Interesting review. I've had the same car, same year from new and complained to the dealer about the engine/gearbox with criticism similar to yours shortly after buying it. They drove it and said it was normal! However it has just been in for a service so I mentioned it again. This time they updated the engine and gearbox software and it's like a different car. It's now the car it should have been 12 months ago.
JayEmm you should pin this - totally changes the review IMO. The SDV6 is a brilliant engine, and the gearbox is a brilliant box - just needed a software update and now it seems it's got one.
Is the gearbox/engine issue exclusive to the estate.? Just bought a 2018 XFS diesel myself and am taking it in for a inspection/service next week so any information on this would be greatly appreciated.
My 2.0 litre turbo 250PS XF Sportbrake is a hoot to drive. Faster & with more acceleration than I ever really need. And with all the luggage carrying practicality is truly is ‘an almost perfect car’. Love the fact that you rarely see another on the road unlike the German or Swedish equivalents. One of JLR’s best kept secrets.
I'm looking at a new XF SB for this reason. Just, I have never even SEEN one in the flesh! I live in the densely populated part of The Netherlands and all the used ones are outside this area. New ones, the dealer won't say the lead time. What frustrates me is the cost of the option. You want it all optioned out to make it "modern" but then the price just doubles. And it becomes more costly than BMW, Mercedes, Audi, Volvo, etc.
Now driven 50k miles in my Sportbrake V6 Portfolio S. Never had axle tramp, and rarely spun the rear wheels. I drive mostly in winter mode which calms the gearbox down a bit and makes better use of the torque, performance is more than adequate in this mode. Switch to sport mode or manual if required for a quick get away or overtaking. It is both beautiful and awesome. The only thing missing is AWD.
They are some of the best looking cars on the market. However, there is nothing Jaguar about them. To the fans and long time drivers of the brand, and that includes me, they are quite simply not what made us turn to the brand.
After watching every review of this jaguar yours is by far the most informative and fact driven review out there, seems most car journalists and U tube pod casts are scared to tell is there true thoughts and tip toe around as if there working for the car companies there reviewing, thank you for your great reviews especially those one as I'm on the look out for an estate and was considering this jaguar, not new but second hand, you've just saved me a night mare.
All reviews are just personal opinions. For a better idea read the owners forums rather than YT videos and get a collective view rather than that of just one person. You'll find that most people who bought this car are extremely happy with it and many wouldn't buy anything else.
Ian Howard been there and done it with fast German saloons. Very capable, but very boring. Have tracked a C63 (previous shape) extensively and it’s a great machine, but I’d never want to own one. I test drove the current shape when car shopping, found it a bit sterile.
Damn right!!! I had two XFS 3.0D. X250 and X260 - and they were great. The X260 XFS 3.0 S/C petrol though, is a different animal altogether. 80Hp up on the 3.0D, the acceleration is visceral above 50 compared to the 3.0D. Heaven knows what the old gen XFR 5.0 S/C is like - but I think I've got the best mix of power and tech (HUD, Configurable Digital Dash etc). German cars seem to have this myth of reliability - maybe in the old days - but not any more. JAguar are actually quite good these days and very much rivals to german engineering. Give me a Jag any day - best mix of the german marques - and you're not another sheep in the crowd. People actually let you out of side roads too. Whats not to like?
My 6 year old petrol V6 is so beautiful to drive I bought it back from the Middle East when I got back home to the UK. It's left hand drive, rear wheel driven, handles beautifully and smooth as silk. It also looks better with a full bonnet than the new ones with that horrid bumper line!
I bought an ex-Demo XF R-Sport and so far no real issues and it performs extremely well without too much of a petrol bill so apart from keeping some fellow British workers in a job I am happy with experience so far. There appears to be a fashion to knock Jaguar all the time, but I know the German experience hasn't panned out well for some people. I know someone who total engine failure on his Audi A5 after less 9000 miles on the clock. Tata have in my opinion have done very well with the brand even after Ford did their best to destroy it. Tata are also assembling the XF in India for the Asian market so I don't think its a brand that will disappear soon as they have poured quite a bit of money into it.
jags and land rovers are just as reliable as the other european cars. the people complaining about reliability are people talking about the bmw and ford days of the past.
I've seen a few of your Jaguar reviews and to be honest, I don't think a Jaguar is the car for you. You seem to be constantly complaining about perceived issues that few owners have ever even mentioned. I think you're looking for perfection and you'll never find it. Each to their own but having driven everything else in it's class and owned a few, there's nothing that comes close to the XF. That's why I bought one, and I'm absolutely besotted with it - something I've never said about any other car I've owned in 45 years. My only regret is that I didn't buy one 10 years ago. I know not everyone will agree but I've noticed that one of the things about YT is that people seem to find it easier to go along with whatever a review says about a product. I'm not deliberately playing Devil's Advocate here and as I said, each to their own but I find that the constant criticism of what to me and many others is a fantastic car eventually becomes quite irritating. Nothing personal, just my opinion, but why bother?
JM - Sounds like you didn't have the traction control in winter mode - really needed for damp roads - 700Nm will spin up the wheels really easily. This is recommended in the driver's manual. Fantastic on a dry road - not on wet. You're driving the Sport option - when you hit the throttle - you want the gearbox to kickdown and get the revs and torque going. Otherwise - do as you said - give it a bit of throttle - and it will waft away, but it won't be fast. The gearbox does seem sluggish at first - especially if driven by Miss Daisy previously. Once the gearbox 'learns' your driving style - it is much much better. Take it out and thrash it for a few days. Trust me - then the engine and gearbox talk to each other. And yes - thats in eco mode too. Once that's done - the car is fine. HUD a bit blurred - heard of it - but mine is crystal clear to be honest. I like the digital dash - works for me. There are probably better out there - but I'm not driving a german cloned sheep - so no thanks. As much as I liked the 3.0D and the instantaneous torque - there was a bit of pedal lag. I've now managed to get myself a now discontinued (such a shame)3.0S/C XFS - and there is no lag whatsoever - it is also far more potent (and thisty, but I didn't buy it for its fuel economy). Will be looking forward to the upcoming XF SVR powered by a BMW Unit (again - shame it couldn't be a Jag 5.0 SC unit). Bean counters - who needs em, eh? lol.
Top driving gloves! Great review, even at the age of 31, I really like Jag estates. On a seperate note, your comment about the gearbox, dropping down for higher rpms - my Audi A4 TDI does EXACTLY the same thing - drives me mental. Revs like it's a petrol, forgets about any torque. Great.
Ironically, I have just taken delivery of a 5.0L XK. I mulled over an EV but as this is the last time I am likely to have a choice in the matter, I picked the type of car that (in my opinion) most people would prefer.....
I was tempted by one of these a few months ago. The JLR dealer were very keen to get us in one offering all sorts of incentives. The car just felt old, like a run out model waiting for replacement. As you suggest, on paper it should be brilliant.
Surely if you put your foot to the floor then dropping a gear is the right thing to do? If you want a graceful acceleration then progressively use the pedal but just don't floor it.
Theoretically yes, but only in a petrol car where the max power is at the top end of the rev range. In a diesel it doesnt make sense to drop a gear and rev over 3k rpm. This particular gearbox in my view was engineered for the 3.0l S/C petrol engine and then just dumped into the 3.0d without any significant tuning
I have a Portfolio Sportbrake with the 250bhp petrol which is a really decent unit for a 4-pot. It works pretty well with the ZF, which is low geared enough in the first 4 gears to hide some of the turbo lag. It loves being revved out and even sounds quite good when doing so. I find the chassis and steering odd though on the 18” wheels. The front is responsive and hooks up really well, but the rear just doesn’t seem quite connected and seems to take longer to settle. Weird. I was expecting better. The build quality is oddly poor in places as per the video’s comments. I love the looks, it drives pretty well and the build quality is quirky. Overall just a bit strange, but there is something alluring about it. Still, at £330 p/m on a 2 year lease I don’t really care!
@@CarsofGlasgow yes it really was a great deal at the time. Less good was the average of 29mpg I got. I replaced it 14 months ago with a 2014 330d touring. A better engine in every way, although right now the diesel prices are making me cry despite averaging 40mpg.
I had one of these and it was excellent but the whole time I had it I really wanted an XFR so I only kept it a couple years before trading it in for the shouty, fast model.
Good review. You are mostly right, in particular about the transmission behavior. I have this car and i always found it odd that it dropped into a gear that would put the revs into a range where there is limited power. I want the shove of where its at, not where its been. Therefore needs to be driven with the paddles for optimum shove (providing you know where it is) Rwd is better dynamically than awd. I had to have mines in to fix numerous rattles, quite painful but we got there in the end. Good car, we really like ours. Not built to the same standard as a german but is Absolutely more exclusive than any of the competition.
The late great John Bolster weekly road tester and technical editor of AUTOSPORT for many decades always chose something extraordinary for the Christmas edition a dustcart a road roller bulldozer tarmac laying machine double decker bus - you get the idea - and he applied all the same test criteria as normal.
Great review as always! You should trail linking two of your other similar car reviews at the end of videos to encourage new viewers to watch your other rest reviews. Merry Christmas and I look forwards to another year of your content
Thanks for the videos this year James! Have really enjoyed seeing your channel excel this year. Have a good Christmas and look forward to seeing more in the new year!
Alternative idea for practical fast 4wd 6 cylinder diesel... 435d Gran Coupe! (or a 335d estate of course). Mine is still available for you to try btw :)
@@paulanderson79 It sounds dreadful and smells even worse. And some people simply don't enjoy that diesel low-rev high torque characteristic. Oh, it's also notably more cancerous.
@@AoyagiAichou That's a very broad sweeping statement and one with which I obviously cannot entirely agree. You simply can't assert that all petrol cars are better than all diesel cars.
@@paulanderson79 No of course I'm not saying that. But I will say that in *almost all cases* an *equivalent* petrol engine is a better choice than diesel for anything but heavy work and raw fuel consumption numbers. Oh, and it's usually easier to drive with manual gearbox. Yes, sound is subjective and yes, some people don't mind the stench, but I'd say that doesn't change that.
@@AoyagiAichou euro 6 diesel models don't exhibit that exhaust stench in my experience. I actually like the midrange shove from a modern high performance diesel car. But I do agree that manual models are more work to drive than similarly powered petrol models from the same range.
I've got one and haven't noticed hardly any of these so called issues. Went from a BMW to the Jag and it's better in 99% of ways. The only thing I can say which I've also noticed, is it does drop down a gear when you put your foot down, but it still goes like a rocket. The gearbox does learn your driving style and can be reset. Or you can drive it hard for a few days, and it will learn your new driving style and adapt accordingly.
This is possibly best video you have done. As car review its brilliant. Awesome camera work, awesome editing and you answer ALL the questions that need answers. Nice!
Thanks for the honest Review. Was very interested in this Car for the great exterior and interior Looks. Just testdrove a XE Diesel and experienced the gearbox problems with the 4 cylibder reving up and starving, hoped the XF 6 cylinder engine solved that but seems like the gearbox needs to be at least reconfigured if not replaced. Such a shame :( anyhow enjoyed watching, Merry Christmas to you!
Great video James on what is a great car from JLR, the V6 Diesel (originating from Ford PAG days) is smooth and rightly shines in Range Rovers, where the torque characteristics and the 4x4 drive works perfectly
I test drove this car, and experienced the same problem with the gearbox setup. Trying to nip onto a busy roundabout, nothing, nothing, and then wham - the car is almost over the roundabout and I'm frantically hitting the brakes. Also, driving along a fast A Road, and any prod of the throttle results in a kickdown and needlessly high revs. Various people have posted that either (a) the gearbox will adapt to your driving style or (b) you can ask a Jaguar garage to update or reset the software, but this is the main aspect I need some confidence with before potentially acquiring what is otherwise a fairly compelling car.
I've got the saloon X260 XFS 3.0 S/C petrol and I don't recognise any of the negative issues you hightlight so I agree that you are correct that it needs a bigger petrol unit. BTW I don't get the speed bump booming thing. Has the test car got some suspension issue?
Another excellent piece . I currently have a similar but older version of this car. Mine has the six speed ZF box..Same issue!! The engine and gearbox have just been bolted to each other without any consideration to if they compliment each other
This is the sort of review I like, information which you want to hear and lots of detail. . Although, I think I disagree a little with the whole torque argument because your revs, being a factor of work done, surely has a large influence on your power - especially as they are all related? power = torque x rpm / 5252 ? . Even with diesels, peak power is always higher up in the rev range and whilst torque is great for shove/pull, you still need the power. I'm not an expert in all this but I have the XF 3.0d diesel and you can easily test it in the real world as you can with any car. Pop it in manual and get the revs to about 2000rpm and accelerate. Compare it to accelerating from the same speed with the revs at around 4000rpm and you'll see that this has much better acceleration.
I am pleased to see someone building an estate car rather than another boring SUV!!... but some of the detailed points you called out are probably just a reflection of the troubled times Tata find themselves in and the smaller 4 pot engines are a clear indication that all these variant models will soon be available as hybrids. I don't expect to see anymore EV's in the Jaguar range other than the I-Pace for a while yet.... i.e. 5 years. Merry Christmas to you James and a prosperous 2020 to come... :-)
I have one of these, and cannot agree with you more - the drivetrain setup completely ruins it. If it’s even a tiny bit wet, I just cannot get away from the lights without spinning up the rear wheels. And the gearbox is hopeless. I’ve been back to the dealer and asked if there is a software update for the gearbox. They looked at me like I was from Mars. The only way I can get it to behave is to use the snow / winter mode. The only problem with that, is that it then starts in 2nd gear every time. It feels as though Jag just doesn’t quite have the money to do all the development and testing that is needed to put it all together. Which is a shame really, since the rest of the car is great.
ottermanuk Lol. Re-Reading it I understand that now. Was just confused because my BMW has a Zf 8 speed and it’s the best transmission I’ve ever used. It’s amazing.
Cody Machado Yeah, I think it’s a software issue. I’ve had that gearbox in other cars, and it’s fine. And I don’t think 300 horsepower really justifies 4 wheel drive - there’s plenty of rwd cars with more than that.
Great review, I agree about the dials, but a bit harsh on the heads up (not for me but I can see appeal ) was assuming the V6 S would be Supercharged petrol 😐
I have the previous model, albeit the saloon. with the same egine - but 272bhp rather than 300 - and I had the same wheel-spinning issue from the start. It had the original-fit Dunlop SP Sport Maxx tyres, and at the first change I put on Michellin Pilot Sport 4S. Transformed the grip. No better in any other way that I can discern, but they really stick the car to the road - wet or dry.
Liked the review nevertheless I have owned and driven my 2014 Sportbrake 3-0S for some 8 years and never experience rear wheel spin but again I don’t leave the lights etc like a bat out of hell I have had to floor it a couple of times but still without the wheel spin not really noticed the gear change issues but as said I am a more conservative driver just enjoying the power ,versatility and practicality of the car .
Why does everyone hate SUVs? I have had fast sedans (540i 6 Speed), Chevy Tahoe, Opel Astra Wagon and now a Sportage. I love the high riding position of an SUV. I don't miss anything, except a V8.
The Jaguars off later has really impressed me styling wise. Literally everything after those gasthly uggly s and x types. If there only would be any manuals for sale it would be perfect. Supercharged engines that actually sound decent and rwd. Perfect for one looking on the used matket If only there wouldn't fucking be for those autocraps 😠 guess I'm stuck with the 90s and early 2000s cars,
Good review and like the way the bloke doesn't give a score but just gives his thoughts. I have one of these cars in Oz and for me the engine gearbox combo is the reason I bought the car, I was after a strong towing wagon. I didn't want to buy a typical bogan dual cab 4WD that most people buy here in Oz, most are gutless and average to drive on road compared to the Jag V6 diesel. I'm surprised by his view on the how it drives but I think he is use to driving petrol cars and the way they respond. I'm use to the way the diesel turbo likes to be used, ie 1/4 to 1/3 rd pedal is all you need. I also like the fuel economy of the diesel compared to petrol. If I had the choice again, I would buy this car again no problem and this fact also made me laugh, its quite a bit cheaper to service each year than my wife's Subaru outback.
cool, I just bought one with 177 K KLms so looking fwd to it. Is it worth getting the motor chipped remapped and is the 202 kws 600 nms torque sufficient?
@@tonybooth4 Can't say for sure with your spec motor as my wagon has the 221Kw and 700Nm engine. It's a beast at towing my race bike trailer. Long story shortish, I have no thoughts about getting my engine mapped as its not lacking in any way for me.
Out of all the reviews I've watched about estates, this is the only one that mentions lack of grip at the back, I took it for granted the 3.0 would be 4 wheel drive (I live up a mile long rough track and am into camping and fishing) Oh well, Audi A6 allroad it is then.
Hopefully by the time I can afford a Jag XF they will bring out or work out what it deserves. Though I do question why Jaguar have acquired Bowler with a tight budget. However I'd hope that jaguar doesn't fall into bankruptcy at any point. Either way that was a great review, truley enjoyed watching it. Good job
I had the Saloon 3.0d V6 S cant agree more. From the lights in the wet very hard not to spin the wheel, plus the double whump from the rear suspension over bigger bumps. Set of rears lasted only 15K miles. Lovely to drive at pace and on the twistys but hard to live with in town. In addition visibility very poor, front A pillars are an accident waiting to happen.
I've never had that problem and mine is a 3.0d. Seems to me that you're either trying to floor it, or you're using crap tyres. In which case you'll get the same response from virtually any powerful car in the wet. Few, if any, big cars are ideal in town driving.
I still fail to understand why people choose to drive SUVs that not only look like blobby vans with windows, but handle like them too: a car is superior in almost every way. You might get slightly more carrying capacity, but the reasons most people give - seeing over hedgerows, easier to get in and out of - don't really wash (are that many people affected by those two things to an extent that they are the biggest issues in choosing a car?). I think it mostly comes down to 'big is better' and 'I like being high up'. I've no doubt that some people actually have some need for an SUV, but not the vast majority - it's just a fashion thing.
I agree. All the strange terms such as cross-over cars puzzle me. I mean, why compromise in that way? A decent sized estate (Sport tourer whatever the badge says) generally carries more stuff than an SUV of similar exterior dimensions. And as you say, you get car handling, not van with windows handling.
Don't forget "It makes me feel safer in an event of a crash" as they plow through somebody in an MX-5, killing them on the spot while they were driving with their knees with a phone in one hand, coffee in another and three kids in the back. "And I oop-"
I'm thinking about one of these to replace my current Stage 2 tuned 981 Cayman S (come have a go of it, its insane). I reckon 3.0 V6 Diesel, Stage 2 tune with straight pipe will make it fun.
You keep on making comments regarding the XE in the video. Is that the old XE or the new 2020 one? Having sat in both the new XEs interior and infotainment is considerably better than the XF. XF seems the most neglected car in the line up to me. The outgoing XJ still had the best quality interior in my opinion. Great vid none the less!
Hi Jay, interested to hear your comments on this car as I have a 2008 XJ diesel with basically the same engine. My car has the previous 6 speed ZF and it works pretty-much perfectly with the low down torque of the diesel. However, when the XF came out with the 8 speeder and diesel motor I test drove one and found it to be a complete mismatch. All the time it was changing gear or multiple gears, so it never felt settled. So my vote for a better XF would be a reprogramming of the auto-box software.
The ZF gearbox can be reset to learn your driving style, which will then hold the gear instead of dropping a gear. Or just drive it hard for a few days and it learns your driving style.
I love my 4WD. I actually need it 3-4 months a year. I am not a fan of cars that try to be everything. They always come up short on every aspect they aim to deliver. This Sportbrake S starts at $72,000, and with a couple of options you're over 80K....for a wagon. No thanks. It looks okay, but split that 80K up and you can easily have two vehicles that better deliver the aspects you want without sacrificing for the sake of "everything".
@@lightningthunder5928 Jeep Cherokee. I've had Jeeps for 30 years. This last one I bought in 17. Long story short - I was going to buy a Jaguar F Type. Wonderful car, but it wasn't the right fit for me. So I bought an Alfa Romeo Giulia Ti Sport and the Jeep for less that I had budgeted for the Jag. Each vehicle does it thing very well and I couldn't be happier. I have an old 04 Silverado work truck, so the only thing I'm lacking is a two seater convertible for summer days...maybe a Miata, an old Z3 or used F Type next spring. Peace!
can you do more cam views of the cabin ..cam stuck inside the car windows and pov view instead of the cam stuck outside the car..you see more of the surroundings with cam outside than you do of the car
is the gear selecting part of the process for getting better economy/co2 emissions, i.e it keeps trying to be as quickly into the most efficient gear rather than the best driving gear...presume it also starts in 2nd gear
Driving a 5 year old XF Saloon with the 3.0 petrol. I love driving that car... but that has to do with the drivetrain. Baring that, it isn’t a luxury car at all. Nice car, I like the simple interior, quality is ok... but only the experience of driving it makes it stand out from dozens of competitors.
I really want to like this car so much - alas...There's very little available for people who need 4 doors and some measure of practicality like you say. The X5M etc. leave me cold personally. anyway, GREAT outro.
It saddens me greatly that crossovers and SUVs are killing the fast estate
I agree. I just dont understand why people buy them.
Love the shape of this Estate XF
Interesting review. I've had the same car, same year from new and complained to the dealer about the engine/gearbox with criticism similar to yours shortly after buying it. They drove it and said it was normal! However it has just been in for a service so I mentioned it again. This time they updated the engine and gearbox software and it's like a different car. It's now the car it should have been 12 months ago.
JayEmm you should pin this - totally changes the review IMO. The SDV6 is a brilliant engine, and the gearbox is a brilliant box - just needed a software update and now it seems it's got one.
I wonder from what age vehicles this tweak can be made. Does anyone know?
Is the gearbox/engine issue exclusive to the estate.? Just bought a 2018 XFS diesel myself and am taking it in for a inspection/service next week so any information on this would be greatly appreciated.
how is it now ?
I knew this was going to be a serious review once those driving gloves were present.
My 2.0 litre turbo 250PS XF Sportbrake is a hoot to drive. Faster & with more acceleration than I ever really need. And with all the luggage carrying practicality is truly is ‘an almost perfect car’. Love the fact that you rarely see another on the road unlike the German or Swedish equivalents. One of JLR’s best kept secrets.
I'm looking at a new XF SB for this reason. Just, I have never even SEEN one in the flesh!
I live in the densely populated part of The Netherlands and all the used ones are outside this area. New ones, the dealer won't say the lead time.
What frustrates me is the cost of the option. You want it all optioned out to make it "modern" but then the price just doubles. And it becomes more costly than BMW, Mercedes, Audi, Volvo, etc.
Had 5 Supercharged XF 3.0's, superb, never any issues or missed a beat ever
Now driven 50k miles in my Sportbrake V6 Portfolio S. Never had axle tramp, and rarely spun the rear wheels. I drive mostly in winter mode which calms the gearbox down a bit and makes better use of the torque, performance is more than adequate in this mode. Switch to sport mode or manual if required for a quick get away or overtaking. It is both beautiful and awesome. The only thing missing is AWD.
Probably has traction control turned off
Hear a lot of people complain at the looks of modern jags but to me Ian callums designs are some of the best looking cars in modern history
They are some of the best looking cars on the market. However, there is nothing Jaguar about them. To the fans and long time drivers of the brand, and that includes me, they are quite simply not what made us turn to the brand.
After watching every review of this jaguar yours is by far the most informative and fact driven review out there, seems most car journalists and U tube pod casts are scared to tell is there true thoughts and tip toe around as if there working for the car companies there reviewing, thank you for your great reviews especially those one as I'm on the look out for an estate and was considering this jaguar, not new but second hand, you've just saved me a night mare.
All reviews are just personal opinions. For a better idea read the owners forums rather than YT videos and get a collective view rather than that of just one person. You'll find that most people who bought this car are extremely happy with it and many wouldn't buy anything else.
You drove the wrong one. Come for a ride in my supercharged S saloon - completely different animal.
oh is it
You bought the wrong brand. Come for a ride in my c63...
Ian Howard been there and done it with fast German saloons. Very capable, but very boring. Have tracked a C63 (previous shape) extensively and it’s a great machine, but I’d never want to own one. I test drove the current shape when car shopping, found it a bit sterile.
Damn right!!! I had two XFS 3.0D. X250 and X260 - and they were great. The X260 XFS 3.0 S/C petrol though, is a different animal altogether. 80Hp up on the 3.0D, the acceleration is visceral above 50 compared to the 3.0D. Heaven knows what the old gen XFR 5.0 S/C is like - but I think I've got the best mix of power and tech (HUD, Configurable Digital Dash etc). German cars seem to have this myth of reliability - maybe in the old days - but not any more. JAguar are actually quite good these days and very much rivals to german engineering. Give me a Jag any day - best mix of the german marques - and you're not another sheep in the crowd. People actually let you out of side roads too. Whats not to like?
@@rigger8722 what mpg do you see with the 3l petrol?
My 6 year old petrol V6 is so beautiful to drive I bought it back from the Middle East when I got back home to the UK. It's left hand drive, rear wheel driven, handles beautifully and smooth as silk. It also looks better with a full bonnet than the new ones with that horrid bumper line!
I bought an ex-Demo XF R-Sport and so far no real issues and it performs extremely well without too much of a petrol bill so apart from keeping some fellow British workers in a job I am happy with experience so far. There appears to be a fashion to knock Jaguar all the time, but I know the German experience hasn't panned out well for some people. I know someone who total engine failure on his Audi A5 after less 9000 miles on the clock. Tata have in my opinion have done very well with the brand even after Ford did their best to destroy it. Tata are also assembling the XF in India for the Asian market so I don't think its a brand that will disappear soon as they have poured quite a bit of money into it.
jags and land rovers are just as reliable as the other european cars.
the people complaining about reliability are people talking about the bmw and ford days of the past.
I've seen a few of your Jaguar reviews and to be honest, I don't think a Jaguar is the car for you. You seem to be constantly complaining about perceived issues that few owners have ever even mentioned. I think you're looking for perfection and you'll never find it. Each to their own but having driven everything else in it's class and owned a few, there's nothing that comes close to the XF. That's why I bought one, and I'm absolutely besotted with it - something I've never said about any other car I've owned in 45 years. My only regret is that I didn't buy one 10 years ago.
I know not everyone will agree but I've noticed that one of the things about YT is that people seem to find it easier to go along with whatever a review says about a product. I'm not deliberately playing Devil's Advocate here and as I said, each to their own but I find that the constant criticism of what to me and many others is a fantastic car eventually becomes quite irritating. Nothing personal, just my opinion, but why bother?
JM - Sounds like you didn't have the traction control in winter mode - really needed for damp roads - 700Nm will spin up the wheels really easily. This is recommended in the driver's manual. Fantastic on a dry road - not on wet. You're driving the Sport option - when you hit the throttle - you want the gearbox to kickdown and get the revs and torque going. Otherwise - do as you said - give it a bit of throttle - and it will waft away, but it won't be fast. The gearbox does seem sluggish at first - especially if driven by Miss Daisy previously. Once the gearbox 'learns' your driving style - it is much much better. Take it out and thrash it for a few days. Trust me - then the engine and gearbox talk to each other. And yes - thats in eco mode too. Once that's done - the car is fine. HUD a bit blurred - heard of it - but mine is crystal clear to be honest. I like the digital dash - works for me. There are probably better out there - but I'm not driving a german cloned sheep - so no thanks.
As much as I liked the 3.0D and the instantaneous torque - there was a bit of pedal lag. I've now managed to get myself a now discontinued (such a shame)3.0S/C XFS - and there is no lag whatsoever - it is also far more potent (and thisty, but I didn't buy it for its fuel economy). Will be looking forward to the upcoming XF SVR powered by a BMW Unit (again - shame it couldn't be a Jag 5.0 SC unit). Bean counters - who needs em, eh? lol.
Jay kind of reminds me of Chucky off Sons Of Anarchy with those gloves on.
This is "Top Gear", when that show was it´s best :-) So cool.
Top driving gloves! Great review, even at the age of 31, I really like Jag estates.
On a seperate note, your comment about the gearbox, dropping down for higher rpms - my Audi A4 TDI does EXACTLY the same thing - drives me mental. Revs like it's a petrol, forgets about any torque. Great.
Also, had no idea 'winter diesel' was a thing. Huh, TIL.
Fatty it’s to do with emissions, peak torque = peak cylinder temps which = peak NOX, so they try and avoid that area of the rpm range.
It seems to be a common trait of that ZF box, everything I've driven with it does the same
Ironically, I have just taken delivery of a 5.0L XK. I mulled over an EV but as this is the last time I am likely to have a choice in the matter, I picked the type of car that (in my opinion) most people would prefer.....
Congrats on the purchase and enjoy!
Now if they produced an AWD petrol hybrid model it would certainly be on my list of possibles.
I was tempted by one of these a few months ago. The JLR dealer were very keen to get us in one offering all sorts of incentives. The car just felt old, like a run out model waiting for replacement. As you suggest, on paper it should be brilliant.
Surely if you put your foot to the floor then dropping a gear is the right thing to do? If you want a graceful acceleration then progressively use the pedal but just don't floor it.
Theoretically yes, but only in a petrol car where the max power is at the top end of the rev range. In a diesel it doesnt make sense to drop a gear and rev over 3k rpm. This particular gearbox in my view was engineered for the 3.0l S/C petrol engine and then just dumped into the 3.0d without any significant tuning
I have an XF S and it was really dangerous in the wet until I replaced the tyres with Michelin PS 4S and it made a huge difference. It’s fine now.
I did wonder about the tyres on the review car. I have the 3 litre XF S Petrol supercharged and it runs brilliantly on Michelin Pilot Sport 4/4s.
Fast estates have always been my love. Why I love volvos. Old e39 estates were sexy, sadly they are in short supply today
You're still with us! I thought the McLaren Illuminati might have got you after the last video I saw. Merry Christmas and Happy New Year!
I have a Portfolio Sportbrake with the 250bhp petrol which is a really decent unit for a 4-pot.
It works pretty well with the ZF, which is low geared enough in the first 4 gears to hide some of the turbo lag. It loves being revved out and even sounds quite good when doing so.
I find the chassis and steering odd though on the 18” wheels. The front is responsive and hooks up really well, but the rear just doesn’t seem quite connected and seems to take longer to settle. Weird. I was expecting better.
The build quality is oddly poor in places as per the video’s comments.
I love the looks, it drives pretty well and the build quality is quirky.
Overall just a bit strange, but there is something alluring about it.
Still, at £330 p/m on a 2 year lease I don’t really care!
thats a great lease deal
@@CarsofGlasgow yes it really was a great deal at the time. Less good was the average of 29mpg I got. I replaced it 14 months ago with a 2014 330d touring. A better engine in every way, although right now the diesel prices are making me cry despite averaging 40mpg.
@@mattholland315 oh tell me about it, I have a 4.3l v8 petrol & a JLR 3.0d and the fuel prices are hurting!!
I had one of these and it was excellent but the whole time I had it I really wanted an XFR so I only kept it a couple years before trading it in for the shouty, fast model.
Take it to Courtenay Sport for a remap and it's a different animal, gearbox map is phenomenal.
got a gearbox remap on mine, made it far better. Still only had the car 6 months, just didn't do what I wanted it to.
Good review. You are mostly right, in particular about the transmission behavior. I have this car and i always found it odd that it dropped into a gear that would put the revs into a range where there is limited power. I want the shove of where its at, not where its been. Therefore needs to be driven with the paddles for optimum shove (providing you know where it is)
Rwd is better dynamically than awd.
I had to have mines in to fix numerous rattles, quite painful but we got there in the end.
Good car, we really like ours. Not built to the same standard as a german but is Absolutely more exclusive than any of the competition.
The ZF gearbox can be reset to learn your driving style, which will then hold the gear instead of dropping a gear.
The late great John Bolster weekly road tester and technical editor of AUTOSPORT for many decades always chose something extraordinary for the Christmas edition a dustcart a road roller bulldozer tarmac laying machine double decker bus - you get the idea - and he applied all the same test criteria as normal.
Great review as always! You should trail linking two of your other similar car reviews at the end of videos to encourage new viewers to watch your other rest reviews. Merry Christmas and I look forwards to another year of your content
Thanks for the videos this year James! Have really enjoyed seeing your channel excel this year. Have a good Christmas and look forward to seeing more in the new year!
Alternative idea for practical fast 4wd 6 cylinder diesel... 435d Gran Coupe! (or a 335d estate of course). Mine is still available for you to try btw :)
wish it was a petrol, wish there was an xe estate, wish there was a giulia estate...
Why would you want a petrol model? Jaguar's V6 diesel is a superb engine.
@@paulanderson79 It sounds dreadful and smells even worse. And some people simply don't enjoy that diesel low-rev high torque characteristic. Oh, it's also notably more cancerous.
@@AoyagiAichou That's a very broad sweeping statement and one with which I obviously cannot entirely agree. You simply can't assert that all petrol cars are better than all diesel cars.
@@paulanderson79 No of course I'm not saying that. But I will say that in *almost all cases* an *equivalent* petrol engine is a better choice than diesel for anything but heavy work and raw fuel consumption numbers. Oh, and it's usually easier to drive with manual gearbox. Yes, sound is subjective and yes, some people don't mind the stench, but I'd say that doesn't change that.
@@AoyagiAichou euro 6 diesel models don't exhibit that exhaust stench in my experience. I actually like the midrange shove from a modern high performance diesel car. But I do agree that manual models are more work to drive than similarly powered petrol models from the same range.
I've got one and haven't noticed hardly any of these so called issues. Went from a BMW to the Jag and it's better in 99% of ways. The only thing I can say which I've also noticed, is it does drop down a gear when you put your foot down, but it still goes like a rocket. The gearbox does learn your driving style and can be reset. Or you can drive it hard for a few days, and it will learn your new driving style and adapt accordingly.
This is possibly best video you have done. As car review its brilliant. Awesome camera work, awesome editing and you answer ALL the questions that need answers. Nice!
Thanks Chris. It's a new format I am trying
@@JayEmmOnCars it works really well. Really enjoyed watching it.
Xf the best ever power confort and very dynamic cars
Thanks for the honest Review. Was very interested in this Car for the great exterior and interior Looks. Just testdrove a XE Diesel and experienced the gearbox problems with the 4 cylibder reving up and starving, hoped the XF 6 cylinder engine solved that but seems like the gearbox needs to be at least reconfigured if not replaced. Such a shame :( anyhow enjoyed watching, Merry Christmas to you!
The ZF gearbox can be reset to learn your driving style, which will then hold the gear instead of dropping a gear.
Love your videos. Just found them . Subbed. I have been an enthusiasts since I was 5. So I love the depth and length of your videos.
Great video James on what is a great car from JLR, the V6 Diesel (originating from Ford PAG days) is smooth and rightly shines in Range Rovers, where the torque characteristics and the 4x4 drive works perfectly
I test drove this car, and experienced the same problem with the gearbox setup. Trying to nip onto a busy roundabout, nothing, nothing, and then wham - the car is almost over the roundabout and I'm frantically hitting the brakes. Also, driving along a fast A Road, and any prod of the throttle results in a kickdown and needlessly high revs. Various people have posted that either (a) the gearbox will adapt to your driving style or (b) you can ask a Jaguar garage to update or reset the software, but this is the main aspect I need some confidence with before potentially acquiring what is otherwise a fairly compelling car.
I've got the saloon X260 XFS 3.0 S/C petrol and I don't recognise any of the negative issues you hightlight so I agree that you are correct that it needs a bigger petrol unit. BTW I don't get the speed bump booming thing. Has the test car got some suspension issue?
Another excellent piece . I currently have a similar but older version of this car. Mine has the six speed ZF box..Same issue!! The engine and gearbox have just been bolted to each other without any consideration to if they compliment each other
The ZF gearbox can be reset to learn your driving style, which will then hold the gear instead of dropping a gear.
Tiff Needell has one of these, and loves it.
This is the sort of review I like, information which you want to hear and lots of detail.
.
Although, I think I disagree a little with the whole torque argument because your revs, being a factor of work done, surely has a large influence on your power - especially as they are all related? power = torque x rpm / 5252 ?
.
Even with diesels, peak power is always higher up in the rev range and whilst torque is great for shove/pull, you still need the power. I'm not an expert in all this but I have the XF 3.0d diesel and you can easily test it in the real world as you can with any car. Pop it in manual and get the revs to about 2000rpm and accelerate. Compare it to accelerating from the same speed with the revs at around 4000rpm and you'll see that this has much better acceleration.
Absolutely spot on. Seems to me many people seem to make the mistake of thinking it will behave the same as a petrol engine.
Like the new review style. Listening to your viewers!
I do my best. It's easier with press cars so viewer reviews will not be in this format
I am pleased to see someone building an estate car rather than another boring SUV!!... but some of the detailed points you called out are probably just a reflection of the troubled times Tata find themselves in and the smaller 4 pot engines are a clear indication that all these variant models will soon be available as hybrids. I don't expect to see anymore EV's in the Jaguar range other than the I-Pace for a while yet.... i.e. 5 years. Merry Christmas to you James and a prosperous 2020 to come... :-)
Amazing. Your review differs dramatically from all the others I have seen.
That activity key is genius.
6:56 I was laughing my head before you said that
I have one of these, and cannot agree with you more - the drivetrain setup completely ruins it. If it’s even a tiny bit wet, I just cannot get away from the lights without spinning up the rear wheels. And the gearbox is hopeless. I’ve been back to the dealer and asked if there is a software update for the gearbox. They looked at me like I was from Mars. The only way I can get it to behave is to use the snow / winter mode. The only problem with that, is that it then starts in 2nd gear every time. It feels as though Jag just doesn’t quite have the money to do all the development and testing that is needed to put it all together. Which is a shame really, since the rest of the car is great.
Jack Routledge so you hate that it’s RWD only
@@NewDesignVinylGraphics Did you even read Jack's comment? The issue is with the gearbox/traction control not that it's RWD
ottermanuk Lol. Re-Reading it I understand that now. Was just confused because my BMW has a Zf 8 speed and it’s the best transmission I’ve ever used. It’s amazing.
Maybe jaguar should program it differently. Funny enough reviews I’ve watched people have said the it is actually programmed better in the Jaguar
Cody Machado Yeah, I think it’s a software issue. I’ve had that gearbox in other cars, and it’s fine. And I don’t think 300 horsepower really justifies 4 wheel drive - there’s plenty of rwd cars with more than that.
Gon big jay Emm, gotta get em all lad
Great review, I agree about the dials, but a bit harsh on the heads up (not for me but I can see appeal ) was assuming the V6 S would be Supercharged petrol 😐
I hope your gloves get better soon James 😃
bryan lol I about spat my tea out 😂
I have the previous model, albeit the saloon. with the same egine - but 272bhp rather than 300 - and I had the same wheel-spinning issue from the start. It had the original-fit Dunlop SP Sport Maxx tyres, and at the first change I put on Michellin Pilot Sport 4S. Transformed the grip. No better in any other way that I can discern, but they really stick the car to the road - wet or dry.
This reminds me of the original Top Gear with that Quentin guy
I have an xf estate and I'm dying to rag it sideways
Wishing you and your family a fantastic Christmas and a prosperous and healthy new year :-))))
Liked the review nevertheless I have owned and driven my 2014 Sportbrake 3-0S for some 8 years and never experience rear wheel spin but again I don’t leave the lights etc like a bat out of hell I have had to floor it a couple of times but still without the wheel spin not really noticed the gear change issues but as said I am a more conservative driver just enjoying the power ,versatility and practicality of the car .
Why does everyone hate SUVs? I have had fast sedans (540i 6 Speed), Chevy Tahoe, Opel Astra Wagon and now a Sportage. I love the high riding position of an SUV. I don't miss anything, except a V8.
The Jaguars off later has really impressed me styling wise.
Literally everything after those gasthly uggly s and x types. If there only would be any manuals for sale it would be perfect. Supercharged engines that actually sound decent and rwd. Perfect for one looking on the used matket If only there wouldn't fucking be for those autocraps 😠 guess I'm stuck with the 90s and early 2000s cars,
New F Type is a disappointment
So what this car needs is that new straight six or the v8 and 4wd. Spectacular colour btw!
Good review and like the way the bloke doesn't give a score but just gives his thoughts. I have one of these cars in Oz and for me the engine gearbox combo is the reason I bought the car, I was after a strong towing wagon. I didn't want to buy a typical bogan dual cab 4WD that most people buy here in Oz, most are gutless and average to drive on road compared to the Jag V6 diesel. I'm surprised by his view on the how it drives but I think he is use to driving petrol cars and the way they respond. I'm use to the way the diesel turbo likes to be used, ie 1/4 to 1/3 rd pedal is all you need. I also like the fuel economy of the diesel compared to petrol. If I had the choice again, I would buy this car again no problem and this fact also made me laugh, its quite a bit cheaper to service each year than my wife's Subaru outback.
cool, I just bought one with 177 K KLms so looking fwd to it. Is it worth getting the motor chipped remapped and is the 202 kws 600 nms torque sufficient?
@@tonybooth4 Can't say for sure with your spec motor as my wagon has the 221Kw and 700Nm engine. It's a beast at towing my race bike trailer. Long story shortish, I have no thoughts about getting my engine mapped as its not lacking in any way for me.
@@RossoOz yes the mapping upgrades it to your spec for the moment though I haven't had a chance to give it a decent run
The lights are the matrix LEDs on that car,
James Cox _ No they are not. I have the same ones and I can say that they aren’t.
I have one in the U.S. Approximately 250 came here. I've never seen another in person.
Out of all the reviews I've watched about estates, this is the only one that mentions lack of grip at the back, I took it for granted the 3.0 would be 4 wheel drive (I live up a mile long rough track and am into camping and fishing)
Oh well, Audi A6 allroad it is then.
Hopefully by the time I can afford a Jag XF they will bring out or work out what it deserves.
Though I do question why Jaguar have acquired Bowler with a tight budget. However I'd hope that jaguar doesn't fall into bankruptcy at any point.
Either way that was a great review, truley enjoyed watching it. Good job
The ZF gearbox can be reset to learn your driving style, which will then hold the gear instead of dropping a gear.
You said that this car has some traction issues but does your has winter tires or 4 seasons, I think it's better in rwd because 4wd is boring
Loved The Review Just Subscribed Thank You.
I had the Saloon 3.0d V6 S cant agree more. From the lights in the wet very hard not to spin the wheel, plus the double whump from the rear suspension over bigger bumps. Set of rears lasted only 15K miles. Lovely to drive at pace and on the twistys but hard to live with in town. In addition visibility very poor, front A pillars are an accident waiting to happen.
I've never had that problem and mine is a 3.0d. Seems to me that you're either trying to floor it, or you're using crap tyres. In which case you'll get the same response from virtually any powerful car in the wet. Few, if any, big cars are ideal in town driving.
I still fail to understand why people choose to drive SUVs that not only look like blobby vans with windows, but handle like them too: a car is superior in almost every way. You might get slightly more carrying capacity, but the reasons most people give - seeing over hedgerows, easier to get in and out of - don't really wash (are that many people affected by those two things to an extent that they are the biggest issues in choosing a car?).
I think it mostly comes down to 'big is better' and 'I like being high up'.
I've no doubt that some people actually have some need for an SUV, but not the vast majority - it's just a fashion thing.
I agree. All the strange terms such as cross-over cars puzzle me. I mean, why compromise in that way? A decent sized estate (Sport tourer whatever the badge says) generally carries more stuff than an SUV of similar exterior dimensions. And as you say, you get car handling, not van with windows handling.
Women (including my wifey) say exactLy that “I like being high up”. So there goes 50% of the market... :(
Americanization of the world mate
Don't forget "It makes me feel safer in an event of a crash" as they plow through somebody in an MX-5, killing them on the spot while they were driving with their knees with a phone in one hand, coffee in another and three kids in the back. "And I oop-"
Because people really want MPVs, but they aren't macho enough.
@JayEmm, do you think the older version (2013) is still worthy of consideration and a good cheaper alternative to the newer one you review here?
Yes. Better than you think. 😉
I'm thinking about one of these to replace my current Stage 2 tuned 981 Cayman S (come have a go of it, its insane). I reckon 3.0 V6 Diesel, Stage 2 tune with straight pipe will make it fun.
If you lose your activity key then what? Isn’t a keypad better like American Fords?
Great video!
I have the same issue with golf dsg diesel. I don't want the revs to shoot up when the torque peeks around 2k
Awesome colour though.... 👏
You keep on making comments regarding the XE in the video. Is that the old XE or the new 2020 one? Having sat in both the new XEs interior and infotainment is considerably better than the XF. XF seems the most neglected car in the line up to me. The outgoing XJ still had the best quality interior in my opinion. Great vid none the less!
Lovely Jubbly, but, I can't imagine JLR lending you anymore cars in the future, no car is perfect?
Yep put a straight six in it and supercharge it that's something jaguar are good at.
How do you feel about the 2020, which got a v6 petrol with awd?
It didn't.
Great video. Now do an Alpina D3
Hi I do think you have to use manual on country roads.
Hi Jay, interested to hear your comments on this car as I have a 2008 XJ diesel with basically the same engine. My car has the previous 6 speed ZF and it works pretty-much perfectly with the low down torque of the diesel. However, when the XF came out with the 8 speeder and diesel motor I test drove one and found it to be a complete mismatch. All the time it was changing gear or multiple gears, so it never felt settled. So my vote for a better XF would be a reprogramming of the auto-box software.
I drove it thinking the old six speed would actually be a better fit
Brilliant review
Try changing the tyres to all-season or cold weather variants to alleviate the traction issues 🙄🤔
Enjoyed the video cheers
i am wondering if the engine gearbox problem applies to the pre facelift model...
The ZF gearbox can be reset to learn your driving style, which will then hold the gear instead of dropping a gear. Or just drive it hard for a few days and it learns your driving style.
Excellent Drive..
I love my 4WD. I actually need it 3-4 months a year. I am not a fan of cars that try to be everything. They always come up short on every aspect they aim to deliver. This Sportbrake S starts at $72,000, and with a couple of options you're over 80K....for a wagon. No thanks. It looks okay, but split that 80K up and you can easily have two vehicles that better deliver the aspects you want without sacrificing for the sake of "everything".
jamie t what 4wd do you love?
@@lightningthunder5928 Jeep Cherokee. I've had Jeeps for 30 years. This last one I bought in 17. Long story short - I was going to buy a Jaguar F Type. Wonderful car, but it wasn't the right fit for me. So I bought an Alfa Romeo Giulia Ti Sport and the Jeep for less that I had budgeted for the Jag. Each vehicle does it thing very well and I couldn't be happier. I have an old 04 Silverado work truck, so the only thing I'm lacking is a two seater convertible for summer days...maybe a Miata, an old Z3 or used F Type next spring. Peace!
jamie t golly
I'd be really curious what your opinion would be on modern Volvos. Bar probably the T5 versions, they aren't that sporty, but they seem nice.
To make it worse the new XE has the dual infotainment screen like in range rovers now.
Someone I know bought an XK S wagon for like $70k here in New York. Only one I've ever seen
can you do more cam views of the cabin ..cam stuck inside the car windows and pov view instead of the cam stuck outside the car..you see more of the surroundings with cam outside than you do of the car
is the gear selecting part of the process for getting better economy/co2 emissions, i.e it keeps trying to be as quickly into the most efficient gear rather than the best driving gear...presume it also starts in 2nd gear
Yes, so you'd hope sport mode would fix it but as mentioned in the video it does not
RUclips algorithm brought me here. The posch accept kept me through to the end 🤷
Driving a 5 year old XF Saloon with the 3.0 petrol. I love driving that car... but that has to do with the drivetrain. Baring that, it isn’t a luxury car at all. Nice car, I like the simple interior, quality is ok... but only the experience of driving it makes it stand out from dozens of competitors.
I really want to like this car so much - alas...There's very little available for people who need 4 doors and some measure of practicality like you say. The X5M etc. leave me cold personally.
anyway, GREAT outro.
I prefer Audi A6 avant
Love this epic ride!! 😎😎😎
The 3.0 V6 Diesel is a Ford engine - which kinda surprised me when I found out. Goes well though!.