Genuinely like seeing this kind of content in the dry periods of Destiny. I remember once you went back and looked at your 5 top things you hoped for in the game from pre-launch, think it would be cool to see you take a look at some of your other old videos and do the same.
Dry periods eh? The whole game is basically a dry period. Barely any multiplayer maps and none new seem to ever be released. Running the same campaign missions over and over and over and over and over and killing the same NPCS. I can't take much more than a month of this game before it's installed for a while
tbf if a cheese option is available and faster than the normal method, ofc people are going to use it. and garden just has some pretty underwhelming rewards. only real reason to run it is the bow, maybe the auto rifle, and div then youre done with it
"Crota's End" had the BEST beginning to a Raid 💀. The jumping down into the depths of a hollowed out moon, trying to survive the darkness one lantern at a time always got my heart pumping!!!
HOT TAKE: Raid bosses should never be a bigger version of a regular enemy. No big minotaur, harpy, hydra, oger, captain. They should all have their unique design and i know bungie have the creative talent to do so!
What if they were both? Like the Crown of Sorrows boss. Just another big cabal. But he had cool Hive stuff to go with it. Or Atheon, technically, he is a huge minotaur, but his design is still unique too
I kind of agree I guess, but not completely. Like golgoroth was just a big modified ogre, sanctified mind was just a big modified Minotaur, and crota was just a big modified knight, but I think they all worked fine. On the other hand, consecrated mind or argos weren’t unique looking enough imo to be raid bosses. But yeh, obviously stuff like a robot spider captain, Shaniks, riven, etc are preferable (imo panoptes has the ideal design for a raid boss).
There's two types of people who want all raid exotics to be RNG-only: - The guy who got Vex on his first run while the entire rest of the team held his hand, then never did the raid again. - The guy who got it after 50 runs and wants everyone to suffer as much as he did.
Im convinced there is a built in algorithm that assesses “who was the most ass in this groups raid?” And that determines who gets the exotic- maximize uselessness for highest raid exotic drop rates
I’m like 4 days late but here’s my “hot” take: Raid matchmaking is still a terrible idea, but dungeon matchmaking should be a thing 1-2 months after they launch. LFGs run the dungeons micless 90% of the time anyway.
'if youre going to raid you should clear time in your schedule for it with no bathroom breaks or meals to be taken during it' breaking this in year 1 of d1 created one of my funniest destiny memories where a friend said he was going to shower on Atheon - we continued doing 5 man attempts and he returned as we cleared it, and the game gave him Gjallarhorn for being AFK and he told us all about how he walked into the room with a towel and immediately saw ghorn drop
I used to not mind people doing this. And I still don't.. As long as that person is clearly 21+ Anyone else takes extra time, then come back saying they have chores. That pisses me off.
Not even kidding bro, but that is how I got my ghorn to drop from Crota’s End. It was everybody’s first clear pretty much so we were taking a long time to do everything, and I had to help my grandma with something that took about 20 minutes after a failed crota attempt. I run back into the room to see them killing Crota through the windows and I get ghorn to drop. I was so happy but felt so guilty lol
Raid exotics being rng isn't the problem. The problem is having a weekly cap of only 3 attempts per week. You should get a chance to get the exotic on every single clear.
Master difficulty raids should be contest mode instead of incredibly high light requirement. that way they dont get easier for high light sweats who justified the light requirement by “we need a challenging activity” and players dont have to grind endless bounty xp to even have a chance
Blessed take, don't think this is a hot one. The ridiculous light req ensures that I will never do a Master raid. I'll raise it to any light level requirements beyond the initial release week rush should be removed. Use modifiers that put players X power below enemies like Contest, but making players grind power past the normal cap is an artificial gate. You can be a great player who doesn't have or care to spend the time grinding XP all season. The leveling system itself can all get thrown out, to hell with it.
true, I hate the idea that if I no lifed bounty farm simulator I would be able to do the raid easier, as no activity in the entire game gives the xp a bounty gives, which is absurd. Master shouldn’t be 1:1 difficulty at 1360 power, that’s just stupid imo
@@NobleVI_343 yup, id say im one of the best raiders in my clan (top 3 and im not 3) but i get bored to death after just 10 mins of bounty grinding so im the only one in the clan that cant do master due to being too low light 😂 some bs
@@blueknightcraze6766 I mean, if you can get 1350/ 1355, you’re good, as long as you’re seasoned and can avoid being one-shot by literally everything, you can succeed at it as long as they have levels. You don’t need to be 1360, it just turn Master into ez mode
@@headglitch7003 it's good until the final boss- then it's just a shitshow. Also the drops are absolutely terrible from it- for pve and pvp (especially compared to DSC or Vault)
@Avaint TF yeah they are fine but can get same quality from anywhere really- Crypt you've got the reconstruction/recombination weps which are just nuts for pve and heritage is fantastic for pvp. Vault you have the timelost weapons but even still fatebringer is top tier for pve and pvp, vision is great, shotgun is great etc etc. Garden has no meta defining weapons, just a few average ones that are honestly outclassed by pretty much anything else. Why use reckless Oracle when chroma rush is just better, why use ancient gospel when eyasluna/palindrome/fatebringer are so so much better. Same thing with Last Wish unfortunately- amazing raid but the weapons have just been power crept basically.
I think that part of what makes people like Deep Stone Lullaby so much is that it comes after what was initially the most stressful encounter in the raid.
Here's a take, not sure of its temperature tho - from a non-raider: I think Bungie should make further efforts to utilise raid spaces for other activities and quests/quest steps - similar to the underbelly of the Leviathan and its interaction with the Izanagi quest - that aren't necessarily directly related to the raid, raid exotic or raid exotic catalyst itself.
I want to see more in between sections in raids with hidden optional bosses and complex puzzle based mechanics. There's something to be said about using your brain to solve a puzzle instead of relying on your teams ability to spray a hailstorm of bullets and nova bombs at a big target.
I’d love to see more RNG and randomness in raid and dungeon encounters, like dungeons will have multiple bosses but you wouldn’t get them all each time
I think 72 hour contest mode would be perfectly balanced keep the 24 hour day 1 rewards a thing but let contest mode last the entire weekend of release for a raid so more people can experience the day 1 raid
@@EwwwApex The emblem isnt what matters. I know hundreds of people who play purely for the contest experience. A lot of times my fireteam couldnt complete day 1 raids but that didnt matter we did it for fun.
As someone who did 83 runs of DSC before getting eyes, opened almost 120 chests on riven, and 50 runs of scourge for anarchy there has to be a pity counter for raid exotics…
Crown of Sorrow wasn't the best raid (especially the first encounter, it was too long with the same mechanic cycled 4 times), BUT the boss encounter was one of the best boss fights where mechanics and dps were equally important and satisfying to do. Same goes for SoS, the final encounter was buggy af but the balance between mechanics and dps was really fun and satisfying.
i really liked crown, the final fight was fun. Didnt like Spire, only did it once and hated it. that could have been because i had a crap raid team that day though
Yeah, I think Ghalran is probably the best raid boss fight in all of destiny's history. It's SO well designed. BUT, CoS suffers from a few issues that doesn't make it onto the "best raids" list. Namely, encounter 1 plus the raid loot in the dungeon. Oddly enough, CoS is like an inverse GoS. Garden has pretty solid loot and most of the raid is pretty good, but the boss SUCKS. While, conversely, the encounters prior to the final boss aren't great and the loot blows. BUT, the final boss is so much fun that it carries the rest of the raid. If I could replay CoS even while getting sunset loot, I would just to fight that boss again.
Crown of Sorrow's later encounters are either wonderful, or just the worst, no in between. They are so mechanic-heavy that a team who doesn't have great synergy will suffer through a miserable slog, while well-synced players and players experienced in the raid will have a lot of fun juggling the combat and encounter mechanics. Extremely fun, but everyone has to know what they are doing pretty well for it to be fun.
@@colepowers8345 Yup, you either finish the encounter in 10 minutes or 2 hours, that's why it's satisfying with a good team and horrible with 5 good players 1 bad player, most encounters nowaday can be carried with 1 bad player BUT Val Ca’our and Gahlran... They are nearly impossible, especially Val Ca’our, Having Superior Retainer on the wrong player was a immediate wipe.
The reason that I disliked Spire of Stars until the end was the bugs and issues with hitboxes there were, like the ship ball throwing was really tough to hit viably
That was not an issue, the balls had so much aim assist on them. It's the same with people getting "glitched" over the barrier at calus, sure it happens rarely, but nowhere near as much as people say it did. I can't say I ever missed a ship that I didn't deserve to miss.
"If you are to raid, you should clear time in your schedule to do it, No bathroom breaks or long meals." I was doing a DSC run where when we got to Taniks abomination, my friend said he was going to make a sandwich. 4 hours later, the only thing he did was make that sandwich and eat it, he finally gets back, god knows how any of us stayed or didn't find another. We now joke about long metrics of time where people need breaks as "Sandwich Metrics" being 4 hours.
I once had a friend go and sell a used car mid game. I also had another take me quite literally when I told him to change the batteries in his smoke detector, leaving mid encounter to do it.
I have a friend who used to make sandwiches between matches. "Where's so and so?" "They're making a Joe's Sandwich." "Oh, just start up the game then. Kick him from the squad."
I've got a friend who will say he's gotta go to the bathroom, and he's gone for a completely random amount of time it seems. Sometimes he'll be back in a few minutes, sometimes we won't hear from him for the rest of the night. Sometimes he'll come back like an hour or two later and say "I was taking a shit." If it takes you an hour, you really ought to go see a doctor.
Running a raid on all 3 characters with the same gang each week for pinnacles makes for some really fun callouts that develop. Personal fave has been Atheon Oracles becoming Ass n Tiddies, where the oracles behind Atheon are Left Cheek, Crack, Right Cheek, and the oracles in front being Left Tiddy, Cleavage, Right Tiddy. It made for some major confusion whenever we had like 1 person of the regular group drop out and some rando would join but we refused to do other callouts.
In vault (LW) we would make the callouts as random as possible but still try to figure out the symbols. 69 fish, triple boob snake, fish high af (swimming through seaweed), *screeching eagle sounds*, n fish, sleepy 8 snake to name a few. For the third encounter on DSC we would use states in the US as callouts for scanner.
@@Treble_V2 I've never understood "n fish". "Circle fish" makes a lot more sense, especially since nearly everyone already knows two fish in a circle is the 69 fish. Legitimately, I've heard someone call circle fish "upside down u fish".
only time i ever cried playing Destiny 2 Well, after my team managed to beat Taniks after a 16 hour play session, i cried a fair amount after that too but for different reasons because my team was at each other's throat at that point
best oracle callouts for Atheon are just front/back left/mid/right -You only need to include front/back if another oracle appears in the same section, which immediately tells the shooters where the last oracle will be with only two callouts, i.e. -"Mid, left" -> no duplicate oracles, last one is on right side -"Back mid, left" -> last oracle is front mid, because otherwise you wouldn't specify "back mid" if it was the only one -the only slight problem is if you get back/front of something as the first two, but that's not really much an issue ever (I just know someone would bring that up if I didn't mention it -I have done Atheon plenty of times, and this is generally the preferred method for LFGs (on xbox, at least)
@@fubsthefish8320 problem with numbers is that u need to specify what kind of numbers ur doing (which is 1 and which is 6 etc), while directions are always the same every time and dont need clarifying. Its incredibly easy to introduce people to VoG or co-ordinate with LFGs using directions as all you need to say is "we're doing directions" and not "we're doing numbers like a clock" and then have ti explain to someone unaware of what "like a clock" means relative to the oracles
THANK YOU for mentioning that with clock, the oracle tones ascend with the numbers. I feel like not many people realize that, and it’s genuinely helpful. If you miss a callout but know that it was a very low tone, you know to look towards 1 or 2 and so on.
Datto’s gotta be one of my favorite RUclipsrs just because he has these long ass videos and I love them. I still put on old D1 guides in the background because he’s genuinely fun to listen to
Raid loot should feel like some of the strongest in the game, the weapons should have more unique or even intrinsic perks that can only come on those raid weapons, currently raid loot feels like everything else in the game with nothing special differentiating it, although deep stone crypt did have some interesting unique perks which was good.
Ye the only reason to chase raid loot imo is if it has beastly perks. DSC had the right idea with weapons having perks you can't get anywhere else in the game
either unique perks or overall higher stat totals. Eyasluna vs timelost fatebringer or adept pally is a bit too close, but a total just right under gm gear or flawless would feel nice. why would i ever want a Trustee except for reconstruction over a contingency plan
I had 81 clears of dsc before I got eyes, but I still support the raid exotics being rng. It really adds a sense of determination to go in every week and that true feeling of relief once you finally get it
Don't know how hot of a take this is, but I'm definitely growing increasingly sick of RNG for gear in video games just generally. Fully agree with Datto that with enough clears you should just get the raid exotic
I think what would be cool is if you could spend spoils at the chest to grab the exotic. Maybe half the required from the kiosk. So 120 spoils to buy the exotic outright
@@adambeck427 if that were the case, I think it'd make sense to have it just be an auto drop. Because otherwise you could just use spoils you already had from other raids to get it and I think that goes against the whole "mastery of the raid" feeling. I was about to suggest "raid specific spoils" to buy the exotic, but we have enough different currencies, so just making it a guaranteed drop after x amount of runs would make more sense.
Just took a group of my friends through last wish and I was the only one that had any experience and even with fusions being broken it was incredibly fun taking them through. Was also super proud of them because we made it through vault in 3 tries. Truly a highlight of my reading career
@@Hackcam eh, sanctified it's just mote team 1, mote team 2 and tether team, then during DPS it's 3 people tether and 3 people fuck off to the other side but I can see what you mean by adaptating, like one more missing so you reopen portal, etc. But then again there really isn't mechanics to remember, just opening portals and banking motes while tether team creates platforms and tether the boss during dps
Clock lets you get to damage phase faster instead of standing in the back. But if you don't know the clock method its better to just do it the easy way from the back of the room with left middle right. Its less optimal and more tedious. But requires less setup and explanation than clock method
Hot Take: The current boss encounter paradigm is boring and needs to go. Mechanics to break shield and then standing still DPS is so boring. Riven is one of my favorite bosses because of how she gives you the opportunity to do DPS whenever, but still, there is a large element of separation between mechanics and damage phases. I want a world without phases to our boss fights. Imagine a raid boss where 2 people get to do DPS as any given time, while the other 4 do mechanics to get themselves ready for DPS, and then they switch and 2 of those people have to go and do DPS, all the while the boss is very mobile.
I've both solo flawlessed dungeons, and done low man raids. Of the two I believe that doing dsc and last wish 3-man was infinitely more fun than losing my solo flawless to the sparrow race in grasp or the falling section after chamber of suffering.
The riven, queenswalk, and wishwall system was the perfect system for farming a raid exotic and should be copied for future raids ( except for the riven cheeses and queenswalk bugs)
I would love to see more excerpts from Twitch vods since I can’t usually catch the stream but rly enjoy Datto talking about Destiny. Ty for the content!
I totally agree last wish is one of the beest raids. It challenges your abilities to coordinate as a team, it has excellent lore to it, the overall design of the raid just surpasses all the others, and its one of the most challenging raids.
"Protective Light needs a huge nerf or removal otherwise day 1 numbers will never be even remotely close to garden or crown levels again." Other than most charged with light build being nerfed due to MW weapons no longer generating orbs, (IK stream was live before the latest Twab) meaning it is somewhat getting a nerf, you cannot delegate day one raid clears to a single mod.
People say that Well of Radiance makes the raid too easy but god forbid if you want to switch to something else. Twitter is full of clowns as always. I bet they are the same people that say they never die and the WellLock behind them who is healing them on cooldown is akwardly smiling and agreeing to their 0Head takes while cursing them
We should do some just general Destiny 2 hot takes. I’ll start: the game needs more open world exotic weapons per season and not have every new exotic tied to either a raid, dungeon, quest, or special mission and they shouldn’t be revealed in the roadmap so they remain secret until discovered.
I think this is a hot take but I want to see more ad clear type encounters like shiro chi and queens walk. Some of the most intense games I’ve played in destiny has been those two encounters with everyone popping ad clear supers being forced to always be on their toes moving, it makes the anxiety high if there’s a timer I also just think it’s exciting to slay out.
I just want ad clear to be more of a thing in Destiny in general. Much of the content in the game has too few enemies given how powerful the players are. I'd love more raids encounters where ad clear was something you actually had to work at like Shuro Chi, Riven etc, instead of being a potato job you do when you don't know the raid mechanics.
Only problem is then people bitch about a slow fight so it's either a fight you can just dps quick with potential 1 phase or another way that will take longer.
Loved this video because 1) we get 40 minutes of Datto honestly speaking about what the community thinks about the game and 2) you also added chat on the side. I personally find it more stream videos more engaging like that.
Crown of Sorrow is one of my favorite Raid Lairs, IMO it would be best raid for me if it wasn't for the first encounter that needs to do way more than introduce you to the crystal / blessing mechanic
Spire of Stars was probably my most hated raid simply because of how buggy it was on prestige mode. Could have been that our group was just unlucky but the majority of our resets were because the bomb didn't connect to the ship or it wouldn't arm at all. It was a cool encounter when it worked.
I love DSC but I haven’t played anything before d1 so I’m probably missing out…but out of the ones I’ve played I love DSC and it will forever be my favorite raid
@@inventor4279 not even joking, the bar is literally just LW (which is pretty fucking good), GoS (which is pretty fucking bad), VoG (n o s t a l g i a), and DSC (which was actually really good). 3/4, it's bar is average
So, I was always worried that Riven Cheese would be patched, but after doing the normal method, it was honestly really fun, much more fun than the cheese, so I gotta agree with most the “riven patch,” takes.
My raid team does atheon oracles (front: left right middle) (back: left right middle) and we only call out the first 2 Oracles, so if its front right back right back left we'd call out right and back right
For oracles I stand by this as the superior strat: BACK LEFT/BACK MID/BACK RIGHT FRONT LEFT/FRONT MID/FRONT RIGHT I did VoG with my clan, three of which were 20 under at that point because they were new lights who joined because of crossplay and they had absolutely no problems with oracles whatsoever.
Man, hearing the positive reception towards crown really gets me going ngl. I do have some bias because Shadow was my first raid title and I tried my hand at sherpa'ing it.
Vault of Glass is the best "New Light's First Raid". Its shorter than most of the raids in the game, and mechanics that have a learning curve but are not impossible to learn. For example, the Oracle encounter, it will be a challenge starting out. But once you learn where each oracle spawns or you get a view to help keep track of multiple it makes the encounter easier.
Hot take at 11:11: As a Warframe player I can tell you: RNG is never fun. We have so much stuff that only drops occasionally and most of our community is annoyed by now that there is no challenging content with pretty much guaranteed good rewards. I played through a few contents about 60-70 times until I got what I wanted and I can tell you, its more frustrating than replaying the same Raid phase a few times more (btw I know that for sure, I played all Raids in D1 and the Raids are one of the reasons I sometimes think about coming back...)
@@J-manli I think the best system is a combination of RNG with protection and skilled-based objective. If you complete a flawless or a master raid, then you get the exotic out right, or you can try your RNG if you arent good enough (with protection ofc, pure RNG with no protection has no place)
My personal opinion, kings fall was one of the most eerie yet enjoyable raids I’ve ever played. Taken king expansion I feel is unbeatable in the way it directed the game
As a PS4 player I used PAC. It helped with teaching people the encounter by using the square/triangle/circle button layout as a physical "map" for which rift/well/bubble to go with the corresponding buff.
Good take: Leviathan being open world like and non linear was awesome for sense of scale and world building. It was cool too trying to solo the keys or mixing them into the run. It added an awesome skill gap that didn’t make it bad for new players but just benefitted people with lots of clears of that just took time to explore. I liked learning the area myself lost and alone soloing the keys way back when. I wish they could work this aspect into more experiences and actually make the world feel full. Not just like walls with doors painted on but real, explorable, secret riddled, areas. The leviathan raid felt much more like that to me that most if not all other locations (and it still wasn’t perfect)
11:10 I'd be ok with this if all the RNG raid exotics were also tied to triumphs. That way you get the excitement of a possible lucky drop as well as a sense of progress towards an inevevitable goal. maybe have a special shader for the gun on completion of the triumph too or something.
Vault in Last Wish has a similar issue that’s only gotten worse with time. When it first came out, the knights were an insane threat so people on add clear had a somewhat engaging job. Now it’s basically a 3 person encounter with the 3 other people just standing there. For what’s it worth I really enjoyed Dogs but that’s probably because I would lead the others.
I love Crown. At least the last two encounters. Boss fight has a lot going on and no one can really sit back and do nothing. That said, I can recognize its short comings and know it is not the best raid.
I really like quest exotics in raids. I think the div puzzle was fun, but i can see why it was frustrating for some. I think the way Vex was handled is perfect. It provides the best of both worlds, random drop with exotic, but quest for catalyst. It just adds another layer of depth to the raid. makes it stand out more, and becomes a lot more memorable
Hot take: GOS is the best raid. It was difficult and punishing but not overwhelmingly so. The mechanics were great and the raid encouraged heavy communication. The motes mechanic were only frowned on because of gambit and the teather mechanic was only flawed when the fireteams set up incorrectly.
I do agree with this. If your team wasn't tone deaf and would place themselves where they were supposed to instead of getting in each other's way. It was very simple and can be a clean run with no issues
To add onto the raid exotic RNG argument I agree with you BUT if you want them to be purely RNG they need to be worth it. imagine doing 100 raids for terrabah only to find out it was a worse recluse.
I think you’re really underrating Crown of Sorrow, though because of your experience I can understand why. The two phases in the boss room are great. I will admit that the entry encounter is boring and the jumping puzzle is just kinda meh, though.
I kind of liked that the jumping puzzle was more than just jumping. Sure it drags on a bit (especially considering the previous encounter), but I still enjoyed it. Then again, I'm someone who doesn't mind Crown first encounter and Garden 2nd encounter.
@@rockies613 It actually could - the speed at which you cleared the waves determined how quickly the next waves would spawn. Most people either never learned this, or never wanted to accept that the only thing stopping it from going faster was... them
Facts. The final boss is one of the best encounters in the game. The only reason some don’t like it is because it’s hectic. Also because you have to be in sync with your partner.
assuming you weren't over levelled for it, the ENTIRE leviathan raid required 'perfect execution' on every single fight otherwise you wiped, there was quite literally no wiggle room for mistakes to be made and still come away successful.
How to make oryx fight better assuming it returns in D2: Make the corrupted lights stun him and then damage can be dealt. More lights = more time oryx is stunned.
My hottest take is that Shuro Chi is the best Raid encounter in Destiny history. Personally, movement (ie not standing still on plates) and callouts where everyone is involved and when things go wrong you have to improv, are my favorite two aspects in any Destiny raid encounter. It’s why the Death Zamboni, Aksis Phase 2, and Queenswalk are my other favorite encounters as well.
I am not really a speedrunner XD, I just started doing some of them ~3 months ago, so I am not considering that aspect at all. That said: obviously if we factor in the length of the raid, you would not be able to answer anything that’s not Last Wish, so I’m trying to see the bigger picture. If I have to speak from a “fun” perspective, Spire was by far the best raid to play 6 man, especially year 1. On the other hand, Crown had pacing issues on first encounter but 2-3 man Crown are some of the most enjoyable activities I’ve ever done in this game, since it was challenging enough and barely glitchy.
Here's a take: the mechanic in D2 where someone being dead for too long wipes everyone hurts the experience of clutching an encounter and generally discourages desperately trying to salvage an attempt gone bad. It's bad for making the kind of moments that people remember raiding for.
Correct Atheon oracle callout = callout first 2 oracles. If there's 2 on the same side, specify front or back. i.e. if the 3 oracles are left, right, middle you callout left and right. If the oracles are front left, middle, back left, you callout front left and middle.
I disagree and agree with patching the riven cheese yes the encounter is amazing and built beautifully but after your 50th time doing it the cheese is there to speed things up per say
The fact that 90% of the community has never experienced Riven properly is a tragedy. The fact that they never patched it so you couldn’t just bake the boss is criminal. I can’t imagine being one of the members of the team who designed that amazing fight only to have almost no one experience it properly.
I don’t know wtf kind of callouts other people use, but imo the best strat is to use close and far with either left, middle, or right, while only calling the first two
Crown of Sorrow genuinely is a top tier raid, but brought down by the first encounter being an absolute slog. If that had a faster pace or less phases, easily would be one of the best rivaling WotM/DSC/LW.
@@inventor4279 I mean it’s a shorter raid sure, but the last 2 encounters are some of the best in the game. The 2nd encounter is a perfect introduction to the mechanics in the final encounter, preparing you for the balancing act. It may not be as good as the last encounter, but the second encounter works great in the grand scheme of the raid itself.
I've always thought raid exotics should have a low drop rate, but every time you complete a raid, you get a, we'll call it a Raid Token. Each week you get up to 3 Tokens per account, and can spend those Raid Tokens on the raid exotic specific to those Tokens. If you get the exotic drop before you build up enough tokens, well, you got the exotic. If you dont, you buy it with the Tokens you've been building up
My hot take comes from personal experience and the enjoyment that I had. Crotas end was my favorite raid. I had a playgroup that I loved to play with. We would play every night for 5 or 6 hours. We lost our first member to college and not being able to play really at all anymore with taken king. The other one stuck around until around the time of curse of Osiris. We would run Crota and vault to help other people finish after we finished nightfalls and any other top level content for the week. I wish I could go back to those times. It was the most enjoyable for me
The FPS dropping to -2 during the zamboni encounter wasn’t super great. The aesthetic was awesome though and the boss encounter was a lot of fun. Last Wish just had an extra encounter, well done encounter, the best boss fight imo. LW is still king.
Omega hot take: The final encounter of Crown is better than every encounter of Wrath. People just like wrath because the weapons were good. A lot of encounters were a slog.
Crown was my favorite raid. I did it three times and each time I had a absolutely fantastic time. Getting tarrabah on the second completion felt so good
"Shadow" was the first raid title I went for. And it was the most fun, as the raid challenges were actually well constructed and required us to actually adapt our playstyle. Was also really fun to run Flawless as it contained very little uncontrollable bullshit, like certain other raids (Leviathan Psion grenades, Garden of Salvation Supplicants) Also did Rivensbane and Enlighted. Cannot say the same about all the challenges there. Especially having to not be hit by Shurochi in Last Wish, and having to kill a lot of Vex with The Sanctified mind platform destruction in Garden of Salvation.
Ultimate take - Oracle position callouts The virgin front LMR/ back LMR The chad numerical positions Don't take this too seriously, whatever works works. Use whatever is best for you and your team, even if your callouts are worse :)
Imo the problem with LMR callous is that in order to make sense of them you need to make sure your all standing in the same spot as the callouts person. Which is usually in the front of the damn room. It takes at minimum 7 seconds to leave the portal from oracle side to get to wherever you are doing damage. Whereas numbers you can stand wherever you want. Even right by the exit portal.
I remember so many teams switched up the callouts from Deathsingers to Oryx, where the front is closest to the entrance on Deathsingers, and swapped for Oryx. The reasoning was mostly that we’d be in front of Oryx, and so people knew to come to that side when doing the final damage, as well as where the big blubble people got teleported into was. (Didn’t make sense to say ‘in the back, in front of Oryx). Keep Deathsingers’ front towards the entrance only because that’s the first side you see when you enter the room. It’s ‘in front’ of you. I did a lot of Sherpa-ing during D1 and this system was the easiest for new players and for experienced players to adjust to.
My hot take: Taniks ruins Deep Stone Crypt. He doesn't make any sense either as an ally of Eramis or just... as someone it'd be a priority to resurrect, he isn't even ACTUALLY turned into an Exo, it's literally just "He's alive again somehow." And the Shank-legs, while funny, is just kinda incomprehensible because large Shanks didn't feature anywhere else in the raid, so where the hell did it come from? If I could wave a magic wand and just... replace Taniks with more Atrax. For the initial reveal after security, just have Atrax helping another Atrax out of a pod, then both look at you and flee. For the nukes encounter, just have Atrax in the center of the room (and have some god damned heavy shanks instead of just piles of captains as your only majors), and then the final boss with be Atrax with a big shank booty. Have the raid literally just be chasing her up and down the length of the Crypt. I don't care if people say it's too samey, you know what's samey? KILLING TANIKS AGAIN.
Oryx is in the back of the room because where he appears in the raid is akin to the place a throne would be, which is the back of the room. On top of that, the room where we fight him is closed off by space. Besides, his position would absolutely be based on our perspective, and given we entered from the opposite side of where he appears, he’d be in the back
Raid exotics should be RNG until you complete every other triumph in the raid seal except the badge, at which point it is a 100% drop from your next clear. That would be the best way imo - clear path to getting it but always a chance to get lucky and be able to play with it early.
Genuinely like seeing this kind of content in the dry periods of Destiny. I remember once you went back and looked at your 5 top things you hoped for in the game from pre-launch, think it would be cool to see you take a look at some of your other old videos and do the same.
what video is that
@@cmemo6508 ruclips.net/video/j2ej0FwobsA/видео.html
@@matthodges7225 thank u
Dry periods eh? The whole game is basically a dry period. Barely any multiplayer maps and none new seem to ever be released. Running the same campaign missions over and over and over and over and over and killing the same NPCS. I can't take much more than a month of this game before it's installed for a while
@@OneHunnitNoCapStannitOnBidnisz L + ratio + Literally no one asked + ligma + wocky slush + bruh + amogus
“Raid bosses need to be more complex” they say as they cheese riven and avoid garden like the plague
tbf if a cheese option is available and faster than the normal method, ofc people are going to use it. and garden just has some pretty underwhelming rewards. only real reason to run it is the bow, maybe the auto rifle, and div then youre done with it
raid bosses dont need to be more complex, weve gone way past the point where they are fun to play and are just annoying
@@guppysam garden has some of the best guns in the game?? The pulse, bow, auto, fusion, and even hand cannon are all really good
@@TheRealHippo- theyre good but replaceable by other things that are much easier to farm
d1 raids are 10x better then d2 ones
"Crota's End" had the BEST beginning to a Raid 💀. The jumping down into the depths of a hollowed out moon, trying to survive the darkness one lantern at a time always got my heart pumping!!!
Yeah but you can kill your friends in deep stone crypt with your sparrow
Last Wish- Kings fall- Crota top 3 in my book. Only reason I put crota top 3 cause the gear and Gally was dropping from it.
best part of soloing crota on d1 weekly outside of when it's the featured raid for ir yut elemental primaries
And the sense of dread fully supports the lore of what the original Corta fireteam went through. Big agree on this one.
I can only imagine how fast we will get through that part these days with all the crazy movement we can do. Especially with Eager Edge now too.
HOT TAKE: Raid bosses should never be a bigger version of a regular enemy. No big minotaur, harpy, hydra, oger, captain. They should all have their unique design and i know bungie have the creative talent to do so!
I agree most,y but I think that heavily modified versions of booger enemies are cool. Like the sanctified mind looks way cooler than atheon
Yes, BUT...it can work with the correct context. EOW is the first example that comes to mind. Maybe the only one, that actually works.
Yes but according to Bungie content is hard.
What if they were both? Like the Crown of Sorrows boss. Just another big cabal. But he had cool Hive stuff to go with it. Or Atheon, technically, he is a huge minotaur, but his design is still unique too
I kind of agree I guess, but not completely. Like golgoroth was just a big modified ogre, sanctified mind was just a big modified Minotaur, and crota was just a big modified knight, but I think they all worked fine. On the other hand, consecrated mind or argos weren’t unique looking enough imo to be raid bosses. But yeh, obviously stuff like a robot spider captain, Shaniks, riven, etc are preferable (imo panoptes has the ideal design for a raid boss).
There's two types of people who want all raid exotics to be RNG-only:
- The guy who got Vex on his first run while the entire rest of the team held his hand, then never did the raid again.
- The guy who got it after 50 runs and wants everyone to suffer as much as he did.
I'm on run 22, I'm with the suffering and hatred part, still haven't gotten it and I got a friend who got it 1st run and 5th run
I mean I got eyes before the sniper of that raid
@@okipullup5792 I feel you. Didn't get both eyes and vex until after run 40 for their respective raids.
Im convinced there is a built in algorithm that assesses “who was the most ass in this groups raid?” And that determines who gets the exotic- maximize uselessness for highest raid exotic drop rates
I did 42 runs of VOG before I got vex. I’m sick of the extreme RNG.
I’m like 4 days late but here’s my “hot” take:
Raid matchmaking is still a terrible idea, but dungeon matchmaking should be a thing 1-2 months after they launch. LFGs run the dungeons micless 90% of the time anyway.
That’s a good point, you can even solo all dungeons, so I’m definitely down for matchmaking
Having done solo grasp. I am definitely appreciative of playing it with other people.
'if youre going to raid you should clear time in your schedule for it with no bathroom breaks or meals to be taken during it'
breaking this in year 1 of d1 created one of my funniest destiny memories where a friend said he was going to shower on Atheon - we continued doing 5 man attempts and he returned as we cleared it, and the game gave him Gjallarhorn for being AFK and he told us all about how he walked into the room with a towel and immediately saw ghorn drop
I used to not mind people doing this. And I still don't.. As long as that person is clearly 21+
Anyone else takes extra time, then come back saying they have chores. That pisses me off.
@@GuzzlingDuck u our a 🤡 adults have chores the same as under 21 year olds
@@OneHunnitNoCapStannitOnBidnisz but we aren't told to do them, we do them at a more convenient time. Kids get told they have to do them now
Not even kidding bro, but that is how I got my ghorn to drop from Crota’s End. It was everybody’s first clear pretty much so we were taking a long time to do everything, and I had to help my grandma with something that took about 20 minutes after a failed crota attempt. I run back into the room to see them killing Crota through the windows and I get ghorn to drop. I was so happy but felt so guilty lol
@@b-mo272 I agree with you. One time I went afk during trials because my mom was mad at me about something, and my team mates were not happy lol.
Raid exotics being rng isn't the problem. The problem is having a weekly cap of only 3 attempts per week. You should get a chance to get the exotic on every single clear.
Actually agree. I hate how the ring is rn.
120 runs of last wish and I still havent gotten 1k voices
@@MichaelJohnson-uo3ef 1 run per 1 voice
@@MichaelJohnson-uo3ef got it first try and started at riven. Delayed my team 2hrs cause I had no dps weapons as well
I agree with this cause I’m currently tryna get collective obligation and I’ve been trying for weeks now
Master difficulty raids should be contest mode instead of incredibly high light requirement. that way they dont get easier for high light sweats who justified the light requirement by
“we need a challenging activity”
and players dont have to grind endless bounty xp to even have a chance
Blessed take, don't think this is a hot one. The ridiculous light req ensures that I will never do a Master raid.
I'll raise it to any light level requirements beyond the initial release week rush should be removed. Use modifiers that put players X power below enemies like Contest, but making players grind power past the normal cap is an artificial gate. You can be a great player who doesn't have or care to spend the time grinding XP all season. The leveling system itself can all get thrown out, to hell with it.
true, I hate the idea that if I no lifed bounty farm simulator I would be able to do the raid easier, as no activity in the entire game gives the xp a bounty gives, which is absurd. Master shouldn’t be 1:1 difficulty at 1360 power, that’s just stupid imo
Lol 😆 🤣 😂
@@NobleVI_343 yup, id say im one of the best raiders in my clan (top 3 and im not 3) but i get bored to death after just 10 mins of bounty grinding so im the only one in the clan that cant do master due to being too low light 😂 some bs
@@blueknightcraze6766 I mean, if you can get 1350/ 1355, you’re good, as long as you’re seasoned and can avoid being one-shot by literally everything, you can succeed at it as long as they have levels. You don’t need to be 1360, it just turn Master into ez mode
“Garden of Divinity” he’s not wrong though, touched that raid once for the exotic and never again
Ah c'mon it's not that bad. Try it without being dragged down by people who have done 2 raids in their life.
@@headglitch7003 it's good until the final boss- then it's just a shitshow. Also the drops are absolutely terrible from it- for pve and pvp (especially compared to DSC or Vault)
@Avaint TF yeah they are fine but can get same quality from anywhere really- Crypt you've got the reconstruction/recombination weps which are just nuts for pve and heritage is fantastic for pvp. Vault you have the timelost weapons but even still fatebringer is top tier for pve and pvp, vision is great, shotgun is great etc etc. Garden has no meta defining weapons, just a few average ones that are honestly outclassed by pretty much anything else.
Why use reckless Oracle when chroma rush is just better, why use ancient gospel when eyasluna/palindrome/fatebringer are so so much better.
Same thing with Last Wish unfortunately- amazing raid but the weapons have just been power crept basically.
@@seahawk1579 The final boss is fine. The community is just terrified of mechanically heavy fights.
@@seahawk1579 garden boss ez
I think that part of what makes people like Deep Stone Lullaby so much is that it comes after what was initially the most stressful encounter in the raid.
Here's a take, not sure of its temperature tho - from a non-raider: I think Bungie should make further efforts to utilise raid spaces for other activities and quests/quest steps - similar to the underbelly of the Leviathan and its interaction with the Izanagi quest - that aren't necessarily directly related to the raid, raid exotic or raid exotic catalyst itself.
This comment aged well
Aged well but I think they could have done more than just repurposing the space. They could use it and have changes happen inside the area
@@Spartan-sz7km isn't that exactly what they did tho?
@@addder7385 I was talking about the preservation mission, not season of the haunted
@@Spartan-sz7km it's aged even better now, haha
I want to see more in between sections in raids with hidden optional bosses and complex puzzle based mechanics. There's something to be said about using your brain to solve a puzzle instead of relying on your teams ability to spray a hailstorm of bullets and nova bombs at a big target.
Last wish set pice boss fight
I’d love to see more RNG and randomness in raid and dungeon encounters, like dungeons will have multiple bosses but you wouldn’t get them all each time
@@Rnjesus386 Id love to see a raid that just destroys all pcs and consoles that try to do it when the team wipes
I think 72 hour contest mode would be perfectly balanced keep the 24 hour day 1 rewards a thing but let contest mode last the entire weekend of release for a raid so more people can experience the day 1 raid
48 hour
But- but then it's not a day one clear. Sure, for experiencing it I can understand leaving it on, but then there's no shiny emblem.
@@EwwwApex The emblem isnt what matters. I know hundreds of people who play purely for the contest experience. A lot of times my fireteam couldnt complete day 1 raids but that didnt matter we did it for fun.
@@Palivox raids are usually released on a saturday so you would get the rest of the weekend aka a destin weekend of sunday and monday until reset.
No? XD sorry my man contest mode emblem should have some value
As someone who did 83 runs of DSC before getting eyes, opened almost 120 chests on riven, and 50 runs of scourge for anarchy there has to be a pity counter for raid exotics…
Crown of Sorrow wasn't the best raid (especially the first encounter, it was too long with the same mechanic cycled 4 times), BUT the boss encounter was one of the best boss fights where mechanics and dps were equally important and satisfying to do. Same goes for SoS, the final encounter was buggy af but the balance between mechanics and dps was really fun and satisfying.
i really liked crown, the final fight was fun.
Didnt like Spire, only did it once and hated it. that could have been because i had a crap raid team that day though
Yeah, I think Ghalran is probably the best raid boss fight in all of destiny's history. It's SO well designed.
BUT, CoS suffers from a few issues that doesn't make it onto the "best raids" list. Namely, encounter 1 plus the raid loot in the dungeon. Oddly enough, CoS is like an inverse GoS. Garden has pretty solid loot and most of the raid is pretty good, but the boss SUCKS. While, conversely, the encounters prior to the final boss aren't great and the loot blows. BUT, the final boss is so much fun that it carries the rest of the raid. If I could replay CoS even while getting sunset loot, I would just to fight that boss again.
Crown of Sorrow's later encounters are either wonderful, or just the worst, no in between. They are so mechanic-heavy that a team who doesn't have great synergy will suffer through a miserable slog, while well-synced players and players experienced in the raid will have a lot of fun juggling the combat and encounter mechanics. Extremely fun, but everyone has to know what they are doing pretty well for it to be fun.
@@colepowers8345 Yup, you either finish the encounter in 10 minutes or 2 hours, that's why it's satisfying with a good team and horrible with 5 good players 1 bad player, most encounters nowaday can be carried with 1 bad player BUT Val Ca’our and Gahlran... They are nearly impossible, especially Val Ca’our, Having Superior Retainer on the wrong player was a immediate wipe.
GOS sucks cuz of gambit. if they did any other mechanic then I'd be with you on that
I like raid encounters where there are different "jobs" to do with varying skill level. Plus, being able to pick who does what
The reason that I disliked Spire of Stars until the end was the bugs and issues with hitboxes there were, like the ship ball throwing was really tough to hit viably
That was not an issue, the balls had so much aim assist on them. It's the same with people getting "glitched" over the barrier at calus, sure it happens rarely, but nowhere near as much as people say it did. I can't say I ever missed a ship that I didn't deserve to miss.
@@dvdossbsvskfbdvav fast forward to vow of the disciple glitches. G o d
"If you are to raid, you should clear time in your schedule to do it, No bathroom breaks or long meals."
I was doing a DSC run where when we got to Taniks abomination, my friend said he was going to make a sandwich. 4 hours later, the only thing he did was make that sandwich and eat it, he finally gets back, god knows how any of us stayed or didn't find another. We now joke about long metrics of time where people need breaks as "Sandwich Metrics" being 4 hours.
I once had a friend go and sell a used car mid game. I also had another take me quite literally when I told him to change the batteries in his smoke detector, leaving mid encounter to do it.
I have a friend who used to make sandwiches between matches.
"Where's so and so?"
"They're making a Joe's Sandwich."
"Oh, just start up the game then. Kick him from the squad."
@@seanp1315 it's a weird one, but I'd do that as well. The low battery warning beep from a smoke detector is annoying as hell.
I don't mind getting a bite to eat while discussing encounters as long as it's just a walk to the kitchen to grab some chips or something.
I've got a friend who will say he's gotta go to the bathroom, and he's gone for a completely random amount of time it seems. Sometimes he'll be back in a few minutes, sometimes we won't hear from him for the rest of the night. Sometimes he'll come back like an hour or two later and say "I was taking a shit." If it takes you an hour, you really ought to go see a doctor.
Leviathan was actually really fun and I look forward to it potentially coming back some day.
Running a raid on all 3 characters with the same gang each week for pinnacles makes for some really fun callouts that develop. Personal fave has been Atheon Oracles becoming Ass n Tiddies, where the oracles behind Atheon are Left Cheek, Crack, Right Cheek, and the oracles in front being Left Tiddy, Cleavage, Right Tiddy. It made for some major confusion whenever we had like 1 person of the regular group drop out and some rando would join but we refused to do other callouts.
unrelated to the goated callouts but respect the pfp 100% RA goated asf
I do Alpha Bravo Charlie for the back, delta echo foxtrot for the front
In vault (LW) we would make the callouts as random as possible but still try to figure out the symbols. 69 fish, triple boob snake, fish high af (swimming through seaweed), *screeching eagle sounds*, n fish, sleepy 8 snake to name a few. For the third encounter on DSC we would use states in the US as callouts for scanner.
Pizza, Pizza slice and Pizza box are the only good callouts in spire
@@Treble_V2 I've never understood "n fish". "Circle fish" makes a lot more sense, especially since nearly everyone already knows two fish in a circle is the 69 fish.
Legitimately, I've heard someone call circle fish "upside down u fish".
If you beat Atraks on Day 1 and heard Deep Stone Lullaby, you had THE peak of destiny raid experiences.
only time i ever cried playing Destiny 2
Well, after my team managed to beat Taniks after a 16 hour play session, i cried a fair amount after that too but for different reasons because my team was at each other's throat at that point
best oracle callouts for Atheon are just front/back left/mid/right
-You only need to include front/back if another oracle appears in the same section, which immediately tells the shooters where the last oracle will be with only two callouts, i.e.
-"Mid, left" -> no duplicate oracles, last one is on right side
-"Back mid, left" -> last oracle is front mid, because otherwise you wouldn't specify "back mid" if it was the only one
-the only slight problem is if you get back/front of something as the first two, but that's not really much an issue ever (I just know someone would bring that up if I didn't mention it
-I have done Atheon plenty of times, and this is generally the preferred method for LFGs (on xbox, at least)
For the front/back part, you don’t even need to say front
1st Row would just be Left/mid/right
2nd row would be back left/back mid/back right.
Only done VoG a couple of times in D2 and I've only used the front/back, L/M/R callouts
This is what I thought, until I used numbers
I used to agree, but then realised how easy it is to just say 2 numbers
@@fubsthefish8320 problem with numbers is that u need to specify what kind of numbers ur doing (which is 1 and which is 6 etc), while directions are always the same every time and dont need clarifying. Its incredibly easy to introduce people to VoG or co-ordinate with LFGs using directions as all you need to say is "we're doing directions" and not "we're doing numbers like a clock" and then have ti explain to someone unaware of what "like a clock" means relative to the oracles
THANK YOU for mentioning that with clock, the oracle tones ascend with the numbers. I feel like not many people realize that, and it’s genuinely helpful. If you miss a callout but know that it was a very low tone, you know to look towards 1 or 2 and so on.
Datto’s gotta be one of my favorite RUclipsrs just because he has these long ass videos and I love them. I still put on old D1 guides in the background because he’s genuinely fun to listen to
Raid loot should feel like some of the strongest in the game, the weapons should have more unique or even intrinsic perks that can only come on those raid weapons, currently raid loot feels like everything else in the game with nothing special differentiating it, although deep stone crypt did have some interesting unique perks which was good.
Ye the only reason to chase raid loot imo is if it has beastly perks.
DSC had the right idea with weapons having perks you can't get anywhere else in the game
either unique perks or overall higher stat totals. Eyasluna vs timelost fatebringer or adept pally is a bit too close, but a total just right under gm gear or flawless would feel nice. why would i ever want a Trustee except for reconstruction over a contingency plan
tried it, people cried about it
@@inventor4279 anxiety filled antisocials cried about it
@@imafatboy27 .......why u call me out like that bruh
"Deep Stone Crypt is easy"
Me: *cries in LFG hell*
I will only raid with my clan for these reasons. Lol
I do DSC every weekend / multiple times with randoms from LFG…lol
@@BANExLORD What's your ratio of randoms dipping at Atraks?
There is a reason why I'm only LFGing VoG for now. People struggle with Atheon callouts, I do not trust them with actual mechanics
you only need 3 people to do it
I had 81 clears of dsc before I got eyes, but I still support the raid exotics being rng. It really adds a sense of determination to go in every week and that true feeling of relief once you finally get it
Dopamine hit is second to none. Truly a gjallahorn moment whenever you get one.
Don't know how hot of a take this is, but I'm definitely growing increasingly sick of RNG for gear in video games just generally. Fully agree with Datto that with enough clears you should just get the raid exotic
I think what would be cool is if you could spend spoils at the chest to grab the exotic. Maybe half the required from the kiosk. So 120 spoils to buy the exotic outright
@@adambeck427 that would also work. Just something to make it eventually inevitable if you put the work in
@@adambeck427 if that were the case, I think it'd make sense to have it just be an auto drop. Because otherwise you could just use spoils you already had from other raids to get it and I think that goes against the whole "mastery of the raid" feeling. I was about to suggest "raid specific spoils" to buy the exotic, but we have enough different currencies, so just making it a guaranteed drop after x amount of runs would make more sense.
Yes never got a rapid hit kill clip sacred provenance with 86 garden clears.
@@liquidrufus did garden twice got sacred with rapid kill clip, range masterwork, hammer forged, armor piercing on my second run lol
Just took a group of my friends through last wish and I was the only one that had any experience and even with fusions being broken it was incredibly fun taking them through. Was also super proud of them because we made it through vault in 3 tries. Truly a highlight of my reading career
I also enjoy the tether mechanic in GoS. However, it only takes one blueberry to screw up a DPS phase or a Fortnite build. That's where it hurts.
Consecrated mind is one of the best raid bosses because it focuses on adaptation over pure memorization of raid mechanics
3rd encounter? Isn't it just eyes team + motes then DPS at the relay while holding w
@@Spartan-sz7km meant to say sanctified mind lol
@@Hackcam eh, sanctified it's just mote team 1, mote team 2 and tether team, then during DPS it's 3 people tether and 3 people fuck off to the other side but I can see what you mean by adaptating, like one more missing so you reopen portal, etc. But then again there really isn't mechanics to remember, just opening portals and banking motes while tether team creates platforms and tether the boss during dps
I think clock is a great callout if all 6 people understand and can call out, but front/left callouts are better to use for lfg
Clock lets you get to damage phase faster instead of standing in the back. But if you don't know the clock method its better to just do it the easy way from the back of the room with left middle right. Its less optimal and more tedious. But requires less setup and explanation than clock method
Hot Take: The current boss encounter paradigm is boring and needs to go. Mechanics to break shield and then standing still DPS is so boring. Riven is one of my favorite bosses because of how she gives you the opportunity to do DPS whenever, but still, there is a large element of separation between mechanics and damage phases. I want a world without phases to our boss fights. Imagine a raid boss where 2 people get to do DPS as any given time, while the other 4 do mechanics to get themselves ready for DPS, and then they switch and 2 of those people have to go and do DPS, all the while the boss is very mobile.
Well you sorta got that with Vow of the Disciple.
This not a raid hot take, but i wanted to share it:
Doing solo/flawless dungeons is the most fun/challenging thing to do in destiny.
Except for me personally. grasp. Damn sparrow part makes me pull my hair out (I’m bald) 😅😅😅
Yeah. The first time. You can run raids maybe 30 times before it’s a real drag but i you solo flawless a dungeon once and then it’s not fun again
hell no, flawless is more pressure than fun and usually takes a really boring drawn out playstyle
I've both solo flawlessed dungeons, and done low man raids. Of the two I believe that doing dsc and last wish 3-man was infinitely more fun than losing my solo flawless to the sparrow race in grasp or the falling section after chamber of suffering.
in my opinion trio flawless raids are the funnest
The riven, queenswalk, and wishwall system was the perfect system for farming a raid exotic and should be copied for future raids ( except for the riven cheeses and queenswalk bugs)
I would love to see more excerpts from Twitch vods since I can’t usually catch the stream but rly enjoy Datto talking about Destiny. Ty for the content!
I totally agree last wish is one of the beest raids. It challenges your abilities to coordinate as a team, it has excellent lore to it, the overall design of the raid just surpasses all the others, and its one of the most challenging raids.
"Protective Light needs a huge nerf or removal otherwise day 1 numbers will never be even remotely close to garden or crown levels again."
Other than most charged with light build being nerfed due to MW weapons no longer generating orbs, (IK stream was live before the latest Twab) meaning it is somewhat getting a nerf, you cannot delegate day one raid clears to a single mod.
I remember I replied to this on Instagram. My answer was that Eater of Worlds was the best the Leviathan raids had to offer
People say that Well of Radiance makes the raid too easy but god forbid if you want to switch to something else. Twitter is full of clowns as always.
I bet they are the same people that say they never die and the WellLock behind them who is healing them on cooldown is akwardly smiling and agreeing to their 0Head takes while cursing them
We should do some just general Destiny 2 hot takes. I’ll start: the game needs more open world exotic weapons per season and not have every new exotic tied to either a raid, dungeon, quest, or special mission and they shouldn’t be revealed in the roadmap so they remain secret until discovered.
I think this is a hot take but I want to see more ad clear type encounters like shiro chi and queens walk. Some of the most intense games I’ve played in destiny has been those two encounters with everyone popping ad clear supers being forced to always be on their toes moving, it makes the anxiety high if there’s a timer I also just think it’s exciting to slay out.
I just want ad clear to be more of a thing in Destiny in general. Much of the content in the game has too few enemies given how powerful the players are.
I'd love more raids encounters where ad clear was something you actually had to work at like Shuro Chi, Riven etc, instead of being a potato job you do when you don't know the raid mechanics.
I miss scourge of the past :c Hopefully they'll bring it back one day, as a legacy raid. Together with leviathan, and all the wings it had
Well of radiance isnt a problem they need to make more unique ways of damaging a boss other than standing and shooting at a boss
Bingo
I agree
Only problem is then people bitch about a slow fight so it's either a fight you can just dps quick with potential 1 phase or another way that will take longer.
Like Atraks
Oryx enters the chat
Loved this video because 1) we get 40 minutes of Datto honestly speaking about what the community thinks about the game and 2) you also added chat on the side. I personally find it more stream videos more engaging like that.
Crown of Sorrow is one of my favorite Raid Lairs, IMO it would be best raid for me if it wasn't for the first encounter that needs to do way more than introduce you to the crystal / blessing mechanic
Spire of Stars was probably my most hated raid simply because of how buggy it was on prestige mode. Could have been that our group was just unlucky but the majority of our resets were because the bomb didn't connect to the ship or it wouldn't arm at all. It was a cool encounter when it worked.
I think Blue loves last wish the most mainly because he has 69 clears 😂
I love DSC but I haven’t played anything before d1 so I’m probably missing out…but out of the ones I’ve played I love DSC and it will forever be my favorite raid
dsc is easily the best one but thats cuz d2 bar for raids is pretty fucking low
@@inventor4279 not even joking, the bar is literally just LW (which is pretty fucking good), GoS (which is pretty fucking bad), VoG (n o s t a l g i a), and DSC (which was actually really good).
3/4, it's bar is average
So, I was always worried that Riven Cheese would be patched, but after doing the normal method, it was honestly really fun, much more fun than the cheese, so I gotta agree with most the “riven patch,” takes.
My raid team does atheon oracles (front: left right middle) (back: left right middle) and we only call out the first 2 Oracles, so if its front right back right back left we'd call out right and back right
The recent VOG team I was with did the first 2 calls too
For oracles I stand by this as the superior strat:
BACK LEFT/BACK MID/BACK RIGHT
FRONT LEFT/FRONT MID/FRONT RIGHT
I did VoG with my clan, three of which were 20 under at that point because they were new lights who joined because of crossplay and they had absolutely no problems with oracles whatsoever.
what ab the seventh oracle? aren’t there 3 each left and right and one in mid?
i really like that system tho
@@clag1109 I think he means aetheon? I could be wrong though.
@@clag1109 Oh no I mean for Atheon, for the actual oracles encounter I use
L3 R3
L2 R2
L1 R1
Mid
Which is probably fairly standard
@@Captain_Yata yeah i realized like right after that you meant atheon, my b
@@clag1109 That's aight :)
Man, hearing the positive reception towards crown really gets me going ngl.
I do have some bias because Shadow was my first raid title and I tried my hand at sherpa'ing it.
Also Sanctified Mind has the best final boss theme imo.
Personally I can’t agree. Aksis in D1 or Riven/Queenswalk
Riven:
Oryx:
Taniks;
Rhulk:
Nezarec (this is how it is spelled)
Vault of Glass is the best "New Light's First Raid". Its shorter than most of the raids in the game, and mechanics that have a learning curve but are not impossible to learn. For example, the Oracle encounter, it will be a challenge starting out. But once you learn where each oracle spawns or you get a view to help keep track of multiple it makes the encounter easier.
Hot take at 11:11: As a Warframe player I can tell you: RNG is never fun. We have so much stuff that only drops occasionally and most of our community is annoyed by now that there is no challenging content with pretty much guaranteed good rewards. I played through a few contents about 60-70 times until I got what I wanted and I can tell you, its more frustrating than replaying the same Raid phase a few times more (btw I know that for sure, I played all Raids in D1 and the Raids are one of the reasons I sometimes think about coming back...)
RNG is the easiest way to artificially extend play time and I hate how reliant lots of games are on RNG to maintain its playerbase.
@@J-manli I think the best system is a combination of RNG with protection and skilled-based objective. If you complete a flawless or a master raid, then you get the exotic out right, or you can try your RNG if you arent good enough (with protection ofc, pure RNG with no protection has no place)
Getting Harrow destroyed me
The one about contest mode being active is one of my favorite D2ubers jarv
My personal opinion, kings fall was one of the most eerie yet enjoyable raids I’ve ever played. Taken king expansion I feel is unbeatable in the way it directed the game
As a PS4 player I used PAC. It helped with teaching people the encounter by using the square/triangle/circle button layout as a physical "map" for which rift/well/bubble to go with the corresponding buff.
26:50 after listening to that, I think that all nightfalls should have matchmaking, with the exception of grandmaster nightfalls.
Good take: Leviathan being open world like and non linear was awesome for sense of scale and world building. It was cool too trying to solo the keys or mixing them into the run. It added an awesome skill gap that didn’t make it bad for new players but just benefitted people with lots of clears of that just took time to explore. I liked learning the area myself lost and alone soloing the keys way back when. I wish they could work this aspect into more experiences and actually make the world feel full. Not just like walls with doors painted on but real, explorable, secret riddled, areas. The leviathan raid felt much more like that to me that most if not all other locations (and it still wasn’t perfect)
11:10 I'd be ok with this if all the RNG raid exotics were also tied to triumphs. That way you get the excitement of a possible lucky drop as well as a sense of progress towards an inevevitable goal. maybe have a special shader for the gun on completion of the triumph too or something.
Hot Take: Dogs on hard mode Leviathan is one of the best raid encounters ever but only for 3/6 of the people
4 people are on the running team, 2 people are on crystals. how is there a 3/6 split anywhere
@@Saterienne the 2 crystal people, plus there’s usually 1 leader on the runner team and the other 3 follow them.
Vault in Last Wish has a similar issue that’s only gotten worse with time. When it first came out, the knights were an insane threat so people on add clear had a somewhat engaging job.
Now it’s basically a 3 person encounter with the 3 other people just standing there.
For what’s it worth I really enjoyed Dogs but that’s probably because I would lead the others.
@@henryzelman4541 yeah, I was always the crystal guy, so I loved it
I love Crown. At least the last two encounters. Boss fight has a lot going on and no one can really sit back and do nothing. That said, I can recognize its short comings and know it is not the best raid.
It’s my favorite raid even tho the first encounter is to long
a raid final boss should always be at least a two phase and it should take quite a bit of optimization or its a 3 phase
Yarrabah needs one thing to be viable: not loosing Ravenous Beast progress when you switch weapons, i.e. the Vex Mythoclast treatment.
I really like quest exotics in raids. I think the div puzzle was fun, but i can see why it was frustrating for some. I think the way Vex was handled is perfect. It provides the best of both worlds, random drop with exotic, but quest for catalyst. It just adds another layer of depth to the raid. makes it stand out more, and becomes a lot more memorable
Datto's critizicing raid callouts like he has a belt
L
Hot take: GOS is the best raid. It was difficult and punishing but not overwhelmingly so. The mechanics were great and the raid encouraged heavy communication. The motes mechanic were only frowned on because of gambit and the teather mechanic was only flawed when the fireteams set up incorrectly.
I do agree with this. If your team wasn't tone deaf and would place themselves where they were supposed to instead of getting in each other's way. It was very simple and can be a clean run with no issues
To add onto the raid exotic RNG argument I agree with you BUT if you want them to be purely RNG they need to be worth it. imagine doing 100 raids for terrabah only to find out it was a worse recluse.
Matching making for raids but you have to have completed the raid 5 times minimum to unlock matching for that raid
I think you’re really underrating Crown of Sorrow, though because of your experience I can understand why. The two phases in the boss room are great. I will admit that the entry encounter is boring and the jumping puzzle is just kinda meh, though.
I agree. If the first fight could go faster based on skill it would be considered a much better raid by most IMO
I kind of liked that the jumping puzzle was more than just jumping. Sure it drags on a bit (especially considering the previous encounter), but I still enjoyed it.
Then again, I'm someone who doesn't mind Crown first encounter and Garden 2nd encounter.
That's the only raid I've never done- Well, and the newest one. People are assholes and expect so much day one that I stopped caring
@@rockies613 It actually could - the speed at which you cleared the waves determined how quickly the next waves would spawn. Most people either never learned this, or never wanted to accept that the only thing stopping it from going faster was... them
Facts. The final boss is one of the best encounters in the game. The only reason some don’t like it is because it’s hectic. Also because you have to be in sync with your partner.
assuming you weren't over levelled for it, the ENTIRE leviathan raid required 'perfect execution' on every single fight otherwise you wiped, there was quite literally no wiggle room for mistakes to be made and still come away successful.
The riven cheese isn't a glitch. It's just taking advantage of a mechanical and doing a ton of damage very quickly
How to make oryx fight better assuming it returns in D2: Make the corrupted lights stun him and then damage can be dealt. More lights = more time oryx is stunned.
Bro is from the future
40 minutes of datto on a day where my mental health has not been the best, thank you datto :D
Hope you're feeling better my friend ❤️ take care!
Cringe.
My hottest take is that Shuro Chi is the best Raid encounter in Destiny history.
Personally, movement (ie not standing still on plates) and callouts where everyone is involved and when things go wrong you have to improv, are my favorite two aspects in any Destiny raid encounter.
It’s why the Death Zamboni, Aksis Phase 2, and Queenswalk are my other favorite encounters as well.
I am not really a speedrunner XD, I just started doing some of them ~3 months ago, so I am not considering that aspect at all. That said: obviously if we factor in the length of the raid, you would not be able to answer anything that’s not Last Wish, so I’m trying to see the bigger picture. If I have to speak from a “fun” perspective, Spire was by far the best raid to play 6 man, especially year 1. On the other hand, Crown had pacing issues on first encounter but 2-3 man Crown are some of the most enjoyable activities I’ve ever done in this game, since it was challenging enough and barely glitchy.
Here's a take: the mechanic in D2 where someone being dead for too long wipes everyone hurts the experience of clutching an encounter and generally discourages desperately trying to salvage an attempt gone bad. It's bad for making the kind of moments that people remember raiding for.
When it comes to new raid mechanics, both the Tales of Iyo raid in Ghost of Tsushima Legends, and It Takes Two have some good inspiration
Correct Atheon oracle callout = callout first 2 oracles. If there's 2 on the same side, specify front or back. i.e. if the 3 oracles are left, right, middle you callout left and right. If the oracles are front left, middle, back left, you callout front left and middle.
An even easier way would be to just always callout front or back on the first 2 so you can spend less time looking and more time looting and shooting
I disagree and agree with patching the riven cheese yes the encounter is amazing and built beautifully but after your 50th time doing it the cheese is there to speed things up per say
The fact that 90% of the community has never experienced Riven properly is a tragedy. The fact that they never patched it so you couldn’t just bake the boss is criminal. I can’t imagine being one of the members of the team who designed that amazing fight only to have almost no one experience it properly.
If DSC final boss was more grandiose, and the full raid was a tad bit harder. would be best no cap.
I don’t know wtf kind of callouts other people use, but imo the best strat is to use close and far with either left, middle, or right, while only calling the first two
Crown of Sorrow genuinely is a top tier raid, but brought down by the first encounter being an absolute slog. If that had a faster pace or less phases, easily would be one of the best rivaling WotM/DSC/LW.
Completely agreed. The final boss is perfect in every way.
nah, all of the encounters minus the last one are ass, it feels like a dungeon with a lot of filler
@@inventor4279 I mean it’s a shorter raid sure, but the last 2 encounters are some of the best in the game. The 2nd encounter is a perfect introduction to the mechanics in the final encounter, preparing you for the balancing act.
It may not be as good as the last encounter, but the second encounter works great in the grand scheme of the raid itself.
I've always thought raid exotics should have a low drop rate, but every time you complete a raid, you get a, we'll call it a Raid Token. Each week you get up to 3 Tokens per account, and can spend those Raid Tokens on the raid exotic specific to those Tokens. If you get the exotic drop before you build up enough tokens, well, you got the exotic. If you dont, you buy it with the Tokens you've been building up
Hot take: Deep stone crypt is S tier, NOT THE BEST, but s tier.
My hot take comes from personal experience and the enjoyment that I had. Crotas end was my favorite raid. I had a playgroup that I loved to play with. We would play every night for 5 or 6 hours. We lost our first member to college and not being able to play really at all anymore with taken king. The other one stuck around until around the time of curse of Osiris. We would run Crota and vault to help other people finish after we finished nightfalls and any other top level content for the week. I wish I could go back to those times. It was the most enjoyable for me
wrath of machine is the best raid hands down, when you add on outbreak prime, no other raid comes close. best experience of destiny hands down.
The FPS dropping to -2 during the zamboni encounter wasn’t super great. The aesthetic was awesome though and the boss encounter was a lot of fun. Last Wish just had an extra encounter, well done encounter, the best boss fight imo. LW is still king.
Omega hot take: The final encounter of Crown is better than every encounter of Wrath. People just like wrath because the weapons were good. A lot of encounters were a slog.
@@whisperofthebookworm5341L take
Crown was my favorite raid. I did it three times and each time I had a absolutely fantastic time. Getting tarrabah on the second completion felt so good
"Shadow" was the first raid title I went for. And it was the most fun, as the raid challenges were actually well constructed and required us to actually adapt our playstyle.
Was also really fun to run Flawless as it contained very little uncontrollable bullshit, like certain other raids (Leviathan Psion grenades, Garden of Salvation Supplicants)
Also did Rivensbane and Enlighted. Cannot say the same about all the challenges there. Especially having to not be hit by Shurochi in Last Wish, and having to kill a lot of Vex with The Sanctified mind platform destruction in Garden of Salvation.
@@Diminisherrr Yeah I did my first raid seal, disciple-slayer and I had a great time. But dungeons are were I shine
Ultimate take - Oracle position callouts
The virgin front LMR/ back LMR
The chad numerical positions
Don't take this too seriously, whatever works works. Use whatever is best for you and your team, even if your callouts are worse :)
Imo the problem with LMR callous is that in order to make sense of them you need to make sure your all standing in the same spot as the callouts person. Which is usually in the front of the damn room. It takes at minimum 7 seconds to leave the portal from oracle side to get to wherever you are doing damage. Whereas numbers you can stand wherever you want. Even right by the exit portal.
TRUE
I remember so many teams switched up the callouts from Deathsingers to Oryx, where the front is closest to the entrance on Deathsingers, and swapped for Oryx. The reasoning was mostly that we’d be in front of Oryx, and so people knew to come to that side when doing the final damage, as well as where the big blubble people got teleported into was. (Didn’t make sense to say ‘in the back, in front of Oryx). Keep Deathsingers’ front towards the entrance only because that’s the first side you see when you enter the room. It’s ‘in front’ of you.
I did a lot of Sherpa-ing during D1 and this system was the easiest for new players and for experienced players to adjust to.
My hot take: Taniks ruins Deep Stone Crypt. He doesn't make any sense either as an ally of Eramis or just... as someone it'd be a priority to resurrect, he isn't even ACTUALLY turned into an Exo, it's literally just "He's alive again somehow." And the Shank-legs, while funny, is just kinda incomprehensible because large Shanks didn't feature anywhere else in the raid, so where the hell did it come from?
If I could wave a magic wand and just... replace Taniks with more Atrax. For the initial reveal after security, just have Atrax helping another Atrax out of a pod, then both look at you and flee. For the nukes encounter, just have Atrax in the center of the room (and have some god damned heavy shanks instead of just piles of captains as your only majors), and then the final boss with be Atrax with a big shank booty. Have the raid literally just be chasing her up and down the length of the Crypt. I don't care if people say it's too samey, you know what's samey? KILLING TANIKS AGAIN.
Oryx is in the back of the room because where he appears in the raid is akin to the place a throne would be, which is the back of the room. On top of that, the room where we fight him is closed off by space. Besides, his position would absolutely be based on our perspective, and given we entered from the opposite side of where he appears, he’d be in the back
My hot take: Gahlran is the best raid boss Destiny has ever had. Crown of Sorrows would be a top 3 raid if the first encounter didn't drag.
Agreed
Maybe shorten the ritual encounter and add another "bridge building" encounter?
Hot take: crown boss phases are on par with vault and riven in lw, both having you work as a team and be quick with your jobs
Raid exotics should be RNG until you complete every other triumph in the raid seal except the badge, at which point it is a 100% drop from your next clear. That would be the best way imo - clear path to getting it but always a chance to get lucky and be able to play with it early.
at VOG remastered, we just named the oracles "left/right/middle, far/close"