Hope you enjoyed this video! To go a step further, challenge yourself & take ThatPickleball IQ Test to see how well you really know the game. VERY FEW get 10/10. I dare you to try: 😊 thatpickleballtest.typeform.com/to/YuHaz4N6
Hi, I’ve just turned 68 and have been playing pickleball for a very short time. I have been searching RUclips for the basics and tips and techniques to help me understand the game more and hopefully help me improve. Your explanation and demonstration of shots are excellent which makes it a lot easier to understand. Thank you for posting these instructional videos. Playing sports is all about having fun, you certainly capture that.
Just wanted to say, as an enthusiastic beginner (my wife says "obsessed"!), I've watched a LOT of pickleball videos from a lot of different creators. For me, yours are the best. Very clear explanations (even when they include Newtonian physics!), very helpful tips, things I can really apply (or at least try to!) in my next game, and fun video editing. Thank you very much!
Kyle I’m also a certified instructor, I just watched this video of the third shot drop and it’s almost identical to the way I teach. You’re extremely gifted teacher, your knowledge of the game, your explanation breaks it down basics. But lastly you can tell you love teaching, it’s your gift! This is my first time seeing you on video but I’ll definitely be adding you in with the others. I was very blessed to become friends with Simone Jardim I was able to get private lessons. Tony Roig another friend that I think does a wonderful of the game. So I’m adding you to the list and I’ll be passing this on to my students! Great job!
I've been working with a coach, and drop shots from the baseline and mid court have been so difficult. Everything you're demonstrating in this video is consistent with what my coach is doing, but your tips, along with the added visuals, are immensely helpful. I have a tennis background, and backswinging is a hard habit to break. Thank you for making this video.
Great video and demonstration. Couple things I tell my students: if the swing ends above the net the ball will go over the net. I also tell students that if they consider their lower body, (the legs and hips) acts as a steering wheel, helps in direction....and hit as if there are 3 balls in a row. I also say the tighter the grip the more mass is behind your paddle...so yes, lose grip. Great stuff.
Thanks for the pointers. I think you said it right about grip pressure - if you hold the grip tightly the paddle acts like a springboard. If you hold it loosely it acts more like a trampoline or bed. The ball stays in contact with the paddle face longer and so you have more control.
3 weeks into pickleball--your videos are great. Especially doing things like L1 L2 L3... makes it easy to remember. Keep them coming. I"m a tennis player, but loving the similarities AND differences with my new sport!
Kyle, I really like how you set up your instruction. The animation helps tremendously to reinforce your explanation on these skills. Unfortunately, my time to play is down to only Saturdays now, and being able to go back to the videos for a refresher is so great. Keep them coming. I swear I learn something new every single time.
Consider. A soft grip absorbs the power from the incoming shot and the slow (from the shoulder) response uses the large muscles to accurately push the ball over the net. Similar to putting in golf. The large muscle groups bring repeatability and consistency.
Thank you! Thank you! Thank you! Your videos are so informative and helpful. I've posted this before and maybe it's just happening on my browser (Safari) but whenever you point up and say click this video I never see anything appear up there. Just wanted you to know. Are you at any tournaments in or near Ohio this summer/fall? Would love to come to see you play live.
Thanks for letting me know!! I Had to correct this on a few previous videos. I messed it up. On this specific video. The video I reference actually comes out in the next couple weeks! ahh. Sorry. So it will show then. RUclips is kinda funky. sometimes. Still getting better at it.
I'm a golfer, and the whole "less grip" principle applies there also. It really comes down to feel. That whole "buttery" shot is a feel shot. Butch Harmon had the best advice ever when gripping a golf club, and I wonder if its the same for a pickle ball paddle. He said that you should grip your club as hard you can for a few seconds, let it go, then go back and grip it normally. That's the grip tension you should have.
Loved the video the only thing that I felt was unrealistic was that the return of serve is usually deep and hard so in your video your third shot drops were made from easy returns. I would have liked to see those third shot drops being made from hard return of serves. Thanks
Yep, did that a lot for teaching purposes. BUT, as I mentioned in the video, if you serve it harder, you will generate a lot of short returns. Which is what you want. It's a real skill to be able to return the ball deep and hard! But working on them from the baseline is a must for sure! Thanks for bringing it up.
Hey Kyle. I'm a 4-ish level player with a decent ability to hit a hard, deep topspin service return. I can also consistently hit a more floaty, but also deep, serve return. I find the floaty return almost always gives me time to get fully to the net. The power return is hard to handle for lower level opponents, but easy for higher level opponents, where I use the more floaty return, but get all the way to the net. Thoughts?
I think it's super hard to explain these things that for most seasoned players is mostly intuitive. I know how to do this stuff based on my feel for the game, but being able to articulate how I'm doing it to beginners has been a challenge. I think you nailed it with the looser grip and also the removal of the back swing!
Great point by your aide. I have been trying to figure out what the arc of the ball should be on a drop shot and have never been able to find a definitive answer. Now I know the apex should be on my side. Thank you thank you.
An important factor is missing in the discussion of grip. Shock absorption has been discussed and is important but the other important factor is feedback from you paddle. With a tight grip, you don't get a good sense of how hard you're hitting the ball. A looser grip gives you more feedback on your shot. I learned in handgliding that if you grip the bar tightly, you don't get any feedback on the forces the bar is exerting on you to find your balance. Same thing in pickleball where a looser grip gives you more feedback to adjust your shot strength.
Kyle, I really enjoy your videos and always recommend them to my students. At the beginning of each beginner session I tell the students that they are holding an egg in their hands.Every time I touch their hands and change a grip or explain how to hit a forehand I can always tell when they broke their egg.
That was a great instructional video on the 3rd shot drop. Your teaching style is easy to follow, clear and concise and provides an easy one, two, three model to remind us of what to remember when we are on the court drilling our 3rd shot drops. BTW, the training video doesn't pop up on the screen. I'm sure that it is coming though. 😉
I learned that you can think of the grip on a scale of 1-10. One coach told me like for being up at the kitchen and returning a fast ball that comes right to your chest, hold the paddle at a 3 grip so it drops right over net - a reset. So maybe a 3rd shot drop same? It really helped me because if I held the paddle with a 10 drip on that reset shot - it instead flew right back to the back line even if I had no swing and just held the paddle. The loose grip helps!
Love the 3 Ls! It gives me 3 simple things to remember when I am executing the 3-rd shot drop. And that's what I call a good teaching video! I am still not very clear how to add spin with a loose grip... But maybe those 2 things can't be done together... But maybe that is a separate topic. Great video!
Love your videos! You cut to the chase....been playing about 3 years after playing tennis many years. Don't need a lot of hand holding, just why i am i getting lit up by better players on certain days in certain situations... Where can i put this shot in this situation? What do i need to master to improve? etc. You spell it out in 18 days with good humor....BRAVO!
Kyle, your videos are truly wonderful. You explain things so well, very thorough and detailed to help us really get what you are saying. And you are also very entertaining too! Thank you. Keep up the great work.
That Guy has lots of enthusiasm and I think it adds good flavor to the videos. There's levity with sound instruction - lots of fun. Anyway - these drop shots feel weird at first - some feel like they won't go over the net - other times it feels like you are giving them an easy shot. You really have to hit a lot of them to remove that weird feeling. With my backhand, I want to slice through the ball instead of lift - that's a bad habit I'm working on.
Omg youre whole intro 🤩👏 literally taking the words out of my mouth that i tell my Introduction classes!! Get out of my head! And keep making great videos!! Great articulation, makes so much sense for me!
I would LOVE to see a video on how to return shots that come my way FAST & with a ton of spin. Topspin & sidespin. Most of my balls go into the net. And yes, im a 3.5 player, the guys with the advanced shots are usually 4.0+, at Open Play courts. I love playing against better players, but those "super spin" shots drive me crazy. So, maybe a video about returning those and/or shot strategy (?)
My coach helped me return spin. He told me to stiffen your arm from elbow through to your wrist, one entire arm position. Doing this allows me to have the strength and guidance to get the spin ball back. Hope this helps.
@@lsee6145 I will try. You want your arm to be straight and stiff from your elbow all the way through your wrist. It’s all on one plane I guess. Easier to show someone than tell them. Hope that was clearer because it works well.
Great tips again. Adding top spin is for later, after you have consistently hit third shots IN and without high bounce. Third shot top spin needs tons of drills as initially you will find your shots going into net due to miss timing your shots. And using an 'eastern grip, if not familiar adds to problems ' hitting away from target.
Trying to 3rd shot drop on a grip pressure scale 1 to 10. From backline grip pressure at 7 to 8, transition zone grip pressure at 5 to 6 & kitchen zone grip pressure at 3 to 4. Would do you think?
I think the idea about loose grip and tight grip in regards to "control" is flipped around. What you are rather describing is the *transfer of forces.* The more rigid/solid something is, the better it will be at transferring the forces that are applied onto it. In your example, holding the paddle very tightly means that the entire arm-hand-paddle complex is quite rigid. If a ball coming at high speed were to bounce off that paddle, it would get sent faster and further away. In contrast, the softer something is, the more it can absorb the forces that are applied onto it. In your example, holding the paddle lightly/loosely means that the entire arm-hand-paddle complex is softer. If a ball coming at high speed were to bounce off that paddle, it would get sent back slower and closer to you. This is because the loose grip and arm act as a "cushion" that absorbs some of the impact forces. This is, however, different from *control.* Should you be in a position where you have to decide where to send the ball, a tighter grip will provide more accuracy compared to a looser grip. This is because having a looser grip also means having more places where energy is lost, as well as more places where micro movements occur due to the impact forces. When the ball enters in contact with the paddle, the loose grip can allow that paddle to be shifted around and have its face moved from absorbing the impact. In contrast, holding the paddle more tightly reduces the potential for these small movements to occur, thus allowing for more precision and accuracy in regards to where the ball is intended to be sent. All in all, a combination of both can be used depending on the situation you find yourself in. If you are receiving a hard drive as a 2nd shot, and you want to make a 3rd shot drop, it's natural to adopt a looser grip. This might make it a bit more difficult to send the ball back exactly where you want it to go in terms of precision, but it will also make it much easier to absorb some of the forces allowing the ball to drop closer to the net and make your drop more effective. That was a lot words, and I hope it makes sense. I guess my main goal was to point out the differences I make between *"Control"* and *"Force transfer".*
Muscle control and “touch” is mediated by repetition/muscle memory over the long term and by muscle tension and focus in the short term. Less tension = more feel and control; tension presents a barrier to be overcome so that control can be exerted. Any accomplished athlete knows this for sure. Great video.
I find that bending my knees slightly in preparation helps the lifting motion of the 3rd shot drop when the knees are extended during the stroke. It contributes to the "touch", in addition to the light grip. Also, sometimes I find that I have to come forward quickly against a perfectly placed drop shot and for a change of pace, I perform a forehand "shovel shot" hitting the lower pole of the ball...basically a back spin that sometimes surprises my opponent who will pop up the return for my partner to put away.
you discuss the importance of a top spin 3rd shot drop. def understand that (the ball spin and effect on opponent trying to attack it). does this mean it's not that great to do 3rd shot backspin drops? can you please explain this in detail? thanks!
A good way to articulate it is talking about how a ball can be absorbed when your wrist is looser. There is more flex in what is happening at the point of contact rather then if it’s a firm grip it will essentially act with no elasticity and come right off😊
Grabbing the paddle tightly limits your ability to move your wrist and elbow joints, since a tight grip requires you to forcefully contract all the muscles in your arm that might possibly move those joints. Moving the paddle with a tight grip gives you more of a punching motion, one where all the movement occurs at the shoulder, as opposed to an elegant swinging motion, one using the wrist, elbow, and shoulder. A punching motion is great when hitting something with a fist, but it is nowhere near as accurate as a swing when you're using a paddle to hit a ball. The explanation for that difference in accuracy comes from a field (physics) separate from mine (exercise science). Thumb this up so this man gets the answer he was asking for!
ANOTHER great video. Great teacher hitting on nuances that are essential to learning, and for me, x-tennis guy, pinpointed at where I always fail (swing side to side when I should be lifting). So thanks for the.......GREAT LIFT. :).....made my mrning !
I found this video very, very helpful and useful. My only critique is when discussing the height of the ball (or the apex) of the shot, it was difficult to see the ball how "high" it went against the backdrop of the white wall.
My way of loosening my grip and works really really well for me, is releasing/loosening the grip of my forefinger and middle finger. Not letting go of the paddle but loosening the grip of the 2 fingers. The only fingers in control of my paddle are my thumb, pinky, and ring finger. It took time but is very effective. (Works for me)
Regarding soft grip, I always reference Jack Nicklaus (greatest golfer of all time with 18 major wins and 117 tournament wins). He described holding the golf club as "cradling a baby bird". I tell my beginners, imagine your paddle hand is holding a baby bird. Good videos, keep it up!
Hey Kyle, great stuff! When you were demonstrating the top spin drop it seems like you were hitting and dropping back after the shot. Or the balance was shifting backwards after the shot. Is that intentional or do u transfer the weight forward to allow the momentum to take you forward to the NVZ?
Thank you for the thorough explanation! I’m a new subscriber. Just started learning to play pickleball without any sport background. Got any tip on beginner more affordable paddle?
Thanks for the video, Kyle. I'm a huge fan. I'm only about 2 weeks into playing Pickleball and working on implementing your tips. Today, I used your punch technique with much success!! I was hitting the ball out a lot initially, and today the punch shot worked like a charm. Thanks again!!
The reason the loose grip has more control is because it allows you to sort of "catch" some of the force of the ball, instead of the ball simply ricocheting with the same amount of force. Imagine trying to catch a tennis ball with a metal pot vs with a woven basket. It's probably going to uncontrollably bounce out of the metal pot. Having a loose grip acts as a shock absorber.
Tennis shot used to be lifting and pushing before top spin became dominant technique. Is the same happening with PB? Paddles spin rating reached beyond 2000 RPM but none of the shots demoed here utilized such spin.
I play in a group that whenever I do the 3rd shot drop it bounces high enough for them to drive the ball back at me and it kills us every time (lots of old tennis players). The only way I can seem to get ahead is 3rd shot lob. Do you have any other suggestions?
I like your video and explanation much better some video from other coaches I like the fact you actually demonstrate these shots together during talking and very clear! Thank you!
you are fantastic. i notice something - (because i do the same) your right foot it in front of your left - and, i find that EASIER for drops. Heck, sometimes I feel like i hit it more square on a drive too. Do you? Also, thanks for how you explain things. thanks for keeping it FUN too !!
Gosh i made this video a long time ago. I still believe in dominant foot in front. But have also have been experimenting lately with some alternative footworks like Being square. But some of that is dependent on what ball im receiving and
I am wondering, how you would adjust if you set up for a drop but notice the opponent didn't advance towards net, do you switch from that short backswing to drive or would you still drop? Love your explanation and humor!!😅
Quick question about L1 - Loose Grip… when I loosen my grip, I feel like I get more “rim” “band” or “not sweet spot” hits leading to an inconsistent ball flight? When that happens , I feel like I’m not keeping my eye on the ball or maybe it’s bc I’m still carrying over my bad habit swings from Table tennis?! Aka, trying to do the advance option to the MAX! Tons of top spin!
This may be a dumb question... I'm new to pickleball coming from tennis. I've never even played a match of pickleball or anything. So like I said this may be a dumb question. Typically in tennis when I hit a drop shot I do it with a slice to keep the ball low so it doesn't have much bounce and it forces the opponent to hit a slice back giving you the opportunity to go from defense to offense potentially. I would think that would be beneficial in pickleball as well. But all the video and matches that I've watched they typically utilize a topspin drop like you mentioned in this video. I guess my question is why is topspin preferred over a slice?
Lots of players use both. if you hit a topspin ball, it dips down and often causes the player at the net to short hop the next shot. that short hop is tricky and can lead to errors into the net or pop ups. I use both. On my backhand, I typically slice, and on my forehand, I typically hit topspin. That's my preference right now mainly because of ability. I don't have the two handed topspin drop just yet.
I love this video but have a question about not stepping onto the court until the third shot, if I’m still at the baseline, what to do if the opponent hits the return (2nd shot) into the kitchen? Now I have to hustle to the kitchen line ….
Yes. True! You would. This happens less frequently as most people will hear the advice (and it's good advice). Return deep to keep your opponent from getting to the kitchen. In my experience, people occasionally try to hit a drop shot return. BUT, 1. it's a difficult shot. 2. And if they do it successfully once and it hurts you, just adapt and be ready for the next one!
And you're right with the "foot" thing. A. BALANCE is the issue. You can be balanced with a closed stance, an open stance or even on the run. Otherwise, we would fall down every time we run. Wheelchair players play pickleball, and they're certainly not worried about their feet. In tennis, I actually have players purposefully hit off-balance in a lot of different ways - not that bad balance is ever an ideal situation, but our laziness and our opponents will constantly cause us to be off-balance. We should be able to at least get the ball back, even if our balance is horrible. Great job with this video!
Loose grip gives you more feel and allows the spin to take over. Also makes your arm and paddle work as one unit. Firm pressure decreases spin and increases power. I come from billiards and same holds true there. You get more spin with a loose grip and fluid stroke than with firm grip and tense arms.
When you do the top spin drop, looks like the paddle no longer stays or starts in front of you (always visible), but is slightly behind you, correct? Thanks for explaining everything so well, really appreciate and learn from it!
Wondering if an underspin 3rd shop drop would be as effective, or more effective, than a topspin drop. Can you explain why, or why not ? I’m a new Pickleball player ( former tennis player ) Also, differences between drop shot and dink ?
Drop shot happens from the baseline. Dink happens up near the kitchen. And on my backhand, i exclusively use a backspin because I find it more consistent. Both can be good for sure! Good to have both!
This is a technique to add to do third shot drops. Just add pace gradually during drills to simulate actual returns and under pressure moments. You may find the same 'techniques' also apply in defensive 'resets', like soft grip , only change might be double hand grip for some.
Fantastic video man! What grip are you using to demonstrate the forehand drops in this video? Traditionally people have taught continental but as the game evolves, it looks like an eastern grip is becoming more popular as the primary grip with some switching to continental for a few shots. What do you think?
Yes, that's coming soon, either tomorrow or next week. Making that decision tonight. I said click here, only because I know this next video would be done this week, and wanted people to be able to go right to the drill video for the future. So just one week delay! But it's coming soon, i promise.
Thanks for the video. I would say thou that it's much easier to hit a 3rd shot drop when you're standing in no man's land (mid court) rather in the back court or base line where your more likely to either hit it into the net or leave hanging high for your opponent to slam. Your position on the court is very important to determine what type of shot you want to hit and when. If you're going to drill a 3rd shot drop do it from the baseline where you're more likely to be. You never, almost never, what to be standing in "no man's land."
Agree, that is why you are seeing many default to a 3rd shot drive on a hard deep return and then do a 5th shot drop off what is (hopefully!) a shorter volley...
Hope you enjoyed this video! To go a step further, challenge yourself & take ThatPickleball IQ Test to see how well you really know the game.
VERY FEW get 10/10. I dare you to try: 😊
thatpickleballtest.typeform.com/to/YuHaz4N6
Hi, I’ve just turned 68 and have been playing pickleball for a very short time. I have been searching RUclips for the basics and tips and techniques to help me understand the game more and hopefully help me improve. Your explanation and demonstration of shots are excellent which makes it a lot easier to understand. Thank you for posting these instructional videos. Playing sports is all about having fun, you certainly capture that.
Glad they are helpful and you enjoy watching! Have fun out there!
Just wanted to say, as an enthusiastic beginner (my wife says "obsessed"!), I've watched a LOT of pickleball videos from a lot of different creators. For me, yours are the best. Very clear explanations (even when they include Newtonian physics!), very helpful tips, things I can really apply (or at least try to!) in my next game, and fun video editing. Thank you very much!
Absolutely! Thanks for the kind words.
I agree 100%! His videos are the BEST
This will be $70/lesson with some drills, with a non pro in Naples, FL
😱 😊😊😊😊😊😊
I agree!
Kyle I’m also a certified instructor, I just watched this video of the third shot drop and it’s almost identical to the way I teach. You’re extremely gifted teacher, your knowledge of the game, your explanation breaks it down basics. But lastly you can tell you love teaching, it’s your gift! This is my first time seeing you on video but I’ll definitely be adding you in with the others. I was very blessed to become friends with Simone Jardim I was able to get private lessons. Tony Roig another friend that I think does a wonderful of the game. So I’m adding you to the list and I’ll be passing this on to my students! Great job!
Awesome! Thank you!
Your videos are by far superior. Thanks for really taking the time to explain.
Absolutely! Thanks for watching!
Light grip: pretend holding a live bird. Just enough pressure so it won’t fly away but not too tight to choke it
Oo i like that!
What if my name is Lenny? 😢😂
Bro I came here to comment exactly this. Are you a fellow card mechanic or just heard it somewhere else
what kind of bird? swallow or ostrich?
Vager Vance used the same analogy for holding a driver.
I've been working with a coach, and drop shots from the baseline and mid court have been so difficult. Everything you're demonstrating in this video is consistent with what my coach is doing, but your tips, along with the added visuals, are immensely helpful. I have a tennis background, and backswinging is a hard habit to break. Thank you for making this video.
Thats awesome your working with a coach. And thanks for the kind words.
Great video and demonstration. Couple things I tell my students: if the swing ends above the net the ball will go over the net. I also tell students that if they consider their lower body, (the legs and hips) acts as a steering wheel, helps in direction....and hit as if there are 3 balls in a row. I also say the tighter the grip the more mass is behind your paddle...so yes, lose grip. Great stuff.
Thanks for watching!
Thanks for the pointers. I think you said it right about grip pressure - if you hold the grip tightly the paddle acts like a springboard. If you hold it loosely it acts more like a trampoline or bed. The ball stays in contact with the paddle face longer and so you have more control.
Oo thats good!
3 weeks into pickleball--your videos are great. Especially doing things like L1 L2 L3... makes it easy to remember. Keep them coming. I"m a tennis player, but loving the similarities AND differences with my new sport!
Fantastic! Glad its helpful. Thanks for watching
Giving us other examples to really understand what you’re saying like the cornhole sand bag was seriously a game changer and so helpful! Thank you!!
So glad that helped :)
I have been watching the 3rd shot drop over and over again. It helps me to clearly understand the third shot as a beginner. Thank you!
You're welcome :) Glad it's helpful!
Kyle, I really like how you set up your instruction. The animation helps tremendously to reinforce your explanation on these skills. Unfortunately, my time to play is down to only Saturdays now, and being able to go back to the videos for a refresher is so great. Keep them coming. I swear I learn something new every single time.
Amazing!! Thanks for the kind words :)
Been playing about a year and a half and this is the best pickleball video I've ever watched! Thank you so much
Wow, thanks!
This is the perfect 3rd shot video ever made! I have watched a million of them!! Thank you
Glad it helped!
All good stuff...a little top spin will keep the ball bouncing lower as it shoots the ball forward (an added bonus to it bouncing lower).
Wow! great explanations. I like that you broke it down into several component parts AND
defined what a third shot drop is. Thank you.
Thanks for watching. Glad it helped!
Finally, good quality content that has definitions and clear examples. Very well done my friend.
Glad you liked it!
Great video. Liked a number of points but especially where you explain what a successful drop is ( opponent has to hit up on the drop).
Glad it was helpful!
As always, great tips!
Could you make a video on your Pball journey as a beginner to Pro?
I need to do more stuff on this! I agree. Its in the works
Consider. A soft grip absorbs the power from the incoming shot and the slow (from the shoulder) response uses the large muscles to accurately push the ball over the net. Similar to putting in golf. The large muscle groups bring repeatability and consistency.
Thank you! Thank you! Thank you! Your videos are so informative and helpful. I've posted this before and maybe it's just happening on my browser (Safari) but whenever you point up and say click this video I never see anything appear up there. Just wanted you to know. Are you at any tournaments in or near Ohio this summer/fall? Would love to come to see you play live.
Thanks for letting me know!! I Had to correct this on a few previous videos. I messed it up.
On this specific video. The video I reference actually comes out in the next couple weeks! ahh. Sorry. So it will show then. RUclips is kinda funky. sometimes. Still getting better at it.
Thanks for the clarification, I too was looking for that video.
I'm a golfer, and the whole "less grip" principle applies there also. It really comes down to feel. That whole "buttery" shot is a feel shot. Butch Harmon had the best advice ever when gripping a golf club, and I wonder if its the same for a pickle ball paddle. He said that you should grip your club as hard you can for a few seconds, let it go, then go back and grip it normally. That's the grip tension you should have.
Great input!
Loved the video the only thing that I felt was unrealistic was that the return of serve is usually deep and hard so in your video your third shot drops were made from easy returns. I would have liked to see those third shot drops being made from hard return of serves. Thanks
Yep, did that a lot for teaching purposes. BUT, as I mentioned in the video, if you serve it harder, you will generate a lot of short returns. Which is what you want. It's a real skill to be able to return the ball deep and hard!
But working on them from the baseline is a must for sure! Thanks for bringing it up.
Hey Kyle. I'm a 4-ish level player with a decent ability to hit a hard, deep topspin service return. I can also consistently hit a more floaty, but also deep, serve return. I find the floaty return almost always gives me time to get fully to the net.
The power return is hard to handle for lower level opponents, but easy for higher level opponents, where I use the more floaty return, but get all the way to the net.
Thoughts?
I think it's super hard to explain these things that for most seasoned players is mostly intuitive. I know how to do this stuff based on my feel for the game, but being able to articulate how I'm doing it to beginners has been a challenge. I think you nailed it with the looser grip and also the removal of the back swing!
Thank you!!
Great point by your aide. I have been trying to figure out what the arc of the ball should be on a drop shot and have never been able to find a definitive answer. Now I know the apex should be on my side. Thank you thank you.
Glad it helped!
An important factor is missing in the discussion of grip. Shock absorption has been discussed and is important but the other important factor is feedback from you paddle. With a tight grip, you don't get a good sense of how hard you're hitting the ball. A looser grip gives you more feedback on your shot. I learned in handgliding that if you grip the bar tightly, you don't get any feedback on the forces the bar is exerting on you to find your balance. Same thing in pickleball where a looser grip gives you more feedback to adjust your shot strength.
Kyle, I really enjoy your videos and always recommend them to my students. At the beginning of each beginner session I tell the students that they are holding an egg in their hands.Every time I touch their hands and change a grip or explain how to hit a forehand I can always tell when they broke their egg.
That is awesome! Thanks for sharing the videos! Glad you enjoy them!
Great video! Now to practice what you preached. LESS IS MORE. Three little words that I struggle with on the PB court. Thanks!!
Less is more. Amen!
That was a great instructional video on the 3rd shot drop. Your teaching style is easy to follow, clear and concise and provides an easy one, two, three model to remind us of what to remember when we are on the court drilling our 3rd shot drops. BTW, the training video doesn't pop up on the screen. I'm sure that it is coming though. 😉
thank you!
And yep, coming today or tomorrow! Had to get it through editing, so week delay on that :)
90 days into this great game. I really enjoy your approach and method of instruction! Thank you!
Thank you!
I learned that you can think of the grip on a scale of 1-10. One coach told me like for being up at the kitchen and returning a fast ball that comes right to your chest, hold the paddle at a 3 grip so it drops right over net - a reset. So maybe a 3rd shot drop same? It really helped me because if I held the paddle with a 10 drip on that reset shot - it instead flew right back to the back line even if I had no swing and just held the paddle. The loose grip helps!
yeah that's really good!! Thanks for sharing.
Love the 3 Ls! It gives me 3 simple things to remember when I am executing the 3-rd shot drop. And that's what I call a good teaching video! I am still not very clear how to add spin with a loose grip... But maybe those 2 things can't be done together... But maybe that is a separate topic. Great video!
Glad you enjoyed it! Thanks for watching!
Great instruction and the animation showing the ball trajectory adds so much value to understanding. Subscribed!
Glad it was helpful! Thanks for subscribing!
Love your videos! You cut to the chase....been playing about 3 years after playing tennis many years. Don't need a lot of hand holding, just why i am i getting lit up by better players on certain days in certain situations... Where can i put this shot in this situation? What do i need to master to improve? etc. You spell it out in 18 days with good humor....BRAVO!
Glad it was helpful!
Love the signage for the facility...been there a few times☺@@thatpickleballguy
Great video. Your explanations are right on. Thanks
Glad it helped! Thanks for watching
Love your videos!! I'm super new to the game of PB and as a tennis player of many years, your explanations make sense and translate really well.
Awesome!! Glad it worked out
This is the best video I have seen about how to hit soft shot and the strategy behind third shot drop.
Awesome! Glad you enjoyed it!
Kyle, your videos are truly wonderful. You explain things so well, very thorough and detailed to help us really get what you are saying. And you are also very entertaining too! Thank you. Keep up the great work.
Glad you like them! Thanks for watching!
That Guy has lots of enthusiasm and I think it adds good flavor to the videos. There's levity with sound instruction - lots of fun. Anyway - these drop shots feel weird at first - some feel like they won't go over the net - other times it feels like you are giving them an easy shot. You really have to hit a lot of them to remove that weird feeling. With my backhand, I want to slice through the ball instead of lift - that's a bad habit I'm working on.
Thanks! I like levity :) And keep working at it. It doesn't come overnight!
Great and clear instructions in an indoor facility which makes it great for filming. So many people film outside and way to much noise.
Glad you enjoyed it!
Omg youre whole intro 🤩👏 literally taking the words out of my mouth that i tell my Introduction classes!! Get out of my head!
And keep making great videos!! Great articulation, makes so much sense for me!
Love it!!
I would LOVE to see a video on how to return shots that come my way FAST & with a ton of spin. Topspin & sidespin. Most of my balls go into the net. And yes, im a 3.5 player, the guys with the advanced shots are usually 4.0+, at Open Play courts. I love playing against better players, but those "super spin" shots drive me crazy. So, maybe a video about returning those and/or shot strategy (?)
Hit up on the ball
Yeah, I like the comment below, if someone gives you a ton of spin, try swinging through the ball rather than trying to be perfect on a 3rd shot drop.
My coach helped me return spin. He told me to stiffen your arm from elbow through to your wrist, one entire arm position. Doing this allows me to have the strength and guidance to get the spin ball back. Hope this helps.
@@barb987 Can you explain this? "one entire arm position"?
@@lsee6145 I will try. You want your arm to be straight and stiff from your elbow all the way through your wrist. It’s all on one plane I guess. Easier to show someone than tell them. Hope that was clearer because it works well.
Great tips again. Adding top spin is for later, after you have consistently hit third shots IN and without high bounce. Third shot top spin needs tons of drills as initially you will find your shots going into net due to miss timing your shots. And using an 'eastern grip, if not familiar adds to problems ' hitting away from target.
Thanks for watching! Glad it was helpful!
Trying to 3rd shot drop on a grip pressure scale 1 to 10. From backline grip pressure at 7 to 8, transition zone grip pressure at 5 to 6 & kitchen zone grip pressure at 3 to 4. Would do you think?
I think the idea about loose grip and tight grip in regards to "control" is flipped around. What you are rather describing is the *transfer of forces.*
The more rigid/solid something is, the better it will be at transferring the forces that are applied onto it. In your example, holding the paddle very tightly means that the entire arm-hand-paddle complex is quite rigid. If a ball coming at high speed were to bounce off that paddle, it would get sent faster and further away.
In contrast, the softer something is, the more it can absorb the forces that are applied onto it. In your example, holding the paddle lightly/loosely means that the entire arm-hand-paddle complex is softer. If a ball coming at high speed were to bounce off that paddle, it would get sent back slower and closer to you. This is because the loose grip and arm act as a "cushion" that absorbs some of the impact forces.
This is, however, different from *control.* Should you be in a position where you have to decide where to send the ball, a tighter grip will provide more accuracy compared to a looser grip. This is because having a looser grip also means having more places where energy is lost, as well as more places where micro movements occur due to the impact forces. When the ball enters in contact with the paddle, the loose grip can allow that paddle to be shifted around and have its face moved from absorbing the impact.
In contrast, holding the paddle more tightly reduces the potential for these small movements to occur, thus allowing for more precision and accuracy in regards to where the ball is intended to be sent.
All in all, a combination of both can be used depending on the situation you find yourself in.
If you are receiving a hard drive as a 2nd shot, and you want to make a 3rd shot drop, it's natural to adopt a looser grip. This might make it a bit more difficult to send the ball back exactly where you want it to go in terms of precision, but it will also make it much easier to absorb some of the forces allowing the ball to drop closer to the net and make your drop more effective.
That was a lot words, and I hope it makes sense.
I guess my main goal was to point out the differences I make between *"Control"* and *"Force transfer".*
This was so helpful. I've had 4 lessons and I will try out these techniques today
Fantastic!
Best step-by-step re 3rd shot drop technique I've seen. Grazie!
Glad it helped!
Muscle control and “touch” is mediated by repetition/muscle memory over the long term and by muscle tension and focus in the short term.
Less tension = more feel and control; tension presents a barrier to be overcome so that control can be exerted. Any accomplished athlete knows this for sure. Great video.
I find that bending my knees slightly in preparation helps the lifting motion of the 3rd shot drop when the knees are extended during the stroke. It contributes to the "touch", in addition to the light grip. Also, sometimes I find that I have to come forward quickly against a perfectly placed drop shot and for a change of pace, I perform a forehand "shovel shot" hitting the lower pole of the ball...basically a back spin that sometimes surprises my opponent who will pop up the return for my partner to put away.
I like that!!
you discuss the importance of a top spin 3rd shot drop. def understand that (the ball spin and effect on opponent trying to attack it).
does this mean it's not that great to do 3rd shot backspin drops? can you please explain this in detail? thanks!
A good way to articulate it is talking about how a ball can be absorbed when your wrist is looser. There is more flex in what is happening at the point of contact rather then if it’s a firm grip it will essentially act with no elasticity and come right off😊
That's well said. Thank you!
I never thought about it this way! Thank you for the tips now im ready to grip n rip (slightly grip lol) 😆
Grabbing the paddle tightly limits your ability to move your wrist and elbow joints, since a tight grip requires you to forcefully contract all the muscles in your arm that might possibly move those joints. Moving the paddle with a tight grip gives you more of a punching motion, one where all the movement occurs at the shoulder, as opposed to an elegant swinging motion, one using the wrist, elbow, and shoulder. A punching motion is great when hitting something with a fist, but it is nowhere near as accurate as a swing when you're using a paddle to hit a ball. The explanation for that difference in accuracy comes from a field (physics) separate from mine (exercise science).
Thumb this up so this man gets the answer he was asking for!
Great explanation of 3rd shot drop. Other videos show you how to do it but not why.
Glad it helped!
ANOTHER great video. Great teacher hitting on nuances that are essential to learning, and for me, x-tennis guy, pinpointed at where I always fail (swing side to side when I should be lifting). So thanks for the.......GREAT LIFT. :).....made my mrning !
Awesome!! Glad it was helpful
Beautifully done job and super graphics too! I really like your "never lose sight of the paddle" tip.
Thank you very much!
My second time watching this, you are hilarious Kyle!
Thanks :)
I found this video very, very helpful and useful. My only critique is when discussing the height of the ball (or the apex) of the shot, it was difficult to see the ball how "high" it went against the backdrop of the white wall.
Ahh! Good feedback. I'll do a better job with that next time!
My way of loosening my grip and works really really well for me, is releasing/loosening the grip of my forefinger and middle finger. Not letting go of the paddle but loosening the grip of the 2 fingers. The only fingers in control of my paddle are my thumb, pinky, and ring finger. It took time but is very effective. (Works for me)
Regarding soft grip, I always reference Jack Nicklaus (greatest golfer of all time with 18 major wins and 117 tournament wins). He described holding the golf club as "cradling a baby bird". I tell my beginners, imagine your paddle hand is holding a baby bird. Good videos, keep it up!
OO that's really good!
Hey Kyle, great stuff! When you were demonstrating the top spin drop it seems like you were hitting and dropping back after the shot. Or the balance was shifting backwards after the shot. Is that intentional or do u transfer the weight forward to allow the momentum to take you forward to the NVZ?
You keep it direct, with great remedial paddle actions that make sense. New guy but your videos are the best, Keep them coming!
Thanks Jeff! Glad they're helping.
Thank you for the thorough explanation! I’m a new subscriber. Just started learning to play pickleball without any sport background. Got any tip on beginner more affordable paddle?
Absolutely! Thanks for watching!
Great video - you’re a gifted communicator and teacher. Thanks so much. You’ve gained a subscriber!
Thank you :)
Thanks for the video, Kyle. I'm a huge fan. I'm only about 2 weeks into playing Pickleball and working on implementing your tips. Today, I used your punch technique with much success!! I was hitting the ball out a lot initially, and today the punch shot worked like a charm. Thanks again!!
Fantastic!! yeah that's one that can really help early on.
clearest explanation of TSD technique I've seen. Thank you!
Glad it was helpful!
The reason the loose grip has more control is because it allows you to sort of "catch" some of the force of the ball, instead of the ball simply ricocheting with the same amount of force. Imagine trying to catch a tennis ball with a metal pot vs with a woven basket. It's probably going to uncontrollably bounce out of the metal pot. Having a loose grip acts as a shock absorber.
Oo yeah, that's really good!
Tennis shot used to be lifting and pushing before top spin became dominant technique. Is the same happening with PB? Paddles spin rating reached beyond 2000 RPM but none of the shots demoed here utilized such spin.
Again, fun and informative with good, actionable tips. Keep it up! Also, love seeing you on the Arizona PBL!!!
Glad it helped!
I play in a group that whenever I do the 3rd shot drop it bounces high enough for them to drive the ball back at me and it kills us every time (lots of old tennis players). The only way I can seem to get ahead is 3rd shot lob. Do you have any other suggestions?
I like your video and explanation much better some video from other coaches I like the fact you actually demonstrate these shots together during talking and very clear! Thank you!
You're welcome!
Thanks so much, this video has answered so many of my questions:) and your explanations are top notch 🏅
Glad theyre helpful!
you are fantastic. i notice something - (because i do the same) your right foot it in front of your left - and, i find that EASIER for drops. Heck, sometimes I feel like i hit it more square on a drive too. Do you? Also, thanks for how you explain things. thanks for keeping it FUN too !!
Gosh i made this video a long time ago. I still believe in dominant foot in front.
But have also have been experimenting lately with some alternative footworks like
Being square. But some of that is dependent on what ball im receiving and
Also thanks for the kind words :)
Loved the corn hole analogy!!
Glad it helps!
great video! do you have a video about the backhand drop?
Glad you enjoyed it! Check out this video ruclips.net/user/shorts_tsLCLgnp9s
I am wondering, how you would adjust if you set up for a drop but notice the opponent didn't advance towards net, do you switch from that short backswing to drive or would you still drop? Love your explanation and humor!!😅
I'd often hit an in between. A little soft drive that goes further than a drop would.
The apex comment gave me such a useful visual to work on! Thank you!
Glad to hear it!
Your corn hole bag analogy was very illustrative.
Glad it was helpful!
which grip should we use when we to the drop shot? thanks
Great video and detailed instructions, thank you!
Glad it was helpful!
Quick question about L1 - Loose Grip… when I loosen my grip, I feel like I get more “rim” “band” or “not sweet spot” hits leading to an inconsistent ball flight? When that happens , I feel like I’m not keeping my eye on the ball or maybe it’s bc I’m still carrying over my bad habit swings from Table tennis?! Aka, trying to do the advance option to the MAX! Tons of top spin!
yeah, start with a more flat lifting ball, and you're going to have to really rep it out. Then move to topspin after you got the first version down!
This may be a dumb question... I'm new to pickleball coming from tennis. I've never even played a match of pickleball or anything. So like I said this may be a dumb question. Typically in tennis when I hit a drop shot I do it with a slice to keep the ball low so it doesn't have much bounce and it forces the opponent to hit a slice back giving you the opportunity to go from defense to offense potentially. I would think that would be beneficial in pickleball as well. But all the video and matches that I've watched they typically utilize a topspin drop like you mentioned in this video. I guess my question is why is topspin preferred over a slice?
Lots of players use both.
if you hit a topspin ball, it dips down and often causes the player at the net to short hop the next shot. that short hop is tricky and can lead to errors into the net or pop ups.
I use both. On my backhand, I typically slice, and on my forehand, I typically hit topspin. That's my preference right now mainly because of ability. I don't have the two handed topspin drop just yet.
I love this video but have a question about not stepping onto the court until the third shot, if I’m still at the baseline, what to do if the opponent hits the return (2nd shot) into the kitchen? Now I have to hustle to the kitchen line ….
Yes. True! You would. This happens less frequently as most people will hear the advice (and it's good advice). Return deep to keep your opponent from getting to the kitchen.
In my experience, people occasionally try to hit a drop shot return.
BUT,
1. it's a difficult shot.
2. And if they do it successfully once and it hurts you, just adapt and be ready for the next one!
And you're right with the "foot" thing. A. BALANCE is the issue. You can be balanced with a closed stance, an open stance or even on the run. Otherwise, we would fall down every time we run. Wheelchair players play pickleball, and they're certainly not worried about their feet. In tennis, I actually have players purposefully hit off-balance in a lot of different ways - not that bad balance is ever an ideal situation, but our laziness and our opponents will constantly cause us to be off-balance. We should be able to at least get the ball back, even if our balance is horrible. Great job with this video!
Really well said!
Great info - thank you for posting! Gonna work on my third shot drop!👍👍
Love it!!
Loose grip gives you more feel and allows the spin to take over. Also makes your arm and paddle work as one unit. Firm pressure decreases spin and increases power. I come from billiards and same holds true there. You get more spin with a loose grip and fluid stroke than with firm grip and tense arms.
Exactly! Great input!
When you do the top spin drop, looks like the paddle no longer stays or starts in front of you (always visible), but is slightly behind you, correct? Thanks for explaining everything so well, really appreciate and learn from it!
I still try to keep it in front of me as much as I can. Sometimes I let my technique slip.
LOVE your demos and explanations!!
Thanks, glad you enjoyed it!
I love your channel! this is great! Thanks for the thorough explanation.
Absolutely! Thanks for the kind words
Good stuff ,, very helpful . Can always pick up something I can use .
These are wonderful instructions and illustrations! Thank you!
Glad it was helpful!
Wondering if an underspin 3rd shop drop would be as effective, or more effective, than a topspin drop. Can you explain why, or why not ? I’m a new Pickleball player ( former tennis player ) Also, differences between drop shot and dink ?
Drop shot happens from the baseline. Dink happens up near the kitchen.
And on my backhand, i exclusively use a backspin because I find it more consistent. Both can be good for sure! Good to have both!
This is a technique to add to do third shot drops. Just add pace gradually during drills to simulate actual returns and under pressure moments. You may find the same 'techniques' also apply in defensive 'resets', like soft grip , only change might be double hand grip for some.
Exactly!
Love the graphics.
Great explanation. Thanks
Hi Kyle, great video! Thanks for making this. Btw where is the link you mentioned at the end of the video on how to train the third shot drop?
Video coming soon! Gotta finish editing it
Awesome can’t wait!
Fantastic video man! What grip are you using to demonstrate the forehand drops in this video? Traditionally people have taught continental but as the game evolves, it looks like an eastern grip is becoming more popular as the primary grip with some switching to continental for a few shots. What do you think?
I use primarily continental, but yes, you're right. A lot of pros do switch their grips at different times for specific shots.
Do you have your index finger on the paddle? What are your thoughts on that vs a continental grip. Thanks
Yeah, I do that a lot I've realized. I'm actually not sure if thats good or bad yet, I need to figure that out.
I use continental a good amount.
You mentioned clicking on a link for how to train 3rd drops with topspin. I don’t see it anywhere. I would like to watch it.
Yes, that's coming soon, either tomorrow or next week. Making that decision tonight.
I said click here, only because I know this next video would be done this week, and wanted people to be able to go right to the drill video for the future.
So just one week delay! But it's coming soon, i promise.
Bro just found out about APL this week. Can’t wait to watch you guys play for Season 2. Good luck!
Thanks man!
Thanks for the video. I would say thou that it's much easier to hit a 3rd shot drop when you're standing in no man's land (mid court) rather in the back court or base line where your more likely to either hit it into the net or leave hanging high for your opponent to slam.
Your position on the court is very important to determine what type of shot you want to hit and when.
If you're going to drill a 3rd shot drop do it from the baseline where you're more likely to be. You never, almost never, what to be standing in "no man's land."
Agree, that is why you are seeing many default to a 3rd shot drive on a hard deep return and then do a 5th shot drop off what is (hopefully!) a shorter volley...