British Soldiers stand up for Black American Soldiers | The Incident at Bamber Bridge - Reaction
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- Опубликовано: 10 июл 2021
- Alvin talks about the historical Battle of Bamber Bridge in a new segment called "What They Didn't Say!" More information is available in the book "Forgotten" by Linda Hervieux available from various sources on and off the internet. You can also reach Ms. Hervieux on / lindahervieux.author or on / lindahervieux .
You can watch the full "He Said, He Said, He Said - Live" episode "Is Depression Driving Your Car?" with special guest, Steven Welch LCSW-R, CASAC, CCTP on the following links:
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#Segregation #American #Military #Novel #Discrimination #Ally #England #Military #Confidential #Forgotten #Racist #Negro #White #JimCrow #Equality #CriticalRaceTheory #Inclusion #Equity #alvinking #vashboddie
My Grandfather was a white man, a cook in the British 8th Army that fought in north Africa and up through Italy in WW2, he told us stories about how he used to feed black American sergeants that were refused entry to the U.S. mess hall, he was disgusted by the treatment of these men by some of the US soldiers
My uncle who served in the War WW2 always said black soldiers were men led by white boys. And yes there was discrimination in supplies and treatment.
@@daistoke1314 TBF most troops were led by young, inexperienced officers. Mainly because they died in disproportionate numbers.
@@I_Don_t_want_a_handle good point, the same problem cropped up in British army as it expanded, young officers with limited or no experience being put into positions of command without the time to learn how to do the job.
God bless your grandfather❤️
In another video about this I heard there were white British soldiers who fought alongside black American soldiers as well.
A major point here was that the British public were used to seeing non-white troops before the US entered the war, and were encouraged to treat Indian, Māori, West Indian (Caribbean) and African troops the same as British, White Canadian, Australian, New Zealand or South African troops, sailors or airmen.
Same applies to France here.
French army got in trouble for treating the black soldiers good as well.
@@Londronable Look at what happened to the “ Haarlem Hell Fighters” in WWI.
@@Londronable Mmm! I served a few time with the French military and I certainly saw rampant racism by the French
@@jimwalsh8520 I doubt many people understand what "rampant racism" actually means.
It's a good thing we became less tolerant of it. A very, very, good thing and I encourage it to continue.
But let's not pretend things haven't slowly gotten better over time.
the merchant navy recruited thousand of Chinese men to work the ships,
the way they got treated after the war was disgusting, lucky i know about it as ex merchant seaman and come from Liverpool home of the UK's 1st chinatown
To all the Black Americans who fought for peace and to end the 2nd World War. THANK YOU for your service!
I think it is absolutely hilarious and quite brilliant that when asked to racially segregate their businesses, the bamber people put up signs saying “black troops only” hahahaha. I believe those business people would have said something along the lines of “put that in your pipe and smoke it.”
I think that sentiment was implied! lol!
they complied and segregated. That was the request right.
The period equivalent of a White Lives Matter sign.
My Dad was an Anti aircraft gunner in the Royal Navy , after a torpedo strike they went to Norfolk Virginia for repair. Once in port they went ashore.. jumped on a bus and went straight to the rear.. as we tend to do if there's a group. Anyway after a while they noticed everyone was staring at them and the bus wasn't going . Apparently a black woman informed them that whites had to sit at the front of a bus. To his dying day he could never understand the practice and to be fair neither can I.
I've said it before (as a Brit) Considering the Battle of Bamber Bridge, Fighting Nazi fascists while the very same thing was happening back home against our Black brother and sisters? You can see WHY the American establishment WOULDN'T want this to be COMMON KNOWLEDGE back home! Land of the Free, Home of the Brave? Just another soundbite in The State of the Nation?
What's the names of the US death camps set up for black people in the 1940s? I never heard of their existence before.
@@charleshowie2074 Irrelevant response to Kenneth's comment. The point is that the Nazi regime considered any coloured race to be inferior to those of Northern European descent, i.e. that whites were inherantly superior to black and brown people, which was exactly the thinking behind segregation in the US. There may not have been 'death camps' but the groundwork was in place and who knows how it might have developed!
@@rayjennings3637 The worst crimes of Nazi Germany, in my humble opinion, were the death camps they set up for mass extermination of civilians. Our friend said that the very same thing was taking place in the US at the same time. I had not heard of this and asked what the names of the camps were. I do not understand how that is irrelevant to what he said.
If I misunderstodd his meaning then that's my bad and I apologise. I'd not heard about that of which you speak. My comment was in response to his words, "... fighting Nazi fascists while the very same thing was happening back home against our Black brother and sisters?". I interpreted those words in the general sense of fighting the oppression put upon the black people and native Americans in that country. I would be equally interested to hear of any properly authenticated cases of so-called 'death camps' for black people in the US.
@@rayjennings3637 Maybe you are able to read people's minds in a way that I cannot. Unfortunately, I can only read and respond to what people actually say. If they did mean 'it should not be forgotten that while the US was fighting the Nazis oppression (though at a far less degree and scale) was also taking place at home' that would be entirely uncontroversial but that is not what they said.
There is an interview from WW2 where a Londoner was asked what they thought about US soldiers that were in Britain. He said, "I love the Americans! It's a shame they brought the white fellas over with them though!". Enough said!. 🇬🇧🇺🇸❤
This is an awesome quote! Thanks for sharing it!!
My Mother was evacuated to her in laws house in Lytham with my Sister from Manchester and she said that the black soldiers were politer and cleaner than the white ones and they never sat down in your house without permission, which is considered rude in Britain. She said some of the white American soldiers from shitkicker, nowhere state, were totally out of their depth with the reality of living in Britain during the dark days of WW2. The black soldiers were more used to making do and mending and she got fed up of the constant, “ You should see America, everything is huge,we have no shortages blah blah blah, how can you live like this? Blah blah blah.” Because we decided that if Britain fell, it would be on the battlefield, not in a railway carriage.
The same in France during WW1.
Yeah - let’s see the interview 😉
@@tmahe28 I am neither a archivist or a secretary my petal🤣. Although it must be said, I'm no stranger to a deep delve atop of a cluttered desk😜. Enjoy your research mate 👍
Is this really, solely black history? (I will say at the start that my father had once been a slave…and like him, I have aimed to appreciate the good in all people regardless of race). I’ve long been aware of the Bamber Bridge story and the locals who treated their fellow man with humanity. They share this story because they showed the black soldiers a normal reciprocal regard even though their fellow Americans did not. Here in Britain in the 1950’s, when I was seven, I had a best friend who had a white mother and black father. We never seemed to notice each other’s skin colour. We were just normal friends and she was really popular. I’m hopeful for a time when we no longer have separated histories but share a joint future without prejudice.
The woke globalists and the crap theyve pulled off like unchecked immigration and failed Middle East policies have created way more racism compared to the 1980s and 1990s here in the UK.
Dear Susan, my mum is Austrian and was a little girl when American tanks rolled into her little Tyrol village she remembers that from the turret emerged a black soldier. The kids were bemused as they had never seen a black person before. They soon realised this was friendly when they all got sweets and chocolates! They learned when tanks came treats came with it and no one was ever left out. They were free of the fear of the Nazis and treated as special for once. The sickening thing is the servicemen went home to segregation.
Kind regards Martin.
@@martinotoole9959 ❤️
It's a tricky question, in a way I agree that distinguishing history into history and black-history categories is in itself a form of segregation and so should be avoided, I think it was Morgan Freeman that said the way to make racism to go away was to just stop talking about it, but I can also see that there is a whole lot more 'white-history' in our history books, so it does help to make it more easily searchable so that it gets the attention it deserves.
@@BrianC1664 I remember that comment from Morgan Freeman and felt it was sensibly just common sense. If you genuinely see just a fellow human being in a man or woman, then colour becomes irrelevant.
Hi. I live near Bamber Bridge in the UK. The story isn't that well known outside the town because it was essentially hushed up so as not to damage UK/US relations during the war. The back story to this is that the black soldiers were regular customers in the village pubs, befriending locals (including white British soldiers). They mixed, played cards/darts, etc and were well respected.
The white US military police were also stationed near by and would drink at the same bars. They resented the non- segregation and tensions boiled over when they were beaten by British soldiers for threatening a black soldier who was served a drink while they waited.
When the US authorities demanded segregation, the pubs response with 'black troops only' signs was and act of defiance. White locals and black troops continued to socialise..
On the night of the 'battle', military police tried to arrest a black soldier for improper uniform and were actually confronted and beaten up by British soldiers and locals.. their vehicles were then pelted with beer bottles as they left.
Unfortunately they returned with reinforcements and there were casualties. As you say, the black troops raided the armoury but in hindsight this just gave the authorities the excuse to label it as a mutiny.
The Old Hob Inn is still standing.
There were lots of incidents that outraged the local population regarding racial discrimination. A relative told me of a black soldier being beaten unconscious by white US troops simply because he chatted to her at a bus stop. The local police tried to persue it but were the US authorities wouldn't cooperate.
In New Zealand there was a huge brawl and riot between Kiwi troops and US troops because the Americans didn't want the Maori soldiers mixing with them. The problem followed the US army wherever it went.
The manner street riot still makes me chuckle, honestly, Americans having the audacity to tell native Maori to not enter a bar in their own lands🤣 like, wtf...
I learned about this at uni. It's good to know that Bamber Bridge wasn't the only place that black American soldiers were welcomed by the towns hosting US forces. It seems that the British often stuck two fingers up to the white American soldiers who expected segregation to be observed in the UK, as it was back home.
How incredibly sad that a black G.I. lost his life to an American bullet :(
@@miaschu8175 not saying everything was equal here in the UK but we didn't have the segregation like in the US. After the war Britain was trying to rebuild because of the heavy bombing. Those war babies grew up listening to blues music and re introducing it to the USA .
Me too- Preston
There was also a major riot in Australia.
In a similar vein I once heard this story on PBS.
During WWII a US freighter was torpedoed of the coast of Canada, many of the crew were black and many managed to reach the coast of Canada in a fairly isolated area. The people in a small coastal town rushed to the beaches to help the survivors but were shocked when the black sailors screamed and shouted to the Canadian women to stay away from them.
The Canadians were stunned by their attitude until someone explained that if they were in the USA the black sailors would be beaten and arrested for having contact with a white woman.
Even though these were brave sailors who had been thrown into the sea by an enemy attack, they were terrified at the prospect of being touched by white women.
The Canadians were horrified and called the Canadian Army who sent someone to explain that they were in Canada and were PERFECTLY SAFE.
The Canadians took the sailors into their homes and tended to them. The PBS report was about a group of those surviving sailors who, long after the war, went back to the Canadian town to thank those wonderful, caring people.
Wow. Amazing story! Thank you!
I live in Liverpool only 30 miles or so from bamber bridge. I had heard this story years ago and forgotten about it. Thank you for sharing and highlighting this story. Personally I think it should taught, highlighted and remembered.
Agreed. The more we know about where we've been, the more we can grow and the further we can go. Thanks for checking out the clip!
Similar thing happens in wavertree Liverpool in the pub opposite edge hill station. couple white yanks mouthed off where quickly shown the door. And told your kind aren’t welcome. It didn’t go any further but because of that tale I new about bamber bridge. I think that happened all over GB. During the war. I’m ashamed how farage and the torys have dragged us down.
@@garygalt4146 You need to grow up. The Labour lot were out leafleting the third world, extollling the benefits of living in Britain. All fighting age men with no dependants. The NHS have had 6 million newly registered patients. It has nothing to do with racism. It's a healthy respect for the national population who are already struggling to cope with an aging infrastructure and lack of accomodation for our own people and a large group of young men who have totally different values to us, floodng across the channel. They see women as being second class and treat them accordingly. Stop labelling everything with a racist slant and try opening your eyes for once in your life and see things how they really are. Either that or go over to their respective countries and see it for yourself like i did.
@@garygalt4146 A bit unfair to compare the Tories with Farange. The Tories prime motivation is money, while Farange is an opportunistic nationalist. Although I think Boris is more like Farange than the average Tory.
@@SarthorS Both Johnson & Farage are traitors imo. They've sold this country & its people down the line for a quick profit.
I'll bet the British were impressed with the politeness of black US soldiers, who were suddenly in a different world. We would have thought theses guys are very nice people. Even though the British had maintained a great empire for centuries, it wouldn't have occurred to them as hosts to treat others like that. There was racism in the UK like there is all over the World, but not on such a fundamental scale. I hope we've all moved on.
I`m sure that the Black soldiers ,seeing all white faces ,would have felt that they must use `Sir` and `Ma`am`, as they had been conditioned to do. They would have been sent to rural places, as this was where the U.S. camps were to be situated, and it would have been only a generation or so back that the English villagers were expected to doff their hats to the wealthier people , to the Doctor, Vicar ,rich landowners etc.
.So the novelty of having this civility offered to them would have made them even more impressed with the manners of the visitors. Then ,when the Southern whites appeared ,not only did they have felt the necessity of putting their countrymen back in their place ,but also would have seen the British attitude as stupid and ignorant and shown it .Naturally ,it would have been very much resented ,"Strangers trying to tell us what to do in our own country!"
@@gillcawthorn7572 "Strangers trying to tell us what to do in our own country!"
It's like that now.
@@gillcawthorn7572 What you say about manners is very true. Show others respect and guess what...they'll like you!
@@DanA-fk6tl Unfortunately such a comment is wasted on the self-entitled. But I suppose it came back to bite them in the (rear) end
The American GI was paid about twice his Anglo equivalent iirc which made them very popular with the ladies (the Aussies apparently really hated them) So as a Brit I can imagine the more polite demeanour of the black US soldier would have made a good impression and any relationships with the white Anglo women would be more discreet rather than the more brash and in your face white US soldier. And that's even before we get to any overt racism towards the blacks would have infuriated the locals
Im from Preston UK.. which Bamber bridge is a district of, not a separate town, laterally 3 miles from where i grew up on the other side of town, iv known about this story since i was 10 years old.. im 54 now, im so glad its getting world wide attention its getting now!
I am sure that in 1945 Bamber Bridge was a separate town, Preston's boundary was extended in 1974, I am not sure if Bamber Bridge is in South Ribble District or Preston.
As a nation I know us Brits don’t always get it right - but most of us are as anti-racist as you can be. The incident at Bamber Bridge was a sad indictment of how the USA treated its black servicemen who were prepared to give up their lives not just for the USA but for us in Europe. Those black servicemen were heroes. Shame on the USA for how they treated their own servicemen. And all these years on its sad to see that the black population has to speak out again again at racism via the BLM. They shouldn’t have to but the fact they do is evidence that many countries still have a long way to go.
When my dad , God rest him, came over to England from Galway he saw in the windows of lodging houses a sign, No Irish, no Blacks no Jews or dogs. When I left home he feared I would struggle getting digs , his memory scarred by his experience of the past. That was the 50's and we all grew up thank God.
@@martinotoole9959 Iv heard of the "no blacks, no dogs,no Irish" but not no Jews ???. I think it was different with the Irish as the English/British have a long history. Plus there was (and is) a feeling amongst English people that the Irish will hate you just because you are English
Blm have caused more people to be rscialist we don't like the term white privilege
@@lightfootpathfinder8218 he's just made it up mate. But you can't prove he has so just let him get on with it
@@markbrown4127 we should be used to the crap they spout by now but it's stil lies
The pub (or Public House if you prefer in the States), the Ye Olde Hob Inn in Bamber Bridge is my local pub. There is a blue plaque commemorating the event.
The black soldiers were the first Americans to come to England in wartime, because they were not fighting troops but used for the labouring jobs like preparing camps and airfields .Like you say ,they were treated as different and honoured visitors and welcomed by the English .Don`t forget that there were many young British men missing from their homes ,who were themselves fighting abroad, so for dances ,trips to the cinema etc ,English girls were pleased to have the escort of the Americans .
When the White Americans ,the fighting troops, arrived they found that all the girls already had American boyfriends ,some of whom had been welcomed to visit into English homes. Blacks were used to using all the public facilities ,shops ,pubs etc and ,of course ,had they chosen to accept that they were in a different culture ,so would the White Americans have been welcomed .Unfortunately, a decision was made that the status of the Whites had to be maintained ,so orders were put out that a colour bar should be put in place ,as if it were the States .British people don`t like being told what to do in their own country by outsiders, so these attempts failed badly ,as the Battle of Bamber Bridge shows ,with the British taking the side of those they could see were being oppressed .
Although it is included in a work of fiction ,a very good account is shown in `The Chequer Board` a book by the author Neville Shute. Although the setting is in the South West of England ,it tells how a local pub landlord wrote to Winston Churchill ,the Prime Minister ,to alert him to the troubles being caused to the local people by the American authorities ,this actually did happen.
This is awesome additional information as to how things unfolded. It makes perfect sense that being sent over early would give the soldiers the opportunity to get settled and experience life without the racial oppression from the U.S.
Thank you for your comment and for turning us onto "The Chequer Board!"
@@hesaidhesaidhesaidlive One part of this story that really resonates with British people is the part where the US MPs complained to the owner of the pub, and demanded that he put up signs indicating that his pub was segregated
The very British response was to say "ok", then he put up signs saying "Black troops only" - so no more fights could break out with the people the locals had accepted and befriended
in fact it seems that all three of the pubs in Bamber did the same, honouring the request of the American military police - but leaving the white officers and MPs nowhere to drink
www.lancs.live/news/lancashire-news/true-story-behind-battle-bamber-16526991
A quote I have read elsewhere said "We quite the American servicemen, they are friendly and very polite. But we don't like those white fellas they have brought along with them"
The British not only don't like being told what to do in their own country,; they especially wouldn't stand for it in their own pub.
Britain had a similar opinion in India. They have a strict caste system and the British tended to totally ignore it giving "untouchables" the same rights as everybody else. Really annoyed the locals.
Couldn’t overcome everything though, when Brighton Pavilion was turned into a hospital for Indian soldiers in WW1 they had to segregate between the Hindus and Muslims, doctors, nurses and kitchens all kept apart.
The situation would have arisen wherever there were American soldiers in Britain because we didn't have segregation anywhere. It's wasn't just no segregation in Bamber Bridge. Remember Britain had its Empire. We were used to seeing people from all over the world, of any colour or religion, in our schools, hospitals or streets. The smaller the town, the less likely you were to see them, but they existed. There were rich Indian princes at Eton & going to Oxbridge universities. They also played cricket, which made them gentlemen in our eyes. We had the Caribbean, & Australia & New Zealand with their aborigines & Maori. We even had the Gurhkas, one of the most impressive military units in the UK. There were instances of racism, not everything was perfect, but we had no segregation. That's not the British way, especially when we're all together fighting a common enemy.
Even today, racism is not a problem in the UK like it is in American. We don't have a different word for British people who are not white. The US calls them African-Americans, we simply call them British. Yes, there are elements of racism around still, such as the police stopping & searching black young men more often than their white counterparts, but the vast majority of the British population does not want it.
Take Megan Markle (I think she's kept her maiden name). Most of us didn't know she wasn't white. We assume she simply had a tan. When we found out, it didn't change what we thought of her or how she was reported in the British media. We were all delighted that Harry had settled down & seemed happy. He'd done some wild things when he was young (like going to a party in a Nazi costume), then he joined the army, volunteering to put his life on the line for his country. We wanted to celebrate his marriage with him & her. But then the stories started to come out about how Megan was behaving & upsetting some members of the royal family. Even now, after everything that's happened, you still don't see racist attacks on her in the media because they know the British public wouldn't accept it. Pick fault with her behaviour or attitude, yes, but never with her colour. Hating someone because of an inherent characteristic over which she has no control is disgusting. It's a simple as that.
All black skin means is a person's ancestors lived in an area where the sun was hot so their skin evolved over time to protect them. That's all. It does not make the person bad/good or better/worse than anyone else. It just is. I've never understood racism.
That's about the best summation of Britishness I've ever heard. It brought tears to my eye's. Makes me proud to be British.
@@simonmonk7266 Thank you, Simon.
Bunker Harry never put his life on the line in the army. If you want to know more about that check out TrevorCoultMC He’s an heroic British veteran who will open your eyes on Harry’s army days. Everything else you said 👍
@@farrahwalker6222 Yes 6 soldiers guarding him 24/7 so he didnt get into trouble they were expected to shield him against bullets or anything harmful at the risk of there life
Angela have to say I understand why police stop black peoplecin London because its black youths killing black people. They are trying to save life's by finding knives
The British attitude at Bamber Bridge mirrored the rest of the British. You can draw back to Tudor England when it was decreed that Enlish air was too pure for a slave to breath therefore, any slave who stes foot on English soil, is a free man. The Chruch of England welcomed them and indeed, bye the late 1600s early 1700s, there were ordained black priests in the CofE. Having travelled extensivley, the racism witnessed shocked me, even in the USA and mainland Europe is awful
Wow thanks for that comment , very interesting
Slavery was unofficially abolished after the Norman conquest, when it became illegal to sell slaves within England. Instead the Normans imposed serfdom, slavery in all but name, upon the English. It took nearly a thousand years before the ordinary man could have a say in how his own country could be run.
@@I_Don_t_want_a_handle And years before any other country. Aboliton act 1833 but was in force from 1780 in reality. The Royal Navy blockaded West Africa and took out Portugese, Spanis, South American and Yank slavers. Serfdom is a word you should look up but, not on google, in a library
@MeteorMeanderer Magna Carta did not apply to serfs but to the Barons, Church and a tiny number of freemen who were not serfs.
The ordinary man did not get a say in the UK until 1918, the ordinary woman 10 years later.
@@I_Don_t_want_a_handle Actually it did apply, the Normans abolished serfdom, if you like slavery. i think you should try a libraryold sport
And that's 1 of the reasons I'm proud to be British
On the global peace index, the UK sits at #33. The US sits at #122 - out of a total of 163 on the index.
@@wessexdruid7598 im glad im a kiwi as nz is 4th in the GPI and 6th in the index of economic freedom
@@bodybalanceU2 Don't tell everybody - they'll all want to come.
@@wessexdruid7598 oh sh*t thats right nz doesn't exist - not on the maps anyway
Never deny a man, a beer. Humanities written rule. or a fruit based drink for the ladies.
There was a similar incident called "the battle of Manners St" in New Zealand,US white troops wouldn't allow Maori soldiers to drink in the same bar, it too was hushed up to keep up morale and discipline.
I was raised in Bamber Bridge and once lived in the street leading to the American camp. We played in it as kids before it was demolished to make way for housing. The original gatehouse survived to be used by a telecoms company and still exists. I love this guy’s pronunciation of Lancashire.
He could probably say it better if he took that gum out of his mouth.
Everbody knows it's pronounced Lankushuh
He's got our number. Lol
Makes this Brit proud.
GBA. 🇬🇧🇺🇸.
You missed the bit where the local men were fighting alongside the black soldiers against the military police. Guilty of having a drink and a nice time.
That would never do.
The woman was fighting as .
@@sharonrowland9030 Yes, your right Sharon , I slipped up when I spoke and apologise for my error. Forgive me and kind regards Martin.
Sharon. I apologised in the best way i could. Please respond and say its all cool, I don't want to piss off anyone, and God forbid a lady. P.S. that's not sexist, it's just sadly trying to be a gentleman in a smartphone world.
@@martinotoole9959 sorry not been on for a few day. All is cool. Dont worry. Thanks for reply.
I am a Brit and I have never heard of this it's just terrible how the American army treated the black soldiers, even in those days of a World War when they were meant to be fighting a common enemy.
Incidents like this happened all over the country.
Then the men went home to a place where it was illegal to sit with a white person No sir. That's wrong on every level I despise prejudice , freedom is a basic human right unless you go to prison whatever your colour, race or sex. I'm getting old but I love my fellow man.
Have a look at Floyds War , a Police series set in WW2 , one of the episodes tackles this issue.
Thanks for posting this, Alvin. I’m a white middle aged English male and didn’t know about this particular, disgusting event but it reminded me of an old episode of Foyle’s War TV series called Killing Time (storylines were often based on true events) which used a very similar scenario and the writer Anthony Horowitz, who did meticulous research into the WWII period, could well have known about and been inspired by this event. In the storyline the eponymous hero, Chief Superintendent Foyle, is forced to issue an order for segregation as part of the storyline but, as the IMDB webpage Trivia section points out: “The British did not ban contact between Black American service personnel and English women. Ronald Bailey, author of "Homefront: U.S.A." in the Time-Life World War II book series, said that British civilians often joined on the side of African-American soldiers in brawls against prejudiced white American servicemen.” As someone posted here, this isn’t Black History it is History and everyone both sides of the Pond (and elsewhere) SHOULD know about this. So thank you for educating me.
British soldiers stepped in to defend the black soldiers too. You also failed to mention that local people also fought to defend their black visitors.
I am English and was brought up by my parents to believe that all people are the same, black, white brown, made no difference, as a young man I was an Engineer in the British Merchant Navy and visited Baton Rouge, I went into a Bar and Grill for Lunch, I was ignored by the Bar maid, the owner asked me if I was new in town, I said that I had just arrived, take a look around you, you're the only white boy in here, the penny dropped, I apologised and started to leave, he invited me to stay, asked me where I was from. I said England, don't you have this in your country he said, No, it would not be allowed,, after I had dined he told me when you are in Baton Rouge, you go where the white folks go. I am now 69 years old and that memory is still with me.
I use to live near Bamber Bridge,the pub involved is still there and you can still see some bullet holes in the outside wall.
Last year I cycled the 17 miles from Ormskirk Railway Station to The Hob Inn at Bamber Bridge, I had Bangers & Mash (that's sausages and mashed potatoes) for lunch washed down with a traditional hand pulled real ale, to which I gave a toast to those servicemen in WW2. I have to confess that going back I cycled the 4 miles to Preston Railway Station to catch the train home.
We call sausages 'Bangers' because if you don't prod the skin, they go bang in the frying pan!!!!
I always wondered where the name came from! I take the skins off before frying…
There's another similar one called the battle of the Grafton white US troops from RAF Brutonwood demanded the removal of West Indian troops from the Grafton ballroom in Liverpool a large fight insured
Happened in a naffi in North Leicestershire two home guard were in there at the bar and a black us soldier wanted some grub so he sat down and started eating. When in walked two white us soldiers who got drinks and immediately started on the black soldier. The two home guard didn't like it so gave the two white soldiers a good pasting. The home guards co dragged em in next day and had to explain what happened.
A more modern look at the differences between UK and US attitudes towards racial issues here.
A couple of years ago I watched a video here on youtube that had mixed race couples from the US who where living over here in the UK, these couples were not mixed race themselves but rather one black partner with one white partner (just to make that clear).
All couples shown said the same thing (each in their own words) that when they started seeing each other they all got crap from their own kind, both partners of each couple, when they married they were all disowned by their own kind (now that "own kind" attitude right there shows a tendency to believe that we are not the same, we are not alike, we are different, and so why should we all be treated the same, or even equally), black friends and family alike all disowned the black partners from these couples as well as the white friends and families of the white partners doing likewise and that to me shows me that in some instances (but not all) that black folk in the US can also be just as at fault for driving a wedge between folk of various tones.
Anyway I digressed, all of these couples just wanted to get away from it all for a short while and chose to come to the UK for their honeymoons and when they arrived here they were coming through customs not even holding hands (because they were so used to not doing so in public), they admitted they felt intimidated into not showing the slightest amount of fondness for each other never mind intimacy, but when they exited customs and entered the main terminals they were suddenly left totally agog.
They all said that they expected more of the same here in the UK and so showed some restraint as they were expecting a majority white nation to be pretty much similar in attitudes as the US, but what they saw instead was couples everywhere who were all of different colours openly showing displays of total affection, at that moment their surprise turned to joy and they really enjoyed the freedom of being a couple without being judged, that was right up until they had to pack up and go back home to the US where they knew what to expect, at this point I can liken that exact feeling to the black GI's going back to the US and segregation after experiencing the welcome they had from a white population in the UK.
It wasn't long before all of the couples felt overpowered by the attitudes and judgementalism back in the US that they couldn't wait to earn enough to get the hell back out of Dodge and get back to the UK even if only for a short break and they all made up their minds to emigrate to the UK and live here full time, I mean I guess having lost their friends and families they had nothing else to lose and a whole bunch of happiness to gain, but they all came across as being the happiest of couples claiming to be the happiest that they have ever been but sadly it was evident that that happiness would not have been possible without having to leave the US to live in the UK.
I have looked for the video many times since and just can't find it, I guess it would just be like looking for a needle in a haystack but if found it is a video with an eye opening insight straight from the horses mouth so to speak, and yes we do have our element of racist arseholes here in Britain, but every country in the World has an element of it's population that are racist but when I see videos like that one about those couples and videos like this about things like Bamber Bridge, it really does make me wonder about how bad Britain is made out to be by some people but I guess only bad news makes the news and the many many instances of how good we are never get mentioned.
Well done sir, keep learning and finding out the real truth. Big loves and kisses from England:-) Xx
Thanks for the love, Milo. We really appreciate it! If you haven't already, check out other clips from our show and consider tuning in or catching a full episode sometime.
Segregation was never practised in the UK. We brits are a bit odd but we have a very strong sense of fair play, discriminatory behaviour towards men in uniform at that time just didn't happen, banning the white GIs was a clear message as to what white British people thought of segregation.
Also remember the British abolished slavery some 60 years before the US. Just think a little after 30 years of American independence slavery was abolished in the empire. US slaves that escaped would try to get Canada which also had the same British laws.
This happened all over the place, like Bristol and Bath, to name a couple.
there were similar incidents in New Zealand and Australia as well
And Plymouth and Liverpool 👍
Seems to be a common thing during that period, can remember my Grandparents talking about similar incidents in my town and my wife's relatives talking the same subject 126miles apart.
I am sure it was a common thing during that period. It's lovely to hear of the different stories and how the different communities responded.
Thanks for checking out the clip and for the comment!
Actually I wouldn't be here if it was for three black G. I. s giving my Gran blood during the war 🤔🙏❤️
@@hesaidhesaidhesaidlive both of the communities had more than the war in common, and still do have if people clear the smoke out of the way.
Wow, @@carljones7380! That's amazing. I love hearing stories of the things that connect and bind us!
Hi
I live close to Bamber Bridge. Thanks for that one. Love it. Thanks for all the black US soldiers that fought for the freedom of the world.
This is an awesome sentiment. Fighting for freedom seems to mean more especially when you don't really have it yourself.
Similar situation occurred in Australia.
Another group worth research are The Harlem Hellfighters who fought in WW 1 as part of The French Army. One of the best records of any unit involved.
There's a great video on RUclips from the 1940's where Burgess Meredith talks to the American troops about how English white people treat black people, it's actually quite funny 'Look, they're talking to the black feller like he's an equal'
Ironically the empire did make us more aware of other creeds and cultures. Burgess Meredith should have been in that pub in his other job, as Rocky’s trainer. The length of that battle is astonishing. God knows how long street battles would have gone on for if Hitler had invaded? I can imagine it would have taken decades to totally control the whole country. A re-run of when the Romans faced the ancient Britons.
Good stuff, so much untold history still to go! Well done! 👍🏾
Thank you, Rod! Let us know if there are any stories you'd like for us to investigate!
@@hesaidhesaidhesaidlive will do, subbed and great coming across your channel.
I am from Bamber Bridge, I knew about it but not in any detail, it's only this last couple of years after Black Americans have found out and interest about the story has spread that I have found out about it more. I'm guessing most of the guys who were there are gone now, it really deserves a more accurate analysis before more information is lost. There is a memorial plaque opposite the Hob Inn pub.
I've lived 2 miles away from bamber bridge my whole life there is now a memorial and a garden there to remember the events.
We are proud and grateful for the service of black soldiers here in the UK and we do not tolerate racism.
I really recommend a video called "Britain's Crusade Against Slavery," It's one of our nations proudest historical moments.
Bamber Bridge escalated because the British solders in question were paratroopers, so the first group of us military police didn't do well in the first fight that started it all off!
Thanks for this great video.
It's estimated there are 10 million in modern slavery still. No matter how tough things were in the past and in absolutely no way am I undermining the treacherous things, it makes me stomach turn that people in 2022 are focusing on themselves when they weren't personally affected and they never mention the 10 million.
As a disabled person that's had blatant discrimination a number of times, I refuse to be a victim and give my power away. If I'm willing to take praise when things go well in my life, I must take responsibility when they're not going well. I take longer to get there because of my health but that's OK.
I firmly believe we have a responsibility to help others and what better way than helping just 1 of the 10 million. Imagine what could be achieved if everyone used their energy in a positive way instead of political division 🌍💜🥰
I agree. We are stronger together. Thanks for the comment. I hope things are beautiful where you are!
So tragic makes me so sad to think about it , am only grateful that the Brits did the honable thing
Read about how the Brits abolished slavery
My mother and father lived through the second world war in Brirain. They were happy to have the Americans finally fighting beside us. My parents generation didn't see them as black and white just American allies fighting beside us. Black blood was the same colour.
Wow. I live in Lancashire, five miles from Bamber Bridge and had never heard of these events before.
Thanks for everything you said, it was an important piece of history and not just Black history, people's history.
2miles away from my house and I didn’t even know this was a race thing, makes Me proud to be from here!
It’s a great legacy. Thank you!
And this why I love my home county of lancashire 🌹
Thank you for forgiving us for mispronouncing the name!☺
@@hesaidhesaidhesaidlive haha no worries mate, try pronouncing Gloucestershire or Worcestershire, Americans find these names particularly difficult. Good video by the way
🇬🇧 The REAL land of the free 🇬🇧
😁👍👏👏👏👏👏👏
Learnt about this in modern history at school here in the UK.
Hey dude, im a British white fella & just wanted to say i didn't know about this incident, but what i do remember when growing up in the 1980's, this lovely elderly black gentleman used to always sot outside his house & he told us stories, great story-teller actually, & we lived his accent as still American & as a kid, in the 80's thats like a movie-star accent, was so cool, he said that he & supposedly 100's of other black g.i.'s moved to UK after ww2 as so open & fair, unlike USA back then, many settled in UK after ww2 for this reason, did u know that?
FYI in UK i never knew any specific issue btw. Blacks & whites per say, except the odd nutter on either side, likewise police nothing like in your country, the only race issue we have seemingly always had & v.much still do is the in-ability for islam & all others to mix sadly. In Leeda where im from was always white & black together fighting muslim gangs which of course not my thing but everyone knows it, thats deep rooted animosity simply as no integration which is sad FYI
The US authorities demanded the local pubs at Bamber bridge provide segregation. So they obliged with 'black troops only' signs in their windows. US Miltary police tried to arrest a black soldier for improper dress and there was resistance. Later more US MPs tried to arrest black soliders and one was shot dead. This led to the misunderstanding by the black solidiers back at the base that the US MPs were out to kill them and they armed themselves with a gun fight ensuing.
Today the blacks that are in Britain shout racial prejudice etc all the time and point out how in the 60s boarding houses had signs in their windows that said 'No blacks, No Irish, No dogs'. You have to ask yourself what changed, what was different?
Thanks for sharing this , I'm afraid to say that these attitudes still persist in your Military , I have worked with American service personnel stationed here in the UK , the Blacks and Whites did not mix when off duty , in contrast the British forces all go out together , of course our Armed Forces have never been segregated and we have not had any equivalent of the Jim Crow laws , it's not perfect here of course but we do not have the US race problem.
DID not have the US race problem. Nowadays, we have the exact same problem with Diversity, Equity, and Inclusion as the States. The RAF have been infested with segregationists banging on about "useless White Men."
All convictions were quashed.
I worked in Bamber Bridge and have been in that pub
I wish you could post a pic of you there!
Theirs was more than one incident of this kind in the UK, as segregation was a totally alien & unfair concept!!
Especially towards soldiers who were there to protect us from any invasion’s!!!
Nazi’s we’re only 20 miles away!!
Was told by my parents how grateful they felt to ALL soldiers who were willing to risk their lives to protect them!!
Sorry this happen in my home town in North Ireland we still remember them
We appreciate you all doing the right thing!
I never knew this and I live in the nex town to Bamber Bridge or as the locals call it Brig.
Thank you very much,I'm english and didn't now this
You're welcome 😊
I just love the spirit we have as British people. We (the majority of us) know wrong from right and don’t care about race. “Black troops only” is a classic British response to segregation
l used to live in Bamber Bridge, just outside Preston.
Wasn’t the only incident like this, in England, at the time.
Its something that's not talked about much maybe because of the British Empire, but with out the British Empire Slavery would have continued much longer than it did, maybe not even being stopped.
Well Britain did lead the Western world in abolishing slavery (though there's still some going on in the West these days and much more in the Middle East and Eastern parts)
The bloody legacy of the British Empire is not something to be proud of. Through vicious military conquest, it used enslavement, massacres, famines and partitions to create profit.
It was the largest empire ever known, covering a quarter of the world and colonising hundreds of millions of people. The Union flag represents its barbarity.
Its first colonies were established in Jamestown, north America, in 1607. Upon arrival, the British convinced the chief of the local Powhatan tribe that his people should be put to work supplying the colonisers with food.
If you look at all Empires its based on strong taking over the weak, The problem is what the British where doing in many cases where not as bad as what the locals had been doing before. But the point I was trying to make is when slavery is all over the World and then its stopped in one quarter of the World that has a big impact on the rest of the World . Now if the British had not made a stand against it I don't think it would have ended in America quite as soon as it did as the Republicans may not have won the 1860 election or even been formed as a party, So the Democrats would have probably won the 1860election and slavery would have gone on for much longer. But because its an Empire that helped stop it Its not talked about as something good.
there is a documentary with interviews that looks at how the experience of being in a non segregated country (and returning to the US after fighting) influenced the US civil rights movement.
This sounds amazing! Thank you!
the pubs were told to be segregated they put sighns in there windows saying black soldiers only. Also white British male and female soldiers plus white locals fought with the black soldiers agenst the white soldiers, it was a huge hoha. I'm extremely proud of how the Brits stood up for what was right.
Totally. All of that is detailed in the book!
Thank you so much. I am an Englishman who knew nothing of this, and we had mixed race Americans (by this I mean Americans of all persuasions, Hispanic, black, or white, even one chinese American) at one of our hotels in Yorkshire in the 1970's through until my parents eventually sold it in the early 2000's. these people were very well educated and they taught me so much about histroy, and physics, and just science in general. However this never cropped up at all.
Well hello there "the truth hurts", I am "truth hurts". It's only fair to warn you that I post some pretty controversial comments occasionally. Awfully sorry if you catch any flak from people thinking that you are me, I'm sure you are a much nicer person than I.
My Regards....
@@truthhurts9241 If you are using the name "Truth hurts" then as long as you are telling the truth there is nothing anyone can do or say. However if you are using the name and posting propaganda, then I am sure our paths will cross, and be prepared for a few truthful and possibly hurtful truths. Like the reason this here video should be taught in schools across the Uk is because we here in England banned slavery of any kind within England in 1066. The Anti slavery movement was a crusade, if you like, of Imperial Britian.
@@thetruthhurts7675 Hi, yes only the truth will do, and well researched at that. And that is what some people can't handle. Have you seen the video of How Britain stopped the slave trade, that's how I found out about all this, again, not from school. As for propaganda, there's enough of that C'rap on here already. Have a nice one.
@@truthhurts9241 Yes I saw that on RUclips I did know that William the Conqueror had banned slavery in 1066, what i didn't know was that it was almost a single handed batt;le for first England and then the Uk throughout history to stop slavery. To say I was impressed is to be modest here. Do have a good day.
@@thetruthhurts7675 Thanks mate, we British did used to be Great at times.
I live near this village. There is a monument in the village.
Wow.I live 5 minutes from Bamber Bridge
It's funny my great grandfather fought in Ww1 with African Americans and in ww2 my grandfather did the same. But I can tell u I have a village map from 1944 and it says it was so good the African Americans came into the village and drove every child round in willy jeeps. My grandfather recalled an ambulance pulling up at the farm to collect a patient . A pig to go of for a BBQ at there camp .ps that was a crazy risk in war raviged England . Go winterbourne gunner 🙂
Thanks for sharing this memory! Diversity in friendships is truly the key to a life well lived.
I was Born in Shepherds Bush London, Went to Primary and Secondary school with loads of different cultures, I don't see colour 🤔 x
Green means you can cross safely 😃👍
There were also incidents in Brisbane, Queensland and places further north as well during WWII. In Austalia, sorry.
Really? Do you have any details on these incidents? We'd love to know more!
Why did you say sorry? I cannot see the need, or is it sarcasm?
@@hesaidhesaidhesaidlive this is 6 part series I think you'd probably like to watch,
ruclips.net/video/-KHMFOe16OI/видео.html
@@SuperMYSHKIN It was apologising for an earlier blue. Mistake.
@@hesaidhesaidhesaidlive yes, I’m Australian and when Americans came here, the white American soldiers wouldn’t eat or sleep in the same building as black Americans. So the black Americans hung out with the white Australians, I think it was in Melbourne the doco I watched . Yes I knew about Darwin too. Must try and find the Melbourne ww2 doco of Americans here. I’ll post below here if I find it.
A similar thing happen in Queensland, Australia as well.
I've never heard of this.
Fairly certain a few off duty British soldiers came in on all the black GIs side as well as many locals, it was a riot that developed into a battle.
When can I see the movie directed by Steven Spielberg ?
What!!!! As a Black-born UK citizen, I was not taught this. It flies in the face of the realities my parents, from the Caribbean, experienced when they came to help rebuild the UK in the 1950s.
Thanks for your comment! It makes us feel pretty amazing that we were able to share some of the beauty of your home country and its people!
of course it does
It's a shame that people coming here from the Caribbean had to endure the attitudes they did. I feel part of it was socio-economic.. as in a general resentment of immigration. Part of my family came over from Ireland to be greeted with signs on pub doors that read 'no dogs, no Irish'. I have friends who have Polish and Ukrainian ancestry who also met with resentment. The major difference is, of course, that they were inconspicuous in an everyday setting and therefore didn't experience the same level of exposure. They didn't 'look' like immigrants.. as crude as that may sound. One generation down the line and they were completely amalgamated.. Caribbean and Indian people suffered a lot more because of this. Humans in general are pretty stupid animals. We search through all our similarities trying to find the slightest difference to get hung up about.
It's yet another stain on our history.
The Jamaican bus driver, who I'd talked to since I used to take that bus to school, asked me about the contemporary history course I was taking as a minor at uni. I told him that I was going to learn about colonialism and decolonisation.
He said that I was going to learn more about his history than he had, as he learned about the "Mother country" at school. I thought that was sad and wrong.
I chose the course because I wanted to learn about how racism started; it didn't make any sense to me. I understand now how racism starts, but not how it's perpetuated, or why intelligent/knowledgeable people continue to be racially prejudiced. It makes no sense.
It wasn't just black..there was signs saying no Irish etc. Let's not make out Caribbeans came as a sense of duty to rebuild the UK. They came for a better life which us to be respected. The issue was that it wasn't really distributed well so you had a lot of immigration in certain areas which alarmed locals. Imagine the same thing happening in Jamaica..
Fact is that it wasn't only blacks struggling at the time it was all people..high unemployment etc..I know because I grew up in that time.. it was hard.
On the whole we've found a way through..regardless of what the race baiting industry try and tell you.
Something similar happened in NZ about the same time
There were many US troops transiting through NZ at the the for the Pacific theatre and s group of white American soldiers were drinking in a bar in Wellington. A Maori (indigenous New Zealand) soldier came in and was told by the yanks that it was whites only and threw him out. When some NZ soldiers heard of this they came and returned the favour, none too gently. American MPs came as did more Kiwis
It got pretty rough and did not end well for those fine representatives of the US.
In our armed forces the Maori and Pakeha (white) soldiers fought side by side and there was much mutual respect between the two.
No place within the UK has a history of slavery. What we did have was serfdom, when titled landowners or nobility paid their workers a pittance to work the land, they lived in tied accommodation (owned by the landowners) and could be turfed out at will, whole families thrown on the scrap heap to live in abject poverty or transported to the new world as convicts for non payment of debt, or stealing a leaf of bread.
The crux of it is that although there was still a lot of ignorance and prejudice around non-whites in the UK (especially away from port cities) Britain never had segregation laws, and also didn't associate black people with slavery (the ignorance was more cultural around African stereotypes, living in tribes, hunting with spears etc). There were black players in sports teams, a black officer in WWI etc, even if the country was overwhelmingly white. There is a problem with the extrapolation white/black relations of the US' south as if that's the default position.
I have just found out that the New Railway Children 2 film involves what happened during WW11 at Bamber Bridge. I now have it on my viewing list. I knew nothing about this until listening to those who had heard of it. There have been tv series and some fil.s with the stories of The Black American GI's and how the people would not accept the US Military here trying to turn our hospitality in our establishments and people it seems into having segregated preferences. It did not happen and we were not a segregated Country then or ever.. I hope you watch the film and enjoy it.
You should title the video " the incident at bamber bridge - American reaction "
Always put American reaction in the title so it comes up on searches
Thank you for the suggestion. We'll give it a try and see what happens.
How did you find the video?
This also happen on a London bus black soldiers on the bus white soldiers cot on told women conductor to get the of she Replied this my bus and you get of
The British after 4 years of bombing, rationing and making do and mending, were not in the mood to be told what to do.
It was also the locals of bamber bridge and British soldiers both male and female who stood shoulder to shoulder with the black American soldiers! Which is why it was also famous, because allies fought against each other!
Ps also it wasn’t just bamber bridge, there were numerous incidents where locals all over the UK said NO to segregation!
It’s just that Bamber bridge ended in a gun fight! The others were just fist fights..
It really was a remarkable event!
'Forgotten'. Could it be a sign of 'progress' that 20 years later returning Vietnam solders were rejected, dismissed, and 'forgotten' - regardless of color?
What really grips as an Englishman, British and member of the Commonwealth, this till is very prevalent in the US today. All 350 million need a good backside kicking
It was white American soilders v black American and white British soilders.
Why no Hollywood movie of this?
I have just come across your film. There is a bit of a back story about the Lancashire character. The people of Bamber Bridge would have been fairly poorly paid workers in the cotton and rail industries etc. Used to hard work and deprivation. Their homes 2 up and 2 down terraced houses with open fires or cast iron ranges to cook on. Many would still have gas lighting. So in British terms they too were the underdogs. But Lancastrians aren't unintelligent, nor did they let their conditions get them down too much. they had a sense of humour and the irony of Blacks Only in the bar would have been intentional, never mind justice. They also took people at face value, to get on you just joined in. Oh and one thing that wasn't rationed during the war was beer, though I doubt it was overly strong. Mild beer was a thing back then, about 3% alcohol aimed at quenching thirst rather than giving you a hangover.
Going back to 1843 in Lancashire children worked in the cotton mills and coal mines, does that sound familiar to work in the cotton fields?
I Think the british Where So thankfull To have someone To fight fo the same feedoms as them no matter what the colour of your skin is we are all the same. Thank you from Uk
Look at the story of the Harlem HellFighters in 1917. On the front line with the french and their relationship with the civilians.
Heart felt dismay and disgraceful heritage from USA army to its people of colour we in England stand proud to be a part of our many cultural heritage of wonderful people who have represented us from our history god bless all of us of different colour and ethnics we in our small islands are honoured and proud of all our wonderful peoples of our country and I can only apologise for past preducice in the fact we relied on our fellow brothers and sisters of any race to have to be faced with backward ideology of horrendous oppression
I’m from near where this took place and although it is still a huge divide in America. We see it as human history as we don’t like to segregate still. We are all part of the human race and until that is acknowledged sadly racism will still exist. Great video though and keep sharing
In what shire?
lol. Yes, we have gotten lots of love/comments/corrections/encouragement on that pronunciation.
Thanks for watching and commenting.
Back in UK at an American Airbase in 1980s i used to go to the Officers club which was like a Disco night at weekends.
There was two halls and guess what?
One was basically all white folk and the other mostly Black folk.
If you are willing to fight for your Country especally then you should be treated exactley the same as anybody else regardless of your skin colour.
When your in the Military you are Brothers and should be treated as equals.
Look up the battle of Brisbane