol, yes, I though Harry had been promiscuous at the other end of the workshop (he has been AWOL for a while) lol. Cheers, Jon
Nice job on the spindle. Good idea to paint the inside if youve got it that far apart.
For the preload adjustment you could look in the manual for your M300 to see what Harrison suggest for the process of adjusting those spindle bearings. I think youve probably got it pretty good. When you get it running, leave it running for a while and see how warm they get.
Hi Robert, thanks for the comment and suggestion. I never thought of that, I will take a quick look today at the M300 script. Cheers, Jon
Nice job Jon. It is almost identical to the R8 spindle in my VMC. Mine is slightly earlier and has an angular contact ball bearing at the taper end rather than a taper roller. I use Koyo bearings in just about everything I work on because I find them to be excellent quality. Made in Japan and there doesn't seem to be counterfeits out there as there so often are with SKF. I see you used Timken so I doubt you'll be changing them for a good long time.
Best wishes, Dean.
Hi Dean, thanks for the comment. Yeah, I am not even sure on the Timkens to be honest, they were only a couple of quid dearer than SKF so clearly not the Timken they used to be. Still better than the hairdryer bearings fitted in the factory though (hopefully). Cheers, Jon
Hi Jon, enjoyed the video! Love the clear explanations on everything you do! 👍
Take care mate
Hi Tony, thanks for the comment and feedback, much appreciated mate. Cheers, Jon
Jon -- nice approach, well thought out plan, thorough cleanup, plotting the sizes is an excellent idea.
Having a beefy spindle is a tall benifiet .I give you an A+ . Have you mother sign your report card and bring it back to me.
TTFN - Ta Ta for now .
Hi Jim, thanks for the comment and feedback, coming from a man of your talents and experience, that is a decent report card! TTFN2U2. Cheers, Jon
thats what my spindle looked like on my new milling machine.... had to strip it and i hadn't even used it
Hi, thanks for the comment. Yep, they have certainly nailed repeatability in China, they all come exactly the same! Cheers, Jon
wat you could do to get one of them to fit tighter in the head is to have one of them electro plated then put it in the lathe and use a toolpost grinder to cut it perfectly to spec
i think theres a way to prevent the rack from getting plated , think they use a special paint
might even run a verry large reamer or a good rigid hone through the head and get it perfect
should take care of the damaged areas too
Hi Watahyahknow, thanks for the comment. Yes, that could work. If I find it a particular problem, my initial thinking was, as I now have a spare head, I could swap the heads over, put my old Mt4 spindle in the spare head and bore my Cormak head out for a bronze sleeve. That would make a good video. Cheers, Jon
Good one Jon . I think the last time i checked the play in my one , combined spindle & quill unlocked was 018 '' . I will probably look at getting the quill hardchromed or sleeving the head . Did the 30 taper have a larger bearing ? 👍
Hi Max, thanks for the comment. Yes, the 30 taper spindle had a bearing with larger O/D (Cup) and same I/D (cone), so much more robust hopefully. Cheers, Jon
Good job Can you please give me the name of the ball bearings.👍👍
Great stuff so far Jon. Look forward to seeing it all go together. Just out of interest, what is the fit of the int 30 spindle in the spare head casting you have? If it is better than 30 micron you are onto a winner.
Hi Carl, thanks for the comment. The other head is about the same as mine based on a quick bore measurement (still need to measure my bore once spindle is extracted). The other head is much older and missing some features mine has so ideally I want to keep mine as original. I have a cunning plan, if the slop really causes agro, I may swap the heads and use the spare head to rebore mine allowing for bronze sleeves, how's that for video material lol. Cheers, Jon
@@jonsworkshop Sounds good. I am looking forward to seeing how things progress.
Hi friend, Excellent video full of informations, so, I have a spindle like yours but the cone morse 3 it's damaged, Do you know where I can buy a new one? and again: can you tell me the code of Timken bearings or the two internal diameter of them? May be I can find a different brand. Tanks Regards Piero
I enjoyed that. Have you seen Robrenz? He does a great video on spindle rebuild.
Hi, thanks for the comment. I do watch Robrenz yes, don't remember his spindle video, will go and check it out. Cheers, Jon
Nice work, Jon. Out of interest, what size are the bearings?
Hi Michel, thanks for the comment. Timken 30206 Metric Taper Roller Bearing 30x62x17.25mm & Timken 30207 Metric Taper Roller Bearing 35x72x18.25mm. Please be aware that these are unique to the ISO 30 and will be different to other types of taper. I would always suggest stripping your own and measuring prior to purchasing anything (remember where these are made!!). Cheers, Jon
@@jonsworkshop Cheers, Jon. My problem is a bit different to yours, in that I have no vertical head at all, I was wondering how small you can go in bearing terms with an ISO30 taper spindle. Those are a lot smaller than I was planning, I was looking at something more like a 30207 / 30209 pair, which would give me a fatter spindle, and thus more stiffness overall. I'm not planing on having a spindle downfeed, so "cartridge" size is a lot less of an issue.
My mill's a Crouzet FC100, relatively similar in capacity but the layout is all different.
Food for thought, food for thought.
Hi Jon, quick question if i can.... have a new to me, used Beaver Mill mk2. I have measured the play left to right on the spindle and its 0.9mm. For how much i would use this machine being a new hobby for me should i just leave the play as is... or do i go down the rabbit hole on trying to find out where this play is and carry out repairs? Which poss could be more then the machine.... had a quote for new bearings £300.00, if the repair was just changing the bearings I could poss do that. I don’t believe nor can I find replacement quill or spindle for my machine.
Hi, difficult to give you a definite answer without seeing the machine but 0,9mm is practically unusable (I would be breaking a sweat at 0.09mm)!!! My suggestion would be to get dti's all over the thing and absolutely understand where the slop is (spindle, quill, head etc), then decide what to do. 0.9mm in bearings means they have totally collapsed, or the pre-load may have just worked loose, it is not wear! If it's just pre-load, then it might just need reset although if it has been run like this the bearings will probably be shot. Is there any end float in the spindle, this will be an indication of pre-load etc. Hope this helps 😄
Hi, thanks for the advice... doesn’t sound good news for me. Its seems i have nothing to lose so might as well separate the spindle and quill to have a look at the bearings. If no major issues are found put it back together, set the pre-load and carryout dti measurement of run-out again. And keep everything crossed.!!!!
In your experience it I done all the above and still have 0.9mm run-out what options do I have? Shame to weigh in the mill for scrap metal.@@jonsworkshop
👍😎👍
Thanks Joel. Cheers, Jon
I wonder how the ramp or fillet at the bottom of the shaft splines were achieved? It wasn't a standard end mill, otherwise it would be rounded.
Hi Bob, thanks for the comment. I suspect they were put in using an inserted side & face cutter on a horizontal machining centre. They will definitely be CNC manufactured. Cheers, Jon
@@jonsworkshop oh yeah! LOL! They probably cut it with a beefy slitting saw.
Please, could you send the bearing codes for this machine?
Hi, really sorry, but I don't want to send out anything on this. I have stripped three separate heads and spindles all off the 7045 machines, and the bearings have been different in all three. They fit bearings depending on how they machined the spindles is all I can assume. The only way to know for sure what you have is to strip your own unit down. The last thing I want is to give someone bad information leading to them buying incorrect parts. Hope you understand. Cheers, Jon
@@jonsworkshop I understand, thank you