Rob Reacts to... Football Referee Reaction to Wayne Barnes - Another Great Rugby Referee!
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- Опубликовано: 20 сен 2024
- A slightly more straight to the point and less 'jokey' type of referee, but I am very impressed with his ability!
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The thing i love about Rugby is that as a supporter I can be sat next to a fan from the other side in the stands and we just watch the match ,have a drink and a chat together and at the end of the match shake hands and all walk out together. I'm a Quins supporter and was at a game down in Exeter where afterwards Exeter supporters invited my Husband and I into town for a drink. Was a great night. We were in our Quins tops and had no hassle at all.
Yea seems really nice and friendly. I know Joe Marchant. I was talking to his sister this morning whilst out on a dog walk!
Very true - but not advisable to have a night out in Bristol wearing a Bath shirt if Bath ever manage to beat Bristol again !
At the 2015 world cup, the police in some areas suggested crowd segregation and were told in no uncertain terms that would not happen.
@@johnenglish929 as someone who lives in keynsham where its 50/50 bath or bristol supporters I agree with you.
"Bad haircut". That guy is Joe Marler, he is a hell of character.
haha
Great guy, but you're right that trim is awful 😂
@@joshsellick5229 Which is funny because the number of football players who have taken out of my haircut! haha
his eminence the archbishop of banterbury
As a welsh guy I'm always happy having Barnsey or any of the English refs in charge, them and the Welsh refs are usually among the best quality
Barnes is from glos but he was educated at Monmouth so we're claiming him by default!
@@lewisb85 There must be something in the water in Wales that makes good referees. Luke Pearce is my favourite atm and he was born in Wales even though he refs in the prem.
@@thejgod4982 That area of the west country he's from is almost like wales extended culturally, He went to Monmouth which is the same public (private) school I went to.
Wayne Barnes is a qualified and very well respected barrister!!!! It is that skill set that sets him a part from the rest as the best referee with Nigel Owens!!!
As a Welshman , I think Mr Barnes is the better referee.
respected barrister, no he's not!!!
@@gow03333 There's always arguements between rugby fans about how good Nigel is, but that's almost always down to how he interprets the laws. Interpretation is always personal so that inevitable. However, I think everyone would agree that Nigel (and Wayne and many others) is a fantastic communicator.
@@craigrik2699 He absolutely is. He specialises in fraud cases.
In Rugby the Captain is the only player who is allowed to speak to the ref without being spoken to first. Of course in reality players do speak to the ref. However. They must be very careful and respectful.
Thanks for doing this vid man really wanted another referee video thank you.
I have noticed you have gained a lot of subscribers good work keep it up
It's interesting the difference between Wayne Barnes and Nigel Owens! And thanks man, steadily increasing subs. I found out my Nigel Owens video was featured on a rugby blog!
Rugby Union you can be penalised for something you had absolutely no control over, so ref’s explaining their decision can be very useful.
In-fact that's the basis of a great deal of modern tactics. "Forcing the penalty" as we say.
I think the fundamental difference between football and most other sports is that a football supporter loves their team above everything else, whereas in other sports, especially Rugby, supporters probably love the Sport more than their team.
That's a wonderful way of putting it!
Hit the nail on the head there. I love Munster but I absolutely love rugby
Melbeeswax You have hit the nail on the head . Thats the case in ireland with GAA sports the sport itself is more important than any team.Its a recognition that clubs and county teams are part of a greater whole and i would agree thats very much the case with rugby aswell
Should do one on how rugby uses TMO (television match official) compared to how football uses VAR. I think football could learn a lot in that area
I would do but I'm struggling to find a video explanation of both.
I say this every time I'm forced to watch the football. The Euros have been pretty decently reffed so far, Fingers crossed.
A crucial difference between Rugby and Soccer is that players of the former code have respect for the Referee's Authority and accept the Ref's decisions. It's acceptance of discipline. Nigel had humour but Wayne Barnes also is a great Ref.
Cultures of the sports and people are so different.
you can't book 3 players
yes I can
- at that point you know that if he books them it will be 3 guys minimum
I’m pretty sure Barnes is a lawyer by trade. So he is very clear and considerate like in a courtroom haha.
If thats true then i think his manorisms certainly link to that.
Yep, he's a Barrister
6:29 shows an example of a scrum. The "front row" of each team are 3 guys from each team who are literally pushing against each other, with other team mates behind adding their weight to the pushing.
In the front row of each team, the outer two guys are " props" who support the weight of their central front rower. He is the hooker, who tries to control the ball with his feet when it goes into the scrum, and hook it back to his team mates behind him in the scrum, from where it will be passed on to the outfield players and play resumes.
Thanks Paul, I appreciate the help!
@@RobReacts1 and us front row types are a law unto ourselves. I did my Level 1 Referee course about 16 years ago to help with coaching juniors. When we did the session on reffing the Scrum the instructor ( who happened to by my Club’s rep on the Greater Manchester and Cheshire Referees committee) asked me to tell everyone what I, as a Tighthead Prop (no. 3) would do in the first scrum:
“Nut the loose head as we go down, twist him underneath me and drive up on his neck”. There was about 30 seconds of silence from all the backs.
7:31, 'it's a penalty against you' and then the player holds his hand out to shake the ref's hand.
law 26 in rugby reads "the referee is the soul judge of fact" ie the ref is right even when he is wrong
He has the whistle!
there is this old joke in my country , about refs , thought u might like it :
Lucifer and God get together to talk about playing a game of football(soccer) against each other. God agrees and tries to warn Lucifer:
- Lucifer, i'm all for it, but the best players are in Heaven , you guys don't stand a chance!!
- Yeah, u might have the players, but the referees ? :D
haha! The man with the wistle!
Not directly related to this,but the most incredible refereeing performance ever was the last 25 minutes or so of France v Wales in 2017. Barnes had to deal with an incredibly complex set of circumstances and did it brilliantly without making a single error despite the intense pressure he was under from both sides.
The thing about Barnes is that he isn't a full time referee. His day job is as a barrister. On a daily basis he has to think on his feet and work through complex situations and rules/laws.
I seem to only now be discovering these videos Rob. Sorry about that! Barnesy is another example of a clear, decisive and calm referee. He sets the tone and holds people to it. Very supportive of new referees and young match officials (YMO). Has been a regular in society and regional development events.
One part of the video I'd like to call out please? All of us in the game, and especially those of us officiating, have to safeguard player safety. In the compilation, you saw Wayne spot a player looking slightly odd and he intercepted him, told him to wait a minute and called the doctor on for a HIA. That is not only excellent observation but quick reaction. Exactly what we all need to be doing. Player safety is our first and final concern.
Interesting you picked up on him being descriptive - may be his profession shining though. Wayne happens to be a practicing and well credentialed barrister.
Just on some of your questions: The refs speak to the captains because technically no other player is allowed to speak to the ref - obviously if the ref wants a word with someone in particular they'll speak to them but the only players who are allowed to give backchat or question the decisions of the ref are the captains.
As for the scrum rules. The front row of the scrum on each team is made up of two props and a hooker in the middle. If one of these players is sent off with a card then at the next scrum that team must substitute on another player who specialises in this role in order for the scrums to still be contested as the position is seen as too dangerous to be done without specialised training.
In the clip you saw, wasps (team in yellow) had their hooker yellow carded and off the field while their replacement hooker was injured. The coach said that one of their props was happy to play at hooker, however the player disagreed (good refereeing btw to actually check with the player). Therefore, wasps couldn't field a full front row of specialist players so the scrums were changed to be 'uncontested' meaning that there would be no pushing and the team that puts the ball in would be guaranteed to win.
Thats really interesting. So is the hooker normally the biggest and strongest player? ie, he is the one pushing and being supported by others.
@@RobReacts1 He's not necessarily the biggest and strongest (it tends to be the props either side of the hooker who have the hardest and more technical role in the scrum) but it does require specialist training to play in any role in the front row. therefore it is unsafe for just anyone to hook as their not used to the balance and may loose their footing that could cause the scrum to collapse which can be very dangerous.
@@RobReacts1 the front row normally have no neck to speak of... a scrum consists of the forwards (eight men each side) and both sides push and shove to gain the ball (the hooker would try to get the ball with his feet and kick it to the other end of his side of the scrum where it is picked up by one of the backs) so basically the weight of the opposite scrum (easily 600+ kilograms) rest on the shoulders of the three front row players and it is quite obvious why this could lead to severe neck injuries if you are not proper trained...
You missed an important aspect of the refs job at 10:49 the safety of players after a head collision. Whilst you were still talking about the earlier sending 3 people off incident Wayne Barnes stopped play and got the medics on the pitch at once.
Sorry yes I did see that but I was probably on a tangent haha. Thanks for pointing that out 🙂
3.15 - A bit of context - When a player is tackled (knee on the ground is the definition of a tackle) they must do one of two things. 1) Pass the ball or push it in any direction apart from forward. 2) Straight release of the ball on the ground by placing it in any direction.
They also have to move away or make an attempt to or get up. They may not prevent the opposition gaining possesion of the ball.
in this part, the tackled player in grey doesn't release the ball preventing the player in black from gaining possession. Penalty offence - Holding on shown by the secondary signal of crossed arms pulled towards the chest. What isn't shown in the clip is Black 10 and Wayne Barnes having a bit of banter together.
5.08 - The REFEREE is the sole arbiter of fact and law in a match. The CAPTAIN is responsible for his team's discipline; that's why we normally speak to the captain first. If he doesn't pass the message on then we start escalating...
Thanks for the extra details. Much appreciated!
@@RobReacts1 No problem. Been refereeing for 16 years after stopping playing. If you need an answer then feel free to message.
@@PropBoyGinge I'm looking forward to watching tomorrow's game to put the examples and details into actual moving images 🙂
The ref is can stop the clock which allows him to explain his decision to the players /allow captains to talk to their teams
Sadly football players don't seem to like the time is takes when we try and explain things to then. 🤣
Seems like Rob would make a great rugby referee
Aha I keep getting told to switch! Im going to try and learn more about the game first so its not too much of a leap if I do try and swithc...IF! haha
The respect you talk about in rugby also extends to the supporters. Fans are mixed in the stadium the beer flows,great banter.in 30 years old going to games ive never seen a fight or even bad blood between the fans.get yourself to twickenhan for the autumn internationals.
I think it's crazy that fans can sit with other team fans;
Rugby referees are talking to players throughout the game trying to manage and be proactive to keep the game going
you misunderstood Wayne Barnes the asking for a yellow card is to do with the player mouthing off, not him asking another player to be carded.
Oh really. Well I'm sure it's the same in both sports that it's unsporting to try and get another player carded.
@@RobReacts1 agreed :)
As an ex football referee I gave yellow cards to players who waved an imaginary card at me three times in my career twice at Level 6 and once at Level 5. It should definitely be stamped on more often though.
I sin binned a player at the start of this season for clapping sarcastically at the lino(who was one of the club's weekly helpers) 🤣 little fuckers
The law says that if there are multiple transgressions after another, like one team is offside but the other team does something really bad, the worse, most of the times both transgression is punished, not the first gets penalty but the worst one gets possession
I think the reason why captains will actually speak to their teams is because of how important penalties, and by exstention the ref is to to the match. Every match official will have a different interpretation of the laws, and it is vital the every player understands what the ref will and won't tolerate.
With the complexity of the game and the number of laws there are you could probably find a foul every 10 seconds at minimum, but most of them aren't given because they don't affect the flow of the match. Different referees draw the line of when an infringement becomes penalisable at a different point and, if both teams are breaking different laws at the same time, will have differing opinions on what foul is worse and should be penalised.
For example in the Nigel Owans video you watched there was a clip where one team had been holding a player in the air too long but the other team didn't let the man get to ground before tackling them. It was the second team that was punished as Nigel sees dangerous play as worse than cynical play. The first team were told not to do that again and he left it at that. Another ref might say that the cynical play was worse than the dangerous play as the jumper would have been safely on the ground before the tackle was made had he not been held up by his team.
Interesting. Thanks
The elite level refs get to know the players around the world as they ref test matches of the tier 1 nations. This lends to a much more comfortable reffing style. Unlike most other sports, because the elite club is quite small, the fans also get to "know" the refs and most have their favourites and villians
There are certainly the 'Villians' in the Premier League at the moment :P
I was at the Northampton vs Leicester Final, Dillion calling someone a "F**king cheat was clearly audible on ref mike, he claims he was talking to a player rather than the ref, but only he knows how true that was.
Goode and Barnes are really good friends.
It's one of those things that only he knows who he directed it at.
@@RobReacts1 Dillon pretty much admitted on a podcast that he let his emotions get the better of him, he even made a comment that he was thankful that wayne is as professional as he is and doesn't bare grudges.
Really enjoying your reactions Rob
Football is the reason why my lads play Rugby and Cricket!
Predominantly because of stories I heard of touchline parents shouting at children
But also the disrespect of the officials, the children see it in the premier league and copy it.
I do apologise for offending the biggest sport in the world.
Only if players coaches and parents would learn from rugby, the best sport in the world!
As the old saying goes, yes we’ve all heard it.
Football is a gentleman’s game played by hooligans!
Rugby is a hooligans game played by Gentlemen!
Keep the videos coming “Sir” 👍👍👍
Haha thanks bud! Yea it's bad and kids need to learn as they watch the professionals on the TV!
In the world of football the players DEMAND RESPECT but NEVER give it. In rugby you don’t have to ask
You put that perfectly. Give all the abuse to the ref and as soon as the ref even speaks with authority it ends up with..."you can't talk to us like that"
You can be descriptive because the match clock will be stopped, so no time is lost. IMO it make more sense than football when there's a rush cos the they are loosing time
I suggest you watch the video of Wayne Barnes telling the story of getting into Australia without a passport - it’s on RUclips !
I got recommend that yesterday. Was very funny and typical referee banter!
Also watch WB taking Nigel Owens on a roller coaster.
Barnes has improved massively in recent years. He started out being very, very "law" specific and was guilty of creating a very "stop/start" game. He's lightened up significantly with experience.
Hooker is a very specific skill set - they are in the middle of the scrum and have quite a bit of responsibility for the safety of the scrum - if either a prop or a hooker get taken off the field for injury or card, then, as they are specialists, you have "uncontested" scrums where the 2 packs bind down but don't push or put pressure on each other. This wasn't the case when I played many, many years ago as players were far smaller and lighter (in general) so the pressure on the front rows was nowhere near as heavy and, as long as you were fit and strong, you could play prop or hooker.
It is the same with football in a sense that refereeing strictly to the law can cause more issues.
Very true. He never used to let the game flow but he has improved dramatically is now about as good as it gets.
Yeah absolutely.. reminded me of an old school teacher. Black and white. Stop start. But now I enjoy his games. Has been one of world rugby's go to referees for the last decade.
@@davidhough5288 to be fair all referees still learn from their experiences. The ups and downs help make us all better
@@RobReacts1 absolutely.. I enjoy your reacts to referees. JP Doyle is another great referee with good communication. And also another good RUclips video is refereeing masterclass. Regarding Nigel Owens and his TMO. Brilliant to watch. Give it a look
About your comment about referee's position in a game : it is fair to say that player must understand that the referee is part of the game and need to be positionned somewhere that might affects player's moves but there is also a problem in rugby, it is that offensive team often target the referee's area to destabilize the defence (as an "extra screen"). Not defending the guy who pushed the referee, nothing acceptable, but the issue with targeting referee's area will have to be addressed at some point by world rugby
Fair statement you make! I understand sometimes refs can 'be in the way' during play and accidents happen. Its worse for referees as we're not expecting any impact, same as in football, so because we're not expecting it, it always feels worse.
you could make a 24hr compilation of Wayne Barne's decisions because he never stops blowing his bloody whistle! he's better now but that man has ruined more rugby games. A few years ago if he was reffing I wouldnt bother watching the game unless it was one I really cared about ;-) All the good points you mentioned were always there, the other side was screaming at the telly, "stop blowing that fucking whistle"
Aha
Different character to Nigel Owens but rugby benefits from clear decisions by the referee (even if they are occasionally wrong)
Can't get everything right I suppose 🤣
The vast majority of rugby matches are reffed by teachers, as a result, the relationship between players and refs is very much like a pupil teacher relationship. You also seen refs expressing admiration for good pieces of skill. And at schoolboy level the reffing can border on coaching. We also have a mercy rule at junior level, where a 50point lead ends the game. Before it gets to that it's very common for the sides to swop players the even up the competition. It just leads to an entirely different mindset and relationship.
I help referee u14-u16s and i am always doing my best to help then and explain so they are then better behaved and know the laws better than the adults. I also run a children's football coaching company.
Wayne Barnes is an exceptional referee, despite his occasional inability to determine whether or not a pass is forward (illegal in rugby) during high pressure games.
I think he did well in last night's match
If you are a Kiwi, you need to develop a bit o' perspective
🤡
Thanks for another great vid and reaction
Glad you enjoyed
Another reason for refs to be more descriptive is because the laws are really complicated.
football offside rule v the 5 around rucks alone? 😂
He is also a working barrister.
Football needs to bring in the 'Time off' like rugby, gives the ref time to explain and deal with a situation, also a lot less play acting from tackles etc, no injury time needed if the time is not running.
Yea certainly an argument for iy
I've watched European Cup games in which WB will easily switch between speaking French and English depending on which player/team he's speaking with at the moment. That's really impressively imo.
Some people can barely speak their native language! :D
Allan Rolands an Irish ref from some years ago was equally skilled in language and was regularly given the whistle for French games.
@@iallso1 how cool is that!
Please get a better mic. I thought the last video I watched was a one off soundwise. Otherwise, great videos.
Thanks for the advice. Its a step up from my original videos. Im now using a Streamcam. But i will invest in a standalone mic at some point :)
Tbh this vid doesn't do a lot of his stuff justice, like how he learnt French for when he refs French sides so he can explain decision better so that they aren't at a disadvantage compared to English speaking sides.
Or how he stops play very quickly when there is an injury
oh i did hear how he can speak french. Thats so good of him!
11:32 - England No.8 won't shut up, his team mates take him away as they know 1.) Wayne will card him if he continues and 2.)The RFU will back Wayne
We need the FA to back us referees!
@@RobReacts1 Yep. The behaviour of the players is driven/limited by their experience of the outcomes, if they know the ref is powerless in certain areas (backchat, mobbing him etc) then they will do it, the higher the stakes the more likely the behaviour.
I played rugby, occasionally to a 'not totally shit' level, for 35 years - the clear, consistent and supported consequences is what kept the behaviours in line
@@RobReacts1 Yep - clarity of guidance and high profile backing of consequences, then not backing down when a prem team pressurises them.
Without that, nothing will change
I can not stand Reaction videos, but yours are worth the watch.
Well I will take that as a compliment
@@RobReacts1 a compliment it is.
Came across your videos recently. Excellent. Do you think football referees will ever get this amount of respect?
Honestly, no never. The FA and FIFA ect dont have any real intention of sorting these issues!
Unlike football the ref can stop the clock if needs be, I once went to a game which lasted over 100 minutes for a 80 minute game, also after the half time or full time whistle play carry’s on until the ball is out of play. One last thing what’s your view of the the ref being miked-up so everyone knows what’s happening.
I dont mind the idea. As long as the decisions arnt then being questioned by the pundits after the game!
@@RobReacts1 They need educating that the Ref is the law on the pitch we may not like the decision but except it, especially if they understand why the decision was made. This is the England manager speaking to the media after losing to Wales ruclips.net/video/0x52v_TGFv4/видео.html I couldn’t imagine a football manager being like him.
Bad law but it's a law. Let's think the new handball law the new offside law
The issue of where the ref is standing is very important, the team in yellow were in defence, he was blocking the defensive line’s view of the opposition, which gives the attacking side an advantage.
This is true, however, it would of be quicker, easier and more respectful to simply ask him to move rather than come offside to shove him out of the way. How many breakdowns are there in a game, the ref isn't going to get their position perfect on everyone one.
@@ItsLithium as a player I’ve done both, but at that level the ref should know better.
You should react to positions in rugby
Can you react to rugby referees compilations? There’s a few of them on here all with great referees from around the world.
All you need to know is that Wayne hates Northampton Saints xD
Oh come on im sure he doesnt 😂
@@RobReacts1 have a butchers at a few more videos. but yes i am tottaly biased lol
Love these vids
Cheers man! I'm scared to do non-rugby vids now!
The issue with getting out the way here is the defenders want to be able to see what the attack is doing, the ref was in the way (it's hard in rugby because almost anywhere you stand will be problematic in some way). However, in this instance, the player shoves Wayne Barnes, which is why it was a penalty. Can't touch the ref like that.
Yea makes complete sense! This is the thing, its not like the players cant see the referee, we wear different colour kit in all sports!
hope there is one of these for Romain Poite
yes... quality ref
Dylan Hartley,the guy he red carded for abuse, received a 3 month ban and missed out on the Lions tour (a once every 4 years British & Irish combined team) . A huge punishment, and a reminder to everyone that if you go after the ref, then the consequences can be severe, no matter your status as a player
That really is a HUGE punishment. I'm assuming he thought before he spoke from then on!
@@RobReacts1 At the time the comment that Wayne B heard was 'you f-ing cheat'. Dylan has always said it was directed at one of the opposition.
It did however clearly & globally reinforce that abuse of the ref is not tolerated at any level.
I think that message was received across all levels of the game
So, would you rather be a football referee or a rugby referee?
Well I am a football referee and I know nothing about rugby. However, IV had loads of comments saying I should switch. I'm going to try and get into watching it and understanding rugby first. Then who knows! 😋
In football if you've made a decision that goes against one team and there shouting at you why cant you give them cards? It feels like football referees have no respect from players.
We can give them a card. At the lower leagues we now have sin bins for dissent which are effective!
It’s been interesting following your journey into rugby, do you think once you are back refereeing after lockdown any of this will change your approach to refereeing a football game or how you react to the players behaviour/attitude on the field?
I would certainly like to try. IV got a video coming out tomorrow at 4 or 5pm reacting to rugby ref complication. It's quite a long video because I stop and talk about every incident. At the end I say how I want to try and implement some things. If they work then great and if they don't then at least I tried. I actually got my first appointment today for the restart. Saints u16 Vs Chelsea u16 in the middle with 2 linos. So that will be really good and a decent standard!
@@RobReacts1 I look forward to seeing the video, all the best for the upcoming games!
I don’t think football have too many “bad laws”. However some referees interpretation of the laws is absolutely shocking. Especially when they can see real-time/slow mo replays.
I do agree that the interpretation of laws isnt always great. However, maybe its a case that the laws arnt very clear? Just a thought.
Totally disagree with your comments about talking to the players as play goes on, I often find myself just telling a players I saw something, or maybe I want them to calm down stop doing something. I think that refs actions from both codes do very similar things it’s just the reaction and respect that is the biggest difference. I do not ref at a high level, but even at my level the respect is there and having the captains on your side is a massive part of making sure that you can control the game. Interesting stuff though.
Your comment toward the end about doing what you say is also really important, never ever tell a player/team you’ll be reffing in a certain way because you’ll definitely find yourself in a position where you don’t do what you said you’d do. Also I have changed a decision when I realised it was wrong, not many once maybe twice but 9n both occasions both teams were totally happy with the outcome.
Ok that's cool. I appreciate the comment.
I don't think it's an actual rule but you are taught that only the captain speaks to the referee and if you have any issues you tell your captain and he'll pass it on. And the other way of course
I would also very much love to see a video of you discussing laws you might think are bad and an analysis of why you think that and your suggestions to improve said laws
I agree I would love to see that in football--discussion goes through the captain. Allied to that if a player does 'lose it' with the referee he won't get any support from his team-mates except they will drag him away before he digs himself in even deeper
I would enjoy football a lot more if their referees would toughen up on player behaviour. The way players crowd referees after a decision needs to be dealt with, a couple of yellow cards and an occasional red card would soon sort them out. Stop the game and talk to the captains to give them warnings. Stop treating them like the overpaid prima donnas they seem to be.
I agree, but please watch my video on why its not so straight forward as that being a football referee. ruclips.net/video/4GD6xddGlmU/видео.html
Make a rugby player a football ref., and then change the cards to: yellow, red, punch in the face.
@@danpearce4547 haha brilliant!
Geoff, I've been saying this for years. It's time refs were able to hand out warnings to players for misbehaving and disrespecting the ref's decision.
Intimidation of football referees starts at grassroots with parents throwing abuse at them. That’s where the rot starts and needs to be stopped. The referees need support from their organisation.
What are your thoughts on the latest decisions/controversy with VAR in the Prem at the moment? So many clear errors have been made
As a saints fan IV been fuming that VAR hasn't told the referee that players keep diving! Even when Nathan Tella dived, he should have been booked(and he's a saints player)
@@RobReacts1 That is one of many and it seems incredibly foolish - many minutes being spent looking at millimeter offsides but then complete indecision with clear-cut fouls. I'm a rugby fan and watching the football fail to implement something like the TMO is crazy - football is far less messy as well.
Football and rugby are so different I think it’s hard to compare
I think the current culture and discipline problems in football makes it near on impossible to referee like a rugby ref.
3 months late and may have been mentioned already but in the lower levels only the captains can talk to the ref.
haha always appreciated still. Its a great concept that would be good in football
@@RobReacts1 It's to stop a team crowding a ref trying to influence. If there is a decision they don't like. takes the intimidation factor out of the game.
if you like George Carlin a good video to react to is baseball vs football, very funny. and of course, Abbott and Costello who's on first is still the best comedy routine about sports.
You had the sizing of the views wrong. I wanted to watch the rugby, not look at three quarters of a screen of you, scanned through and saw it was same all the way through so left vid after 1 min 18 secs.
You need to look at the channel name... What you find if I am small in the corner is that I end up cutting out bits of the video I'm watching and then the viewer misses bits. Thanks for your feedback however, I think you have missed the point.
@@RobReacts1 Thank you for your reply However, there are three of us watching here and we saw the Owens react video, we thought that was ok and decided to watch another, but within a minute we all looked at eachother and Phils words were, "is this a Rob appreciation video or a rugby video". Bottom line, three lost viewers, we may be a drop in the ocean, but there may well be others who think the same and just switch channels without taking the time to comment, and they won't show up on your stats.
In fairness to football refs. I get the feeling that if they spoke to players in a similar way then they'd get the players, the clubs, the media, and then ultimately the FA all jumping on their backs about the injustice. I know we always say that the standard of reffing is a lot higher in rugby, but football refs get hung out to dry all the time... they also get treated like crap.
"you can't talk to us like that" they say to us...after barraging us with questions they don't want answers to, disagreeing and general dissent! 🤣
The art of rugby refereeing is almost an constant narrative to the players that facilitates the game and the ability to not give any ground when you apply the rules. The great refs stand out.
I've got another video for you Rob, Wayne having a bit of fun at Nigel's expense - ruclips.net/video/Qz48ClAquzI/видео.html. (A word or two of explanation: - the Bledisloe is the Bledisloe Cup, contested by Australia and New Zealand and the three guys he refers to in the audience are all Aussie TV commentators).
You are right about the stop/go nature of rugby. It hadn't occurred to me how much more time is available for rugby refs to interact with players. Obvious when you point it out!
Il give it a watch!
Haha nice bit of banter between refs!
I think it's a shame you skipped the double red card situation with Ayerza and Marler. For me as at football referee that was such an eye opener on how you can handle a potentially very difficult situation.
I was probably going off on a tangent about the previous situation and missed it. I try my best for it to be my initial thoughts as it's the first time watching the video.
Looks like you either skipped it or edited it out. It's the bloke with the haircut. It's just him for one second and then there's something else.
@@barteksvaberg4403 Ah i know exactly what you mean. That was the only tiny bit that was infringing copyright so i was given the option to auto-trim that bit out!
@@RobReacts1 Oh, what a bummer. You have seen it yourself, though, right?
@@barteksvaberg4403 yes mate.
Rob, you make much of the difference between soccer and rugby in terms of stop start, and say this is why you cant really stop the game to lecture someone but rather you may run alongside them and "have a word" but I rather think this misses the point. If yo stop the game, and publicly lecture someone (obviously if the situation warrants it) then this is witnessed by the whole 22 players on the pitch, the support staff on the sidelines and the crowd (post-COVOD). This then get a message across that you will not be messed about - and the subject of your dressing down probably ends up being very self conscious as the centre of attention for possibly 10s or 100s of thousands of people. Try it sometime - it would set an interesting precedent. I also think soccer would benefit from the "10 m! rule. If you get backchat, or the players infringe the 10m at a free kick then you should have the ability to mover the free kick 10m up the field. If that then takes in into the penalty area then so be it - they would soon stop doing it then!
When I say about running alongside players to warn them, that's just the warning. If action is needed then we obviously stop play. But it's the sort of thing we are taught to do.
@@RobReacts1 The point I was trying to make Rob is that a single, public early intervention could well set the tone for the entire game however, I acknowledge that you are the referee so whatever you say is correct! :) You can probably tell which of the two games I played!
@@samday9328 haha I do agree with you mate! And I'm not saying we don't. But because we are taught the 'stepped approach' it's not something that's done early in a game. But I agree it should be. But I think that goes with how the FA should be back to discipline players properly and not take any shit.
@@RobReacts1 These people need to be shown that the game is far more important than the individual!
Rob I wonder if there are any things you can take away from these vids that you can use in football refereeing?
I would love to say there is but i honestly dont think there is because of the 'culture' or football. Most of the time there isnt any point in explaining decisions like in rugby because players dont want to listen. As explained in my other video about the difficulties of being a football ref, we cant discipline for dissent in the same way even if we would like/need to. Its really frustrating because im seeing what football should be, but will never actually be. If all that makes sense?!
@@RobReacts1 yeah I totally get you. Can you still move free kicks back 10m for dissent? Do you think making the ref mics part of live broadcast would help?
@@alistairbeverley12 no you can't move a free kick position. I think it would help for sure. It would probably stop players foul language for starters. As long as the pundits don't then go and question everything the refs say.
One thing I’d like to ask is, have you learnt anything new and will you adapt it for football??
Good question. The problem is I think it's hard to do the same things in rugby. Speaking manor, discipline etc because the football culture and support from FA just isn't the same. Im certainly on the side that Rugby are doing things much better!
@@RobReacts1 I agree, sadly FA just want easy rules but forget they can make football better. The VAR system is only now starting to view off ball incidents instead of offside & goal line action but, the forth ref must look out for cheating. Football has got into a rut ever since foreign players brought their bad gameplay here years ago, they may have taught skills with the ball here but, also cheating to get free kicks nearer goal and fouls to get players sent off....over acting the foul where the real players get up and carry on....it’s now being taught in schools and this MUST be stopped....
Wayne is also a barrister
The thing about a "competent hooker" is an outcome of the changes to the game since it's professionalization.
The big problem comes from the abandonment of enforcing proper foot placement in the front row.
The props used to be required to 'close off the tunnel' between them by stepping forward with their outside foot. This put a foot under their center of gravity which helped them keep their feet at the cost of some forward push. Now they keep their feet well back to push which makes any wobble dangerous. Players that have spent a certain amount of practice time at those positions are now required in the front row. What exactly is required is unknown to me as I predate this crap and, evidently, even the coaches and front row players of today don't know what is required evidenced by the fact that the coach said he was competent and the player didn't think he was.
Thats really interesting to know. Thank you!
The fact is the t front row of the scrum is very specific in term of strength.
Any player at these position must be well prepared so as to avoid any risk of injuries.
Then if you have a lack of prop or hooker, they won't be any contested scrum. They will be 16 layers that will be mocking the position.
@@kwaxix You know it didn't use to be that way. Only since they changed the way the tight 5 scrummages has it become necessary to 'specialize" front row players. Scrums were much more stable and resolved in seconds.
It's about footing not push.
Players were not only under an obligation to not collapse but they were not allowed to cause their opponent to collapse either.
@@rittherugger160 indeed, but the change in the rule (the tempo of the 3 commandments) is to minimize the impact. More technic, less injuries.
As I don't play anymore I didn't notice the change in the foot positioning.
@@rittherugger160 I fully agree. Scrums changed from being a restart to the game to being the opportunity to win a penalty causing there to be an arms race in the tight 5. If you watch the 2003 world cup final back, it's startling how quick the scrums are compared with today.
What do you think about the idea of football refs having mics? I don’t see what the issue is. It’s new standard in rugby for years. What’s the problem
I think it's a good idea. Firstly it may stop some of the abuse of refs at the top level as the mics will pick up the players. But secondly the decisions from the ref should not then be scrutinized by the pundits after.
@@RobReacts1 agreed. What’s the reasoning behind the counter arguments. I heard some referees said they didn’t want to be micd up.
@@andrewbaird8219 erm. Maybe the sound of their voice. The fear of saying something they shouldn't to the world?!
@@RobReacts1 surely knowing that they are micd up, they’d think about what they are saying. Plus in discussion with players what exactly are they going to say that they fear. The benefits of having mics so that the FA and refereeing authorities can witness first hand the abuse and tone of situations instead of hearing about it after the fact with none of the context. Rugby refs have had the mics for years both at international level and domestic and I can’t think of the last time a ref said something that put them in hot water live.
Love the vids tho. Very interesting. I’ve played rugby for years, switched from football when I was 18. It amazes me when I first started playing rugby the difference in the manner you deal with the ref. I laughed when I was told I had to refer to the ref as “sir” it felt really weird. Just became second nature after a while tho
Another great reaction
Thanks man!
@@RobReacts1 no problem Wayne Barnes is actually officiating the Italy and wales game tomorrow 😂
WB gets many 50/50 decisons wrong, blowing the whistle early and too often. All rugby refs should have to justify the decision after the match if requested by a team
I disagree. I don't think a referee should have to justify their decisions after the match. Although being mic'ed up is brilliant
Why do you disagree, would only make decisions more transparent and only if a team requests it
@@johnkeegan8712 I think if the ref is mic'ed up then he is normally explaining to the players when he gives the decision.
@@RobReacts1 ref has already blown the whistle then tells the players. That's not explaining the reason for the decision That's telling the players "I've made a decision" now go away.
The french refs are pretty good at communicating just never make the right decisions
Oh man do you remember how Poite was some years ago? Wouldn't even explain to the captain why a penalty was given. He would just ignore them. He got so much better at that
@@emilyc9240 poite should of been sacked years ago
you should react to nhl referees!
I'm sure it's something I will do
Goodey
If you tell the captain about a problem with one of their team and they do nothing then the subsequent red and yellow cards are the fault of the captain. You're a player down? Tough shit, do your job.
Aha I'm trying to use the captain's more when reffing football...well the one game back we've had
What are your thoughts on football referee's being mic'd up like rugby referee's so fans and pundits can hear what's being said?
I dont have a problem with that. But it requires pundits to change. The pundits always say they want to hear why the refs make the decisions, so if they do then they should then start debating it.
Great and Wayne Barnes should not be in the same sentence.
Aha that's what's so wonderful. Everyone has an opinion. I'm glad you expressed it as I sure do! 🙂
Things that need to happen in football
Mic up the ref so that all interaction is heard, this will show what info you are giving to the players.
Grow balls and card player back chat.
Learn from rugby VAR and don't turn it into a sterile scientific line drawing exercise. 1 line if unsure its a goal.
You should watch my video on the difficulties of being a football ref. It may show you some things that you don't know about. It's not quite as simple as booking and sending everyone off.
React to rugby respect moments😊
I mean it's nice he's taking things for him to use in soccer but it's not because those a great refs.its rugby.thats what makes the difference.players don't need to pretend to be tough guys by insulting the ref. They're rugby players. enough said.
Go on then, I'll do it. What are the bad laws?
haha someone had to ask. Glad to see you were actually watching! :D
Firtly, this one is preference for me as a referee. I dont like that the gk can now pass to their player inside the penaltie box for goalkicks. Its lead to not so good teams trying to pass the ball out from the back and just giving the ball away! And as a referee it means its harder for us to get our positioning right.
Secondly, the handball situation is a mess at the moment.
Offsides are a mess. Wenger had a good idea about if any part of your body that can score is behind the second to last defender then it should be offide.
Thats the most obvious i can think of which most people would understand.
@@RobReacts1 the offside one with VAR involvement for me is a funny one as the Wenger idea just moves the lines to a different place. Having thought about it over and over I think offsides needs to go back to the on pitch officials. Whatever they give goes either way unless the VAR can clearly call it by eye when looking at the replay. VAR is supposed to be about clear and obvious not forensic detective work. The lines have to go.
The hooker is in the middle of the front row of the scrum. Due to the technical nature of the front row players MUST be competent and capable for safety. The replacement hooker for Wasps was not happy to go contested so uncontested scrums would follow - whereby both packs of forwards would bind up and set but NOT apply pressure and shove against each other. Referees are in charge of the match. Originally only the captains were permitted to even request to speak to the ref.
Mr Barnes, like Mr Owens are top 5 of global referees respected worldwide.
Thanks for that bit of knowledge David. Now I know a little more! ☺️
To go a bit further, in rugby you have your starting hooker, and you must have a replacement on the bench (you have to have a replacement for each of the front row positions, due to the specific requirements). The Wasps prop had hooked before when he was younger, and at a lower level, which is probably why the team manager said he can do it. The prop himself decided it wasn't a great idea.
As a prop, I'd not want to play hooker, very different world, and a scarier one as your arms can't save you hitting the deck. Don't think my shoulders would let me anyway.
@@rugbydan761 spot on Dan. When I moved from the second row up to the front I learned how to hook but it was an absolute last resort!
Bring in the yellow card rule from rugby to football. Won’t happen because football has to much money involved.
The FA and FIFA etc have no intention on making things better
The FA and FIFA etc have no intention on making things better
The FA and FIFA etc have no intention on making things better
Rugby is a hard, tough, physical game played by hard tough physical blokes. The ref needs to be hard and to the point. The ref must control the game. Football is just running about kicking a ball and not dangerous, yes there are technical aspects to football but nowhere near as dangerous as rugby. I can understand how you, a football ref, can be confused by the calls made by a rugby ref.
Im doing my best to learn the laws and figure out why foul etc are being given.
I’m sorry if it looks as I have belittled you. I had no intention of doing that. Each to his own game, Rugby when played with a passion, is a very dangerous game and a ref needs to be spot on and not be intimidated by big, huge players. Players can suffer severe injuries if left to run riot.
Don’t get me wrong, some rugby refs make some awful decisions and penalties given that are shocking, but most refs take no bad language or other sorts of verbal abuse from players. Again please accept my apologies if I caused offence.
@@grahamsibbert2412 No no I didnt think that, I was just making the point that my Knowledge started at 0% a few weeks back but its been fantastic and enlightening to learn more about rugby and im doing my best to learn the laws etc. :)
Hello Rob. I would advise against sitting down reading the RFU rule book, it’s so complex and only really understood by playing the game.
Some refs calls look totally wrong, especially the Offside rule when a players foot can be judged in front of a player, but the views given on telly are so hard to work out. Another is Not Rolling Away, simple but an opposing player can, with a little skill cause that offence by giving the player no room to move etc etc etc. I would advise watching the new series of Utube vids by Nigel Owens, he sit down on his farm and answers viewers questions and is very clear in describing a lot of refs calls. In my opinion the top world ref now is Wayne Barns, followed by that little stocky fellow who’s name escapes me, he is another welsh ref too. First you had Derek Evans, then Nigel Owen and now Wayne. Sorry for going on and on, I guess you could say I am the sports greatest armchair fan/critic and at age 75 I can’t do much else. My favourite teams are 1. England. 2. Wales. 3. Australia.
@@grahamsibbert2412 So iv been getting more and more invested and iv been told I need to switch to reffing Rugby. Im learning the laws as im watching, but would happily sit down and read the laws(although Im a dreadful reader).
I’m starting to think that footballers have zero respect for there refs.
Well I already know they have no respect for us :D
Footballers have massive egos,Rugby players for the most part,don't.