Never Morman here. I’ve been following Morman stories for over a year now. I live in Aubrey, Texas which is in the same area as Prosper/McKinney/Fairview. I watched the meeting live and saw Nemo speak. I really appreciated how he came to the town’s defense. Much love from Texas, Nemo!
Despite all of the wonderful support Nemo has and deserves, and having been warned about what it feels like to endure one of these excommunication councils, it is impossible not to notice that Nemo is really shook up. He's always so stoic; but his feelings are showing up pretty raw here, and my heart goes out to him and the rest who have gone through this process...especially since I've seen so many truly bad people get away with abuse, cheating, etc and NOT go through this. If Nemo was one of their good ol' boys on high, he'd be protected.
An excommunication is emotional abuse. We have just witnessed an abuse victim. Not letting him know what the allegations are is part of that abusive scheme. It is disgusting and unchristlike. This alone disproves the Church.
@@charlesmendeley9823 yep. exactly Why I would not go through it and resigned. Wasn't going to let them not treat me as I would expect to be treated as an adult in every other instance of my life.
@@charlesmendeley9823 Give me a break. He touts the church that he belongs to and it's leaders as liars, money grabbers, pokes fun at the temple with his friends and then acts like a shocked and harshly dealt with child when they call him for a disciplinary. So disingenuous. Playing victim all day long.
My husband and I were excommunicated in 1972 for apostasy because we could not sustain racist policies of the Mormon Church. As we were leaving the trial, the stake president said, “You’ve read too many books.” I asked, “May I get that on letterhead?” I recommend when Nemo’s stake president says, “You’ve pointed out too much truth,” Nemo ask for that on letterhead! You will feel better in just a while, Nemo.
What’s the phrase “Out of the best books”. This was firmly established in me as a young Relief Society member back in the 80’s. Then the Church went all correlated on us!! 😮
Im a member of the church and I cannot explain why they think they have power to excommunicate someone from the church of Jesus Christ? Even if everything is true, no one can point the finger to someone and tell them the church of Jesus Christ does not belong to that person anymore. This frustrates me so much! I apologize for all those ones who are hurt by my church! It kills me inside!
@@TyleRMatin6532in Joseph’s day the rules and regulations were agreed upon by common consent of the people. Today, the leaders like to make all the rules..including the recent definition of an “apostate” that came from Oaks as someone who doesn’t follow leader’s orders in all things. They’ve created a cult and are leading under unrighteous dominion.
The thing that really bothers me about this whole thing is that the leaders think they have control over our salvation. My salvation is between me and God. These councils are a joke
That's a good point though. In their minds, they're actually taking his salvation away from him. Like they think he deserves that. Never mind murderers, r*pists, abusers, thieves, etc. This guy who is a truth teller and is peacefully advocating for better practices is so evil, they're going to threaten that Jesus can't save him.
@@IamCreeoh yeah the church went to court to help defend my x brother in law he was charged with attempted murder with a deadly weapon against my sister and he wasn’t even a Mormon. And the only reason the church knew this had happened was when my sister was rushed to hospital she lived interstate with no family or friends the the hospital asked if there was anyone they could call for her and 2 days she had the missionaries knock on her door and they told her if she needed anything just to call them. They went and visited her and then rang the bishop and he immediately took Terry’s side. My sister wouldn’t have anything else to do with the church and my mum who was divorced single mum on a pension asked the church if they could help with train fare so she could go and pick my sister up and they said no so she had to go to the court and get money from the poor box.
I just listened to this after it aired and my heart was just touched when Nemo came on. I’m sorry you are having to carry this weighty burden. I’m a Brit that left my home (🇬🇧 Aylesbury ward, St.Albans/Watford stake.) to marry and I’m now exmo in Utah. It was a hard time with no family support and now no extended family. Mormon Expressions (John Larsen) and Mormon stories was a lifeline. Thanks to Nemo, Zelph Sam, Sam, Natasha, Lindsey, Kate and all the exmo warriors helping us live on beyond this church. 💛
I see Nemo's excommunication as a badge of honor. Lotta good people been given the boot. Nothing to be ashamed of. Hold your head high. Many blessings of a nurturing nature. ❤😊
I’m so mad, yet Chad daybell is still a member, Jodie Hildebrant, still a member, Ruby Frankie still a member… “Spencer” still a member… REALLY?!?!!!!!!!
I love that SP points out that the public speaking against the church is actually what the handbook says. Now private communications aren't even safe cause we've (apparently) got the Mormon Stasi spying on members and reporting dissidents. It really IS sinister.
Nemo should have been axed a long time ago, he is the sinister one acting as if he is LDS when he clearly doesn't believe in "the Church". It is sad to see these group of people claiming to be supporting him when all they are doing is playing their own victim cards all over again. So you don't believe, great, leave. You want to "help" others? Okay help them, but stop with the "poor me" rubbish.
So heartbreaking to witness his pain! But as a nevermo with a deep interest in how people experience religion, I think witnessing each other is the most important bond we can have. So proud of Nemo for standing in his integrity. Virtue is its own reward.
Nemo - The Martin Luther to the Mormons. Nevermo and don't understand why you want to stay, but you have my support. You are very wise and articulate and God is already using you to do great things.
I just want to say thank you to all who are on this panel. But really, thank you to Sam Young. I know people who have had kids go into the bishops office alone in one visit and they put on Facebook how they shouldn’t have done that. They felt horrible as parents etc. and going forward they demand to be in the office. I describe myself as an ex Mormon although my name has not been removed (yet) and my I have been very open with my son and he does not attend church. My husband stopped going as well although he still has a belief. I told my son that he is never to be alone with another adult no matter what. So I appreciate all that has been done for the sake of my child. But also the conversations I have had with him are so much more different than what I had with my parents. Everything related to sex was a big “no” until marriage. I remember seeing porn while in Europe and feeling so ashamed about it and telling my bishop. I’m horrified and sick thinking about that conversation now. That was in 2000. I remember it because of my brothers wedding. Anyway, thank you to all who have made this sacrifice for me to be where I’m at today, for me to be able to have the conversations with my child that I can and explain what is healthy, what is not. And also to have the conversations I’ve had with all my neighbors who have left the church as well. It’s a much safer place for all of us because of all of you! ❤
The real irony is him being part of an organisation he states he wants to be part of but then tries to break it down for years. Not one of his videos has been to compliment the church or it's leaders for their work. He then has ther audcity to play the victim when called in for a disciplinary. the guys an embarrasment to himself.
@Kerry-f3c I'm curious, are you ok being part of an organization that misleads, isn't completely honest, by its own standard and silences those that are openly honest, as the organization teaches? If there are lies, mistakes Nemo has made, please, point them out. Or just criticize him, without providing fact.
I can see you guys being very sincere and emotional and how this has brought you back to your own excommunication's. I deeply feel for you and hope the newspapers in England pick up on this. Love from ENGLAND 🇬🇧 ❤️
It’s beautiful the exmo community knows how to mourn with those that mourn and lift up the hands that hang down. No need for ministering lists, or compassionate service coordinators. We the people, see a person who needs support and show up in the ways we can, even if it’s just in spirit on a youtube vigil. Not trashing Sam Young by any means - I'm sure he handled disciplinary counsels as well as they can be handled - but that's kind of what the church specializes in cruelty with a smile. I feel like it's an inherently spiritually and emotionally violent process, especially when one is being thrown out of the church for standing for truth, like they taught us to do.
You have made this a statement about the church. Yet, this is your experience only. Others have very different views. It never ceases to amaze me how people's personal experience, whilst valid, claim to be the only way. Have a broader perspective than just your own.
Omg! Natasha! Yes!! please tell us how to support Nemo the BEST way we can!!!! I dont have much but want to support that sweet CARING AMAZING young man who is only doing what he feels is RIGHT
Nemo is a good person. We are all victims of the Mormon church brainwashing, mind games and control. Nemo stood up to the dishonest leaders and I am appreciative for all his work. Love you Nemo!
Give me a break. He has established himself in some circles as this hero of truth telling. He turns up to his discplinary in his temple white suit. He has constantly called leaders liars, church teachings and history as false and then acts all upset that they are being harsh to him. He needs to give his head a shake.
There is nooooo way my kids are to be alone with ANYONE, I was standing right there for their interviews; people giving me the side eye and I could NOT care less
Ok I got to the part where NEMO got into the car- and I have to say, aside from a previous comment I made on this video, that it is refreshing to see the support from fellow friends and colleagues of Nemo in the video. I feel like I can maybe sense a little bit from the people in this video who have gone through the excommunication process how much they truly do feel for him, are there for him, and have compassion for him. And I think that is important. Thank you
Nevermo and long-time Mormon Stories listener here. I really hope that Nemo finds peace in separation from the church. I watched the episode on his channel where he said that the fact that the church is built on lies is not a good argument not to try to reform it. I can agree with that as far as things like child welfare go, but I think that fundamentally the LDS church was founded by a power-seeking narcissist, and that it primarily exists to sustain itself, not better its members. So yes, it's important to help people whose lives are impacted by the church, but I don't think the church itself can be redeemed at the end of the day. The church leaders will never be honest because that would mean revealing that the church isn't what it claims to be, and the entire conceit unravels. With lies it began and with lies it will end. I hope that Nemo can see that the wonderful community he knows and the people he loves are that way because of the divine light in them, and that such wonderful things can (and should) continue to exist outside the context of the church.
Fabulous collaboration from hosts, guests and commenters. Although Nemo is likely feeling humiliation, hurt and betrayal from the egregious actions of the mormon church, I believe he will be stronger and find his own spiritual truth. You have tremendous support, Nemo. Thanks to you all.
1:44:45 Bill, sadly you are right. Maybe it's because the history of the church hasn't started with a truth seeker as we were taught, but rather with a power and status seeker. That is the foundation. And so it continues.
I am a NeverMo, but grew up with a lot of Mormon friends, hence my curiosity! I have been down the rabbit hole with a bunch of these folks' videos and podcasts for the past year or so, and Nemo has always been one of my favorites. My heart dropped when I learned he'd been called to a disciplinary council, but I didn't imagine the sorrow I would feel on starting this video. I was in tears at the beginning as well as when Nemo first came out. I have never been a faithful follower of any religion, so the fact that an excommunication could have such an effect surprised me. For a faithful member? Y'all are correct - it is incredibly cruel, and I would say an act of violence. Sending my best wishes for Nemo, and while I am skeptical, I sincerely hope he gets what he wants!
I think that it hit BR and Natasha and Nemo hard because at some level they hadn’t fully given up on the church and they expected or hoped for justice. Against all odds they still hoped. I think the emotion is the result of fully realizing the farce. I went through the emotional pain of separation far earlier. When it came time I submitted my resignation because I was deliberately telling them that they have no power or authority over me and I would not pretend any longer that they did.
Thank you to everyone on this panel and, of course, Nemo for giving me a safe place to learn. Learning the truth about the church is painful. You are all a light in a really scary and dark place.
Writing from Canada - I went through a church tribunal in the 1990's in British Columbia. (I found it tough to belong to an American Church in my own country, due to the arrogance & lack of compassion towards international church members). I had no advocates with me at my excommunication, as that wasn't allowed. There were about 10 men in the room, (many were my friends), which obviously outnumbered me and the leaders were trying to intimidate me throughout this tribunal (apparently, there were only supposed to be 3 men in there - the Bishopric). I was treated disrespectfully, as a woman typically is when they don't 'cave in' to the patriarchy. The pain I felt was immense. Today, I feel it all over again. I only wish I had the talents and courage of people like Nemo, to help me deconstruct back then, because this helps with the healing. That said, I can relate to the process Nemo is going through. I feel for you, your wife, and your family, Nemo. I am so grateful for your podcasts and the strength they have given me and so many others. I just want to thank you for the bottom of my heart and am sending you all the support and love from across the Pond.
I’m sorry you went through this, especially alone. 🥰 I’m quite emotional reading all the accounts of how the church treats so many. I hope you are able to recover and have a beautiful future 💗
My heart goes out to you, Nemo! My experience in the church has been different because I was kind of ostracized and judged very harshly because of my severe head injury. despite that, I’m struggling with the idea that I’ve been lied to all my life. My son is a huge support for me and my daughter is also! My ex-wife was always very supportive of me. Anyways, sorry I’m talking about me if I had some money I would send it your way, but I’m overdrawn at the moment. My heart goes out to you and I’m sorry you have to go through this! You and John have helped me so much, thank you Sorry my punctuation is atrocious. I haven’t taught my iPhone to punctuate properly yet and they have a really hard time going back and reading what I’ve put and understanding it. As my wonderful father-in-law would say. “ keep on keeping on!”
It is a fact, LDS people are not entitled to voice up opinions against the "church" - yes is lower case- because they are excommunicated, shame on them!
Sending much love and respect for Nemo. I am currently technically a completely inactive member, though I consider myself an exmo. My heart breaks for Nemo in this horrific barbaric farce of “discipline.” How disgusting and disheartening that he’s experiencing this, all for seeking and standing up for truth and honesty and integrity. Chin up, sweet Nemo. You are a good and righteous young man. Sending you warm hugs.
Nice work everybody! We can hope perhaps Nemo’s stake leadership will see sense, though I doubt it. Whatever the outcome, Nemo can be proud to have had the utmost integrity and to have tried hard to shine a light in the dark dank corners of the church to show the rot for what it is. We’re with you and behind you Nemo, whatever the outcome.
It’s a pity the people banging on people’s doors are trying to kick out someone who wants to remain. I know they recently stopped but I’m old enough to have been bothered.
As a Never Mormon I spend a lot of time listening to and watching the podcasts. I live in a densely populated LDS community and I choose to learn more about their lives. It makes me sad that my female friends live under the oppression of their faith and likely still believe that Jos Smith was a great man. (NOT). Like those crazy Trump supporters who will not believe he is demented, my friends are equally blind to the lies of the church leaders. I was away from technology today and spent a lot of time thinking about Nemo, his goodness and the power his team of accusers have over him. Blessings on Nemo and his family, he is an amazing man.
I find it even more disturbing that the stake president is making Nemo wait a few days for him to come to a decision. If the president isn’t able to see a clear outcome after all of this then Nemo should not be excommunicated or disfellowshipped. This just shows he has doubts about what to do.
Wow! Look at the support! My heart goes out! Hugs, Nemo! 😔 BTW, seeing our Nemo, he is dressed in WHITE! I'm weeping my heart out! I'm sorry, Nemo, and wish you knew how loved you are! Please, take the time to reflect, and heal, which will take time... Wishing you, PEACE, & MY DEEPEST LOVE! 😢🎻♥️
I am outside the Mormon church myself, but I try to be a friend to ex-Mormons as best I can in my Catholic faith. This may or may not be helpful. From my historical research of the origins of the LDS Church I have reached the conclusion that Mormonism itself is an “apostasy” from 19th century Evangelical Protestantism, particularly in its Puritan form. Mormons today think and speak very similarly to Evangelical Protestants for this reason. The truth is that Mormonism and all its history are part of what I call “Americana.” 😊😊😊
This is a rare "cross over" podcast with almost all of the "celebrity" ex-Mormons with an online presence. Peter Bleakly's tribute to JD is well-deserved. appropriate. Nemo is such a treasure and the LDS is throwing away his genuine love and concern to improve the church.
I wonder if at least one or some of the apostles or other leadership are thinking to themselves the following regarding the current new batch of excommunications, some of which, like Nemo's will be very public because of the speed of the internet: “I fear all we have done is to awaken a sleeping giant and fill him with a terrible resolve.”
@phillisob. I think they know EXACTLY "WHAT THEY HAVE DONE." Just what they hope with all their "hearts" to do: hurt, harm, humiliate. Except THEY ARE ultimately DOING IT TO THEMSELVES the worst.
@@sheliabryant3997 Yes, they very may well know. They saw what happened with John and many others; it only intensified their missions and brought attention to them. Hurt, harm, and humiliation are but a few tools they wield in their neverending search for control. I hope Nemo really unleashes now and loses his restraint.
Agency, The Church will find every lever to remove it from you. Accept the definitions of truth as we define it or you will suffer. Do we ever find free and open conversation in the Church or is it controlled and constrained to be acceptable to the dogma.
Listening to Nemo's car interview, it makes me feel like "what if children and baptism members were informed of the process of disciplinary councils and what they will face and what sorts of things can trigger them"- that seems like actual informed consent- we are going to tell you what this looks like if you ever choose to leave, and we will tell you because it is a huge sacrifice of time and money and all life decisions made from the perspective of this church- so if you are sincere and loving, and you come to disagreements, this is what is will then look like. Disciplinary councils are SOOOO hidden and secret, I wonder what people would do if they came to light more (as they are in this instance).
Oh…You Beautiful, Beautiful BEings..: I don’t know how to adequately express my Appreciation&Love for Each of You.! You are the BRave&Courageous, out on the front lines using Your Voices with Love&Compassion to bring the Darkness into the Light ☀️ The World is Seeing how this particular System has become One of the most profound examples of Ultimate Bondage. A System of Ritualistic Torture, Rape, and Abuse that has Become one of the largest agents for Human Trafficking on this Planet! Let Us ALL Shine our Sovereign Birthright, Our Love&Compassion on All of these proceedings … 🙏🏽 🙌🏼 🙏🏽 🙏🏽 💜 💟 💜 🙏🏽 🙏🏽 🙌🏼 🙏🏽
First, I know that surname…. Heath. I think I knew the Heaths when I lived in the UK. ❤ Next, I don’t know why but Nemo’s excommunication is hitting me particularly hard. I was in the Mormon Stories space for Natasha’s as well, which was horrendous. Yet, knowing how the “church” treats women it was almost inevitable, the violence of their actions against her. Unforgiveable, but not unexpected. With Nemo, I’m heartbroken again. Peace and light to everyone xxxx
Once again the church got it wrong But, it is building such a wonderful group of beautiful people that have grown in knowledge, understanding, and wisdom that are now "Outside the church". The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter Day Saints is built on sand slowing sifting away. Truth is the only answer, and their fight to hide the truth, deny the truth, and failure to redefine their doctrine is destroying them. Very sad and so many people yet to be hurt. Thank you John and entire panel for such wonderful support of Nemo.
Listening to Natasha Helfer, I need to say, I do not personally understand the POV of trying to change the church and looking to make change in the church. I did not agree with certain cultural things for a long time, but when the doctrine became a problem point for me and the foundations of the church and the book of mormon, I just left. I did not want to be treated as an adult getting told off or disciplined like a child for my beliefs. If I no longer believed in their doctrine, I thought it best to leave. I do not understand the mentality of wanting to still identify as mormon when you no longer believe the doctrine. I do understand that not everyone feels this way, I just wanted to express my experience and POV and not sure why people choose to go through this or try to stay when they do not believe in the doctrine. I guess I might get some huge blowback. I guess it makes me wonder if I am alone in this thinking. I am sorry for what Nemo is going through and I think watching Nemo going through this might catch some attention due to how reasonable and logical his approaches have been- it might make some people think twice watching him go through this (or that they might hide more because they DO NOT want to put themself through this). Who knows!
You are not alone in this thinking, plenty feel that way; but wanting to stay and reform your community is also a very real response. I agree that Nemo has always been a very polite and careful critic.
Nemo gives credible style, new meaning - and a particularly fine upgrade - to the white-suit haberdashers. Dearest boy, your gallant heart is broken, and your face has born the weight of sorrow these recent days; but, Douglas, YOU LOOK MAHHHVVELLLUSS, DAhhhhllllink! 🌹🌹 [ As do all who have lovingly hosted your vigil.]
I’m a huge supporter of this podcast and a guest who so generously share their experiences. This entire situation has perplexed me though. I just assumed that all of the post Mormon podcast community had already been excommunicated. I’m blown away that he’s so distressed. Why in the world would you want to be officially associated with this organization? why in the world would you be fighting not to be excommunicated - the request for people to send letters protesting this absolutely blew my mind. I would expect this to be a topic of discussion amongst the post Mormon podcast community from a content perspective, but I have to say that seeing the tagline “and online global vigil“ was incredibly offputting. Being removed from an organization that you are so critical of requires an online global vigil? I’m horrified by the Mormon church, but the expectation that you can literally make criticism of the church, your profession and then be upset that they want to officially disassociate themselves from you, seems completely unreasonable. I hate to see his distress, but this whole situation has really Changed my perspective on things.
@@angelaarnett3333 I may not know what is going on in terms of beliefs about the afterlife in the hearts of Nemo and others, but if the church proclaims itself to be the "one true church" with which God is pleased and which leads to salvation, exaltation, eternal families etc, the procedure of excommunication or an excommunication trial is something that may be justified in cases of horrific intentional irreversible crimes, not when the person points out the flaws in the leadership. According to their beliefs that casts the person away from the path to eternal life with eternal families. Besides, right here and now Nemo's family members are in the church - that directly affects them on a very personal level. Yes, he criticizes the organization, but he does it by pointing at obvious discrepancies between what they preach and how they live. So why not to show support for him today whether I agree with his choices or not.
I think you don't understand what such thorough brainwashing is like. There are emotional ties that we can't even perceive, much less untangle. For those who grew up in the church, it has literally formed our identities and how we even process/experience emotions (until I left in my 30's, I used to walk into a room of people and think, I'm Mormon , because that was my identity and I didn't have one outside that.. It was my actual essence as a person). So even if, logically, we are able to break free and see the problems, there are still deep, conditioned, emotional responses. It took me years after leaving the church to not have moments of secret fear that I had got it all wrong, that the church, on some level, WAS true, and I had committed the unpardonable sin and world suffer in eternity. It was totally irrational. There was no part of my rational mind that believed it was even possible for the church to be true after all the evidence, experience, and critical thought I had accumulated. I didn't even believe in God anymore but still the fear and sadness world come. In addition, the tactics they use during these councils are abusive and shaming, and that would impact anyone. The abuse in the church usually isn't straightforward like it is in more violent religions. It is very layered, psychological, and twisted together with "kindness" and "truth". It gets past your armor and is so hard to come away clean.
I am a never Mormon who has been following this community for quite a long time. I think all the participants here have traumatic stories, but I feel the same intense sadness for Nemo that I felt during John and Natasha’s proceedings. It’s tragic so unnecessary
That a beautiful truth-seeker and truth-teller ❤ like Nemo has been forced to undergo such an abominable process is a sad commentary in and of itself on the state of the Mormon church. Nemo - you are loved … even here in Quebec by one who has always questioned and rarely received answers until upstanding members like yourself decided to make things public. Thanks a million for having the courage to do what’s right. 😢
I have been sooooo fearful Nemo may be sooooo broken by this act of HATE, HUMILIATION, CHURCH DESTROYING HIS GOOD NAME, COMMUNITY, AFFECTING HIS LIVING, BEING OSTRACIZED BY PEOPLE CLAIMING THEY ARE DOING AS JESUS TAUGHT THEM! Nemo…i love you. Jesus loves you. Taking the narrow, straight path is not easy hon. Call upon Jesus. So sorry.
It sounds like the tribunal already knows the outcome. So sad. Maybe being excommunicated from the cult isn't such a bad thing. Sending love to Nemo and his family.
Temple clothes to a disciplinary council is a straight up baller move. I love it.
Sorry you are going through this Nemo. Gotta be hard
I’m gonnna do that,too. GENIUS.😮
@clanceyfox. HIGHEST use
that temple costume will ever see.
Never Morman here. I’ve been following Morman stories for over a year now. I live in Aubrey, Texas which is in the same area as Prosper/McKinney/Fairview. I watched the meeting live and saw Nemo speak. I really appreciated how he came to the town’s defense. Much love from Texas, Nemo!
Despite all of the wonderful support Nemo has and deserves, and having been warned about what it feels like to endure one of these excommunication councils, it is impossible not to notice that Nemo is really shook up. He's always so stoic; but his feelings are showing up pretty raw here, and my heart goes out to him and the rest who have gone through this process...especially since I've seen so many truly bad people get away with abuse, cheating, etc and NOT go through this. If Nemo was one of their good ol' boys on high, he'd be protected.
❤❤❤❤❤❤❤❤❤
An excommunication is emotional abuse. We have just witnessed an abuse victim. Not letting him know what the allegations are is part of that abusive scheme. It is disgusting and unchristlike. This alone disproves the Church.
@@charlesmendeley9823 yep. exactly Why I would not go through it and resigned. Wasn't going to let them not treat me as I would expect to be treated as an adult in every other instance of my life.
Y
@@charlesmendeley9823 Give me a break. He touts the church that he belongs to and it's leaders as liars, money grabbers, pokes fun at the temple with his friends and then acts like a shocked and harshly dealt with child when they call him for a disciplinary. So disingenuous. Playing victim all day long.
From the HP movies, Luna Lovegood: they want you to feel alone, because alone you aren't much of a threat. YOU ARE NOT ALONE NEMO!!!
Luna is such a vibe!
My husband and I were excommunicated in 1972 for apostasy because we could not sustain racist policies of the Mormon Church. As we were leaving the trial, the stake president said, “You’ve read too many books.” I asked, “May I get that on letterhead?” I recommend when Nemo’s stake president says, “You’ve pointed out too much truth,” Nemo ask for that on letterhead!
You will feel better in just a while, Nemo.
I thought the Glory of God is Intelligence? I heard that somewhere. Not a member and from the outside, this is horrible.
@@honderwoman1 heaven forbid becoming educated. I’m sorry that happened to you.
What’s the phrase “Out of the best books”. This was firmly established in me as a young Relief Society member back in the 80’s. Then the Church went all correlated on us!! 😮
And just 6 years later the church changed the very thing they ex communicated you for.....
This is both shocking and inspiring. I would love to hear your full story
Watching Nemo’s speech was just a knife to the heart. Why do good people have to go through this trauma???
Yes, I cry, because I love him. He is an honest human trying his best to change things. I am so sad, very sad.
Im a member of the church and I cannot explain why they think they have power to excommunicate someone from the church of Jesus Christ? Even if everything is true, no one can point the finger to someone and tell them the church of Jesus Christ does not belong to that person anymore. This frustrates me so much! I apologize for all those ones who are hurt by my church! It kills me inside!
What do you think of your scripture Doctrine and Covenants 134:10? Is this false revelation according to you?
Here here! I appreciate your insight.
It hurts a lot more people than just the ones that get excommunicated.
@@TyleRMatin6532in Joseph’s day the rules and regulations were agreed upon by common consent of the people. Today, the leaders like to make all the rules..including the recent definition of an “apostate” that came from Oaks as someone who doesn’t follow leader’s orders in all things. They’ve created a cult and are leading under unrighteous dominion.
I am not a member but this does not sound like anything Jesus would do.
The thing that really bothers me about this whole thing is that the leaders think they have control over our salvation. My salvation is between me and God. These councils are a joke
That's a good point though. In their minds, they're actually taking his salvation away from him. Like they think he deserves that. Never mind murderers, r*pists, abusers, thieves, etc. This guy who is a truth teller and is peacefully advocating for better practices is so evil, they're going to threaten that Jesus can't save him.
@@IamCreeoh yeah the church went to court to help defend my x brother in law he was charged with attempted murder with a deadly weapon against my sister and he wasn’t even a Mormon. And the only reason the church knew this had happened was when my sister was rushed to hospital she lived interstate with no family or friends the the hospital asked if there was anyone they could call for her and 2 days she had the missionaries knock on her door and they told her if she needed anything just to call them. They went and visited her and then rang the bishop and he immediately took Terry’s side. My sister wouldn’t have anything else to do with the church and my mum who was divorced single mum on a pension asked the church if they could help with train fare so she could go and pick my sister up and they said no so she had to go to the court and get money from the poor box.
And yet… we will be sad and mourning about something like this, and they know it and do it with the intent of hurting us
So why is he so tearful about being excommunicated? If it isn't valid to him then what's the problem? Unfortunately it's because he is not genuine.
I think Nemo being described as an incredible orator is a very well put description of him.
I just listened to this after it aired and my heart was just touched when Nemo came on. I’m sorry you are having to carry this weighty burden. I’m a Brit that left my home (🇬🇧 Aylesbury ward, St.Albans/Watford stake.) to marry and I’m now exmo in Utah. It was a hard time with no family support and now no extended family.
Mormon Expressions (John Larsen) and Mormon stories was a lifeline. Thanks to Nemo, Zelph Sam, Sam, Natasha, Lindsey, Kate and all the exmo warriors helping us live on beyond this church. 💛
It will be o.k. Nemo! You are the most honest and intelligent historian!
I see Nemo's excommunication as a badge of honor. Lotta good people been given the boot. Nothing to be ashamed of. Hold your head high. Many blessings of a nurturing nature. ❤😊
If Nemo wants to re- name his podcast my suggestion is “Nemo the Truth Teller”
❤ brilliant
Mormon, I meant "Nemo the Truth Teller Mormon"
I’m so mad, yet Chad daybell is still a member, Jodie Hildebrant, still a member, Ruby Frankie still a member… “Spencer” still a member… REALLY?!?!!!!!!!
What are you talking about Chad Daybell was most certainly excommunicated from the Mormon church, I believe in April 2023
Chad probably isn't anymore. Now, he is a convicted murderer.
The way they blindsided and ambushed Nemo with evidence of personal conversation gives me dark chills. This church is so sinister.
I love that SP points out that the public speaking against the church is actually what the handbook says. Now private communications aren't even safe cause we've (apparently) got the Mormon Stasi spying on members and reporting dissidents. It really IS sinister.
Who was his Judas? Cardon Ellis wanted him Oaked, he'd gladly pay 30 pieces of silver.
Nemo should have been axed a long time ago, he is the sinister one acting as if he is LDS when he clearly doesn't believe in "the Church". It is sad to see these group of people claiming to be supporting him when all they are doing is playing their own victim cards all over again. So you don't believe, great, leave. You want to "help" others? Okay help them, but stop with the "poor me" rubbish.
@@Thomas123-c1vwatch it again
@@MaxGray-iw4uu Ya, following Jesus' example is definitely wrong!
So heartbreaking to witness his pain! But as a nevermo with a deep interest in how people experience religion, I think witnessing each other is the most important bond we can have. So proud of Nemo for standing in his integrity. Virtue is its own reward.
Nemo - The Martin Luther to the Mormons. Nevermo and don't understand why you want to stay, but you have my support. You are very wise and articulate and God is already using you to do great things.
❤yes, I said that several weeks ago!
Aw nemo… welcome to this side of the church. We will have ya
My heart hurts SO MUCH! NEMO, we love you. Thank you for speaking truth. ❤
If possible, it would be great to have shorts of the different comments from the panelists- very good, powerful, helpful, and meaningful soundbites.
The heavens are weeping for our beloved Nemo. It has a dark cast over this event. Boy I hope the leaders get the message. Truth will prevail.
I just want to say thank you to all who are on this panel.
But really, thank you to Sam Young. I know people who have had kids go into the bishops office alone in one visit and they put on Facebook how they shouldn’t have done that. They felt horrible as parents etc. and going forward they demand to be in the office. I describe myself as an ex Mormon although my name has not been removed (yet) and my I have been very open with my son and he does not attend church. My husband stopped going as well although he still has a belief. I told my son that he is never to be alone with another adult no matter what. So I appreciate all that has been done for the sake of my child.
But also the conversations I have had with him are so much more different than what I had with my parents. Everything related to sex was a big “no” until marriage. I remember seeing porn while in Europe and feeling so ashamed about it and telling my bishop. I’m horrified and sick thinking about that conversation now. That was in 2000. I remember it because of my brothers wedding.
Anyway, thank you to all who have made this sacrifice for me to be where I’m at today, for me to be able to have the conversations with my child that I can and explain what is healthy, what is not. And also to have the conversations I’ve had with all my neighbors who have left the church as well. It’s a much safer place for all of us because of all of you! ❤
While the church is defending its lies in court, they're excommunicating Nemo for telling the truth. Oh the irony
The real irony is him being part of an organisation he states he wants to be part of but then tries to break it down for years. Not one of his videos has been to compliment the church or it's leaders for their work. He then has ther audcity to play the victim when called in for a disciplinary. the guys an embarrasment to himself.
@Kerry-f3c I'm curious, are you ok being part of an organization that misleads, isn't completely honest, by its own standard and silences those that are openly honest, as the organization teaches? If there are lies, mistakes Nemo has made, please, point them out. Or just criticize him, without providing fact.
@@zjco9344 My point is that Nemo not only seems OK being part of that organisation but is in tears at the possibility of not being part of it anymore.
@Kerry-f3c Have you taken the time to listen to him explain and understand why he wants to be a part of it?
@@zjco9344 yes
I can see you guys being very sincere and emotional and how this has brought you back to your own excommunication's. I deeply feel for you and hope the newspapers in England pick up on this. Love from ENGLAND 🇬🇧 ❤️
It’s beautiful the exmo community knows how to mourn with those that mourn and lift up the hands that hang down. No need for ministering lists, or compassionate service coordinators. We the people, see a person who needs support and show up in the ways we can, even if it’s just in spirit on a youtube vigil.
Not trashing Sam Young by any means - I'm sure he handled disciplinary counsels as well as they can be handled - but that's kind of what the church specializes in cruelty with a smile. I feel like it's an inherently spiritually and emotionally violent process, especially when one is being thrown out of the church for standing for truth, like they taught us to do.
Been watching you from the beginning Nemo. Thank you for your bravery.
Sorry to hear about this. Best wishes to everyone facing excommunication.
Much love to you, Nemo. Thank you for the impact you've made in my life. Thank you for seeking truth.
Being a Mormon is NOT about being a good person. It’s about believing the RIGHT things. I learned that on my way out and it’s reaffirmed here now.
You have made this a statement about the church. Yet, this is your experience only. Others have very different views. It never ceases to amaze me how people's personal experience, whilst valid, claim to be the only way. Have a broader perspective than just your own.
Omg! Natasha! Yes!! please tell us how to support Nemo the BEST way we can!!!! I dont have much but want to support that sweet CARING AMAZING young man who is only doing what he feels is RIGHT
Nemo is a good person. We are all victims of the Mormon church brainwashing, mind games and control. Nemo stood up to the dishonest leaders and I am appreciative for all his work. Love you Nemo!
❤
❤
Give me a break. He has established himself in some circles as this hero of truth telling. He turns up to his discplinary in his temple white suit. He has constantly called leaders liars, church teachings and history as false and then acts all upset that they are being harsh to him. He needs to give his head a shake.
There is nooooo way my kids are to be alone with ANYONE, I was standing right there for their interviews; people giving me the side eye and I could NOT care less
From Quito Ecuador. Thank you Nemo...your admiren all over the world
Ok I got to the part where NEMO got into the car- and I have to say, aside from a previous comment I made on this video, that it is refreshing to see the support from fellow friends and colleagues of Nemo in the video. I feel like I can maybe sense a little bit from the people in this video who have gone through the excommunication process how much they truly do feel for him, are there for him, and have compassion for him. And I think that is important. Thank you
It is so beautiful to see all the panelists come together and all the supporters. Much love to Nemo.
It's pathetic really though
Nevermo and long-time Mormon Stories listener here. I really hope that Nemo finds peace in separation from the church. I watched the episode on his channel where he said that the fact that the church is built on lies is not a good argument not to try to reform it. I can agree with that as far as things like child welfare go, but I think that fundamentally the LDS church was founded by a power-seeking narcissist, and that it primarily exists to sustain itself, not better its members. So yes, it's important to help people whose lives are impacted by the church, but I don't think the church itself can be redeemed at the end of the day. The church leaders will never be honest because that would mean revealing that the church isn't what it claims to be, and the entire conceit unravels. With lies it began and with lies it will end. I hope that Nemo can see that the wonderful community he knows and the people he loves are that way because of the divine light in them, and that such wonderful things can (and should) continue to exist outside the context of the church.
A nevermo here, but love his channels he has contributed to.
Same….a nevermorman but recovering Baptist and I support Nemo!!!
El valor de Nemo es grande a la vista de Dios.
Gracias Nemo por todo, esto solo es una muestra del valor que tiene como persona.
Fabulous collaboration from hosts, guests and commenters. Although Nemo is likely feeling humiliation, hurt and betrayal from the egregious actions of the mormon church, I believe he will be stronger and find his own spiritual truth. You have tremendous support, Nemo. Thanks to you all.
1:44:45 Bill, sadly you are right. Maybe it's because the history of the church hasn't started with a truth seeker as we were taught, but rather with a power and status seeker. That is the foundation. And so it continues.
This.
I am a NeverMo, but grew up with a lot of Mormon friends, hence my curiosity! I have been down the rabbit hole with a bunch of these folks' videos and podcasts for the past year or so, and Nemo has always been one of my favorites. My heart dropped when I learned he'd been called to a disciplinary council, but I didn't imagine the sorrow I would feel on starting this video. I was in tears at the beginning as well as when Nemo first came out. I have never been a faithful follower of any religion, so the fact that an excommunication could have such an effect surprised me. For a faithful member? Y'all are correct - it is incredibly cruel, and I would say an act of violence.
Sending my best wishes for Nemo, and while I am skeptical, I sincerely hope he gets what he wants!
Great commentary from the Panel I am shook by the actions of the church and how they have gone about this absolutely deplorable
Of course you are seeing this reported by only those against the church, so you would think that.
Excommunication is eternal progression in the right direction.
@mikelray3965.
A🌈 M🌈E🌈N!
I think that it hit BR and Natasha and Nemo hard because at some level they hadn’t fully given up on the church and they expected or hoped for justice. Against all odds they still hoped. I think the emotion is the result of fully realizing the farce. I went through the emotional pain of separation far earlier. When it came time I submitted my resignation because I was deliberately telling them that they have no power or authority over me and I would not pretend any longer that they did.
Thank you to everyone on this panel and, of course, Nemo for giving me a safe place to learn. Learning the truth about the church is painful. You are all a light in a really scary and dark place.
Is this excommunication related to the elder oaks message given recently that bishops need to excommunicate more people?
Writing from Canada - I went through a church tribunal in the 1990's in British Columbia. (I found it tough to belong to an American Church in my own country, due to the arrogance & lack of compassion towards international church members). I had no advocates with me at my excommunication, as that wasn't allowed. There were about 10 men in the room, (many were my friends), which obviously outnumbered me and the leaders were trying to intimidate me throughout this tribunal (apparently, there were only supposed to be 3 men in there - the Bishopric). I was treated disrespectfully, as a woman typically is when they don't 'cave in' to the patriarchy. The pain I felt was immense. Today, I feel it all over again. I only wish I had the talents and courage of people like Nemo, to help me deconstruct back then, because this helps with the healing.
That said, I can relate to the process Nemo is going through. I feel for you, your wife, and your family, Nemo. I am so grateful for your podcasts and the strength they have given me and so many others. I just want to thank you for the bottom of my heart and am sending you all the support and love from across the Pond.
I’m sorry you went through this, especially alone. 🥰 I’m quite emotional reading all the accounts of how the church treats so many. I hope you are able to recover and have a beautiful future 💗
❤❤❤
My heart goes out to you, Nemo! My experience in the church has been different because I was kind of ostracized and judged very harshly because of my severe head injury. despite that, I’m struggling with the idea that I’ve been lied to all my life. My son is a huge support for me and my daughter is also! My ex-wife was always very supportive of me. Anyways, sorry I’m talking about me if I had some money I would send it your way, but I’m overdrawn at the moment. My heart goes out to you and I’m sorry you have to go through this! You and John have helped me so much, thank you
Sorry my punctuation is atrocious. I haven’t taught my iPhone to punctuate properly yet and they have a really hard time going back and reading what I’ve put and understanding it. As my wonderful father-in-law would say.
“ keep on keeping on!”
Why does your heart go out to him? He has effectively bated the church to do this for years now he is crying at their response he was looking for.
Nemo is a whistle-blower. He should be protected and supported.
If I were to be called in, I would not give them the time of day. I’m accountable to God not the church!
It is a fact, LDS people are not entitled to voice up opinions against the "church" - yes is lower case- because they are excommunicated, shame on them!
Nemo is too good for them. They can't have anyone with integrity. They can only allow "yes" men who value obedience above integrity.
Sending much love and respect for Nemo. I am currently technically a completely inactive member, though I consider myself an exmo. My heart breaks for Nemo in this horrific barbaric farce of “discipline.” How disgusting and disheartening that he’s experiencing this, all for seeking and standing up for truth and honesty and integrity.
Chin up, sweet Nemo. You are a good and righteous young man. Sending you warm hugs.
❤speaking truth is now called apostasy...right! Thats gaslighting!!
Nice work everybody! We can hope perhaps Nemo’s stake leadership will see sense, though I doubt it. Whatever the outcome, Nemo can be proud to have had the utmost integrity and to have tried hard to shine a light in the dark dank corners of the church to show the rot for what it is. We’re with you and behind you Nemo, whatever the outcome.
I only saw a few minutes of this and I feel sincerely hurt how he is being treated.
It’s a pity the people banging on people’s doors are trying to kick out someone who wants to remain. I know they recently stopped but I’m old enough to have been bothered.
No reasonable discussion of the case against you without them stating beforehand what you would be charged with.
Sending love and support to Nemo he’s integrity is so valuable to Life 🧡 thank you
As a Never Mormon I spend a lot of time listening to and watching the podcasts. I live in a densely populated LDS community and I choose to learn more about their lives. It makes me sad that my female friends live under the oppression of their faith and likely still believe that Jos Smith was a great man. (NOT). Like those crazy Trump supporters who will not believe he is demented, my friends are equally blind to the lies of the church leaders. I was away from technology today and spent a lot of time thinking about Nemo, his goodness and the power his team of accusers have over him. Blessings on Nemo and his family, he is an amazing man.
I find it even more disturbing that the stake president is making Nemo wait a few days for him to come to a decision. If the president isn’t able to see a clear outcome after all of this then Nemo should not be excommunicated or disfellowshipped. This just shows he has doubts about what to do.
Until he is told by higher up do it now. It's sad but true
Silly comment. According to Nemo they have over a thousand emails to go through and to make a decision on the night would have been ill considered.
@Kerry-f3c other times they make decisions that night. I'm not sure if good or bad. I hope it's good for nemo but honestly I have little faith
@@padfootdoggy "other times" of course because every circumstance is different.
Wow! Look at the support! My heart goes out! Hugs, Nemo! 😔 BTW, seeing our Nemo, he is dressed in WHITE! I'm weeping my heart out! I'm sorry, Nemo, and wish you knew how loved you are! Please, take the time to reflect, and heal, which will take time... Wishing you, PEACE, & MY DEEPEST LOVE! 😢🎻♥️
Thanks for all your courages content Nemo it has helped me tremendously!!!
going to hit 100k by next week
All my appreciation and support to Nemo.
Even Jesus was compelled to speak out against the hypocrisy of the church leaders of his day - and then he was crucified for it.
I am outside the Mormon church myself, but I try to be a friend to ex-Mormons as best I can in my Catholic faith. This may or may not be helpful. From my historical research of the origins of the LDS Church I have reached the conclusion that Mormonism itself is an “apostasy” from 19th century Evangelical Protestantism, particularly in its Puritan form. Mormons today think and speak very similarly to Evangelical Protestants for this reason. The truth is that Mormonism and all its history are part of what I call “Americana.” 😊😊😊
Sending my support to Nemo PERTH Australia 🙌💞
This is a rare "cross over" podcast with almost all of the "celebrity" ex-Mormons with an online presence. Peter Bleakly's tribute to JD is well-deserved. appropriate. Nemo is such a treasure and the LDS is throwing away his genuine love and concern to improve the church.
I wonder if at least one or some of the apostles or other leadership are thinking to themselves the following regarding the current new batch of excommunications, some of which, like Nemo's will be very public because of the speed of the internet: “I fear all we have done is to awaken a sleeping giant and fill him with a terrible resolve.”
Now i like RFM even more for lighting an OLG candle for Nemo. what a sweetie pie.
Great work pulling all Mormon excommunication alumni together👏
Every thought and hug (since he does welcome them)goes out to Nemo and his family.
I don't understand why Nemo would want to stay in the church, but I don't have to in order to support him. They don't know what they just did...
@phillisob. I think they know
EXACTLY "WHAT THEY HAVE DONE."
Just what they hope with all their "hearts" to do: hurt, harm,
humiliate.
Except THEY ARE ultimately DOING IT TO THEMSELVES the worst.
@@sheliabryant3997 Yes, they very may well know. They saw what happened with John and many others; it only intensified their missions and brought attention to them. Hurt, harm, and humiliation are but a few tools they wield in their neverending search for control. I hope Nemo really unleashes now and loses his restraint.
Community is important to many
Watching after work and just sending so much love to Nemo.
Agency, The Church will find every lever to remove it from you. Accept the definitions of truth as we define it or you will suffer. Do we ever find free and open conversation in the Church or is it controlled and constrained to be acceptable to the dogma.
Listening to Nemo's car interview, it makes me feel like "what if children and baptism members were informed of the process of disciplinary councils and what they will face and what sorts of things can trigger them"- that seems like actual informed consent- we are going to tell you what this looks like if you ever choose to leave, and we will tell you because it is a huge sacrifice of time and money and all life decisions made from the perspective of this church- so if you are sincere and loving, and you come to disagreements, this is what is will then look like. Disciplinary councils are SOOOO hidden and secret, I wonder what people would do if they came to light more (as they are in this instance).
Oh…You Beautiful, Beautiful BEings..: I don’t know how to adequately express my Appreciation&Love for Each of You.!
You are the BRave&Courageous, out on the front lines using Your Voices with Love&Compassion to bring the Darkness into the Light ☀️
The World is Seeing how this particular System has become One of the most profound examples of Ultimate Bondage.
A System of Ritualistic Torture, Rape, and Abuse that has Become one of the largest agents for Human Trafficking on this Planet!
Let Us ALL Shine our Sovereign Birthright, Our Love&Compassion on All of these proceedings …
🙏🏽 🙌🏼 🙏🏽
🙏🏽 💜 💟 💜 🙏🏽
🙏🏽 🙌🏼 🙏🏽
With all due respect, this may be for the best. These church hierarchy-whatever they are-are hypocrites.
Love to Nemo🦋
First, I know that surname…. Heath. I think I knew the Heaths when I lived in the UK. ❤ Next, I don’t know why but Nemo’s excommunication is hitting me particularly hard. I was in the Mormon Stories space for Natasha’s as well, which was horrendous. Yet, knowing how the “church” treats women it was almost inevitable, the violence of their actions against her. Unforgiveable, but not unexpected. With Nemo, I’m heartbroken again. Peace and light to everyone xxxx
Heartbreaking and so utterly painful! ❤❤❤ all the love and support to Nemo and his family
Thank you for your integrity Nemo. 🙏🏼
God will bless you for standing up for the TRUTH! Sadly the church will cling to the lies. We love you Nemo!!
Once again the church got it wrong But, it is building such a wonderful group of beautiful people that have grown in knowledge, understanding, and wisdom that are now "Outside the church". The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter Day Saints is built on sand slowing sifting away. Truth is the only answer, and their fight to hide the truth, deny the truth, and failure to redefine their doctrine is destroying them. Very sad and so many people yet to be hurt. Thank you John and entire panel for such wonderful support of Nemo.
Listening to Natasha Helfer, I need to say, I do not personally understand the POV of trying to change the church and looking to make change in the church. I did not agree with certain cultural things for a long time, but when the doctrine became a problem point for me and the foundations of the church and the book of mormon, I just left. I did not want to be treated as an adult getting told off or disciplined like a child for my beliefs. If I no longer believed in their doctrine, I thought it best to leave. I do not understand the mentality of wanting to still identify as mormon when you no longer believe the doctrine. I do understand that not everyone feels this way, I just wanted to express my experience and POV and not sure why people choose to go through this or try to stay when they do not believe in the doctrine. I guess I might get some huge blowback. I guess it makes me wonder if I am alone in this thinking. I am sorry for what Nemo is going through and I think watching Nemo going through this might catch some attention due to how reasonable and logical his approaches have been- it might make some people think twice watching him go through this (or that they might hide more because they DO NOT want to put themself through this). Who knows!
You are not alone in this thinking, plenty feel that way; but wanting to stay and reform your community is also a very real response. I agree that Nemo has always been a very polite and careful critic.
A jury returning too immediately is almost always an appeal Point in Australia.
Exmo, here. Nemo is a light in the dark. It might be flickering a bit right now, but he'll be back and brighter than ever.
I love this community ♥️💯
as a theological history nerd i can’t help but compare this kind of ambush to the spanish inquisition
“requiring delusion” is spot on
Nemo gives credible style, new meaning - and a particularly fine upgrade - to the white-suit haberdashers.
Dearest boy, your gallant heart is broken, and your face has born the weight of sorrow these recent days;
but, Douglas, YOU LOOK
MAHHHVVELLLUSS, DAhhhhllllink! 🌹🌹
[ As do all who have lovingly hosted your vigil.]
Nemo sending you strength from.south australia
I’m a huge supporter of this podcast and a guest who so generously share their experiences. This entire situation has perplexed me though. I just assumed that all of the post Mormon podcast community had already been excommunicated. I’m blown away that he’s so distressed. Why in the world would you want to be officially associated with this organization? why in the world would you be fighting not to be excommunicated - the request for people to send letters protesting this absolutely blew my mind. I would expect this to be a topic of discussion amongst the post Mormon podcast community from a content perspective, but I have to say that seeing the tagline “and online global vigil“ was incredibly offputting. Being removed from an organization that you are so critical of requires an online global vigil? I’m horrified by the Mormon church, but the expectation that you can literally make criticism of the church, your profession and then be upset that they want to officially disassociate themselves from you, seems completely unreasonable. I hate to see his distress, but this whole situation has really Changed my perspective on things.
@@angelaarnett3333 I may not know what is going on in terms of beliefs about the afterlife in the hearts of Nemo and others, but if the church proclaims itself to be the "one true church" with which God is pleased and which leads to salvation, exaltation, eternal families etc, the procedure of excommunication or an excommunication trial is something that may be justified in cases of horrific intentional irreversible crimes, not when the person points out the flaws in the leadership. According to their beliefs that casts the person away from the path to eternal life with eternal families. Besides, right here and now Nemo's family members are in the church - that directly affects them on a very personal level. Yes, he criticizes the organization, but he does it by pointing at obvious discrepancies between what they preach and how they live. So why not to show support for him today whether I agree with his choices or not.
I think you don't understand what such thorough brainwashing is like. There are emotional ties that we can't even perceive, much less untangle. For those who grew up in the church, it has literally formed our identities and how we even process/experience emotions (until I left in my 30's, I used to walk into a room of people and think, I'm Mormon , because that was my identity and I didn't have one outside that.. It was my actual essence as a person). So even if, logically, we are able to break free and see the problems, there are still deep, conditioned, emotional responses. It took me years after leaving the church to not have moments of secret fear that I had got it all wrong, that the church, on some level, WAS true, and I had committed the unpardonable sin and world suffer in eternity. It was totally irrational. There was no part of my rational mind that believed it was even possible for the church to be true after all the evidence, experience, and critical thought I had accumulated. I didn't even believe in God anymore but still the fear and sadness world come.
In addition, the tactics they use during these councils are abusive and shaming, and that would impact anyone. The abuse in the church usually isn't straightforward like it is in more violent religions. It is very layered, psychological, and twisted together with "kindness" and "truth". It gets past your armor and is so hard to come away clean.
Nemo~Jesus Christ was also persecuted for telling people the truth!
Stay close to Him and you will realize how free you are!
Never Mo Catholic here to support Nemo ❤❤
For humans to decide instead of God, seems quite off.
I am a never Mormon who has been following this community for quite a long time. I think all the participants here have traumatic stories, but I feel the same intense sadness for Nemo that I felt during John and Natasha’s proceedings. It’s tragic so unnecessary
If your identity and salvation rests in Christ, it does not matter what the LDS Church does. They are irrelevant.
Amen!
You might believe that as truth but that does not ease the loss of community Nemo is experiencing.
That a beautiful truth-seeker and truth-teller ❤ like Nemo has been forced to undergo such an abominable process is a sad commentary in and of itself on the state of the Mormon church. Nemo - you are loved … even here in Quebec by one who has always questioned and rarely received answers until upstanding members like yourself decided to make things public. Thanks a million for having the courage to do what’s right. 😢
I have been sooooo fearful Nemo may be sooooo broken by this act of HATE, HUMILIATION, CHURCH DESTROYING HIS GOOD NAME, COMMUNITY, AFFECTING HIS LIVING, BEING OSTRACIZED BY PEOPLE CLAIMING THEY ARE DOING AS JESUS TAUGHT THEM!
Nemo…i love you. Jesus loves you. Taking the narrow, straight path is not easy hon. Call upon Jesus. So sorry.
It sounds like the tribunal already knows the outcome. So sad. Maybe being excommunicated from the cult isn't such a bad thing.
Sending love to Nemo and his family.