@@auntbarbara5576 What’s the point of your comment? I have flown 3-4 separate United 767’s the last 2.5 years and had no issues on any of the aircraft. Not to mention, it’s not like United isn’t being delivered new widebodies at a high pace.
Nope As long as they can jig or cradle the fuselage to remove the stress of it's own weight it's a big job but relatively easy to inspect and replace/repair any buckled frames and support structure and reskin that portion of the fuselage. I bet it took a few months to completed that repair but she's as good as new now with new sheet metal. I worked at an airline once that bellied an aircraft in on a runway, ground the skin and structures so badly you could stand inside and look at the ground. 3 months later it was back in service and lived it's lifespan in revenue service and has since been retired.
Living in the same country as the plane manufacturer has its benefits! In any other ME/ asian / african airline the airframe likely would've been scrapped
I flew on UA from IAH to LIM on a 767-300ER about a 8mo ago. The landing was so hard that the multiple ceiling panels broke off and several overhead bins opened. The crew played it off like nothing had happened. It was 3am when we landed, nobody was asleep after that landing!!
This unfortunately happens often when flight crews switch from 757, to 767, both which are flown under the same type rating, and unfortunately, they both have different flying characteristics, especially on the landing. I rode cockpit jump seats several times and with the same crew on both airplanes, and the results were when switching from one aircraft to another, a hard landing usually followed, many Ryanair style. Surely, the passengers jumped on their seats too.
The PIC, as the pilot monitoring, was in charge of reading and verifying the before landing checklist. How or why did he miss the speed brakes lever not being in the armed position? Goes to show the 'thousand' of flight hours don't really make a difference when the pilot's attention lapses.
You have to remember that we're human. At the end of the day, until AI replaces us all, there are going to be people who go to work tired, or stressed, or not at their best. There are going to be distractions and mishaps. We triple check things a lot of times but when you're looking at an industry where 100,000 landings are being done every day, the rare one in ten million mishap is going to eventually happen. That's not an excuse, it's just an explanation.
This is something that first officer will never forget for the rest of his life, hopefully making him a better pilot going forward. Those checklists are crucial to follow to the letter.
He may have made that omission but why did the much more experienced captain let it pass? Surely, with his extensive flying experience he would have noticed that the speed brakes (which happens to be located on his side of the console) was not pulled to the armed position?
The captain should have been providing more - And better - Supervision knowing the first officer was still relatively new to the type. What consequences is the captain being dealt for this situation (I suspect the FO got canned given they were still a fairly new hire)?
Skipper contributed somewhat no doubt by calling "SPEED BRAKES ARMED" on the before landing checklist, but neglected to so, and both crew didn't notice that they in fact were not armed. Take your lumps and learn from it boys.
@@paulsz6194 Aircraft was determined to be on a stable approach and configured per company policy. That says they were within the acceptable airspeed range.
@ your right Hoss, but Ground/Flight spoilers are not up on the approach, most likely stowed no lower than 300 radio. They deploy on touchdown with WOW input. They are very effective on all similarly equipped aircraft on killing lift. A video displaying this from a United 763 landing on 28 LSZH clearly illustrates. Cheers bud!
Former 757/767 captain here. Even though the two airplanes have a common type rating, they handle surprisingly different. The 757 handles like a pickup truck-- fairly firm with good solid control feel, but not heavy. The 767 otoh handles like...a minivan with loose power steering. It's more sensitive especially considering how much heavier it is. Also, you have to land the two aircraft a little differently. The 757 you can pull the power to idle at 40 feet and there's enough elevator and wing to still put it down smoothly. If you do that in a 767, you'll (often) come down on the runway like a dumpster of bricks; you have to gradually pull off the power so the throttles just hit idle as your wheels are touching. If you've been flying the 757 a lot and then get assigned a 767 flight, you have to remember not to land it the same way. I'm not saying this was a factor in the incident above, but something to consider if you've ever experienced a hard landing on a 767.
If F/O was small amount of flt hrs on B767, the Captain was responsible for proper monitoring SPDBRK armed psn, flare profile and touch down configuration.
The NTSB’s report is based on the actual events as recorded by the DFDR, but why was there no mentioned that there was a much more experienced pilot sitting on the left seat who was supposed to be also monitoring the junior pilot’s handling of the landing?
@ Thats often a repairable damage. The manufacturers provide Structural Repair Manuals that detail the limits and extent of damage and the repair schemes. Its the insurance companys that will decide if it worth repairing
Excellent work by the NTSB, and let me start by stating that the 767-300ER has been a fav plane of mine (one of a few) for decades now. I wonder if the NTSB checked service records to see if any possible fatigue had been developing over the decades of service this plane has given. That's not to lessen the impact (sorry for the unintentional pun) that the FO's decisions had on the outcome, but I can imagine that this plane has had tens of thousands of landings in its 25+ (guess) career, each landing adding some pressure to the fuselage at that "pinch point." Regardless, outstanding work by the NTSB and by United by staying committed to investigating this incident.
As a previous training captain myself, its hard to say exactly what happened though there certainly seems to be a few standout issues that were at hand. Given the skill level of the First Officer ( hear say only, though 129 hours on type and still under training 🤷♂) would have made for a difficult time for the training captain regarding TEM. There would have been a lot of bad habits needing to be undone. Landing, is where I would has at a guess the FO was continually having issues. Maybe not his / her fault, were they a "pumper" . I can pretty much back it in, in their initial training they were not shown how to use the eye height indicators correctly. They aren't there for decoration. Sitting to high which is a natural thing you want to do in big jets is a recipe for disaster mainly to the fact that when you flair all you can see is the runway immediately below you. Thus the reason for putting the main oleo's up through the passengers arse's. The 767's main gear bogies droop forward and not backwards to try and stop the nose slap. Either way you go, without seeing the First Officers training records in black and white its hard to say.
Our airline policy was to call “Speedbrake” or “No Speedbrake” if it did not deploy. We also verified visually the items in the Landing checklist. I have heard that the FO was fired and is suing United.
Some details on PPRUNE: - FO was a complete dolt and United was pushing then through for some unknown reason - FO was at 125hrs on the 76 already and not signed off yet on (basic) IOE (most pilots take 25 hours) - FO lied to investigators about pushing nose down (said they didnt, when the FDR clearly showed they did) - FO failed several check stages previous and had to redo many checks repeatedly
Failing check-rides is normal for everyone. Almost all seasoned pilots have failed a check-ride. Why not talk about the PIC one again failing to arm the speed brakes or even noticing?
I was an LCA on the 757/767. That’s pretty poor performance by the LCA to 1. F/U the landing checklist and 2. To not be guarding the yoke to prevent improper control input. If I was his lead, he would have some explaining to do 🧐
@@twvs5 Learn how airline contracts and seniority work. Pilots don't become difficult to pink slip on day 1. Not too different from other trades where new hires are "on the bubble" for a period of time.
@ Well him being let go I honestly do not know for sure, I hope that's not correct. I just heard that around. However the First Officer being on his IOE came from the NTSB Prelim Report via Blancolirio.
What was the investigation on CG limits? anyone knows? trim settings? IAS? wind components? I personally think speed brake deployment has very little to do with the bouncing of nose wheel.
This is a trend that is going to happen more and more. As regional pilots jump to the major airlines without ever being a Captain the level of experience will drop even further and and more mistakes will be made. To take it a step further the regionals like SkyWest will have the minimum experienced pilots making air travel very risky and dangerous. It is also a mistake to put a brand new pilot at the controls of a heavy, large aircraft like a 767. Simply put air travel is going to become increasingly riskier and the regionals are going to be worse. And the stream of military pilots is all but dried up.
Agreed upgrading at the regionals is key. Decision making, experience working through summertime T'storm and winter deicing, flying 3-5 legs a day is some of the best experience you will get. Some of these FO's only spent maybe 3 months max at the regionals before heading to a major.
Similar thing happened to a Monarch B757-2T7 in Gibraltar and blew the front tyres along with damaging the fuselage. G-MONE or G-MONC was the registration.
They work both automatically or manually but 99 times out of 100 they will be armed for automatic operation while setting up the landing, when the wheels spin up they deploy on their own which greatly reduces pilot workload during the most critical phase of flight. Im only an aircraft maintenance technician but I have sat in the cockpit for many landings and every little bit helps. the last 30 seconds before landing the pilots are incredibly busy so auto speedbrakes, auto brakes and the like is very helpful to the crew
@@fdxdsm No, 100% of the time the speed brakes are armed for landing unless the auto function is not working, then the CA deploys them at touchdown. The thrust reversers also trigger spoiler deployment.
I was always told hold slight back pressure, and not to hammer the brakes, it’ll settle. Or just do that. Not getting points with the shop guys, but it still did most certainly land.
1. Don't bend metal. 2. Don't make the nightly news. 3. Retire before the chief pilot knows your name. I guess the FO made all three. Will Kirby cut the newbie some slack?
You should never land nose wheel first I saw a B52 break apart on landing because the drag chute was deployed before the aircraft touched down, the rapid deceleration slammed the aircraft on the ground and it broke immediately forward of the wing leading edge. This was in the 80's. The B52 has been in service for 70 years - 70!
A low time pilot will make mistakes during his training flights. Although there was damage to the ac I'm quite sure he won't make this mistake again. I hope UA didn't fire him and destroy his career. We all make mistakes. I'm curious to know why the PIC didn't notice the ac wasn't set up properly for the landing. He holds some of the blame.
I heard he failed multiple check rides and was needing more hours for training than normal. I’m sorry but some people are just not meant to be pilots.. As a captain you want someone next to you who you can trust.
N641UA is the oldest plane in United's fleet. It's also the same one that had an engine failure out of IAH in 2023, a diversion for "slats disagree" a month before that, and a fuel imbalance diversion in 2018. I hope she's retired with honor, she served us well.
@@JimboJimbo-i4i Yep. I remember hearing a news about a surgeon who amputated the wrong leg of a patient. That's why both pilots & surgeons use checklists.
Was FO an embraer 145 pilot before United? His muscle memory might have been the issue here. But after 129hrs he should have had a better picture and technique.
Heres the deal. In no way shape or form did he do anything wrong well he did but…. BUT… the pic is in charge of monitoring the damn flight! All checks shall be done before landing why did he miss the spdbrk light being extinguished? This doesn’t make sense it feels like CRM was ZERO. I hope the FO can learn from this and become a better pilot.
Why was the "newbie" FO assigned to the widebody 767-300? I thought the seniority/bidding process pretty much precluded going straight to a widebody given low hours.
Trust me, as someone who isn't a big fan of Boeing, I gladly accept this assessment. When the 737 Max crashed in Ethiopia because of MCAS, people were quick to blame the pilots because they're from "third world country". Even then CEO Dave Calhoun said *"we made a decision to recommend a simulator training (for 737 Max) for regulators and pilots of the developing world, Not because the U.S airlines needed it..... They probably don't."* So I'm glad to see that American pilots are humans and are capable of making mistakes. Where you're born doesn't make you a good pilot, hard work and professionalism does.
Standards so low, there hasn’t been a crash in 15 years. One can only dream of the good old days when plans fell from the sky 2-3 times a year at a time when air traffic was half what it is today. Those were truly well trained professionals.
Typical horrible United Airlines… Safety and training secondary… anytime I’ve ever been on United Airlines flight. There’s been always something wrong with the plane every single time don’t trust them.
This will one of these that will have a catastrophic failure in the fure, and thet will look back and say it was not repaired according to the manufacturers guidelines
Living in the same country as the plane manufacturer has its benefits! In any other ME/ asian / african airline the airframe likely would've been scrapped after such substantial damage!
1ST. OFFICERS MISTAKE , TO HUMAN IS ERROR ,HOPE HE LEARNS BY HIS MISTAKE !! THE 767,300ER WAS FIXED AND THE CAPTAIN DID WHAT HE COULD TO LAND THE JET AND KEEP EVERYONE SAFE !! THE JET WAS REPAIRED AND IT'S BACK IN THE SKY !! GOOD JOB RECOVERING THIS MISTAKE HOPE ALL HAVE LEARNED A LESSO GOOD JOB GOOD DAY ❤❤
Both actually the checklists are demand and response checklists, usually one calls out (demands) the step in the checklist the other is supposed to comply and report as each step is completed. Regardless the ultimate responsibility falls to the captain. I'm sure they both "stood tall" in the chief pilot's office for that one
As a former commercial helicopter and air cargo pilot I can tell you that landing a B767 is like putting icing on a cake!!! To botch the landing that badly the pilot must have been performing an anal cranial inversion!!!
767 is always known for skinned wrinkled when the airplane is flown INCORRECTLY. FIRST OFFICER NEED TO BE FIRED due to NOT configuring the Airplane correctly and become a hazard in the future due to BAD FLYING TECHNIQUE. He have no business flying PASSENGER AIRLINE and go back to flying DC3.
Not a Boeing problem and this could absolutely happen to an Airbus, it depends on how hard you hit the nose gear. What happened was a Pilot Induced Oscillation (PIO).
This has happened several times at several different airlines. Recent notables being American and Air France. Can you point to the dolly where United hurt you?
Wow I’m shocked. I fully expected this aircraft to be written off
Well, it is United we're talking about.
These Clinton-era (first term) 76's are still new to them.
They just have to replace the panel
@@Kiwiaviatornz and some stringers and framework. AOG Baby!!
@@auntbarbara5576
What’s the point of your comment?
I have flown 3-4 separate United 767’s the last 2.5 years and had no issues on any of the aircraft.
Not to mention, it’s not like United isn’t being delivered new widebodies at a high pace.
Nope
As long as they can jig or cradle the fuselage to remove the stress of it's own weight it's a big job but relatively easy to inspect and replace/repair any buckled frames and support structure and reskin that portion of the fuselage. I bet it took a few months to completed that repair but she's as good as new now with new sheet metal.
I worked at an airline once that bellied an aircraft in on a runway, ground the skin and structures so badly you could stand inside and look at the ground. 3 months later it was back in service and lived it's lifespan in revenue service and has since been retired.
I flew on this plane about a week ago. She’s in perfect condition now ! Good job UA maintenance!
Living in the same country as the plane manufacturer has its benefits!
In any other ME/ asian / african airline the airframe likely would've been scrapped
No bondo required?
@@paulsz6194 Just speed tape
Pretty sure boeing repaired it.
@@CrazyForCooCooPuffs Yup, damage like that, Boeing would have been called in.
I flew on UA from IAH to LIM on a 767-300ER about a 8mo ago. The landing was so hard that the multiple ceiling panels broke off and several overhead bins opened. The crew played it off like nothing had happened. It was 3am when we landed, nobody was asleep after that landing!!
This unfortunately happens often when flight crews switch from 757, to 767, both which are flown under the same type rating, and unfortunately, they both have different flying characteristics, especially on the landing. I rode cockpit jump seats several times and with the same crew on both airplanes, and the results were when switching from one aircraft to another, a hard landing usually followed, many Ryanair style. Surely, the passengers jumped on their seats too.
@@javacup912 Experience, or lack of it, is a huge factor in these increasingly common incidents.
The PIC, as the pilot monitoring, was in charge of reading and verifying the before landing checklist. How or why did he miss the speed brakes lever not being in the armed position? Goes to show the 'thousand' of flight hours don't really make a difference when the pilot's attention lapses.
You have to remember that we're human. At the end of the day, until AI replaces us all, there are going to be people who go to work tired, or stressed, or not at their best. There are going to be distractions and mishaps. We triple check things a lot of times but when you're looking at an industry where 100,000 landings are being done every day, the rare one in ten million mishap is going to eventually happen. That's not an excuse, it's just an explanation.
Ryanair: "You're hired!"
What you kids don't understand is this happens all the time every airline you just don't hear about it
@@AlienGamer38 daddy chill
@@airplanewhat5316 quite kid
The only "difference" is that the 737 family was designed to be landed "firmly," but I still really appreciate your humor/humour...
@@steinbockguy it happens all The Time you just don't hear about it
"speedbrakes?" "armed." is part of the verbal landing checklist. How did they miss that.
This is something that first officer will never forget for the rest of his life, hopefully making him a better pilot going forward. Those checklists are crucial to follow to the letter.
*first officer
@creativemindplay A typo... autocorrect.
The PIC failed to monitor the speedbrakes not being deployed.
He may have made that omission but why did the much more experienced captain let it pass? Surely, with his extensive flying experience he would have noticed that the speed brakes (which happens to be located on his side of the console) was not pulled to the armed position?
Well the captain was not up to his tasks either. He didn't notice the errors
The captain should have been providing more - And better - Supervision knowing the first officer was still relatively new to the type. What consequences is the captain being dealt for this situation (I suspect the FO got canned given they were still a fairly new hire)?
Well it happened with a USA airline where there is limited job security (compared to developed countries) . . .
Skipper contributed somewhat no doubt by calling "SPEED BRAKES ARMED" on the before landing checklist, but neglected to so, and both crew didn't notice that they in fact were not armed. Take your lumps and learn from it boys.
There was no mention of the airspeed of the flight prior to touch down…. Perhaps they were coming in a little high?
@@paulsz6194 Aircraft was determined to be on a stable approach and configured per company policy. That says they were within the acceptable airspeed range.
ok bro but speed brakes extending have a negligible affect on the landing attitude of a 767, source - prior UA 757 767 pilot and KC-46 pilot
@ your right Hoss, but Ground/Flight spoilers are not up on the approach, most likely stowed no lower than 300 radio. They deploy on touchdown with WOW input. They are very effective on all similarly equipped aircraft on killing lift. A video displaying this from a United 763 landing on 28 LSZH clearly illustrates. Cheers bud!
Former 757/767 captain here. Even though the two airplanes have a common type rating, they handle surprisingly different. The 757 handles like a pickup truck-- fairly firm with good solid control feel, but not heavy. The 767 otoh handles like...a minivan with loose power steering. It's more sensitive especially considering how much heavier it is. Also, you have to land the two aircraft a little differently. The 757 you can pull the power to idle at 40 feet and there's enough elevator and wing to still put it down smoothly. If you do that in a 767, you'll (often) come down on the runway like a dumpster of bricks; you have to gradually pull off the power so the throttles just hit idle as your wheels are touching. If you've been flying the 757 a lot and then get assigned a 767 flight, you have to remember not to land it the same way. I'm not saying this was a factor in the incident above, but something to consider if you've ever experienced a hard landing on a 767.
If F/O was small amount of flt hrs on B767, the Captain was responsible for proper monitoring SPDBRK armed psn, flare profile and touch down configuration.
The NTSB’s report is based on the actual events as recorded by the DFDR, but why was there no mentioned that there was a much more experienced pilot sitting on the left seat who was supposed to be also monitoring the junior pilot’s handling of the landing?
This does shine blame on the captain. What is more amazing is that United chose to repair the plane.
@ Thats often a repairable damage. The manufacturers provide Structural Repair Manuals that detail the limits and extent of damage and the repair schemes. Its the insurance companys that will decide if it worth repairing
"Look cap! No hands!"
Excellent work by the NTSB, and let me start by stating that the 767-300ER has been a fav plane of mine (one of a few) for decades now. I wonder if the NTSB checked service records to see if any possible fatigue had been developing over the decades of service this plane has given. That's not to lessen the impact (sorry for the unintentional pun) that the FO's decisions had on the outcome, but I can imagine that this plane has had tens of thousands of landings in its 25+ (guess) career, each landing adding some pressure to the fuselage at that "pinch point." Regardless, outstanding work by the NTSB and by United by staying committed to investigating this incident.
As a previous training captain myself, its hard to say exactly what happened though there certainly seems to be a few standout issues that were at hand. Given the skill level of the First Officer ( hear say only, though 129 hours on type and still under training 🤷♂) would have made for a difficult time for the training captain regarding TEM. There would have been a lot of bad habits needing to be undone. Landing, is where I would has at a guess the FO was continually having issues. Maybe not his / her fault, were they a "pumper" . I can pretty much back it in, in their initial training they were not shown how to use the eye height indicators correctly. They aren't there for decoration. Sitting to high which is a natural thing you want to do in big jets is a recipe for disaster mainly to the fact that when you flair all you can see is the runway immediately below you. Thus the reason for putting the main oleo's up through the passengers arse's. The 767's main gear bogies droop forward and not backwards to try and stop the nose slap. Either way you go, without seeing the First Officers training records in black and white its hard to say.
Our airline policy was to call “Speedbrake” or
“No Speedbrake” if it did not deploy. We also verified visually the items in the Landing checklist. I have heard that the FO was fired and is suing United.
I feel sorry for the FO. I hope this incident didn't end his career.
Some details on PPRUNE:
- FO was a complete dolt and United was pushing then through for some unknown reason
- FO was at 125hrs on the 76 already and not signed off yet on (basic) IOE (most pilots take 25 hours)
- FO lied to investigators about pushing nose down (said they didnt, when the FDR clearly showed they did)
- FO failed several check stages previous and had to redo many checks repeatedly
Failing check-rides is normal for everyone. Almost all seasoned pilots have failed a check-ride. Why not talk about the PIC one again failing to arm the speed brakes or even noticing?
There is so much more that can be added to that list.
I was an LCA on the 757/767. That’s pretty poor performance by the LCA to 1. F/U the landing checklist and 2. To not be guarding the yoke to prevent improper control input. If I was his lead, he would have some explaining to do 🧐
@ agreed, sounds like 2 fires
wow. that's egregious. genuine question: what ethnicity was he? was he fired?
Did they not complete the landing checklist?
What happened to the FO?
I believe he was let go. He was on his Initial Operating Experience with United.
@@ryanlittleton5615 Source?
@@twvs5 Learn how airline contracts and seniority work. Pilots don't become difficult to pink slip on day 1. Not too different from other trades where new hires are "on the bubble" for a period of time.
That’s pretty bad if the FO was still doing OE at 129 hours
@ Well him being let go I honestly do not know for sure, I hope that's not correct. I just heard that around. However the First Officer being on his IOE came from the NTSB Prelim Report via Blancolirio.
What was the investigation on CG limits? anyone knows? trim settings? IAS? wind components? I personally think speed brake deployment has very little to do with the bouncing of nose wheel.
Super interesting! 🤨
Thanks guys!
It will buff out.
The pic @ 3:23 is a Delta B757 (about 7yrs ago)
This is a trend that is going to happen more and more. As regional pilots jump to the major airlines without ever being a Captain the level of experience will drop even further and and more mistakes will be made. To take it a step further the regionals like SkyWest will have the minimum experienced pilots making air travel very risky and dangerous. It is also a mistake to put a brand new pilot at the controls of a heavy, large aircraft like a 767. Simply put air travel is going to become increasingly riskier and the regionals are going to be worse. And the stream of military pilots is all but dried up.
going to get even riskier when the FAA and NTSB budgets get slashed and experts are replaced by loyal partisans.
Agreed upgrading at the regionals is key. Decision making, experience working through summertime T'storm and winter deicing, flying 3-5 legs a day is some of the best experience you will get. Some of these FO's only spent maybe 3 months max at the regionals before heading to a major.
Similar thing happened to a Monarch B757-2T7 in Gibraltar and blew the front tyres along with damaging the fuselage. G-MONE or G-MONC was the registration.
Im more wondering what UA did with the FO who did this? Were they retained? Retrained? Or discharged?
Fired and the FO is now suing UA for 100,000 dollars
@@onehittaquitta and UA should countersue the FO for the cost of repair. LOL That will shut him up.
Retrained. Room for cream?
What about the Pilot " Monitoring" did he not see this mistake ?
Lack of experience and possible workload made this happen.
IS arming the speed brakes a step in the checklist for landing? Or is it arbitrarily performed as desired?
They work both automatically or manually but 99 times out of 100 they will be armed for automatic operation while setting up the landing, when the wheels spin up they deploy on their own which greatly reduces pilot workload during the most critical phase of flight.
Im only an aircraft maintenance technician but I have sat in the cockpit for many landings and every little bit helps. the last 30 seconds before landing the pilots are incredibly busy so auto speedbrakes, auto brakes and the like is very helpful to the crew
@@fdxdsm No, 100% of the time the speed brakes are armed for landing unless the auto function is not working, then the CA deploys them at touchdown. The thrust reversers also trigger spoiler deployment.
I was always told hold slight back pressure, and not to hammer the brakes, it’ll settle.
Or just do that. Not getting points with the shop guys, but it still did most certainly land.
Almost all of airplane mishaps are pilot error. I am glad no one was hurt.
Just glad we were not on this flight.
Why?
It'd be a great story to tell your friends 😅
1. Don't bend metal. 2. Don't make the nightly news. 3. Retire before the chief pilot knows your name. I guess the FO made all three. Will Kirby cut the newbie some slack?
ANA has been in this incident before with the same plane
Interesting impact dynamics: nose-wheel impact but buckling about a third of the way aft of the impact…to a layperson like me, makes intuitive sense:
You should never land nose wheel first
I saw a B52 break apart on landing because the drag chute was deployed before the aircraft touched down, the rapid deceleration slammed the aircraft on the ground and it broke immediately forward of the wing leading edge. This was in the 80's. The B52 has been in service for 70 years - 70!
@That’s fine but in this case, the plane touched down on center undercarriage first as per usual. The two times hard bounce caused the damage.
Classic case of POI, just lucky the plane did not break in two.
Non i think that the fuselage was old thats the point
Well, it is United.
That wasn't a hard landing, that was a crash landing 😂😂
A low time pilot will make mistakes during his training flights. Although there was damage to the ac I'm quite sure he won't make this mistake again. I hope UA didn't fire him and destroy his career. We all make mistakes. I'm curious to know why the PIC didn't notice the ac wasn't set up properly for the landing. He holds some of the blame.
I hope I'm wrong but I think United let him go.
@@ryanlittleton5615you mean fired him ! 😊
@ I mean yeah. Same thing lol.
I heard he failed multiple check rides and was needing more hours for training than normal. I’m sorry but some people are just not meant to be pilots.. As a captain you want someone next to you who you can trust.
@@pilotguy7074 Yes, and as a newbie FO you also want the PIC to properly monitor the speed brake checklist.
N641UA is the oldest plane in United's fleet. It's also the same one that had an engine failure out of IAH in 2023, a diversion for "slats disagree" a month before that, and a fuel imbalance diversion in 2018. I hope she's retired with honor, she served us well.
Somebody's got to be at the top of the seniority list
Engine failure isn't an aging airframe issue, considering engines get rotated through different airframes.
United airlines is not Delta with the upkeep on their older planes, go check in Amarillo airport, so many United planes scrapped.
We've all effed up at work.
There are some jobs where effing up just isn’t acceptable at all, like this
@@JimboJimbo-i4i Yep. I remember hearing a news about a surgeon who amputated the wrong leg of a patient.
That's why both pilots & surgeons use checklists.
@@JimboJimbo-i4i C'mon man!
Any landing you walk away from is a good landing
❤ Excellent video ❤
Was FO an embraer 145 pilot before United? His muscle memory might have been the issue here. But after 129hrs he should have had a better picture and technique.
Depends if he actual was flying the landings!
Ex-Navy? They land HARD on carriers.
Yeah, making sure I'm NEVER flying this aircraft.
Fo is "our strength"?
Heres the deal. In no way shape or form did he do anything wrong well he did but…. BUT… the pic is in charge of monitoring the damn flight! All checks shall be done before landing why did he miss the spdbrk light being extinguished? This doesn’t make sense it feels like CRM was ZERO. I hope the FO can learn from this and become a better pilot.
Instrument landing in good weather, and slammed it down 3 times? Yikes, there goes your career.
Bro is gonna get fired
Definitely because he didn’t follow prelanding procedures. Def a small but significant mistake.
Over 30 years old.
Human Error............ That what makes us all human.
If this was a foreign airline, comments would have been way more harsh!
Looks like the ANA that landed too hard
Years taken off that airframe🙂↔️
Don’t go above 10000
Why was the "newbie" FO assigned to the widebody 767-300? I thought the seniority/bidding process pretty much precluded going straight to a widebody given low hours.
Sim training will not help with this. These pilots need re-training or hopefully lose there licenses.
My back!
They are not “Speed Brakes “. They are “Ground Spoilers”.
You are obviously uneducated, or just ai misinformation
Please delete your channel
united airlines leaves the chat, ryanair joined the chat
Captain needs a few months off
Surprised? All the Boeing haters aren’t going to accept this as an answer.
Trust me, as someone who isn't a big fan of Boeing, I gladly accept this assessment. When the 737 Max crashed in Ethiopia because of MCAS, people were quick to blame the pilots because they're from "third world country". Even then CEO Dave Calhoun said *"we made a decision to recommend a simulator training (for 737 Max) for regulators and pilots of the developing world, Not because the U.S airlines needed it..... They probably don't."* So I'm glad to see that American pilots are humans and are capable of making mistakes. Where you're born doesn't make you a good pilot, hard work and professionalism does.
Never fly United, never going on a Boeing.
The airlines are desperate for pilots. Standards are not the same as it was 10, 20, 30 yrs ago. It's just a matter of time for .......
Standards so low, there hasn’t been a crash in 15 years. One can only dream of the good old days when plans fell from the sky 2-3 times a year at a time when air traffic was half what it is today. Those were truly well trained professionals.
Typical horrible United Airlines… Safety and training secondary… anytime I’ve ever been on United Airlines flight. There’s been always something wrong with the plane every single time don’t trust them.
This will one of these that will have a catastrophic failure in the fure, and thet will look back and say it was not repaired according to the manufacturers guidelines
I read the 767 was reinforced at that area in later revisions
ANA had it worse 😂
Living in the same country as the plane manufacturer has its benefits!
In any other ME/ asian / african airline the airframe likely would've been scrapped after such substantial damage!
PIO
oops !!
I wonder what UA did to the pilots.
average ryanair landing
2023 !!!
Strange isn't American planes made of cast iron ?
a plane made of cast iron won't fly
PIC is in command
Old plane-
Do you have a tail number? I’m never flying on that plane.
N641UA. Its also the oldest aircraft in their fleet. Double whammy.
SO I seen a 767 where horse piss had corroded the fuselage skin underneath and a guy just poked his finger through it.
Shoulda boughtta airbus
1ST. OFFICERS MISTAKE , TO HUMAN IS ERROR ,HOPE HE LEARNS BY HIS MISTAKE !! THE 767,300ER WAS FIXED AND THE CAPTAIN DID WHAT HE COULD TO LAND THE JET AND KEEP EVERYONE SAFE !! THE JET WAS REPAIRED AND IT'S BACK IN THE SKY !! GOOD JOB RECOVERING THIS MISTAKE HOPE ALL HAVE LEARNED A LESSO GOOD JOB GOOD DAY ❤❤
Aren't the 767's going the way of the DoDo?
Not yet . United’s keeping them
This FO sucks
So did they get fired? Trial and error doesn't work when you're responsible for 100+ lives.
Your fired
Capt at fault for not arming speed brake auto deployment.
Both actually the checklists are demand and response checklists, usually one calls out (demands) the step in the checklist the other is supposed to comply and report as each step is completed. Regardless the ultimate responsibility falls to the captain. I'm sure they both "stood tall" in the chief pilot's office for that one
At the very least I hope this "pilot" had to pay for the damage ... many $million$ for sure. AND lost his license.
As a former commercial helicopter and air cargo pilot I can tell you that landing a B767 is like putting icing on a cake!!! To botch the landing that badly the pilot must have been performing an anal cranial inversion!!!
767 is always known for skinned wrinkled when the airplane is flown INCORRECTLY. FIRST OFFICER NEED TO BE FIRED due to NOT configuring the Airplane correctly and become a hazard in the future due to BAD FLYING TECHNIQUE. He have no business flying PASSENGER AIRLINE and go back to flying DC3.
? The captain should have checked if the airplane is configured correctly.
Then check out the Lufthansa A340-600 which also got its fuselage bent by a hard landing. It was caught on camera check that one out
The ntsb needs to be overhauled.
Simple. Piss poor airmanship
So is this a Boeing issue? Could an Airbus survive such a landing?
Not a Boeing problem and this could absolutely happen to an Airbus, it depends on how hard you hit the nose gear. What happened was a Pilot Induced Oscillation (PIO).
An airbus would shatter from this landing . A hardy 777 probably couldn’t even land untouched in this way . This was all pilot error
An Airbus wouldn't have the unarmed speed brake issue because ECAM would monitor this and show the item and landing memo in blue.
It was just an airline fracture
i think sodd off
Leave it to United airlines to do this......
This has happened several times at several different airlines. Recent notables being American and Air France. Can you point to the dolly where United hurt you?
The copilot fuckup😂
Oh come on it has to be Boeing’s fault.
yeah definetly mhm
The plane was not made for such landing forces. All blame on the pilot.
@ Sarcasm my friend. 😀
So what happened to the FO ?