Evangelicals - Latter-day Saints, What Is The Divide?
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- Опубликовано: 16 окт 2024
- Cwic Media Website: www.cwicmedia.com
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Jeff McCullough, Kurt Francom and Greg Matsen discuss their personal interfaith efforts between Evangelical Protestants and Latter-day Saints.
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I am LDS. Many years ago i lived next to a Baptst Pastor. Music was the link that brought us together. I sang with their choir one Christmas. We never talked doctrine . We became good friends.
There is so much evil in the world today it would be great if all those that believe in Christ and love their neighbors can come together in faith to fight evil and make the world a better place.
Yes! One Heart, One Mind!
@@mavinswapp9663 yah it would be great! We (Christians) used to be one church at one time.
Reading 1 Corinthians ch. 1 we see they were already diving themselves back then and Paul was trying to unite them…”One Lord, one faith, one baptism, one God and Father of all who is overall, through all and in all”
My husband and I served a medical mission in Florida and Georgia and we wondered if we would experience Bible bashing but we were so pleasantly surprised when people saw the name of Jesus Christ on our badge, they just wanted to talk about Jesus and share what he has done for them. We completely we pleasantly surprised.
Heres the SOCIAL divide : Evangelicals.
We may be theologically divided and while modern members of the church of Jesus Christ are not spending most of their time attacking other religions; my whole life, I’ve just watched evangelical churches en mass create false videos and false accusations and criticize us. Banners out in front of their churches in Socal, advertising the temple ceremony for all to come see on video while they mock us to tears.
It’s only in the last 15 years that members of the church have grown a spine and started to engage in greater theological and apologetic discussion but before that, we were always the ones who, in modern times, were mostly kind and reaching out. And our doctrine certainly does NOT condemn them.
In fact, our message of salvation covers all faith and even atheists. We have the greatest universal salvation as defined by evangelicals while they sentence everyone else to hell. Our message is of FAR greater hope for ALL...both deceased and current.
It’s interesting that when I meet an evangelical, I always praise them for going to church and I try to find common ground and when I explain I am a member of the church of Jesus Christ, they often default to attack ....saying I don’t believe in the same God.
That’s true. we don’t believe in some unknowable and undefinable non-anthropomorphic trinity ball of a God, but I don’t spend my time telling them how they are wrong and that they are not Christians but they certainly do.
If Pastor Jeff wants to lessen the divide, he should be reaching out to other evangelical churches to truly build unifying bridges and not allowing them to keep painting a picture of us that is not accurate. We repeatedly clarify our beliefs and they largely cling to their false narratives that their churches trained them up to believe.
I've always been put off by the aggressive approach of Evangelicals since they are among those with the least leg to stand on.
@@jaredshipp9207 100%. I have always said that if I weren't a member of this true church, I would seek churches such as Catholics and Eastern Orthodox and the Restored church of God (David C Pack) who at least have some claims to authority and organization and David C Packs group at least blows the trinity out of the water which is garbage that even the beloved Billy Graham ( I think he was a good man ) said he was unable to define .
Evangelicals would be last on my list. They swing in the wind far more than the above. But I am happy people attend and always promote evangelicals to attend church more (if they dont want to come to ours). At least they are getting some of the basics so that later they are primed to maybe accept and add even greater truths.
@ruckin3 I understand the Catholics and their claim to authority. It's always seemed strange to me that certain churches, like the Restored Church of God, use that term "restored." You look at just about all of them, and they are essentially just Protestant faiths. Not only in their doctrine but how they came about. How can something be "restored" when these churches, as far as I'm aware, don't even claim heavenly beings have come to earth to do the restoring? Its just more reformation. The objection Protestants have to the Catholic Church is clear but obviously the problem they've all had from the start is they are dead branches from a dead tree. Substituting, as did the Jews, living prophets for what they have of the written word. As Joseph said, "There's no salvation between the two lids of the Bible without a legal administrator."
@@jaredshipp9207 I dont see that my reply posted but seems you got it based on your reply. I am often shadow banned especially on this channel. Yes, Catholic and eastern orthodox would be my top 2 because they have the lineage claim (kinda)
But I absolutely loved how the "restored" church of God turned the trinity on its head. I watched all of David C Packs videos on it many years ago and learned a ton on the trinity and how to combat it. Hopefully you get this reply.
Jesus Christ said that few people would get into heaven. Matthew 7:13-14
I am working with it… but I don’t fully trust Pastor Jeff. I would like to though. I was consistently belittled, mocked, and shunned growing up and at other times lost work for being a member of the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter Day Saints. Ridicule has been the norm from evangelicals no matter how I have treated them. Sadly. I have come to see them as the Jihadists of Christianity. I feel like if the confines of civilized society were removed we may not be safe around them. I don’t say that to hurt anyone, it is simply my very real lived experience. Would love to see that change.
I still remember being religion-shamed by Protestants including a teacher at my school recess in second grade. They will never let us into their petty club anyway and if that is what their "heaven" is like, I don't want to go.
I had a job working for the West Covina Fire department back in 1979. I was involved in helping the department get maps of all the fire hydrants located while working with the water districts linked to the city. To make a long story short, I was threatened physically by one of the older firemen in a moment when nobody else witnessed it. The threat was verbalized to me for being Mormon, after he worked out on a punching bag. At the time, I was recently returned home from my mission in Germany. I told my father what happened. He was not a member and nobody else in my family was either. He was a fearless WW2 veteran and was absolutely ballistic on the phone with the city and let them know how infuriated he was with them. Later in the week, I was moved around from station to station and constantly scrutinized by one of the other captains, forcing me to quit. The whole thing was very ugly. The perpetrator ended up just getting his wrist slapped and I was out of a job, or rather, harassed into unemployment.
I am a member of the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-Day-Saints. One of my closest friends is Evangelical. Music brought us together initially. Hiking brought us closer secondarily. On our hikes we talked religion. Then she moved to another state. Now we call weekly and are reading and discussing the New Testament together. We have done this for 3 years and are only up to the last part of John. That's how in depth we discuss the scriptures. We agree on many things; we differ on many things but we are always kind in our discussions.
I appreciated your video today. My friend and I are doing many things very well. That's why we are able to keep our discussions going.
Thank you, gentlemen, for your efforts in helping open lines of positive interfaith communication.. I am looking forward to the Interfaith Summit.
I’m so glad that there’s a greater push for interfaith relationships.
When I was younger I was afraid to listen to other faith conversations because I think I was afraid that my mind would be polluted and Satan would have a way into my mind.
But once one of my friends made a comment to me about something that I was struggling with. She said that I hadn’t forgiven someone and that was why I was struggling.
I am LDS and have been taught about forgiveness my whole life but I listened to her because we were friends. In the end she taught me something about forgiveness from her perspective because of the teachings from her Church that I had never learned and my struggle was healed. I learned that day that I didn’t need be afraid because all of Gods children are given light in what ever religion. And Children of God can discern light from darkness if they look for the light.
Honestly, as much as I dislike the attention we give to pastor Jeff, I think he’s leading more evangelicals to the Church than members of the church to Protestantism. The truth will win out.
So glad you see it too brosky. His ulterior motives are clear. I've seen him "heart" several comments in which latter-day saints were thanking him for helping lead them to protestant Christianity, or describing their journey to protestant Christianity. Also, he completely straw-manned the BoM when he went over it in his videos. He's nice, has the looks, the production quality, and the charisma... But lacks the Spirit of truth.
@@DoctrineofChrist248 For what it's worth... part of the reason (I mean, possibly even the main reason?) why Pastor Jeff moved to Utah is to minister to Protestant Evangelicals there. Simply being Protestant in LDSland can be very difficult; I had a good friend (son of a pastor) who grew up in Rigby, ID, and grew to love camping when he lived in Utah because he had *no friends.* And leaving the LDS church -- in Utah no less -- can be an absolutely gut-wrenching experience. Even if you have no desire to leave yourself, try to have a little empathy for what it must be like to go through that. And there's the spiritual side of trying to help Evangelicals be kind and loving and not argumentative and not self righteous, even when they're pretty sure they're right. To me, there's nothing scary or threatening about Pastor Jeff giving away RUclips hearts to people (of his faith) who are going through something rough; that's kind of his job. He can't make me change my religion if I don't want to, and he's always acted respectfully.
You make a valid point. While the attention on Pastor Jeff can be frustrating, it's true that his influence might actually be drawing more people to the Church. In the end, it's the strength of our faith and the truth we uphold that will prevail. Let's stay focused on our mission and trust that the truth will indeed win out.
The LDS faith is full of individuals who have experienced the world of Christianity outside of the church, it's a lot easier to be less divisive when we see ourselves in others.
As an LDS member, I’m often fearful of saying I’m LDS because of the hostility from evangelicals. It’s not the other way around. I feel I’ve been given and know so much more as far as doctrine that I’m really not interested in Jeff’s religious beliefs. I feel I’d be “dumbing myself down”. I’m glad he’s trying to learn more but I don’t feel it’s genuine. He’s used to being in the chaotic rat race of thousands of evangelical churches. As a church we’ve outgrown that. I just don’t see the interest in learning more about what he believes. I’m sure he’s a nice guy but I don’t care about “learning” from him.
There are several reasons to learn of others' beliefs. Not just what you know yourself. By understanding others' beliefs, we can communicate more effectively and create relationships. For me, that is important.
Its like trading in your Bentley for a Honda Civic when Evangelicals try to prusade me with their beliefs.
Could this fearful feeling comes from that deep down in your heart, you knew Mormon gospel is different from the gospel of the Bible?
@@我的方舟 Our doctrine is not different from the doctrine of the Bible. We study that often and draw from the direct words of Christ. However, our doctrine is much different from the various creeds that have been published by men that mingles the philosophies of men with scripture. Those we reject.
@@我的方舟 Wow. we believe in the Bible and we follow. You simply have a different interpretation. Ask Latter-day Saints what they believe.
Pastor Jeff my friend you are so close to the tree of life.
Great video and discussion. We need dialogue like this to focus on all the things we have in common, our deep love for Jesus Christ, our desires to follow Him. ❤
I worked in the state of North Carolina for awhile when work would not allow me to attend an LDS congregation I would cross the street and go to the Baptist congregation I just wanted to be with good people and told them so. The only problem I ever had going to other churches and I have been to many was the ministers they treated me like I was a leper but never the people. I came from a Protestant background.
I'm sure Pastor Jeff is a good friend, to those who know him on a more personal level. However, his ulterior motives are clear. I've seen him "heart" several comments in which ex latter-day saints were thanking him for helping lead them to protestant Christianity, or describing their journey to protestant Christianity. Also, he completely straw-manned the BoM when he went over it in his videos, and clearly tried to sow seeds of doubt with that strawman. He also subtlety undermines our presiding high priests occasionally. He's nice, has the looks, the production quality, and the charisma... but lacks the Spirit of truth. I was impressed that his videos wouldn't offer me light and truth before giving him a chance, and that impression proved true. And no, I'm not "afraid" of his ideas, or of exploring ideas in general. I've spent plenty of time exploring the philosophies and theologies of the west and near-east.
Thank you for speaking up
I hope that means you don't want the ex lds group to stay feeling lost when they come to not believe in the lds church, or the lds specific doctrines that they spouse. Maybe it is better that they go the route that if the church isn't true, then nothing is. If the journey is about heading to Christ then be happy for them.
I also fear his underlying motive. He contradicts our gispel and the BOM, by using New Testament quotes. He does not read the KJV. He uses a New modern bible. " The bible is trye so long as ut us translated correctly. He is distorting the true word of God.
I'm a CJCLDS (Church of Jesus Christ of Latter Day Saints 🙂). I believe that our faith is as valid as evangelicals think theirs is.
As we head into the time of tribulation, isn't there a time to become allies? To accept that both sides love Jesus Christ and that we will need each other?
So far, the answer to that has been no. Evangelicals attack me personally whenever my faith is known by them. (Many do, it's not all.)
Most accurate comment on this feed.
Thanks Greg for giving this guy access to your subscribers. It should build up his channel! By the way, I am neither “ignorant or afraid”.
But on this subject you don't seem to be thinking very clearly. We can't hide in a corner and draw a circle around us. That seems to be your approach.
@@CwicShow you may be right about me brother. I’m 70 and have been defending my faith against PJs my whole life. I saw a few of his podcasts and my mind went to Mother Eve in the garden when she said “ I know you now”. I get what you your trying to do and I understand. My testimony of the restored gospel is immovable and um changeable. I’ll leave the fight to the next generation. On a brighter note we’re hoping to go with you and brother Porter next year to Egypt!!
@@shanethompson2406 I get it!
@@shanethompson2406yes hard to know what Jeff really wants .
@@lindamartinez7006I disagree. It’s very easy to see what he wants. His earlier videos are clear. This new tactic is deceptive and so clever. I love interfaith dialogue as much as the next person, I’ve just NEVER felt inspired watching PJ. The first time I watched *even his new schtick* of reading the BoM it was just void of sincerity.
On the other hand, go watch David Boice from 52 Churches in 52 Weeks before he made the unexpected choice to become a member of the LDS church.
He was sincere. He was truly invested in reaching out and understanding other’s beliefs. He never once criticized another Faith’s beliefs. He could never have decided to join the restored church of Jesus Christ and thousands of viewers from many faiths would still be watching him, due to his sincere vibe (that PJ 100% lacks).
I love that this summit is happening. Over the last few years I have learned to have a different perspective of my beliefs and religion without the fear of losing my relationship with God. This strengthens my faith. I love you guys!
Great conversation. 100 agree. We need to come together as followers of Christ.
Respect to you Pastor Jeff! You are the one who reached out. I may have been skeptical about your motives but from this conversation I see a genuine Christian in you. I bet this has been an educational and transformative journey for all of you. Thanks for bringing us along for the ride and using technology for good. I think if we all approach our faith with the humility as these three gentlemen we will all be the better for it. Great episode.
I so wish that the world could take on these attitudes and engagements! I love my "Non Mormon" friends. Jesus is always the answer for what ills the world!
I am looking forward to the Summit. Thank you Jeff, Kurt, and Greg for doing what you do I love it so much. I can’t wait for this.
I can't trust pastor Jeff. Something is off. I dislike his much attention we as members of the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints give him.
Jesus said, Follow me. John 10:27-29
Jesus never said to follow Joseph Smith, Jeff, a pastor, a bishop, etc..
Ive have been following Hello Saints for a couple of years. I have liked his comments about the LDS. However his focus on us has changed. He is no longer inquiring he seems to be on a quest to infiltrate us and destroy us from with in. He temonds me of the ant-christs in the Book of Mormon. Telling the people what they want to hear and then tell8ng them why their belief is not true gospel. He is speaking to so many public LDS personalities, he is not talking to the leaders of the church. Im done watching him. I think he just makes the LDS saints question what we believe.
This is such a beautiful thing to see. This model you all teach, by loving and respecting our different understanding with each other. Satan has no chance to intervene with his lies and destroy the spirit of your conversations without contention, I'm so pleased to see that doesn't exist in your interfaith meeting. I pray all your examples will be a demonstration to the world how we can exchange our various Ideas and understanding without contention or anger stepping into the conversation. Good on you all for your excellent example you all have set, as to how this can be accomplished. Great Content as always Greg.
We will all need each other because the world is doing all they can to eliminate GOD out of life. We must stick together. You are doing a great job. We need to love and accept each others differences. Keep up the good work
Thank you I loved this. We all need to remember we are all His children and all loved by Him and we need to do as President Nelson taught us about loving.
Glad you enjoyed it.
Problem is Bible thumpers. Don't think we're children of God.... We're only children of God if we're saved and saved in the way they think you have to be saved
Why does Nelson call people names then - from the pulpit at Gen Conference - if he preaches to be loving ?
@@davidchristensen587 huh?
He called people “lazy learners “ and “lax desciples “ from the pulpit at general conference. Doesn’t sound very loving. Also told people not to “take counsel” from those who don’t believe. How is any of that “loving” - (as he preaches about being loving).
I used to go to a Baptist Church before I became LDS. I was almost Baptized in the Baptist church until the LDS missionaries came to my house before my scheduled “Baptist Baptism.” I have no negative feelings toward Protestant Christians. I’m so grateful for the initial knowledge that the Baptist church gave me about Jesus Christ. I feel that they really prepared me to become LDS. I’m glad Pastor Jeff is doing this because I feel that we have WAY more in common than we realize. We are all brothers and sisters in the Lord.
I am watching this video for the first time. I am at timestamp 15:17. You are discussing why it's important that we bridge the divide between Evangelicals and LDS. Personally, I have real struggles specifically related to this issue in my life. This is very helpful to me. Any skills, ideas or help that's made available, I believe is inspired by the Holy Spirit and Gods Will. Thank you. 🙏🏻
Love Pasteur Jeff’s comments @39:00 about being patient. If someone saw one or two things I said and did while a missionary in Spain regarding Catholics and the church, I’d be ashamed. I am ashamed - they were not loving and kind. But I realized quickly that I needed to treat other faith kindly and with brotherhood. So absolutely a fan of patience even when someone says something you might justly be offended about.
"The enemy is over there" according to the story I read is what Admiral Lord Nelson said to two officers who had a dispute before the Battle of the Nile.
We need to understand the Divide and then have understanding of each other's differences and then build a community with each other to spread the light of Christ and become more as one people as the Christ believing people in this world. That way we can have more charity and love and Christ like influence.
Love all three of you guys and the examples you set of accepting and loving each other and believing in Jesus Christ.
Appreciate it.
I was just released as a RS pres in my ward and given a calling in stake communications. I've been apprehensive a little bit about what I have to offer there, but this discussion made me more excited to try and work with my community. So thank you!
Thanks for sharing!
So what is the purpose of all this? It’s fine to get along, and love one another, and as Joseph Smith said I will die defending the faith of another’s faith as my own, but the doctrine will never come together, I hope when the Saviour comes that we will absolutely follow Him and then it will be well ❤
Where will the summit take us after all is said? Respect: "Now I see how you could think that" and Appreciation: "I am grateful for your commitment to the LORD, and for being a sunbeam of light in the world". How is that for a start?
Can’t wait for the summit next week. It sounds very interesting!
Fighting to be right is something that comes from pride, living faith and doing charity is what Jesus taught.
I wish you would’ve had David Alexander involved in this conversation. He has experiences on both sides of the “divide”.
There's no way on earth any of these three would include David Alexander in a video, not after David has repeatedly denounced Jeff as someone trying to lead away Saints. No chance. Zero. None.
One Sunday morning, there was a space available to meet on the cruise ship. It was a good experience. The problem that all people had was that everyone had a wanting to teach, but all had the fear that they would teach incorrectly or would absorb a falsehood as they see it.
Building bridges is important and our faith in Christ unites us… however, we must remember that this is Christ’s restored church and still need to share the gospel with them and invite them. Let’s not become so cozy that we forget to invite them to Christ’s church. As a convert, I was blissfully unaware of all the truths I was missing out on but thanks to some amazing members and their persistence + kindness, I came to know the church was true and was baptized.
What a great video. Jeff begins talking at @42:00 about rather than focusing on our differences but rather our relationship to God as being fundamental. He hit the nail on the head. Are we going to be in heaven together and I would add, would we want to be in heaven together? I have a few thoughts to add to this:
1. Since when did God authorize us to make judgements on other people's salvation or exaltation? That is his domain. We do not need that burden. We need to focus on treating each other with respect and dignity.
2. We are approaching this with a Telestial mindset and not a Celestial mindset. We do not have all the facts. We have the facts that we need in order to operate and navigate. I am reminded of the story of the woman that would complain to her husband about how her neighbor's clothing was always dirty when she hung it up to dry. Then one day the husband washed the windows and all of the sudden the next door neighbor's laundry was clean. Sometimes when we have more information, our perspective changes.
3. What is most important that we are coming closer to Christ.
As a Latter Day Saint I think Jeff is an instrument in the Lords hand. Much good will come from the positive interfaith dialogue that is happening because of Jeff. As president Nelson has asked us to be peace makers I think Jeff is a guy that is making that happen. If a member of the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter Day Saints leaves because of a faith crisis I would much rather them be an evangelical like Jeff than an atheist. Great things will happen and I’m excited to see what comes of this.
To the Latter Day Saints who are attacking Jeff. Stop it! You’re not helping. Remember President Nelson’s peace maker talk. 😊
Yes , no attacks . Thats the key 🗝️
Bravo! How refreshing to hear a LDS saying this.
No attacks on him. Study your own gospel 90 percent of the time. Jeffs goal is to "slowly force into LDS people HIS truth" Its the truth of one man. It is Jeffs Gospel as only He sees it. There is not unity of faith and specific beliefs in Their man made Christianity. Every day one of their churches split over the smallest of things. They may feel the spirit often on points of doctrine. Remember Lehis Dream about the Iron Rod. If you listen too much to the great and spacious building, anyone who wants to take you away from your peace, you will loose the spirit and become confused and then start believing mans false creeds.
@@BGCflyerI’m one of a small handful LDS who are accused of “attacking” PJ on these feeds. The majority of the comments are nice (“niceness” has replaced the Ten Commandments don’t ya know?) towards PJ.
@@dcarts5616 …I’m a little confused how niceness is replacing the 10 Commandments?
I love these discussions! I wished I lived closer and were able to go to this conf. While on my mission, years ago, my companion and I were humming along and I don’t know what church nor denomination tried to run us down from his car and yelled, “you Mormons are going to hell!” As a sheltered LDS kid in a Catholic private school, I’d never experienced such contempt. I’ve still no idea why that person felt justified. No finger pointing, but dialog is vital. Many of my closest friends are not LDS. Connections and relationships are most important.
Im glad you were able to get past that . 😊
@@yeti1002 I’m over it. I just never knew there was an “issue” like that. My Catholic sisters were pretty chill.
@@a.m.o.3323 same here , I attended a Ukrainian school for five years in Chicago .The only LDS kid in the whole schooI ,I looked like them but didn't quite fit in at first . Eventually I did gain there trust , you learn from your experiences. That's life 😉
This is a replay of the creedal debates from almost 2,000 years ago. Fascinating that we still can't get to a solid an uniformly accepted conclusion.
Greg, I would consider attending a conference like the one described...it sounds great.
Also, thanks for this video. I would love to nail down the list of similarities that we have with protestant Christians.
I would say it's not a dichotemy of "truth" vs. "relationship", it's not a question of which is a higher on the hierarchy between the two-these are not seperate juxtaposed things. The truth is that our relationships are most important and therefore the love and respect we demonstrate in the way we communicate the truth is the actual truth about what we believe and how what we believe truly influences us.
Appreciated this discussion. Have enjoyed Pastor Jeff from day one. Offline relationships really are probably the most effective for interfaith unity. The uphill battle feels massive in the online/media space though. I saw Pastor Jeff posted the summit on TikTok and the comments that followed were anything but supportive. People are quick to react and slow to listen. But when we look at the content that garners views/engagement… it’s the type of content that is controversial and divisive. Isn’t that an interesting phenomenon? It’s like people would rather be entertained than informed. Hope the summit is successful! I’d love
to see personal invites sent to Mark Driscoll and Jeff Durbin to attend 🙏🏻
I love Mark Driscoll and Jeff Durbin but I have a hard time seeing them follow the rules of the summit. They are good at compare and contrast.
@@ryansmith6610 I would never ask them to be presenters. I want them to be listeners and learn something. Their approach to Latter-day Saints is abysmal.
If each individual from both sides truly love Christ, will they not both be willing to embrace Jesus on the other side of the veil no matter which Jesus he truly ends up being. Because I love Jesus so much, I believe I will embrace him even if he ends up being more evangelical than LDS. I would imagine the same would be true for most evangwlicals. We love him so much we will follow him!
Jeff is describing something called the “narcissism of small difference”.
Look it up. Fascinating. We see it everywhere! Especially politics.
I was raised w/o religion, and converted to Jesus Christ only through personal Bible study a year after college. A year later I was baptized LDS and thought that we, and other Christians, Catholics, and jews were all more on the same page than we were different, because we all worshiped God above all, and tried to love our neighbor, No MATTER what they believed. We are all a lot closer together than we are to where we're trying to go! Does not the Bible, the Torah and the Book of Mormon all CLEARLY teach that principle? Let's give one another a helping hand...
Can you discuss the savior's instruction to the apostles that if their message is not accepted to wash their hands/feet and go elsewhere?
He is right anout having bad experiences. I was told to leave by the manager at a DQ when i was fifteen when i was with my brother, visiting my sister who was adopted to save her from our real dad. I wasnt lds then , i was catholic.
Anyway , she asked what church we went to, and i told her. The manager over heard us, and said as soon as we are theough eating to get out and never xome back . This happened in Vidor Texas. I found out later, the kkk is strong there. And i noticed when i was there. I didnt see one black person the whole time. My sister got mad at me, because she was told to never come back also . This was in 1973.
I was working in kilgore Texas at United Machine shop. And one of my fitter's found out i was LDS. He got so angry, he wanted to beat me up. Hensaid you dont believe in God or the real Jesus. I tried to tell him he was wrong . This is the same guy who o e time was talking about having strip poker with his wife and mother in law. 😮 Your going to tell me im a hesthen , but then your completely immoral. Wow.
How much money will be made by this conference? and for who?
It's mostly free. Oh, and you don't have to watch or pay anything if you don't want to. Did you every pay for your kids to to to EFY? You know why there was a cost for that? Because it costs money to create it.
I am so looking forward to this upcoming interfaith summit. I discovered Hello Saints way back near the very beginning and have been a follower ever since. I tried to get some of my fellow Latter Day Saints to listen to Hello Saints and many would just say - Oh my gosh, why listen to that, he is just trying to convert Mormons to being Evangelical. All they would do is accuse Jeff of being subversive. How can we possibly love and respect each other if we won't listen to each other. I think Jesus Christ wants us to love and be supportive of each other and Not divisive. This is just one small step in that direction.
My evangelical best friend at work, no matter how close we got, (we were the only openly Christian people on our team so we often talked religious or political stuff) always told me I didn’t worship the right Jesus. It would be said right to my face, at the most random times. It stung me, because I NEVER said anything similar to her, because as a LDS I was taught that truth and light can be found in most places where Jesus was worshipped. I never got the same respect from ANY of my Protestant/Evangelical colleagues.
Pastor Jeff misleads so many Latter-day Saints into thinking he might join our Church. He is here to convert Latter-day Saints to his version of Evangelical Christianity. It’s his ministry. It’s straight up priest craft with a sunnier disposition and better hair. He’s learned that Latter-day Saints are disgusted by confrontational tactics, so he’s here just poking around gently and hopes to get enough attention to attract people to the new church he’s establishing in Utah. Giving him a platform is fine, because he’s done nothing to disqualify himself, but please, people, understand his true intentions are not good, ultimately, for Latter-day Saints. Has he helped some other Evangelicals learn to be nicer to us and look under the hood in a way they perhaps haven’t before? Perhaps. But please quit thinking he’s on some journey to membership in The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints.
Some pretty radical assumptions. They're not true. He has never said he might join the Church. Why would you make something up like that? Do you know him? When I hear this type of comment, I realize how ignorant each of us can be. Jeff is a friend of mine and I promise you these accusations are false.
@@CwicShow So he didn't really make a video suggesting some members leave the church to make a hybrid church of LDS and his faith?
@@Shannon-xg2gl No, he didn't! Ridiculous!
I'm a member of the church , i don't feel threatened by Pastor Jeff . I know that some LDS members feel some what put off by him . These get together's are rather good . I'm from chicago , keep pumping out these videos .
The website for the summit is saying it's not secure, so I can't sign in.
20:15 Springfield! Thanks for the shoutout! You are doing a great work. Keep it up.
More than ever, I think our country needs to culturally stop focusing on difference and trying to be everything to everyone and start finding common ground. This is true of religious groups, and should be a particularly joyful exercise among those who common ground is seeking Christ.
Great conversation. I have been searching for a unifying message and it has gelled into this. We are all one body in Christ. Let's not fight over who is the eye and who is the hand. Let's listen to Jesus who said we need each other. If ye are not one ye are not mine. We tend to believe that only applies within our respective faith communities. But if we believe in Christ, we are part of the same body, though as parts we are different as a foot from a forehead, yet equally important.
Hard to be one when the other is 46,000.
@rconger24 There is only one true and living God, one Christ, and one gospel. 🕊 That is what unites all Christians. ❤️
Did you watch the video?
There are not 46,000 denominations. Do you think every church you see is a denomination?
Denominations disagree over going to war, musical instruments in the church, type of music sung, type of church government, how to understand the book of Revelation, etc..
There are 100 sects of Mormonism based on one book. How do you know yours is correct?
I think it is important that the lds people know and can express their faith tradition. While watching interfaith dialogs I see many lds people go all over the place on what they believe individually and what the church teaches. Having grown up lds there are things that I was taught in my youth that many wont talk about or say that they don't believe that. So being able to articulate is important. Many wont even hold the the articles of faith.
I don’t trust that pastor one bit. We can be pleasant to him but I’m not a fool to what he is up to.
As an LDS person, I just wonder why we care so much about what Evangelicals think?
Let them square themselves with Christ when he comes because it was their churches that Christ said are an abomination in his sight to Joseph Smith.
@@77thNYSV -As an LDS person, I care what Evangelicals think because 99.9% who have RUclips channels or ministries or congregations don't understand Latter-day Saints and LDS doctrine and promote falsehoods about us. Usually with venom and disrespect and even hatred. I bet some Latter-day Saints have also treated non-LDS the same way. Interfaith dialog is crucial for people of all faiths to understand and become more Christlike towards each other. It's also easier to be a missionary when you know what resonates with people and what doesn't. Pastor Jeff has pointed out in many videos what is similar in our doctrine and what points cause other Christians dissonance. As Latter-day Saints we often take our doctrine for granted whereas some of it is really unique and maybe hard to understand for others. I have enjoyed seeing Jeff's journey learning about The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints from scratch and comparing and contrasting similarities and differences and what he thinks. President Nelson has also said that it is our work to gather Israel and bring people to the Gospel. It's hard to do that if you don't know what Evangelicals think or if you expect they need to find their own way.
Thank you so much for this conversation. I am LDS. I am a regular temple goer. I am a faithful primary chorister. I have been positively influenced by my evangelical friends. I have come to know my savior more through worshipping with them and I love their perspective on grace that I have needed in my life. Thank you Pastor Jeff. God Bless your ministry.
14:18 Do evangelicals think we should refer to them as not being Christian? I think I've heard pastor Jeff say that he thinks members of the Church of Jesus Christ are not Christian because we believe in a different Jesus. He compared it to each of us knowing a person named "mom", but that mom is a different person. So, in a conversation between an evangelical and a member of the Church of Jesus Christ, do the evangelicals think that both sides should think the other side isn't Christian? It should go both ways, right? If we think we have the right Jesus and they think they have the right Jesus and they're not the same Jesus, both should believe that the other isn't Christian (in the evangelical view), right? Honest question, not trying to stir up stuff. I'm honestly curious if evangelicals think we're not informed on the issue or not true to the issue. I guess I personally think we actually follow the same Jesus, they're just missing a little information about Him (or maybe we are).
It seems to me that there are certain political forces that would like to get rid of all relgion and religous values, that it would behoove all religious people to come together -- not to change doctrines -- but to preserve and strengthen constitutional rights for religious freedom and freedom of speech as well as values for basic morality and family values in society.
Pastor Jeff your family member may have touched on something. You may not be safe on the Wasatch front. You may be in serious danger of contracting diabetes from the constant delivery of cookies, brownies and green jello with marshmallows in it from your neighbors. Just saying be very careful. Friendly advice from Kentucky
It's looks like you're expecting us to trust Jeff as much as you do without the benefit of the personal foundation you've been able to build with him.
I don’t expect that. And I understand why people wouldn’t. But that doesn’t mean I don’t trust him. I know him better than my audience, and I am trying to convey what I know.
@@CwicShow Fair enough. I'm very glad you said it that way. Tell me then, from the outside, it looks very much like "believing Jeff" is a shibboleth amongst LDS content creators. If you do, welcome! If not, no soup for you (e.g. David Alexander after posting my video). Am I wrong?
@@StandFirmSaints Most of the content creators actually know him. David Alexander does not. And I don't think I understand your comment about him. Jeff is also a very good friend of mine. If I see attacks against him that are based on false premises, then yes, I am going to defend him.
@@CwicShow I shouldn't have used the David Alexander example. Too electrically charged, which consequently overshadows the question.
Isn’t it true that the church believes in the end people will convert to Mormonism to live with Heavenly Father. Celestial kingdom and exaltation is the goal. Other religions do not believe this
@judybooth4901 - Latter-day Saint here. There will ultimately be unity in the presence of Christ. He will set His standards. There will be no "isms" in His presence. No thousands of different religions like here on earth because in His presence, everyone will know Him and His truths. Latter-day Saints believe the Celestial Kingdom is the place to experience the fullness of God the Father and Jesus Christ, and that's why we perform proxy work for others to also have that opportunity, but everyone still has the choice. It's not a choice of "Mormonism" or any other religion. It's a choice of accepting all that Christ has to offer.
Well and at 43:00 I find it ironic that we have such a gap. Evangelicals and Latter Day Saints have a very similar starting point. A desire to get back to the true teaching of Christ. The thing we disagree about is the level of “overhaul” required to get there. Luther and Wesley and others attempted a reformation. We say no that is not enough, we need a full blown restoration. Like that’s a pretty similar starting point.
I think you guys are doing a great thing in us understanding each other and in understanding each other is dispelling hate. I always like to think that all good people of every religion will gain salvation. I would be very disappointed if mother Teresa was not part of the mellenium. One scripture I have read that has caused me to think that might not be the case, is Revelation 14:6
I have ask myself why did God send that angel to earth with a gospel if there was already a religion on earth that can gain man salvation? Why was it so important that it had to be preached to every nation kindred tongue and people?
Being LDS I believe that angel was the angel Moroni. If so what have we got that makes us so different from the rest of Christianity? One thing that stands out is Temples, what is important about Temples? Well a few important things obviously Malachi tells us if we don't turn the hearts of the children to their fathers then the whole world will be cursed at the second coming. Joseph Smith visit by the angel Moroni worded it slightly different that the whole world will be utterly wasted at His coming, why the difference? Is it because the world was created for the purpose of sealing families together for time and all eternity. If not done then it was a waste of time creating the world in the first place? Also the spirits in prison have zero hope of getting out and into the paradise if Temples are not erected. So being LDS you might say I'm bias but these scriptures are all in the Bible but nobody is doing anything about it because they don't understand what's being said. In reality we are no better it took the return of Elijah in 1836 before we knew what it was about. If Temples are the only way we can be forever as families, I feel really sorry for those who reject it, as they love their families as much as we do. In some cases I wish it was not true as Jeff and his followers are really good people. If we are followers of Christ both Bible and book of Mormon ask you to get confirmation from God, as did Peter who became a rock.
Matt 16:16-18
I did this myself so I know it works and I am so glad I did otherwise I would be so confused trying to work this out mentally in fact I would say impossible.
As Jeff said 44,000 different sects is it possible to know all their doctrine then work out which one has all the truth necessary for salvation?
Of course if that angel was not the angel Moroni then there is going to be one turn up in the future what will he have that we currently haven't got, that we need?
But keep going guys, good has only come from it so far.
I feel bad for those who reject the restored gospel . Can you imagine how Lehi felt when laman and lamuel rejected all the blessings.
I find it hard to watch PJ. I find him disingenuous. He is good looking and friendly which makes people readily embrace him and his subtle deceptions. I see him as basking in his money and fame and rubbing elbows with good LDS members, while desirering to preach to them the "truth". I am surprised by the number of LDS members who subscribe to his patreon page, giving money to build up a man who teaches you that your church is not true. While I appreciate interfaith interactions, I believe that they should begin with a foundation of honesty and integrity which, unfortunately, I have not found in PJ. I stopped watching him along time ago, so maybe he has changed. We can always hope.
I sense a strong foundation of integrity and honesty. I think he's very willing to accept the differences in doctrine. He believes what he's been taught and he shares that. Greg and Kurt believe what they've been taught and they share that. It seems like a vey amicable give and take with both sides realizing there's a divide in doctrine and both sides are going to hold true to their doctrine. Both sides understand that but they are willing to look at what they do have in common - most importantly their love of Jesus Christ and their belief that He is their Savior.
@cheyaweber704 Like I said, it has been a long time since I have watched PJ. I know he has changed his approach because he has gotten a lot of push back. And I do believe that it is important to understand other people and what they believe. But, he doesn't look for the good in our church or the beliefs that we have in common as he reads the Book of Mormon, he only seems to find the things that are controversial or that he doesn't agree with, and then he "preachers gotta preach" tells us at the end of his video how we are wrong. I think the point where I stopped watching him altogether was, I had seen him on an interview telling the other person, that evangelicals didn't really know anything about the Mormons and never talked about them and then the video came out where he was preaching against Mormonism from his pulpit. That told me that he was not being honest in his approach and that it was just his clever sales pitch to preach to the Mormons.
Yep, he appears harmless as a dove but he’s wise as a serpent. However, I think he’s doing more good than bad. I think he will lead more evangelicals to the Church than members to evangelicalism
@@ItsSnagret That I do believe. Because he is very likeable and has a sizable platform, he will begin to reach more people outside of the LDS community. I don't hate him, he is hard to hate. I hope that he has an influence for good on all people and brings people unto Christ, no matter what faith they belong to.
@@cheyaweber704Jesus Christ said that he would divide people and families. Matthew 10:34-37; Luke 12:51-53 The truth naturally divides people. To be worthy of Jesus and eternal life, one must side with God's truth even if it divides his own family.
I can’t watch PJ 😂. Knowing what he’s doing makes it hard to watch. Maybe if he dropped the Book of Mormon image from his channel profile pic and the title Hello Saints I’d give him some grace. I’ll repent later, but for now, when he’s present in a video, I choose not to watch.
Bingo! WISC
I with you dcarts. He’s looks harmless as a dove but he’s wise as a serpent
Agreed brosky
I loved the segment where Jeff talks about how we need to stop demonizing each other. Some LDS members don't agree with Jeff's approach, and that's okay. But even so, there's no need to demonize him or make assumptions about him.
@@crissie70 I really hope that what I said isn’t considered a demonization of PJ. I simply stated that I can’t take him seriously, with his Book of Mormon image and Hello Saints channel name. Maybe you don’t know, because you’re not LDS, but we have existing channels on RUclips that do use the same tactics as PJ. For example Mormon Stories, Radio Free Mormon’s Come Follow Me course, NemotheMormon, etc. They use our familiar nomenclature with intent to deceive an unsuspecting LDS and by then it’s too late. That’s all I’m saying. I think PJ is a nice person. I think his beliefs are great. I also think he’s not being upfront with his mission, that’s all.
I'll call it, pastor Jeff is going to be baptized one day 😊
The Dream Team!!!
Nice spin. I’m 71. I have studied a lot. What I claimed for decades, and was called “anti”-which I was not - - is now on the church’s website to a large degree (in the “gospel topic essays”). Interesting evolution.
He also called his own granddaughter “myopic” - from that same pulpit.
The nerve! I think your grasping here.
@@CwicShowYou may find it appropriate. I simply don’t. Not in his position.
Regarding a "divide" you certainly can't look at this as team A and team B or simply as an LDS point of view and a Protestant point of view!
After all, while the LDS tradition and faith is on the same page, the Protestant tradition and faith is all over the map! The Protestant divide is huge!
A Baptist run Ropes Course that rents its facilities out as part of an adventure experience refused to allow our LDS kids at YM/YW camps refused to rent their facilities to us, because of our faith. Very sad and not very interfaith building.
I see both sides of the argument being had in these comments.
Pastor Jeff is definitely strong in his beliefs that evangelical Christianity is correct and he's not looking to possibly convert to our church. And that's okay. Yes, he may be trying to build off-ramps (as David Alexander has talked about) for members of our faith who might be disillusioned or deceived. But part of him might be honestly trying to build bridges of understanding at the same time. I will remain skeptical and strive to pay attention to the Holy Ghost whenever I listen to anyone, whether that be Pastor Jeff or President Nelson. The Holy Ghost has confirmed to me on many occasions that President Nelson is a prophet of God. I know his words are the words of Christ, and I see that clearly as I strive (however imperfectly) to put them to the test.
Let's all trust in the promise of the sacrament prayer to always have his spirit to be with us and we can be instruments in bringing more unto Christ. Thanks, Greg for your faithful approach in building interfaith relations.
Pride. ignorance and deceit is the divide.
I hope Jeff “chainsaw “McCullich, let’s David Alexander baptize him. And then have David Alexander, yourself and David Boice do his confirmation,
12:00 Pastor Jeff: "We're pretty much in Zarahemla, and nobody on the outside knows what's going on over here..." The amount of time and effort and goodwill that it took to get to the point that he can see an analogy like this, express it in a totally earnest and respectful way... this is why LDS people love Jeff and Joy! Thank you, Greg, Kurt, and Jeff, for the conversation. This is awesome in so many ways.
36:30
Who are the LDS members threatening this guy?
"Stop what you're doing or else!"
45:00 Jeff, 👏👏👏👏👏👏👏
Really?
Had to put pastor Jeff on?
Don’t watch. And I love bringing good friends and good people on the show. Doesn’t get better than Jeff
@@CwicShow
Your being deceived, you’ll see in time
@artantunesjr Oh, ok. I didn’t realize you knew him so well. Jeff and I are good friends. I know him pretty well. You’re deceiving yourself with ignorance.
I’m not attacking you, I just happen to know better in this situation.
We need this synergy between Christ loving people with “differences” we may have via being in different dominations. The secular world is going to magnify exponentially in the next 20-30 years due to AI, advances in medicine and systems in place for society. So many people are gonna brush off any need for Christ when all of their needs are met (robots, AI and such). Those churches that have enough resources $$$ and systems will survive. 1000s of churches will close their doors due to no tithing, offerings from people cause people simply just won’t care. We better combine or become cohesive in our efforts or the future is grim for so many religions.
The very first thing to figure out is: what is the objective of developing interfaith relationships other than to convert? That would be the only reason to have those relationships. They share their testimony about the truthfulness of their snake handling protestant evangelical, church, and we share our testimony of a church lead by living profits and apostles, and we hope that we can convert as they can convert us. Our church is doing wonderful things around the world. Wonderful things, including building temples as directed by heavenly father and approved by past apostles, like Moses, Elijah, Peter and even Jesus Christ himself as shared by church membersin their diaries from Kirkland. Jeff always has to do stuff with latter-day Saints in order to develop revenue for himself. Be careful. He’s a wolf and sheep clothing.
@KB-nv4bl - I completely disagree. There are many reasons to have interfaith relationships without an ulterior motive or ultimate goal of conversion. If conversion were really the only goal, then how do you determine which side should become converted to the other side? If each side expects the other to be converted, both will remain at odds and there will never be a deeper connection. There is much to be gained by learning about others' beliefs, what is important to people and why. I have several close friends that are Hindu, Buddhist, and Muslim, plus a variety of Christian religions and it's always enlightening to learn more about each other's beliefs. Belief also influences culture and practice, so you can't really understand people or appreciate your similarities or differences without interfaith conversations. I also benefit by hearing and answering the questions they have for me as a Latter-day Saint.
47:00 amen 👏👏🙏💟
He called people “lazy learners” and “lax deciples “ from the pulpit at General Conference. Doesn’t come across as all that loving ( as he preaches).
@davidchristensen587 - Did you even watch that talk in General Conference? President Nelson was talking about having faith in Jesus Christ as the Master Healer. The actual quote is: "Through your faith, Jesus Christ will increase your ability to move the mountains in your life, even though your personal challenges may loom as large as Mount Everest. Your mountains may be loneliness, doubt, illness, or other personal problems. Your mountains will vary, and yet the answer to each of your challenges is to increase your faith. That takes work. Lazy learners and lax disciples will always struggle to muster even a particle of faith."
Greg and Kurt... please do me and the Lord Jesus Christ Himself and change the podcast name to... members of the Church of Jesus Christ. NOT the latter day saints. We can't seem to keep Christs name in whom we are representing 😢 it seems like everyone is just trying so hard to show we don't worship Jesus Christ 😢 we are either Mormons or now we are latter day saints. Please we are members of the Church of Jesus Christ
A favor 😀 I forgot that paer
I agree and believe in the importance of unity through interfaith dialogue, as we navigate the complexities of our evolving world.Christ's words in Mark 9:40 ('For he that is not against us is on our part'), should be our guide. But, how do you grapple with LDS belief that evangelicals merely lack the full truth (amd know not where to find it) and we can add to the truth they do have offering a broader lens and perspective on the premortal existence and modern revelation and contrast that with protestants eagerness to label our faith as from Satan, demonic and that we worship a different ie false Christ?
Like one person saying hey your painting is good here's how you can make it better and here's some more paints and brushes to keep painting. Then the other side says hey your painting needs to be thrown out or painted completely over, also toss your favorite colors and brushes...and by the way the devil inspired all those brushstrokes.
Build a relationship first regardless of whether they will ever convert.
@CwicShow I don't take issue with relationship building at all nor was my comment meant to imply I need to convert them.
It just feels like the nature of our faith and doctrine means we come to interfaith discussions with a perspective of grace, not accusation. (Though there's always outliers but we'd be hard pressed to find lots of talks and devotionals from leadership promoting hostility to other faiths. Whereas it's real essy to find that on the other side of the divide no?)
…there are many LDS who have left the “church”. They feel hurt and religiously lied to. Those who have left but still keep their faith in God often want to reach out to LDS and share with them all the things that were covered up. This is a unique type of evangelical that tend to comment on these RUclips discussions.
They won't get much response because they always act like they're aware of something regarding gospel doctrine or church history that those of us who remain aren't aware of. When, in reality, it's they themselves who are behind the 8 ball and when they finally caught up, they failed to navigate it and remain faithful. Nobody was "lied to." There are simply, as President Nelson said, "lazy learners and lax disciples" who have failed to put in the work necessary for a full understanding and lasting testimony.
@@jaredshipp9207
God loves you. ❤️
11:17 Amen! I remember reading How Wide the Divide about when a Latter-Day Saint showed up to protest a pornographic book store being opened in a community and the Protestants wouldn’t protest alongside the LDS person. Here they had alignment and yet their ideology was more important the common goal.
100. The divide is MUCH wider on their side. Ive found LDS to be very tolerant / accepting of other religions in comparison.
That’s because they aren’t really against porn .
@@lindamartinez7006 I have wonderful evangelical friends and family that would vehemently disagree and find this comment very offensive.
I volunteered one Saturday out front of a supermarket showing an anti-pornographic video to shoppers. There were two EV's I knew previously. They passed by openly laughing at me. I guess I was too "worksy" for them.
9:00 bingo! We forget the mercies of Christ if we default to this.
Stand in temple square and see the evangelicals hold up signs against the latterday saint religion a lot of them are on mormon stories
The evangelical hated for the Church comes down to one thing…. money. Evangelical pastors make money and popularity through preaching, in other words priestcraft.
Ah yes Andy Stanley. He’s 80% there! He just needs a 99 yr old to sustain!
Dont poke the bear!
I am glad that this is being discussed.
It was often exhausting being a Latter-Day Saint in the Midwest. Constantly being told what I believed by Evangelicals and being harassed about how wrong I was. One time there was a bible study over lunch that some protestants at work started over lunch. I and another Latter-day Saint went to the bible study and were asked to not participate by one of the members of the group.
Later I moved to Utah and I learned, that during that same time period that I was being hassled, some Latter-Day Saints in Utah were treating those that were of other faiths or of no faith at all or those that had left our faith very much the same way, or worse than, I had been treated.
Im just listening to this. It sounds like Jeff M is already a socially converted LDS. Relief society probably bringing him meals and he might even have what used to call “ home teachers “ . I just don’t see him defending the New Testament gospel like Paul did . Makes me wonder what space he is In . Won’t surprise me to see him baptized LDS soon and his family get their temple sealing. Greg , I am sure you will be at his LDS baptism . You definitely have played a part in his conversion.
Honestly, I don’t approach relationships this way. I would never really even think about this. I’m not Jeff’s friend to convert him.
So interesting as there are also many Latter-day Saints who think he is doing the converting. People on both sides just don't like walking in unfamiliar paths.
Jeff is a high integrity individual. His family is amazing.
The thing that bugs me the most is when it’s said that we believe in a different Jesus! Fundamentally we have the same belief-the specifics are different, but as people who love and worship Jesus, let’s stick together! 🤍