TRAUMA: "I'm held by a hand with a scar."
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- Опубликовано: 1 июн 2019
- Shock trauma and process or cumulative trauma. My experience of being in a traumatized state but not knowing it. Regression into PS. But PS contains important elements that elude D. A split between thinking and feeling.
I plan to keep reading, teaching, and thinking or meditating on this topic.
So happy you recovered and are cancer free! I really appreciate your contribution to the field of psychology and love your videos! Keep them coming:)
Wishing you good health professor Carveth! Your work has had a tremendous impact on me and countless others
Thank you so much for sharing your experiences! My past work experiences in the cancer support community has added another layer of my emotion when I’m listening to your story... I’m so glad that you have recovered! Wish you good health Dr. Carver! I have been enjoying your lectures thanks to your work.
I remember reading Frankl early on and he had a big influence on me. I think we may be seeing the beginning of such a turn within psychoanalysis, or at least a greater openness, to spirituality already.
Don, thank you for all of your videos. you have taught me so much about how to be a better human being to myself and others.
I found your channel a few weeks ago. I have been watching your older lectures and really enjoying them. I'm so sad to hear that you were ill, but much relived to hear that you are better. I would love to see more videos on psychoanalysis and spirituality as that is an evolving interest of mine. Your channel has really helped me a lot on a personal level--and has also helped me further consider pursing a career as a psychotherapist--or maybe analyst one day. Look forward to hearing more from you and so glad you are doing better.
I feel so by touched hearing about your journey through recovery. Glad that you survived and continue to share your gift with us.
Prof Don Carveth...I just want to wish you well going forward. You have given me so many things to think about and wonder upon overs the years. My practice in Art Psychotherapy ( trained Msc Psychoanalytic Psych - trinity Dublin) are continuely nourished through your teachings. Thank you ! Wishing you continued strength. Heidi
Thank you for sharing your experiences! I worked in Cancer Support Community before, and your story added another emotional layer for me. I am SO glad you’re recovered. Wish you good health Dr. Carveth! Your lectures has been so important and inspiring for today’s psychotherapy world.
Jonas, thanks for your reply and thank you for reminding me of another statement by Wittgenstein: “of that of which we cannot speak, we must perforce remain silent.“ But I too find it difficult to remain silent!
I have been visiting your channel for for intellectual stimulation, for a virtual conversation with an insightful man, and for a breath of fresh air in our crazy world of constant "rat race". I am so grateful to you for all the work you put into these well crafted video essays. Please continue making and posting your videos: I bet there are a lot of people out there whom you help to dig deeper into themselves by sharing your thoughts and insights. I am one of them. Wishing you good health and many-many years of productive, interesting and happy life. Thank you, professor Carveth, and God bless you!
Thank you so much for your kind comments and wishes.
Oh gosh, I didn't know that you'd been ill! I wish you all of the best and a good recovery. Your videos have helped me a lot in my life and I just want to express my gratitude and hope that you're able to recover well from this cancer.
I’m very happy to hear this, thank you.
Thank you very much, Lei Sun.
Don you’ve been great for my mental health. I thank you for being so vulnerable and raw on camera. If I didn’t have your videos id be clueless. This video stirred up a lot of emotions for me ❤
So glad it helped
Thank you so much for all the teaching that you share, Professor Carveth, I am truly grateful for that. I find your open-minded yet critical views and thoughts about spirituality and religion very inspiring. Wish you all the best.
Charge, You are most welcome, thank you
Wish you well and thank you for your teaching.
There is more to life than work.
I read someone said that our anxiety drives us towards our goals, and when we get there we don't realise that.
I am so glad you did survive and you can continue to help us understand the labyrinth of our minds. Wishing u a very merry Christmas
Thank you and the same to you.
I’m so sorry to hear you have had such a traumatic time Don. I thought I’d watched all your videos before we met last year, but I only just got to this one. You continue to inspire and teach me so much as my psychoanalytic studies at BIrkbeck continue. I am so grateful to my God that you survived and are well. Wishing you all the best in figuring out what these extra 10 years (or hopefully 20) could be used for. Maybe just continuing these videos is enough? Thank you for everything. God bless.
Thank you, Kate
I would like to thank you for your candid sharing of personal trauma, and how difficult it is to confront the idea of death and our own mortality and frailty. To see the years ahead as an opportunity to give something back, is for me a very generous act. Your encounter with the female patient felt most beautiful. Having taken so much from your lectures I am delighted to know you are fully recovered. From the hills of Surrey, England, my best wishes.R
Thank you for these kind remarks and best wishes.
Thank you, I very much agree with what you say here. Best wishes.
It is indeed good to hear about your recovery! I was very taken by your open, honest and insightful account of it all.
Last time you published a video on Psychoanalysis and Spirituality we had a brief exchange in the comment section. I suggested that a transcendent position should be added on top of PS and D in order to allow for the incredibly open, unified and alive position that we normally associate with enlightenment and mystical experiences. Well that was apparently not your cup of tea back then.
Allow me to briefly contrast Psychoanalysis with Spirituality in terms of the nature of the respective professional inquiry.
To put it simply, psychoanalysis is concerned with the contents of the mind wheras Spirituality inquire into the nature of consciousness itself. Psychoanalysis thus deal with mental states, thoughts and emotions, that vary over time whereas Spirituality ideally deals with the formless presence, awareness itself, that never changes.
What is that formless presence? It is our primordial being, beyond name, form, thought and emotion.
If we explore this realm deeply enough experientially, not intellectually, we eventually plunge into the void, the mystery of the unknown.
It is very humbling for the ego to realize that thinking at this stage has come to an end. The analytical mind cannot get any foothold here. The openness is so vast and tangible that life becomes a shimmering mystery in the midst of ordinary life.
I am trying to encourage you -- should you continue to discuss spirituality -- to address the ineffable, non-conceptual nature of immediate experience, which is really the hallmark of Spirituality. I do find most of your analytical remarks on spiritual experiences rewarding, but those remarks also tend to throw the spiritual baby out with the bathwater.
Another way of framing the comparison would be to say that our essential being is at the very heart of both Psychoanalysis and Spirituality.
What is this primordial being?
I suggest that we do not and cannot know.
If we deeply understand this being we live in awe, beyond understanding.
Yours in discourse, Jonas
You are a treasure, careful, calm, thorough. I reap great benefit from your lectures. I am a Jungian in Los Angeles. It is vital and enhancing to the work, to go back to the developmental theories and remember…what resonates for me, was does not. I am a mother of five and grandmother of 3.
I am grateful you are healthy Don. Of course you went back to work…but the feeling function is too, the guide…it also allows us to make decisions, along with the thinking function.
May you live a long and healthy life. Warmest, Kriss Light
PS: Julie Miller duly noted 💕🎶
Thank you, Kriss. I am reading a bit of Jung and Jungians theae days.
Thank you very much.
So happy to hear you are recovering from this terrible trauma.
Happy you are well now!!!
Very interesting about that alarm call song and the signature. I find in work with people (Music Therapy or Psychoanalytical work) that when they start humming or singing something without words, the lyrics if they can be found are very meaningful. It's so much more meaningful too when an analyst can talk about their own experience, so refreshingly open and truthful - after all are we not searching always for the Truth - where the analyst can also face and be truthful, it makes psychoanalysis more down to earth, more human, more equal. Following this talk, I would rather be held by a hand with a scar, where the hand belongs to a warm human truthful being, than a scar-free hand belonging to a lofty, chilly, faceless being who hides from their own truth. Your presentation also highlights the importance of life long continually looking at our own selves as therapists and analysts, rather than after an analysis, waltzing off in a 'well that's me sorted' sort of way! May good health, thinking and puzzling, and longevity be yours. And thank you.
Thanks, Conrad,.
Thank you, Keira, I’m doing very well indeed these days.
Thank you.
Beautiful
Heidi,,Thank you, I’m happy to learn that you have found them helpful. Now that I am fully recovered I will soon be making more.
To hope...?
While disillusionment and disappointment, seem to haunt me.
I am having to go back right to the beginning in mental health in getting a job as a mental health care worker for the N.H.S , still encumbered with e-learning yet having done some many years of self-development but desperately longing to rejoin the psychotherapeutic and psychoanalytic community, I cannot afford even the assessment application fees let alone the first or second term costs which are said in the region of £2-3000 and time is running out as I am 60 or was yesterday.
This video reminds me why I hold to analysis and even depth psychotherapy as being currently the best or only method for the collaborative deconstruction of the deeply ingrained defensive tendencies we all hold against the truth, the truth which will eventually liberate us, if only we could let it.
This video simply inspires me, and I hope you to Don.
the Wisdom of a great analyst, the analyst as a "person" and matured practitioner of the art form of analysis.
ruclips.net/video/HRC6hqWstgM/видео.html
Thank you, I’m happy to hear you find them helpful. I’m planning a video on psychoanalysis and spirituality to be uploaded before too long.
I’m Very glad you have recovered. Your speech got me thinking about psychoanalysts and psychotherapists functioning as secular priests and healers but ones that do not promise immortality or miracles but armed only with only the promise of leaving adherents ‘ sadder but wiser ‘if you subscribe. I think therapists should acknowledge this quasi-religious or spiritual dimension to their work rather than to rationalise their endeavours under a carapace of pseudo scientific or medical empiricism. By consciously acknowledging this relation they will hopefully dis-identify from it, and from the potentially harmful ( to themselves and others) messianic and omnipotent fantasies.
Agreed
I think we may be seeing the beginning of such a turn already. I remember reading Frank l early on and it had a big influence on me.
How do you plan to hold onto this feeling/experience instead of letting it fall by the wayside?
Dear Jonas, I hear you. I agree with the need for a transcendent position beyond PS and D. In fact James Grotstein posited this some years ago. Certainly my own studies of eastern and western mystical traditions and Heidegger has led me to appreciate both the ineffable and the idea of the ground of Being. And, as my son keeps reminding me, I know that the Bodhisatva returns. Still:
“Beloved, let us love one another, because love comes from God. Everyone who loves has been born of God and knows God. Whoever does not love does not know God, because God is love.” St. Paul.
@Don Carveth. Yes, thanks indeed for your reply!
I didn't know of Grotstein's work. Oftentimes it is helpful when it comes to introspective explorations to be somewhat uneducated about academic theory, I gather. Prior to my journey I was very critical of e.g. Kleins work, based on methodological considerations. Eventually I discovered my root trauma, and there is was, the PS-position revealed itself phenomenologically.
The many years of grief that ensued eventually revealed the truth of D. However the presence that was there all the time also kept inviting me to explore objectless presence deeper and deeper. So the movement has always been deeper and beyond, in the name of openness that is.
Since I have a rather strong background in Philosophy of Science it was extremely important for me to take a good look within without too much guidance of theory. Now the inner exploration has reached a point where conceptualizations generally appear as limitations, although at times they may be helpful communication wise. But now I digress.Thanks for the reference.
Yes, God is love. But God is just another word for the ineffable. We can't even say that the mystery is a mystery. It is and it isn't. It is beneath and beyond all our categories. At some point this tendency to regurgitate the limits of the mind, a sin that I clearly commit above, becomes incredibly silly. And then it fades away to reveal the life that remains. The ineffable is after all just a recognition of reality from the point of view of the thinking mind.
I guess I am trying to say, concerning the T-position, that Wittgenstein's famous sentiment seems entirely appropriate to me:
We must throw away the ladder after having climbed up on it.
And yet for some strange reason I find myself drawn to speak about the unknown, effectively pointing to the ladder itself.
I do look forward to hearing more from you on Psychoanalysis and Spirituality!
Yours in discourse, Jonas
I haven't read the more critical biographies so I don't know to what extent Freud's long battle with oral cancer may have purportedly had on his patient work in terms of his psychological state, but needless to say he kept producing fascinating texts during the period! And it's interesting that his pet project in the later years ("Moses and Monotheism") was also on a "spirituality / psychoanalysis" cross-over topic.
Interesting, I myself first begin to reclaim my childhood face when in my 30s I had my first analysis.
I was traumatized as a 12 years old boy when I was about to be circumsized. I thought they were going to give the anastesia via breating yet while I was sitting on the bed in the hospital 5 bulky men and a couple of nurses with my Dad all of a sudden rushed into the room shouting and giving orders and they held my arms and legs whilst I was cursing and crying calling my dad and the doctors liars and sons of ****. then 5 of them held me turned me around pushed me into the bed and put a needle of sedatives into my buttocks with today i can still feel its pain. when I woke up I was totally different person. My psyche was torn apart and for 10 years I was not aware how a sedated life I was living. I was passified and assaulted. That what I lived is a true castration nightmare. I have lost all the trust I have had for my dad my mother and other people, at that time I could not process the cruelty and animosity that was projected on to me and called a pink lie. Today i am recovering out of it bit by bit with EMDR and psychotherapy and I am also studying to become a psychologist.
I’m interested in how Victor Frankl applies here. Frankl was a living example of survival in hellish ordeals having decided to not escape Nazi occupied Vienna and spend time with his family in the death camps. He had death, disease, abuse and human rights violations all around him. He managed to keep going and quoted Nietzsche’s phrase “he who has a strong enough why can bear any how.” He labelled his method of psychotherapy logotherapy. Logos refers to meaning and even has divine connotations with Christ (who happened to have scarred hands and is a Comfortor to those enduring trials and tribulations). His book Man’s Search For Meaning rarely gets quoted in analytic literature but is a best seller and isn’t out of print! It’s sold over 10 million copies. His book documents numerous spiritual experiences and is very inspiring. Has anyone read this? What do you think? I know most post-Freudian sneer at spiritual experiences and have the master’s stance of being irreligious (but don’t often share his similar view on art). Thanatological life experiences often are the seedbed for the stirring up of the spirit. C.S Lewis famously said I don’t have a soul I am a soul and juxtaposed this with people attitudes on having a body but not being just a body. Jung and Freud also fell out over this. Could psychoanalysis have a relational turn towards the Spirit, the Father and Jesus or is this too much for most ardent atheists or wary agnostics to still consider?
shock trauma for me! :( ... so happy you are cancer free... are you okay now?
Dr. Carveth is well, thank you for reaching out.
Woohoo cancer free!
You can kind of lose track of time in trauma states. And I think trauma states are 'for the coastline'.. in other words.. I don't live near a beach, the nearest waves are a good hour away, but sometimes when I am out walking I wish I was walking on a beach. The roaring sound of the tumbling waves, et al., just so inexplicably timeless, and headache-overriding.
Interesting point. Although he claimed the horse was dead, he couldn’t stop eating it.
I think the problem has to do with reason and rationality. There is probably a way to conceive of depressive position functioning as transcending reason. I personally have had difficulty with this. I think there is much in what you say about God as the third, etc, I have a problem with any fees that is not accompanied by day out.
Don Carveth, I think i might find the idea less perplexing because i don’t come from a judéo-chrisrian tradition and maybe not so familiar with the biblical stories though they are referenced in the Quran. What stands out for me is that the Quranic text invites the reader to constantly use reason to find the truth, so in my mind faith and reason go hand in hand. But I will also keep meditating on the topic. And thank you for taking the time to reply.
@@lailaalattar417 The core notion in Islam, though, is submission, which clearly sets Islamic faith in opposition to reason. I am not saying that the other organised religions are necessarily different in this respect, just what is the case with Islam. Of course it would be possible to claim, circularly, that it is rational to submit to God, the Imam, the Quaran, the Haddits, the village ruler and the householder, but then we are discussing a notion of rationality altogether foreign to critical thinking, which is at the heart of western philosophy of rationality and enlightenment.
Jonas Hjerpe, thank you for your reply. The notion of submission in “Islam” means entering willingly into the peace of God. The recognition of God is similar to Freud’s description of the unconscious, that he can’t show it to us but everything points towards it. From an object relational perspective, submission to this unlimited source of everything is a freeing experience because in the same way the ego realises it is not the centre of it’s universe but there is this unconscious, the knowledge that the self is not alone and not the ultimate diet but there is an unseen force called God that has the ultimate say actually has a relieving and freeing effect it is a freeing submission.
The ultimate doer not diet 😁
@@lailaalattar417 Thanks indeed for your constructive response!
Usually when I meet muslims and proponents of most other faiths I face endless pontifications. In those cases submission does not mean openness, but plain submission to authority. Every now and then I come across mystics like Rumi, who meet the entire creation with awe and wonderment. You seem to be heading in the direction of the mystic who ultimately let go of all scriptures and beliefs in order to face the ineffible grace of this life, this creation. It is very unfortunate, though, that there are so few of you truly moderate, liberal, anti-authoritarian adherents out there. Islam and the muslim world is yet to face a long called for phase of reformation, which us needed in order to replace the iron age mindset typical of most believers with something resembling true openness, freedom and true critical thinking.
Your comment renewed my hope in the future of Islam somewhat, I am happy to confess!
Off to the beach hi girl.
5 6 15
This is self help, not psychoanalysis
Thank you.