Good conclusion. I like that a lot. 95% of NV is moving, 5% is shooting. Don't bankrupt yourself on the laser. My 2 cents: The mawl is the best LAM at night The Raid XE is the best LAM during the day. Which sounds silly, but for rifles that are "general purpose" the mawl sorta gets in the way a lot, and ends up taking a lot of impacts as it's the leading surface. All lasers suck at holding zero. But my experience, the MAWL is particularly bad with micro zero shift because it just gets smacked so regularly. Add the weight and bulk, and the raid really does feel comfy. I don't know shit about the NGAL because Im a dirty yucky civ that is to irresponsible to own such a thing. But when it's dark, man, the ergos of the mawl are unbeatable.
That’s an interesting perspective. I haven’t seen any deviation on my MAWLs zero, even after years of owning it. But I can see the potential for shifts given it is the leading surface. In general I prefer box style lasers. Would love it if BE Meyers would make a MAWL lite. Shave some weight off and drop the price a bit.
While I like my mawl, like desert said, I’d prefer it in more of an NGAL style. I don’t like that I can’t use it ambidextrously without running a tape switch off the back.
If you use the diffuser cap, it will reduce the power on the NGAL. The caps aren't just to protect the lenses and keep dust and debris out, it can also reduce the power when you need it to be lower than the "low" setting. Some lasers come with multiple diffuser caps that can project different patterns, to make your laser more identifiable from others around you.
I'm gonna buy a basic PVS-14 because I can afford it, and I'll get a laser down the line. That's as far as I'm gonna go with this. To much potential money to be wasted that could be better served with so many other things.
@@GuacIsExtra99 I've been really into guns and shit since I was a kid, but I'm not a gear hoarder. I don't need 10 different rifles, five plate carriers, 7 chest rigs and the like. If that's your thing cool, but I'm very much a I'm gonna buy 1 or 2 things and stick with em. If I wanted to hoard gear, I could have been doing it for a very long time.
Blows my mind these companies can sell a $3k laser that is still lackluster in performance and durability. The night vision market is a joke because of inflated prices and goverment contract cushions. I like buying american but i hope holosun dips their toe more into the market like they did with optics to finally shake up the market a bit
@@DZ4295DBW maybe western companies should stop making god awful and horribly overpriced products then. It's not my fault the only good laser units are vaporware or cost over 3 grand or both.
I've "hypothetically" had several IR devices of both civ & FP over the last few years. Two PEQ 2's ( 2 & a 2Alpha), One LA-15, Six DBAL A3 FP & 2 Civvy class 1's. Two DBAL D2's, 3 or 4 DBAL I2's in various setups like vis red or green, illuminator or not etc. Holosun LS321G & LS117IR. I think that's all. Point is I ended up just settling on a Class 1 DBAL I2 Red Vis & IR (now discontinued) & Surefire M620V w/ KM2C head. All of them fell short in one way or another. I'll eventually give the RAID XE a try along with the MAWL & see what all the hype is about but I bet I just end up selling them off too after seeing this vid along with others.... EDIT to add BrassFacts talked me into ordering a SOMOGEAR 15 to try out so add that to the pile LOL Thanks for the comparison sir!!
So far I’ve been having good luck with my OTAL-C IR only, and using a Surefire Vampire KM2-C head, I’ve conjoined them via the Unity TAPS sync system. Has been doing well out to around 150 yards.
I have this exact setup I got the otal used for $450 and vamp head for about $200. Using the unitly lightning. Whole setup under $700 for decent illum you can beat it
Informative video. The Mawl C1+ is the only good laser that’s even available to civilians so it’s not much of a debate. Unless you want the D2 chonk. RAID XEs might as well not exist to civilians and sane with full power units. And no reason to think OGLs will be available soon. The DIR-V the only other intriguing option right now.
For anyone considering a FP PEQ15. The FP DBAL A2 is better in almost every objective measure including a metal body, more powerful laser and illuminator and a cleaner ir illum beam. When tested side by side everyone out that night said the DBAL was leaps and bounds better
Good points, although even if you only use it a couple times a month for training, the capability is a big plus, especially if you're on Property and have predators/ pests to wack.
While being a solid performer I believe the D2 to have more cons than pros. Durability, ergonomics, signature, etc make it a poor buy relative to a full power PEQ-15.
I always came to the conclusion that civ ir illuminators just suck completely after 50 yards, so making any builds around that range and knowing the capability is good enough. for longer range a standalone laser might be considered
But do you think most people can train and achieve good shoots beyond 50 -60 yds?, I mean, i think that distance is enough for PID with nvg and get good impacts without spending thousands and thousands of dollars. Thats my opinion. What do you thinkl?
@@PETRAS_ yeah if you have the means and capability to train that distance go for it. but as for IR illuminators without going full power your options are limited. this is why supplemental thermal and maybe rifle mounted nvg's paired woth scopes might come on handy. but to throw out a tight illumation circle that far is asking alot from a civil laser. plus at that point you might want to reconsider what your mission objective is. if the enemy has night vision or if this really is a fight you can realistically win
@@jamesstewart9970 who told you mid October? Wilcox does NOT give out any timeframes so if they told you that it was a lie and I wouldn’t trust them to ever deliver.
If you’re planning on weapon mounting it, don’t. Juice isn’t worth the squeeze and PVS-14s aren’t known to handle that recoil well. I’d recommend investing in a T2/EXPS3 and you’ll be fine
Depending on your rifle setup/caliber, you could add a bunch of blems to your PVS-14 in short order due to recoil. Some people do it without issue, others have blems immediately. Not worth the risk, IMO. There are some housings that “fortify” the tube and increase its recoil rating (Knights I believe) though.
What I wonder: how come the cost of those laser/illuminators is so high. I can get lasers with 10x the power than those shipped from china for about 200 eur. Yes i am aware of R&D, testing, proper drivers/components, QC etc. etc., but surely with all that taken into account they can't be that outlandish. It's not my intention to nag, it's is more of an inquisitive statement: Is there someone who took one of those apart and discussed/explained why they are so expensive? If not idk if we could call sytropyro (: Great video, cheers from GER
I'm not an engineer, but I can say that R&D is a significant factor. Additionally, these companies must charge the civilian market no less than they do the military. While units like the Somogear PEQs are compelling at their price point, they don’t handle 5.56 recoil very well. In short, you get what you pay for.
The reason is because their pricing is inflated due to how government and private entities buy them in bulk contracts What costs them a few hundred dollars to make, they will sell to civilians for thousands, as that is what the military/LE will pay for them.
Making them be able to zero and hold zero under recoil and temperature/pressure changes is difficult. Also, illuminators that don't get regulated by FDA are more expensive/complicated to make. And lastly, nothing is cheap with nigh vison lol... if someone could make a cheap unit that works, it would be out by now.
@@snowfa1155 I figured anything with nightvision is expensive i have a pair of dtnvs with elbit xlsh wp tubes. It is warrented ofc, just that the price imo could be less even taken into consideration points you elaborated upon
Let's see if that cheap china laser can handle some SCAR recoil. Lots of MAWLs, NGALs, RAIDs, etc riding on SCARs with no issues from recoil damage or losing zero.
After owning several civ powered lasers I sold them all and ended up sticking with the mawl on my go-to and the holosun lasers on my training rifles. The mawl is awesome. The holosun lasers do everything the other civ lasers do, but for less money.
I try to tell people getting a FP laser for the laser itself is silly. You will have a greater signature, your laser will bloom more which means you have a less refined aiming point. And greater risk of damaging tubes. The illuminator is the important part. I really haven't found myself in a situation where my MAWL C1+ ran out of horsepower. Maybe if I was running it in conjunction with a clip on NV device on a long range rifle.
I just bought a brand new Ngal, I bought it because l3 rep said Ngal is scar 17 rated. However I can’t find any info confirming this online. Do you have any info on this? I’m scared to use it on my scar so I’m gonna use it only for my ar right now. If it’s not scar rated I’m going to have to buy another 308 rifle for my night vision build. I don’t want to buy a Navsea peq15 either because it’s unibtanium costs like 6-10k depending on condition and vendor for old tech also which is crazy to me.
I would say anyone of us who are in the sub $1600 market we are Effed. The Duval a3/D2 are our real only options unfortunately. Getting FP lasers aren’t really an option cuz you’re gonna get a POS that you can’t fix if it breaks. As much as it sucks the stringers are our options. Even mawls are way too much for most of us. I have dual tubes and an a3 and a d2 it’s better than nothing, it’s lacking. But unless I can start making 20k a month none of this is applicable to 99% of us. When I did used to make 12k take home my money still didn’t go to these kinds of things because I was paying for a house. Hoping the OGL and others go civ market and that there’s more competitors in the market that start coming out for better products and more competition for lower prices.
I think I’ll just get an aluminum bodied full power sotac perst4 for 105$ that I pot DIY from eBay and some separate 80$ ir illuminator 🤣🤣 MAYBE I’ll get a 400$ somogear ngal
I was looking into this stuff because of night trekking and I don't want to be running into stuff like psycho's or other wild animals the middle of the woods as crazy as it sounds. I know your going over the light and laser part, but what about the Ir light and laser mode part of it because I need booth. So what would be best for that? I don't want to be running the light it's self unless I need it as I would only use the ir light mode instead while moving around and same for the laser. Don't want to broad cast my position. Any suggestions?
I had issues w/ raid xe software. It's still in the hands of WIlcox 2 months later. I would have gone with an NGAL if I could do it over. Also, why not add the perst 3 in to your reviews? It's a solid performer. And if you have any buddies who want to sell their nods, please let me know.
I've also got that hexagon pattern on my RAID Xe that shows up depending on the focus knob. After you got it back from Wilcox was it removed entirely or less pronounced?
It has a very powerful illuminator but you can’t adjust the divergence. It has a cqb filter that ships with it for close engagements. Also the laser WILL NOT lose zero. And for what it’s worth it’s very light but is made of some kind of blend of supposed high temp resistant, strong polymers. Easy to use layout/ergos but brand new to the market so not tested thoroughly.
Love the no muss no fuss presentation. So tired of the over the top high production stuff that adds no value to what I am looking for- good scoop. And as a Marine my attention span isn't great unless it involves breaking things.
I can just hear it now. "You get what you pay for." BS. The NV market, right now, is like the red dot market was over a decade ago: Cheap garbage from China that wasn't fit for airsoft and the Bushnell TRS-25 at the bottom and then ... nothing, nothing, nothing- $1000 Aimpoint. That market has completely filled up and there is something for everyone at virtually every price point. Lasers are almost entirely for the government customer - let's get that straight. L3-Harris and BAE systems are not legally allowed to sell you and I those products for less than they sell them to the govt. The result is you pay the golden toilet seat tax - don't @me with your R&D nonsense, there is a huge amount of graft and "price plus plus" involved in every govt. transaction and if you're convinced otherwise... well you're convinced. Recognize that. These are LASER POINTERS, not lightsabers. There is so much info out there about zero shifting $2000 -$4000+ laser pointers that anyone with the ability to critically think should be asking themselves how these companies get away with it (because they sell to the govt. duh). If this was a civilian only product, they'd have been "yelp'd" into bankruptcy with the amount of bad reviews they'd have gotten by now. How can it be, that in an industry where the concept of zero shift is practically tattooed into the minds of every consumer and mfg. we still have products that cost several times what a basic AR costs that can't shoot straight? In order to own any of this stuff, you must accept the following: This was never for you. You don't really matter as a customer to the OEM The actual customer is ok over paying by a significant margin and so it goes that you must as well Government contract items will always be suspect to a certain extent. (quality or cost or anything in between) If the originating contract has left out something you would have liked (features or performance) you will do without it. Any OEM that has provided a "civilian" version of a govt product will still charge you an arm and a leg for it Any OEM that has provided a civilian only product will use the cheapest materials possible for that product (3D printed plastics etc.). And the punchline is this: even after you take this into account, USA is still number one. Man, what a s#$% show it is out there. P.S. Capitalism is a superpower, not night vision.
I disagree on the DBAL-A3. Tightening the beam allows you to get better performance at a short distance. It's way better than the ATPIAL-C. I do agree that the A3 is anemic and not a very good device, but its at least serviceable where as the ATPIAL-C should only ever be acquired for clone builds. And as others have said, the DBAL-D2 is a bulky bastard, but its performance is undeniable and its price is right.
If your a civilian, the answer is none of them. Save money put together a good work bench and learn actual valuable life skill. It allows you to sustain the hobby at a much lower cost and over longer period. Allow you to produce match grade ammo at lower cost and enjoy the hobby of shooting for much more than just buying cheap ammo which still probably cost just as much. And even in the SHTF fantasy of yours play out you can last much longer and offer more value to community than the tactitard who spent time make belief.
NV lasers and any kind of active IR illumination are about as pointless for night ops as flashlights. As NV has become so cheap, anyone involved in an engagement will at least have some cheap Chinese goggles and be able to see you tromping through the bush lighting up everything in your path. Then, If you start firing on their comrades, your cool IR laser shows them exactly where the rounds are coming from. NV is fine, just don't use it in conjunction with IR illuminators or lasers. Use NV passively in conjunction with thermal. PEQ's were cool back in the GWOT days, when we knew the opfor didn't have night capabilities. Today, different story.
I strap an IZLID 1000P to the bottom of my mk18, as Brad Meyers intended. It is physically longer then my 10.3” barrel, it handles like a 203, but having a laser/illum that is sub 1 watt is actually laughable and embarrassing, you are going to die.❤
NGAL all day. VCSEL for one, but form factor and reliability are not inherent to the LA5 UHP. IIRC, the UHP has half the lifetime of use than a regular LA5B, this is due to the added power.
It's sad that China is making comparable products for 1/10th the money. It shows how much the military industrial complex effects prices. If these weren't restricted to mil/le the price would be so much lower.
If the comparable units you’re referring to are the somogear PEQs then you’re mistaken. Units that disassemble themselves, let alone lose zero are not comparable
@@DimDesertNights The newest version of somogears are nice. In the past month they completely remade the housing. They have been incrementally improving them for over a year. Of course they're not perfect. I modded mine and reinforced the solder and covered the pcb in liquid tape as an insulator. It's run great. The illuminator on it is so much cleaner than my real atipal. Is it on my main HD/shtf rifle? No. However, I'm personally really excited for their new Ngal knockoff. If they can make it reliable for double of what they're charging now, that's a win for everyone. It's just sad the people have to resort to buying from china or the grey market to get what they need. It's insanity people can't own a laser (because of eye safety)... that mounts on a gun. Awesome video though man. Definitely agree with the illuminator being the most important part of the system. Also, loved the Sig callout.
Chad meme discusses infrared aiming technology
Gun tube tony robins vibe.
Good conclusion. I like that a lot. 95% of NV is moving, 5% is shooting. Don't bankrupt yourself on the laser.
My 2 cents:
The mawl is the best LAM at night
The Raid XE is the best LAM during the day.
Which sounds silly, but for rifles that are "general purpose" the mawl sorta gets in the way a lot, and ends up taking a lot of impacts as it's the leading surface.
All lasers suck at holding zero. But my experience, the MAWL is particularly bad with micro zero shift because it just gets smacked so regularly. Add the weight and bulk, and the raid really does feel comfy.
I don't know shit about the NGAL because Im a dirty yucky civ that is to irresponsible to own such a thing.
But when it's dark, man, the ergos of the mawl are unbeatable.
That’s an interesting perspective. I haven’t seen any deviation on my MAWLs zero, even after years of owning it. But I can see the potential for shifts given it is the leading surface. In general I prefer box style lasers.
Would love it if BE Meyers would make a MAWL lite. Shave some weight off and drop the price a bit.
@@DimDesertNightswhat rail do you have it on? I assume the more secure rails dont lose zero as easy
Rail flex is a valid factor.
KAC URX4
@@DimDesertNightsShaving weight off would more than likely equate to reduced durability.
While I like my mawl, like desert said, I’d prefer it in more of an NGAL style.
I don’t like that I can’t use it ambidextrously without running a tape switch off the back.
DBAL D2 should have been in the lineup, trading bulk/weight for some solid illumination, "decent" pricing, and Class 1 ease of purchase.
Wish I had one on hand at the time of filming. But personally I’m not a huge fan of the D2. I do understand why others like it though.
For it is the only answer.
Bad form factor but MAWL performance and you can find them for $1200 on secondary market. Probably best choice without breaking the bank
Where tf are you finding used mawls for $1200 send me that
@@SuperXrayDoc He's talking about $1200 DBAL D2s. Taking size out of the equation, it does perform as well as a MAWL C1.
I want the hour long video with all the details. Thank you.
If you use the diffuser cap, it will reduce the power on the NGAL. The caps aren't just to protect the lenses and keep dust and debris out, it can also reduce the power when you need it to be lower than the "low" setting. Some lasers come with multiple diffuser caps that can project different patterns, to make your laser more identifiable from others around you.
Fantastic breakdown, extremely valuable to any person that isn’t an idiot.
Absolutely love the discussion and the call to action at the end. Chad energy there
Most honest review I’ve seen, dropped some truth bombs! Great stuff thanks for taking the time to make this vid
I'm gonna buy a basic PVS-14 because I can afford it, and I'll get a laser down the line. That's as far as I'm gonna go with this. To much potential money to be wasted that could be better served with so many other things.
You say that now and you’ll be surprised how much gear you’ll have a month from now lmao
@@GuacIsExtra99 I've been really into guns and shit since I was a kid, but I'm not a gear hoarder. I don't need 10 different rifles, five plate carriers, 7 chest rigs and the like. If that's your thing cool, but I'm very much a I'm gonna buy 1 or 2 things and stick with em. If I wanted to hoard gear, I could have been doing it for a very long time.
Cries in 15k later after getting my pvs14 😭
Blows my mind these companies can sell a $3k laser that is still lackluster in performance and durability. The night vision market is a joke because of inflated prices and goverment contract cushions. I like buying american but i hope holosun dips their toe more into the market like they did with optics to finally shake up the market a bit
If holosun made a unit with a VCSEL illuminator they would absolutely sweep the market.
@@carbon8edYeah but you'd be doing R&D/T&E for the PLA(N). Lol. Swear American consumers seriously don't think.
@@DZ4295DBW maybe western companies should stop making god awful and horribly overpriced products then. It's not my fault the only good laser units are vaporware or cost over 3 grand or both.
I've "hypothetically" had several IR devices of both civ & FP over the last few years. Two PEQ 2's ( 2 & a 2Alpha), One LA-15, Six DBAL A3 FP & 2 Civvy class 1's. Two DBAL D2's, 3 or 4 DBAL I2's in various setups like vis red or green, illuminator or not etc. Holosun LS321G & LS117IR. I think that's all. Point is I ended up just settling on a Class 1 DBAL I2 Red Vis & IR (now discontinued) & Surefire M620V w/ KM2C head. All of them fell short in one way or another. I'll eventually give the RAID XE a try along with the MAWL & see what all the hype is about but I bet I just end up selling them off too after seeing this vid along with others.... EDIT to add BrassFacts talked me into ordering a SOMOGEAR 15 to try out so add that to the pile LOL
Thanks for the comparison sir!!
So far I’ve been having good luck with my OTAL-C IR only, and using a Surefire Vampire KM2-C head, I’ve conjoined them via the Unity TAPS sync system. Has been doing well out to around 150 yards.
Definitely an effective budget setup. Permitting the TAPS is actually in sync
dont let hop see this comment
I have this exact setup I got the otal used for $450 and vamp head for about $200. Using the unitly lightning. Whole setup under $700 for decent illum you can beat it
Ngal defuser caps are for toning the laser down. Defuser on the pointer with open illuminator is the way to go
Crazy informative video man, appreciate all the effort collecting this info must have taken. Sub'd!
great video, wished you had a few more civilian options like the DIR-V and the D2
Informative video. The Mawl C1+ is the only good laser that’s even available to civilians so it’s not much of a debate. Unless you want the D2 chonk. RAID XEs might as well not exist to civilians and sane with full power units. And no reason to think OGLs will be available soon.
The DIR-V the only other intriguing option right now.
Pretty much
Well done thanks for the shout out dude
Also, the MAWL in short range or "room illuminator" is pretty hard to beat in a structure.
For anyone considering a FP PEQ15. The FP DBAL A2 is better in almost every objective measure including a metal body, more powerful laser and illuminator and a cleaner ir illum beam. When tested side by side everyone out that night said the DBAL was leaps and bounds better
In my experience DBAL illuminators are worse than PEQs. They all vary unit to unit.
Dbals are not very durable
Great video good run down and rating on equipment.🎱
"buy a shot timer" is absolutely the best advice. Accountability and measurable performance > credit card debt.
Good points, although even if you only use it a couple times a month for training, the capability is a big plus, especially if you're on Property and have predators/ pests to wack.
D2 is the only answer.
Hear hear!
What are you poor?
@@zokhrozzWoomzy and your not?
My Perst/Kiji combo spliced into the Unity Axon work pretty well. I just wish that button on the Axon was momentary only.
Been waiting for a video like this. Good stuff!
Another fantastic video! Thank you!
I was surprised you didn't add the DBAL-D2.
Good advice at the end.
Great Vid! What about the Steiner DBAL-D2 class 1 with the IR LED? Thanks!
While being a solid performer I believe the D2 to have more cons than pros.
Durability, ergonomics, signature, etc make it a poor buy relative to a full power PEQ-15.
@@DimDesertNights I appreciate the insight! I wasn't aware of those issues. Thanks!
I always came to the conclusion that civ ir illuminators just suck completely after 50 yards, so making any builds around that range and knowing the capability is good enough. for longer range a standalone laser might be considered
But do you think most people can train and achieve good shoots beyond 50 -60 yds?, I mean, i think that distance is enough for PID with nvg and get good impacts without spending thousands and thousands of dollars. Thats my opinion. What do you thinkl?
@@PETRAS_ yeah if you have the means and capability to train that distance go for it. but as for IR illuminators without going full power your options are limited. this is why supplemental thermal and maybe rifle mounted nvg's paired woth scopes might come on handy. but to throw out a tight illumation circle that far is asking alot from a civil laser. plus at that point you might want to reconsider what your mission objective is. if the enemy has night vision or if this really is a fight you can realistically win
Great info! Can you do a video comparing different rifle zeroes? 25 yd, 36, 50, etc.
Just seeing this and glad I placed an order for a raid xe last week! Looks fantastic!
Let us know how it runs when you get it in 4 years
Mid October so about a month and a half out.
@@jamesstewart9970 who told you mid October? Wilcox does NOT give out any timeframes so if they told you that it was a lie and I wouldn’t trust them to ever deliver.
@@jamesstewart9970you got it yet bro?
Great video, I like the last part the best. I think I'll get a good picatinny mount for my PVS14 that's been used for an hour in the last five years
If you’re planning on weapon mounting it, don’t. Juice isn’t worth the squeeze and PVS-14s aren’t known to handle that recoil well.
I’d recommend investing in a T2/EXPS3 and you’ll be fine
Depending on your rifle setup/caliber, you could add a bunch of blems to your PVS-14 in short order due to recoil. Some people do it without issue, others have blems immediately. Not worth the risk, IMO. There are some housings that “fortify” the tube and increase its recoil rating (Knights I believe) though.
Good content brother…but for Gods sakes, less words! Get to it! Still subscribed. ✌️
I just did a survey on your RUclips channel All👍👍👍
Villain weapon works lense cover is a must for the atpial c for it to be useable IMO.
Excellent - Thanks
If we could just get something that uses the MAWL-C tech without the price, although it might not be possible.
I hope you can review Holosun newest IRis. I do have BE Meyer MAWAL. I just want smaller one for my B&T TP9. Thank you very much !
What I wonder: how come the cost of those laser/illuminators is so high. I can get lasers with 10x the power than those shipped from china for about 200 eur. Yes i am aware of R&D, testing, proper drivers/components, QC etc. etc., but surely with all that taken into account they can't be that outlandish. It's not my intention to nag, it's is more of an inquisitive statement: Is there someone who took one of those apart and discussed/explained why they are so expensive? If not idk if we could call sytropyro (:
Great video, cheers from GER
I'm not an engineer, but I can say that R&D is a significant factor.
Additionally, these companies must charge the civilian market no less than they do the military.
While units like the Somogear PEQs are compelling at their price point, they don’t handle 5.56 recoil very well. In short, you get what you pay for.
The reason is because their pricing is inflated due to how government and private entities buy them in bulk contracts
What costs them a few hundred dollars to make, they will sell to civilians for thousands, as that is what the military/LE will pay for them.
Making them be able to zero and hold zero under recoil and temperature/pressure changes is difficult. Also, illuminators that don't get regulated by FDA are more expensive/complicated to make. And lastly, nothing is cheap with nigh vison lol... if someone could make a cheap unit that works, it would be out by now.
@@snowfa1155 I figured anything with nightvision is expensive i have a pair of dtnvs with elbit xlsh wp tubes. It is warrented ofc, just that the price imo could be less even taken into consideration points you elaborated upon
Let's see if that cheap china laser can handle some SCAR recoil. Lots of MAWLs, NGALs, RAIDs, etc riding on SCARs with no issues from recoil damage or losing zero.
After owning several civ powered lasers I sold them all and ended up sticking with the mawl on my go-to and the holosun lasers on my training rifles. The mawl is awesome. The holosun lasers do everything the other civ lasers do, but for less money.
Hey there,
How do you feel about the Holosun units? Thanks!
I try to tell people getting a FP laser for the laser itself is silly. You will have a greater signature, your laser will bloom more which means you have a less refined aiming point. And greater risk of damaging tubes. The illuminator is the important part. I really haven't found myself in a situation where my MAWL C1+ ran out of horsepower. Maybe if I was running it in conjunction with a clip on NV device on a long range rifle.
Didnt old cam corders have night vision?
So why have we come so far but now restricted to tubes where you can only see straight ahead?
When it comes out next year, please compare the eotech OGL (civilian) to the Civilian RAID Xe please! 🙏
>next year
HAHAHA
I have a wide spectrum of lam devices and gun chad has it right
I have a raid xe and I have the same hexagon honeycomb thing in the center of the illuminator
Make more videos. This is a threat.
I just bought a brand new Ngal, I bought it because l3 rep said Ngal is scar 17 rated. However I can’t find any info confirming this online. Do you have any info on this? I’m scared to use it on my scar so I’m gonna use it only for my ar right now. If it’s not scar rated I’m going to have to buy another 308 rifle for my night vision build. I don’t want to buy a Navsea peq15 either because it’s unibtanium costs like 6-10k depending on condition and vendor for old tech also which is crazy to me.
Excellent
Still have that atpial? Lemme get it if your hands brother
Where is the best place to aquire a MIL SPEC full power pew 15 or 16?
I would say anyone of us who are in the sub $1600 market we are Effed. The Duval a3/D2 are our real only options unfortunately. Getting FP lasers aren’t really an option cuz you’re gonna get a POS that you can’t fix if it breaks. As much as it sucks the stringers are our options. Even mawls are way too much for most of us. I have dual tubes and an a3 and a d2 it’s better than nothing, it’s lacking. But unless I can start making 20k a month none of this is applicable to 99% of us. When I did used to make 12k take home my money still didn’t go to these kinds of things because I was paying for a house. Hoping the OGL and others go civ market and that there’s more competitors in the market that start coming out for better products and more competition for lower prices.
Hate to be the bearer of bad news but the OGL’s current MSRP is $3,000
@@DimDesertNights yeah I saw, I’m just hoping more and more companies hit the civ market and there’s better tech for better more competitive pricing
I think I’ll just get an aluminum bodied full power sotac perst4 for 105$ that I pot DIY from eBay and some separate 80$ ir illuminator 🤣🤣
MAYBE I’ll get a 400$ somogear ngal
I was looking into this stuff because of night trekking and I don't want to be running into stuff like psycho's or other wild animals the middle of the woods as crazy as it sounds. I know your going over the light and laser part, but what about the Ir light and laser mode part of it because I need booth. So what would be best for that? I don't want to be running the light it's self unless I need it as I would only use the ir light mode instead while moving around and same for the laser. Don't want to broad cast my position. Any suggestions?
19:57 Way to throw sig under a bus 😂
Ls321?
I had issues w/ raid xe software. It's still in the hands of WIlcox 2 months later. I would have gone with an NGAL if I could do it over. Also, why not add the perst 3 in to your reviews? It's a solid performer. And if you have any buddies who want to sell their nods, please let me know.
What were the issues?
I've also got that hexagon pattern on my RAID Xe that shows up depending on the focus knob. After you got it back from Wilcox was it removed entirely or less pronounced?
It was removed. You should send yours in
The noise my wallet is making while watching this video is the super troopers line: "Please no."
The rail max laser will work and they are 100? 50? I have 2 sitting around
Designate ir-v from USNV is Vcsel tech coming in at around $1,800
It has a very powerful illuminator but you can’t adjust the divergence. It has a cqb filter that ships with it for close engagements. Also the laser WILL NOT lose zero. And for what it’s worth it’s very light but is made of some kind of blend of supposed high temp resistant, strong polymers. Easy to use layout/ergos but brand new to the market so not tested thoroughly.
Love the no muss no fuss presentation. So tired of the over the top high production stuff that adds no value to what I am looking for- good scoop. And as a Marine my attention span isn't great unless it involves breaking things.
What are your thoughts on the Steiner CQB-L and an Illuminator such as a Surefire Vampire or Kiji?
They’re unreliable and leave a lot to be desired. Your money is better spent on a peq15
I can just hear it now. "You get what you pay for." BS. The NV market, right now, is like the red dot market was over a decade ago: Cheap garbage from China that wasn't fit for airsoft and the Bushnell TRS-25 at the bottom and then ... nothing, nothing, nothing- $1000 Aimpoint. That market has completely filled up and there is something for everyone at virtually every price point.
Lasers are almost entirely for the government customer - let's get that straight. L3-Harris and BAE systems are not legally allowed to sell you and I those products for less than they sell them to the govt. The result is you pay the golden toilet seat tax - don't @me with your R&D nonsense, there is a huge amount of graft and "price plus plus" involved in every govt. transaction and if you're convinced otherwise... well you're convinced. Recognize that.
These are LASER POINTERS, not lightsabers. There is so much info out there about zero shifting $2000 -$4000+ laser pointers that anyone with the ability to critically think should be asking themselves how these companies get away with it (because they sell to the govt. duh). If this was a civilian only product, they'd have been "yelp'd" into bankruptcy with the amount of bad reviews they'd have gotten by now.
How can it be, that in an industry where the concept of zero shift is practically tattooed into the minds of every consumer and mfg. we still have products that cost several times what a basic AR costs that can't shoot straight?
In order to own any of this stuff, you must accept the following:
This was never for you.
You don't really matter as a customer to the OEM
The actual customer is ok over paying by a significant margin and so it goes that you must as well
Government contract items will always be suspect to a certain extent. (quality or cost or anything in between)
If the originating contract has left out something you would have liked (features or performance) you will do without it.
Any OEM that has provided a "civilian" version of a govt product will still charge you an arm and a leg for it
Any OEM that has provided a civilian only product will use the cheapest materials possible for that product (3D printed plastics etc.).
And the punchline is this: even after you take this into account, USA is still number one. Man, what a s#$% show it is out there.
P.S. Capitalism is a superpower, not night vision.
I disagree on the DBAL-A3. Tightening the beam allows you to get better performance at a short distance. It's way better than the ATPIAL-C. I do agree that the A3 is anemic and not a very good device, but its at least serviceable where as the ATPIAL-C should only ever be acquired for clone builds. And as others have said, the DBAL-D2 is a bulky bastard, but its performance is undeniable and its price is right.
where can I get a new peq 15 like the one shown in this video as a civilian.
2,200$ new old stock full power peq 15? what am i missing here?
😅Nice video but I can see I’m definitely out of my league. Damn these prices are high lol
So does everyone just hate the USNV DIR-v at this point?
Never used it
This video is kind of moot cuz most people can't get NGALs and Wilcox since they're only made in HP for Mil/LE
Why do you have these ir lasers if you don’t have nods? Youre borrowing your friends?
If your a civilian, the answer is none of them. Save money put together a good work bench and learn actual valuable life skill. It allows you to sustain the hobby at a much lower cost and over longer period. Allow you to produce match grade ammo at lower cost and enjoy the hobby of shooting for much more than just buying cheap ammo which still probably cost just as much. And even in the SHTF fantasy of yours play out you can last much longer and offer more value to community than the tactitard who spent time make belief.
all onboard illumination suc k compared to a surefire vampire.
somogear PEQ is the only option for me
NV lasers and any kind of active IR illumination are about as pointless for night ops as flashlights. As NV has become so cheap, anyone involved in an engagement will at least have some cheap Chinese goggles and be able to see you tromping through the bush lighting up everything in your path. Then, If you start firing on their comrades, your cool IR laser shows them exactly where the rounds are coming from. NV is fine, just don't use it in conjunction with IR illuminators or lasers. Use NV passively in conjunction with thermal. PEQ's were cool back in the GWOT days, when we knew the opfor didn't have night capabilities. Today, different story.
No warning for poors not to watch?! Lol thanks for the info!
what do you think about ops core?
I’m a big fan of their amps and carbon bump SF.
@@DimDesertNights Thanks for the answer. I believe that today Ops Core is the best product on the market
Ngal best. If you have to get a civ, mawl
My guy, what do you do for a living to afford all these devices? I need to know so I can do it lol..
1/6 are mine lol. I’m just a regular dude who has good friends
Oh this is easy… the one that holds a zero on 300 blackout
CTF-2 or raid xe
Raid XE, if you have 3,000$ to blow on a laser box.
CTF-2 does the job acceptably for a fraction of the cost
Are you mil or prior?
Forgot about Holosun 😂🥲
Man i thought you might talk about the peq 2, it seems like a pretty good option if you don't mind the size
Each example featured here is just a reminder that I need NODs of my own
NODs are far from a “need” imo. Tons of fun though
I strap an IZLID 1000P to the bottom of my mk18, as Brad Meyers intended. It is physically longer then my 10.3” barrel, it handles like a 203, but having a laser/illum that is sub 1 watt is actually laughable and embarrassing, you are going to die.❤
More like how much laser/ illuminator can I afford
You keep using the term "PID" what is that?
Positively identify
@@DimDesertNights cool thanks
I own night vision and lasers because chicks dig that, you know? I'm just here for the ladies....
He keeps mentioning used lasers. Where does one buy a used laser?
plebbit, tacswap, arfcom, etc
Perst 4 ?
Dude looks like young maasad ayoob 😂
UHP LA5 vs NGAL.
NGAL all day. VCSEL for one, but form factor and reliability are not inherent to the LA5 UHP. IIRC, the UHP has half the lifetime of use than a regular LA5B, this is due to the added power.
None, because they would tell the CURRENT enemy exactly where I am.
Which can you “afford”
GigaChad over here saying social media clout isn’t important pfft gtfo
It's sad that China is making comparable products for 1/10th the money. It shows how much the military industrial complex effects prices. If these weren't restricted to mil/le the price would be so much lower.
If the comparable units you’re referring to are the somogear PEQs then you’re mistaken. Units that disassemble themselves, let alone lose zero are not comparable
@@DimDesertNights The newest version of somogears are nice. In the past month they completely remade the housing. They have been incrementally improving them for over a year. Of course they're not perfect. I modded mine and reinforced the solder and covered the pcb in liquid tape as an insulator. It's run great. The illuminator on it is so much cleaner than my real atipal. Is it on my main HD/shtf rifle? No. However, I'm personally really excited for their new Ngal knockoff. If they can make it reliable for double of what they're charging now, that's a win for everyone. It's just sad the people have to resort to buying from china or the grey market to get what they need. It's insanity people can't own a laser (because of eye safety)... that mounts on a gun. Awesome video though man. Definitely agree with the illuminator being the most important part of the system. Also, loved the Sig callout.
I wish I could buy the weapons left in Afghanistan
@@mikebarile30 Or the weapons sold on the black market out of Ukraine
Left to right, no vis, does it all for the right price, too expensive, too expensive/ unobtanium, prefer the PEQ15 over a DBAL, too expensive
Cqbl-1 with VAMPIRE. Low key kitchen knife murder count. Haven’t met many bloody hands past 100m. But you do you