This is one of the best videos I have seen for long time. There is endless debate which gear is the best (because people are crazy) and few how to use the right gear in the best way. Thanks. I am looking forward for another videos.
This is absolutely the best video I have seen regarding shooting at high iso for any camera regardless of the sensor size. I have come to learn and follow these rules over the years of shooting and experimenting. I am so glade you mentioned the fact that you see much less grain in print as you do on the computer. It is amazing how much of the noise goes away in print. I like to keep a fair amount of the noise to maximize the detail in print. This video should be shared to everyone who thinks you need a full frame sensor to shoot in low light or higher iso values. Thanks for the time you put into this video. I also would like to add that is is best to use the sharpest lenses you can to maximize as much resolution as possible. And thankfully Olympus primes and pro lenses are extremely sharp.
Hi Joseph, thanks for this great video. I’m a recent convert to RAW, and this adds to my skills. Some have commented about the slower shutter speed as you increase the EV+. To avoid this going below a SS to get a sharp image, the EM1.2 allows you to set a minimum SS with Auto ISO. So if you set your highest ISO to say 6400, and min SS to say 1/30s or whatever is needed if handholding for the focal length you’re shooting, adjusting the EV+ to ETTR, will raise the ISO once your minimum SS has been reached. I’m sure many photogs already know all or some of this but for me this tutorial has been very enlightening. Thanks again for teaching an old dog a new trick.
I subscribed to your channel recently because I just bought an Olympus OMD-EM1 MARK III, and I am discovering all your videos, your explanations are remarkable, I feel like I am learning photography a second time, I can say only one thing: WELL DONE.
Those hand drawn diagrams of the histogram really help understand. Especially about the pixels that are past the highlight border and how much could you get back. I think I already knew this from editing my photos and realizing I couldn't get my highlights back but your diagrams really solidifies everything clearly and very easy for anyone to understand. Thank you, Joseph!
I find these tutorials incredibly useful Joseph, they have improved not only my EM1 Mk2 setup to the point of "perfection" but the general shooting tips are also valuable. Keep them coming thanks.
Fascinating. Thank you, Joe! I've been binge-watching your videos and I am learning so much more about getting the best out of MFT, especially with Olympus.
Omg, some people's questions...! A lot of people do not seem to know how to listen... Joseph, a great topic... subbed... Let me recap for those who still don't understand: 1) Shutter speed is the most important (use as high sutter speed as possible so you don't get a blurry image) 2) if you have to, it's better to use overexposed iso 6400 + ss 1/125 at f2.8... than iso 3200 + ss 1/60 at f2.8 (it depends how fast your subject is moving for your shutter to freeze it sharp) You have to know the relationship between subject speed and shutter speed, to get optimal sharp subject... that's the gist of it... best regards
I have always wondered while Olympus has been branded as a high noise camera. That has certainly never been my experience. My files are very clean. Now, through your video, I understand why. I always push my exposure to the right! I never realized it was impacting the amount of noise in my photos. Thanks for the lesson and the encouragement to continue ETTR! I am looking forward to your next post!
I'm the opposite - as in I accept deep shadows to preserve my highlights - but still have the same results you've mentioned. I rarely get above ISO 800, and shoot bands/events and street at night. Not a problem in the dark. Pushing the ISO above the native 6400 creates problems I've heard, but apart from astrophotography I can't think of a real situation where one would need an ISO that high.
I love your explanations and the way you present the info. I have struggled with noise at high ISO and after watching this, I think I am just not exposing far enough to the right. Never thought of all that info missing from the highlights. Great job.
Thank you Joseph on this video. The reason I have not thought of selling my EM-1. Indeed proper settings in camera is way to get decent if not tack sharp images. I have taken note of my histogram when taking my photos for better images. Your added information helps a lot. Cheers!
THANK YOU, Joseph! As a Pro, I can't BELIEVE I knew so little about this! Some videos on YT are worth their weight in Gold, and yours here is one of them. Liked, Subscribed, and Shared!!!
This is fantastic. I'm coming from a D800E which has trouble recovering highlights and no trouble recovering shadows. This makes perfect sense to me and I really need to change the way I expose on my E-M1 M2. Great info, very helpful.
Very well explained! Another problem when pushing exposure in post is that colors are less good in general and you get easily a reddish color cast in the shadows. For sharpening in LR the masking slider is very useful to limit the sharpening on the edges.
Thank you so much, I just did a test on my own and was surprised by the amount of noise I was able to reduce with this simple technique! I thought ISO 400 was practical limit for my micro 4/3 camera, but now I know I can get well usable picture with 1600 :)
Wow, because of this video I might stick to my MFT! I have been increasingly annoyed with noise in my pictures and other barriers to shutter speed & low light performance of my pictures. But only because I dread pushing my ISO, rarely use 800 (!), and prefer to underexpose. I really need to experiment with ETTR. I had heard about it but never understood the concept. Very impressive comparison: ISO 3.200 with exposure corrected to the left vs. ISO 200 with exposure corrected to the right. Thank you!
Interesting and informative video. I came to the same realization myself with regard to exposure compensation with the OM-D cameras. I routinely push to the right in camera, and recover to the left in Lightroom. Olympus' newer sensors/camera algorithms definitely provide excellent room for highlight recovery. Better, than some competing products, in my opinion. It's a huge change from some of their earlier cameras, such as the E-330 era equipment which I often had to push to the left because of fairly dramatic highlight clipping. All in all, I think these newer camera's from Olympus are incredibly capable and vastly underrated by the broader photographic community. It's nice to see a thoughtful video where a practicing photographer offers real insight into his process rather than just opinion. Well done!
That was a great tutorial on ettr. I was following along with my em5ii and the histogram wouldn't budge then I realized I had live view boost turned on. I shoot underwater a lot and need it on to see my composition. I also use two strobes underwater so I have tons of light and always shoot at base iso. I turned live view boost off and the histogram now moves.
Loving your work Jospeh. I’ve recently made the switch from Nikon to Olympus shooting with the EM1 and EM1 MK2 and your tutorials are really helping make the transition
To ask a very simplistic question. I rarely shoot in manual mode. Too many variables for the friends and family photos I take. I usually shoot in aperture preferred mode. Can I then use the exposure compensation to achieve the same ettf result you suggest?
very thoughtful and well done demo of ettr. i look forward to trying to employ some of your thinking. let me get this straight: nail focus with a reasonably high shutter speed then look to raise the iso moving the histo to the right in the hopes of 2/3 stops over "proper" exposure. thank you for the effort and sharing. BIG thumbs up.
Joseph, great video. Most of the time I do landscape photography so the noise is very minimal, however sometimes I do buildings in the city and I need to push the ISO a bit up. So I will test your theory and let you know. Thank you for the tips .....
Thx Joseph, I am strugling with noise. In my case with landscape photography. But this rule can be used for every style. I will use the ETTR the next time and will do some testing with different exposures. Keep up the good work! Regards, John!
Excellent demonstration of ETTR. Thanks for this. I agree that print is the best way to really evaluate IQ. Love my Olympus cameras, to this is appreciated.
Victim? I think there are enough of those already. It comes down to why you would choose to do it. I'm not going to go out and intentionally overexpose my street shots because I want to spend hours fiddling with them in a raw editor. Even when I shoot events like bands I'm going to expose properly. And in the studio I have to make sure I get it looking good, or my clients will look at their shots and be disappointed, plus once again I don't want to spend hours hunched over a monitor adding shadows back and recovering highlights. It all depends on use cases. One time events like sports or wildlife makes sense to ensure you get the critical shot - especially because you can't control the environment.
Awesome video! I'm and accountant by trade but love photography and learning about photography. I really enjoy your videos. FYI live in DFW area and have been shooting with Olympus and Nikon for years. Just sold my Nikon equipment and will attempt to only shoot Olympus for the next year. This video and your other videos are very helpful.
A few of points: 1) ETTR is about leaving the ISO at its base ISO, especially considering an ISO invariant camera like the EM1 II. 2) In doing what you suggest in your video, photographers run a serious risk of blowing highlights due to reduced dynamic range with higher ISOs 3) ETTR isn't to be used all the time, especially not with jpeg's (not that you suggested this) 4) ETTR is ONLY for shutter speed and flash work when the desired aperture is chosen at the base ISO. If your shutter is too slow, add a flash... it's quite simple really. Now go as much as you can to the right and your signal to noise ratio will be good for getting a "noise-free" image.
Awesome, I use Panasonic and Sony and CaptureOne but your advise is almost device and software independent. And very much like to see how the good old whiteboard or flip chart style of presenting helps a lot even in the digital age. Thank you, subscribed
A really good video, Joseph. And it fits perfectly for the E-M1 II that actually has a lot of details in the highlight - more so than in the black areas. I always overexpose a little bit and am able to pull a lot of details out of the highlights. I saw a comparison between the E-M1 II and the Fuji XT2, and the E-M1 had a lot more details in the highlights while the XT2 had more details in the shadows. Your video really shows why it's necessary to know your camera. I learned a lot.
I think ETTR has very limited use with high ISO. One primary reason of using high ISO is that one may not have fast enough shutter speed at a given aperture. To ETTR however, one needs even longer shutter opening. ETTR may be more useful at base ISO when shooting landscape where shutter speed is not a constraint
I think that is the point of the video, to not be afraid to push up the ISO even further to allow EETR as even with the added noise of pushing ISO the final image will be better as the shadows will have much better detail. At least if there will be poor image quality from high ISO use it will be poor across the image rather than just localised grain within the shadows.. :)
As Charles One pointed out: Go from 3200 to 6400 and do ETTR instead of using 3200 (if this would give you the shutter speed you want, or even go to 12800 or somewhere in between if it isn't enough). At base ISO the noise is no real problem (at least not for a film aficionado like me). It is exactly high-ISO situations where Joe is right, it just works there - try it. Be aware that his advice is specific for ISO "variant" sensors (like there seem to be in current Olympus cameras; and it works with Panasonic models too, as someone pointed out to me lately).
I had one situation (tell in front, I am not a pro) where was shooting in church. Set shutter to 1/100 to freeze movement, and aperture according to needs. But was afraid to go over 3200 and photos were underexposed. So, it was for sure better to go to 6400 for proper exposure. But ettr would mean to go with even higher iso. I would like to see such example. E.g. 6400 is being set by camera, but going with higher iso for ettr.
Hi Joseph, what a totally excellent video, your Histogram explanation was the best I have found anywhere. That's a really useful tip and I will be trying it out when next need to use high ISO with my EM10 (mark 1). Thanks Derek.
Use Olympus Workspace to lower your noise. It's free. Assuming you are using an E-M1 or E-M1 Mk II, you need to make sure your setting in the camera are the same as your setting in the program. Don't forget to take a dark frame at the same settings because you can use this in your workflow. This is the best way I have found for improving the noise of Olympus files. However, the fact remains that, despite what people say, Olympus - and Micro Four Thirds cameras generally - are not nearly as bad as been claimed. People spend so much time comparing that there's no practicality considered any more. I took some astro pics the other night at 6400 and they looked fine. I shoot both M43 and "full frame" and there are plenty of occasions I can barely tell the difference.
Great explanation and tutorial! I'd heard of ETTR before but you covered it in a way that was really easy to understand. I have always been afraid of pushing the ISO on my E-M5ii because of the results, but now realise I was almost certainly trying to underexpose and ending up giving my files nowhere to go in post!
A key aspect of this as pointed out by Michael Reichmann is that the amount of exposure information for a particular image decreases dramatically as you move from the right hand side of the histogram to the left. He uses the example of a 12 bit RAW image which for a 5 stop exposure contains 2048, 1024, 512, 256, 128 levels from the brightest stop to the darkest stop. The absolute noise at each brightness is constant so that exposing to the right increases the proportion of wanted exposure information to unwanted noise providing cleaner images that can adjusted to taste in PP as you explain. Given all the features on Olympus cameras I'm surprised that there isn't an ETTR function to make the best use of the smaller m4/3 sensors. Y
I did some testing with my EM1.2 on ETTR a while ago.The histogram shown by the camera is based on the (preview) JPG only which means if you do an ETTR based on the camera histogram you usually have one stop or more headroom in the RAW file highlights. But when you set the Gradation to "Low Key" and use the highlight "Blinkies" you get much closer (with regards to ETTR in RAW) :-) Also it only makes sense only to do ETTR in case you keep the same ISO. E.g. an ISO 800 image would look almost identical to an ISO 1600 overexposed by 1 stop. Also interesting: the EM1.2 has an baseline exposure of 0.81 in RAW which means the RAW is underexposed by 0.81 stops and the RAW converter automatically pushes the image by 0.81 stops (the original EM1 had baseline exposure of 0.32)). This means you have a little bit more noise, but also more headroom to recover highlights (in RAW). When shooting in good light you can also use ISO 64 (which is nothing else than an ISO200 overexposed by 1,7 stops = ETTR ISO200)
Sebastian Stumpf Intersting notes, that’s about the same conclusions I’ve come to from trial and error in that you would most often want to overexposed by at least a stop and any ISO if possible. Thanks for the info!
Where do you both setup your Histogram values for Highlights and Shadow Limits? My own use of Ps tells me I don't want to print any higher than about 245 or lower than about 15. Is this where I set my camera up for it's Histogram values limits? Would either of you change these values for Em1.2? (I also see that '245' would not afford me true ETTR, but rather a 'safety margin'.) What do you think?
@@tkarlmann Even if you wouldn't print outside the 245 to 15 range (sounds a bit like the old rules for litho printing to only use the range from 5% to 95%), you should shoot the full range if possible and change it in post. This way you have better data to deal with; I would not "shoot for printing" in camera.
@@c.augustin I shoot Weddings (& Albums), so I definitely need to shoot for the Print. The problem I see is if you extend the range, you risk blowout. Are you willing to rely on the "Raw Margin" to prevent blowout?
@@tkarlmann No, just not looking for 245 as the upper limit when shooting, but nearer 255 (253 if you like, because there's lots of room in these "2" when thinking in the 12 or 14 bit the sensor has in the raw file - while the sensor records linearly, this "0-255" we are shown is logarithmic to better match "f-stops"), and going for 245 in post - this is more or less what Joe recommends. Relying on the histogram (instead of metering) normally gives you enough headroom in the raw files to be fine when doing ETTR; as someone else pointed out in some comment here there's an exposure bias at play to give this headroom, and it depends of the camera model - so testing one's own equipment is crucial. If you are fine with what you get with your method, go for it (and if smaller print sizes are your target, than it doesn't matter anyway if there's noise in the shadows).
Noise is overrated, especially when it comes to Olympus MFT cameras (they have "nice" noise that has kind of an "analog" touch). But your advice is very valuable and perfectly matches what I found usable in low-light situations (but without using the histogram - I'll do this in the future). For the Pen F it is even more relevant, because you not only get noise in underexposed areas, you get "striped" noise when pulling them up in Camera Raw (other than with the E-M1 Mk II). Thanks for sharing
Thanks a lot for this video. I heard about this but never tried. Your Video encouraged me! ISO 6400 and very good results! I often didnt go above 1600 and pushed the exposure and shadows after. Big mistake i know now.
Hi, wow your explanation really make sense. I tend to lower the ISO depending on the image sensor stabilizer with longer exposure when it’s night shot. In that case always hard time focusing and exposure to the right post processing. And I see a lot of noise in the shadow. After seeing your tutorials, I will change ISO settings to higher ISO and lower the explosive in the post processing. What a great explanation drawings and samples. Do you think the should I turn down or off the noise reduction in the camera settings?? This is only I did not hear in your video. Thanks.
Great video. When I made your video full screen, I could actually see the differences between the images. I have been exposing to the right because I was convinced to by others who know more than I do. Now I feel like I can expose to the right because I understand why. Years ago I shot some girls indoor court volleyball with a Canon 7D Mark II, and would set the aperature at 2, the shutter speed at 1250, and then put the ISO where ever it needed to be to expose to the right. The images had a lot of noise, but were sharp and in focus. I saw online that some other people had been told to "never shoot above ISO 800" or "never shoot above ISO 1600" and so then they were shooting at lower shutter speeds than I was, to keep their ISO's low. So where I was fixing the shutter speed to get freeze the motion and then using whatever ISO was needed to do that, they were stopping at a maximum ISO and shooting at a lower shutter and getting blurry images and asking how to solve this problem. Well. The solution is to shoot at the shutter speed required and then whatever ISO is needed to expose to the right.
Changing ISO to fit the other settings is a great idea! And it would be easy to do too: Using Auto ISO with a high upper limit, S to fix the needed shutter speed and exposure compensation to determine ETTR (I have a dial on my Pen F for that). I'll try this the next time I'm in a low-light situation that requires slow shutter speeds (instead of relying on image stabilization).
I know what an ETTR is and I usually used it in landscape but I'm afraid to raise my iso, In landscape it is ok to under expose sometimes to compensate with the overexpose parts if you wan't a single image shot but in portrait it changes BIGTIME... I was invited to shoot a portrait today and I was disappointed with some of the results, I try to limit the iso and I end up losing those shots... thank you very much... well explained.
I truly believe that the first thing you have to take care of technically is to make a sharp image. If you're keeping your ISO down but then getting softness due to camera or subject movement, that's a mistake in my book. A sharp image will clean up and print so nicely while a slightly blurry one will never look great. So for me I'll use whatever ISO I need to in order to get a tack sharp image. Once I've done that then I think about ETTR and exposure. Now normally with portrait's I don't choose to raise my ISO too much because I can easily add light with strobes etc. rather than just shooting ambient but if natural light is your thing I've made prints 3 feet wide from ISO 1600/3200 images that I'm very happy with.
Thanks you make it so simple Expose to the right I'm new to mft and shoot in Manual mode mainly Birds in Woods so usually low light so I up my iso but when looking at the photo pulling it back to the left so it doesn't look over exposed but when I open up in photoshop it looks quite noisy.can't wait get out to try ettr
Great description. One thing. When you want the histogram to shift to the right, you want to expose the image more, so you want to increase the ISO, or increase the aperture size, or increase the shutter speed time. During ISO adjustment the dials work as you would think to naturally turn the dials in the direction you want the histogram to move. But you need to swap the dial direction in the menus to get the aperture and shutter speed dial direction to work so that the dial direction and the histogram movement feels right. So that when you turn a dial the histogram moves in the direction you feel that it should. This is most important when you are looking at your histogram after a shot so the histogram adjustment is not live. You take a shot, review the image showing the histogram, then look at the right edge of the curve. If you have your aperture and shutter dials set up so the dial direction matches the histogram movement, then you only need to think that you want the histogram for the next shot to be so many clicks left or right. And that histogram movement could be any combination of clicks on the shutter, aperture, or ISO. I usually pick my aperture and shutter so then I am adjusting the ISO. When I am out and about I am usually shooting white and gray cars as they come by and checking my histogram. Someone needs to come up with a camera that allows us to set the ETTR gap in plus and minus stop increments.
In my Olympus cameras, when I turn the back dial with my thumb swiping to the right the live histogram moves to the right or the histogram for my next shot appears more to the right, and when I turn the front dial with my finger swiping to the right, in relationship to me, as I am looking at the back of the camera or through the viewfinder, the histogram also moves to the right. This feels correct and useful to me.
The key to ETTR is collecting more photons. You don't do this by increasing ISO. ISO is simply a volume control on the amplifier in your camera. If you take two images with the same exposure (histogram), one at ISO 400 and one at ISO 200, the one taken at ISO 400 collects half the photons of the one at ISO 200. So for a given ISO, to accomplish ETTR, simply decrease your shutter speed and/or increase your aperture enough to shift the histogram to the right but not too much that you overexpose the highlights.
Thank you. Sorry. I don't agree. The key to ETTR is not collecting more photons, it is maximizing the number of pixels in the recorded image that have a high luminosity value. And in my situations where ISO is needed to be increased for ETTR, the situation is not two images with the same exposure and different ISO's, it is a fixed minimum shutter speed for some reason, a fixed maximum aperture for some reason, and then one exposure with a lower ISO that would be thought to be "normal" and one exposure with a higher ISO that would be thought to be "to the right". In both these situations the shutter and aperture are the same so the photon density is the same. But the advantage the exposure that is "to the right" has is more pixels in the recorded image that are not "crushed" and more pixels that have a higher luminosity so that more detail in the darker parts of the recorded image are, well, recorded.
@@Smoothblue90 You're right that your are out. What you do need to do is understand the exposure triangle. Here it is fstoppers.com/education/exposure-triangle-understanding-how-aperture-shutter-speed-and-iso-work-together-72878
Really great video Joseph, thank you. Can I just ask how you expose to the right for a given iso? Surely the only way of reliably doing this if you've reached the maximum aperture for your lens is to reduce shutter speed. If you do this, surely you'll increase your chance of getting a blurry image?
Damon Henry Sharpness is job one so if I need more speed I’ll get it by adding ISO. Once I’m there I’ll look at my shutter and if I can, I’ll lower it by 1/3 - 2/3 of a stop to slightly over expose. For example if I’m good with 1/125 for sharpness but my exposure is 1/200 at ISO 3200 I’ll drop it down to brighten the image. That gives me the best looking high ISO when processed.
Very good tutorial: thanks a lot - I have subscribed. Though I occasionally shoot wildlife at higher ISO on my EM1.2, I generally use my D500 for the low light/high ISO shots. Though I learned about ETTR a few years ago I normally rely on my camera meter/experience. From now on, however, I will pay more attention to my histogram in low light/high ISO conditions.
Excellent cours! Thanks! These days, I'm looking at "up grading" for a new affordable good camera. I noticed that you like Olympus. There is also (mostly for outside, not really for video, but "respectful" for portraits) the pentax k1 mark II. But really, probably there are many that could do portraits. Fuji are good as well. Though, I don't know much about Olympus, I have feelings that it is a good option. If you have time for me, I would appreciate if you could give me some tips... Thanks in advance!
You say. New. Affordable. Good. Camera. I of course have no idea what affordable means to you. The new cameras I have been interested in are $1600 plus. M1 Mark II. G9. X-T2. And great portrait lenses for those are $1000 plus. Olympus has the 45mm 1.2 and the 75mm 1.2. Fuji has the 56mm 1.2. Is that the dollar ballpark you are thinking about? Right now I think the best value in portrait photography is the Panasonic G7, the Olympus 45mm 1.8, the Godox X1T transmitter, the Godox v870ii for a main light, the Godox tt350 for a side or hair or background light, the Godox S-type Bracket Bowens Mount Holder for Speedlite Flash, and then for a softbox something in the range of the Westcott Rapid Box XL 36" Octabox , or the Cheetah 36" Deep Parabolic Quick RiceBowl, or the Glow ParaPop 38" Portable Softbox.
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This is one of the best videos I have seen for long time. There is endless debate which gear is the best (because people are crazy) and few how to use the right gear in the best way. Thanks. I am looking forward for another videos.
This is absolutely the best video I have seen regarding shooting at high iso for any camera regardless of the sensor size. I have come to learn and follow these rules over the years of shooting and experimenting. I am so glade you mentioned the fact that you see much less grain in print as you do on the computer. It is amazing how much of the noise goes away in print. I like to keep a fair amount of the noise to maximize the detail in print. This video should be shared to everyone who thinks you need a full frame sensor to shoot in low light or higher iso values. Thanks for the time you put into this video. I also would like to add that is is best to use the sharpest lenses you can to maximize as much resolution as possible. And thankfully Olympus primes and pro lenses are extremely sharp.
All I can say is, "thank you, thank you so much!". You have just solved the Only problem I have with my micro 4/3rds system. You are the best!
Hi Joseph, thanks for this great video. I’m a recent convert to RAW, and this adds to my skills. Some have commented about the slower shutter speed as you increase the EV+. To avoid this going below a SS to get a sharp image, the EM1.2 allows you to set a minimum SS with Auto ISO. So if you set your highest ISO to say 6400, and min SS to say 1/30s or whatever is needed if handholding for the focal length you’re shooting, adjusting the EV+ to ETTR, will raise the ISO once your minimum SS has been reached. I’m sure many photogs already know all or some of this but for me this tutorial has been very enlightening. Thanks again for teaching an old dog a new trick.
I subscribed to your channel recently because I just bought an Olympus OMD-EM1 MARK III, and I am discovering all your videos, your explanations are remarkable, I feel like I am learning photography a second time, I can say only one thing: WELL DONE.
Those hand drawn diagrams of the histogram really help understand. Especially about the pixels that are past the highlight border and how much could you get back. I think I already knew this from editing my photos and realizing I couldn't get my highlights back but your diagrams really solidifies everything clearly and very easy for anyone to understand. Thank you, Joseph!
I find these tutorials incredibly useful Joseph, they have improved not only my EM1 Mk2 setup to the point of "perfection" but the general shooting tips are also valuable. Keep them coming thanks.
Fascinating. Thank you, Joe! I've been binge-watching your videos and I am learning so much more about getting the best out of MFT, especially with Olympus.
Man, your ETTR explanation is one of the best I saw on RUclips. Thanks!
I just wanted to say that I've struggled understanding histograms until today. You really did a great job explaining it. Thanks!
Like so many viewers, this information has resolved perhaps my greatest concern in low light scenarios. Thank you so much. 👏🏻👏🏻👏🏻
Omg, some people's questions...! A lot of people do not seem to know how to listen...
Joseph, a great topic... subbed...
Let me recap for those who still don't understand:
1) Shutter speed is the most important (use as high sutter speed as possible so you don't get a blurry image)
2) if you have to, it's better to use overexposed iso 6400 + ss 1/125 at f2.8... than iso 3200 + ss 1/60 at f2.8 (it depends how fast your subject is moving for your shutter to freeze it sharp)
You have to know the relationship between subject speed and shutter speed, to get optimal sharp subject...
that's the gist of it...
best regards
I have always wondered while Olympus has been branded as a high noise camera. That has certainly never been my experience. My files are very clean. Now, through your video, I understand why. I always push my exposure to the right! I never realized it was impacting the amount of noise in my photos. Thanks for the lesson and the encouragement to continue ETTR! I am looking forward to your next post!
I'm the opposite - as in I accept deep shadows to preserve my highlights - but still have the same results you've mentioned. I rarely get above ISO 800, and shoot bands/events and street at night. Not a problem in the dark. Pushing the ISO above the native 6400 creates problems I've heard, but apart from astrophotography I can't think of a real situation where one would need an ISO that high.
I love your explanations and the way you present the info. I have struggled with noise at high ISO and after watching this, I think I am just not exposing far enough to the right. Never thought of all that info missing from the highlights. Great job.
Thank you Joseph on this video. The reason I have not thought of selling my EM-1. Indeed proper settings in camera is way to get decent if not tack sharp images. I have taken note of my histogram when taking my photos for better images. Your added information helps a lot. Cheers!
THANK YOU, Joseph! As a Pro, I can't BELIEVE I knew so little about this! Some videos on YT are worth their weight in Gold, and yours here is one of them. Liked, Subscribed, and Shared!!!
This is fantastic. I'm coming from a D800E which has trouble recovering highlights and no trouble recovering shadows. This makes perfect sense to me and I really need to change the way I expose on my E-M1 M2. Great info, very helpful.
One of the best/most useful videos I have seen in a long time.
Very well explained! Another problem when pushing exposure in post is that colors are less good in general and you get easily a reddish color cast in the shadows. For sharpening in LR the masking slider is very useful to limit the sharpening on the edges.
Thanks for the reply Joseph. The idea that we have a further 6 bits up our sleeve in the raw file is a really valuable point you are making. Thanks
Big thanks Joseph, I didn’t think I needed to watch this video, but I did need to. Never to old to learn! Very helpful.
One of the clearest and most helpful vids I've seen to help my photography. Thanks.
Thank you so much, I just did a test on my own and was surprised by the amount of noise I was able to reduce with this simple technique! I thought ISO 400 was practical limit for my micro 4/3 camera, but now I know I can get well usable picture with 1600 :)
Wow, because of this video I might stick to my MFT! I have been increasingly annoyed with noise in my pictures and other barriers to shutter speed & low light performance of my pictures. But only because I dread pushing my ISO, rarely use 800 (!), and prefer to underexpose. I really need to experiment with ETTR. I had heard about it but never understood the concept. Very impressive comparison: ISO 3.200 with exposure corrected to the left vs. ISO 200 with exposure corrected to the right. Thank you!
Interesting and informative video. I came to the same realization myself with regard to exposure compensation with the OM-D cameras. I routinely push to the right in camera, and recover to the left in Lightroom. Olympus' newer sensors/camera algorithms definitely provide excellent room for highlight recovery. Better, than some competing products, in my opinion. It's a huge change from some of their earlier cameras, such as the E-330 era equipment which I often had to push to the left because of fairly dramatic highlight clipping.
All in all, I think these newer camera's from Olympus are incredibly capable and vastly underrated by the broader photographic community. It's nice to see a thoughtful video where a practicing photographer offers real insight into his process rather than just opinion. Well done!
That was a great tutorial on ettr. I was following along with my em5ii and the histogram wouldn't budge then I realized I had live view boost turned on. I shoot underwater a lot and need it on to see my composition. I also use two strobes underwater so I have tons of light and always shoot at base iso. I turned live view boost off and the histogram now moves.
"the histogram wouldn't budge then I realized I had live view boost turned on"
Ditto - THANK YOU!
Loving your work Jospeh. I’ve recently made the switch from Nikon to Olympus shooting with the EM1 and EM1 MK2 and your tutorials are really helping make the transition
Which camera gives the best high ISO image, the mk1 or the mk2?
To ask a very simplistic question. I rarely shoot in manual mode. Too many variables for the friends and family photos I take. I usually shoot in aperture preferred mode. Can I then use the exposure compensation to achieve the same ettf result you suggest?
@@dustinhecker3986 too late probably but yes you can.
Great video Joseph, very good straightforward and practical advice. Keep them coming.
very thoughtful and well done demo of ettr. i look forward to trying to employ some of your thinking. let me get this straight: nail focus with a reasonably high shutter speed then look to raise the iso moving the histo to the right in the hopes of 2/3 stops over "proper" exposure. thank you for the effort and sharing. BIG thumbs up.
This is the best explanation of histograms I have seen. Thank you!
Joseph, great video.
Most of the time I do landscape photography so the noise is very minimal, however sometimes I do buildings in the city and I need to push the ISO a bit up. So I will test your theory and let you know.
Thank you for the tips .....
Thx Joseph, I am strugling with noise. In my case with landscape photography. But this rule can be used for every style. I will use the ETTR the next time and will do some testing with different exposures. Keep up the good work! Regards, John!
Joseph , your videos are just so informative and brilliant . As an Olympus shooter myself you inspire me . Loving what you are doing .
Thank you. Been looking for such an explanation on high iso shoots.
by far the most accurate and useful content on the olympus em-1ii.... Thank you for your help...
Excellent demonstration of ETTR. Thanks for this. I agree that print is the best way to really evaluate IQ. Love my Olympus cameras, to this is appreciated.
Fantastic explanation, I have always been a victim of underexposing for fear of blowing highlights, this video puts it all into perspective. Thanks!
Victim? I think there are enough of those already. It comes down to why you would choose to do it. I'm not going to go out and intentionally overexpose my street shots because I want to spend hours fiddling with them in a raw editor. Even when I shoot events like bands I'm going to expose properly. And in the studio I have to make sure I get it looking good, or my clients will look at their shots and be disappointed, plus once again I don't want to spend hours hunched over a monitor adding shadows back and recovering highlights. It all depends on use cases. One time events like sports or wildlife makes sense to ensure you get the critical shot - especially because you can't control the environment.
Great information Joseph. Really enjoyed it. Can't wait to try putting it in practice. Thanks.
Awesome video! I'm and accountant by trade but love photography and learning about photography. I really enjoy your videos. FYI live in DFW area and have been shooting with Olympus and Nikon for years. Just sold my Nikon equipment and will attempt to only shoot Olympus for the next year. This video and your other videos are very helpful.
A few of points:
1) ETTR is about leaving the ISO at its base ISO, especially considering an ISO invariant camera like the EM1 II.
2) In doing what you suggest in your video, photographers run a serious risk of blowing highlights due to reduced dynamic range with higher ISOs
3) ETTR isn't to be used all the time, especially not with jpeg's (not that you suggested this)
4) ETTR is ONLY for shutter speed and flash work when the desired aperture is chosen at the base ISO. If your shutter is too slow, add a flash... it's quite simple really. Now go as much as you can to the right and your signal to noise ratio will be good for getting a "noise-free" image.
Great explanation Joseph. Those images look great even at ISO 3200 or 6400 using the ETTR technique.
Superb explanation on Historgram. Greetings from Malaysia.
Excellent demonstration of ETTR benefits Jo, well done!
Thank you so much for a brilliant explanation of ettr, very clearly explained and well illustrated.
Awesome, I use Panasonic and Sony and CaptureOne but your advise is almost device and software independent. And very much like to see how the good old whiteboard or flip chart style of presenting helps a lot even in the digital age. Thank you, subscribed
Some testing and some printing is in my future. Brilliant tutorial
Great video. Thank you. I was afraid about high ISO in my E-M5 mk Il, now I am not.
Thanks! Very enlightening. I will try some night photography to test this technique.
A really good video, Joseph. And it fits perfectly for the E-M1 II that actually has a lot of details in the highlight - more so than in the black areas. I always overexpose a little bit and am able to pull a lot of details out of the highlights. I saw a comparison between the E-M1 II and the Fuji XT2, and the E-M1 had a lot more details in the highlights while the XT2 had more details in the shadows. Your video really shows why it's necessary to know your camera. I learned a lot.
I think ETTR has very limited use with high ISO. One primary reason of using high ISO is that one may not have fast enough shutter speed at a given aperture. To ETTR however, one needs even longer shutter opening.
ETTR may be more useful at base ISO when shooting landscape where shutter speed is not a constraint
I think that is the point of the video, to not be afraid to push up the ISO even further to allow EETR as even with the added noise of pushing ISO the final image will be better as the shadows will have much better detail. At least if there will be poor image quality from high ISO use it will be poor across the image rather than just localised grain within the shadows.. :)
As Charles One pointed out: Go from 3200 to 6400 and do ETTR instead of using 3200 (if this would give you the shutter speed you want, or even go to 12800 or somewhere in between if it isn't enough). At base ISO the noise is no real problem (at least not for a film aficionado like me). It is exactly high-ISO situations where Joe is right, it just works there - try it. Be aware that his advice is specific for ISO "variant" sensors (like there seem to be in current Olympus cameras; and it works with Panasonic models too, as someone pointed out to me lately).
I had one situation (tell in front, I am not a pro) where was shooting in church. Set shutter to 1/100 to freeze movement, and aperture according to needs. But was afraid to go over 3200 and photos were underexposed. So, it was for sure better to go to 6400 for proper exposure. But ettr would mean to go with even higher iso. I would like to see such example. E.g. 6400 is being set by camera, but going with higher iso for ettr.
Excellent tutorial. MOST photographers including pros don’t understand noise. Thanks
Hi Joseph, what a totally excellent video, your Histogram explanation was the best I have found anywhere. That's a really useful tip and I will be trying it out when next need to use high ISO with my EM10 (mark 1). Thanks Derek.
Use Olympus Workspace to lower your noise. It's free. Assuming you are using an E-M1 or E-M1 Mk II, you need to make sure your setting in the camera are the same as your setting in the program. Don't forget to take a dark frame at the same settings because you can use this in your workflow. This is the best way I have found for improving the noise of Olympus files.
However, the fact remains that, despite what people say, Olympus - and Micro Four Thirds cameras generally - are not nearly as bad as been claimed. People spend so much time comparing that there's no practicality considered any more. I took some astro pics the other night at 6400 and they looked fine. I shoot both M43 and "full frame" and there are plenty of occasions I can barely tell the difference.
Great explanation and tutorial! I'd heard of ETTR before but you covered it in a way that was really easy to understand. I have always been afraid of pushing the ISO on my E-M5ii because of the results, but now realise I was almost certainly trying to underexpose and ending up giving my files nowhere to go in post!
Thank you thank you! Really appreciate you sharing your deep knowledge!
A key aspect of this as pointed out by Michael Reichmann is that the amount of exposure information for a particular image decreases dramatically as you move from the right hand side of the histogram to the left. He uses the example of a 12 bit RAW image which for a 5 stop exposure contains 2048, 1024, 512, 256, 128 levels from the brightest stop to the darkest stop. The absolute noise at each brightness is constant so that exposing to the right increases the proportion of wanted exposure information to unwanted noise providing cleaner images that can adjusted to taste in PP as you explain. Given all the features on Olympus cameras I'm surprised that there isn't an ETTR function to make the best use of the smaller m4/3 sensors. Y
So informative Joseph... thank you! Love to see what a pro-photographer can do with M43!
Thanks for creating. Very informative 🙏
Very informative and useful video. Thank you Joseph! I would love to see some tips on your workflow and post processing using the Olympus files.
I did some testing with my EM1.2 on ETTR a while ago.The histogram shown by the camera is based on the (preview) JPG only which means if you do an ETTR based on the camera histogram you usually have one stop or more headroom in the RAW file highlights. But when you set the Gradation to "Low Key" and use the highlight "Blinkies" you get much closer (with regards to ETTR in RAW) :-) Also it only makes sense only to do ETTR in case you keep the same ISO. E.g. an ISO 800 image would look almost identical to an ISO 1600 overexposed by 1 stop. Also interesting: the EM1.2 has an baseline exposure of 0.81 in RAW which means the RAW is underexposed by 0.81 stops and the RAW converter automatically pushes the image by 0.81 stops (the original EM1 had baseline exposure of 0.32)). This means you have a little bit more noise, but also more headroom to recover highlights (in RAW). When shooting in good light you can also use ISO 64 (which is nothing else than an ISO200 overexposed by 1,7 stops = ETTR ISO200)
Sebastian Stumpf Intersting notes, that’s about the same conclusions I’ve come to from trial and error in that you would most often want to overexposed by at least a stop and any ISO if possible. Thanks for the info!
Where do you both setup your Histogram values for Highlights and Shadow Limits? My own use of Ps tells me I don't want to print any higher than about 245 or lower than about 15. Is this where I set my camera up for it's Histogram values limits? Would either of you change these values for Em1.2? (I also see that '245' would not afford me true ETTR, but rather a 'safety margin'.) What do you think?
@@tkarlmann Even if you wouldn't print outside the 245 to 15 range (sounds a bit like the old rules for litho printing to only use the range from 5% to 95%), you should shoot the full range if possible and change it in post. This way you have better data to deal with; I would not "shoot for printing" in camera.
@@c.augustin I shoot Weddings (& Albums), so I definitely need to shoot for the Print. The problem I see is if you extend the range, you risk blowout. Are you willing to rely on the "Raw Margin" to prevent blowout?
@@tkarlmann No, just not looking for 245 as the upper limit when shooting, but nearer 255 (253 if you like, because there's lots of room in these "2" when thinking in the 12 or 14 bit the sensor has in the raw file - while the sensor records linearly, this "0-255" we are shown is logarithmic to better match "f-stops"), and going for 245 in post - this is more or less what Joe recommends.
Relying on the histogram (instead of metering) normally gives you enough headroom in the raw files to be fine when doing ETTR; as someone else pointed out in some comment here there's an exposure bias at play to give this headroom, and it depends of the camera model - so testing one's own equipment is crucial. If you are fine with what you get with your method, go for it (and if smaller print sizes are your target, than it doesn't matter anyway if there's noise in the shadows).
Noise is overrated, especially when it comes to Olympus MFT cameras (they have "nice" noise that has kind of an "analog" touch). But your advice is very valuable and perfectly matches what I found usable in low-light situations (but without using the histogram - I'll do this in the future). For the Pen F it is even more relevant, because you not only get noise in underexposed areas, you get "striped" noise when pulling them up in Camera Raw (other than with the E-M1 Mk II). Thanks for sharing
Thanks so much for this video. Can't wait to test...I learned a lot!
You’re amazing! Keep doing these videos! Thank you!
Thanks a lot for this video. I heard about this but never tried. Your Video encouraged me! ISO 6400 and very good results! I often didnt go above 1600 and pushed the exposure and shadows after. Big mistake i know now.
I wish I have seen this video longtime ago. Gracias Joseph !
Very helpful. I appreciate the detail and use of examples.
This explains it really clearly. Great advice
I don't use a m43 yet, but this is very helpful. Thank you.
Excellent tutorial...can’t wait to give it a try
Hi, wow your explanation really make sense. I tend to lower the ISO depending on the image sensor stabilizer with longer exposure when it’s night shot. In that case always hard time focusing and exposure to the right post processing. And I see a lot of noise in the shadow. After seeing your tutorials, I will change ISO settings to higher ISO and lower the explosive in the post processing. What a great explanation drawings and samples.
Do you think the should I turn down or off the noise reduction in the camera settings?? This is only I did not hear in your video. Thanks.
Great video. When I made your video full screen, I could actually see the differences between the images. I have been exposing to the right because I was convinced to by others who know more than I do. Now I feel like I can expose to the right because I understand why. Years ago I shot some girls indoor court volleyball with a Canon 7D Mark II, and would set the aperature at 2, the shutter speed at 1250, and then put the ISO where ever it needed to be to expose to the right. The images had a lot of noise, but were sharp and in focus. I saw online that some other people had been told to "never shoot above ISO 800" or "never shoot above ISO 1600" and so then they were shooting at lower shutter speeds than I was, to keep their ISO's low. So where I was fixing the shutter speed to get freeze the motion and then using whatever ISO was needed to do that, they were stopping at a maximum ISO and shooting at a lower shutter and getting blurry images and asking how to solve this problem. Well. The solution is to shoot at the shutter speed required and then whatever ISO is needed to expose to the right.
Changing ISO to fit the other settings is a great idea! And it would be easy to do too: Using Auto ISO with a high upper limit, S to fix the needed shutter speed and exposure compensation to determine ETTR (I have a dial on my Pen F for that). I'll try this the next time I'm in a low-light situation that requires slow shutter speeds (instead of relying on image stabilization).
Very educational. Definitely try ETTR method with my em5 mkii soon.
Broadly echoing the comments below; helpful video and well presented. Second video I have watched and impressed by both. Good work👍
Great and very informative video. Thanks for sharing !
I know what an ETTR is and I usually used it in landscape but I'm afraid to raise my iso, In landscape it is ok to under expose sometimes to compensate with the overexpose parts if you wan't a single image shot but in portrait it changes BIGTIME... I was invited to shoot a portrait today and I was disappointed with some of the results, I try to limit the iso and I end up losing those shots... thank you very much... well explained.
I truly believe that the first thing you have to take care of technically is to make a sharp image. If you're keeping your ISO down but then getting softness due to camera or subject movement, that's a mistake in my book. A sharp image will clean up and print so nicely while a slightly blurry one will never look great.
So for me I'll use whatever ISO I need to in order to get a tack sharp image. Once I've done that then I think about ETTR and exposure. Now normally with portrait's I don't choose to raise my ISO too much because I can easily add light with strobes etc. rather than just shooting ambient but if natural light is your thing I've made prints 3 feet wide from ISO 1600/3200 images that I'm very happy with.
@@JosephEllisPhotographer nice, yeah more of natural lights, thanks.
Wow man you blew my mind. This info helps no matter the format you use.thank you so much
Subscribed. Really valuable video. So many people dump on MFT without learning it. Great work, thanks dude.
Great tutorial. Can you expose to the left using JPEGs?
Thanks you make it so simple Expose to the right I'm new to mft and shoot in Manual mode mainly Birds in Woods so usually low light so I up my iso but when looking at the photo pulling it back to the left so it doesn't look over exposed but when I open up in photoshop it looks quite noisy.can't wait get out to try ettr
Great video, powerful hints. Thank you!
Thank you! The best explanation of ETTR I have seen, for any level of photographer :-) . Will OMD5 or 10 perform as well as OMD1in that respect?
Thanks a lot for this nice and informative easy-to-understand video!
Great description. One thing. When you want the histogram to shift to the right, you want to expose the image more, so you want to increase the ISO, or increase the aperture size, or increase the shutter speed time. During ISO adjustment the dials work as you would think to naturally turn the dials in the direction you want the histogram to move. But you need to swap the dial direction in the menus to get the aperture and shutter speed dial direction to work so that the dial direction and the histogram movement feels right. So that when you turn a dial the histogram moves in the direction you feel that it should. This is most important when you are looking at your histogram after a shot so the histogram adjustment is not live. You take a shot, review the image showing the histogram, then look at the right edge of the curve. If you have your aperture and shutter dials set up so the dial direction matches the histogram movement, then you only need to think that you want the histogram for the next shot to be so many clicks left or right. And that histogram movement could be any combination of clicks on the shutter, aperture, or ISO. I usually pick my aperture and shutter so then I am adjusting the ISO. When I am out and about I am usually shooting white and gray cars as they come by and checking my histogram. Someone needs to come up with a camera that allows us to set the ETTR gap in plus and minus stop increments.
In my Olympus cameras, when I turn the back dial with my thumb swiping to the right the live histogram moves to the right or the histogram for my next shot appears more to the right, and when I turn the front dial with my finger swiping to the right, in relationship to me, as I am looking at the back of the camera or through the viewfinder, the histogram also moves to the right. This feels correct and useful to me.
The key to ETTR is collecting more photons. You don't do this by increasing ISO. ISO is simply a volume control on the amplifier in your camera. If you take two images with the same exposure (histogram), one at ISO 400 and one at ISO 200, the one taken at ISO 400 collects half the photons of the one at ISO 200. So for a given ISO, to accomplish ETTR, simply decrease your shutter speed and/or increase your aperture enough to shift the histogram to the right but not too much that you overexpose the highlights.
Thank you. Sorry. I don't agree. The key to ETTR is not collecting more photons, it is maximizing the number of pixels in the recorded image that have a high luminosity value. And in my situations where ISO is needed to be increased for ETTR, the situation is not two images with the same exposure and different ISO's, it is a fixed minimum shutter speed for some reason, a fixed maximum aperture for some reason, and then one exposure with a lower ISO that would be thought to be "normal" and one exposure with a higher ISO that would be thought to be "to the right". In both these situations the shutter and aperture are the same so the photon density is the same. But the advantage the exposure that is "to the right" has is more pixels in the recorded image that are not "crushed" and more pixels that have a higher luminosity so that more detail in the darker parts of the recorded image are, well, recorded.
One more thing. I am out. This is not the beginning of a debate.
@@Smoothblue90 You're right that your are out. What you do need to do is understand the exposure triangle. Here it is fstoppers.com/education/exposure-triangle-understanding-how-aperture-shutter-speed-and-iso-work-together-72878
This is so helpful! Thank you for the walk through and detailed explanation. I really appreciate this.
Great Video, I'm going to try these techniques the next time I'm shooting high ISO with my OMD EM1 MKII Thanks! :)
Thanks Joseph for this video. Greetings from Spain.
Really great video Joseph, thank you. Can I just ask how you expose to the right for a given iso? Surely the only way of reliably doing this if you've reached the maximum aperture for your lens is to reduce shutter speed. If you do this, surely you'll increase your chance of getting a blurry image?
Damon Henry Sharpness is job one so if I need more speed I’ll get it by adding ISO. Once I’m there I’ll look at my shutter and if I can, I’ll lower it by 1/3 - 2/3 of a stop to slightly over expose. For example if I’m good with 1/125 for sharpness but my exposure is 1/200 at ISO 3200 I’ll drop it down to brighten the image. That gives me the best looking high ISO when processed.
What a great video, I needed to see this.
Great vid with a lot of information relevant to my needs. Thanks for taking the time to do this.
Great intro to histograms!
Very good tutorial: thanks a lot - I have subscribed. Though I occasionally shoot wildlife at higher ISO on my EM1.2, I generally use my D500 for the low light/high ISO shots. Though I learned about ETTR a few years ago I normally rely on my camera meter/experience. From now on, however, I will pay more attention to my histogram in low light/high ISO conditions.
Some good ideas to think about.
Thanks for this tutorial. Very useful.
Excellent cours! Thanks!
These days, I'm looking at "up grading" for a new affordable good camera. I noticed that you like Olympus.
There is also (mostly for outside, not really for video, but "respectful" for portraits) the pentax k1 mark II. But really, probably there are many that could do portraits. Fuji are good as well.
Though, I don't know much about Olympus, I have feelings that it is a good option.
If you have time for me, I would appreciate if you could give me some tips...
Thanks in advance!
You say. New. Affordable. Good. Camera. I of course have no idea what affordable means to you. The new cameras I have been interested in are $1600 plus. M1 Mark II. G9. X-T2. And great portrait lenses for those are $1000 plus. Olympus has the 45mm 1.2 and the 75mm 1.2. Fuji has the 56mm 1.2. Is that the dollar ballpark you are thinking about? Right now I think the best value in portrait photography is the Panasonic G7, the Olympus 45mm 1.8, the Godox X1T transmitter, the Godox v870ii for a main light, the Godox tt350 for a side or hair or background light, the Godox S-type Bracket Bowens Mount Holder for Speedlite Flash, and then for a softbox something in the range of the Westcott Rapid Box XL 36" Octabox , or the Cheetah 36" Deep Parabolic Quick RiceBowl, or the Glow ParaPop 38" Portable Softbox.
Great video just what I was looking for!
Great video...thank you for an excellent service to the m43 community
Brother, this makes complete sense! Thanks for the demonstration! Cheers... New sub here!
Man, I have been told that always shoot iso than 800. This blow my mind.
Great Video, I learned a lot.... nicely done and very informative
I still use my E3 and E5 for weddings/portraits...heck for anything! They outperform ANY m4/3 camera.