Fix Your Field of View & the Sense of Speed "Lie" (Sim Racing Tips)
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- Опубликовано: 27 сен 2024
- Real pros only sim race with the "Death Star trench run" Field of View.
/ 958064381304156162 - See, verifiable proof. LOL
FoV Calculator-
www.projectimme...
Horizontal to Vertical FoV Calculator-
themetalmuncher...
Follow me like a stalker! (please dont actually stalk me... duh)
/ emptybox_007
![Are you making these MISTAKES when braking [Sim Racing]](/img/1.gif)
I rarely comment but Holy shit, in AC i was using like 58 FOV, turns out my realistic FOV should be 28, i now have my FOV at 28.7 and i just feel like i am doing faster and better laps, because now that i am zoomed in i get a proper sense of scale of the track and how wide i can go, also it feels like i have more time to react, absolutely insane difference, it's absolutely unbelievable. Thank you so much!!!
Also one thing i've found, car starting to oversteer is A LOT scarier, probably because of the immersion and sense of scale that you're actually in a car that is losing control, so drifting is now not only fun, but terrifying!
Eventually you will probably find over steer isn't that scary and you can detect it sooner than before. :)
I'll have to try this and see how far mine is off. I increased mine alot from the starting value because it felt too closed in but I probably have it much too wide now as well.
Actually, after doing about 220km on Nordschleife you're correct, you can sense when the car is about to oversteer a lot sooner, usually with the wide FOV you don't have a reference point so by the point you start feeling it in the wheel it's almost too late. The only drawback i've seen thus far is drifting is a lot more difficult as you can't actually look around / see where you're going, and i didn't find a way to have the camera turn as i turn the wheel, sadly
Martin Angelov And this is where Real Head Motion comes in. It needs some fiddling to find the settings you like but is definitely worth it. Content manager also has integration for it so you don't have to turn it on manually every time you want to race.
The latest version of it is 1.0.4.2. It might be a bit hard to find but don't get an earlier version.
Real Head Motion doesn't work for drifting though because the opposite lock points your head in exactly the wrong direction
Back in the '90s I did a lot of track driving in real life. When I got my first driving sim game it had my local track and I literally could not drive the track in the game no matter how slow I went. So I shelved the game. Only in recent years did I try again, found FOV talk on forums, and that fixed my visual perception problem.
If FOV does not make complete sense to people, it could also be thought of as zoom level. We spend our entire lives at 1:1 zoom. This is how our brains are trained to judge distance. This is also how we learn to judge upcoming corners when driving. Changing FOV away from 1:1 zoom level messes up our perception. Calculating FOV for your monitor size and placement is how to get near what you brain is already calibrated to.
Thanks for the video.
I sometimes give the example of the hotel brochure with the luxuriously spacey rooms that, once you arrive there, turn out to be nothing more than a broom closet photographed with a super-wide angle lense that not only makes the room seem wider on the sides, but also changes the felt distance at the center of the picture to the other end of the room.
not only that, adding a wide angle view distorts distance perception and spatial awareness
This is how I felt. With the correct FOV, I feel like my brain doesn't have to process extra calculation needed for corner.
was it assetto corza with a controller
cause controllers are fucked i noticed and none the fuck mentions it.
10% tilt leads to 90% steering wheel turn
Thanks for re-doing your tutorial videos lately empty, we really appreciate it
Agreed
Here you will see how to get the fov right in 45 secs: ruclips.net/video/CljcI7SylPM/видео.html
Thanks for the video, I too am a "correct FOV" evangelist and I can't really fathom how people cry for laser-scanned tracks, direct-drive wheels etc. etc. and then end up driving looking through a fisheye lens. If i may, one thing you could add is use your drawings to show the distortion that happens with high FOV. If the space around you is a circle, it becomes oval the more you increase the FOV to have a bigger slice of it stay in front of your eyes. Which hurts your brain in two ways: 1) stretches the world right in front of you, making things appear farther and flatter 2) alters the perceived speed of any object coming at you making it artificially faster. This is a great recipe for misjudging distances, elevations, corner angles, opponent cars' behavior. In short words: it is easier to drive with correct FOV!
It's all relative, like I can't fathom how I use to drive on a monitor which is practically a 2d video feed on the driver's face, now that I have VR.
Haha right, but what I am talking about is just changing a little number in the settings.
well there's nothing human about going faster than running speed, so all perception is arbitrary at that point, especially when on a small (not surround) single screen
I used to be such an evangelist too. The problem was, I could barely judge the distance using the "correct" FoV, which is around 25° vertical for my setup. That was especially true for the situations where I needed to back out, almost inevitably leading to me hitting something with the rear of the car (if I wasn't looking backwards). I endured through this ordeal for a while, since the usual default FoV of 60 or so feels just wrong. But then I decided to give it a little thinking and came to the conclusion that one thing the calculators don't take into consideration is that our vision is (mostly) binocular and there is the stereoscopic base offsetting our eyes from one another. So, with only one eye placed at the center you can only see a certain frustum, but displace it a bit to the left and then the to right, and that would open noticeably more of the world "behind the window". That's why I think you need to take the "correct FoV" formula with a little grain of salt.
These days I'm using a perceptive approach: take a car which dimensions you can visualize in your mind, place it somewhere close to an object of a known size, which is also easily imaginable (like a marshal, for example). Make sure you can see the object clearly from the cockpit, preferably to its full height. Then look at the object from the cockpit, look at the scene from the side with the car facing the object, try to visualize how you would actually see that object if you were sitting in that car for real, looking at the object. Adjust the field of view, so that the object would feel about the same size and distance from you that you expect it to be. Take another look from the side, take another look from the cockpit. Adjust again. Repeat until you are more or less satisfied. The actual numbers are not all that important, since your viewing distance might fluctuate during the race, but just set the FoV to something making sense for your brain.
In my case the right perceptive FoV appeared to be around higher 30's to the lower 40's.
And another thing. Try to place the monitor as close to your face as safely possible. Every inch counts. Of course, getting a bigger screen is a huge help too. Just keep in mind that TVs can introduce a significant amount of input lag that will make all your FoV woes seem petty in comparison.
The bigger the screen and the farther you are sitting from it, the more sense the "monocular" correct FoV formula should have.
i could not believe how much of a difference this made. I play on a 55 inch tv and making some minor adjustments to the fov, i was able to knock off 1+ seconds off of my fastest lap times. Changing the fov and making sure i am keeping my eyes up and looking in the proper area have made a huge difference and given me much more confidence when racing.
the fov calculator is just not there when I click the link
“Knock-knock open up this is the sim racing police” OOHHH SHEET!
The struggle is that, low FOV gives you less peripheral vision and less visual cues, whereas high FOV makes you not able to perceive the speed and turning accurately. The only solution i suppose, is VR. But it's such a hassle to deal with that heavy equipment on you face for 30min.
I suggest we should just go play hotwheels .
Gaslands is a tabletop game that lets you use your Hot Wheels cars. I know you were kidding, but there really is a really good game for that
VR still isn't that good. Lots of, either lag, or jerkiness. I haven't been impressed yet with any VR footage I've seen.
I was in the Gran Turismo Sport closed Beta and made a big and detailed thread on Polyphony's beta feedback forum, explaining why FOV is important, what it does, why it's more important in a sim with realistic tracks and braking distances etc. I also listed games that had FOV options, among them GT5 and GT6 (they're disguised as triple-screen options, but work on single displays as well) as well as many newer console games like DiRT Rally, Project CARS and Assetto Corsa, with the conclusion that at the time really only Forza was as ass-backwards as GT was going to get back to (since then Codemasters has dialed FOV console options back again as well). Another guy who wanted camera position and movement options (seat position as well) fought with me and we helped each other, bumping our threads. They got a ton of likes and after about 4 weeks a patch was introduced that allowed some (very very limited) seat position options and a dev wrote something to us along the lines of "sorry, we tried to implement FOV options, but... framerate". Which in my opinion is BS when most people actually need a narrower FOV, which should actually be less resource intense than the relatively wide FOV currently in there.
So, ...we TRIED to complain and get FOV in there. The Forza forums are full of it as well, but the Turn 10 devs don't even answer those.
Another thing:
I liked your first FOV video a lot and even linked to it in my GTS beta thread. Now this new FOV video has got some good visualization (good work!), but I wish you would have shown the difference from bad FOV to good (and probably relatively narrow-"slow") FOV in regards to sense of speed more while driving --> two prime examples for me:
- *Nordschleife in Forza* vs the Nordschleife in lets say AC, iR or R3E with correct FOV (maybe add the line "imagine you were playing this 5 feet away from a living room TV"). This examples highlights the distortion of distances very well (take the Adenauer Forst "S" after the Fuchsröhre... the geometry seems un-round with bad FOV)
- *DiRT Rally* a forrest stage highlights the ridiculous sense of speed an unrealistically wide FOV gives. A Germany stage can show the distortion of brake distances.
Also really good are Spain stages in DiRT 4. When the replay camera changes to the backseat center cockpit camera with a wide FOV, the stages look so ridiculously fast, no sane person would drive on a road without run-off areas at that speed.
I remember campaigning for this back in the Forza 2 days and they did have options to change the FOV in Forza 3. This was almost a decade ago. I played FM3 and FM4 on a projector with a calculated FOV, it was great.
Did they remove it in the newest ones? I'm not sure what you're getting at, it sounds like from context that they did remove that feature.
@@amirsharar8547 Yeah, FOV adjustment is removed from FM7. :/
Thanks a lot for the tutorial, Empty Box!
In Assetto Corsa, the big jump from 55 to the calculated 25 was just too much for me, very uncomfortable making the game unplayable. I found that by reducing the FoV gradually I'm able to adapt a lot better, a couple of hours in FoV 40 already feel a lot better than the previous 50. Next step is a 35 or 30, whichever feels adaptable.
Same for me, I should be running like 28 to 30 on ACC but I simply can't, I often don't even see the apex of the corner I'm turning into, never mind cars around me. It's impossible to race with that low of a setting.
Dear Mr Box
I can’t begin to thank you enough for posting this
I’ve been iracing for just over 12 months and am only an average driver.
I never realised how screwed up my fov was!!!
I kid you not within 10 laps I’m already just over 2 sec quicker!!
I can actually brake later and get the car to the apex so much better.
Thank you so much sir. 👍
same here. not 2 seconds but still way more stable laps
i just feel like im going at 5km/h on low fov and launch into a guardrail on every corner
edit: i still see this comment getting replied to lol, setting correct fov on a 24in screen is dumb but putting it somewhat close (ive been playing on 35-36fov for a long time now) actually improved my driving in many sim racers
Yeah me to its shit
The problem is for single screen users this is like driving with an Empty Box on your head where the open end is the same size and distance of the screen. You will lose peripheral vision and therefore sense of speed. I went from hitting walls to a much more natural sensation by setting the calculators to about 1/3 of the distance and adjust seat back or forward so the view / wheel is closer to what your eyes see without a box on your head
@Lewis Wood taken directly from the wiki on Peripheral vision: "The loss of peripheral vision while retaining central vision is known as tunnel vision". The very thing we get taught to avoid when learning to drive, so if you don't have the setup (eg triple / super wide / VR) then it makes no sense to sacrifice peripheral vision input by overly constraining your FoV. In short ... agree
@Lewis Wood they have to get used to it because they've been driving with an incorrect FoV that they're comfortable with. FoV is the single most important thing to setup properly for an immersive and accurate driving experience, but that doesn't mean you can't be fast with an incorrect FoV. Smarter people than both you and I have researched this concept, so no, it isn't being applied incorrectly. This concept is applied to other games with adjustable FoV also, not just sim racing. Your statement that this concept is wrong is just totally incorrect.
@Lewis Wood on a single monitor you definitely need to make somewhat of a compromise. Also nothing wrong in playing with what you're comfortable with. For some people though, it does make a huge difference. I use a 21:9 34" and having the proper FoV set made me a lot more consistent. Each to their own though.
I love the way how you are explain all the pros and maybe some minor cons of this topic. You’re video is very well made and if you said a game changer for all serious simracer. Thanks for spending a lot of time to do this tutorial.
Still perfect...kind regards from Germany
I’m that guy. I run triple 24” screens. IRacing’s calculator says my fov should be 49, but I run 97 because I can’t see the dash gauges otherwise.
If you are running 3 24" monitors and calculating to a 49 degree FoV, you probably need to address that issue... what, are they on the other side of the room?
I'm a little over a meter away from the centre screen, running 36 degrees on the span. Building a new rig at the moment which should allow me to put the centre screen just behind the wheel motor. Looking forward to that day.
Shaun Watts i guess 1m is way to far for 24" setup. Im sitting at the same distance in front of 46" single screen and calculated fov is same as yours. 49°
I've been a casual sim racer for a decade or so now and still must admit that this completely blew my mind. The default settings are there only to show as much graphics as possible and I wager that with most setups and games, the FOV is way, WAY too high. I sit really close to a 32" screen and had to crank it right down (Assetto Corsa), but after I did that.. Oh boy. Basically any car I drive actually acts super predictably and the fabled 'sense of speed' is greatly enhanced - not meaning that I get scared by the scenery exaggeratedly whizzing by, but that the car now acts more closely to my experiences from real life driving. The irony in this is that I learn about the importance of FOV literally days away from receiving my first VR headset (Rift S). *sigh* I could've gotten way more mileage out of a regular screen & TrackIR had I known. Still, thank you!
i like to stretch the fov a bit over the correct fov, so that i can se the side mirror(s) I think they help me alot to see my surroundings
The immersion is SO BIGGER with the correct FoV, it's awesome!
The video is wrong. Here you will see how to get the fov right in 45 secs: ruclips.net/video/CljcI7SylPM/видео.html
I think you're missing the point that having such a limited FoV *does* reduce sense of speed. Yes, it might be realistic if we had such a limited viewport in real life as well, but we wouldn't have such a limited viewport in real life, so the sense of speed *is* lower than it would be in real life and some people understandably dont like that. Many like to race because they like going fast, not because they are looking to eek out half a tenth or they're in love with intense, close competition. And for them, having a lackluster sense of speed just sucks.
I discovered this on my own years ago using rFactor and found it to be exactly as you describe. Myself, I use a fair bit of head motion to get the sense of speed, for I enjoy the challenge of trying to suss out what I see through the unsettled image - but that's my preference, others may not want it. I also use the controller look-ahead settings in order to see into tight hairpins such as at '67 Mexico, or the Station Hairpin at Monaco. This is great advice. For those who haven't tried it, it's worth getting used to for you really feel like you're inside the cockpit. If it's done right your natural depth perception becomes another tool in your arsenal - especially if you run it in 3D.
Another great video. The important thing about FOV is the depth perception. Maybe next time you can illustrate this point by showing (in iRacing) the difference of where cars "appear" to be in the "virtual mirror (fov = 120)" and their actual position using the correct fov with the center mirror and/or side mirrors.
Excellent! Your original FOV vid changed my world! Now I’m in the Rift and there’s no turning back
The video is wrong. Here you will see how to get the fov right in 45 secs: ruclips.net/video/CljcI7SylPM/видео.html
Good info. Speed is sensed by the distance to a reference point. Example look in the sky at jet at 24,000 feet passing overhead and it looks slow. Very far away and no reference points. Now go to an air show and watch a jet do a high speed pass 100 ft over the runway and it looks like 700 mph. Many points of reference to sense speed. I dive a race car that does 220 + mph and the car is 2 inches off the ground. The sense of speed is incredible in the cockpit.
I am relatively new to sim racing. Been doing it for a couple of years, mostly doing laps on F1 cars. For the first year I was (foolishly) using TV cockpit view which felt comfortable to me. After a year I thought why not do some testing sessions in cockpit view. I did that and it felt surprisingly more immersive. It was only a month ago that I finally thought about changing the field of view and voila! Not only did the sense of speed now feel right but also how the car vibrates when going through bumps on the track and the suspension feels great too. Just going around the track now is a lot of fun on its own. Amazing.
That Slaptrain dude could sure watch this video
I don't really watch his videos but I thought he played Forza and stuff like that? Meaning he is NOT a sim racer... So who cares about his FoV? You wouldn't try to get realistic FoV in forza horizon or need for speed or would you?
I'd try, but I wouldn't succeed.
Drifting is quite different from racing, especially when done casually. Unless you drift competitively you don't need milimetere-perfect braking or throttle marks
@@michalvalta5231 Playing Forza 7 sometimes and PCARS 2 and AC at others, I can tell you that 1. FM7 is not *that* abysmally unrealistic (it's drivable on controller not because the physics are dumb, though they are imperfect; it's drivable on controller because of artificial assists, steering angle limits etc), and 2. I actually *have* to race with the braking line on, since without it I overshoot corners almost constantly, being trained to the more natural braking distances of a proper FOV in other sims. If Forza FOV could be adjusted, I probably wouldn't have this problem.. at the very least, I might have the opposite.
Thank you for this video. I found out how much I needed this. After I fixed my FOV I magically and instantly got really good at recovering from spins. The visual input was the last piece of the puzzle I needed.
Here you will see how to get the fov right in 45 secs: ruclips.net/video/CljcI7SylPM/видео.html
SlapTrain should watch this video😂
But why? Maybe I am wrong but doesn't he play games like Forza Horizon? You really don't need to go for realistic FoV in that game, cause it's not realistic. This whole guide is meant for sim racers.
Michal Valta he also played a lot of assetto Corsa, badly but still.
kraM1t just let them be. You need people like them so that’s why you’re always 3 seconds a lap faster driver than him or them. You offered them an insight but they chose to ignore it, they don’t warrant an enlightenment, it’s as simple as that.
* SLAPTrain enters chat *
* Obnoxiously loud EDM Music *
"WhAt Is GoInG oN gUyS"
@@TheDriftingStig Good god I hate his intro. XD
Thanks for this very informative video on FOV racing. When I went to VR several years ago, it was like night and day compared to looking at a display screen. To actually be placed right behind the wheel in a cockpit of the vehicle is an awesome feeling to the eyes. I never wanted to go back to flat screen viewing again.
Then with VR it is based on how well the side views are with the headset. My 2 headsets are around 120 degree views, but some can achieve 170 degrees. Also how large is the sweet spots on the lenses far as clarity.
SIM racing has come a long way since the first years of Auto racing game. I really enjoy all the current Sim racing games and to the people who make all the 3rd party addons, tracks, cars, etc. for each game.
i went from 50fov to 27fov but i find i drive worst and the sense of speed is gone.
Keep at it. Don't go back. The only way you should make your view wider is a bigger "window" into the game world (I mean a monitor or a few).
Top notch Sir, Much Much obliged.
Damn the difference is night & day, night & day lads, one word scintillating.
I literally teared of happiness, when adjusted the Fov, now I'm feeling the car, weight transition & catching slides like a piece of cake, throttle & brake inputs are damn precise, nailing every apex i desire everything feels natural now.
Mount panorama & the nurburgring track width feels like a mile wide, consistency is scary amazing 10 laps within 2 tenths.
Thanks a million dude. You maid every one around me happy. It was that bad.
This is why nose camera is better (unfortunately unrealistic position) to go faster. Wide view, closer to the asphalt... Thanks for the video.
yeah but its harder to judge distance because your fov is wrong
y e e t s I learned to play with cockpit view. Now it’s impossible to use another angle. lol
In my curiosity I calculated my CURVED monitor hFoV myself to see how much difference it makes to a flat monitors hFoV that the calculator in the link gives.
- I have a 49" curved monitor that has 1800R. With 32:9 relation this makes it 47,16 inches horizontal width (assuming the screen size is measured taking into account the curvature instead of going straight across)
- then calculate a circle circumference with r=1800 which makes about 11310 roughly.
- then convert the monitor 47,16 inch to mm I get 1198mm roughly
- now just calculate (1198/11310)*360 which makes 38 hFoV at 1800 viewing distance
It's not all though. I placed the monitor closer to myself at about 1100mm instead of 1800mm. Again with trigonometry we can convert this as follows
- first calculate the opposite of the triangle with tan(38/2)*1800 we get ~620mm
- finally use 1100 instead of 1800 to come back to the hFoV so we calculate 2*tan-1(620/1100) ~59 hFoV
Now if I just plug all the monitor details and viewing distance to the calculator (assumes flat screen) I get a 57 hFoV at 1100 viewing distance (using the Project Cars game).
So in conclusion with a curved monitor you can use 1-3 degrees higher FoV depending on your screen size. This obviously does not make a much of a difference compared to a flat screen.
Not saying that you should not get a curved monitor even if it does not help with the FoV much. Curved monitors have other benefits compared to flat ones.
You are a lifesaver man... i just changed my fov from 75 to 45 30 min ago after seeing this video wich it was calculated.
Did i istantly drive seconds faster ? Yes and no. I did break my previous laprecord though after a few laps so in a case yes ! Imagine after 1000 laps of practice with this new experience.
What i did feel INSTANTLY was confidence! I can take apex smoothly i know when to throttle or brake better. Its a real dealmaker ! Cant thank you enough for this
I have alway used the cockpit or hood view, even in the arcade games like nfs. I just cant get a feel for the car in any other views.
I can’t do hood cam, but I really can’t do chase cam. I was never good at remote control cars.
Chase cam is really bad for me too. Cockpit or hood is fine, since in both cases the camera is fixed on the car. Chase cam usualy turns a little in corners and you just can't be as precise. At least I can't...
Michal Valta the only game I use chase CDM is Forza (because I don't treat it like a sim and I'm on a pad instead of a wheel as the Logitech G920 sucks dick on Forza), however I use cockpit/hood cams in every other Sim I use (as the G920 actually works on a proper sim)
There's actually a really good argument for gamers to not use miniscule sub 70 field of views: motion sickness. Such tiny fields of view give quite a lot of people headaches and motion sickness, and it just feels very uncomfortable, personally my eyes start to hurt once the FOV gets below 70. The discomfort factor is also there if you're used to gaming at higher fields of view. And with that brought up, I really disagree with the whole "having a higher FOV makes your brain not understand what's going on" thing. People have been playing very mentally demanding video games, including driving ones, at higher fields of view for ages, and don't run into problems. The brain can adapt to it. What matters most is practicing at one field of view, and not changing it. Which is why you'll see some pro CS players still using ancient 4:3 resolutions and field of view. I suspect one thing that a lower fov helps with is increasing framerate. That should not be discounted when miliseconds are on the line.
I’ve always felt that for sim racing the dash or hood camera is superior to the cockpit, this is based the idea that your playseat and wheel are representing the cockpit and the screen is the window. Playing with cockpit view feels weird to me, because it’s like i’m sitting inside the drivers head. In my experience both Asetto Corsa and Dirt Rally have the best dash cameras.
TheRealJuralumin
I agree. I like dash-cam too, or move the cockpit cam forward enough so its in a dash-cam position. Dirt rally's dash-cam looks perfect. I set my cockpit view so the top edge of my steering wheel is in line with the top of the cars dashboard, like it would be in my car. I dont like to see the instrumentation above the top of my steering wheel rim. It looks wrong. In my car the speedometer isn't above the top edge of my steering wheel rim. I guess its personal preference. I just cant bare using mathematically correct FOV. I have to have a good visual sensation of speed. It just feels and looks like im travelling at 10mph with correct FOV when the speedometer says im actually doing 100mph.. I've tried to get used to low FOV a few times, but with a single screen i just cant, and i dont enjoy the experience at all. Project cars 2 doesn't offer enough camera shake either.
yes i also use dash/hood view for the same reason, when i drive my real car i dont see a pair of fake hands on a second steering wheel and i dont see the inside of my car when i look though my front windscreen, i dont mind if people like cockpit view, each to their own, what pisses me off is when people say your doing it wrong and the cockpit view or nothing mentality they have (like in this video) even worse when some online servers use "force cockpit view" as an option.
DR's dash camera showed me the light, it's impressive how right it feels.
I agree.. if you are used to driving a real car this is more natural than having an extra steering wheel and hands in front of you.
if you had the money for a goddamn playseat you might as well slap on a VR headset in there as well.
When I first started with iracing years ago I had one monitor and I used to choose all kinds of crazy fov settings. But when I got my first triple monitor setup I actually used the calculator and my times dropped dramatically. I thought it was only because of the three screens peripheral references. When I went back to one monitor I then figured out that it was the fov that I was using that made me more accurate for the most part. Everything may have seemed slower but it was way more realistic and accurate.
It's not so simple. I already mentioned the binocular vision vs. monocular vision FoV discrepancies answering guidofoc down below, but after watching the video I also needed to comment on the feeling of speed problem.
First of all, simply maxing out camera shaking will only make you feel queasy (and I did feel this way while watching that portion of the video). You are forgetting, Matt, that in real life our brain and the "suspension" of our head help a lot to compensate for the vibrations, while what you are offering is basically the same as mounting a camera inside the cockpit rigidly. Also, that should be good for ruining the eyes... So, a much better solution here is having some head movement relative to the road surface, but much more smoothed out and lower frequency, while the cockpit itself (the dashboard or whatever) should indeed vibrate a lot at speed.
What people do not understand about the higher FoV and the sense of speed is that it ONLY works if the compressed and distorted outer part of it whizzing past will only make one feel speed better if that part is placed in the peripheral vision. In other words, no amount of FoV compressing will help sense speed better on a tiny monitor placed far away. If you have a huge screen, however, even the "correct" FoV will be able to convey speed better. And the triple screens here are clearly the winner, since they place the moving stuff right into your peripheral vision, not to mention VR, but it has its own drawbacks related to the desync between the visuals and the lack of the inner ear stimulation due to bumps and g-forces.
No where did I say you should max out the shake, I only used it as a demonstration as to how much of an impact it can have.
Ok, but I hope you agree with what I wrote above in general?
That our brain smooths a rough ride? Yes. Not a chance in hell I'd actually race with the camera movement turned up like that as evidenced by the fact I don't race like that.
Sense of speed is relative, even on a tiny screen you still get a difference between no speed and high speed. It's not as obvious because of the screen size, but any practical size monitor or TV will give you something. If a wide FoV didn't help create a sense of speed at a distance, why is the console crowd obsessed with it? We're not playing on a gameboy here.
Disagree on VR, once you get used to it it's no worse than any standard type of setup in terms of "not actually moving".
What is was saying is that high FoV settings for a tiny screen placed far enough are practically useless. The part of the image that is responsible for the sense of speed due to FoV (appearing to move by the fastest) needs to be placed in your peripheral view to actually affect the perception of speed.
Of course one can get used to analyzing what's going on in their immediate field of view to derive the speed from that, but that won't be much more natural than checking the speedo all the time.
As for why the console crowd is obsessed with fish-eye camera views, that's basically placebo. They'd been told that wider angles help to perceive the speed better, they simply crank it up, and the brain does the rest.
We can see a similar effect with the "belief in the mathematically correct FoV". If we believe in that it's the right way to set up your screen (regardless of context), we won't mind driving while seeing the world as if through a spyglass. And that's why both parties will have problems with accepting what is postulated by the opposite party.
The actual FoV setting you should use to perceive the distance properly, among other things, also depends on the eyes stereoscopic base to the screen viewing distance. Because you have two eyes, your field of view through an actual window of this size would be wider than what you calculated for the 'ideal' one eye in the center situation. Furthermore, the closer the screen to your eyes, the more effect will the stereoscopic base will have (unless you have separate/non-interleaving screens for each eye).
The solution is more or less easy: just calculate the right FoV, then widen it up until you feel like the objects you see appear to be at the distance they actually are at (and the angular sizes you'd expect them to have at that distance). The bigger the screen is and the farther it is from your point of viewing it, the closer the "mathematically correct" formula to the perceptibly correct FoV.
One more thing. It's not very useful to demonstrate videos shot at different view angles, simply because they would only make sense if the viewer has a similar setup as the one you recorded it on (or for). And people usually don't watch YT videos from their racing rig seats.
I'm ~98% positive the last 30sec of this video were of Mount Panorama -- as an Australian, that initial climb up to McPhillamy is burned into my retinas after years of TV coverage... plus the Tyrepower branding on the walls, that's a dead giveaway.
If I could, I would give you a check for $1000.00. But alas, I don't have that amount laying around. Would you rather settle for a big hug? The tips you gave in this video are invaluable for an aspiring racer like me. A big thanks to you!
WOW! Watched this video, dramatically chnaged my FOV. Couple of laps I was all over the place. Just knocked about a second off my Silverstone PB. Thanks Man :-)
Tried lowering the fov for my summer car and I finally got a sub 6 min run!
The video is wrong. Here you will see how to get the fov right in 45 secs: ruclips.net/video/CljcI7SylPM/видео.html
HOOOLLLLYYYY CCCCRRRRAAAAPPP! That makes a world of difference. Couldn’t figure out why I seemed to be braking at right about the same spot yet I’d exit the corner so differently. I couldn’t spot my turn in due to perception. Thanks man makes total sense and thanks for the bonus tip about remapping my peek left and right.
Hi from England Empty box
In the early 2010s I did a lot of work on fields of view in single seater racing cars and thought you may like it if I shared a few of my observations from this time
A single seater racing car driver sat with an eyeline approximately 1 metre above the ground (I forget the exact height) with high cockpit sides, wearing a racing harness, HANS device and racing helmet has very limited head movement, you don’t see drivers turning their heads 90 degrees right and left on straights,.
Drivers have very limited rearward visibility, I mapped the drivers vision through 360 degrees, with a driver in the driving seat indicating when traffic cones came into his field of view, one result was that a traffic cone placed six metres directly behind the centre line of the car is not visible to the driver in his mirrors ( single seater, only wing mirrors), the rearward view in driving games is not even close to realistic.
Other research tracking drivers eye movements has found that a driver focuses well ahead of their car on the corner ahead and not at looking 90 degrees to each side and rearward while approaching a corner, drivers have a surprisingly limited view of cars pulling out from behind and attempting to overtake on the approach to a corner, crystal clear rear views, radar displays and warning arrows don’t exist in real life.
I play GT sport, Assetto Corsa and project Cars 2 and have worked on some of the cars I race in these games in real life, when I was in university studying to become a race engineer every time simulators were mentioned it was stated “games are not simulators” which is a statement I agree with, they are games marketed as simulators.
These comments are not meant to be argumentative, but are based on observations made on actual single seater cars.
Thank you
No, you don't see drivers turning their heads as much as we can, but they also can look with their eyes. If anything, you've really just made more arguments for a correct FoV as you've stated you can't see snot anyways. That's what makes a proper setup (especially if you can use mirrors and the game does them properly which few do) so much fun!
Empty Box thanks for the reply
I wasn’t making an argument for or against correct fov,, it isn’t something I’ve given much thought to, i was just enjoying your video and thought I’d share some observations from real life
Keep up the good work
Excellent and helpful information! Thanks much. I used the calculator, set my FOV and kept overthinking/tweaking things. Took your advice and stuck with one (proper) FOV setting and lap times are the proverbial proof in the pudding. Thanks again!
Field of view makes all the difference especially on triples. Gives you much better depth perception for breaking points etc. to say it doesn’t is completely incorrect. Once I adjusted my field of view to the correct increments my lap times reduced dramatically. I don’t use the screens much these days since I got VR but to set up your FOV correctly is a must in 2D.
Great piece; I love all the perspectives here. Never too many ways to get the fov points across.
The video is wrong. Here you will see how to get the fov right in 45 secs: ruclips.net/video/CljcI7SylPM/видео.html
I changed my VR fov to 120 degrees
Its like being on XTC.
For free.
The video is wrong. Here you will see how to get the fov right in 45 secs: ruclips.net/video/CljcI7SylPM/видео.html
The only thing I don't like about realistic field of view is the fact that on single monitor setups I usually lose my mirrors. If the game I'm playing doesn't have a decent spotter, that means someone can get beside me and I would never know it until I turn into them.
Virtual mirrors are your friend.
Only if they're properly implemented in the particular game. Most only offer a pitifully bad rearview.
I dont see a problem with driving the "incorrect" fov for some persons.
First of all the brain adapts to changes and can remember them and switch. The "conversion" error is variable of course but to say its bigger than everything else is not taking all aspects into account. A person with glases also views the world different and if you are riding a bicycle after 10 years again, you probably wont fall over.
Secondly its a still a game and not reality. Making one part of it super realistic while many other conditions remain unchanched, like he absence of g forces, does not make it overall better every time.
Driving a correct small fov makes it harder to judge your own speed. To explain it, its like driving with 270° wheel rotation instead of 900°. You have a smaller window to judge, easily speaking.
The correct fov made me personally slower (had it on for longer than 1 year) because i drive mostly visually unfixed and not by speed, gear or fixed mark/brake points. I couldnt tell if i was driving 80 or 100 km/h. I am not able to check my speed at the same time i have to be concentrated on a turn for example and the more i can see of my own car in the cockpit view, the more i feel attached to it and "feel" myself in the enviroment, so i switched to a wider fov and my driving improved. just my 2 cents. never make a thing a "must", it always depends.
[Edit] Just to add an afterthought... The more you differ from the real world, the more differences in preference will show up. If you tell someone to grab a ball from the ground and bring it to you, you will have a good succes rate, but if they have to use a remote controlled video observed dipper to do it, they all have their own preference configuration.
*Driving a correct small fov makes it harder to judge your own speed.*
I disagree entirely. The speed is the speed and if anything relying on peripheral vision to calculate your speed is doing it wrong and is an adaptation to the lack of detail available in the centre, ie. the most important part of your screen. The issue with this video is it really doesn't get into the problem with the distortion effect of a wide FOV and that's the critical issue here. Distorted high FOV compresses more detail in the centre of the image making the objects you're approaching effectively appear faster, too fast to gauge distance in many cases. A lower FOV makes them seem slower, they come at you more gradually rather than being distorted then suddenly becoming apparent. This gives you more time to orient yourself and creates a sense of approach to the corner. It also makes placing the car easier because you have something to look at.
I think maybe you spent over a year driving with a lower FOV and not improving because you failed to adapt to the conditions. If you're not basing your movements based on markers what is your action relative to? Feeling is basically just then a subjective thing but it is always going to be relative no matter what. It seems you adapted to gather the necessary information for cornering from things outside the centre of the view and by not rejecting this method with a lower FOV you basically rejected the value of it and stubbornly carried on with your method.
*To explain it, its like driving with 270° wheel rotation instead of 900°. You have a smaller window to judge, easily speaking.*
The case is more I think that you are driving with the 270' setting with respect to the centre of the screen when you use a higher FOV with all the compression and distortion of detail, that lowers the resolution of objects further away and makes judging distances and speeds of approach harder. I think this idea of using the periphery of a flat screen as your guide is misleading. Its not how our eyes work so maybe you've learned to make the best of an inferior methodology.
"i drive mostly visually unfixed and not by speed, gear or fixed mark/brake points. " What are you doing?
Yes it makes judging the speed harder for me. And exactly what empty box is talking about, I like more to sit inside the car not touching steering wheel with my beard. Thats what I feel and that is my preference . We are all slightly different from each other so applying "correctness" on paper is not correct for everyone
*Thats what I feel and that is my preference . We are all slightly different from each other so applying "correctness" on paper is not correct for everyone*
In this case then your preference could be entirely driven by a stubbornness and refusal to become comfortable with a superior arrangement. Preference is a really sneaky little concept. Anytime this argument gets made with respect to say FOV nobody seems able to offer anything but "feels wrong" or "I prefer" as arguments.
In the end if you can't explain why it works other than you feel it works no matter how convinced you are I will remain perpetually skeptical that its not simply a person being stubborn or prioritizing the wrong things, such as feeling their comfort with the immersion in the cockpit is essential to confidence in cornering or whatever.
BollocksUtwat just to sum this up - as I said, if you can do better cornering and such with low FOV, than you can use it. I can't. Its simple. I tried and it does not work for me at all. I would rather have smaller on-track view and a bit more "cockpitness" around me. That way I can focus on upcoming apex as well as have few more degrees of seeing what is around me.
As I said: everyone is slightly different. Thats the trick.
Really really good video. You had me at “you should use the cockpit view”. I hate it too when I watch Gran Turismo “finals” and these guys are driving with a view that’s not realistic as a driver. It’s absurd.
I’ll be coming back your tutorials.
That´s the most instructive FOV video ever. I´m strugling to find the correct for flight simulator and this is very informative. My main problem was just the "sense of speed". You made things much clear. Thanks a lot.
You are so right about GT sport's terrible cockpit view. You can't adjust the FoV, you can't even turn off the virtual driver. It sucks!
Camera movement doesn't add sense of speed, it's a sense of instability that can trick you into thinking you must be going faster, it wears off, and its value in terms of realism is highly questionable.
Low fov does foreshorten distances. Time to travel is the same, so it feels slower.
High fov let's you see objects as they pass more closely, sense of speed when you look sideways or are very close to an object is much higher.
High fov does have a greater sense of speed.
Perhaps you should do a video about drawing the in-game wheel (or not). VR makes sense, but otherwise....
To me it's a case of whether the screen is a window into the world, or as you said, a view from a camera. Neither is wrong, it's all just personal preference, and helping people set their displays correctly is one thing, but that's as far as it goes.
I like the cockpit motion blur. I don't see it as a real effect but more like simulating the effect adrenaline has on your focus when your actually moving at these kind of speeds.
That 47 degrees view looked like i was biting into the steering wheel, holy crap does it feel uncomfortable. something like 65 would be the bare minimum i would go, actually 90 seems way more natural.
gotta move your seat back homie
turn the virtual wheel off
Just watched this for probably the 10th time and still as informative and enjoyable as the first time.
Thank you for the great content with a ton of humor thrown in, the little captions are as funny today as there were initially...
The video is wrong. Here you will see how to get the fov right in 45 secs: ruclips.net/video/CljcI7SylPM/видео.html
Hoping you can help me Matt - I did the calculations (I have done them before) and on my 32" 16:9 monitor that I sit 33" from (it's a long way, I know) the vFOV on Assetto Corsa works out to 26 degrees. So I set it to that - it was nearly half what I was previously running - and did some laps on Nurburgring GP. In Turn 1 and Turn 8 (the two right hand hairpins) the FOV is so restricted that when it comes time to start acclerating out of the corner I'm literally doing it blind as the corner exit has not appeared on screen.
Is this how it's supposed to be? Not only just it just *feel* wrong, but since I have no exit point to focus on, I'm losing what little consistency I had.
Interestingly, I am finding it *much* easier to catch slides with this FOV, which is something, but I am slower on all circuits in all cars because of the lack of vision I now have. Help?
The corner doesn't move, the car does. You'll get used to it, and if not you can again go ahead and add a few degrees if you need it.
You could also try to mess with seating position to shave a couple inches off your distance. Might add a couple degrees of HFOV to at least see the outer kerb of the corner exit. Alternatively, I know there are some programs out there capable of mapping steering wheel input to the in-game camera's horizontal angle (something similar is a feature by default in PCars 2), though if you drive cars with wildly different steering lock angles, that might get tedious to keep setting up.
Hey that's my iRacing Midwest Club logo! Good to see it still in use in sim and in a great video on YT!
I was using about 45 degrees of vFoV. I tried to calculate it by myself once and calculated 26 degrees of vFoV. I got super surprised but applied it anyway, but then I saw the calculator. It gave me 20 degrees of vFoV. It's mind-blowingly tight, but since then, I'm at my lightning speed. I have literally no problem when I first drive on a track that I have no experience before. Don't worry about having less view. Just try it for about 10 laps. Any difference makes it like starting from zero. I but a book under my monitor 1 week ago and it was totally different. But I got used to it after 2 laps and beat the guy that was faster than me at lap 3.
i use bonnet/hood view, because it looks more realistic than cockpit view, when i drive my real car i dont see 2 steering wheels (the one im holding and another one held bi fake hands) also the monitor is like a front windscreen, you dont see the inside of your car when you look though your front windscreen.
i dont care what view other people use, but it gives me the shits when people demand everyone use cockpit view and even force others in certain online servers with the force cockpit view option, each to there own i say.
Turn the in game steering wheel off. I'm alarmed you "don't see the inside of your car when you look through your front windscreen", as that would mean you are blind.
lol, i dont see the inside of my car when looking though my front windscreen meaning i dont see the inside of my car on the outside, no im not blind, i do see the inside of my car, its in front of the windscreen on the inside of the car, stops me from getting wet when it rains.
No, you do see the inside of the car. Your eyes are simply focusing on something else. Same way a properly setup cockpit view works.
i prefer not to have unnecessary cockpit detail taking up alot of the screen, like i said the before each to their own
I use the bonnet view as well in AC. I found I can judge my car's behavior better if I treat my monitor like it's the windshield and anything between that and my chair is the dashboard. The same way that I found my driving improved quite a lot when I positioned my chair a little further from my wheel with my arms only slightly straight and adjusted the position of my pedals. It's likely a lot of people who use bonnet view physical presence influence their virtual presence.
great video,very in depth and i just realised that i was racing the wrong way,i always use my cockpit view when i use the steeringwheel but my fov is to high,so thank you for the great tips i will try it out soon👍
I feel like this FOV is only useful for triple monitors, it's borderline impossible to use on single as your side view is essentially gone.
"Don't change your FoV once set"
Unfortunately, I'm paying Assetto Corsa on PS4, so I have to reset all the cockpit view settings EVERY SINGLE RACE
...funny thing: I noticed in your diagram that 47° horizontal corresponded to "distance of screen ~= width of screen" and tried moving my phone to the appropriate distance during the clip - and the video pretty much sprang into a very vivid 3D in my brain.
That is a very good sales pitch for configuring your FoV correctly!
That is also an interesting idea to try out in the first place! :D
360p squad, unite.
I'm guessing you watched the video before it finished so the high resolutions weren't available yet.
This has helped me, altough it makes either the "look-ahead" feature or something a bit necessary. as a biker I like to look ahead as far as I can to judge the whole mess, and while your FoV tips do indeed help, it's a shame AC doesn't have the same look-ahead setting as rF2 has. Anyway, good vid.
Use RHM for AC.
This video is essential for every simracer. @Empty Box Many thanks.
And regarding the Sense of speed "lie", i'd like to add, that i think it also has to do with the common TV onboard footage. We are used to these fisheye lense /GoPro-like onboard cameras, which give a very misleading sensation of speed.
I've seen Rallye onboard videos which give the impression the car is racing at warpspeed. Not a surprise that many people think a racecar in a Sim should feel similar.
I'm driving with mathematically correct FOV (which is 28 vFOV with my singlescreen setup) since over 2 years, and it's definitively a game changer. I think, i became more consistant on track with realistic FOV.
Also most people naturally sit centered to their monitor but a large number of people don't even think about centering their monitor vertically. It's just as weird sitting too high or low as it is sitting to the right or left of center, and distorts the perspective and sense of space.
If you just have to have the monitor higher or lower than your eye level, at least in iRacing there is a setting that lets you offset the image vertically so that your eye level is centered with the view, if not the monitor itself. Not sure about other sims.
This is a fantastic explanation. You made a great point about how the left of the screen is mostly a-pillar. My setup gives 40hfov and in most cars that's about where the a-pillar starts (with default seat position), so it's perfect. Took a few hours to get used to but now driving much better than before!
yup, most differences between 50 and 75 hFoV are useless on your left side. However, I use a little bit more than that (on a single screen) so I can get important cues from beoynd that a-pillar. This FoV makes cars like the porsche 919 driveable.
@@RDMracer yes I am considering to buy a much bigger TV (55"-65") to allow me to see enough view beyond the A-piller.
@@breezyamar My personal preference would go to increasing it up to 81 degrees already, which is my cross-sim standard. (Use the same FoV everywhere, that's the most important.) This way you can look forward to increasing your steering precision and speed experience with a new monitor, instead of it increasing your view.
Personally, I think using low FoV is very dangerous as it might create tunnel vision, a habit to only stare directly in fron of your car. This is normal for beginners, but drivers are supposed to start looking further ahead once they are comfortable with the car to increase track awareness and with that their performance.
@@RDMracer very interesting point!
I'm bored at work, so I counted. "field of view" was said 51 times. But in all seriousness, this is such a great video and explanation of things. I probably watch this video at least once a month. Fantastic job!!
The video is wrong. Here you will see how to get the fov right in 45 secs: ruclips.net/video/CljcI7SylPM/видео.html
ive been a sub and a fan for many years, but these videos lately have been fantastic and super helpful. I was guilty of this and didn't even know it! Gonna try a better FOV later.
The video is wrong. Here you will see how to get the fov right in 45 secs: ruclips.net/video/CljcI7SylPM/видео.html
On the sense of speed topic. you can tell a huge difference between street driving and driving on a race track. race track feels alot slower for the same reasons
Four years later and I'm just learning about this 🤣
Really well put mate, I can't believe people wouldn't want it as close real as possible 👏👏👏
Here you will see how to get the fov right in 45 secs: ruclips.net/video/CljcI7SylPM/видео.html
the thing no one takes into account, is there are many people like me, who suffer from motion sickness. mathematically my fov should be at 28 degrees, but if i drive like that for only 10 minutes i start to feel sick. it's just not possible for many people do drive optimally in sims. VR makes it WAY worse btw, so that isnt an option either.
Jesus Christ, I changed my FOV for F1 2018 and instantly, no lie first lap out of the chute was .225 quicker than my fastest time trial lap to date, which was already in the top 750 and yet it felt as slow as I've ever driven, almost like waiting on the car to hit its mark, that's how ahead I was in my thinking because the FOV changed my perception and made me so much more accurate hitting my marks, versus the rushed guessing-type feeling I was experiencing with a wide FOV. Wow!
Such a low FoV means you can't look where you're supposed to be looking which is usually the exit for the next turn (with its apex being in your peripheral vision), or even the apex for the second next turn.
With these low FoV settings these points aren't even on the screen meaning all you can see is usually the apex for your next turn, and not the exit line or turn thereafter.
As opposed to a high FOV where everything on the road looks tiny? Just learn the track. No way around it.
@@SonicBoone56, if you need to sit closer to the screen to get a wider FoV it's probably worth it.
Learning the track obviously helps compensate for not being able to view the exit or next apex yet, but this still train a bad habit of only looking at the apex for the corner you're currently going for.
F1 driver obviously all know the tracks they race on off by heart but they still focus on the exit or apex for the turn thereafter, with the nearest apex being in their peripheral vision as this helps them perfect their racing line and exit.
I have tried all sorts of FOVs (extremely low to extremely high) and got fully comparable lap times after adapting. The sense of speed thing people complain about with a low FOV is all caused by the fact that the closer to the centre of your view, the lower the angular speed of the passing scenery. Things move the fastest (angularly) when they are precisely 90° from the "bearing" direction of the car. The higher the FOV you use, the faster the objects near the edges of your screen, regardless to the distance of your eyes from the screen. The best solution overall, obviously, is to put your screen as close as practicable and set the FOV to the mathematically correct value.
I was quite shocked by the fact that Assetto Corsa uses vertical FOV but does not say that CRUCIAL information in the menu!!! That is just beyond ridiculous... Before I found out, I felt like: "This doesn't look realistic but the FOV (horizontal instead of vertical) is correct, WTF did I do wrong?". The horizontal FOV is THE standard in MANY applications. So, to just show "Field of View" in the menu is incredibly reckless. Designers of any kind should understand that it is the USER they need to focus on THE MOST. Everything should be as clear as possible, no puzzles to waste time with! Especially today - the screens are so huge (in terms of pixel count) that you can put TONS of text on the screen at the same time, no need to save screen space by omitting IMPORTANT information.
All game menus should look like this:
Item name - Value - Detailed description
Item name - Value - Detailed description
Item name - Value - Detailed description
.
.
.
Unlike in the era of 640x480, you can usually say everything needed even if you use just one line per item on today's 1920x1080 or more...
GT Sport fix
- settings > additional settings > adjust cockpit view
This tip changed the game for me. Thank you.
174 guys did not understand a single word.
This is way over my head. I'm playing on a 100" projector in 16:9. I need a general idea of how far away my head should be from the screen. Any thoughts or suggestions?
Thank you so much for this video, I had no idea I was doing FOV ass backwards this entire time. GT probably got me complacent, been playing that since the 90’s.
Really great video my friend. Thanks for taking the time and contribution to the sim community.
The FoV calculator at project immersion uses Flash. This is now considered a dead technology. Adobe are not updating it, nor are they producing security patches.
Are there any other recommendations?
Great video but the sense of speed loss is not a lie - it is genuine. We don't view the world through a 45deg FOV so when we game with that view it does make things look a lot slower. This is why I bought a GoPro for my recording my sports - a standard camera portrayed nothing of the sense of speed I felt when riding my MTB, snowboarding or surfing etc. The a wide FOV helps to portray a real sense of speed. However speed is not everything for sim racing and so like you I do place a priority on getting accuracy in other areas like scale/distance etc and run a FOV which is close to "correct" but not quite all the way there as I simply prefer it slightly wider.
You aren't disagreeing at all with what I said. There is a reason the word lie is in quotation marks, because while it's true, it's often talked about incorrectly., All too often we see people say "this game has a better sense of speed" when the vast majority of that is down solely to camera settings and movement options. It's the basic output without understanding the "why" bit that is crucial that is the problem that misleads some.
As you know, the GoPro for example isn't some magical camera that records "with extra speed!!!11!1!", but with a wider FoV that can give it's recordings that feeling. But I know you get this from your comment. :)
Empty Box spot on!
I normally never disagree with you, but I do have to on something here - on whether correct FoV makes you quicker, no matter what. I have a very low FoV at the moment, even allowing for the +10° rule of thumb you mentioned in the previous version of this video and while it does help with distance recognition, etc. I do seem to struggle a lot without peripheral vision in very low-speed corners and hairpins. (E.g. T5 and last corner on the Ricard.) I think that's because I would naturally look at the apex and generally rely a lot on eye-hand coordination at my current skill level (which is very low) and much less on muscle memory (because I have not driven enough yet). Blind corners I'm also struggling with more than usual. (I dread Paddock Hill Bend lol. :)) I guess this should improve as I get more experience as you have, but for beginners, I think it does count just how large your FoV actually is.
Honestly feel like I needed to strike a happy medium using a 24in single monitor set up. I used a Mazda MX5 on Nordschleife for experimenting as have one parked on the drive and could use for comparison, and it honestly felt in game like I had a piece of cardboard attached to each side of the head blocking peripheral vision.
I completely understand the logic behind the math and reasoning, but unless you use VR or triple Monitor set up, I have come to realise you will never truly get the full simulation immersion anyway, so didn't see any harm striking the happy medium at least until a triple monitor set up is realistic for me.
Field of view affecting sense of speed is not a lie, it's geometry. At the left/right angular limits (edges of screen), points move more quickly toward the edge of the screen with a high FOV. I'd think this would be immediately obvious to anyone playing with FOV settings.
On a single screen I can't stand a narrow FOV, but to each his own. Just set it to whatever you like and call it a day. For the last few years I've only run VR so this isn't an issue anymore.
The lie is "this game has no sense of speed" comments - when its purely camera settings and motion blur, nothing more.
Yes! more tutorial videos!, i loved the old series, would love to see more!
I always look at it like this:
Large FOV = great sense of forward speed
Small FOV = great sense of car rotation
Driving at the limit means you have to react to where the nose of the car is pointing to. A bit of oversteer will turn the car a bit more, which is super obvious with a smaller FOV. This gives you far more visual info to make you decide to correct the oversteer.
I find it much easier to get used to the limited sense of forward speed, and much harder to get used to a lack of sense of car rotation.
Going smaller than 'realistic' would be silly, but the problem is 99% of the time having a too large FOV, which simply makes it harder to spot small bits of car rotation! :-)
Large FOV = -great- *exaggerated* sense of forward speed
Unless the large FOV happens to be the correct one of course, which for single monitor use it often isn't.. ;-)
I only really play the SimBin games, and i never change FOV no matter screensize or anything, all i change is the seat position in case you sit too far or close to the wheel, or too low from the road. I like driving seeing the cockpit as a whole, not just the windshield with the dash. I wanna see the wheel moving, the entire dash, and stuff like that.
It might be the Forza player in me, i grew up playing Forza on the 360, but i cannot drive with a low FOV or without seeing the whole cockpit, i feel claustrophic
So basically judging speed and distances in sim racing with the wrong FOV is like trying to judge speed and distance in a curved wing mirror.👍
The video is wrong. Here you will see how to get the fov right in 45 secs: ruclips.net/video/CljcI7SylPM/видео.html
Field of view does affect the sense of speed, though, as it affects the speed at which objects move from the centre of the screen to the periphery. It's a pretty well known trick in other genres to make your character feel faster while sprinting and such
That's exactly the point, "sense of speed" in a gaming sense isn't what people think it is - it's almost solely a function of FoV and camera movement, nothing more.
@@TacticalCardboard Oh, fair play! We're on the same page, then
I see, I guess its like treating the monitor as a window. The windows job is to be neutral, not telescopic making things bigger, or an inverted telescope making things smaller. The distance we sit from the window, and the size of the window will give us different fields of view accordingly. So, I think just try to find the view that looks the most natural and less magnified or reduced. I use a ridiculously large 'screen', I use a projector that gives me about 113 inches and I sit about 2.5 meters away from the screen lol - a challenge in itself. I didn't realise FOV had so much effect. Low field of view is headache inducing on such a big screen as there is too much movement. Giving myself a much wider FOV, and then compensating by moving the seat camera forward, as this does not affect the FOV (I guess we can think of the dashboard ect. as 'plant pots' on the window ledge - move em where you want, the view out the window will be the same). I have a much nicer drive, plus the perspective does seem more 'real' also, and judging corners and distances seems more intuitive. The only small issue is, a wide field of view can slightly stretch the images, making the cars seem a bit longer etc., but it makes for a better race regardless I think.
After the debacle and fuss about Project Cars 2, Empty Bachuss redeemed himself with this video. Speaking of PC2, my game improved nicely after sorting out the FOV, it doesn't have any FOV numbers, but now I have a better idea what I'm looking for, I change it by eye only
Correct. If you feel there is too much movement, just change the camera to have less movement.
this vid is great!..the info is perfect!..so many simracers get this wrong and wonder why they struggle...i spent too many hours trying to explain this to lamers on the iracing forums even tho there was a calculator built into the game, hardly anyone bothered to use it, or they would lower the FOV that it calculated coz they didnt like it...i calculated my triple screen setup to 135deg and still have people telling me its wrong when i post camera footage of my screens...
Love the way you speak about cockpit view! Can't believe there is even an option to change the view.
Best field of view video explanation there is.
The first Test Drive Unlimited had a field of view option. Very good sense of speed and perception.
Just started sim racing in iRacing. I thought having fov between 70-90 would be better. But it was hard to judge corners from difference tracks. Gonna give this a try (45hfov). Perhaps this will help me to hit the apex better.