but the ex arm was a nightmare just thinking about that gives me chill when there will be no more 2d animes (but ig 3d can be good in future but not for me u can enjoy 3d lovers )
@@hanime009 yes but in the same year Vivy fluorite was out and give us one of the best anime of this year with an animation who merged 3d and 2d perfectly
I work as a 3D Artist, and I find that it's not the visuals/style that is the problem, but rather 90% of the time, it's the animation itself. They don't seem to undertstand what curves are and don't treat the animation the same way, they simply let the computer do all the inbetweens and then just set it to like "15fps". Which just looks like an even, laggy mess. A ton of animation could be better if they just chose what keyframes to keep, manually, just like how 2D animation works. (A quick movement uses less keyframes/images than a slow movement for example). It is not even a difficult thing to achieve, not even all that time consuming and simply seems to be a lack of experience and knowledge. I think we will see this improve though, as they get more and more experience with 3D. There are more and more shows that seem to do a decent job recently already.
Absolutely. It is even possible to replicate 2D animation with 3D, by "dumbing down" 3D Animation. Arc System Works already does that with their fighting games
This is exactly what I try to explain to people whenever this topic comes up amongst my friends. Much like many Japanese anime studios however, they just can't wrap their heads around it. Ajin: Demi-Human, while it still had its own issues, is a phenominal example of a beautifully animated CGI anime (all the fighting/action scenes at least, I don't remember much about the animation quality of the rest of the show). S1E5 at ~16:25 is one of the scenes I can't help but go back and watch every now and then when something reminds me of it.
A good point. Japan's 3D artist pool is in its infancy still. There simply aren't enough highly-skilled 3D artists in Japanese studios to support large numbers of fully 3D to highly-dependent 3D show productions. I'm aware that this is slowly changing and we will eventually see a bigger volume of high-end 3D work come out of Japan as the years go by and artists get trained. But the main point again, 3D is just another medium and can be used effectively when planned for from the beginning.
I think it’s bad when a show is COMPLETELY in CGI to compensate with bad 2D animation or used as a solution to production issues. If a show and director started with the vision of using CGI from the beginning, then CGI can be better then 2D. Another option where I believe CGI can be amazing (minus ex arm) is when it’s used alongside 2D animation. A key example is demon slayer who actively uses cgi in there episodes however it blends very well with the 2D animation. Another example is AOT season 4 which only uses CGI for the titans and 2D animation to convey the the rest of the shows characters. This means you’ll be having CGI titans fight with 2D characters in the background making it very hard to blend but I think they did a pretty good job overall.
As an artist I honestly prefer 2D anime. 3D anime can look really good (Land of the Lustrous managed to keep the stylization that the manga has) but 2D has much more room for stylization like, the line art, shapes and facial expressions. 3D film (like Disney) look so much more plain to me because their getting so much more realistic… I don’t feel much emotions for it because it is like something I’ve seen countless times (and can look pretty uncanny honestly). I don’t want anime to become like that, I love how dynamic anime is, I love how nostalgic, timeless or beautiful shows can get. 3D is so much more robotic and boring at times, sometimes even if it’s done right (Of course not always, Spider-verse was absolutely incredible but films like this are quite rare) (I’m not good with phrasing, hope I explained my point well)
I think it depends how it's done. I feel like there is a limit for me when it comes to 2D when it comes to emotion because it always looks really fake. Some really well animated 3D can activate feelings that I only really feel in real life that are much deeper.
@@pleasedontwatchthese9593 Yes, 2D more suitable for overreacting, big emotion potrayal or cartoonic. 3D able to bring out more in depth emotion with more detail changes or small transition.
I noticed Japan sucks at creating 3D animation but have mastered 2D animation. While US sucks at 2D animation but have mastered more 3D animation and CGI. American sfx and CGI in the US are top notch compared to Japan or other countries. That's why their live action movies have better special effects and crazy realistic creatures and cgi character designs . But America makes crappy 2D character design and when it's 2D animation, they do tweening type (ex Rick and Morty, Family guy, Steven universe, adventure time), pretty much all of their recent 2d animations are tweening instead of frame by frame. It's interesting I wonder why they don't do frame by frame 2D anymore? Maybe the money isn't in it for the US anymore and make more money doing 3d animations and CGI. While Japan sucks at CGI and 3d animation. But super crazy good in their 2d animations. Maybe they don't have the latest software for 3d? Or the money isn't for it in Japan yet that's why they don't make enough 3d? I heard the money is more in videogames and that's where they use their 3d animations.
I think i read somewhere he’s not completely against CG, he just doesn’t like using too much of it. I believe the exact amount he allows is 10% CG in his films
I think ufotable is godly implementing 3D elements in their animation, like the fate/zero persecution scene, that was amazing, also with Kimetsu no Yaiba with the movie, and I’m not sure but I heard that the effects of the weapons clashing in fate are 3D, but to be honest I don’t even notice if
Yeah, Demon Slayer does make use of 3D alot as well, but they executed it very well. I really don't find it jarring and it actually captures the experience it needs. Sure there will be others just plainly don't like any form of 3D. But other than that, Demon Slayer executed their 3D pretty well.
that fate/zero persecution scene wasn't 3d. 3d was only used as reference for angles. thats usually what ufotable does. they use 3d for reference, but they draw and animate in 2d
CGI/3D is just fine when it's done well. See Duke of Death and his Maid, Gantz:O or Orange's absolute beautiful Beastars and Land of Lustrous. I hope it continues to be used as a compliment to traditional animation as well.
Really forgot Gantz:O was out , Watched it in Netflix and was very impressed with it. Major respect to the effort when is done right. And interesting other titles are does in Netflix or other sites?
Hi, former 3D Animator for the (now closed) Xebec Animation Studio here. I was still finishing up as a student back in the 90s, (yep im old) when I was wowed back then by Zoids Chaotic Century with their 3D (it didn't age well). I ended up working for the studio some time later in the mid to late 2000s. 3D has definitely gotten better in anime over the years, where they are put to good use, a good show would be able to either make it blend well enough, or hide it in a lot of stuff that it isnt too noticeable (a good example is the recent Gundam Hathaway movie). Im still slightly on the fence with full 3D shows like Kengan Ashura, but they make up for it in either style or story. Yeah it does boil down to preference, but the industry as a whole, while not yet at a level I'm impressed with (The Resident Evil 3D movies are not so good) is getting better. I currently work in the games industry - seeing the stuff that games companies can produce, Im sure anime studios have it in them to produce better quality 3D shows.
I think we should actually go backwards to Initial D levels of 3D animations from the 90s with how they intermixed the 3D cars with the 2D animation. Truly a classic!
This series is like “Let’s fight” lite. The thumbnail and first impression of the video feels like a YT news channel lol, although the feeling goes away when you start watching. I like this type of content, have a good day.
It all depends on the studio. With Beastars, I was slightly put off at first, but fell in love with the style very shortly after. But when we look at Berserk 2016/2017. Which was handled by a studio with no prior 3D animation experience. Well.. It's pretty obvious which one was the better adaptation.
Seeing how gorgeous it is in battle scenes in series such as 86-Eighty Six and Night Head 2041 the answer is a resounding NO. I mean, that scene on the battlefield in the latest 86-Eighty Six episode had amazing animations.
the key thing here, for me, is that the CGI is limited to 'lifeless' objects or machinery. Even in something old like Initial D because it's the cars it looks good but when it's background characters or people it or evas (this ones kinda my take) it look like crap. CGI does not have emotion and conveys it all weird. Berserk 2016 died for this
@@voidvisual oh, absolutely. I never said I wanted to see more 100% CGI anime, but action scenes? Definitely. I would love to see more anime use CGI in their action/fighting scenes if they can get it done correctly. Night Head 2041 from this year is the perfect example. It's mostly CGI but my goodness those fight scenes were mind blowing (and it's actually a solid series).
I'm not sure why Joey disagreed with the 3D animation in "Blame!", but I bloody loved it, and it's what got me into binging anime as a whole just because of how amazing it looked along with the plot.
Hey Joey, really liking the stuff you putting out on your second channel. I like the liberty you’re giving yourself with the second channel because you’re talking about a lot of diverse stuff (I feel) that’s really interesting to listen to.
@@missplainjane3905 are you saying that demon slayer, fate series, attack on titan, howl’s moving castle, etc. don’t look stunning? I think you are limiting CGI to “is it a 3D model or not” when it is really “make this object move in 3D”.
From what I have gathered from colleagues who have worked in Japan on various projects, its that there is an acute shortage of 3D artists, the whole system of training and pipeline support has been set up for 2D, very few studios actually invest in workflow innovations for 3D. I understand that Polygon is one such company because the founder has had exposure to western techniques. Its changing though I think. To your point about hiding the 3d, this just requires a time investment in look development time. I'm a matte painter. I once made some backgrounds for Spiderverse for example which achieved painterly style but as you know that show has a lot the dynamic camera work enabled by 3D. Anyway, I'm sure that achieving the aesthetic while saving time will be easier achieved with projects with enough budget. For the Studios themselves, its a learning process, they all will get better at using it.
Joey, listen to Rob here. Echoing some of what I said in my comment as well. Japan's 3D artist force just isn't robust enough yet to support lots of high-end 3D at the moment. But it will be. Probably within the next 5 years.
I loved this Joey! Fantastic topic. I really like your approach on the reasoning why studios have to switch to 3D. I personally don't mind it when it isn't a problem for the movement. Its just that I am so used to 2D animation where sometimes limbs make impossible movements to make it look more emotive and I miss that. I'm really sure that in a few years time "simplistic" animes that dont have very difficult character designs will knock it out of the park. I'm sad to see an artform like the 2D animation have to make way for 3D, but If that means artists will get paid better and won't have a gruesome deadline I'll take it. Thanks for the content!
The one anime I'm very mixed with CG is Dorohedoro. I absoulty love the story, the character and the world and I'm happy we got some form of anime adaptation to it. My conflicting feeling with the show is Q Hayashidas artstyle being turned into CG. The dark gritty atomsphare the manga is drawn is absoulty breath taking but to see it being done in CG and not really having the same feeling just feels off. Im not saying its bad, I just wish it could have been done in a way where it feels and looks like her work but thats something that would be hard to do. I do hope it Dai Dark gets an anime adaptaion it's done in 2d but I wont hate it if it's done in CG.
Cgi in anime can be great if it’s done right! Dragon Quest: Dai’s Great Adventure (2020) is also another great example of CGI in anime done right, especially during the fight/action scenes
I think a great underrated gem of 3D anime is High Score Girl on Netflix. There is moments where it looks choppy BUT they did a very good job with playing with 3d perspectives to achieve those anime effects like an enlarged fist hitting someone or exaggerated facial expressions
yea, i agree. My example would be The Dungeon of Black Company's second ed. And ngl, i keep coming back to rewatch it ruclips.net/video/BT6KV5G6-NM/видео.html
I recommend checking out Akage no Anne and Oniisama e. Both show with animation and art that's held up today, and I believe they were made in the 80s/90s.
@@moro-og-739 Some Z episodes dip in quality. But some, if not most, look amazing that you'll have a full blown erection just by looking at it. And the movement of the animation is really good for its time as well. Katsuyoshi Nakatsuru Tadayoshi Yamamuro (Prime) Naotoshi Shida Naoki Tate Masaki Satou to name a few of the people who gave us spectacular animation and artwork in DBZ.
when i think of cgi in anime, i usually think of girly idol-focused anime, like the Aikatsu! franchise, Love Live! franchise, Pretty Series franchise, BanG Dream! franchise (seasons 2 & 3 were fully cgi), and D4DJ First Mix. The first 3 franchises i mentioned used cgi for performance aspects of the show, while the remainder of it was fully 2d. But, if you look the last example, D4DJ First Mix, Studio Orange took advantage of the fact that it was fully 3d cgi, and tried to make it as fun as possible (in comparison to seasons 2 & 3 of its sister series, BanG Dream!, which looked VERY JARRING and odd with its mix of 2d and 3d animation).
Bit sad Joey didn't mention POLYGON Pictures which is a studio that has made, in my opinion, almost equal strides in full CGI works to Studio Orange with their Godzilla movies, Blame(Joey did mention this one and said it was a missed opportunity to not go 2D for this one, but I'd argue the movie still looks great. The general aesthetic of the movie worked really well in CGI), and not to mention Ajin. I should probably also mention the new movie for Sidonia no Kishi that came out in June that looks great from the trailers. Admittedly, CGI animation in terms of character movements can look a bit jank, but they've also done great character animations in these works, along with actually doing a great job with actual human characters in terms of facial animations as well. BBK/BRNK was a great mention though. Was a bit afraid that show wouldn't be mentioned either. Sorry this was a bit rambly, I scrolled down and only saw about 1 comment mention Ajin and mostly other shows were mentioned. I just wanted to share my love for the POLYGON works somehow.
Land of the Lustrious completely changed my view on 3D anime when done right. Also just hate when they try to mesh 2D and 3D together where it doesn't look good at all
I think it just needs to be done well and don't mind CGI in certain things. Sometimes, it just makes more sense to do it in cg. Besides, almost everything nowadays is not even "traditionally" hand drawn anyway in the classic sense. Hardly anyone is using paper, they are using computer programs to help them draw and there is still a lot of things that the program will help you do.
I honestly think the CG/2D hybrid is the way forward. Not the oddly placed CG in mostly 2D scenes, but stuff like Spider-Man Into the Spider-verse, Beastars, and the newly released Arcane. It takes the best from CG and 2D and fuses them together in proper harmony. You get the cinematic lighting, depth, dynamic movements with the expressiveness if 2D. Blender is also becoming huge and things like the grease pencil hand the ability to make 2D animation along with 3D just seems to create more efficient ways of animating. I love 2D anime like Mob Psycho but most anime don't have the free-form animation. I find a lot of 2D anime very stiff. 2D backgrounds with little depth don't excite me as much. Along with uniform lines (no line-weight) makes things so flat. It is easy to point at the failed CG Ghibli movie, but we also had Lupin III and Belle released recently. I don't think something like Spider-Man into the Spider-verse or Arcane is "cheap." Japan's traditionalism may end up hurting them. Especially, the cranking out quantity over quality. They don't give enough room for polish. The West is already starting to experiment away from the typical Disney style now. Ironically, there seems to be a lot of anime and stop motion influences in stuff like Luca. China is also is skilled with CG and may break into the mainstream one of these days too.
A good example of excellently used CG in anime is with Mobile Suit Gundam Unicorn, Sunrise used 3D models in the scene, and in another process, they completely draw over it and make it from CG to 2D.
As a 3D technical artist myself, this is not a question of "which is better", it's a question of which is used most effectively to achieve the artistic vision. It all comes down to preproduction and planning. Show productions which use 3D as a crutch will obviously feel lower quality. Planning for 3D from the beginning and understanding its limits is what actual good production practice is. The truth is, most Japanese anime studios suck at using 3D programs right now (Orange, Ufotable being exceptions, along with Ghibli a little.) As Japan's 3D artist force matures, 3D anime will become "better" and far more prevalent. There's also a giant industry shift happening behind the scenes in the west ever since Spider-verse was introduced. 2D and 3D are becoming less separated and I've been seeing more and more calls to have mixed media properties.
I should also add that people seem to think 3D is automatically easier to accomplish than 2D animation. This is not necessarily the case. There is mountains more prep-work that has to be done before any 3D animator can even add a key frame to a timeline. On especially well rendered 3D shows, production time is often far more laborious than on a show of similar quality in 2D. There's simply just so many more factors to keep track of. Literally another dimension of them. So while the overall production may be quicker, it does not, by any means, make it easier.
Well, bad CGI is bad. Sometimes it doesn't blend in with the hand drawn animation at all and that really sucks. The best CGI you don't notice much if at all.
If done correctly, i think CGI can be amazing when used, for example, animes like Dorohedoro, or the "Idol Parts" of Zombieland Saga Revenge (which is mainly 2D) look amazing
The thing with CGI is depends on who is making it and why he is making it , like for example Berserk 2016 2017 that thing everyone knows why it ended up like that because of Ego basically not going into details, things like Beastars and Land of lustrous it is very shown the love and care put into it to come out like that which made it good.
Budgets his a huge part of what makes bad cgi a thing but recent years has shown us that studios can makes some amazing fully 3d anime and the more time passes the better they will get. Studio Orange does amazing, the Honkai Impact 3rd anime shorts made by MihoyoAnime are fabulous and hell the next Dragon Ball Super movie kinda looks great to me.
The unfortunate thing with CG in general is that it's easy to pick up and hard to do well. Another thing is that bad CG is jarringly noticeable and you will never even see the good CG, unless you know what to look for. A lotta times bad CG is a product of production limitations and a limit on resources.
Most anime have CG backgrounds and do very well with them, but for whatever reason character animation is not their forte. There are independent animators who do excellent CG anime characters, but studios can’t seem to get it right (be that because of time constraints, know-how, etc.).
Really thought the cgi looked really good in "Beastars" and "Ronja the Robber's Daughter". But as long as the story and the characters are good, I don't mind if an anime is handdrawn or cgi.
As an older fan of anime I have always loved how traditional anime looks. Not only the character design but the overall visual product, the feel of the strokes, the paint, the background paintings, etc. I stopped watching anime over ten years ago, at least modern anime because I can't stand CGI in anime and I'm not talking about products like Berserk; I'm talking about regular shows. They look visually awful, plastic, artless because digitally produced anime doesn't have the gentleness of pencil strokes and the texture of real paint. The combination of choppy animation with flowig backgrounds don't mix well either. I see too many problems with modern anime. Fortunately, there are still many old series to watch. Try Ann of the Green Gables, Swiss Robinson Family or Future Boy Conan. Look at the art.
I think it is a natural progression of things when it comes to this media. CGI will be the way to go, it'll improve to a point that it will be the same as / or some in the level of traditional anime. I would love the Corridor Crew take on this as video as well or a challenge probably. At the end of the day, we have to stick to it. Support our animators, creators, authors, and the anime industry itself. It will get better! Love the topic, Joey! Great job discussing it!
I just watched Arcane today and I would say it is at the level of traditional anime and surpasses it in that it has the expressiveness of traditional 2D and the lighting/effects and dynamic depth and movement of CG.
Am I wrong for seeing the title and thinking of the ex-arm anime? Also, I think it's a matter of skill and studio. Example, Studio Ufotable ia god tier with their CG
I used to not like CGI anime but after watching Kengan Ashura, I actually don't mind CGI that much. For me, I think the CGI actually enhanced the anime for me cause it made the fights smoother. I am starting to like CGI more.
For me it's more about the artsyle, like when I see Beastars I don't think if it as a CGI anime I just think if it as 3D animation with anime textures. Kind of like an anime video game.
I think "The Duke of Death and His Maid" did a really good job of using 3D. The first episode looked a bit bizzare, but overall the execution was the best I've seen for 3Dish anime.
I realize that it was a French studio, but when I was a kid I really liked Code Lyoko. Even though it hasn't aged well, props to them for mixing the 3d and 2d.
I don't entirely agree that 'Japan is behind with CGI'. There are wonderful older examples like Vexille, Appleseed and FFVII: Advent Children to name a few. It's more like the anime industry is behind, and even that is not entirely true given how well GITS SAC (2002-2005) used CGI for Tachikomas, the entirety of Freedom or the more experimental stuff by Studio 4C.
In my opinion, I actually like both styles even in Western Animation.... but I'm a big fan of 3D Animation overall. Beastars is a good example as to why I feel Anime should at least try the 3D route as some of the 2D segements in the Anime feel... stiff, whilst the 3D stuff feel organic and fluid, just the natural movements of the characters is stunning to watch, especially with the action scenes
When you mention mixing CGI with handdrawn animation, even that doesn't have to look bad, actually. Much like with 3D animations itself, mixing CGI with handdrawn animation really depends on how it's applied, either by hiding the GCI very well, using it for large background objects (which tend to have a different style in many animations anyway) or deliberately _not_ hiding it and denote that something is otherworldy. There also is the fact that in many 2D animations, the static "background" uses a different style (e.g. a more realistic shading or more abstract graphics) compared to the animated "foreground" (e.g. only two shadings or being less abstract). This makes it very easy to pick up what gets interacted with and what doesn't and the style will often clash. Indeed, using a 3D background with a 2D foreground is really the same thing, just with a different medium, which means it can look bad but it can also look very interesting.
Violet Evergarden has some CRAZY good uses of CGI in it’s animation. For instance the cm for the light novel used no cg and the first shot of it had violet using a typewriter, that cut took the animators 1 month to finish. This is what led to the using cg for the full anime, and they still look GORGEOUS!
That's the thing, bad CGI is bad CGI, if they do it well and it works then great, but it's upsetting when they have no skill in the production of CGI and just slap it onto a series because "the future"
For me, the best Anime with 3d CGI would have to be Kengan Ashura, the designs are very stylised and the movement is mostly very good and natural looking which I think is the biggest thing that puts people off of 3d elements in anime. And the only reason I watched it was because I wanted to watch Baki but I kinda got overwhelmed and confused with where to start and then I saw Kengan from the recommendations and ended up loving it, the style was definitely off putting at first but I quickly got over it, and I would love to hear your opinion of it, if you can, please.
Nighthead 2041 is definitely a slept on cg anime. That shit was gorgeous but im pretty sure alot of people who saw it was cg just immediately noped out. It kills me that people just refuse to give some things a chance. Nighthead is definitely getting slept on
I think several of the best modern studios like Mappa, WIT, Ufotable, A-1, and others under the Production I.G. Umbrella have shown over the past seven or eight years that a well blended mixture of both looks the best as of now.
The show Ultraman from Netflix also showed potential on the animation in 3D. That it looked pretty real in certain aspects. And the animation looked smooth. (considering that first I heard about it the show was also Live Action back in the day. It was a great update having search old clips and pics) also Arcane is a good milestone too( not finish the series yet but with the few episodes in oh my goodness the amazing quality it has.)
I just finished kingdom season 1 and that would be the original ex arm type of animation where they constantly used 2d 3d animation but it doesn't mix well
6:00 when it comes to time limits (at least today) Hollywood is also very strict, for example frozen 2 had a deadline which resulted in the poorly stitched together story that we got. But for why toy story “looked better” it might stem from Pixar having experimented a lot with 3D in their short films like the lamp in their logo which was an experiment with how light moved and bounced on objects.
CGI can be very well done "Drowning sorrow in raging fire", which is a manhwa mostly if not solely in 3D, seems to be motion captured (mocap). It makes the cgi very lifelike. If they didn't mocap it, they did an insanely good job at it.
From a financial stand point, making a high budget 3d-based anime movie with assets polished AF, and then recycle the assets for a lower budget series might be a more sounding business. I think disney is doing this practice? But as how anime goes, it's usually the other way around, series first and then movie though that's not always the case for every title/IP. In the end 3d or hand drawn is just a technique. They have their own limitations and resource management strategy but they are both capable of producing high quality entertaining animes.
its about how its used not whether one is better than the other. But yes also personal preference too. I am a aspiring animator who doesn't really know too much about the industry, but I am very passionate about this topic
Idk about God Eater being 3D or not but I love the animation aesthetic and vibes, even though lots of people dislike the shading effect and their animation aesthetic.
In my opinion, 3D CGI is just another tool to make anime. It's up to the creators, animators, and producers to decide how to use it. I think 3D CGI has a ton of potential in anime. Give it time to grow, change and develop. Don't just say it's bad because it's not 2D. Okay that's all.
3:30 Some good examples of 3d hiding Heavens feel part 1: Lancer walking toward Assassin on the construction lift / Assassin dodging Lancers attacks on the truck Evangelion Rebuild : Asuka force feeding Shinji Kimetsu: Thunderclap sixfold when zenitsu dodges the poison spit/ Akaza and Rengoku trashtalk scene where the camera angle spins
I think that 3D Anime can be just as good as 2D Anime if it's done right, with the proper budget, time, effort, dedication and talent. Some 3D Anime i really liked were: Houseki no Kuni, Gantz: 0, Final Fantasy XV: Kingsglaive, Beastars and Kengan Ashura.
A good anime called Girls und Panzer combines 2d and 3d pretty well with the recent movies that has some real quality animation. Also if you liked Tanks or any other type of military history, then this is an excellent watch for you. (note that if your watching for good plot then this is not for you, but the battles, action scenes, history, and all the fine details put in this anime will surely make you enjoy it)
Ever since I watched gigguks video on bad cg I’ve started noticing the use of cg. And these days instead of saying “oh god it’s bad cg” i say “ oh wow that’s some pretty seamless cg. Still found it though”
I think the big break in CGI besides Beastars and the other show you mentioned, I really think Promare has really pushed the line on blending the 2D and 3D animation, which goes to show what the studio standards will be in the next ten years.
Certain elements of 3D done properly can be good, I like 2D a lot but it doesn’t mean 3D is always a bad thing
For once stop commenting
but the ex arm was a nightmare just thinking about that gives me chill when there will be no more 2d animes (but ig 3d can be good in future but not for me u can enjoy 3d lovers )
@@hanime009 yes but in the same year Vivy fluorite was out and give us one of the best anime of this year with an animation who merged 3d and 2d perfectly
@@yellowcard8100 mad cuz he getting likes ? Grow up
@@mnoosm642 mad cuz he gets likes? Grow up
I work as a 3D Artist, and I find that it's not the visuals/style that is the problem, but rather 90% of the time, it's the animation itself.
They don't seem to undertstand what curves are and don't treat the animation the same way, they simply let the computer do all the inbetweens and then just set it to like "15fps". Which just looks like an even, laggy mess.
A ton of animation could be better if they just chose what keyframes to keep, manually, just like how 2D animation works. (A quick movement uses less keyframes/images than a slow movement for example). It is not even a difficult thing to achieve, not even all that time consuming and simply seems to be a lack of experience and knowledge.
I think we will see this improve though, as they get more and more experience with 3D. There are more and more shows that seem to do a decent job recently already.
very true
Absolutely. It is even possible to replicate 2D animation with 3D, by "dumbing down" 3D Animation. Arc System Works already does that with their fighting games
They did that with Beastars.
This is exactly what I try to explain to people whenever this topic comes up amongst my friends. Much like many Japanese anime studios however, they just can't wrap their heads around it. Ajin: Demi-Human, while it still had its own issues, is a phenominal example of a beautifully animated CGI anime (all the fighting/action scenes at least, I don't remember much about the animation quality of the rest of the show). S1E5 at ~16:25 is one of the scenes I can't help but go back and watch every now and then when something reminds me of it.
A good point. Japan's 3D artist pool is in its infancy still. There simply aren't enough highly-skilled 3D artists in Japanese studios to support large numbers of fully 3D to highly-dependent 3D show productions. I'm aware that this is slowly changing and we will eventually see a bigger volume of high-end 3D work come out of Japan as the years go by and artists get trained. But the main point again, 3D is just another medium and can be used effectively when planned for from the beginning.
I think it’s bad when a show is COMPLETELY in CGI to compensate with bad 2D animation or used as a solution to production issues. If a show and director started with the vision of using CGI from the beginning, then CGI can be better then 2D. Another option where I believe CGI can be amazing (minus ex arm) is when it’s used alongside 2D animation. A key example is demon slayer who actively uses cgi in there episodes however it blends very well with the 2D animation. Another example is AOT season 4 which only uses CGI for the titans and 2D animation to convey the the rest of the shows characters. This means you’ll be having CGI titans fight with 2D characters in the background making it very hard to blend but I think they did a pretty good job overall.
well UFOtable in general uses a lot of CGI.
100% agreed
AOT S4 used it for more than titans it was just good enough to where it was sometimes more difficult to notice.
Counter example - land of lustrous was meant to be 2D.. but it came out amazing in 3D
really wondering if anyone has seen duke of death anime that shit was atrocious
You should title these: “Patron Picks.”
"welcome to pp: patron picks". a series where i take p(is)s (patron suggestions) from my patreon.
Welcome to the scam picks! The series where you create content for me and spend money to ask me questions 😊
As an artist I honestly prefer 2D anime. 3D anime can look really good (Land of the Lustrous managed to keep the stylization that the manga has) but 2D has much more room for stylization like, the line art, shapes and facial expressions. 3D film (like Disney) look so much more plain to me because their getting so much more realistic… I don’t feel much emotions for it because it is like something I’ve seen countless times (and can look pretty uncanny honestly). I don’t want anime to become like that, I love how dynamic anime is, I love how nostalgic, timeless or beautiful shows can get. 3D is so much more robotic and boring at times, sometimes even if it’s done right (Of course not always, Spider-verse was absolutely incredible but films like this are quite rare)
(I’m not good with phrasing, hope I explained my point well)
I 100% agree with all of your points i feel like this is the opinion we should think about with cgi and 2d
I absolutely agree with the your points!
I think it depends how it's done. I feel like there is a limit for me when it comes to 2D when it comes to emotion because it always looks really fake. Some really well animated 3D can activate feelings that I only really feel in real life that are much deeper.
@@pleasedontwatchthese9593 Yes, 2D more suitable for overreacting, big emotion potrayal or cartoonic. 3D able to bring out more in depth emotion with more detail changes or small transition.
I noticed Japan sucks at creating 3D animation but have mastered 2D animation. While US sucks at 2D animation but have mastered more 3D animation and CGI. American sfx and CGI in the US are top notch compared to Japan or other countries. That's why their live action movies have better special effects and crazy realistic creatures and cgi character designs . But America makes crappy 2D character design and when it's 2D animation, they do tweening type (ex Rick and Morty, Family guy, Steven universe, adventure time), pretty much all of their recent 2d animations are tweening instead of frame by frame. It's interesting I wonder why they don't do frame by frame 2D anymore? Maybe the money isn't in it for the US anymore and make more money doing 3d animations and CGI.
While Japan sucks at CGI and 3d animation. But super crazy good in their 2d animations. Maybe they don't have the latest software for 3d? Or the money isn't for it in Japan yet that's why they don't make enough 3d? I heard the money is more in videogames and that's where they use their 3d animations.
Miyazaki already used CG in 1997 with Princess Mononoke, of course only for small parts and very well hidden.
I think i read somewhere he’s not completely against CG, he just doesn’t like using too much of it. I believe the exact amount he allows is 10% CG in his films
That creepy looking wavy tentacle monster right?
@@abhiroopdas3232 Yes but also the particle effects for the Daidarabotchi (night walker)
Yeah the first animated film to have CGI was an anime
I think ufotable is godly implementing 3D elements in their animation, like the fate/zero persecution scene, that was amazing, also with Kimetsu no Yaiba with the movie, and I’m not sure but I heard that the effects of the weapons clashing in fate are 3D, but to be honest I don’t even notice if
They used a ton of CGI in Heavens Feel too
Yeah, Demon Slayer does make use of 3D alot as well, but they executed it very well. I really don't find it jarring and it actually captures the experience it needs. Sure there will be others just plainly don't like any form of 3D. But other than that, Demon Slayer executed their 3D pretty well.
that fate/zero persecution scene wasn't 3d. 3d was only used as reference for angles. thats usually what ufotable does. they use 3d for reference, but they draw and animate in 2d
"People only notice CG when it's bad CG" - Grant
Land of the lustrous is my favorite anime series of all time, mostly thanks to the gorgeous and stunning cgi work from studio orange
So happy to see lotl fans x3 I've read the manga a few times, I love the story
CGI/3D is just fine when it's done well. See Duke of Death and his Maid, Gantz:O or Orange's absolute beautiful Beastars and Land of Lustrous. I hope it continues to be used as a compliment to traditional animation as well.
Really forgot Gantz:O was out , Watched it in Netflix and was very impressed with it. Major respect to the effort when is done right. And interesting other titles are does in Netflix or other sites?
I really like what Arc System Works is doing with their fighting games like Guilty Gear and Dragon Ball Fighter Z.
Hi, former 3D Animator for the (now closed) Xebec Animation Studio here. I was still finishing up as a student back in the 90s, (yep im old) when I was wowed back then by Zoids Chaotic Century with their 3D (it didn't age well). I ended up working for the studio some time later in the mid to late 2000s. 3D has definitely gotten better in anime over the years, where they are put to good use, a good show would be able to either make it blend well enough, or hide it in a lot of stuff that it isnt too noticeable (a good example is the recent Gundam Hathaway movie).
Im still slightly on the fence with full 3D shows like Kengan Ashura, but they make up for it in either style or story. Yeah it does boil down to preference, but the industry as a whole, while not yet at a level I'm impressed with (The Resident Evil 3D movies are not so good) is getting better. I currently work in the games industry - seeing the stuff that games companies can produce, Im sure anime studios have it in them to produce better quality 3D shows.
It's hard, I mean CGI can be Land of the Lustrous and Beastars or Berserk and Ex-Arm...
Hard to tell..
Or you get the inbetween that is High Score Girl and The Duke of Death and his maid.
What about Earwig and the Witch?
all cgi in anime is garbage
@@user-vs8nu8id5q no
I think we should actually go backwards to Initial D levels of 3D animations from the 90s with how they intermixed the 3D cars with the 2D animation. Truly a classic!
This series is like “Let’s fight” lite. The thumbnail and first impression of the video feels like a YT news channel lol, although the feeling goes away when you start watching. I like this type of content, have a good day.
It really depends on the anime. Land of the Lustrous knocked it out of the park. Berserk 2016 however……
yes, the 3d made their bodies look more gem like and looked awesome.
He'll yeah, Houseki no Kuni rocks
Gantz:0 is a perfect example of great CGI anime. It's usually on Netflix, worth checking out.
Wasn't there an insane budget for that?
Shirogumi made a pasterpiece 3DCGI in 86
Dorohedoro used 3D animation for the characters, and still is one of the best animes the winter season of 2020 gave us.
Looks like garbage. It's worse when they use CGI to try and imitate the 2D animation, instead of doing its own art style.
@Max Dela Penya Third grade drop-out confirmed.
It all depends on the studio. With Beastars, I was slightly put off at first, but fell in love with the style very shortly after. But when we look at Berserk 2016/2017. Which was handled by a studio with no prior 3D animation experience. Well.. It's pretty obvious which one was the better adaptation.
Seeing how gorgeous it is in battle scenes in series such as 86-Eighty Six and Night Head 2041 the answer is a resounding NO.
I mean, that scene on the battlefield in the latest 86-Eighty Six episode had amazing animations.
the key thing here, for me, is that the CGI is limited to 'lifeless' objects or machinery. Even in something old like Initial D because it's the cars it looks good but when it's background characters or people it or evas (this ones kinda my take) it look like crap. CGI does not have emotion and conveys it all weird. Berserk 2016 died for this
@@voidvisual oh, absolutely. I never said I wanted to see more 100% CGI anime, but action scenes? Definitely. I would love to see more anime use CGI in their action/fighting scenes if they can get it done correctly.
Night Head 2041 from this year is the perfect example. It's mostly CGI but my goodness those fight scenes were mind blowing (and it's actually a solid series).
@@voidvisual I liked the 3D animation and CGI in Evangelion 4.0 - might be an unpopular opinion at this point.
I'm not sure why Joey disagreed with the 3D animation in "Blame!", but I bloody loved it, and it's what got me into binging anime as a whole just because of how amazing it looked along with the plot.
@@voidvisual hmm.. whats your thoughts about Ajin, I liked it though, cos it make those black matter more creepy hahah
10:28 Joey deadass gave the same point three times
Hey Joey, really liking the stuff you putting out on your second channel. I like the liberty you’re giving yourself with the second channel because you’re talking about a lot of diverse stuff (I feel) that’s really interesting to listen to.
It done correctly, it can look great.
But it really takes me out of it when the 3D is rendered at a very low frame rate in some of these anime.
CG in Anime can be really good either if the studio embraces the fully 3D route or if they blend it in so well that you don't notice it.
@@missplainjane3905 it doest tbh
@@missplainjane3905 are you saying that demon slayer, fate series, attack on titan, howl’s moving castle, etc. don’t look stunning? I think you are limiting CGI to “is it a 3D model or not” when it is really “make this object move in 3D”.
It’s all about being immersive. It cannot take you out of the story
or they third way it and make it unrecognisable to either? not a mix, well maybe a mix. The best example I can give is klaus
@thomasffrench3639 yes!
My first encounter of 3D anime is Land of Lustrous. It was odd at first but I got hooked by how smooth their movements are.
From what I have gathered from colleagues who have worked in Japan on various projects, its that there is an acute shortage of 3D artists, the whole system of training and pipeline support has been set up for 2D, very few studios actually invest in workflow innovations for 3D. I understand that Polygon is one such company because the founder has had exposure to western techniques. Its changing though I think. To your point about hiding the 3d, this just requires a time investment in look development time. I'm a matte painter. I once made some backgrounds for Spiderverse for example which achieved painterly style but as you know that show has a lot the dynamic camera work enabled by 3D. Anyway, I'm sure that achieving the aesthetic while saving time will be easier achieved with projects with enough budget. For the Studios themselves, its a learning process, they all will get better at using it.
Joey, listen to Rob here. Echoing some of what I said in my comment as well. Japan's 3D artist force just isn't robust enough yet to support lots of high-end 3D at the moment. But it will be. Probably within the next 5 years.
I loved this Joey! Fantastic topic. I really like your approach on the reasoning why studios have to switch to 3D. I personally don't mind it when it isn't a problem for the movement. Its just that I am so used to 2D animation where sometimes limbs make impossible movements to make it look more emotive and I miss that.
I'm really sure that in a few years time "simplistic" animes that dont have very difficult character designs will knock it out of the park.
I'm sad to see an artform like the 2D animation have to make way for 3D, but If that means artists will get paid better and won't have a gruesome deadline I'll take it.
Thanks for the content!
I liked the CGI in Dorohedoro! It added to the fight scene that would have otherwise been really hard to draw
The one anime I'm very mixed with CG is Dorohedoro. I absoulty love the story, the character and the world and I'm happy we got some form of anime adaptation to it. My conflicting feeling with the show is Q Hayashidas artstyle being turned into CG. The dark gritty atomsphare the manga is drawn is absoulty breath taking but to see it being done in CG and not really having the same feeling just feels off. Im not saying its bad, I just wish it could have been done in a way where it feels and looks like her work but thats something that would be hard to do. I do hope it Dai Dark gets an anime adaptaion it's done in 2d but I wont hate it if it's done in CG.
Cgi in anime can be great if it’s done right! Dragon Quest: Dai’s Great Adventure (2020) is also another great example of CGI in anime done right, especially during the fight/action scenes
I'd like to put in Lupin the First in that category. Another fine example as CG working ever so well in animation.
I just want to know how toei will handle the CGI for dragon ball super super hero
I think a great underrated gem of 3D anime is High Score Girl on Netflix. There is moments where it looks choppy BUT they did a very good job with playing with 3d perspectives to achieve those anime effects like an enlarged fist hitting someone or exaggerated facial expressions
Finally someone talks about high score girl
I am so obsessed with the animation style in Beastars. It's unbelievably satisfying to me and I've never seen anything like it before.
Nope. If it's done correctly it can look good. I do prefer the 90's style of Anime most though.
Dbz and yyh’s style is just pleasing to look at (in good resolution)
yea, i agree. My example would be The Dungeon of Black Company's second ed. And ngl, i keep coming back to rewatch it
ruclips.net/video/BT6KV5G6-NM/видео.html
@@missplainjane3905 Gantz O
I recommend checking out Akage no Anne and Oniisama e. Both show with animation and art that's held up today, and I believe they were made in the 80s/90s.
@@moro-og-739 Some Z episodes dip in quality. But some, if not most, look amazing that you'll have a full blown erection just by looking at it.
And the movement of the animation is really good for its time as well.
Katsuyoshi Nakatsuru
Tadayoshi Yamamuro (Prime)
Naotoshi Shida
Naoki Tate
Masaki Satou
to name a few of the people who gave us spectacular animation and artwork in DBZ.
when i think of cgi in anime, i usually think of girly idol-focused anime, like the Aikatsu! franchise, Love Live! franchise, Pretty Series franchise, BanG Dream! franchise (seasons 2 & 3 were fully cgi), and D4DJ First Mix. The first 3 franchises i mentioned used cgi for performance aspects of the show, while the remainder of it was fully 2d. But, if you look the last example, D4DJ First Mix, Studio Orange took advantage of the fact that it was fully 3d cgi, and tried to make it as fun as possible (in comparison to seasons 2 & 3 of its sister series, BanG Dream!, which looked VERY JARRING and odd with its mix of 2d and 3d animation).
Bit sad Joey didn't mention POLYGON Pictures which is a studio that has made, in my opinion, almost equal strides in full CGI works to Studio Orange with their Godzilla movies, Blame(Joey did mention this one and said it was a missed opportunity to not go 2D for this one, but I'd argue the movie still looks great. The general aesthetic of the movie worked really well in CGI), and not to mention Ajin. I should probably also mention the new movie for Sidonia no Kishi that came out in June that looks great from the trailers.
Admittedly, CGI animation in terms of character movements can look a bit jank, but they've also done great character animations in these works, along with actually doing a great job with actual human characters in terms of facial animations as well.
BBK/BRNK was a great mention though. Was a bit afraid that show wouldn't be mentioned either.
Sorry this was a bit rambly, I scrolled down and only saw about 1 comment mention Ajin and mostly other shows were mentioned. I just wanted to share my love for the POLYGON works somehow.
I watched Ajin and Berserk (2016) - but I also watched Beastars sooo, I kinda think that I now know the range of CGI :'D
Land of the Lustrious completely changed my view on 3D anime when done right. Also just hate when they try to mesh 2D and 3D together where it doesn't look good at all
I think it just needs to be done well and don't mind CGI in certain things. Sometimes, it just makes more sense to do it in cg. Besides, almost everything nowadays is not even "traditionally" hand drawn anyway in the classic sense. Hardly anyone is using paper, they are using computer programs to help them draw and there is still a lot of things that the program will help you do.
I honestly think the CG/2D hybrid is the way forward. Not the oddly placed CG in mostly 2D scenes, but stuff like Spider-Man Into the Spider-verse, Beastars, and the newly released Arcane. It takes the best from CG and 2D and fuses them together in proper harmony. You get the cinematic lighting, depth, dynamic movements with the expressiveness if 2D.
Blender is also becoming huge and things like the grease pencil hand the ability to make 2D animation along with 3D just seems to create more efficient ways of animating. I love 2D anime like Mob Psycho but most anime don't have the free-form animation. I find a lot of 2D anime very stiff. 2D backgrounds with little depth don't excite me as much. Along with uniform lines (no line-weight) makes things so flat.
It is easy to point at the failed CG Ghibli movie, but we also had Lupin III and Belle released recently. I don't think something like Spider-Man into the Spider-verse or Arcane is "cheap." Japan's traditionalism may end up hurting them. Especially, the cranking out quantity over quality. They don't give enough room for polish. The West is already starting to experiment away from the typical Disney style now. Ironically, there seems to be a lot of anime and stop motion influences in stuff like Luca. China is also is skilled with CG and may break into the mainstream one of these days too.
A good example of excellently used CG in anime is with Mobile Suit Gundam Unicorn, Sunrise used 3D models in the scene, and in another process, they completely draw over it and make it from CG to 2D.
Stuff like Arcane really shows off the future of full 3d animation but my thoughts are defiantly more a deep canvas type approach.
I see this, and raise Guilty Gear Strive type 3d.
God damnit, Guilty Gear looks so fucking good!
As a 3D technical artist myself, this is not a question of "which is better", it's a question of which is used most effectively to achieve the artistic vision. It all comes down to preproduction and planning. Show productions which use 3D as a crutch will obviously feel lower quality. Planning for 3D from the beginning and understanding its limits is what actual good production practice is. The truth is, most Japanese anime studios suck at using 3D programs right now (Orange, Ufotable being exceptions, along with Ghibli a little.) As Japan's 3D artist force matures, 3D anime will become "better" and far more prevalent. There's also a giant industry shift happening behind the scenes in the west ever since Spider-verse was introduced. 2D and 3D are becoming less separated and I've been seeing more and more calls to have mixed media properties.
I should also add that people seem to think 3D is automatically easier to accomplish than 2D animation. This is not necessarily the case. There is mountains more prep-work that has to be done before any 3D animator can even add a key frame to a timeline. On especially well rendered 3D shows, production time is often far more laborious than on a show of similar quality in 2D. There's simply just so many more factors to keep track of. Literally another dimension of them. So while the overall production may be quicker, it does not, by any means, make it easier.
Well, bad CGI is bad. Sometimes it doesn't blend in with the hand drawn animation at all and that really sucks.
The best CGI you don't notice much if at all.
If done correctly, i think CGI can be amazing when used, for example, animes like Dorohedoro, or the "Idol Parts" of Zombieland Saga Revenge (which is mainly 2D) look amazing
The thing with CGI is depends on who is making it and why he is making it , like for example Berserk 2016 2017 that thing everyone knows why it ended up like that because of Ego basically not going into details, things like Beastars and Land of lustrous it is very shown the love and care put into it to come out like that which made it good.
Budgets his a huge part of what makes bad cgi a thing but recent years has shown us that studios can makes some amazing fully 3d anime and the more time passes the better they will get. Studio Orange does amazing, the Honkai Impact 3rd anime shorts made by MihoyoAnime are fabulous and hell the next Dragon Ball Super movie kinda looks great to me.
i believe Polygon Pictures did a great job with "Sidonia no Kishi" back in 2014
The unfortunate thing with CG in general is that it's easy to pick up and hard to do well. Another thing is that bad CG is jarringly noticeable and you will never even see the good CG, unless you know what to look for.
A lotta times bad CG is a product of production limitations and a limit on resources.
Land of the lustrous/houseki no kuni did everything right with 3d cgi
Look at land of the lustrous it looks so beautiful couldn't be any better
I think Ergo Proxy did a great job blending 3D CGI and 2D, back in 2006
Most anime have CG backgrounds and do very well with them, but for whatever reason character animation is not their forte. There are independent animators who do excellent CG anime characters, but studios can’t seem to get it right (be that because of time constraints, know-how, etc.).
Ufotable and studio orange is a good example for "good" 3D CGI animation. Examples being houseki no kuni and Demon Slayer
if i wanted 3d waifus to be rejected by, i'd go outside
Really thought the cgi looked really good in "Beastars" and "Ronja the Robber's Daughter". But as long as the story and the characters are good, I don't mind if an anime is handdrawn or cgi.
We are getting a 3D anime Dragon ball movie (Dragon Ball Super: Super Hero) next year. Look forward to see people compare that with DBS: Broly...
As an older fan of anime I have always loved how traditional anime looks. Not only the character design but the overall visual product, the feel of the strokes, the paint, the background paintings, etc. I stopped watching anime over ten years ago, at least modern anime because I can't stand CGI in anime and I'm not talking about products like Berserk; I'm talking about regular shows. They look visually awful, plastic, artless because digitally produced anime doesn't have the gentleness of pencil strokes and the texture of real paint. The combination of choppy animation with flowig backgrounds don't mix well either.
I see too many problems with modern anime. Fortunately, there are still many old series to watch. Try Ann of the Green Gables, Swiss Robinson Family or Future Boy Conan. Look at the art.
I think it is a natural progression of things when it comes to this media. CGI will be the way to go, it'll improve to a point that it will be the same as / or some in the level of traditional anime.
I would love the Corridor Crew take on this as video as well or a challenge probably.
At the end of the day, we have to stick to it. Support our animators, creators, authors, and the anime industry itself. It will get better!
Love the topic, Joey! Great job discussing it!
I just watched Arcane today and I would say it is at the level of traditional anime and surpasses it in that it has the expressiveness of traditional 2D and the lighting/effects and dynamic depth and movement of CG.
Am I wrong for seeing the title and thinking of the ex-arm anime?
Also, I think it's a matter of skill and studio. Example, Studio Ufotable ia god tier with their CG
I used to not like CGI anime but after watching Kengan Ashura, I actually don't mind CGI that much. For me, I think the CGI actually enhanced the anime for me cause it made the fights smoother. I am starting to like CGI more.
Chinese has a lot of 3d cgi anime.
For me it's more about the artsyle, like when I see Beastars I don't think if it as a CGI anime I just think if it as 3D animation with anime textures. Kind of like an anime video game.
I think "The Duke of Death and His Maid" did a really good job of using 3D. The first episode looked a bit bizzare, but overall the execution was the best I've seen for 3Dish anime.
Given also blended the 3D with the 2D animations really well
it was honestly very impressive
“Is 3D CGI bad for anime”
If you can look at Honkai Impact 3rd’s animated shorts and still say that it’s bad, then nothing is going to convince you.
It’s so sad seeing that nobody is talking about Ajin
almost at 400k congrats joey, you make it look so simple
Land of the lustrous is easily in my top 5 most aesthetic anime of all time
I realize that it was a French studio, but when I was a kid I really liked Code Lyoko. Even though it hasn't aged well, props to them for mixing the 3d and 2d.
I don't entirely agree that 'Japan is behind with CGI'. There are wonderful older examples like Vexille, Appleseed and FFVII: Advent Children to name a few. It's more like the anime industry is behind, and even that is not entirely true given how well GITS SAC (2002-2005) used CGI for Tachikomas, the entirety of Freedom or the more experimental stuff by Studio 4C.
In my opinion, I actually like both styles even in Western Animation.... but I'm a big fan of 3D Animation overall.
Beastars is a good example as to why I feel Anime should at least try the 3D route as some of the 2D segements in the Anime feel... stiff, whilst the 3D stuff feel organic and fluid, just the natural movements of the characters is stunning to watch, especially with the action scenes
When you mention mixing CGI with handdrawn animation, even that doesn't have to look bad, actually. Much like with 3D animations itself, mixing CGI with handdrawn animation really depends on how it's applied, either by hiding the GCI very well, using it for large background objects (which tend to have a different style in many animations anyway) or deliberately _not_ hiding it and denote that something is otherworldy.
There also is the fact that in many 2D animations, the static "background" uses a different style (e.g. a more realistic shading or more abstract graphics) compared to the animated "foreground" (e.g. only two shadings or being less abstract). This makes it very easy to pick up what gets interacted with and what doesn't and the style will often clash.
Indeed, using a 3D background with a 2D foreground is really the same thing, just with a different medium, which means it can look bad but it can also look very interesting.
Violet Evergarden has some CRAZY good uses of CGI in it’s animation. For instance the cm for the light novel used no cg and the first shot of it had violet using a typewriter, that cut took the animators 1 month to finish. This is what led to the using cg for the full anime, and they still look GORGEOUS!
That panning out shot where she jumps onto a lake.
*Chef’s kiss.
The dragon quest movie blew my mind. It looked so good.
That's the thing, bad CGI is bad CGI, if they do it well and it works then great, but it's upsetting when they have no skill in the production of CGI and just slap it onto a series because "the future"
For me, the best Anime with 3d CGI would have to be Kengan Ashura, the designs are very stylised and the movement is mostly very good and natural looking which I think is the biggest thing that puts people off of 3d elements in anime.
And the only reason I watched it was because I wanted to watch Baki but I kinda got overwhelmed and confused with where to start and then I saw Kengan from the recommendations and ended up loving it, the style was definitely off putting at first but I quickly got over it, and I would love to hear your opinion of it, if you can, please.
Yes, i love Kengan Ashura to and the new season is coming.
Nighthead 2041 is definitely a slept on cg anime. That shit was gorgeous but im pretty sure alot of people who saw it was cg just immediately noped out. It kills me that people just refuse to give some things a chance. Nighthead is definitely getting slept on
Glad someone else thought that looked really good? I still need to watch it but it's on my list!
@@Drstrange3000 yeah its definitely worth it. It's not perfect but hardly anything is
@@roddny444 That's great to hear! I will check it out.
I think several of the best modern studios like Mappa, WIT, Ufotable, A-1, and others under the Production I.G. Umbrella have shown over the past seven or eight years that a well blended mixture of both looks the best as of now.
The duke of death and his maid was a pretty great CGI anime. Honestly didn't expect it to be that good.
The show Ultraman from Netflix also showed potential on the animation in 3D. That it looked pretty real in certain aspects. And the animation looked smooth. (considering that first I heard about it the show was also Live Action back in the day. It was a great update having search old clips and pics) also Arcane is a good milestone too( not finish the series yet but with the few episodes in oh my goodness the amazing quality it has.)
I just finished kingdom season 1 and that would be the original ex arm type of animation where they constantly used 2d 3d animation but it doesn't mix well
6:00 when it comes to time limits (at least today) Hollywood is also very strict, for example frozen 2 had a deadline which resulted in the poorly stitched together story that we got. But for why toy story “looked better” it might stem from Pixar having experimented a lot with 3D in their short films like the lamp in their logo which was an experiment with how light moved and bounced on objects.
CGI can be very well done "Drowning sorrow in raging fire", which is a manhwa mostly if not solely in 3D, seems to be motion captured (mocap). It makes the cgi very lifelike. If they didn't mocap it, they did an insanely good job at it.
I think it's fine with some art styles
From a financial stand point, making a high budget 3d-based anime movie with assets polished AF, and then recycle the assets for a lower budget series might be a more sounding business. I think disney is doing this practice?
But as how anime goes, it's usually the other way around, series first and then movie though that's not always the case for every title/IP.
In the end 3d or hand drawn is just a technique. They have their own limitations and resource management strategy but they are both capable of producing high quality entertaining animes.
As long as CGI anime looks like it runs at 10fps, it'll never take off.
its about how its used not whether one is better than the other. But yes also personal preference too. I am a aspiring animator who doesn't really know too much about the industry, but I am very passionate about this topic
Idk about God Eater being 3D or not but I love the animation aesthetic and vibes, even though lots of people dislike the shading effect and their animation aesthetic.
*TheAnimeMan was inspired by his viewing of the new Dragon Ball Super trailer*
I would sacrifice a part of my body just to have another CG JoJo opening.
In my opinion, 3D CGI is just another tool to make anime. It's up to the creators, animators, and producers to decide how to use it. I think 3D CGI has a ton of potential in anime. Give it time to grow, change and develop. Don't just say it's bad because it's not 2D. Okay that's all.
3:30
Some good examples of 3d hiding
Heavens feel part 1: Lancer walking toward Assassin on the construction lift / Assassin dodging Lancers attacks on the truck
Evangelion Rebuild : Asuka force feeding Shinji
Kimetsu: Thunderclap sixfold when zenitsu dodges the poison spit/ Akaza and Rengoku trashtalk scene where the camera angle spins
Shit, Joey, I really liked this topic. I always interested on 2D/2DCGI/2D-3DCGI . Loving them vids! Prop to ya.
I think that 3D Anime can be just as good as 2D Anime if it's done right, with the proper budget, time, effort, dedication and talent. Some 3D Anime i really liked were: Houseki no Kuni, Gantz: 0, Final Fantasy XV: Kingsglaive, Beastars and Kengan Ashura.
A good anime called Girls und Panzer combines 2d and 3d pretty well with the recent movies that has some real quality animation. Also if you liked Tanks or any other type of military history, then this is an excellent watch for you.
(note that if your watching for good plot then this is not for you, but the battles, action scenes, history, and all the fine details put in this anime will surely make you enjoy it)
Ever since I watched gigguks video on bad cg I’ve started noticing the use of cg. And these days instead of saying “oh god it’s bad cg” i say “ oh wow that’s some pretty seamless cg. Still found it though”
Loving the minimalist Beastars sweater!
I think the big break in CGI besides Beastars and the other show you mentioned, I really think Promare has really pushed the line on blending the 2D and 3D animation, which goes to show what the studio standards will be in the next ten years.
Triggers been doing 2d and 3d for years
dang these topics suggested by viewers are awesome. i dont want to cut joeys credit short though lol, very entertaining
I just wanna say the CG mech fights in 86 are so good and fun to watch