Feel free to discuss your thoughts in the comments! Please be civil and have an open mind. If you disagree with any of our interpretations, or you'd like us to elaborate, I'd be happy to respond to any comments I can. Part 2!!
Here's something else you might not have noticed. The reason Mario doesn't like mushrooms in the movie is a reference to the Popeye the sailor movie in which Popeye (Played by the late great Robin Williams) hates spinach and refused to eat it until the end of the movie where it allowed him to finally beat Bluto. This reference was most likely made because Mario was originally based on Popeye. Check out a making of donkey Kong arcade video for more on that.
I more or less agree with your assessments of the movie. I feel like Mario and Luigi were a bit more different to their game counterparts, and I didn’t like Peach’s extreme rewrite at all(but that’s another story) but otherwise, I agree. The movie’s versions DID work for the film continuity to be fair, it just has to be known that they’re different from their games selves, and that they aren’t getting put in the games. As you guys said, the movie is pretty good when you remove it from the source material. Also something of note is that it is absolutely out of character for Bowser to assault Kamek. In the games, he only ever knocked him around as a child. In adulthood, he seems to have a lot of respect for Kamek, enough that he’s one of the few the koopa king has never attempted to harm. And in general, he’s a better ruler to his subjects in the games. Great video nonetheless!
Yo, Lord of the Dragons here! I've gotta admit, I didn't help with this video just as much as I did in the first part, so you crediting me was a surprise (though I did, in fact, do some stuff, so I guess it's logical). By the way, I enjoyed the video quite a lot, and, man, the amount of work you must've put on all the art you've done for this cannot be written. You DARED to disrespect all of us, Bramball denizens, by lying to us due to your own vile and wicked intentions, Famous (lost) Californian RUclips Da Ninendude! That cannot be overlooked, and it will not be, as everyone here will make sure you're remembered as the dastardly traitor to our nation. Also, how could you simply sing about pizza after commiting such atrocity? (I'm sure you know that's just a joke, but I'm warning you just to make sure you aren't offended by my words or something. I'm apologizing in advance to you, just in case you find that too ofensive)
7:33 I don't know if it's just the fact I look more into the Koopalings, Minions, ect and maybe I just don't understand Mario well enough (considering I'm not the biggest fan of his character or the protagonists of the franchise), but I also felt he was too insecure in the movie... Mario being insecure is a picture hard for me to imagine. And yeah, Mario is supposed to love mushrooms. 9:10 "Losing a life" something the fandom takes too literally to the point it's exhausting. 12:05 Oh yeah, and then I saw people claiming the canon name is officially "blue shell" just because it's in the movie, despite the fact it's actually called a "spiny shell". 12:30 Exactly!!! And then there was also a moment where Koopas were telling Mario about wearing shells and how heavy they are to carry and wear in Bowser's Inside Story, I don't remember fully how it went, too burnt out to remember. 13:02 Mistakenly said Mario and Luigi, heheh, and the visual also represented it as the bros too, when it was just Mario and Donkey Kong that were thrown out of Rainbow Road and into the Ocean, unless I just don't remember it right because I'm too burnt out and mentally unwell to remember. 14:12 I dislike how different Kamek was. I wanted scenes where Kamek would be a voice of reason and Bowser would refuse to listen. And yeah, I agree that Movie Kamek acts closer to Kamey Koopa. 15:41 Bowser was easily the absolute WORST portrayed character in the movie IMO. 15:56 I actually didn't know that one, given the fact I didn't play that one. 16:53 Exactly!!!! 17:34 I agree with that too! 17:44 Not only that, but also when he almost blew fire on Kamek in Bowser Junior's Journey out of anger that Peach outcasted him during the Blorb meeting. And I agree, I don't think Bowser would literally burn their skin off, that was out of character and annoying in the movie. 17:52 Oh my god that was one of the worst parts, second to the sacrifice scene I hated so much. 18:04 The worst part in the entire movie, and the part that gives the shitty annoying terrible dogshit Mario fandom fuel on all the incorrect things they say about MY favorite characters to the point I just... can't with the series anymore... at least for a while... but I'm giving Super Mario RPG, Thousand Year Door and videos like this exceptions. (Stuff with Larry or the Koopalings exceptions too) 18:16 Exactly, but no matter how much you explain it to the dogshit terrible snobby shitty disrespectful annoying Mario fandom, they will always react with a shitty sarcastic remark to claim you're wrong about it instead while acting on their shitty superiority complex I hate so much and then turn around and claim *I'M MAKING UP HEAD CANON AND TREATING IT AS CANON!!!!.* 18:28 Exactly. 20:36 Lmao I didn't pay attention to that. I dunno how I missed it. 24:27 When I saw the film, I was incredibly upset by how different Bowser and his minions were from the games. I hated every bit of it knowing it gives people fuel to keep making absurd claims especially with the fact idiots are gonna claim incorrect slander about the characters I like most in the franchise and I feel like people are making it difficult to LIKE THE CHARACTERS I LIKE MOST IN THE SERIES... because they keep comparing them to IRL criminals and spreading misinformation and treating it as fact and act snobby if I dare say otherwise to the point I'll be avoiding MOST discussion, lest the person brings up RPGs like Paper Jam then I at least know I'm talking to someone who is gonna try giving me genuine responses instead of BS and act snobby about it. But I kinda feel like it's to the point I'm better off shutting up about these characters at all and tuning myself out of the games entirely instead of correct misinformation on the characters I like most from the franchise because I'll hardly ever be respected for the way I view them no matter what in discussion with others especially with what the movie did to the fandom pre and post release. I really couldn't help but be completely unable to enjoy the movie, due to how badly the characters I like most were portrayed and the the things the Mario fandom keep saying about them. For me, due to how badly the characters I care about most were portrayed, it was the worst movie I've ever watched in my life... maybe that'll change in the future if my mental health heals... 26:33 Amazing.
@@foursidekm Ohhhh yeah, pfft, I missed it, lol. Thanks for telling me about that, I can see the correction at the top corner saying "Donkey Kong" (though the art depicts Luigi with the mistake before changing into Donkey Kong after, hahah!) so yeah, I suppose the mistake was noticed during the editing process, hahah!
I literally had to pause the video because I’m actually shocked by Luigi’s nickname Like I’ve heard countless times but man… never really thought it was a nickname
Even if the movie wasn't a perfect adaptation, it did hit close enough to home, and made people curious enough(like me)to research by seing your kind of videos! And, some pulpy fun(as jumanji)!
@@cad4871 and? This is a video game series with cartoonish and fictional logic/world building NOT real life logic. This is a series where babies are delivered by storks, where you can shoot fireballs underwater, where you can ride on CLOUDS, where dinosaurs like Yoshi aren’t extinct, where magic actually exists, where you can breath in SPACE and drive go karts there and all sorts of other make believe fictional things that would make no logical sense IRL. But you’re telling me you can’t suspend your disbelief with the literal common trope of a turtle treating its shell as some sort of clothing? That whole trope stems from a looney tunes gag and cartoons featuring turtles.
I have an interesting theory. The movie and games obviously could be separated, but I would like to introduce the multiverse theory. Every series (Mainline, Mario and Luigi, Paper Mario, etc.) Is it's OWN universe. This is supported by Mario and Luigi: Paper Jam, with every main character having a paper counterpart. It's also supported by Super Mario Land and Land 2, with Mario owning not just a castle, but an entire island, directly contradicting MULTIPLE other spin-offs like all of the RPG series, where the Bros. Have a small house that says "Mario" on the front or "Pipe house/ Mario house" in Super Mario RPG and the 2023 remake, respectively. Also also, there's again, all of the older games and TV shows saying they're from Brooklyn, and Yoshi's island. So rather than countless retcons, It's an "Across the spiderverse" situation.
Mario & Luigi Paper Jam shows that there's a parallel world where everything is the same, except for the fact everyone is paper. There's no evidence to suggest that the Mario & Luigi series is within another universe or anything like that. Miyamoto has said before that there is only "one Mario" in the games. In the Land games, Mario does indeed own a castle. But that doesn't mean he kept living in it. It could be more like a vacation home nowadays. Mario Land (where the castle resides) is basically like a theme park, with a bunch of different unique zones to visit. Mario probably wanted to live closer to Peach, so he moved back to his shack in RPG, before upgrading it before Luigi moved in for Paper Mario and the Mario & Luigi games. The movie, super show, and other licensed media are indeed separate universes. But I don't think they're within a shared multiverse. Of course, that could change in the future. But currently there's no evidence to support such a theory.
21:36 finally You’re saying that princess peach is different in the movie because peach in the movie is different to her game version. Thank you for mentioning That peach in the movie is different to the games
I have a few sentence rebuttal to this 27 minute video, mario galaxy. At the end of the game, the lumas jump into a black hole and restarts the cycle of the universe. But as Rosalina says, "The cycle never repeats in quite the same way". So, canonically, the mario series takes place in at least 2 different universes with different things happening. So the mario movie could simply take place in the first cycle where mario is in the mushroom kingdom, then it restarts and leads to the games. Also, worrying about the canonicity of Dance Dance Revolution Mario Mix is so dumb and funny.
The Universe reset undos the events of the original Super Mario Galaxy, and Galaxy 2 happens in its place. That's the only difference that we know for sure is true. I don't think anything about the past would have changed.
@@brykinjarman4625 They do not. Honey Queen lives in a different galaxy. It's possible they were teleported there after the reset, or were visiting for the Star Festival.
@DaNintendude 😑 the star festival is over at that point. The lumas are all alive again, the castle and observatory are fixed. Also, the spin in the water is worse and octolumbas now spit rocks, so other things do change. My explanation is valid.
Even though I hate the movie, I honestly respect the time and dedication put in this video to prove that the movie is not canon to the main Mario continuity. Seriously, the cartoons and manga are likely more canon to the Mario games than the movie lol. Also the Mario Portal is NOT canon or reliable for enemy naming, since it has numerous errors and misnames for a multitude of enemies, as well as the fact that it literally stole names from unofficial sources and named some enemies names of entirely unrelated species (Super Mario Galaxy Monty being called Rocky Wrench on the Mario Portal is easily the biggest offender of this). Edit: Mind rehearting the comment, I just wanted to add something about the Mario Portal?
13:48 You actually missed the very important detail that movieverse toad is implied to be Captain Toad when in the gameverse they're separate characters
The way I see it, it's less that they imply him to be Captain Toad. It's moreso that they merged aspects of the characters together. In terms of role, function, and personality, he's not really anything like the Captain
Fare as i've seen, the power ups healed any wound or injury it's users recieved before activating them! Does that happen in the games as well, or i'm just imagining it and so fourth?
7:11 The only reason why Mario hates mushrooms is because they thought it would be funny if he dislikes the thing that makes him bigger and stronger. I feel like you might be overthinking it.
The reason for him hating mushrooms doesn't change the fact that he has always liked mushrooms in the games. It's not a big thing, but it's a difference nonetheless.
Okay, I agree Game Mario isn't from New York, but... why would the RPGs be non-canon if he were? (Partners in Time aside, which uses the Yoshi's Island baby backstory of course) I'm not sure how Mario's origins play into the other RPGs at all, unless I'm missing something obvious.
Super Mario RPG: When you look into Kamek's mind as Mallow, he sees Mario as "that child from that one time?" referencing Yoshi's Island. Paper Mario 64: Raphael the Raven appears. In Yoshi's Island, he was just a normal Raven that Kamek made huge with his magic. Raphael being his huge self in the game means that Yoshi's Island had to have occurred. All M&L games have direct continuity to the other M&L games, so because Partners in Time couldn't have happened without Yoshi's Island, then neither can Bowser's Inside Story, Dream Team, or Paper Jam. Same with the Paper Mario series. PM64 happens in a world where Yoshi's Island happened, so all future PM games have to as well.
@@DaNintendude AH! You're right, I totally forgot about the psychopath thought when I commented. (Side note, I do wonder if he'll be localized as "Kamek" instead of just called Magikoopa in the remake...) And yes! You are right about Raphael as well; His role in the game slipped my mind when I made my comment. (Side note, I wonder what changed for ol' Raph in about 20 years. He not only no longer has any allegiance to Bowser, but he doesn't seem to know Mario either...) I getcha. That all makes sense, yeah.
@DrMechano The idea of Raphael moving to Lavalava, becoming humble, and basically becoming a deity to the Yoshis of the island is such a cool idea to me. It's not explained at all, but I just find the hidden development so neat
Well they could still use the Brooklyn Origin, it's just their family had to move in order to protect themselves from Bowser's army and such, as for the movie it's most likely Yoshi sacrificed himself to bet the bros back to Brooklyn where they belong, which could be why a Koopa had an Yoshi egg, because the egg was actually the same yoshi transformed by Kamek, if they keep the whole "storks deliver babies" thing.
@@FluppietheRockruffFan It would still make games not canon because Super Mario Odyssey, which has New Donk City in it, makes it clear the original Donkey Kong took place in New Donk City when you go into the 8bit section with Donkey Kong in it as Jump Up Superstar plays. On top of that, the original Donkey Kong, Donkey Kong Junior and Mario Bros would still not be canon, heck, Super Mario Bros would not be canon if the Movie was canon because Mario Bros directly leads up to it. The retconned Brooklyn origin is impossible to still be canon and the movie as well unless Super Mario Odyssey, Donkey Kong, Donkey Kong Junior, Mario Bros and Super Mario Bros were all not canon, which I find very unlikely honestly.
@@xxroyalprincexx6811 Because he's the one responsible for it? Mario hating mushrooms in the film is fine. It just contradicts basically all the games, so it stood out to me as a very odd decision.
Disagree with Gameverse Bowser “not being willing to kill”. He’s tried to kill Mario and his friends on numerous occasions and has used deadly force on the Mushroom Kingdom numerous times. Even in Odyssey, he straight up orders the Ruined Dragon to blow up Mario and Cappy with him even yelling out and I quote “Let’s see you SURVIVE this, plumber boy!”In many of the games where you play as him such as in SMRPG or Bowsers Inside Story, Bowsers has no problem killing any of the enemies that stand in his way. Even normally, he’s not above attempting genocide in the games, Paper Bowser is not even canon Bowser so let’s ignore him. Bowser tried to destroy the entire Paper Mario UNIVERSE in Paper Jam which in turn would’ve killed BILLIONS. So yeah, I agree that Movieverse Bowser is worse than Gameverse Bowser, but to say that being willing to kill is “out of character” for Gameverse Bowser is just objectively wrong on so many levels.
Bowser is willing to kill when he is angry, and he's usually only willing to kill Mario. In the RPGs, enemies are not typically killed. They are knocked out. In Paper Jam, Bowser probably hadn't considered that the paper world would die. He probably thought the connection between worlds would be cut off. It was definitely an impulsive idea, as Paper Bowser definitely would've regretted it eventually. While Paper Bowser and Bowser are separate characters, they have identical personalities. It's shown several times throughout Paper Jam, down to a scene where they plot to betray the other at the exact same time, using the exact same words. Movieverse Bowser is very trigger-happy. He's willing to kill a bunch of random people, not because he's angry, but rather because he feels like it. Ganeverse Bowser may reach points of wanting to kill people, but it's never part of his plan, and he'd never do it in a normal state of being.
lore and continuity. Mario doesn't have overarching plots, but it remembers the past and keeps it in mind. It ties stuff together in fun ways. There isn't an explicit timeline or anything, but there's still a set of rules and progression in terms of characters and information.
@@DaNintendude Sort of. Mario games seem to contradict each other in both spirit and lore all the time. Way moreso than even Sonic or Zelda which are prone to episodic adventures at times but even those episodic adventures do take the past and lore into account (Zelda moreso than Sonic). With Mario, I seriously struggle to find anything that is consistent. Every game feels like a separate episode.
@@seto_kaiba_ I'd argue that Sonic is way more contradictory. Mario only has 2 major retcons, while Sonic has had many, and some just to re-retcon other aspects. There's also official statements that media like Sonic Prime are canon-- which yeah, could work, but feels vastly different than the actual games. (Mario's 2 retcons are the Koopalings no longer being his children, and him being from New Donk City instead of Brooklyn) Zelda puts more focus on its lore and story than Mario does, which is why it comes off as having more continuity. Mario games, particularly mainline ones, have a very clear order of events that build upon each other. Power Star lore from Super Mario 64 was greatly expanded upon in Galaxy, which was then expanded upon even more in Odyssey (Power Moon lore, and the implication that Moons and Stars are the same thing). Captain Toad's own game & DLC tie into timeline placement, with the ending hinting at the green comet from Galaxy 2, as well as leading into 3D World. And its Special Episode is about finding the Super Crown, which places it before NSMBU. Even small stuff gets expanded upon. The ground-pound symbol from Galaxy gets lore in Odyssey. Mario Kart, sports, and party games are referenced in mainline & RPG titles, and is explained in manuals to be in-universe events, and Bowser basically crashes the party to show he's better than Mario. I can't really think of any major contradictions outside of Baby Donkey Kong's existence in Yoshi's Island DS, or the geography changing each game (which isn't really a big deal since that's for gameplay purposes).
Using Paper Mario as supporting points doesn't really work because the Paper Mario universe has been shown to be yet another separate timeline from the main games not only with Mario and Luigi Paper Jam but also the fact that most things in those games are actually literally made of paper
Mario & Luigi: Paper Jam describes the Paper World as "parallel" to the real world. We also see characters acting exactly the same as their Paper counterparts, such as one instance where Bowser & Kamek go off on their own and unknowingly have the exact same conversation as Paper Bowser and Paper Kamek. We also know from the Paper Mario games that several mainline titles happened within the Paper World. And Paper Mario characters have appeared in real world games, like the Goomba King in Super Mario 64 DS & Mario Kart DS-- as well as the Star Spirits being the hosts of Mario Party 5. The Goomba King specifically was created by Bowser using the star rod, so Paper Mario 64 had to have happened in the real world. In other words: it's likely that all Mario games happen in both the real world and the paper world. The paper games have some obvious differences, with their world being literally made of paper. But otherwise, there's nothing stopping the events of Paper games from happening in the real world as well.
I actually think while the games are not supposed to have a canon, the movie is, so we can somewhat get context for certain stuff with the Mario Bros from the games, like who their mother and father is, hiw mario is so good at parkour in his first adventure, what relatives do they have etc. So for us the games is some alternate universe while the movies are the main stuff. Which could explain some stuff.
Mario is so good at parkour in his first adventure because of his previous adventures in New Donk City. The original DK Arcade game, Donkey Kong Jr, Wrecking Crew, and Mario Bros.... All of them have him running around. His nickname was Jumpman, because he was so good at jumping. Mario Bros is specifically supposed to lead into Super Mario Bros, and out of all the city games pre-SMB, he's the most athletic there.
Feel free to discuss your thoughts in the comments!
Please be civil and have an open mind.
If you disagree with any of our interpretations, or you'd like us to elaborate, I'd be happy to respond to any comments I can.
Part 2!!
is the bramball shirt something i can buy
@@emasti_ sadly no, but I was planning on maybe making one for myself at some point.
@@DaNintendudedamn, was hoping for some bramball merch. it is criminal that they do not have a plush
Maybe one goomba amoung bowser's prisoners was a descenter? That'd indicate their still mushroom kingdom citizens!
Here's something else you might not have noticed. The reason Mario doesn't like mushrooms in the movie is a reference to the Popeye the sailor movie in which Popeye (Played by the late great Robin Williams) hates spinach and refused to eat it until the end of the movie where it allowed him to finally beat Bluto. This reference was most likely made because Mario was originally based on Popeye. Check out a making of donkey Kong arcade video for more on that.
Loved the art and sense of humor throughout this one, glad to help alongside the others to point out some differences!
i cannnot BELIEVE I DIDNT NOTICE THE SHIRT until the end of the video
What you forget to account for is that in the movie his “normal size” IS small mario hence all the short jokes
Been WONDERing if you would make a part 2 or not, glad to see it finally came!
I enjoyed watching this, I'm glad you are sharing your Mario knowledge with the RUclips community
I more or less agree with your assessments of the movie. I feel like Mario and Luigi were a bit more different to their game counterparts, and I didn’t like Peach’s extreme rewrite at all(but that’s another story) but otherwise, I agree. The movie’s versions DID work for the film continuity to be fair, it just has to be known that they’re different from their games selves, and that they aren’t getting put in the games. As you guys said, the movie is pretty good when you remove it from the source material.
Also something of note is that it is absolutely out of character for Bowser to assault Kamek. In the games, he only ever knocked him around as a child. In adulthood, he seems to have a lot of respect for Kamek, enough that he’s one of the few the koopa king has never attempted to harm. And in general, he’s a better ruler to his subjects in the games.
Great video nonetheless!
Not a surprise. This is the usual case for most movie adaptations of video game franchises.
Those movie Mario and Luigi drawings are LIT
Soo, no one gonna coment on how Bowser tries to kill Peach, he woundnt do that on the games...well i guess 3D World is there but still
Bowser fights her in Super Princess Peach for the Nintendo DS.
@AlonzoTompkins we talk about elements from that game but beyond concepts a pretty bad game
I was waiting for this. Nice job!
Hey! Great job!
Also Bowser's personality a little bit like the browser from the thousand year door
honey peak just dropped
Yo, Lord of the Dragons here! I've gotta admit, I didn't help with this video just as much as I did in the first part, so you crediting me was a surprise (though I did, in fact, do some stuff, so I guess it's logical). By the way, I enjoyed the video quite a lot, and, man, the amount of work you must've put on all the art you've done for this cannot be written.
You DARED to disrespect all of us, Bramball denizens, by lying to us due to your own vile and wicked intentions, Famous (lost) Californian RUclips Da Ninendude! That cannot be overlooked, and it will not be, as everyone here will make sure you're remembered as the dastardly traitor to our nation. Also, how could you simply sing about pizza after commiting such atrocity?
(I'm sure you know that's just a joke, but I'm warning you just to make sure you aren't offended by my words or something. I'm apologizing in advance to you, just in case you find that too ofensive)
Cons: A disgrace to the Bramball Nation
Pros: Famous (Lost) Californian RUclipsr
25:48 No, I can't forgive you. Lol
7:33 I don't know if it's just the fact I look more into the Koopalings, Minions, ect and maybe I just don't understand Mario well enough (considering I'm not the biggest fan of his character or the protagonists of the franchise), but I also felt he was too insecure in the movie... Mario being insecure is a picture hard for me to imagine. And yeah, Mario is supposed to love mushrooms.
9:10 "Losing a life" something the fandom takes too literally to the point it's exhausting.
12:05 Oh yeah, and then I saw people claiming the canon name is officially "blue shell" just because it's in the movie, despite the fact it's actually called a "spiny shell".
12:30 Exactly!!! And then there was also a moment where Koopas were telling Mario about wearing shells and how heavy they are to carry and wear in Bowser's Inside Story, I don't remember fully how it went, too burnt out to remember.
13:02 Mistakenly said Mario and Luigi, heheh, and the visual also represented it as the bros too, when it was just Mario and Donkey Kong that were thrown out of Rainbow Road and into the Ocean, unless I just don't remember it right because I'm too burnt out and mentally unwell to remember.
14:12 I dislike how different Kamek was. I wanted scenes where Kamek would be a voice of reason and Bowser would refuse to listen. And yeah, I agree that Movie Kamek acts closer to Kamey Koopa.
15:41 Bowser was easily the absolute WORST portrayed character in the movie IMO.
15:56 I actually didn't know that one, given the fact I didn't play that one.
16:53 Exactly!!!!
17:34 I agree with that too!
17:44 Not only that, but also when he almost blew fire on Kamek in Bowser Junior's Journey out of anger that Peach outcasted him during the Blorb meeting. And I agree, I don't think Bowser would literally burn their skin off, that was out of character and annoying in the movie.
17:52 Oh my god that was one of the worst parts, second to the sacrifice scene I hated so much.
18:04 The worst part in the entire movie, and the part that gives the shitty annoying terrible dogshit Mario fandom fuel on all the incorrect things they say about MY favorite characters to the point I just... can't with the series anymore... at least for a while... but I'm giving Super Mario RPG, Thousand Year Door and videos like this exceptions. (Stuff with Larry or the Koopalings exceptions too)
18:16 Exactly, but no matter how much you explain it to the dogshit terrible snobby shitty disrespectful annoying Mario fandom, they will always react with a shitty sarcastic remark to claim you're wrong about it instead while acting on their shitty superiority complex I hate so much and then turn around and claim *I'M MAKING UP HEAD CANON AND TREATING IT AS CANON!!!!.*
18:28 Exactly.
20:36 Lmao I didn't pay attention to that. I dunno how I missed it.
24:27 When I saw the film, I was incredibly upset by how different Bowser and his minions were from the games. I hated every bit of it knowing it gives people fuel to keep making absurd claims especially with the fact idiots are gonna claim incorrect slander about the characters I like most in the franchise and I feel like people are making it difficult to LIKE THE CHARACTERS I LIKE MOST IN THE SERIES... because they keep comparing them to IRL criminals and spreading misinformation and treating it as fact and act snobby if I dare say otherwise to the point I'll be avoiding MOST discussion, lest the person brings up RPGs like Paper Jam then I at least know I'm talking to someone who is gonna try giving me genuine responses instead of BS and act snobby about it. But I kinda feel like it's to the point I'm better off shutting up about these characters at all and tuning myself out of the games entirely instead of correct misinformation on the characters I like most from the franchise because I'll hardly ever be respected for the way I view them no matter what in discussion with others especially with what the movie did to the fandom pre and post release. I really couldn't help but be completely unable to enjoy the movie, due to how badly the characters I like most were portrayed and the the things the Mario fandom keep saying about them. For me, due to how badly the characters I care about most were portrayed, it was the worst movie I've ever watched in my life... maybe that'll change in the future if my mental health heals...
26:33 Amazing.
You can see a correction during the luigi rainbow road part in the corner
@@foursidekm Ohhhh yeah, pfft, I missed it, lol. Thanks for telling me about that, I can see the correction at the top corner saying "Donkey Kong" (though the art depicts Luigi with the mistake before changing into Donkey Kong after, hahah!) so yeah, I suppose the mistake was noticed during the editing process, hahah!
Great Video as usual!I just realized I’ve been mispronouncing Seandwalsh’s name all this time!! Sorry about that 😅😅
Let's both hope that Seán forgives you 🙏
I really enjoyed the first video and love ur art
6:10 also Mario's dad design is clearly based on Talon from Zelda Ocarina of Time!
The theory I see is that it's actually the other way around. Talon is based on mario's dad (and mario himself obviously)
10:57 how did you manage to make bowser look so much like jack black lol
this is a very well made video, I wish all lore explanation videos were as cool as that :))
Welll....its obvious, just an Alternative Universe. Basically like all the pther movies based on the video games we got
I literally had to pause the video because I’m actually shocked by Luigi’s nickname
Like I’ve heard countless times but man… never really thought it was a nickname
Now that I finished the video!
I enjoyed this part 2!! Good job both of you
Even if the movie wasn't a perfect adaptation, it did hit close enough to home, and made people curious enough(like me)to research by seing your kind of videos! And, some pulpy fun(as jumanji)!
We making it out of the sewers with this one 🔥🔥🔥
23:50 "koopas aren’t turtles"
That’s probably the dumbest claim so far in these videos. Sorry.
Why? Their shells aren't part of their bodies like they are for turtles
@@cad4871 and? This is a video game series with cartoonish and fictional logic/world building NOT real life logic. This is a series where babies are delivered by storks, where you can shoot fireballs underwater, where you can ride on CLOUDS, where dinosaurs like Yoshi aren’t extinct, where magic actually exists, where you can breath in SPACE and drive go karts there and all sorts of other make believe fictional things that would make no logical sense IRL. But you’re telling me you can’t suspend your disbelief with the literal common trope of a turtle treating its shell as some sort of clothing? That whole trope stems from a looney tunes gag and cartoons featuring turtles.
FINALLY 🔥 🔥 🔥
Great video! I wish the whole movie was made by Nintendo and not Illumination.
20:41 - That's so wholesome.
omg I love the little doodles along with this
Thank you! It took a lot of extra time, but I was committed to making the video as fun to look at as possible
I have an interesting theory.
The movie and games obviously could be separated, but I would like to introduce the multiverse theory.
Every series (Mainline, Mario and Luigi, Paper Mario, etc.) Is it's OWN universe. This is supported by Mario and Luigi: Paper Jam, with every main character having a paper counterpart. It's also supported by Super Mario Land and Land 2, with Mario owning not just a castle, but an entire island, directly contradicting MULTIPLE other spin-offs like all of the RPG series, where the Bros. Have a small house that says "Mario" on the front or "Pipe house/ Mario house" in Super Mario RPG and the 2023 remake, respectively. Also also, there's again, all of the older games and TV shows saying they're from Brooklyn, and Yoshi's island. So rather than countless retcons, It's an "Across the spiderverse" situation.
Mario & Luigi Paper Jam shows that there's a parallel world where everything is the same, except for the fact everyone is paper. There's no evidence to suggest that the Mario & Luigi series is within another universe or anything like that. Miyamoto has said before that there is only "one Mario" in the games.
In the Land games, Mario does indeed own a castle. But that doesn't mean he kept living in it. It could be more like a vacation home nowadays. Mario Land (where the castle resides) is basically like a theme park, with a bunch of different unique zones to visit. Mario probably wanted to live closer to Peach, so he moved back to his shack in RPG, before upgrading it before Luigi moved in for Paper Mario and the Mario & Luigi games.
The movie, super show, and other licensed media are indeed separate universes. But I don't think they're within a shared multiverse. Of course, that could change in the future. But currently there's no evidence to support such a theory.
@@DaNintendude I suppose the island is explained. But how does there being a parallel universe not support the theory?
9:36 clearly not the entire world in the second movie the map will likely pan out to show more land than what the first movie showed
Maybe him loving mushrooms will grow on him in the second movie idk
Chris Pratt's voice coming out of Mario was enough for me to realize it was non-canon. 😂
He doesn’t even sound Brooklyn
21:36 finally You’re saying that princess peach is different in the movie because peach in the movie is different to her game version. Thank you for mentioning That peach in the movie is different to the games
I have a few sentence rebuttal to this 27 minute video, mario galaxy. At the end of the game, the lumas jump into a black hole and restarts the cycle of the universe. But as Rosalina says, "The cycle never repeats in quite the same way". So, canonically, the mario series takes place in at least 2 different universes with different things happening. So the mario movie could simply take place in the first cycle where mario is in the mushroom kingdom, then it restarts and leads to the games.
Also, worrying about the canonicity of Dance Dance Revolution Mario Mix is so dumb and funny.
The Universe reset undos the events of the original Super Mario Galaxy, and Galaxy 2 happens in its place. That's the only difference that we know for sure is true. I don't think anything about the past would have changed.
@@DaNintendude actually, the creatures from across the game all now live in the mushroom kingdom. So that changed
@@brykinjarman4625 They do not. Honey Queen lives in a different galaxy.
It's possible they were teleported there after the reset, or were visiting for the Star Festival.
@DaNintendude 😑 the star festival is over at that point. The lumas are all alive again, the castle and observatory are fixed. Also, the spin in the water is worse and octolumbas now spit rocks, so other things do change. My explanation is valid.
@@brykinjarman4625 The Star Festival hasn't happened yet.
There are no star bits, and Galaxy 2 starts at the beginning of the festival
26:32 👍😂😆😂
The mushroom thing was miyamoto’s idea he thought it was funny
Maybe after the events of DONKEY KONG,New York was renamed new donk.
New Donk City is on the same planet as the Mushroom Kingdom. New York is not on the same planet in the movie.
Even though I hate the movie, I honestly respect the time and dedication put in this video to prove that the movie is not canon to the main Mario continuity. Seriously, the cartoons and manga are likely more canon to the Mario games than the movie lol.
Also the Mario Portal is NOT canon or reliable for enemy naming, since it has numerous errors and misnames for a multitude of enemies, as well as the fact that it literally stole names from unofficial sources and named some enemies names of entirely unrelated species (Super Mario Galaxy Monty being called Rocky Wrench on the Mario Portal is easily the biggest offender of this).
Edit: Mind rehearting the comment, I just wanted to add something about the Mario Portal?
8:22 if you Watch closly you will notice than swenky don't die in the axident
13:48 You actually missed the very important detail that movieverse toad is implied to be Captain Toad when in the gameverse they're separate characters
The way I see it, it's less that they imply him to be Captain Toad. It's moreso that they merged aspects of the characters together. In terms of role, function, and personality, he's not really anything like the Captain
Fare as i've seen, the power ups healed any wound or injury it's users recieved before activating them! Does that happen in the games as well, or i'm just imagining it and so fourth?
There's no mario continuity, the world changes all the time
7:11 The only reason why Mario hates mushrooms is because they thought it would be funny if he dislikes the thing that makes him bigger and stronger. I feel like you might be overthinking it.
The reason for him hating mushrooms doesn't change the fact that he has always liked mushrooms in the games.
It's not a big thing, but it's a difference nonetheless.
You aciddently called Dk Luigi.
binbenbude (awesome)
Okay, I agree Game Mario isn't from New York, but... why would the RPGs be non-canon if he were? (Partners in Time aside, which uses the Yoshi's Island baby backstory of course) I'm not sure how Mario's origins play into the other RPGs at all, unless I'm missing something obvious.
Super Mario RPG: When you look into Kamek's mind as Mallow, he sees Mario as "that child from that one time?" referencing Yoshi's Island.
Paper Mario 64: Raphael the Raven appears. In Yoshi's Island, he was just a normal Raven that Kamek made huge with his magic. Raphael being his huge self in the game means that Yoshi's Island had to have occurred.
All M&L games have direct continuity to the other M&L games, so because Partners in Time couldn't have happened without Yoshi's Island, then neither can Bowser's Inside Story, Dream Team, or Paper Jam.
Same with the Paper Mario series. PM64 happens in a world where Yoshi's Island happened, so all future PM games have to as well.
@@DaNintendude AH! You're right, I totally forgot about the psychopath thought when I commented. (Side note, I do wonder if he'll be localized as "Kamek" instead of just called Magikoopa in the remake...)
And yes! You are right about Raphael as well; His role in the game slipped my mind when I made my comment. (Side note, I wonder what changed for ol' Raph in about 20 years. He not only no longer has any allegiance to Bowser, but he doesn't seem to know Mario either...)
I getcha. That all makes sense, yeah.
@DrMechano The idea of Raphael moving to Lavalava, becoming humble, and basically becoming a deity to the Yoshis of the island is such a cool idea to me. It's not explained at all, but I just find the hidden development so neat
Well they could still use the Brooklyn Origin, it's just their family had to move in order to protect themselves from Bowser's army and such, as for the movie it's most likely Yoshi sacrificed himself to bet the bros back to Brooklyn where they belong, which could be why a Koopa had an Yoshi egg, because the egg was actually the same yoshi transformed by Kamek, if they keep the whole "storks deliver babies" thing.
@@FluppietheRockruffFan It would still make games not canon because Super Mario Odyssey, which has New Donk City in it, makes it clear the original Donkey Kong took place in New Donk City when you go into the 8bit section with Donkey Kong in it as Jump Up Superstar plays. On top of that, the original Donkey Kong, Donkey Kong Junior and Mario Bros would still not be canon, heck, Super Mario Bros would not be canon if the Movie was canon because Mario Bros directly leads up to it. The retconned Brooklyn origin is impossible to still be canon and the movie as well unless Super Mario Odyssey, Donkey Kong, Donkey Kong Junior, Mario Bros and Super Mario Bros were all not canon, which I find very unlikely honestly.
The debate within Mario community is always what is canon/isnt. I guess that debate rages on...
7:11 You're not gonna criticize Illumination for making that decision are you?
No, it's Miyamoto's fault, lol.
@@DaNintendude Why would you want to blame him for? If it's the way he wants it to be, then so be it.
@@xxroyalprincexx6811 Because he's the one responsible for it?
Mario hating mushrooms in the film is fine. It just contradicts basically all the games, so it stood out to me as a very odd decision.
I still believe this was obvious (im 7 months late wow)
Disagree with Gameverse Bowser “not being willing to kill”. He’s tried to kill Mario and his friends on numerous occasions and has used deadly force on the Mushroom Kingdom numerous times. Even in Odyssey, he straight up orders the Ruined Dragon to blow up Mario and Cappy with him even yelling out and I quote “Let’s see you SURVIVE this, plumber boy!”In many of the games where you play as him such as in SMRPG or Bowsers Inside Story, Bowsers has no problem killing any of the enemies that stand in his way. Even normally, he’s not above attempting genocide in the games, Paper Bowser is not even canon Bowser so let’s ignore him. Bowser tried to destroy the entire Paper Mario UNIVERSE in Paper Jam which in turn would’ve killed BILLIONS.
So yeah, I agree that Movieverse Bowser is worse than Gameverse Bowser, but to say that being willing to kill is “out of character” for Gameverse Bowser is just objectively wrong on so many levels.
Bowser is willing to kill when he is angry, and he's usually only willing to kill Mario.
In the RPGs, enemies are not typically killed. They are knocked out. In Paper Jam, Bowser probably hadn't considered that the paper world would die. He probably thought the connection between worlds would be cut off. It was definitely an impulsive idea, as Paper Bowser definitely would've regretted it eventually.
While Paper Bowser and Bowser are separate characters, they have identical personalities. It's shown several times throughout Paper Jam, down to a scene where they plot to betray the other at the exact same time, using the exact same words.
Movieverse Bowser is very trigger-happy. He's willing to kill a bunch of random people, not because he's angry, but rather because he feels like it.
Ganeverse Bowser may reach points of wanting to kill people, but it's never part of his plan, and he'd never do it in a normal state of being.
Well duh of course is not canon I mean the movie the point of the movie is to be its own separate thing from the games
Also the Kong’s don’t speak a human language.
i think they mentioned this in the first part!!
I think Pauline should be the Mario's girlfreind.
What even is "canon" in a series like Mario?
lore and continuity.
Mario doesn't have overarching plots, but it remembers the past and keeps it in mind. It ties stuff together in fun ways. There isn't an explicit timeline or anything, but there's still a set of rules and progression in terms of characters and information.
@@DaNintendude Sort of. Mario games seem to contradict each other in both spirit and lore all the time. Way moreso than even Sonic or Zelda which are prone to episodic adventures at times but even those episodic adventures do take the past and lore into account (Zelda moreso than Sonic). With Mario, I seriously struggle to find anything that is consistent. Every game feels like a separate episode.
@@seto_kaiba_ I'd argue that Sonic is way more contradictory. Mario only has 2 major retcons, while Sonic has had many, and some just to re-retcon other aspects. There's also official statements that media like Sonic Prime are canon-- which yeah, could work, but feels vastly different than the actual games. (Mario's 2 retcons are the Koopalings no longer being his children, and him being from New Donk City instead of Brooklyn)
Zelda puts more focus on its lore and story than Mario does, which is why it comes off as having more continuity.
Mario games, particularly mainline ones, have a very clear order of events that build upon each other. Power Star lore from Super Mario 64 was greatly expanded upon in Galaxy, which was then expanded upon even more in Odyssey (Power Moon lore, and the implication that Moons and Stars are the same thing).
Captain Toad's own game & DLC tie into timeline placement, with the ending hinting at the green comet from Galaxy 2, as well as leading into 3D World. And its Special Episode is about finding the Super Crown, which places it before NSMBU.
Even small stuff gets expanded upon. The ground-pound symbol from Galaxy gets lore in Odyssey. Mario Kart, sports, and party games are referenced in mainline & RPG titles, and is explained in manuals to be in-universe events, and Bowser basically crashes the party to show he's better than Mario.
I can't really think of any major contradictions outside of Baby Donkey Kong's existence in Yoshi's Island DS, or the geography changing each game (which isn't really a big deal since that's for gameplay purposes).
6:54
In this movie Peach is.........A bad-voiced Marysue.
Using Paper Mario as supporting points doesn't really work because the Paper Mario universe has been shown to be yet another separate timeline from the main games not only with Mario and Luigi Paper Jam but also the fact that most things in those games are actually literally made of paper
Mario & Luigi: Paper Jam describes the Paper World as "parallel" to the real world.
We also see characters acting exactly the same as their Paper counterparts, such as one instance where Bowser & Kamek go off on their own and unknowingly have the exact same conversation as Paper Bowser and Paper Kamek.
We also know from the Paper Mario games that several mainline titles happened within the Paper World. And Paper Mario characters have appeared in real world games, like the Goomba King in Super Mario 64 DS & Mario Kart DS-- as well as the Star Spirits being the hosts of Mario Party 5.
The Goomba King specifically was created by Bowser using the star rod, so Paper Mario 64 had to have happened in the real world.
In other words: it's likely that all Mario games happen in both the real world and the paper world. The paper games have some obvious differences, with their world being literally made of paper. But otherwise, there's nothing stopping the events of Paper games from happening in the real world as well.
@@DaNintendude no
I actually think while the games are not supposed to have a canon, the movie is, so we can somewhat get context for certain stuff with the Mario Bros from the games, like who their mother and father is, hiw mario is so good at parkour in his first adventure, what relatives do they have etc. So for us the games is some alternate universe while the movies are the main stuff. Which could explain some stuff.
Mario is so good at parkour in his first adventure because of his previous adventures in New Donk City.
The original DK Arcade game, Donkey Kong Jr, Wrecking Crew, and Mario Bros.... All of them have him running around. His nickname was Jumpman, because he was so good at jumping.
Mario Bros is specifically supposed to lead into Super Mario Bros, and out of all the city games pre-SMB, he's the most athletic there.
Good the movie is corny af