Minnesota's New Flag Worried Me
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- Опубликовано: 22 май 2024
- The Finalists for Minnesota’s flag and what I think about them, alongside some historical context and other notable flag designs.
TIMESTAMPS
0:00 Intro
0:05 Context
1:23 Older 1957 Proposal
2:18 Flag Design Proposals
4:46 Finalists
8:23 My Thoughts
10:05 Minnesota’s Flag
MUSIC
Forhill - Searching
HOME - Hold
Eveningland - Nimbus
VIDEO
Video by Tom Fisk: www.pexels.com/video/river-wi...
Video by Wilson Malone: www.pexels.com/video/the-flag...
Video by Styves Exantus: www.pexels.com/video/lake-of-...
Video by CityXcape : www.pexels.com/video/skyscrap...
Video by Miguel Á. Padriñán: www.pexels.com/video/closeup-...
IMAGES
Flags: serc.mnhs.org/flags
Seals: serc.mnhs.org/seals
commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/Fi...
commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/Fi...
commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/Fi...
commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/Fi...
Course of Empire: en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Categor...)
REFERENCES
[1] www.sos.state.mn.us/about-min...
[2] www3.mnhs.org/serc
[3] serc.mnhs.org/flags
[4] serc.mnhs.org/seals
[5] www.mnopedia.org/thing/minnes...
[6] newmnflag.org/designs
[7] mnflag.tripod.com/anderson.html
[8] wjon.com/new-minnesota-state-...
FINALISTS
F29 www3.mnhs.org/serc-finalist-f29
F944 www3.mnhs.org/serc-finalist-f944
F1154 www3.mnhs.org/serc-finalist-f...
F1435 www3.mnhs.org/serc-finalist-f...
F1953 www3.mnhs.org/serc-finalist-f...
F2100 www3.mnhs.org/serc-finalist-f...
Out of the finalists, I think the one they chose is by far the best. It's quite unique in its pattern, and it isn't lazily just red, white and blue like Mississippi's and Utah's new flags.
Edit: I've just seen what Minnesota has done to the flag, they've ruined it. The unique shape to the side is still nice, but getting rid of the green and white has really ruined it for me, it looks incredibly bland now.
I think of the 3 redesigns, Mississippi's was the best. But yeah the Commission really did ruin the final pick
I thought that the stripes were better until I saw what the final design looked like hung vertically. Taking that into account I think they made a good choice, though I personally prefer the star/snowflake design F29.
I strongly disagree with the original unedited contend of this comment. It looks so boring, even before they removed the stripes. F29 and F944 are my favorites, though F2100 and F1154 are also good. In the end though, I'm not sure why they didn't just go with the 1957 proposal instead of doing a contest.
Totally agree, the final design picked was perfect before modifications. I was under the impression they were going to tweak small things like the hue of a color or slight proportion shifts, but they went and ruined the design by removing the stripes and changing the (would've been imo) iconic north star design and replacing it with a generic 8 pointed "star".
>>Edit: I've just seen what Minnesota has done to the flag, they've ruined it. The unique shape to the side is still nice, but getting rid of the green and white has really ruined it for me, it looks incredibly bland now.
Glad you enjoyed the heraldic seal on the left there! That version wasn't directly made by me (I made S32) but considering I made the vast majority of the design and someone just stole it and changed the star I feel like I can take the credit :)
I'm very impressed. Thanks for the comment 👍
Your design would have been the best choice and I bet it would have been the People's Choice winner if the public had been allowed to select the winner. But oh no,, the "experts" had to control everything so we ended up with the most boring of the bunch in all cool colors - it's embarrassing. It just looks like a big "K" in icy cold colors. (Bland blues against a blue sky; anyone see a problem here with it not standing out?) Actually, most of the submissions they chose as finalists look like beginners quilt blocks.
Thank you for actually submitting a beautiful design. Hopefully there will be enough public disgust for the winning design that it's lifespan will be short and there will be another contest relatively soon and judges with keener eyes for good design, so please enter the next contest and give us hope for a nice looking flag!
That Nordic Cross Flag with the snowflake at 9:18 was by far the best looking potential flag you showed in this video.
And of the six finalists personally I'd have gone with F2100.
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Oh and I rather liked the Blue Maple Leaf flag too :)
It looks visually appealing, but I doubt it would've ever been picked. The imagery almost entirely represents European Minnesotans, with no representation for the Dakota and Ojibwe. This is important because Minnesota has a very large indigenous population, and almost every place in the state has an indigenous name. It also uses the same blue colour from the current flag, which Minnesotans don't actually use, instead using a much darker blue that is colloquially known as Minnesota Blue.
Glad you liked the F1953 tricolor with the Minnesota shaped K shape, because that's the one they went with!
I like it too, very unique and much more catchy than a seal on a blank background.
It's a very "flag" looking flag. It's not too busy.
The new flag looks better than the old flag.
litterally anything would look better than the old flag
What do you make of the final design selected by the committee? Admittedly, it's grown on me, but I feel like just a swallowtail cut flag might've cut it for Minnesota. Just the navy-blue section, with the cyan cut off might've been more interesting, even if it is stupid simple. (As a tangent, I made a design like that with the 8-pointed star on a blue and green bi-color swallowtail)
I used to believe Good Flag, Bad Flag was gospel, but now I think the best approach is nuanced.
The ultimate flag for that guide would be Japanese city flags, it is very simple and elegant in a vacuum, just a background and a symbol, I love it. However, if every country adopted a flag like Japan or its citys, it runs the risk of being same-y, boring and bland. We're not in the 1500's where flags needed to be hand sewn anymore, complex designs can be printed instantly from the internet, and complex designs have the capacity to look nice.
I used to also see 'Good Flag, Bad Flag' as gospel. It made sense and seemed logical, but in practice it's a little constrained.
I prefer a heraldic approach since they can have pretty cool and complex designs, but even they have ruled about color and whatnot (which should be ignored for flags)
Like you said, a nuanced approach is for the best
I personally disagree. The flags of Japanese cities may look visually appealing, but they feel very corporate and uninspired. They're all logos, at the end of the day, and most are just stylised Japanese letters. A good flag doesn't rely on preexisting symbols, but is a symbol in itself. It evolves over time. This is why I think the flag they picked for Minnesota is perfect - It uses the colours that are already intertwined with Minnesota identity, whilst using the chevron design element already used on numerous alternative and Minnesota regional flags for decades.
@@Beazilla Very true, they are little more inspired than blue-bedsheet flags. There is a very fine line between creative simplicity and bleak blandness.
F1435 strongly reminds me of a small LCD that you'd use in a hobby electronics project with an Arduino microcontroller.
My personal favorite is F2100.
I don't like the new 8 pointed star the commission picked. The original with 4 long arms, 4 short looks significantly better. I do like the brighter blue over the desaturated muted blue. I think most of the Nordic Cross inspired designs looked much better though.
I agree but one interesting thing I just realized is that if you rotate the new 8 pointed star, it looks like the Dakota/Ojibwe native american style star.
It seems to be a compromise between the original design and incorporating a Native American element into the flag.
@@FroyourHistory the "newer" 8 pointed star was indeed chosen for the indigenous element aspect as well as that same star design being used by Nordic countries.
Lets hope the commission does not fuck to much we the flag they chose, because it is a pretty good design.
It's just the somalia flag. I'll let you guess why.
It's not the flag of Somalia, just resembles the flag of some states in Somalia.
It is actually a coincidence, since the flag was proposed by a Minnesotan and voted on.
_(I don't think it looks like Somali state flags all that much personally)_
@@jumbowanathis has to be a dog whistle😂
@@anthonytitone I think they eat those over there.
@@anthonytitone It's probably alluding to the Somali minority in Minnesota, which I believe has the largest Somali population of any US state.
Overall I dont see the problem with the new flag, and overall most of designs are pretty good
YES!!! My fav!
I would change the hoist navy blue to black (for the night sky) thus removing the need to describe the other blue, in line with early heraldic practice.
This flag is better than what they redesigned it too. Can't they seriously just leave the stripes? We should make a petition
At least they didn't have a Presidential candidate making a concession speech... or football fans not having a Super Bowl victory celebration... or Mary Tyler Moore tossing her hat in the air. ... Seriously, you gave us a good look at this issue. I learned from this video.
The commissions' edits made it worse
CGP Grey:Why?
Flag selection, like all elections, should be conducted with ranked choice voting, preferably with schulze vote counting systems.
yep
America went from having the worst flags to the most badass
They could add an Ox pulling the plow doubt farmer pushed it without help. If updated rider could be on a motorcycle or in a pickup truck and farmer pulling plow with a tractor.
What's next?
F253's been my background for about a month now
F253 Minnesota is my spirit animal.
@@b1battledroid882 it's honestly perfect
I liked F944 the most.
The flag we went with is meh.
Nahhhh it going to take effect on my birthday??
(everything happens on my birthday i swear)
0:27. Wait, thats a flag!
Bro the flag isn't as bad as you may have thought its actually more better than the two half assed flag
the new flag is silly we need a vote
Exactly, we need a People's Choice contest to get a beautiful flag. The final selection is proof that the state emblem committee needs to be fired. . The new flag is downright ugly; just a big "K" in icy cold colors.
@@dao8805yeah your in the minority there, it's not brilliant, but it isn't bad either, it's a C+ if I were to grade it. a B if I'm being generous.
America went from having the worst flags to having still the worst flags.
Shouldn't a flag be beautiful? The one selected by the design committee is anything but beautiful - it's downright unappealing. As a Minnesotan I am disappointed and embarrassed at their final choice and even most of their finalists, most of which look like beginners quilt blocks. They should have made this a people's choice contest. Then perhaps we would have gotten something attractive in a combination of warm and cool colors and a design with character that evokes interest and emotion instead of something that looks like a big "K" in icy cold colors that disappears into a blue sky instead of standing out against it. I wish they would just offload the design to Kellogg's by convincing them they need a really boring corporate flag.
The new flag is fantastic!!!
Exactly. Just an inane design by a committee
@@ericsonhazeltine5064 the winner was designed by a young man from rural Minnesota.
What kind of thinking is that? Flags should be beautiful, but they need to represent the people, valor, suffering, success, and environment of where they are of. You can’t just slap a pretty colourful design on a rectangle and call it a day, you need to think of what you want the flag to mean. The chosen flag is good at that because it _looks_ like Minnesota. The desaturated colours make it feel like a chilly, baron environment. That’s Minnesota. The ‘Kellogg’s K’ you talk about is a silhouette of Minnesota, as mentioned in the video. Maybe next time think of a good way to spend your precious minutes, instead of rambling on about an actually appealing flag.
@@NorthStarKnifeReviews well, whaddaya know.
I prefer the old one to all the new ones
I love the fact that the “somali” flag proposal that I have seen so much hate towards is just a more “standard” flag look than what was on the older wavy version of the proposal.
Honestly people need to relax. The one proposed by the general was after all just the french flag with a ton of stars on it.
And those designs actually do not share that much in common if one really look at it. It is not hard to follow where the symbolism comes from. I think it is a great looking and very traditional flag. With a some rare elements to it just to make it stick out from your common traditional flag.
It just looks simplified.
0:58 Isn’t that what happened though? We just want to erase that part of history because it makes us looks bad???
I left because my visa experied but Im planning to come work in live in my cousins living room while working at the local printing press. In my 6 months working there I only saw a single minnesota flag, very few compared to all the texan n californian ones, I hope I see some of the new ones now. I will get a sticker to wear this flag everywhere I am happy the state i lived for 5 years changed their ugly ass falg.
As many are of Swedish origen in Minasota why not in the Swedish colours or design.
Cause Minnesota has it's own color design, it literally has Minnesota blue, so many flags potentials had that in the image.
The feelings police never fail to reduce whatever the hate de jour into mediocrity.
The one they adopted looks like it was inspired by the Somali flag. It becomes more obvious if you go the the wikipedia page for "List of Somali flags".
Well guess what, it wasn’t, don’t believe conservative conspiracies
@@gavindominico9595 Thanks for the clarification, comrade. Double plus good. Pattern recognition is a thought crime.
1:00 Wait, so why is this small group of "other people" suddenly given the power to override literally everyone and change that flag?
Is this some kind privilege thing for that group or what?
Yknow generally celebrating ethnic cleansing by featuring it on your seal and flag isn’t a great thing to do.
But you never cared about “this small group”, or their history, now have ya?
New Hampshire for being an awesome state has one of the worst flags. There was a proposal by a Democrat state rep to change it a few years ago but it got shot down by Republicans because it was viewed as a partisan issue (it's not). Hopefully New Hampshire can learn from Minnesota's new flag and update theirs
I wish flags weren't seen as a partisan issue, I'm interested in the proposal you mentioned. Do you have a link to it?
@FroyourHistory I posted the link, but it got removed. It was proposed by state rep Timothy Josephson in 2017/2018
Apparently, there's a current proposal to add "Live Free Or Die" to the flag. Talk about not understanding flag design 😒
I rly don’t understand why republicans hate flag changes, I mean nobody in a state with an ugly flag is hanging it outside their house, even if ur a die hard confederate u gotta admit the new Magnolia flag in Mississippi just looks nicer & a lot of the seal flags r boring
@anthonytitone Now a Republican is proposing to change it, go figure
I feel like the argument that the American Indian on the Minnesota flag is raciest is so dumb because it’s just depicting how they actually looked and the farmer is living in peace with the native
💪🇺🇸👍
I was never a fan of the old flag however this new flag sucks. Typical of the people in charge today.
The designs seem to be made by grade schoolers. For a STATE FLAG they are crap.
I honestly think they all suck, the new one is too simplistic and geometric to the point it looks like a company logo or a yatch club flag. They should've gone with the north star one (the blue one, with the wavy white and green pattern)
I agree, it's ugly with no interest or character. Almost all the finalists they chose look like beginners quilt blocks. The "winner" just looks like a big "K" in icy cold colors. We need a People's Choice contest!
Like Minnesota itself the flag will be bland and boring.😅
I hate the new one. It's meaningless trash
Orwell was right
In what way was Orwell right? I'm curious to hear
I am disgusted by the new one too. It has a dystopian look to it; rigid, no life or character to it and rendered in cool, bland lifeless colors.
To be fair, the old one did have underlying racist undertones, what with the Native American on horse back seeming to be leaving while the European farmer remains.
If you’re “worried” about the flag then you need to get a life.
This is just a hobby, just like flags and history
Yuck
Don’t care about stupid woke nonsense. Get over it. Grow up.
Why does the world HATE hard working middle class Americans? I just don't get it, we are the people who make good things happen so why are we being pushed out? We don't contribute to crime, we pay most of the taxes collected, we provide products and services to our communities, we help those in need so pleasse explain to me why you HATE us so much.
I don't hate middle class Americans. I just think flags are interesting, due to my interest in history/heraldry.
Lmao you are absolutely talking out of your ass! Sincerely, a middle-class American
Why would u think you’re hated because of a flag design change? I’m not saying that in a rude way I’m just genuinely curious what ur rationale is here? What r u being pushed out of? Also working class people commit plenty of crimes, they don’t generally commit theft tho if that’s what you’re referring to. Thieves steal because they’re too poor to afford things, nobody needs to steal if they have access to things.
@@anthonytitone The middle class has been under attack for many years now. For some reason our way of life is now looked at as though WE are evil for having a decent life. We have been thrown into the group of very wealthy people even though that is far from the truth. This flag does not represent us at all even though WE are the backbone of the state and are the people who created it. This flag represents all the illegals immigrants who came here only to benifit off of what WE created. All they want to do is take what we created and then push us aside and I am sick of it. I am sick of being made out to be the evil A hole that is supposidly making everyone's lives hell. If immigrants want to come here and be a part of us and what we created and continue to help us then I'm all for it but we all know that is very far from the truth. All they want is to make our state like the place they came from. Don't believe me, then give me one example of how our state is better today then it was in the past. Its going to shit and you know it.
It's not the regular people of the world who hate working class people; it's the elites of the world, people in the World Economic Forum, the tech giants, the Wall Street titans and the priviledged politicians in both parties that run America and every other industrialized country around the world who hate working people and see us all as their servants. They rig the system against all of us. Whether forcing an ugly new flag on us is part of their plan has yet to be seen, but it's the least of what they are doing to us. We regular people are all in this together - hang in there.