Blue Valentine. An adult conversation
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- Опубликовано: 1 окт 2024
- Listen I didn't wanna
be somebody's husband and I didn't wanna be somebody's
dad. That wasn't my goal in life.For some guys it is... Wasn't mine.
But somehow, It was what I wanted.I didn't know that and now it's all I wanna do... I don't want
to do anything else it's what I want to do.
Her expectations of who he is didn't match up to the reality of who he is...this is why you need to talk these things out with your partner before you settle down if you're not prepared to love them unconditionally.
donnydanko at the same time he is so confrontational.
@@jasonpeterson4364 no. He saw she was hinting that he should get a better job.
Her hypergamous nature was showing
@@lancejohnson127 he loved her daughter as if she were his own.
@@lancejohnson127 a woman cant, a man can
@@lancejohnson127 conditions like :a billionaire whos a male model and has a 8 inch dick. It is truly sad
criminally underrated movie - I believe in years to come this movie will be recognised as a classic on human relationships
Yaaaaay, agree
True!
Way better than A Marriage Story
@@veroack5707 at 200%
Criminally man❤
His employment didn’t define him. He did it survive but his passion was his family. Her passion was her employment. Low key I wish I was him. Not wanting to stress over climbing the ladder of success.
I kinda relate to him
It’s so interesting because I RECENTLY found the power of contentment for myself and telling myself I am enough, and literally a woman I’m obsessing over told me “that god gives us talents to realize our full potential”, I’m conflicted cause if I’m like Dean I worry I won’t ever KEEP the girl I want, I’m allowed to feel content with life but I guess I better be “content” being alone 😞 man, life is a motherfucker that’s for sure 😞
SHe was supposed to be a doctor but she got pregnant and forced to leave it, that's the reason of her frustration, instead he had nothing in life and his family was everything to him, but ... Sounds like a loser bc money buys you freedom
ive had this exact conversation.
he's an alcoholic, thats the issue
She’s trying to give him a compliment, but he senses the undertone of disappointment. Such a good scene because it shows how even when they’re trying to be nice to each other, the issues come to the surface.
Shes not! This is not a compliment, shes actually trying to say that shes not happy with his job
@@777shack Yep, it's an insult. Then she twisted the twist. We knew what she meant. She tries to play it off.
@@777shackNo, it was a way of trying to push him to get a better job. She wanted him to shape up and provide a better life for the family. Can't say I blame her. Their house had roaches, they both had to work to make ends meet, and since he's clearly the more talented individual, it makes sense for him to take full financial responsibility. And hopefully, she can do something she actually wanted to do which was slùt around and have a career in the future. She should've been straight with him and told him that she's unhappy with her life and she wants to pursue a career and maybe she'd be satisfied with life. This type of conversation is inevitable if you're not honest with yourself.
@@777shackHow so? She’s telling him all the creative outlets he has and trying to understand why he doesn’t pursue something, in her words, doesn’t make him have to drink all the time. They’re just two different people that were never really right for each other and their marriage illustrates that.
@@Whoyouwishyouwere painting walls is a good job, much more paid than nurses. No need to have a fancy job if your job makes you happy. If you watch movie, you'll find out that he is so happy to decorate peoples houses (old man's room). It's a humble job, take a beer in the morning, go out and decorate people's houses, come home to play with your daughter. Modern world, most people couldn't live such a happy life. thanks to her, he can't too no more.
In terms of getting married, "Blue Valentine" is pretty much the equivalent to what "Jaws" is when it comes to swimming in the ocean.
Great analogy. It is pretty scary.
were gonna need a better lawyer..
Lol this is so fucking true.
Sadly, there is a hole in this comparison because Jaws sensationalized the dangers of sharks/the ocean whereas Blue Valentine represents an unfortunately high percent of marriages.
@@FueledFromFiction Stop splitting hairs & get a sense of humor
there was so much miscommunication in their relationship :(
She was manipulative and he wasn't articulate, it was impossible for them to have a conversation without it falling apart.
She was deceptive. A destroyer
@@askeletonsdaisy2440 How???
@@Dancediva240 watch it again. She is her father reincarnated. She doesn't know how to open up and love.
HE WAS A DRUNK AND ABUSIVE
deep down she is actually talking about her own lost potential
Bingo
This and Closer are two of the roughest, darkest, most accurate relationship movies, period.
Those two are my most favorite films.
Those two are my favourite movies about relationships!
I fckin love both movies 🖤
Damn, you said it! Love both movies
the way she is observing him at the beginning of the scene is great
I love that too!
When they first met, Dean had dreams of what he was going to do and become. But after he got his family, his daughter, he found something much more important than his dreams. He didn't care what he did as long as it supported them, and gave him the ability to spend a lot of time with them. That's what mattered to him. But as indicated by this scene, in her view, he had given up on his dreams and was projecting her disappointment on him, and when he talked about "what is potential, what does that mean" she sensed that he was getting close to her real intention and so she decided to shut it down with the tried and true gaslighting "adult conversation" bs. Now I'm not saying that Dean is blameless, he obviously had a lot of issues that contributed to the toxicity, but in this particular scene; she was the villain.
Hi, sorry for replying to the old comment. I recently watched the movie and have been looking at the conversation surround it. So far I've heard that different people empathize with either character and so on. In my point of view, she was the "villain" in that relationship. And I'm struggling to find any of Dean's faults. I agree entirely with your view on her projecting her disappointment on him, but I've read that "Dean isn't blameless" bit with other people and I can't really understand. He seems to be the main force behind the relationship as a whole. He spends time with the kid, he tries to spend time with his wife. The future-room was his idea. Maybe smoking all the time around the child isn't the brightest idea. Did I miss something?
@mihailnikolov5535 honestly you didn't miss something. I just didn't want to say Dean was blameless because people will take offense to that. If we're nitpicking we could say that he could have gone about it better, but I don't think that would have made her any more receptive. She was looking for any justification to not be with him anymore.
@@filmdude9970because she’s a nurse and he paints houses for a living. She is literally keeping them afloat while taking care of their kid 😂
@@filmdude9970I never saw either of them as to blame for their marriage falling apart. It was doomed from the start and over the years they just grew further apart and Cindy saw what they were and didn’t want it to continue. Dean decided to ignore it. They were just never right for each other long term. They didn’t grow together.
I totally agre with you. . Man I recently saw the movie too!. I agre with anyone here except flying dumpling. . That's a crap of shit 😂😅 who cares what the fucking job is or not, or is it academic education?! ... Why don't you think about social education also?. Anyway, dean is a bit edgy and has rough manners at times but it's ok you know, saw me one family not having this kind of moments!. All that dreams he lives in and the love he has to give man. . She's cold blooded she has that kind of intense feeling of getting or not the higher position, move out, or when she sees that asshole the kids biological father but got nothing inside for dean. . . I don't know.. she is human also but seeing this it's just so disappointing all coming to end that, yeah, they really grew so apart..
"What a luxury." I'm not sure why, perhaps it's his delivery, but I love that line. It makes me smile.
Uhh, that's the one thing I felt he could of actually worked on. :1
@@JuanIII The point is that it's the perfect job for him because he goes to work, gets done early, and does the things he wants to do. He mostly liked the fact that he gets to go home and spend time with his family.
@@whyisblue923taken
Regarding drinking, not spending time with family.
delivered like an alcoholic in denial
All the comments on every Blue valentine video always say how Dean was so perfect and cindy was totally in the wrong, but I have to disagree. I think they both had plenty of faults and things they needed to work on.
she destroyed the mans life. I know its a movie but ive seen this happen irl. And all i see is women defending her. Makes me really sad
@@dab0331 when you know someone has so much potential and could do so much with their life, you try to bring it out of them. dont settle for less.
krow Why push and push someone though when they’ve made it clear that all they need in life to be happy is to have a family and be a husband/father?
@James Horton More than that, he has no drive and is comfortable with a simple life. He doesn't need a big purpose to be happy and that's what repulses women.
@@MrFredstt But he's not happy. Have you seen the film, he's clearly not happy with his life and doing nothing to change it. They're both terrible at communicating but his "I''m happy getting pissed and drink-drive to work every day" is nonsense.
it wasn't all her fault. she didnt love him as much as he loved her - that's obvious. but his life did revolve solely on her and the daughter...nothing else. ive dated someone who really didnt have much going on in life, and it does get irritating, tiring. it is understandable how she slowly fell out of love with him.
Melannie when you become the sole reason someone continues to live, shit gets intense. you could tell that he knew he was the problem, too. you can see throughout the film, he goes from charming, clingy romantic to an overly defensive, aggressive alcoholic, and she never really seemed to truly *want* any of it. she clearly liked the attention she gave her, then when she didn't go through with the abortion she needed a male figure in her life to raise the kid. it really is a sad story, but what makes it so horrifically depressing is that neither of them are at fault.
+Melannie Funny thing I just broke up today came here to just i dont know and she gave me the same reason as yours.
I agree with you because all the men right now are accusing her for being an asshole but I bet if they switched roles all the guys would be like well her lazy ass needs to get a job instead sitting around and getting fat of course h e going to leave her any guy would gosh women ! .....
Melannie because she was tired lol of always fighting lol brb ...
"it wasn't all her fault" no, because it was mostly his fault. it's not even about not having anything to do in life, it's about his insecurities, being drunk, constatntly fighting with her and making her miserable...it amazes me how people can take his side..
to begin with, i think cindy had issues with herself because of her ill-functioning family which caused insecurity about love and marriage. on the other hand, dean had this romantic ideal about marriage. this difference is the fundamental reason why they have separate goals for marriage. furthermore, because of cindys upbringing she lacked patience and encouragement that dean needed as a man. it becomes clear when you think about why dean turned into an alcoholic and smoker after the marriage. this further contributed to the disappointment of cindy because he did not have a decent job which she wanted him to do.
so basically, they did not give each other what they needed.
dean's mother abandoned him when he was 10
Her goals in the marriage are akin to a gold digger or sugar baby. She married him knowing he wasn't a highly educated billionaire. She knew what she was getting into. Most guys aren't going to take on a single mother anyway.
Maybe that's what she wanted. She did cheat on him with her boss.
@@bobdede5897 wait what? I thought her boss was just hitting on her. I don’t remember her cheating...
@@bobdede5897 I don’t think she cheated with her boss. The boss was trying to get her to relocate to another clinic and suggested she just come during the week and come back to her husband/kid on the weekends. Then she got upset and realized he just wanted to screw her, and she said she thought she was asked because she was good at her job. There was emails, maybe some flirting, but I don’t think it was consummated. Remember too, Cindy started having sex at 13, she had at least 20-25 partners by the pregnancy. Besides Cindy’s poor communication skills, I think she never actually loved Dean and has difficultly bonding with anyone due to her past. I’m not saying Dean’s drinking should be overlooked, but ultimately I don’t think Cindy ever loved Dean.
its not all her fault. it goes both ways.
of course
Took care of her bastard child
HE WAS A DRUNK AND ABUSIVE
@@JODYJOE She didnt need him to. The father would have loved to.
@@JODYJOE "her bastard child" omg your hysteria doesn't belong to this century...
This is some great acting going on in this scene. They were both great in this film, and I'm sure everybody that is in a relationship has had conversations and arguments like this plenty of times and this is exactly what it looks and sounds like. Much respect to Ryan and Michelle
For me, it seems she is not satisfied with him and somehow with her life as well. I feel sorry for both and I think the anger she may have inside, due to her past and failed dreams, projected to Dean. She hurts him because deep inside this is not the life and the person she wanted.
It's very common with people who grew up with means. I would know, I'm one myself. It took me until my 30th birthday to realize that while I'm definitely not excessively materialistic I like the lifestyle I was brought up on and I want to lead a life that can support that. We are operating on a set af values in every aspect of our lives whether we know it or not. Some ignore them because they can't settle who they actually are with who they think they are.
Annie Hall, Closer and Blue Valentine are certainly the three most accurate portrayal of love I’ve ever seen. Just pure and raw acting.
Yikes. I know several couples just like this. It's actually totally killed any desire to get married ever. I do agree with some of the comments that Cindy was somewhat cold and did far worse things than Gosling ever did. I disagree with that outlook on all women though. I know plenty of couples where the woman is the breadwinner and the guy is a stay at home dad or the more likely option, the woman works an "ok" job and her boyfriend mooches off her and plays video games all day. It's all about the individuals involved. Not all women put ambition in the top spot and not all men put a great ass and big boobs as the only important quality a woman needs. People are complex creatures and both sexes are capable of hurting the other. I just hate seeing so many jaded people, you got a bad egg or two, don't generalize a whole sex because of it. Keep trying to find the one...or don't and just do you, just let go of that bitterness.
Pretty sure it highlights the worst in both young males and females. It's not pretty. It's a bit soul destroying though:(
"I do agree with some of the comments that Cindy was somewhat cold and did far worse things than Gosling ever did." oh the cringe. yes, she provided for their family and he initiated drunken fights. she was so much "worse"... facepalm, honestly men like you make women not want to get married anymore.
Now you and me are married how funny
Agreed. The other side of that coin is that there are so many women who are have okay jobs. But since the husband is the breadwinner or is simply pursuing his highest potential, he's not around enough emotionally or physically to satisfy her. Now she's complaining about that. It's a crazy road to navigate.
@@TheHmcykbux He stepped up and married her when she was pregnant with another man’s kid. He loved that kid like it was his own. His goal is to be a husband and father.....but she wants him to be more.
ryan was robbed for an oscar on this movie, such an amazing and impactful performance
She hates him because he's a reflection of what she has become and doesn't want to admit it. She's not the best mom she dreamed she was going to be, the great doctor, the great wife. I can relate to her and I'm trying to come to terms with myself, accepting that there's no much more that I could do. And it's painful
Love this comment!
When love is gone, is gone.
thewrathofbombast oh really?! 🙂
Nope
Many of us never had it to begin with 😔
Bye Felicia
she doesn't love him for what he is.
Ekayani Chamberlin a drunk........?
Perhaps he's taken to drink because she's impossible to please?
@zadose Cindy failed to communicate & was deceptive. She's the real loser
and vice versa
Women don't feel guilt, only shame. Honest women agree
So you question your husband in a way that makes him feel bad about himself and when he questions you back, you say he's turning what you said into something you didn't mean... All because you wanted him to be something special to fill your own emptiness. Wtf
HE WAS A DRUNK AND ABUSIVE
@@Uhohlisa She was sober and abusive.
@Star 98 So, your partner says you're not good enough in the way you chose to live your live, that you should be something else you don't want to be, so she would feel better about herself and your relationship and that's a compliment? That's selfish. It is irrelevant how I would feel. I'm not saying she's wrong for feeling bad about him, but that doesn't mean she gets to tell him what's the best way to live his life. It's not his job to make her happy. If her emptiness came from their marriage, it's not anyone's fault but hers. If she was unhappy, maybe she should have done something else with her life and stopped acting like he's the root of all of her problems. Hell yes, it's not abusive to tell someone you don't love them anymore, that's what she should've done from the beginning. And of course he had many problems, no one is supposed to cope with his behavior. I just don't think it is fair to say he was the reason she was unhappy. A relationship has two sides. And she's partly to blame for the shitty life she lives, she's not the poor wife. They got together for the wrong reasons, their relationship didn't age well and life happened, that's it.
@Star 98 That's the point, you always hurt the ones you love after a while. Even though you want to believe you just want the best to your partner, deep down you say things because you're unhappy with the way he carries himself. I think the point of the movie is how a relationship decay with time. If you want to be a father and have time to take care of your family, you will forget to take care of yourself and your partner will lose interest. If you care about what your partner do with his life, you will eventually end up being a control freak that criticizes his life choices. It all depends on how they see one another. In fact, the movie doesn't show her saying she blames him for her unhappiness, but her attitude makes it pretty clear. Anyway, she's not the main character, the movie is not about her and how her life with her husband is hard. It is about a couple, a relationship, that has two sides. That's why it's not fair to talk about him like a problem or the reason for her unhappiness. And about ending it, she was right. But what I'm saying is she should have broken up with him earlier, if she was unhappy.
@Star 98 "well she didn’t say he wasn’t good enough in the way he chose to live his life "
she did. you can mince words, but that was the underlying message, and he sees through it.
she's judging him for being happy with what he has. she's not, and maybe that's the problem?
if this is a normal conversation ..i better stay away from relationships
Same.
@@SilentDanDisney Sometimes it's like this, sometimes it's not. Sometimes there's painful times, sometimes there's joyful. This is a particularly difficult time. But when you go through it, you can emerge on the other side better. But for some it remains difficult, and I will say that it's often because they can't find a compromise. It's sometimes one person's fault or both. But it's because they will not find a compromise.
U know that's why couple stop communicating with eachother, they don't want to have this type of conversation. They keep avoiding.
Arguments are a part of relationships. The key is finding someone to argue without they or you leaving
Omg ROFL
The real tragedy is when you have 2 people so in love but still can't make it work 💙
She didn’t love him.
She's out of love with him. Cindy wanted out without being labeled the " bad guy "
@@11kirbyloksI don’t see where Cindy wanted out without being the bad guy. She just wanted out.
Sadly she was no longer in love with him. The love she felt for him was immature and wouldn’t grow.
@@icybanana2851 she could have told him straight up that she didn't feel the same anymore. Instead she kept stalling while Dean kept trying. She would also gaslighting him and throw lots of indirects when the movie would play in present time making Dean irritable in hopes he broke it off instead of her.
I didn't see this at 22
But at 33 I get it.
I love this scene lol. He’s comfortable with his position in life but she is not and is projecting that onto him
It was doomed from the start he had an unrealistic perception of love in the beginning he kept of seeing pictures of happy couples and asking his co-workers about love at first sight and tried to base his happiness off it. And she wasn’t that girl for him they moved so fast in there relationship didn’t even have time to know there ins and outs. It was such a good film but fuck it’s depressing
thats def the point of it tho..depressing in ways for sure but I absolutely loved the hardcore reality and truth bombs it was delivering..and their performances were great. I wouldn't say he had an unrealistic view of love, he just was a sappy romantic at his core and wanted to invest/commit to this woman after seeing her and wanting to pursue her because he felt a special connection. they clearly had a very strong start to their relationship but yea they clearly needed to have better communication on all accounts early/mid way on..but thats whats good about what the movie captures too...thats life, and the reality of it with a lot of ppl and finding themselves in these life traps. Cindys upbringing and family also very much molded her views/insecurities within relationships and shows a lot constantly throughout. She had her problems, so did Dean..but thats everyone too.
damn these movies be hitting harder and harder the older i get
Its so scary when someone you think you know him good but suddenly you don’t anymore and he turns completely a whole different person its really scary
Ugghhh people keep saying "Cindy should've known what she was getting herself into." She didn't know. Things were very different when they first got together, they were different people. They didn't know if they were going to be right for each other but she had a kid and she was scared and Dean agreed to help her raise the child. They would've had more time to figure each other out and realize that they weren't meant to be if the demand of raising a child hadn't interfered. Dean was an alcoholic and became bitter and mean over the years, nothing like he was at the beginning of their relationship. His heart was in the right place but he was too unstable and no one deserves that in a partner. That car scene alone showed how emotionally abusive Dean was and somehow you all still side with him. Cindy's only fault was that she wasn't willing to fight as hard for their relationship as Dean was but can you really blame her? She didn't want to be stuck being unhappy.
I think Cindy’s fault was she never loved him in the first place. She settled for Dean because he stepped up and married her and would be a father to another man’s kid because he loved her that much.
Absolutely true
Dean is not mean or bitter cindy is. Cindy is the problem here. Unloving and stuck up, even in the beginning she was always the problem
Dean is emotionally volatile and bitter. He doesn't respect boundaries. Dean idealizes romantic love and family life.
Cindy is emotionally cold and disappointed with her life. She channels that disappointment with herself into disrespect for Dean. Cindy idealizes material success and status.
Neither of them are the bad guy. They're two people that never should have been together, and they hate each other for it.
"This is the dream". Gosling says that in two differents movies, this one and Lalaland. In both, Gosling's girlfriend encouraging him to follow a career that will make him feel better. But in Lalaland, Stone knows that he's not living his dream. Here, Williams just make assemptions.
When a man grows content, a woman will begin to resent.
Point taken.
You shouldn't be content if your wife is consistently unhappy.
@@brittanymiitchell8491 I recall a mad men line.....what makes women happy? I think the point is women often want more, of whatever. If Dean was out making great money but gone all the time, she would be complaining he was never home never spending time with her and the kid.
@@anneb889 you just used one of the most misogynist shows in the world to defend this lmao. Also what she saying has nothing to do with Dean making money. She's unhappy because one they aren't in love anymore if they ever were. Two he is an immature alcoholic. When you are young and look like Ryan Gosling that's fine. In middle age with bills and a child to raise not so much
When a man lacks ambition and is contented with no growth....a woman looses intrest. Simple
back then I didn't pick up on it but now I realize that calling drinking at 8AM "a luxury" are the words of an alcoholic
My mum and dad do conversations like this at night and I feel uncomfortable with it
she describes him like he is a carnival monkey lmao maybe I am projecting though 😅
Honestly I feel the most for their kid. So many in our parents' generation stuck it through with marriages like this just because divorce was less socially acceptable back then. But honestly, it's a tragedy either way whether they divorce or stay together. I only feel people shouldn't have kids unless they knew what they are getting themselves into. Dean and Cindy deserve each other, but no kid deserves to see their parents like this.
My ex said I have a fear of commitment. No, I don't fear commitment, I fear this. I don't make much money, I have no ambition, I have a head full of issues I can't solve. The last thing I'd want is to pass on the pain to another generation. With no wife and no kids, even if I drunk myself to death at least I wouldn't be hurting somebody I love.
Yeah, I'm thinking about doing this myself actually. I despise alcohol from top my head to the tips of my toes, but I'm beyond bored with life and I don't see myself really doing anything I want in life. I'm thinking about taking to the bottle and smoking the greens and just avoiding thinking about things all together. I'm just tired of waiting for something to happen. Leaving Las Vegas and Under The Volcano have been on my mind. They're both about alcoholism and the emptyness of their existence. It might be the only answer for me.
@@Whoyouwishyouweresorry to hear that pal, just be strong and don't lose hope and talk to your family or friends or someone who cares about you. life gets better if you have people around you that truely cares for you.
@@Whoyouwishyouwereyou hit the nail right on the head with my current lifestyle and it is seriously not worth it. it was fun for the first 3 months then a year passes and you can’t stop no matter how much you want to. I’ve been trying to find ways to get back on track and motivated for the people I love who are able to still accept the shitty things I’ve done when getting drunk or cross faded. Just don’t start what I did and focus on the purpose you truly have. Get out of town if you have to but leaving is the first step
It's scary how much this movie is about me and my ex. We really had the same relationship. It's like it's a movie about us....
She cheated on him with her boss. He's taking care of a kid that isn't even his. You don't have to always side with the woman in every story. He loves her a lot more than she loves him unfortunately.
@Star98 You are correct
@@Star-fl2xstrue never raise someone else's children let the woman face consequences of her actions .
Im a guy, and I really side with Cindy. She just wanted Dean to make something of himself. A man should always aspire to be better. Doesn't have to be Steve Jobs or Bill Gates, but just better. But Dean was content. A little too content. And that can lead to laziness and the stagnation of a relationship.
Good women like Cindy want to see that men strive to be better than they were yesterday.
Im a woman and i feel for dean because... in order for men to strive. They have to feel respected in their household. They have too. Men need to be revered women need to be loved. Thats just the way it is.
I don't think that's the case. He's saying here how he's livig the dream which is bullshit, he's miserable and he makes her miserable, he's a drunk, constantly fights with her, twists her words (she says how they can't even have a normal conversation) because of his insecurities and he doesn't acknowledge his problems.. So she's basically looking for ideas to make him happy again, to change him into the person that she fell in love with back in the day... They're just very different people, wanted vastly different things from life and a relationship which is why they ended up endlessly frustratiing each other and making each other miserable.
Ok, but a good question is: what does she do with her potential?
I feel Cindy is in the wrong. Most men wouldn't take care of someone else's kid. Not even guys that are real 'bums'. Her expectations are way too high. Plus she doesn't love him as much as he loves her. Realistically 99% of men wouldn't put up with that, probably break up with her as soon as he found out she was pregnant.
@@unknownxyz7 She doesn't have any.
Unconditional love means you love them even if they don't want to improve. She should have checked his ambition level before marrying him.
+Saskiequelle Yup but in between her surprise pregnancy and uncertainty that Ryan is the father and her botched abortion and sudden marriage, I doubt she had the capacity to think practically. This is a man who doesnt feel it's necessary to finish high school and she wants to become a doctor!! Big conflict in goals right there but alas, they thought they would be different because they have their own song while everyone else's really is lame. Really childish way to approach something as eye opening and daydream shattering as marriage. It's easy to say love me unconditionally even if I don't want to improve. But the respect is lost then. She is not out of love with him, she is out of respect. And unconditional love shouldnt be used manipulatively, like you better love me even if I'm just interested in bumming around and drinking at 8am in the morning and you better love me because I accepted a kid that wasn't even mine. You're right, she shoulda known better, but considering the circumstances, she was only gonna find out the hard way.
+Jessie K everything you said is exactly what I think of their situation
there's no such a thing as unconditional love
A male will never be loved unconditionally. Only females, children and dogs are loved unconditionally.
"For better or worse . . . You said that!"
This was my wife and I many years ago. Today we are great together.
How did you "fix" it?
You guys broke up right?
Dont lie to me
i wanna know how they fixed it but it doesn’t seem like this person is too active on here... it’s been 3 years 😭
You don’t just make a comment like this and NOT give us advice or an explanation. Details please!!
The tragedy of this relationship is that people can still love each other, madly, yet a hairline crack at the beginning can turn into a fundamental flaw. Cindy and Dean's relationship ended up this way.
However I think they do not break up entirely in the end. Cindy did say she needed some space. In effect she is confused about the direction she SHOULD be going in the relationship. Dean isn't making it easier by being a bit of a bum.
How is he a bum? Last time I checked painters make solid money, yeah Cindy is free to think what she wants, but that shit is disparaging to people that work hard and hold blue collar jobs, sheesh not every guy can be Jeff Bezos, some of us are just out here trying to survive
@@Makiaveli01 He's not a bum, but his actions at her place of employment are way way over the line. He claims he loves her but he destroys her career which in turn jeopardizes his whole family. Funny enough, this scene is the least convincing to me in the entire movie. Almost like it seems too far even for his character. But that's the way they present it.
@@robfalgianohis actions was a reaction of her behavior and that she was lying to him. I know it's not right what he did but the guy got bitten to death by her ex that left her pregnant. I am pretty sure Dean at that moment thought of all that crap and went mental.
@@StrahdVonZarovich802 hi. It’s been a while since I thought about this. We agree that Dean went too far. This can happen when a person feels desperate and out of control of a situation. I understand it. Yes, the circumstances are unfair for him. But his desperation leads to a bad result for all involved. He embarrasses her at work and hits her boss. The bomb inside him explodes and it’s the tragic end of them.
@@robfalgiano it is quite subtle the fact that the other nurse told her (don't let him brainwash you) I mean at this moment Dean the guy that stepped up, married her, took the child as his own and raised and loved it. He listen to some nobody speaking shit about him (implying also that Cindy was talking shit about him in his back).
The fact that Cindy then went back to the hospital tells me that she wanted him to explode there so she could be the ultra victim. Really the movie grinds my gears haha . Have a good day :)
He's a bum but with a great heart. This movie was deep. She needed more, but he just couldn't wrap his head around it. He loved her completely, but she just couldn't appreciate it!
newsflash, most people are bums.
So many comments that chalk down to men hating women, thinking without any nuance-ignoring all the obvious signs here that dean is an immature and emotionally abusive character. I sure hope this movie warded some of you off marriage for the sake of the rest of the dating pool.
One message: the most successful thing you can be in life is happy
I thought that was the whole point is to be happy, that’s like going to an amusement park and being sad? The fuck are you sad for, the whole point is to have fun and be happy
the best movie Ive seen in a long time
I’m literally Ryan Gosling And Dean
So she should've stayed with him even if she doesn't love him anymore?
Love ends, it's the reality. This movie is about reality. No one should stay in a relationship in which they are unhappy. Simple as that.
yes, because we "all deserve better"
i feel like women are allowed to make their partner and their child their main focus without being a loser. why does he have to strive so far for her. she’s just a nurse
Just a nurse? Seriously??
@@tamaracline5739 yes, a completely normal, low earning job.
Fuck nurses
yeah, it's two years at community college to be an LPN. She rants about potential but it's really because her job sucks.
she's so condescending and he doesn't realize she wants more growth on his end. both are at fault
Does this remind anyone of the argument scene in La La Land?
The colorful lighting, the dinner, "This is the dream"?
Also how the camera starts off showing both of them eating together and once they begin to argue it only shows one person at a time. Also in the scene in La La Land.
When I saw La La Land, it reminded immediately of that scene. This scene being way superior
Its disturbing how cold and indifferent Cindy was. It just doesnt make sense, Dean just wanted to love, talk to her, and be there for her. Was that not enough? I guess he had to be a doctor or wrestler or something along those lines. Some women man smh Never satisfied
Star 98 I would never want a woman like Cindy. Rejecting constantly, only having negative things to say. Never commending anything that he ever did for her in his life. Probably only actually stayed with Dean because he offered to raise her baby with her. Also the fact that she had 25 sexual partners in her 20’s? She is not an adult. Adults know how to admit their flaws and work on them. She made it seem like everything she did was perfect and it was all Dean who was the problem. He was only the way he was because she refused to kiss him, show him any amount of affection.
Please understand that women that have had an aggressive and verbally abusive father (like Cindy) shut down when a man gets unnecessarily confrontational like Dean in this scene. Just think about the situation: they are on a date, having dinner and she is afraid to talk (and I don’t blame her, just remember the car scene) but she wants to tell her husband that he lacks vision in a way that is not offensive. The fact that she brings this up means that she cares about him and wants to get this across for the sake of the relationship but he turns defensive and aggressive and that’s when the conversation ends. She is not cold but he’s unwilling to dialog or see her point and that is frustrating.
@Star98 That's Toxic that Cindy didnt tell him. Also she didnt tell him about the Grocery Store Run In with her Ex. Dean knew something was off and sensed her mistrust. Thats Toxic behavior which signifies that Cindy was just as Toxic if not more. She was never up front and honest with him( if u want to go there) which is what a Wifes is supposed to do. He would have stopped his drinking, worked on his "Boyish" ways. All she had to do was meet him half way as Woman but more importantly as A Wife. Dean was always Honest. SHE'S TOXIC. Came from a toxic family . Proof is all there in the Pudding.
@Star98 At least Dean Tried. All Cindy could do, (And Did)was complain. Never tried to find solutions for Complaints either. She Never Tried. Not even Once.
@Star98 What Mommy Issues does he have
I think Dean's monologue when he was with the moving crew, is key. He mentions that when men fall in love, it's a deep love that cannot be moved. Whereas a woman's love is in phases; they can move on easily. Cindy fell out of love, wanted something else, changed her mind and even gleamed at the sight of her ex at the liquor store. Dean gave it his all in the relationship, making his love for Cindy the main vision. But not so much the same story for Cindy.
Ashleyxox in my experience men can be just as undevoted
It's not a set thing between women and men that way...both can feel the deep love or be frustrated by not chasing dreams.
Some of these comments are sad, like this movie is an excuse for people to attack each other.
He has a drinking problem and people are completely missing that critical point
I don’t think drinking is the main point here anyways more like a outcome
Holy shit these comments are so cringy. So many "nice guys" in here
And they all missed the lesson to be learned here.
@@austinryan9382 damn straight!
You're Goddamn Right.
Life (and love for that matter) is what you make it; it’s the story that you tell yourself, the movie you play in your head. Love ends, but that’s when you have to forget about feelings and focus on effort. The effort of making things work for the greater good (usually an emotionally stable family).
This is what happens when man give up their dreams to please woman. In the end woman will want man to be something different that what they thought at first. At that point woman will look the man as weak,hence they will seek another man
Perfectly described. Women don't understand that men too have to give up some things when they start a relationship. And if they are family oriented like dean here, they don't grow as much as the women expect them to.
Dean never had any dreams to begin with. He was a highschool dropout who knew she was too good for him. He said it himself. He wasn't ambitious at all and for someone who was studying to become a doctor, it drove her insane. There is nothing wrong with wanting a better life.
@@jodie3950 There's nothing inherently wrong with being satisfied with what you have, either. A marriage can still work when one is ambitious and the other isn't, problems start when one wants to change the other person.
@@user-ib9hg6ch3d I agree with that too. Someone can be ok with just changing themselves. Another person can look around and feel like their significant other doesn't fit into the fabric of their life anymore. Different people fare differently i guess.
@@jodie3950 This is not an entirely unreasonable position to take, and truly good women deserve the best of what a man can and is willing to give of himself, and this includes material things and living with self-improvement constantly in mind, though its obviously not limited to such things. No one young enough to dramatically improve and grow should choose instead to cease developing and stagnate. But I'm afraid that men and women are more given to the extremes than they are to finding an appropriate balance between the things that their desires are speaking to them, and the things that would truly fulfill them. Ambitiously going all in with ones career is not something that guarantees this balance, and it often will throw it off and become yet another reason for a divorce or a breakdown. Being financially successful in itself doesn't guarantee fulfillment and often times just puts a band aid over the void that we all to one degree or another possess. Fulfillment in life and being momentarily happy about life are not equivalents. Were literally biologically bound to return to a base level of happiness regardless of our status and how much worldly success we may or may not have, and science has shown this. We adapt to the standards of status we've built for ourselves and once that adaptability has been achieved, we simply don't go beyond it, but in pursuing it, we often neglect the weightier matters of love and loyalty to the little things that taken in a culminative sense, matter every bit as much as any career would, maybe even more, especially to the person lying on their death bed. So these things are much deeper than a mere lack of ambition or educational accolades. I think at bottom we were made for wholeness, for something eternal and abiding that simply isn't bound to the fluctuations and inconsistencies of our world and our own desires. Regardless of weather or not you are Christian, we could all pause and heed this statement made by Christ in the bible:
Be on your guard against all kinds of greed--for mans life does not consist in the abundance of his possessions''.
Id just add that neither does his or her marriage
One thing I learnt very early in life was to never give up a guy like him. Yes there are ups and downs, highs and lows, but that is a part of all relationships, even non romantic ones. But a guy like him, he is pure gold even if he is unambitious and may have put on weight. What is important is that he is happy and he is full of love. A content man is more important to me than a rich one.
he stopped having ambition, drive, passion, dreams, whatever you wish to call it.And no one wants to be with a person like that. Specially women. ( not my comment but iam completely agree)
@@natalinatali1482 I am a woman, and I would never mind being with a man who was content and happy with what he has. Being ambitious is good, having a lot of money is great but for me neither of that is attractive to me. Maybe for most women it is.....that is why I feel bad Dean. They are just two people who are not meant for each other.
@@natalinatali1482 I don't agree. His dream is to be a father to a kid and a man to a woman. His ambition is to make them happy and be happy with them. His drive is love.
@@natalinatali1482 It is not because his passion or his drive don't translate into money, career, social recognition, fame, travels or whatever material thing that it is not passion and drive.
@@natalinatali1482 True love, loyalty, tenderness, care, sweetness, stability , time are the most precious things on Earth. Some women value that more than what you value.
This movie is too depressing yet raw and real.
He sacrifice his live for her and and her child.. at the end, all he got was a waste of time with somebody who's fuck up since teenage years, and i blame him for being so desperate for "love"
Sex at 13?
25 partners?
Broken family?
Red Flags red flags red flags.
Here’s the thing. No one, man or woman, wants to be obsessed over so much that their partner focuses all their energies on them. It’s suffocating.
really ?
Dean was an alcoholic. He had the potential to be great but he wasn't. He got depressed and gave up. And she saw that. She wasnt perfect but he had the perfect family. He and her father aren't close primarily because of his lifestyle in my opinion. He could have had the perfect marriage but his depression, unresolved trauma and miscommunication is what destroyed their relationship in the end.
He got depressed for raising a kid from another man.
It's funny how people interpret things. I dont think they were ever going to work out. To preface. I just finished this movie for the first time, I had no clue it even existed. He was an alcoholic, but he wasn't one before meeting her. He wasn't depressed. He wasn't a shell of a man. Why? Because having a one night stand and then letting the puppy phase of a relationship dictate long-term decisions is a recipe for disaster. She was smitten and infatuated. They barely knew each other.
Dean got to this point most likely from the little love he received from her over time. Was he perfect? No. But he tried his damnest to be a good father to a daughter that wasn't even his. At no point in the movie did he complain about that.
So personally, I can't imagine going head first into a situation like that. Only for your spouse to look at you with disgust or resentment towards you over time. Do I think she's a bad person? No, but that's the point of the movie imo. They didn't know any better. They never had the perfect marriage or a perfect family. They were forced to make it work fast and attempt to raise a daughter together. They were eager to try, but It was never in the cards for them.
Ehh I don’t think he cared about being great in the first place. Yes he got depressed and gave up but making it up to the big leagues I don’t think ever was his goal in the first place
If you think one of them is the "good partner" and the other is the "bad partner", you completely missed the point of the movie.
He's stuck in nostalgia, but she wants the two of them to prosper.
But their love was real, so real that they couldn't be together. Yes, it's ironic
Not sure if someone said this yet but I believe it’s more about her. They showed how him and her parents always told her how smart she was and how she wanted to become a doctor. High expectations for herself and from her family. She ends up being a nurse (which isn’t bad of course) but it’s not her potential. He, on the other hand, didn’t have high expectations for himself.. she became his only expectation.. he seemed like he was always a good husband and father to her and her daughter. So it makes more sense to me that she was unhappy with herself.. another example is when she tells the doctor “I thought you wanted me because I’m a good nurse”. That’s what she cares about it.. there’s a reason why she’s the one that brings up the “having potential” conversations and not him. That’s what she cares about in herself and her spouse but mainly in herself.
Michelle is a crazy good actress
Michelle was also good in Shutter Island with Leo
I love this movie it's very raw and real
This movie is most relationships.
My parents are exactly like these two. My mom outclass my dad by a handful of levels. She's a GP, he was a private - sergeant level army who retired then drove a cab and now completely unemployed. They've been married for 32 years and together for maybe +-40 years.
She's unhappy but she continues to provide for the family while he does the house jobs. It's incredibly frustrating to have no solution to the problem but we just take it for what it is........
Are they still together?
So why is she unhappy? Because your dad doesn't make enough, or because he doesn't make more than her? Is she jealous of his "home dad" lifestyle?
@@chelsearae8062 yes they are
@@derek96720 because the sheer lack of effort to improve his career ranking. His boss has offered him to take classes/courses coz the boss knew of my parents situation but my dad's reaction is eerily potrayed by ryan's character. He doesnt see the need to earn more. I'm not sure whether he's the kind to doubt himself so he just settles with the minimal he could muster/achieve. Funnily enough he seems to not mind mooching off of his wife earnings. Ha. Sorry for spilling my family dirt. This may or may not be deleted later
This movie is so real one of my all time favorites
Love is never enough....women don't want love, they want status, fame, romance, money, a father and in between those spaces, you can add love if you want....don't take my word for it, love them unconditionally and see what happens
they both had their problems that they didnt want to deal with for each other
this movie is more anti-marriage + anti-kids until you are 100% ready for each other
in situations like this its always the kids that get ruined. you can regain lost finances, you can remarry, you can find new love. the kid loses years out of its childhood that are life defining
You can lose money chasing women but you'll never lose women chasing money.
Men have to be on their 'purpose' and your woman will respect that.
You make her the centre of your universe she will eventually leave you.
Be her hero putting a dent in the universe.
A classic, on a par with SCENES FROM A MARRIAGE and CANDY. The leads channel these characters, as 10 years turn what drew them together into what pulls them apart.
humans are such fragile beings 💔
I remember thinking his hairline was funny when I saw this. Now years later mine looks like that too 🥲
The best part of this scene is cut out!!
Cindy: "Good luck." *laughs* "I'd like to see you think about what you're saying instead of saying what you think all the time. Good luck, give it a try."
Many years ago, a girlfriend recommended me this movie... I would joke around and even sent her a photo of me with a cap and a moustache, impersonating Dean.
Then we had this talk. The she left me.
Back then, I was unable to understand what was the problem with Dean. It all seemed just like Cindy was being a bitch.
in your opinion, what is wrong with dean?
I think he stopped having ambition, drive, pasion, dreams, whatever you wish to call it. And no one wants to be with a person like that. Specially women.
@@patodiblasi he did work tho is the thing...he brought in money. Sure maybe not as much as Cindy's job at the hospital, but he was trying and contributed enough to be using his "potential" to be the perfect father, maybe not so much husband, but that's because she was at fault as well since you know the saying, it takes two...Lack of drive to conform to societies expectations I can respect in ways honestly. Now passion..I think Dean has tons of passion.
@@patodiblasi He got stuck, he got completely comfortable. He probably knew deep down inside he’s capable of more but didn’t know how to reach that goal. As a man we can’t say that, that can drive ppl away put up a wall. The same wall she’s trying to break down. He patients was thin, his temper was quick.
@@patodiblasi good luck having those things at 60
People who think La La Land is original haven't seen this movie.
The story of La La Land is really different.
She checked out emotionally a long time ago from the relathionship
Most depressing film i've ever seen
"why you have to make money of your fucking potential?"
It's painful to watch cause it's just like jn real life
Phantom Menace...PT bites..once in a while..
This is me on a first date, is that a bad sign? :D
This film is a perfect chronicle for young guys of exactly what NOT to do.
and this is a perfect chronicle for young girls what the warning signs are.
Yep. Find yourself a romantic woman, not a whore that only tries to find sexual gratification.
She's that mother that will scold her child instead of supporting them, because that's the only _love language_ she knows, and her way of treating the husband is the clearest example of that. He's in the "wrong" because he always lacked and needed someone to give him a little push. She's in the "wrong" because she was incapable of giving that push to him.
@@Bambim8this video is literally her trying to push him???? He manipulates, belittles, and gaslights her throughout the whole movie so obviously she acted more aggressive
@@maryamhashem6080its a double edged sword , though you are somewhat right , that he is Gaslighting her , but thats because he senses that she doesn't mean what shes saying . Theres a scene where they're younger in the bus and cindy says , "you have a great way of insulting yet complimenting me" and it's ironic because thats exactly what cindy is doing here . Shes insulting yet complimenting him about how he didn't end up becoming something great.Throught the film we see cindy having a passive aggressive tone , same with the car conversation about the bobby wrestler guy , she didn't have to say he was fat even though his ex was pretty fit , because in reality in her mind dean is a lesser man . we also see cindy was very cold towards dean . What i observed is that both have certain qualities that put them in the wrong and right . Its nuanced than simply whos wrong. Though Deans character definitely suffers more , hes the one that actually wants to stay together , hes even ready to change , while she simply wants to give up . She got pregnant yet he still stuck with her , and we don't even know if the kid is his .she has also had 20 to 25 sexual partners ....that also says something about her
Whoever you side with when watching this film if its Dean or Cindy, then that is exactly whats goin on in this movie. I would 100% side with Dean but i know not everybody would. And thats the tragic misstep in life and relationships. They work or they dont.
Is love enough to sustain life? Of course she loved him, that's why she married him. But she did not know that he would be so ambition less, imagine you being successful and your counterpart whom you love very much, only drinks and is home most of the times. Life is much more than this. When in wedlock, certain responsibilities need to be undertaken which clearly dean did not understand, he thought that what he is doing is enough to make a livelihood and needs no rectification whatsoever. She on the other hand, being a clear and sound minded individual didn't think that way. Falling in love is easy, handling that love is so difficult.
+Apeksha Ghai You're right I feel. These 2 characters had different visions of how their life ought to turn out and after the initial euphoria wore off, she realised this is a man who is not interested in improving himself but she always held on to the dream of one day studying medicine and becoming more than just a nurse. Dean is a difficult man to talk to as he has demonstrated a few times in the movie....the car scene where she told him she saw Bobby...if I had been in Cindy's position, my heart woulda been in my mouth because of the accusatory way her husband was looking at her, as if she had secretly planned to meet her ex in a liquor shop. And Cindy, she doesn't openly state what her problem is and it is very frustrating. She just goes I dunno what to say to you, I'm done I'm done, I've had it. Tell the man exactly what the problem is. I, as a viewer, got super irritated with her passive aggressiveness and wished I could yell at her.
+Apeksha Ghai Bullshit. It was clear from the moment they met that he was a free spirit/slacker. She was prim and proper and wanted a prince yet she fucked him and got pregnant. Boo hoo. Her choice. She had a way out but he said he would stay with her and all she became was a nurse. He became a handy man. He provided enough for them to get by but she wanted more. He loved her. She never loved him. Cold as ice. Ends up resenting him because she made a bad choice and fucks up the families life. Sad.
I just don't think she ever loved him or at least never loved him as much as he did and she is anything but a clear and sound minded individual she is confused and troubled hell that's the reason she married him.
Yes, love should be enough! Love, air, water, food and a roof and some warm. That's it for me 🙂
She was a deceptive ladder climber. Conversation over
Michelle Williams has always been so beautiful to me.
Hola, disculpa hace poco hice un video análisis de la película, y me lo bloquearon por las imágenes y la música de la película ¿sabes cómo puedo resolver eso? Espero me puedan ayudar
BLUE VALENTINÉ....UNA OBRA DE ARTE💥💥💥💥💥
this blows marriage story away.
This could be one of the most well directed scenes ever made.Amazing
She was giving hint 😩
Gawd!... This film is relationship destroying. I hate them both and cry my eyes out for them both. It's a tough ride.
This movie scares the shit out of me as a 27-year-old bachelor.