How to Install a Sewage Ejector and Float Alarm
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- Опубликовано: 19 июн 2024
- Ever wonder how to install a sewage ejector...or even what it is?
In this video, I'll take you through all the necessary steps and items required to replace an exisitng domestic-type sewage ejector, and what to keep aware of in the process.
I'll also show you why you should add a float alarm, as well as how to install it.
This production's dedicated to all my current Plumbing Apprenticeship students, who have been more than patient and understanding, as we strive to deliver a modified sense of academic normalcy during these crazy, crazy times. You guys have been troopers throughout!
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CONTENTS OF THIS VIDEO:
00:00 - Intro
00:10 - Equipment and Materials Required
01:50 - Removing an Existing System
15:58 - Preparing and Installing the New Pump
19:20 - How a Sewage Pump Works: The Float Switch
21:58 - Installing and Setting The Float Alarm Switch
34:35 - About the Check Valve Assembly and Connecting Your Piping
39:37 - Installing and Connecting the Float Alarm Control Unit
40:22 - Testing and Fine Tuning Your New Sewage Ejector System!
43:31 - Outro
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If you like this video, please do "plunge" that LIKE button to a healthy shade of blue. Please also be sure to subscribe to this channel to keep up with a wide variety upcoming videos. I plan to cover topics suitable to the entire spectrum of the Plumbing field - from Newbie Do-it-yourselfer, to the ever-critical hardened Journeyperson.
As always, please do be sure to leave your comments below if there's anything you'd like to see in the future!
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MUSIC:
Spring Swing, Dee Yan-Key
Licensed under Creative Commons: By Attribution 4.0 License
Shattered-Mind, Eric Matyas, www.soundimage.org
Fantastic! I will definitely be upgrading our configuration to include the alarm and shutoff valve prior to finishing the basement bath.
Fantastic!! 👍
wow, I just went to plumbing school! You took the time at each step to explain the "why" followed by the "how" I now know what to watch for. I'm having a basement refinished and the ejector will be upgraded with a new pump and now thanks to you, an alarm. I learned so much and will review your video again before I start the project. You are truly a great teacher and patient man! I wish you lived in my town, I'd gladly hire you cause I would be confident it will be done right. You remind me of the "Holmes" guy on the cable. You do it right and think about the future maintenance. Thank you sir!!
Lol...Thanks so much! Let me know how the project goes!
This is hands down the best overview on RUclips. Thank you!
Thank you so much for your kind, encouraging words! 🙏
Thank you. This is the most detailed video that shows what I need to do to help an elderly family member replace their sewer pump. Thank you again.
Love it! Your comment makes it all worth it! Thanks and good luck!
Very good instructions!
Hey, so awesome to hear! Thank you! 🙏
This was a fantastic video, and that was an understatement. I wish I could tell you how much this helped a non plumber homeowner.
Wow!...thank you so much! 🙏 I can't overstate my gratitude for your kind words, as comments exactly like yours are what keep inspiring me to keep producing these videos. Thanks again so much; I'm delighted that you found it useful!
Thank you so much my friend. Our sewage ejector just failed on us and we had about a half Inch of nasty smelly water on our basement bathroom floor this morning. ( the sewage pump has been in for about 30 years ) I had no idea how to tackle this problem but after watching this video I now have the confidence to do this myself. This is easily the BEST how to sewage ejector video on RUclips. You have a new subscriber. Thanks again !!
Hey, thanks so much for the kind words! Above all, I hope it helps solve your ejector problem...that's what this is all REALLY about! 🙏
About to change out an old sewage pump and install an alarm - the same alarm used in the video. This video was great and covered everything. Thanks.
Thank you so much! I'm so happy it was useful for you!
Thank you so much , you are super helpful, that's what you call professional
Thank you so much!...it delights me to know that you found the information to your benefit!
Thx Man, We've Had To Install A New One Long Ago But We Figure It Out On The Hard Way By Flooding Our Basement With Sewage And Other Nasty Stuff.
Now I Bought A New Pump And Didn't Want Do Mess Even More Up, So We Watched This.
Now We Can Wash Our Laundry And Use The WC Again.
And Without A Proffesional It Only Costed Us Around 400 $!
Thanks!!!!
Aw man!..there's nothing worse than a basement flooded with sewage! I am however, grateful that my video was able to contribute to helping you out with your problem! If you haven't yet, I strongly recommend looking into installing a float alarm like I show in the video. It's a relatively low-cost extra measure in helping ensure that you don't end up with another sewage disaster! Thanks for watching, and your feedback! 🙏
I just can't believe I watched this whole video 😊
Delighted to hear! Thanks for watching!
This is the best overview on RUclips. Thank you!
I'm so glad you found it useful...that's all that matters to me. 🙏 Thank you!
Thank you so much for sharing your knowledge! I learned so much!
It makes me so happy to know that you got something useful out of it! Thanks so much for watching!
Going to install this pump from your video for an rv dump to sewage septic thank you for the very detailed vdeo !!!👍🏽👊🏽
Awesome!...you got this! 💪 🙌
Great video. Thank you for posting.
Thank you! 🙏
That will be super easy to clean or service in the future. Nice video.
Thank you for the kind words, Jeff! More to your point, I always make an effort do anything with future consideration in mind, whether it be for servicing or outright replacement.
Thanks again for watching! 🙏
thank you for your expert guidance
👍
Thank YOU for watching! I genuinely hope it met all your needs.
Thanks very much, this is extremely helpful
I'm so glad you found it useful!
Fantastic video! Step by step - Very much appreciated.
Doing this project on Christmas Eve LOL 🤣
Awesome! Thanks for inviting me over for Christmas 🤣...good luck, and Merry Christmas! 🎅 🎄 🥂
thanks for very informative demo...god bless sir
Thank you so very much. I'm delighted you found it useful! 🙏
Very helpful like to thank you for your tutorial 👍🏽
Thank you very much! I'm so happy I was able to help!
0:46 I need one of these. I'm surprised the guy who installed the new pump didn't recommend one. Thanks to installing a leak sensor beforehand, I was able to keep my basement from flooding at least. My sewage pump pulls double duty...and is also in a freaking crawlspace.
Hi there. I presume you're referring to the float alarm? Yeah, failed sewage ejectors are never fun for anyone (including the person replacing the pump!). I encourage those float alarms for my customers not only for sewage ejectors, but for storm sump pumps as well. Storm water is actually even worse in terms of potential damage, because it can't be stopped from flowing in! As gross as sewage pits are, at least they can generally be controlled by the simply ceasing to use any of the building's sanitary fixtures. Therefore, float alarms, are a solid line of defense for ejector systems. They should be mandated into the Plumbing Code, in my opinion. Thanks for your input!
Best logical video out there!
Wow!....I'm humbled by your generous words, and thank you for watching! 🙏. Hopefully you'll find the upcoming videos equally as useful. Thanks again!
Great video sir
Thank you, Dan...Glad you liked it!
Great video dude very informative thanx
Thanks so much for you generous compliment...and for watching!
@@PlumbingsCool great work my man thanx for the reply
Nicest installation ever .
Thank you sooo much for your kind, generous words! 🙏
Excellent video and clear instructions !
Thank you
Any recommendation where to purchase the pump and check/ ball valve assembly online ?
Thank you very much! 🙏 There's sooo much more I intend to share with you all.
With respect to purchasing a pump and check/ball valve assembly online, I can't confidently recommend an online retailer. I'm not sure where you're geographically located, but here in Ontario, Canada, we have an abundant of reputable dedicated plumbing suppliers (Next, Noble, Wolseley, Desco, etc.) which carry high-quality & approved pumps and materials - and are willing to sell to the public (i.e., those without an account). Personally, I'd avoid the big box stores, as the products they carry are significantly subpar to what's available from real Plumbing & Mechanical wholesalers (at least here in Canada).
Before delving into online retailers, I'd do a Google search for "plumbing wholesalers" located near you, and call them to inquire about "sewage pumps" and "combination check/ball valves". That Hydromatic pump I show in the video has proven to be a good brand, but there's also a slew of other brands I've had a great experience with, such as Little Giant and Liberty.
Hope that helps, and thanks for watching!
I’ve got a float switch that hangs down on a string from the top of the cover and it gets stuck in the on position sometimes and leaves the pump running. Is it possible to just replace the switch or the mechanism where the string connects to it? Thanks for this video it gave me confidence to DIY
By "string", do you mean the wire that connects to the actual float? If so, then you will likely need to replace the entire float switch, which comes factory pre-installed with the wire already connected to it. They're not typically replaceable because the float's housing and the wiring connecting to it on the inside must remain water-tight.
But another question is to ask why the float keeps getting stuck in the on position. Before you swap it out, you might want to make sure that it's not getting snagged or caught somewhere in the "on" (sideways) position. You can test it by manually rotating the switch between on and off positions while monitoring the behaviour of the pump. You mentioned that it hangs from the top of the cover. Therefore, does that mean that if the cover is lifted, then the switch comes with it? If so, you may want to reroute the float so that it is reinforced and held firmly by the discharge pipe, which will keep it in the same position and level (as shown in the video). This way you can set and test the float while still being able to observe the discharge cycle while the cover is off. If I correctly understand your current, situation: Once you place that cover on, it becomes a bit of a guess as to what's actually going on in your pit. Perhaps there's a possibility that your exisitng float is fine, and only needs to be reinforced properly.
I'm glad the video gave you the confidence to tackle it on your own! Thanks for watching 🙏 and Happy 2023! 🥂
Great video, who manufactures that union, check and valve (all in one) ? part number? Thanks
Thank you...I'm delighted you enjoyed it! 🙏. Just finished editing the next one only minutes ago and it should be out soon, so please do stay tuned!
As for the check valve, I cannot recall the specific brand used I installed in the video, but you can find virtually identical ones by Little Giant, Liberty, and Checkmate (and it may actually have been one of those!). Any reputable plumbing supplier should have them. Here are some examples:
www.libertypumps.com/Product/QBCV150C-QBCV200C
littlegiant.com/products/wastewater/accessories/check-valves/cvbv-2u-check-valve/
The ones shown are union slip-on-type connection, and truth be told, I had actually ordered that type for the job in the video - but my supplier had shipped me solvent-weld (glued) instead. So I adapted using the proper connection methods.
Whichever valve you choose, just be sure that you're installing one that's approved to meet the legal Building Code requirements which fall under your particular jurisdiction. Here in Canada - depending upon the material - it may fall under ULC, CSA, ASSE, ASTM, and more! If the valve is approved, it'll be marked or molded accordingly on the material. Hope this helps, and thanks again for watching!
@@PlumbingsCool Nice! thanks for sharing those links. I got to tell you the reason I asked was I NEVER seen the exact one as in your video, so very curious who makes it (and you sourced from). Look forward to your future videos.
@Plumbingscool did you say that the check valve is built into that union along with that gate valve if so what is that part actually called if i was to buy it and install one
It's not a check valve, but rather a ball valve. Simply google "sewage ejectorPVC ball valve check valve combo", and it should provide you with a ton of results.
I have installed dozens of these systems over the last 20 years. The check valve must always be installed horizontally and be spring loaded, if not every time the pump shuts off it will sound like a sledge hammer through out the whole house.. I'm amazed at how many of these systems are installed this way. If plumbers would simply read the instructions on a pump system they would learn a lot.
I appreciate your feedback, Vinny.
The manual for this pump only recommends nominally horizontal installation for "best performance". These particular check valves themselves are designed to be installed either horizontally or vertically. As well, the manual also stresses that the check valve must be a free-flow valve, of which a spring-type is not.
Although I've never experienced any issues with these check valves ever getting stuck on the vertical, I have had to deal with some existing applications where spring-loaded check valves got all seized up and jammed with non-organic solids, preventing the passing of further solids. Messy, to say the least, and an event I certainly don't want to relive.
I know what you mean about the sledge hammer noise...although in my experience, I found the banging to be more of a problem when the traditional brass gated valves are used. These plastic and rubber-gated ones, not so much from what I've seen.
Thanks for watching!
@@PlumbingsCool I understand what you're saying. But there is actually a specific spring loaded valve that is unobstructed for this application. The main complaint I have ever had about working on these systems is the insanely loud banging when it shuts off. I have found that with a spring-loaded valve that is unobstructed made specifically for this application eliminates that problem when installed horizontally. It has been a lifesaver when I rebuild the systems. But whatever works for you and the customer is the bottom line for me.
Where could I buy the ball shutoff you show around 34:35?
I'm not sure where you live, but any reputable plumbing supplier should carry it. If Google-search "Plumbing Supplier" in your area and call them up to save yourself some effort. Simply ask for a "2-inch PVC check valve & ball valve combo for sewage ejectors."
If it is indeed for a sewage ejector, you'll want to ensure that it's for 2-inch pipe (*NOT* 1-1/2", which is designed for smaller storm water sump pumps, and do not usually have the integrated ball valve) .
Also, one other thing I should mention is that the one you see in the video is "solvent weld" connection (just a fancy way of saying "glued!"); another common type is "compression", which requires no glue, but relies upon the tightening of large, integral nuts at each end of the valve to ensure it properly seals and grips the pipe ends. If you opt for the compression type, be sure that you tighten the two outer nuts with a pipe wrench or *really* large pliers so that adequate grip is maintained.
Hope this helps, and thanks for watching!
Great video! I have a question. Because most high-quality waste extraction pumps have painted, cast-iron housings, will these pumps be resistant to the potential corrosive effects of photographic chemicals (comprised of weak acids and strong bases) from a home darkroom? (The residential application will invovle no solid waste.) If so, should a thermoplastic sewage pump be used or a sewage pump made with baffled aluminum?
That's a great question! Your best bet is to contact the manufacturer of the sewage ejector you have in mind (ask for the technical/product support department). However, if I were to guess, I'd fathom that a quality pump would fare quite well subject to photographic chemicals for a few reasons. First, the pumps are designed to convey organic human waste, which contains toxic elements in its own right - namely corrosive uric acid from our liquid waste (constant, unflushed exposure of urine onto copper drainage piping does quite a number on the pipe - often eating right through the pipe walls!). Second, I imagine that your photographic chemicals will be diluted with water as it discharges down the drain, which should weaken the damage (if any) it may invoke onto pump's exposed surfaces.
Personally, I'm not a fan of plastic pumps - not even for simple clearwater sump applications. The simply scream "cheap!"
Once again, if in doubt, do reach out to the manufacturer, who knows their product better than anyone - and are are often more than willing to help, provided they're a reputable manufacturer.
And by the way: I love hearing that you're still developing photographic prints "old school"! Sadly a dying art! 👍 It give me fond memories of me hanging around in my uncle's darkroom, beneath that ominous red bulb!
@PlumbingsCool Thank you so much for your kind reply, and thank you again for a highly informative video. It told me everything I needed to know in order to install a waste water extraction pump.
As for the darkroom chemicals, I now feel confident enough that they will not adversely affect a cast-iron pump. If I change my mind, I can always spray paint the pump with rebar epoxy paint (Rust-Oleum Rb1600) to slow down the rate of corrosion.
The only other plumbing detail I will need to consider is the installation of the vent system for the waste water basin. I will consult the "Methods of Venting Fixtures and Traps in the 2018 IPC" for recommendations. I will most likely use a three-inch vent pipe, and run it to the nearest outside wall, where I can cut a three-inch opening for the pipe vent cover. Piece of cake, right? 😉
My pleasure. With respect to a vent, are you referring to the sewage ejector's vent, or only the lavatory? If it's a true sewage ejector pit, then a vent would be required because it would haver an air-tight lid. In our jurisdiction, the sewage ejector vent would only need to be two pipe sizes smaller than the incoming pit drain, but no less than 2".
If it's a vent only for the lavatory, all that you'd require is an 1-1/4" vent terminating to open air (1-1/2" is fine and more typically available in plastic). If you're running directly through the roof, then you'd need to upsize it to 3" BEFORE it exits the roof or wall (this is dependent upon your geographical area, because here in the Great White North, we have to upsize the vent terminal so that winter hoare frost does not choke off the terminal.). However, if you are having trouble terminating to open air, and all you're dealing with is a single lavatory for modest usage, one less invasive solution would be to install an air admittance valve (affectionately known as a "cheater vent"). To be clear, I'm not a fan of these devices in lieu of a true vent, but on the rare occasion, it does serve a purpose for a simple, single-fixture application where routing may Br tricky (a true vent is ALWAYS superior and preferred over an AAV). Just be sure that you purchase one that is ASSE certified (such as the Oatey SureVent), and be sure to terminate the vent above the lavatory's flood level rim (or at least as high as possible below it. Note that AAV's do NOT work for sealed sewage ejector pits, because they only allow air INTO the system, not OUT, so proper maintenance of atmospheric pressure cannot occur within the pit.
Hope this helps!
@PlumbingsCool Once again, thank you so much for your response and for your very helpful information. I plan to install two vents: one for the sewage extraction basin and one for the lavatory. The basin vent pipe will have a three-inch diameter, and the lavatory vent pipe will be 1.5 inches across, which is one-half the diameter of the main sewage drain pipe for the house. I plan to connect the lavatory vent pipe to the basin vent pipe so I would only need to cut one hole in the house siding.
I love it when people go the extra mile to ensure that plumbing is done right!
Master! Just found this online as recent sewage pump malfunction, turn out to be the float piggyback, question is how to put the new float and level it ? Old one is digital float sensor , replacement is float piggyback like yours in video, zip ties on the plastic pipe , how tall ? By the side of the pump ?
I'm delighted my the video was able to help you out!
With respect to your new float, it should have come with some sort of small plastic bracket to hold it against the pipe and allow you to loop the wire so that it fastens with the wire pointing horizontally. You'll want to leave about four inches (100mm) of wire between from the point it fastens to the pipe and the float itself. Any less and it may cause the pump to cycle prematurely, and too long will require the water level to rise excessively high before it "flips" the float to cause the circuit to close.
With that out of the way, you want to place the float high enough so that there is significant discharge into the pit before it cycles the pump. Too low will cause the pump to cycle too frequently, and with very little rise necessary in the pit; too high will cause sewage to escape back into the horizonal drain inlet (the source of your sewage). Therefore, place the float high enough so that the pump kicks in when the pit's sewage level rises a few inches or so below the pit's drain inlet. Again, if you place your float high, it's going to have to fill up ALL your underground horizontal drain lines before the sewage level can rise further to raise and activate your float.
Of course this will take some trial and error. Fasten your float to an estimated proper level, and simply let your pit fill up with clean water from your fixtures. Adjust and repeat until you've maximized an efficient level for cycling the pump.
Finally, be sure to ensure that the float is placed in a position so that it will not get caught or snag, otherwise, which may cause it to get stuck in the closed or open position. Try to avoid having the float immediately underneath the stream of the drain inlet. Otherwise, over time, any solids and toilet paper will build up and get caught on the float and wire, increasing the risk of restricting it's movement.
Hope this helps, and thanks for watching! 🙏
@@PlumbingsCool u are indeed the master and you did reply me with all the details , big big thumbs up to u sir, bless u and your family
@@PlumbingsCool will adjust it later tonight , base on the information u gave me best activation level is below 2 inched the inlet drain to prevent waste water go inside the inlet drain. Mine home Depot brand didn't come with the accessories only 1 zip ties , so I will have to tied it lil bit downwards ,as now the pump activated at waste water rise up halfway to my inlet drain . :(
It might help if you raise the float higher, AND shorten the length of the cable between your zip tie and the float so that the float swings up and down a shorter distance. In the worst case scenario, a half-filled pit is not that bad, depending on how quickly the pit gets filled. It's just good practice to try to minimize pump cycles for efficiency and to reduce unnecessary noise caused by the running pump and the slamming of the check valve. Hope you get it working how you want it!
@@PlumbingsCool did that and I works great. Now I have another issue , the ball valv handle above the check valve leaking water , I guess is old and I turn it off when I work on it once I turn back on it leaks , question is can I just buy the ball valve and connect using the existing using the rubber adapter ? Maybe glue with the little extension PVC pipe make it easier to connect ?
Thank u …
My pleasure!
As Steve Lav would say; “why do we wear gloves-could never figure it out” 😁
🤣 Truth be told, the only reason I'm not wearing gloves here is because that pit was receiving nothing more than clear water waste from the mechanical room floor drain from since the house was built. If I had to go near that pit NOW (since I installed a 3-piece washroom to it), I'd be going in with a hazmat suit! ☢
Thanks for watching! 🙏
How far of a run will a 1/2 horsepower pump push?
Hi there! A half-horsepower is a mighty strong pump for domestic applications.
In any event, what's important about pumps is not the horizontal length the discharge needs to run (which requires minimum effort to push effluent), but rather the VERTICAL height you need to achieve before the sewage can discharge horizontally, where gravity can take over. A pump's "vertical height" capability is referred to as "head"; the higher you need to go the "heavier" the sewage gets (water pressure increases at the bottom by approximately 1 PSI for every 2.34 feet it needs to climb). Your pump should have the respective head rating stated in its documentation, which states the "gallons per minute" or "litres per minute" discharged based on height. But a half-horsepower pump should be able to discharge at a reasonable rate even as high as thirteen or fourteen feet.
Hope this helps, and thanks for watching!
@@PlumbingsCool , thank you. I only have 2’ of rise by the run is 140’. Just wondering if that’s going to be a problem.
@@USMCord1 I'd need to look more into your scenario to be sure, but if it's how you describe (with no rise beyond the initial two feet), I don't anticipate you having an issue. It would be ideal if you could put some downward grade onto that horizontal run to help it drain as naturally as possible with minimal assistance from the pump.
If I'm ever in doubt in a particular situation, I take the initiative to call the equipment manufacturer directly - specifically their technical support department - and explain the situation to them. No one knows a product like the ones who created it!
@@frankspatone , Thank you!
Im running a shower and toilet to my septic system but theres not enough fall. I dont have a basement. Should i dig a hole and put one of these in a crawlspace then run my piping to pump it upwards towards the septic?
What is your opinion on this?
I can't see why that wouldn't work, if you're OK with the additional work and expense involved. Note that you will also need to run a minimum 2-inch vent from the sewage pit, and of course ensure that it is easily accessible for future servicing.
If you're only running what sounds like a 3-piece bathroom, another possible option may be for you to consider a bolt-down macerating toilet that accepts drainage from a raised shower and a lavatory. If you're unfamiliar with them, a macerating toilet essentially grinds the waste and pumps the sewage up through a measly 3/4-inch(!) pipe.
Saniflow, and I believe Liberty Pumps, make such models, which have been around for decades - notably in Europe. Although I'm not normally a fan of macerating toilets (I prefer the simpler gravity-flush toilets because there's less which can go wrong mechanically), I have installed these alternatives without fail, as viable solutions for where installing a proper drain may not be practical or cost-effective.
@@PlumbingsCool @PlumbingsCool thanks for your input. Im not able to add a septic tank on the other end of my house and figured to add a pump instead. but with it having to go in the crawlspace its not easily accessible for maintenance.
Would the 2" vent be able to end in the crawlspace?
No, definitely do not leave an open drainage pipe in the crawlspace. Doing so will emit harmful sewer gas into the space and eventually into your home.
And in case anyone suggests so, do not use a cheater vent/air admittance valve either. These are not proper vents and would cause closed pump systems to malfunction.
The only proper way is to run the vent pipe up into your attic (if you have one) and either tie into to another existing vent pipe, or run straight through the roof (if so, you'd need to properly weatherproof it by installing the appropriate vent flashing).
@@PlumbingsCool ok thanks good to know about the vent. I have never heard of the macerating toilet. I see it has a pump would that be sufficent to pump just a couple feet incline at about 75' horizontally and save me from needing to install a sewage ejector pump? If so that seems like the simplest option.
Gloves !
Lol...I presume you're giving me advice - and certainly sound advice it would be! Rest assured that I often do wear gloves, and I'd be doing such projects in a hazmat suit if I had it my way...however in this case (as I point out in the video) this pit was completely clean and free from sewage (as at least until now); it had never been used for anything but to receive clear water waste from the mechanical room's condensation lines.
Since the pump replacement its been happily chugging away at moving REAL sewage from a full washroom I had recently plumbed into the basement, a few feet away.
But otherwise, under any other event...as you say: GLOVES!!!
Thanks for watching!
Would a cheater valve work for the sewage pump vent?
Good question! A cheater vent (or air admittance valve) on a traditional sewage ejector system is probably not a good idea - although it's better than nothing. A cheater vent is typically a one-way valve: It allows air into the system, but not out, which prevents atmospheric pressure from being properly maintained. Therefore, heavy drainage flow into the pit would cause positive pressure to build up downstream into the pit, thereby inhibiting proper drainage flow. However, any residual air pressure buildup should eventually dissipate through the inlet drainage pipes and up through the vents serving the fixtures (NOT that that would be proper design or practice!)
One area where you'd be sure to run into issues with cheater vents are those small, self-contained point-of-use sewage ejector boxes (such as those ones made by Liberty or Little Giant), which are designed to fit beside laundry tubs and other small sinks. Their manuals explicitly stress against the use of air admittance valves, as they will not operate properly without a proper vent.
As a general rule, you just can't replace proper venting that runs out to open air.
Hope this helps, and thanks for your question!
@@PlumbingsCool Wow I had no idea it made a huge difference like that whether the vent is coming from your roof (typical setup) vs not routing the extra piping and just using the cheater vale (air vacuum created by pump gets filled in from house). Where is the difference in pressures (outside vs inside) come in as a problem? At the pit or at the septic? Isn't the inside air similar pressure whats in the pit? i was thinking the only losses would be that the vent would use the warm air from the inside to fill in the void in the pit which would result in your warm air getting sucked up. Also does it not matter which cheater vent you use and how its configured? Thanks for the detailed answer. I was hoping to save all the additional piping and breaking out the drywall on a partially finished basement but from what you are saying its not worth the trouble of using this cheater vent.
Right, so technically if your fixtures are properly vented, you may be able to get away with atmospheric pressure being rebalanced in the sewage pit by "stealing" airflow from those fixture vents as required. (it'll suck in air from those vents when the pump discharges, and any excess pressure will built up in the pit should escape through those same vents). But I want to be clear that it is blatantly against Code and not proper plumbing practice.
Venting has nothing to do with air temperatures. Rather, venting's primary purpose is to maintain the liquid trap seals of the building's fixtures (which prevent harmful sewer gas from entering the building). All proper venting needs to exit to "open air", which refers outside the envelope of the the building, which is atmospheric (typically 14.7 PSI at sea level).
Say when you flush a toilet: that high volume of water rushing through the pipes will push air ahead of it and pull air behind it, thereby disrupting the system's pressure. If that toilet discharge passes across the connection of an unvented fixture (say, a sink), it runs the risk of siphoning out the sink's trap seal. But if that sink was properly vented, then the negative pressure pulling on the sink's trap caused by the toilet's discharge would be rebalanced by sucking air through the sink's vent.
Think of when you drink through a straw: Your "Sucking" creates pressure inside the straw that is less than the pressure outside of it (atmospheric). But!...we can all recall an annoying moment when our straw wouldn't work properly because it was punctured or defective, causing us to have to suck harder to pull the liquid into our mouths. That "puncture" in the straw is equivalent to a fixture's vent... Negative (or positive) pressure gets restored through that hole.
Needless to say, there's A LOT more to venting rules than this, but that's really its purpose. Just remember the two big rules of plumbing:
1: All fixtures must be trapped, and
2: All traps in must be vented!
OK, back to your situation!...
If you need to get really invasive to locate and connect a real vent, I would reason I suggest that you may a well try out a proper cheater vent first, and if you experience issues, then proceed with connecting a real vent to the pipe.
As far as proper cheater vents are concerned: Not all cheater vents are created equally: In North America, You'll need to find one that is ASSE-approved. The most common one is the Oatey SureVent:
www.oatey.com/products/air-admittance-valves-aav
There are also some approved solutions from Sioux Chief and one called Turbo Vent.
Avoid the unapproved spring-loaded types (often come in black ABS plastic), because their mechanical nature makes them more prone to failure.
Simply terminate the pit's 2" vent with the valve installed in a vertical (upward) direction few feet above the floor. Hopefully, it'll work out for you without disrupting the rest of your plumbing system. If it does, then just locate a proper vent and connect it accordingly.
Again, an AAV is certainly not ideal (and a piece of me dies in those rare occasions I need to install one! 😞) , but a cheater vent is better than no vent at all.
Good luck!
@@PlumbingsCool This makes more sense now thanks! I didn't think that the vent needs to be two way for the pressure to come to a balance. Plus this isn't to code, makes you wonder why the cheater vent even exists :).
That's a great point. This topic arises often with my Apprenticeship students, who argue, "well, if it's not legal then why is sold?". The bottom line is that it's not up to the store or supplier to determine what's legal, but rather the installer. There's no end to the questionable junk available on the market...but in our free enterprise world, if there's a demand, there'll be someone to fulfill it.
As for AAV's: Legality is a little more complicated. Here in Ontario, there's no denying that cheater vents are present in the Codebook, leading one to presume that their outright legal. But if you look at the code section more closely, it gives the impression that the code was somewhat shoehorned in there at the very end of the Venting section merely because AAV's exist and no denying that they get installed at times.
First, it starts off by declaring that AAV's shall only be installed in buildings undergoing renovation or where connection to a proper vent may not be "practical" (what the heck does that even mean??? Practical is such a subjective word).
Finally by the end of the entire listing of installation requirements, it concludes by stating that installation of AAV's shall be "subject to the authority having jurisdiction", meaning: it's ultimately up to the local plumbing/building inspector to decide whether or not they will allow you to use an AAV...and every inspector is different (and sometimes even clueless and impossible to reason with!)
So at least in my area, it does very much remain a grey area as to the legalities of them.
As a general rule: Always try to do the right thing whenever possible (such as connecting to a true, proper vent!), and bend the rules only when absolutely necessary.
Thumbs up all times long
🙏🙏🙏🙏
you forgot airlock prevention hole on 2 inch pipe
Do you mean the airlock bleeder hole I mention at 18:00 into the video?
Thanks for watching!
why do you have a mask on?
😂 Well, I can tell you, it was NOT because of the sewage ejector, because up until I connected a new 3-piece bathroom to it, it was only picking up clear water from the mechanical room, so no concerns there.
The reason I WAS wearing a mask is because was a project that I carried out at a customer's home right at the height of COVID when we all thought the world was going to come to an end, so...
However, if I ever needed to return to service or replace that ejector now that there's a toilet going into it, you can rest assured that I'll be wearing a Hazmat suit! 😁
Why are u using gloves. 😩😩😩😩😩😩😩😩😩😩😩😩
Lol...do you mean, why am I NOT using gloves? Fair point, and the only reason is because the sewage ejector was only picking up the floor drain from the mechanical room at the time (clear water waste from the furnace only).
However, I have since installed and connected a 3-piece bathroom to it, and I promise you that if I ever need to get back in there again, it certainly won't be without some serious gloves! 🤮