I finally got 12.5.1.5 last night. I took about an hour drive with it. I'm coming from 12.3.6 and yes smooth is the first word that comes to mind. It's also a bit more assertive, even on "chill" and "average." Love the smoother stops and better decision making. The "not getting over for the turn lane soon enough" problem still exists though. In one instance, it was quite aggressive in getting over at the last minute, cutting rather tightly in front of an SUV in order to make the turn lane. I'm surprised he didn't honk at me. I also had an instance where FSD could not get over to make a turn, and it went a little further and made a U-turn to get to where we were going. That's okay. But overall, yes, this is a big step up from 12.3.6 in many ways. One impressive move it made was when a tow truck was completely blocking a street in order to pick up a car. FSD slowed, then smoothly and slowly cut through an adjacent parking lot to go around! I was impressed. Also, most of my drive was in the rain at night. It was giving the "FSD might be degraded" warning.
FSD 12.5.1 is not a huge improvement over 12.3.6, but FSD is certainly improving and is the best reason for owning a Tesla. I do have greater trust 12.5.1.5 👈🏾
@@CasperChicago some major regressions that I’ve experienced: Unsure on left turns. Gets really jerky Cuts off cars when changing lanes Inappropriate lane changes: upcoming left in 300 feet and changes into RIGHT lane. Sudden stops out of nowhere Pulls out into oncoming traffic I’ve never understood why they can’t simply leave in what works while at the same time making improvements? Makes zero sense
I'm really enjoying 12.5.1.5, I mean its a huge difference from 12.3.6. I think alot of people who have had all the in between versions probably aren't seeing such huge changes but going from 12.3.6 to 12.5.1.5 is really huge. The smoothness, the assertiveness, the no longer sitting at empty stop signs thinking what to do. Great job Elon and FSD Team, HW3 running it really well and I'm sure will just get better. As much as I wish I had HW4, I can guarantee I won't be purchasing another Tesla until HW5. I see no reason to buy anything with HW5 already being worked on
Thanks as always for your honesty. My challenges have been random phantom braking, random blinker activation when not necessary (confusing folks), getting into improper lanes right before a turn into an opposite lane (i.e. 500 ft. before a LEFT turn, it decides to get into the RIGHT lane), auto set speed is still atrocious, typically going anywhere from 3 - 10 MPH UNDER speed limits under perfect conditions, requiring constant accelerator taps, especially in California with the multitude of "impatient" drivers (thank you for being one of the ONLY RUclipsrs to talk about this). Even turning off that setting still acts like its utilizing auto set speed with NO WAY to truly turn it off! Positives: hands free is a game changer. I've also noticed a very slight improvement in the way it slows at intersections and getting a little bit closer to stop lines and distance to car in front. Not perfect, but better. Now no longer "zig-zags" when one lane opens up into two or going into a double left hand turn. It now confidently chooses a lane and stays there. Other than that, largely the same. Gotta say though, it almost feels like they brought back "code" to this build and not so much Neural Network, possibly due to HW3 limitations?? I'll be so curious to see if there's a big difference in your experiences with HW4...
My experience is like yours in our 20MSLR+ Twice it has nearly come to a stop as it entered an intersection on green with no other traffic. Bailing on lane changes, dropping into a turn only lane when the nav is straight through, hard stops on yellow when there is no reason to. Get on the highway and it's wonderful! Definitely not ready for the merge. I can understand why they paused. Hopefully we get rapid improvement on this port to HW3.
Same for me, phantom braking, driving down the center yellow striped lane on a two lane road, missing exits, these may be from map errors but 12.3.6 didn't do this to me. The only thing I like is the green dot by the blue steering wheel icon which means camera attention is active so I don't have to do the steering wheel nag, and for that I usually rolled the volume control wheel up and down one notch. But at night the green dot turns off after a while. I can turn on my drivers side dome light and the green light comes back on after a minute because the camera can see me again. 2021MYLR with HW3 that does not have the IR camera.
Good stuff! I prefer these videos where you intervene and leave feedback rather than videos with zero interventions. Way to explain the supervision part that we play.
Interventions are an absolute MUST! Those who tout their videos as ZERO INTERVENTIONS, ISN'T IT AWESOME? are not only being disingenuous but are doing no one any favors. Tesla needs to know the problems. WE need to know the problems. The "everything is awesome" folks are simply there to ensure Tesla stock stays high.
Wow, totally envious. Still waiting for 12.5.1.5 OTA to my 2022 MSLR. Looks like I will be the very last to get HW3 OTA. Very, very frustrating. Thanks for sharing your experiences.
Your vids are among the best out there. Well done. Please keep this up! HW4 here. 12.5.1.3 has been darn near perfect. Had one occasion where the car tried to turn into a driveway that was just before the actual street. It was about 5 feet of difference. Anyone know when the adjustment to allow sunglasses is coming?
My daughter was taken a back when her 2024 Model 3 didn't follow the navigation too. Glad to see that it wasn't just her. I hope Tesla resolve this problem soon!
It happens to others too. Sometimes it's obviously bad map data, sometimes FSD is just making a mistake like a human would. But occasionally the override is intentional because FSD sees a better way. Like when the nav tells you to turn right and then do a U-turn, when it's legal to turn left. There's one like that where I live, and hasn't been fixed for years.
I finally got 12.5 on hw3 MSP21'. This is 95% of what I wanted from FSD. My 120 mile daily round trips for work is now a time to relax. 😮 I no longer feel tired when I come back home!!
Good Video -- Please clarify -- at 4:45 did NOT BOTH white Utility trucks run the same RED LIGHT? Also note, the height of the utility trucks blocked the Tesla's sight of the traffic light. I think FSD would have worked correctly had the trucks not blocked the 2nd light. This looks like a difficult situation that even a human would have trouble with -- how did you know the light was there?
4:47 The first truck appears to run the red light. 4:48 the second truck appears to run the red light. There are 5 traffic lights in the insection, only the 3 lights from the the right side were partially blocked by the trucks at any one time. The other traffic lights on the left side were not affected by FSD sight. The 2 right-most traffic lights applied to the right-most lane. 4:49 All the 3 left-most traffic lights (that applied to FSD) appears to be red while the 2 right-most traffic lights appears to be green 4:50 FSD Disengaged.
@@troydelgado1271 -- Yep that is a very difficult intersection, even for human drivers. I would like to see FSD proceed very carefully (slowly) in such situations -- I understand human drivers, experienced with the intersection, may yell and honk but but it's better than FSD rear-ending or T-Bone'ing another vehicle.
It seems like FSD graduated from the test route and now has to learn to drive on crowded city street. These drives in the city expose the flaws well that might go undetected on the typical test routes. If FSD is to be solved, it needs to be tested in tough environments.
True, oddly angled intersections are seemingly beyond FSD’s reasoning. Yet, a new teen driver would probably have no trouble figuring out which light applies to which lane, and where to stop. And, those left turns in front of traffic were ill advised, waiting only 10 more seconds, would have been completely safe. The look ahead reasoning of FSD isn’t quite there. Maybe, a new setting, “Limo Smooth”, is needed.
I find 12.5.1.5 to be much smoother. I also had a try to run the red light issue. My other issues is that it still doesn’t recognize flashing lights in school zones tries to maintain speed. It also fails on one way bridges/roads where you’re supposed to take turns. Lane changes have regressed for me in that now I have more issues where it wants to get into right or left turn only lanes instead of going straight. Until it solves these “edge” cases robo-taxi will remain a dream.
Thanks. As always, great stuff. Your insight on the camera wiring harnesses are valuable. I think that will make it a no-go. That being said. Tesla should only be obligated to upgrade your HW from 3 to 4 (if they decide to do so) if you already bought FSD before or will buy it to get the upgrade. If you are not paying for FSD you are not entitled to the HW since you don't use the SW no matter what Tesla said about the HW. I have had access to v12.5.1.5 on my 2020 MY now for 5 days and the improvement on v12.3.6 is NEXT LEVEL. I am SO impressed with it. My accelerator inputs are down by 90% and my frustration level by 95%. It still makes many mistakes BUT it's so good now that the issues don't bug me. It's the first version that makes me believe Tesla will solve autonomy. Even if HW3 can't reach SAE L5 autonomy, I think L4 is possible and for me that would be more than good enough. I am giddy every time I can go for a drive and use FSD exclusively now. With v12.3.6 my wife would ask me to not use it. Now she just wants me to not talk about how good it is 😂. I used to feel v12.3.6 accelerated too hard in some cases. Now I am comfortable with it BECAUSE I am so much more comfortable with it. V12.5.1.5 is a total game changer for me. I cannot emphasize enough how dramatically better it is, even on highways (which is not E2E yet). Again. Thanks for your effort in making these vids. I know it requires significant effort and patience.
i love FSD 12.5.1.5 but there at times it feels a bit aggressive, it turns right too fast sometimes and wonder if it can see effectively oncoming car before doing a right… before it was creeping too slow…. also i had a red light issue… i took over too… overall still huge improvement to 12.3.6
I just got this update and I am noticing alot more phantom braking especially during intersections. Does anyone else have this problem? The unprotected lefts are significantly better with this build and also no more zig zagging between lanes.
i read on another forum a while back that they have some AI scrape thru transcriptions looking for keywords or if a certain location generates more interventions
They use an LLM to automatically categorize the voice notes, then those categories are prioritized by how many people report them and how frequently they occur, and then that's what FSD is trained on next.
Thursday, August 29, 2024 ... Greetings. Intelligent people, truly intelligent people, say things and convey their thoughts as simply as possible, using as few words as possible to exchange ideas and/or information. PEACE!
My experience with the car taking a different rount than the the routing, is that the car is doing the wrong thing. I don't think the 2 systems are not thoroughly enough integrated.
Retrofits will happen when Level 5 is solved. That’s when the math will justify the expense. Until then I agree you. Probably something like hardware 7 that has built in cleaning for cameras.
Genuine question, but do we really believe that the FSD profiles have any effect on how it drives? I know before the "Auto Speed" option was made available, it did have a certain follow distance. But I personally have not noticed any difference in all 3 profiles. 2018 M3P FSD 12.4.3 4:20 - what kind of horrible road design is that?! Lol cars are just supposed to last minute merge in the middle of the intersection?
From my personal experience with HW3, I've noticed the cameras are the real culprit for lackluster performance. Two issues constantly stick out for me: 1) Sunlight has a huge effect - which is why the new hardware has a filter. 2) It has huge issues when it comes to steep incline or decline situations - so much to a point where at the apex, it "loses sight" and "understanding" of marker situation.
This version isn’t paused. More went out late yesterday and more will be going out. Not everything will be perfect right away. They need to get a stable release out, then they can work on small point fixes.
the problem i have with the map data is that it 85% of the time takes me to an intersection where it would take me a minimum of 6 minutes to turn left on an arterial road then immediately right 100 feet later when It could route me over 2 streets to proceed through a light. today I tried it just to make sure and the arterial road was backed up several blocks and by the time it would have let up, the light where I would normally go to turns red and they stack up again.
this is a problem with all navigational gps systems since their invention, there is no stopped traffic at that intersection because nobody is stupid enough to attempt to use it.
Nice drive! Do you think there is a chance that Tesla may announce that HW3 cars will NEVER drive autonomously? You will have supervised FSD advantages, but not autonomous? If that happens, what would be the repercussions? Did you sign a disclaimer when you purchased that says Beta software MAY never be a fully released software? Of course, I hope you get fully autonomous self driving in your car!
The thing about traffic lights is that we put them in because without them dumb humans would often drive into each other. Once all the cars are self-driving, we won't need them!
The hard stop around 20:18 is a great example of why cameras-only for the sensors is a bad idea. The black Mercedes in front was slightly angled when it changed lanes and therefore the image of the car was larger to the cameras. When the Mercedes straightened out, it appeared smaller to the cameras, so FSD thought the Mercedes was accelerating or at least maintaininf distance, when in fact it was slowing down hard. That's why it was a hard braking situation. Could have been alot worse if the situation was amplified with a greater initial lane change angle and harder stop.
Where did you hear rollout is paused? My 12.3.6 hugs the right side of lane. Does your 12.5 always hug the left? I'm dying for a version that stays in the center of the lane and doesn't drive like a chump.
Felt too close for me too. "Timing" pedestrians like that is too assertive. Also, for comfort, at least in Chill or Average mode, it should reduce situations where it might have to jam on the brakes.
12.5.1.5 installed last night on my 2020 Model 3. First impressions- still biased towards the center line, still cannot "see" or that the obvious lane becomes a left turn only lane (arrows and a sign) and when the light turns green it tries to go straight ahead. The latest FSD on a HW4 car also fails here- FSD still sets too high a speed in a 35 zone (up to 43mph) but not on all roads. .5 seems smoother than the prior version, but still shows some sawing of the wheel when turning after a stop sign- not yet wife approved.
@@LordStevieI expect that some would say that I have "the habit of command. "But I also understand that that style has its place. My wife and I have an equal voice, but not on all subjects. She says buy the car you want, and I say are you happy with this choice. That translates into buy the performance version if you like it, and on my side it means not using FSD all of the time (and maybe keeping her Lexus a bit longer). But if she said I really like the all wheel long range, well the only discussion would be about the color.
@@LordStevie Nah, this is a good benchmark. Is a passenger who is *not* an early adopter comfortable with the ride? I'm really looking forward to this.
7:00: Who's bright idea was it to have a pothole every 5 feet? 🤦♂ 10:00: Elon also said the HW4 computer won't fit in the space of the HW3. Remains to be seen if Tesla will truly honor their promise. There's a ton of wiggle-room in the definition of "FSD." Interesting drive - would have been damn near perfect if not for 3 GLARING exceptions (running red, failing to recognize road closure, failing to pass double-parked car). Unfortunately, no amount of smooth sailing makes up for any of the 3 times it would have been stuck or dangerously breaking the law.
How long did it take you to feel comfortable allowing FSD to actual drive the vehicle. I’ve been using it on and off since 24 August 2024, and I’m getting more comfortable but still did not realize how soon I’m willing to take over. I’ll get there I suppose.
An easy way to know is to go into the Autopilot menu on the car and look for Park Assist. If you have an option between standard and Tesla Vision you have Hardware 3, if you don't or don't see the option at all then you have Hardware 4.
I don’t have any options to pick from nor do I have any sensors in the front or back of the car. It’s all Tesla vision. so, looks like I have hardware for build. No wonder it’s so slow coming out and why I’m still on 12.3.6. Thanks for your great videos. Keep up the good work.
It also cannot recognize “No turn on Red’ signs. So if there is no red arrow it will pause like at any red light or stop sign, and then try to make the turn even though signage makes it illegal
re map data, it sucks IMO compared to WAZE..on highway pathetic continuous speed limit adjustments (110 kmh to 100 kmh back to 110 then down to 80 then back to 110) it is junk and inexcusable. going under one bridge always causes a speed limit drop and hard braking..just junk
I still do not know why you don't use CHILL mode since you have been so upset for going to fast in several conditions. I run my car in CHILL MODE and do not ever experience your issues.
It seems to have a wide variety of behavior. Seems to be much better in M3 and MY, but BT's experience in his MSP-HW3 is way better than ours in a 20MSLR+. Hard to know why. My first longer drive after the upgrade was simply atrocious. It has gotten a little better, but interventions have gone up at least 3x, not counting accelerator pushes, which are also required much more frequently; almost constantly. I hope we see rapid improvement. Not sure how much environment plays. I'm on big wide TX thoroughfares. Should be much easier.
if not retrofit then give me my money back..HW3 was touted by Tesla as FSD and will not get there. give all HW3 owners who paid for FSD their money back..no excuses Tesla has failed miserably at achieving FSD with HW3...ps AI5 will not achieve FSD either, without a complete rethink..typical Musk failure almost there but never quite (AI5 will have radar imagine that)..vision is not enough, it fails in bad weather (when occluded)..they will need to rethink cameras, add radar, bring back sonar, etc. they can remove any blog they want but their history is there
halted the rollout..sounds like another aborted rollout like 12.4..bigger question is why can't Tesla improve the highway GSD (goofy self-driving), which i suspect is due to fundamental technical limitations in both hardware and software..forget tesla touting their ASS, how bout some real fundamental improvement.. since v11 the only real improvement i see is that goofy continuous useless nag is gone (i got camera "occluded" on every hour long drive), the next only improvement i expect is lessened nag if i ever get above 12.3.6..the round town stuff is always similar but different...FYI "driver takeover" means it is not FSD (irrespective of version), owners should stop making excuses for continuous Tesla failure.
Tesla may not want to retrofit but they’ll have to because of Elon’s pumping promises- he now is trying to cover his tracks from his the initial hype. Elon’s a BS artist, it’s finally catching up with him
I finally got 12.5.1.5 last night. I took about an hour drive with it. I'm coming from 12.3.6 and yes smooth is the first word that comes to mind. It's also a bit more assertive, even on "chill" and "average." Love the smoother stops and better decision making. The "not getting over for the turn lane soon enough" problem still exists though. In one instance, it was quite aggressive in getting over at the last minute, cutting rather tightly in front of an SUV in order to make the turn lane. I'm surprised he didn't honk at me. I also had an instance where FSD could not get over to make a turn, and it went a little further and made a U-turn to get to where we were going. That's okay. But overall, yes, this is a big step up from 12.3.6 in many ways.
One impressive move it made was when a tow truck was completely blocking a street in order to pick up a car. FSD slowed, then smoothly and slowly cut through an adjacent parking lot to go around! I was impressed. Also, most of my drive was in the rain at night. It was giving the "FSD might be degraded" warning.
I have a 2019 M3+ waiting on 12.5.x FSD.
Tesla should make chill and average mean something significant when using FSD
I have never felt a difference between chill, average, or aggressive modes. I believe it's a placebo and those settings do absolutely nothing.
FSD 12.5.1 is not a huge improvement over 12.3.6, but FSD is certainly improving and is the best reason for owning a Tesla. I do have greater trust 12.5.1.5 👈🏾
@@CasperChicago some major regressions that I’ve experienced:
Unsure on left turns. Gets really jerky
Cuts off cars when changing lanes
Inappropriate lane changes: upcoming left in 300 feet and changes into RIGHT lane.
Sudden stops out of nowhere
Pulls out into oncoming traffic
I’ve never understood why they can’t simply leave in what works while at the same time making improvements? Makes zero sense
I'm really enjoying 12.5.1.5, I mean its a huge difference from 12.3.6. I think alot of people who have had all the in between versions probably aren't seeing such huge changes but going from 12.3.6 to 12.5.1.5 is really huge. The smoothness, the assertiveness, the no longer sitting at empty stop signs thinking what to do. Great job Elon and FSD Team, HW3 running it really well and I'm sure will just get better. As much as I wish I had HW4, I can guarantee I won't be purchasing another Tesla until HW5. I see no reason to buy anything with HW5 already being worked on
100% on waiting until AI5 for my next Tesla.
Same with me. AI version should last at least 2 iterations so 5 it is for me too! Can’t wait to get this version!
i'm ready for it, still on 12.3.6. the biggest thing i want is to not pause at stop signs for 60 seconds when it can go
What makes you think there won’t be AI6, AI7, etc?
@@LordStevierobotaxi will likely have AI5. Really Really Full Self Drive for Real 😁
A kinder gentler Black Tesla giving FSD the benefit of the doubt
I love Black Teslas vids. They are relaxing!
The way its navigating thru tight quarters is truly impressive! Best i've ever seen it do.
Thanks as always for your honesty. My challenges have been random phantom braking, random blinker activation when not necessary (confusing folks), getting into improper lanes right before a turn into an opposite lane (i.e. 500 ft. before a LEFT turn, it decides to get into the RIGHT lane), auto set speed is still atrocious, typically going anywhere from 3 - 10 MPH UNDER speed limits under perfect conditions, requiring constant accelerator taps, especially in California with the multitude of "impatient" drivers (thank you for being one of the ONLY RUclipsrs to talk about this). Even turning off that setting still acts like its utilizing auto set speed with NO WAY to truly turn it off!
Positives: hands free is a game changer. I've also noticed a very slight improvement in the way it slows at intersections and getting a little bit closer to stop lines and distance to car in front. Not perfect, but better. Now no longer "zig-zags" when one lane opens up into two or going into a double left hand turn. It now confidently chooses a lane and stays there.
Other than that, largely the same. Gotta say though, it almost feels like they brought back "code" to this build and not so much Neural Network, possibly due to HW3 limitations?? I'll be so curious to see if there's a big difference in your experiences with HW4...
My experience is like yours in our 20MSLR+ Twice it has nearly come to a stop as it entered an intersection on green with no other traffic. Bailing on lane changes, dropping into a turn only lane when the nav is straight through, hard stops on yellow when there is no reason to. Get on the highway and it's wonderful! Definitely not ready for the merge. I can understand why they paused. Hopefully we get rapid improvement on this port to HW3.
Same for me, phantom braking, driving down the center yellow striped lane on a two lane road, missing exits, these may be from map errors but 12.3.6 didn't do this to me. The only thing I like is the green dot by the blue steering wheel icon which means camera attention is active so I don't have to do the steering wheel nag, and for that I usually rolled the volume control wheel up and down one notch. But at night the green dot turns off after a while. I can turn on my drivers side dome light and the green light comes back on after a minute because the camera can see me again. 2021MYLR with HW3 that does not have the IR camera.
Good stuff! I prefer these videos where you intervene and leave feedback rather than videos with zero interventions. Way to explain the supervision part that we play.
Interventions are an absolute MUST! Those who tout their videos as ZERO INTERVENTIONS, ISN'T IT AWESOME? are not only being disingenuous but are doing no one any favors. Tesla needs to know the problems. WE need to know the problems. The "everything is awesome" folks are simply there to ensure Tesla stock stays high.
Wow, totally envious. Still waiting for 12.5.1.5 OTA to my 2022 MSLR. Looks like I will be the very last to get HW3 OTA. Very, very frustrating. Thanks for sharing your experiences.
Your vids are among the best out there. Well done. Please keep this up!
HW4 here. 12.5.1.3 has been darn near perfect. Had one occasion where the car tried to turn into a driveway that was just before the actual street. It was about 5 feet of difference. Anyone know when the adjustment to allow sunglasses is coming?
Elon should do their own navigation mapping using the fleet.
My daughter was taken a back when her 2024 Model 3 didn't follow the navigation too. Glad to see that it wasn't just her. I hope Tesla resolve this problem soon!
It happens to others too. Sometimes it's obviously bad map data, sometimes FSD is just making a mistake like a human would. But occasionally the override is intentional because FSD sees a better way. Like when the nav tells you to turn right and then do a U-turn, when it's legal to turn left. There's one like that where I live, and hasn't been fixed for years.
@@andrasbiro3007 Makes sense! Thanks for the input.
I finally got 12.5 on hw3 MSP21'. This is 95% of what I wanted from FSD. My 120 mile daily round trips for work is now a time to relax. 😮 I no longer feel tired when I come back home!!
Good Video -- Please clarify -- at 4:45 did NOT BOTH white Utility trucks run the same RED LIGHT? Also note, the height of the utility trucks blocked the Tesla's sight of the traffic light. I think FSD would have worked correctly had the trucks not blocked the 2nd light. This looks like a difficult situation that even a human would have trouble with -- how did you know the light was there?
4:47 The first truck appears to run the red light.
4:48 the second truck appears to run the red light.
There are 5 traffic lights in the insection, only the 3 lights from the the right side were partially blocked by the trucks at any one time. The other traffic lights on the left side were not affected by FSD sight. The 2 right-most traffic lights applied to the right-most lane.
4:49 All the 3 left-most traffic lights (that applied to FSD) appears to be red while the 2 right-most traffic lights appears to be green
4:50 FSD Disengaged.
@@troydelgado1271 -- Yep that is a very difficult intersection, even for human drivers. I would like to see FSD proceed very carefully (slowly) in such situations -- I understand human drivers, experienced with the intersection, may yell and honk but but it's better than FSD rear-ending or T-Bone'ing another vehicle.
🔥🔥🔥🔥🔥🔥🔥🔥this is testing in real difficult
traffic!!!!!!!!!
Agreed. Assertive is too assertive. I had to back down to average as well.
It seems like FSD graduated from the test route and now has to learn to drive on crowded city street. These drives in the city expose the flaws well that might go undetected on the typical test routes. If FSD is to be solved, it needs to be tested in tough environments.
I have same situation in my town, an intersection with angled lights. Every single update has run the same light.
True, oddly angled intersections are seemingly beyond FSD’s reasoning. Yet, a new teen driver would probably have no trouble figuring out which light applies to which lane, and where to stop. And, those left turns in front of traffic were ill advised, waiting only 10 more seconds, would have been completely safe. The look ahead reasoning of FSD isn’t quite there. Maybe, a new setting, “Limo Smooth”, is needed.
I think they just need more development time on those edge cases like unusual intersections. It will get there!
I wish they had a team of licensed limo drivers and had their driving assigned to the Chill setting.
I find 12.5.1.5 to be much smoother. I also had a try to run the red light issue. My other issues is that it still doesn’t recognize flashing lights in school zones tries to maintain speed. It also fails on one way bridges/roads where you’re supposed to take turns. Lane changes have regressed for me in that now I have more issues where it wants to get into right or left turn only lanes instead of going straight. Until it solves these “edge” cases robo-taxi will remain a dream.
Thanks. As always, great stuff. Your insight on the camera wiring harnesses are valuable. I think that will make it a no-go.
That being said. Tesla should only be obligated to upgrade your HW from 3 to 4 (if they decide to do so) if you already bought FSD before or will buy it to get the upgrade.
If you are not paying for FSD you are not entitled to the HW since you don't use the SW no matter what Tesla said about the HW.
I have had access to v12.5.1.5 on my 2020 MY now for 5 days and the improvement on v12.3.6 is NEXT LEVEL. I am SO impressed with it. My accelerator inputs are down by 90% and my frustration level by 95%. It still makes many mistakes BUT it's so good now that the issues don't bug me. It's the first version that makes me believe Tesla will solve autonomy. Even if HW3 can't reach SAE L5 autonomy, I think L4 is possible and for me that would be more than good enough. I am giddy every time I can go for a drive and use FSD exclusively now. With v12.3.6 my wife would ask me to not use it. Now she just wants me to not talk about how good it is 😂.
I used to feel v12.3.6 accelerated too hard in some cases. Now I am comfortable with it BECAUSE I am so much more comfortable with it. V12.5.1.5 is a total game changer for me. I cannot emphasize enough how dramatically better it is, even on highways (which is not E2E yet).
Again. Thanks for your effort in making these vids. I know it requires significant effort and patience.
Hope the RoboTaxi will have a softer suspension as FSD hits any and all marks on the roads in its direct path.
i love FSD 12.5.1.5 but there at times it feels a bit aggressive, it turns right too fast sometimes and wonder if it can see effectively oncoming car before doing a right… before it was creeping too slow…. also i had a red light issue… i took over too… overall still huge improvement to 12.3.6
I just got this update and I am noticing alot more phantom braking especially during intersections. Does anyone else have this problem? The unprotected lefts are significantly better with this build and also no more zig zagging between lanes.
Waiting for NYCity,...that will be the most TELLING test of FSD 👈🏾
Im convinced my verbal feedback notes after disengagement go nowhere and do nothing to change or improve the stuff FSD routinely F’s up.
i read on another forum a while back that they have some AI scrape thru transcriptions looking for keywords or if a certain location generates more interventions
I’m sure it’s not a placebo.
They use an LLM to automatically categorize the voice notes, then those categories are prioritized by how many people report them and how frequently they occur, and then that's what FSD is trained on next.
Thursday, August 29, 2024 ... Greetings. Intelligent people, truly intelligent people, say things and convey their thoughts as simply as possible, using as few words as possible to exchange ideas and/or information. PEACE!
My experience with the car taking a different rount than the the routing, is that the car is doing the wrong thing. I don't think the 2 systems are not thoroughly enough integrated.
Retrofits will happen when Level 5 is solved. That’s when the math will justify the expense. Until then I agree you. Probably something like hardware 7 that has built in cleaning for cameras.
Genuine question, but do we really believe that the FSD profiles have any effect on how it drives? I know before the "Auto Speed" option was made available, it did have a certain follow distance. But I personally have not noticed any difference in all 3 profiles.
2018 M3P FSD 12.4.3
4:20 - what kind of horrible road design is that?! Lol cars are just supposed to last minute merge in the middle of the intersection?
From my personal experience with HW3, I've noticed the cameras are the real culprit for lackluster performance. Two issues constantly stick out for me:
1) Sunlight has a huge effect - which is why the new hardware has a filter.
2) It has huge issues when it comes to steep incline or decline situations - so much to a point where at the apex, it "loses sight" and "understanding" of marker situation.
This version isn’t paused. More went out late yesterday and more will be going out. Not everything will be perfect right away. They need to get a stable release out, then they can work on small point fixes.
I received an update and was excited, but sadly it was just the summer update. It didn’t include 12.5.1.5…
the problem i have with the map data is that it 85% of the time takes me to an intersection where it would take me a minimum of 6 minutes to turn left on an arterial road then immediately right 100 feet later when It could route me over 2 streets to proceed through a light. today I tried it just to make sure and the arterial road was backed up several blocks and by the time it would have let up, the light where I would normally go to turns red and they stack up again.
this is a problem with all navigational gps systems since their invention, there is no stopped traffic at that intersection because nobody is stupid enough to attempt to use it.
Nice drive! Do you think there is a chance that Tesla may announce that HW3 cars will NEVER drive autonomously? You will have supervised FSD advantages, but not autonomous? If that happens, what would be the repercussions? Did you sign a disclaimer when you purchased that says Beta software MAY never be a fully released software? Of course, I hope you get fully autonomous self driving in your car!
im still waiting for it
So at 4:49, why did those 2 big trucks in front run the red light?
I’m loving 12.5 so far it’s been a game changer
Dang 20:20 almost rear end
That is nowhere near of being a read end lol
The thing about traffic lights is that we put them in because without them dumb humans would often drive into each other. Once all the cars are self-driving, we won't need them!
The hard stop around 20:18 is a great example of why cameras-only for the sensors is a bad idea. The black Mercedes in front was slightly angled when it changed lanes and therefore the image of the car was larger to the cameras. When the Mercedes straightened out, it appeared smaller to the cameras, so FSD thought the Mercedes was accelerating or at least maintaininf distance, when in fact it was slowing down hard. That's why it was a hard braking situation. Could have been alot worse if the situation was amplified with a greater initial lane change angle and harder stop.
Where did you hear rollout is paused?
My 12.3.6 hugs the right side of lane. Does your 12.5 always hug the left?
I'm dying for a version that stays in the center of the lane and doesn't drive like a chump.
Good vid
2:05 it's been my experience that FSD does NOT adhere to bus stop signs...
Where are you?
@@BlackTesla southern California
Driving past that pedestrian crossing at 32:21 would be a ticket in California. That is too close.
Felt too close for me too. "Timing" pedestrians like that is too assertive. Also, for comfort, at least in Chill or Average mode, it should reduce situations where it might have to jam on the brakes.
Did u leave tesla an audio note on that diagonsl intersection?
How is your auto speed? mind does not do aswell as last update.
Needs a few more 1's and 0's.
12.5.1.5 installed last night on my 2020 Model 3. First impressions- still biased towards the center line, still cannot "see" or that the obvious lane becomes a left turn only lane (arrows and a sign) and when the light turns green it tries to go straight ahead. The latest FSD on a HW4 car also fails here- FSD still sets too high a speed in a 35 zone (up to 43mph) but not on all roads. .5 seems smoother than the prior version, but still shows some sawing of the wheel when turning after a stop sign- not yet wife approved.
You need to tell her to “Suck it up, Buttercup” if she’s not letting you use it when she’s in the car with you!
@@LordStevieI expect that some would say that I have "the habit of command. "But I also understand that that style has its place. My wife and I have an equal voice, but not on all subjects. She says buy the car you want, and I say are you happy with this choice. That translates into buy the performance version if you like it, and on my side it means not using FSD all of the time (and maybe keeping her Lexus a bit longer). But if she said I really like the all wheel long range, well the only discussion would be about the color.
@@LordStevie Found the bachelor.
@@LordStevie Nah, this is a good benchmark. Is a passenger who is *not* an early adopter comfortable with the ride? I'm really looking forward to this.
Is it the best yet?
7:00: Who's bright idea was it to have a pothole every 5 feet? 🤦♂
10:00: Elon also said the HW4 computer won't fit in the space of the HW3. Remains to be seen if Tesla will truly honor their promise. There's a ton of wiggle-room in the definition of "FSD."
Interesting drive - would have been damn near perfect if not for 3 GLARING exceptions (running red, failing to recognize road closure, failing to pass double-parked car). Unfortunately, no amount of smooth sailing makes up for any of the 3 times it would have been stuck or dangerously breaking the law.
How long did it take you to feel comfortable allowing FSD to actual drive the vehicle. I’ve been using it on and off since 24 August 2024, and I’m getting more comfortable but still did not realize how soon I’m willing to take over. I’ll get there I suppose.
Took me about a full week to not be watching its every move and to have my blood pressure back to normal.
I have a 2023 Model Y long range. How do I know what hardware build I have? I am still on 12.3.6.
An easy way to know is to go into the Autopilot menu on the car and look for Park Assist. If you have an option between standard and Tesla Vision you have Hardware 3, if you don't or don't see the option at all then you have Hardware 4.
I don’t have any options to pick from nor do I have any sensors in the front or back of the car. It’s all Tesla vision. so, looks like I have hardware for build. No wonder it’s so slow coming out and why I’m still on 12.3.6.
Thanks for your great videos. Keep up the good work.
Just out of curiosity why does the yoke symbol go on and off in the beginning of the video?
FSD was briefly unavailable when I tried to activate it
Running red lights?? That's pretty bad ☹
It also cannot recognize “No turn on Red’ signs. So if there is no red arrow it will pause like at any red light or stop sign, and then try to make the turn even though signage makes it illegal
Your screen showing the back up camera is really distracting since we can’t see your drivers display. Model S/X really sucks for these kinds of video.
have those 'dead zones' been fixed yet?
Apparently yes.
What are dead zones in this case?
@@craigsilver8248 There was a problem when in some areas autopilot disengaged itself, but seems like it was fixed after fsd 12.3
@@user-wv1qq1wn4o Ah yes. I know of one in my area. The visualization also reverts to... pre-V10? (Super simple.) Is that the same for you?
@@craigsilver8248 Bro I don't even have a tesla😂
They won’t retrofit. They proved they can get this working. They already said no retrofit. It’s not needed anyway. AI3 is fine.
re map data, it sucks IMO compared to WAZE..on highway pathetic continuous speed limit adjustments (110 kmh to 100 kmh back to 110 then down to 80 then back to 110) it is junk and inexcusable. going under one bridge always causes a speed limit drop and hard braking..just junk
I still do not know why you don't use CHILL mode since you have been so upset for going to fast in several conditions. I run my car in CHILL MODE and do not ever experience your issues.
The man has no chill
School moms are entitled :) could have parked on the other side of the road but no no
Some people on X are saying this version is a 5 year regression, certainly does not seem that way with your video
Some people cannot tolerate anything against their will. Some people intentionally bad mouth Tesla!
It seems to have a wide variety of behavior. Seems to be much better in M3 and MY, but BT's experience in his MSP-HW3 is way better than ours in a 20MSLR+. Hard to know why. My first longer drive after the upgrade was simply atrocious. It has gotten a little better, but interventions have gone up at least 3x, not counting accelerator pushes, which are also required much more frequently; almost constantly. I hope we see rapid improvement.
Not sure how much environment plays. I'm on big wide TX thoroughfares. Should be much easier.
"chill", "average", and "assertive" settings do nothing at all, or next to nothing, IMO.
if not retrofit then give me my money back..HW3 was touted by Tesla as FSD and will not get there. give all HW3 owners who paid for FSD their money back..no excuses Tesla has failed miserably at achieving FSD with HW3...ps AI5 will not achieve FSD either, without a complete rethink..typical Musk failure almost there but never quite (AI5 will have radar imagine that)..vision is not enough, it fails in bad weather (when occluded)..they will need to rethink cameras, add radar, bring back sonar, etc. they can remove any blog they want but their history is there
halted the rollout..sounds like another aborted rollout like 12.4..bigger question is why can't Tesla improve the highway GSD (goofy self-driving), which i suspect is due to fundamental technical limitations in both hardware and software..forget tesla touting their ASS, how bout some real fundamental improvement.. since v11 the only real improvement i see is that goofy continuous useless nag is gone (i got camera "occluded" on every hour long drive), the next only improvement i expect is lessened nag if i ever get above 12.3.6..the round town stuff is always similar but different...FYI "driver takeover" means it is not FSD (irrespective of version), owners should stop making excuses for continuous Tesla failure.
Tesla may not want to retrofit but they’ll have to because of Elon’s pumping promises- he now is trying to cover his tracks from his the initial hype. Elon’s a BS artist, it’s finally catching up with him
BTW I’ve had FSD in 4 cars starting from 2019- I still have my original 2019 M3P
looks like a decent wave went out last night, at least theres still hope 🥹
Where did you hear about the rollout being paused? So tired of being stuck on 12.3.6🫠
Idk, today they rolled about 50 updates.
They actually rolled out a pretty big 12.5.1.5 wave last night (~500 per Teslafi). I got it!. Yay!
@@joez9162 it’s not paused. More will come today Thursday.
I just got 2024.26.7, which has Spring update but still has FSD 12.3.6. So, I DO believe 12.5.1.5 isn't going wide, pending further refinement.
Do you have software updates set to “advanced’ in the software settings?
🥳❤💯💢💥💫👍