The war is still ongoing, the media just covers it up. Thousands die every month during the trench battles, the Grand Army of Michigan is the only force holding Ohio at bay and they get no thanks.
Not really Ohio and Michigan got along pretty well in the years following the Toledo War it was only when Michigan vs Ohio State became a big football rivalry that people looked back to the Toledo War to justify the rivalry
Over 10 years ago there was a history channel series, called “how the states got their shapes.“ I bought the DVD, and was very disappointing to find out that it spent little to no time discussing… How the states got their shapes. It was actually more like “a few interesting facts about each state“ you, sir, have bettered them!
My problem with the series was that it had episodes focused on types of borders, like rivers. I find that less interesting than discussing the history of a single state in more depth, even if it can get repetitive. Thank you for the kind words!
What a super video! As a resident of Ohio for almost 90 years, I'm amazed at how much was involved in defining the boundaries of the state. I'm also impressed at the amount of detail and humor you've managed to include in what would normally have been a pretty boring subject. Well done on all counts.
It's absolutely wild to think Connecticut was once much longer than it is today! Though the claim went beyond the Mississippi, as Connecticut's grant stated it would be from sea to sea, so out to the Pacific! Connecticut gave up western land claims following the American Revolutionary War in exchange for federal assumption of its debt, but of course held onto the Western Reserve of what's now northeastern Ohio for a bit longer. And something the region has in common with Connecticut: Clambake! After the Civil War, railroads began carrying fresh Atlantic seafood on ice from New York through Pennsylvania, Ohio and on to Chicago, which led to it becoming popular around Cleveland! Cleveland's Public Square was actually designed when it was part of Connecticut! Moses Cleaveland oversaw the New England-style design of the plan for what would become the modern downtown area, centered on Public Square, before returning to CT, never again to visit Ohio. Moses Cleaveland once served in the Connecticut militia as a brigadier general during the American Revolution, and he was a shareholder in the Connecticut Land Company!
As a Toledoan (Perrysburg to be exact) with only very basic knowledge on the squabbles between Ohio and Michigan for Toledo, this was a really intriguing and educational video! I love the style, the use of Google Earth reminds me of one of my favorite creators (Jon Bois), and it’s a style that really excels here when talking about the geography involved. Great first video, keep it up!
This is why I always get mad when people say “why isn’t the upper peninsula Wisconsin/it’s own state?” If they want us to give up the UP, we better get Toledo
There are a couple of issues at the beginning of the video. 1) The western land claims by various states were not some slapdash thing done post independence, but were based and the vague nature of their boundaries as laid out by their colonial charters upon their founding. These claims were often "from sea to sea", theoretically meaning "from the Atlantic to the Pacific". A great example would be the first colony, Virginia. In 1609, two years after the founding of Jamestown, the King gave the colony a land grant that shifted the colony's boundary south to Cape Fear in North Carolina and extended due west. The Northern boundary started in central New Jersey and extended northwest into Pennsylvania and New York and into Canada, this basically gave Virginia claim to most of the continental US and Western Canada. Then in 1611 the southern boundary was shifted to the 29th parallel, which basically cut through modern day Northern Florida. This basically gave Virginia a claim to the whole of the Trans Mississippi West, but then new colonies began to be formed and they received similar "from sea to sea" land grants. 2) The Treaty of Paris, granting the US their independence, was signed in 1783, not 1782. 3) The French did not own Louisiana in 1783. The Spanish did. The Spanish were given it by the French following the conclusion of the Seven Years War/French and Indian War. The French got it back in the opening years of the 19th century, where they then sold it to the Americans in 1803.
@@GateNerd I assume that you eventually plan to cover all 50 states. Apparently, Ohio is the first one in the series. My question is how do you decide which one to do first, then which one next, etc. Obviously you didn't use statehood date or alphabetical order. So how?
Connecticut actually went to war with the Pennsylvanians three times over its Pennsylvanian portion before the federal government forced them to give it to Pennsylvania. Not on the border between Ohio and Kentucky, but an interesting Kentucky border that's the result of a river is the Kentucky Bend on the Mississippi River. The Kentucky Bend is bordered by Missouri to its north, but there is no bridge between it and New Madrid. The only way to leave the Kentucky Bend is through its southern border with Tennessee, and it's also the only way to get to the rest of Kentucky. Why does the Kentucky Bend exist? Good question! So the border stems from the Royal Colonial Boundary of 1665, which was meant to delimit overlapping inland claims of the Colony of Virginia and the Province of Carolina, respectively. It's unclear why the line was drawn this way, perhaps early surveyors simply incorrectly assumed the river's course. Tennessee once disputed it until 1848. The area was greatly affected by the New Madrid earthquakes in the early 1800s, some of the strongest in the US, and the changes in the river at that time may have been a contributing factor. At one point in time, 332 people lived there in 1880 as it was a big cotton-producing area. The six-decade feud on the Bend between two families was mentioned in Mark Twain's Life on the Mississippi.
And that, children, is why Ohio State - Michigan is THE Game. There may be a military cease-fire but the war ain't over. Oh and by the way, the Shawnee may have pronounced the Maumee more like Mao-mee but we pronounce it Maw-mee.
As a Cincinnati resident Symmes really screwed up the area. Much of the plots of land that were sold, had never been surveyed leading to many local disputes. Oh and he never set aside land for a university (unlike Ohio University in Athens) leading to the repurpose of Symmes personal estate for the creation of Miami University in Oxford (middle of nowhere)
21:54 in some ways, the toledo war still continues today. Its mostly between the sports teams in the two states and their fans. The michigan-ohio state football rivalry is the biggest example imo.
growing up I lived on a road creatively named "Old State Line Road" kinda cool to learn that it REALLY WAS the old planned state like between ohio and michigan.
Found you on TikTok and have been loving your stuff - so glad to see you've moved to RUclips, too! This is a great first video and I'm excited to see what else you produce!
Having grown up on the northern Pa/Oh border this has always blown my mind. I try to tell ppl whenever I can that it was the original 'wild west', while also gushing on abou lt the beauty of the Erie, Grand, Chagrin, and Cuyahoga valleys.
1. I love this! I'm so happy to find someone who actually goes into more of the detail of individual territories within territories that formed the States rather than just another oversimplification video on the topic. So much gets missed! It shaped the State's and Country's character! 2. I think you should differentiate terms. The "stealing" of land should only be used as a term when actual federally sign agreements were violated. Or before being legally discarded, etc. People groups breaking signed treaties is a normal occurrence in history, of course. The Persian Empires and the Eastern Roman Empire alone are clear examples of that, but the USA should have been expected to keep its honored word if it saw itself as above such things, and how it wished to be dealt with by others with their honor in that regard as well. The other term I would differentiate and rather you use to be more descriptive of specific Indian battles, just plain removals, or events would be the word "Conquest." The natural law of conquest was practiced by Indian tribes, nations, empires, Europeans, and then Americans alike. So differentiating the different removals by using the words "Stealing" and "Conquest" would be very helpful. Thank you! 3. Why does the year 1863 keep popping up near the end? Was that a mistake? 4. I do not regret the Electoral College! You could make the USA country ball split on the issue for the joke though!
Pennsyvania didnt just take the land back from Connecticut through political means. They went to war. 3 times. The yankee pennamite wars are little known but a neat part of pa history.
Great stuff and I appreciate your hard work in doing the necessary research. Being from CT and having had relatives migrate to OH, I was hoping though to learn more about the resolution of the CT Western Reserve claim - and when and why that claim disappeared.
As someone loosely related to Rufus Putnam, I have learned more through this one video about my own history than my home state ever taught me. Ohio Education truly is something.
@@chattiermike140 Two things first and foremost; I was talking about the state lines, and the political history. My schools did a decent job teaching its students about Rufus Putnam himself, as well as a broader overview of the important individuals in America's history. We were just never taught much about the prior topics beyond; "This is Ohio. This is [Our City]. This is the river it was built around. We have hills." Second, I graduated with a 3.8 gpa. I was paying attention just fine, but I should have put more effort in, I'll admit that. Please try to think a bit more before you go judging whole people based on two sentences. It makes you appear a bit foolish.
As a toledoan, our part of Ohio is much more culturally similar to Michigan than the rest of Ohio! Also super interesting hearing all these people’s names that ended up being Ohio county names!
Ohio is a cultural assembly of anything and everything. At no point dose it share anything with itself. 2 hours and It's something new every time. Southern ohio is way more like southern farming, east shared more with township style of new york, central Ohio is where the mix hit to basically create most of the Midwest culture, but even that defined itself the farther north or west you go. Of course the 2 cities closest to each other share more in common than any other 2 city's, thats how it was created.
As someone who grew up in a Michigan county that bordered Ohio, I totally agree with your comment. Toledo is one of the major cities where we always went as kids to go to the zoo or the museum or anything like that. It was a bit closer than cities like Kalamazoo or Grand Rapids and a bit easier to get around than Detroit metro. I always hold it close.
This is a good video for teachers and regular viewers alike. I think you did a good job blending in both humor and informational facts. Although the portrait at 7:38 is actually of Rufus King.
Toledo here. One more very important part had been left out. Plans for a canal system were in place that ended in Toledo so Ohio was not going to pay for a canal that took commerce to MICHIGAN
I would like to actually point out something. American settlements did exist in Ohio before the revolutionary war. It’s just that the seven years war destroyed most of these settlements. Also fun fact the Quakers stopped a large amount of these settlements till the start of the Seven years war when the brutality of the conflict and scope of it expanded across the entire frontier.
9:30 You say this like it is a bad thing. The Shawnee didn't farm, so therefore they weren't using the land anywhere close to its full potential. To this day, Native Americans don't exploit the land as well as we do. The United States supports far more people in far more wealth then would be possible if the Shawnee still controlled the land in their traditional ways. I won't apologize for that.
That's interesting the pronunciation, here in Australia, where we are practical "neighbors" with New Zealand, we have, or had a rivalry with them in Rugby League & Rugby Union, "they" (NZ) used to produce some tough players, their "native people" the Maori, were known as tough, still some are, until relatively recently. They have been getting GENOCIDED by the "irreligion" Eastmal parasitism, as they have been progressively & continually having their "male bloodlines" replaced by CHINESE & BABOO'S - those Maori's are known as MEAW-REARS. @@RaquelFoster
WTF, your videos are great, why are there only three? This channel could be huge. Hopefully, you're not ill or dead, and just have something else taking up your time.
When doing some family research i discovered two brothers of my Great Great Grandfather with the surname Sharkey left Glasgow here in Scotland and ended up in Bowling Green Ohio in the mid to late 1800s - For whatever reason they didnt stay too long but the two brothers married two sisters with the surname Poss and brought them back to Scotland - i have a feeling they went there because there was already some of the Sharkey family already in Ohio - when i have time i will try and look into that - so anyone in Ohio connected to the surnames Sharkey .Poss. or possibly Hook we may be related
"Lying, cheating and stealing" A phrase that can best describe the actions of the U Michigan and it's football program. The OHIO/Michigan rivalry has been taken to a whole new level. The hammer from the NCAA will soon be leveled upon Ann Arbor! Go Buckeyes!
Growing up in Cleveland, I never really understood why EVERYONE hated Michigan. Took a podcast or two to hear about the Toledo war. The fact I live in Cuyahoga county often makes me think and therefore upset... E: Didn't mean to detract!!! This is an amazing video. Never really thought about why all the western states are so squared off lol...
10:12 Another fun fact of Symmes is that he was the main proponent of the theory that the Earth is actually entirely hollow. There is a "Hollow Earth" monument in the city of Hamilton (major city in the Symmes Purchase region). Wacky part of histiry that's fun to visit if you happen to fund yourself driving theough Butler County Ohio
As a Michigan resident with family living in North Carolina, I can honestly say that the worst part of driving to visit them is transiting through Ohio. Sheer tedium at the slow speed limits in place which are enforced by more state troopers per mile than any other state in which I’ve driven. O how I hate, Ohio state.
I was born in Kalamazoo, Michigan (11/10/1946), but grew up in Cleveland, Ohio (mom was from there). With that background, you would think I would know Ohio's history a lot batter. Not. I wonder why we never had any civics or history classes about the state? Great video. ;-)
we did...I am from Cincinnati, but Ohio History was taught seems like 6th grade or 7th. Hard to remember when you are an adult what our teachers/textbooks said. BUT I am thankful we had geography class, for sure
Well, if you're going to play type: the roads in the hills were 'laid out' by wildlife and later cows. Roads in the "flatland" are just laid out in lines. Actually, roads are laid out by the surveys. Virginia measured the claims by metes and boundaries (willy nilly). The rest of the state is measured in ranges and townships (rectangles & squares). Look up at OSR 41 and OSR 72 for the comparison. Clark County Ohio is a meeting point of both surveys. Also, check out the Ludlow Line. By the way, our Virginia origins are still present as your New England. We pronounced it Wooster like rooster, whereas you pronounced is wuster. Further playing type: I am comfortable in my blue jeans, cowboy hat, and 4x4 truck. No alcohol or dip, please.
I live near this region now. I knew of this, still amusing. Many of the towns were built around forts. My family on my father's side has been here at least 150 years.
growing up in hilly SW Ohio (outside of Cincinnati), I never knew most of Ohio was flat. Until I went to Bowling Green University and drove back and forth
Ohio should have just pushed into Michigan with it's Militia and show them why we become one of the leading states to send the most troops to the Union during the Civil War lol
huh? Who thinks about it? I am from Cincinnati. No one thinks about it. I also went to/graduated from BGSU and don't remember any feelings like that....
This is related to Ohio borders. As you've probably noticed, streets are sometimes named for what's at the other end; for example, one of the major roads in Cleveland is Detroit Road, which goes west along Lake Erie towards Detroit. There is also a road in Cleveland known as Ontario Street, which, according to old maps, used to run straight north to Lake Erie where it dead-ended. That had to be cartographers making a joke: "just keep riding north until you get to Ontario; be advised the road's a little damp in places."
I now live in Toledo! I was born in Cleveland, and I grew up in Niles, Michigan. In between living in Niles and Toledo, I spent most of my life living in Indianapolis. So I found this video interesting since going through school, I was only educated on Michigan history, and not Ohio. I knew how Michigan borders were formed, but until I viewed this video, I knew nothing of the content about Ohio. Now, if I could find a similar video on Indiana.
@@robbyv109 I went and watched his video. I thought he does a good job at crediting the original and adding his own value. (Unlike some others, as I’m sure you’re aware). Thanks!
As a resident of the great state of Michigan, i want to thank residents of Ohio for their efforts in helping us obtain the Upper Peninsula! ADDITIONALLY, I have read that some very important survey work was done in the northern part of Ohio, in the Lake Erie area and Monroe area as well as an island near Detroit by a Mr Lee. This same Mr Lee would figure prominently in the Civil War on the side of the South. His full name was Robert E. Lee, and became a general who appeared in many battles and featured prominently at Appomattox Courthouse at its end. Do you have any information about him as a surveyor before the war, and as it relates to the Ohio and Michigan conflicts?
Totally. If it wasn't for this dispute Michigan would not have been THE Great Lakes State. While I truly respect Toledo--as I grew up near the Michigan-Ohio border--I am quite confident that Michigan gained a lot more from the U.P. and all of its water area than it would have from the little sliver of land.
First, I love the video, very well done, and very informative. However, and I don't know if I'm the first person to point this out or not(and I'm sorry in advance if I'm not) but I think there was a minor error in that "1863" is written in several places where "1836" should have been. Again, great video, it just made me momentarily go, "Wait, I thought the Toledo War was BEFORE the Civil War?" 😅
Yeah, unfortunately I got the numbers switched in my head. I fixed it in the caption. I felt like Chuck McGill yelling about the Magna Carta when I realized.
It's likely there was dispute within Toledo itself over which state is was in for years leading up to the war but there are surviving post marks from the time that read "Toledo, M. T." for Michigan territory. These would have been stamped by the local postmaster of the time. It's also worth noting that the Maumee and Ohio canal stretched from Toledo to Cincinnati, likely another reason why Ohio fought to keep it.
Very good video, however, as a Cincinnati native I have to inform you that Ohio's border is further west than where the Great Miami River meets the Ohio River. It's only a couple miles but it is significant.
Michigan goes: HaHa, we lost the war, but we won. Also - I cringe so hard every time this guy says the land was "unsettled". Native Americans occupied that land for several thousand years, as far as we can tell. They numbered in the millions. Calling it "unsettled" is so damned cringe, considering what they did to the current occupants when they did "settle" those lands.
Then I suppose you weren't paying very good attention because I am quite specific that I'm talking about white Americans/Americans and talk about the Native inhabitants of Ohio throughout the video.
The Toledo dispute is thought to be the origin of the great Ohio State vs Michigan rivalry.
It is 100%
Yup. Woody and Bo just added to it, and made it better! Go Bucks!
It is
TO HELL WITH. TTUN
Boring flat awful places
Amazing to find out that Ohio and Michigan's rivalries have been going on since our founding
The war is still ongoing, the media just covers it up. Thousands die every month during the trench battles, the Grand Army of Michigan is the only force holding Ohio at bay and they get no thanks.
Yep. And UofM and OSU are located in the cities that where the capitals of the two at the time of the war.
Not really Ohio and Michigan got along pretty well in the years following the Toledo War it was only when Michigan vs Ohio State became a big football rivalry that people looked back to the Toledo War to justify the rivalry
@@waidwml2166 Aha.
@waidwml2166 Well tbf a lot of Michiganders are still biased against Ohio in all things.
source: Live in MI
Over 10 years ago there was a history channel series, called “how the states got their shapes.“ I bought the DVD, and was very disappointing to find out that it spent little to no time discussing… How the states got their shapes. It was actually more like “a few interesting facts about each state“ you, sir, have bettered them!
My problem with the series was that it had episodes focused on types of borders, like rivers. I find that less interesting than discussing the history of a single state in more depth, even if it can get repetitive.
Thank you for the kind words!
Agreed!!!
@@GateNerd did that DVD series help lead to this video
What a super video! As a resident of Ohio for almost 90 years, I'm amazed at how much was involved in defining the boundaries of the state. I'm also impressed at the amount of detail and humor you've managed to include in what would normally have been a pretty boring subject. Well done on all counts.
It's absolutely wild to think Connecticut was once much longer than it is today! Though the claim went beyond the Mississippi, as Connecticut's grant stated it would be from sea to sea, so out to the Pacific! Connecticut gave up western land claims following the American Revolutionary War in exchange for federal assumption of its debt, but of course held onto the Western Reserve of what's now northeastern Ohio for a bit longer.
And something the region has in common with Connecticut: Clambake! After the Civil War, railroads began carrying fresh Atlantic seafood on ice from New York through Pennsylvania, Ohio and on to Chicago, which led to it becoming popular around Cleveland! Cleveland's Public Square was actually designed when it was part of Connecticut! Moses Cleaveland oversaw the New England-style design of the plan for what would become the modern downtown area, centered on Public Square, before returning to CT, never again to visit Ohio. Moses Cleaveland once served in the Connecticut militia as a brigadier general during the American Revolution, and he was a shareholder in the Connecticut Land Company!
As a Toledoan (Perrysburg to be exact) with only very basic knowledge on the squabbles between Ohio and Michigan for Toledo, this was a really intriguing and educational video! I love the style, the use of Google Earth reminds me of one of my favorite creators (Jon Bois), and it’s a style that really excels here when talking about the geography involved. Great first video, keep it up!
my use of google earth is direct from Job Bois, he’s one of my favorites as well
Hello from maumee💪
Toledo should secede from the union, then we'd be like Monaco or San Marino!
This is why I always get mad when people say “why isn’t the upper peninsula Wisconsin/it’s own state?” If they want us to give up the UP, we better get Toledo
@@noinfo1018 Always a trade-off!
There are a couple of issues at the beginning of the video.
1) The western land claims by various states were not some slapdash thing done post independence, but were based and the vague nature of their boundaries as laid out by their colonial charters upon their founding. These claims were often "from sea to sea", theoretically meaning "from the Atlantic to the Pacific". A great example would be the first colony, Virginia. In 1609, two years after the founding of Jamestown, the King gave the colony a land grant that shifted the colony's boundary south to Cape Fear in North Carolina and extended due west. The Northern boundary started in central New Jersey and extended northwest into Pennsylvania and New York and into Canada, this basically gave Virginia claim to most of the continental US and Western Canada. Then in 1611 the southern boundary was shifted to the 29th parallel, which basically cut through modern day Northern Florida. This basically gave Virginia a claim to the whole of the Trans Mississippi West, but then new colonies began to be formed and they received similar "from sea to sea" land grants.
2) The Treaty of Paris, granting the US their independence, was signed in 1783, not 1782.
3) The French did not own Louisiana in 1783. The Spanish did. The Spanish were given it by the French following the conclusion of the Seven Years War/French and Indian War. The French got it back in the opening years of the 19th century, where they then sold it to the Americans in 1803.
He meant "French" as in French settlers were already there
The art is amazing and the video is awesome! Now it's time for the algorithm to hold up its end of the bargain.
thank you for the kind words! this was a lot of work and i’m glad you enjoyed it. fingers crossed with the algorithm
@@GateNerd
I assume that you eventually plan to cover all 50 states. Apparently, Ohio is the first one in the series. My question is how do you decide which one to do first, then which one next, etc. Obviously you didn't use statehood date or alphabetical order. So how?
Just got recommended a year later. I think it's working.
Connecticut actually went to war with the Pennsylvanians three times over its Pennsylvanian portion before the federal government forced them to give it to Pennsylvania. Not on the border between Ohio and Kentucky, but an interesting Kentucky border that's the result of a river is the Kentucky Bend on the Mississippi River. The Kentucky Bend is bordered by Missouri to its north, but there is no bridge between it and New Madrid. The only way to leave the Kentucky Bend is through its southern border with Tennessee, and it's also the only way to get to the rest of Kentucky. Why does the Kentucky Bend exist? Good question!
So the border stems from the Royal Colonial Boundary of 1665, which was meant to delimit overlapping inland claims of the Colony of Virginia and the Province of Carolina, respectively. It's unclear why the line was drawn this way, perhaps early surveyors simply incorrectly assumed the river's course. Tennessee once disputed it until 1848. The area was greatly affected by the New Madrid earthquakes in the early 1800s, some of the strongest in the US, and the changes in the river at that time may have been a contributing factor. At one point in time, 332 people lived there in 1880 as it was a big cotton-producing area. The six-decade feud on the Bend between two families was mentioned in Mark Twain's Life on the Mississippi.
And that, children, is why Ohio State - Michigan is THE Game. There may be a military cease-fire but the war ain't over.
Oh and by the way, the Shawnee may have pronounced the Maumee more like Mao-mee but we pronounce it Maw-mee.
Yo loved the video. Fascinating history. I learned a lot, as an Ohioan I appreciate it. Like the Polandballs style too.
thank you, I'm glad you liked it!
As a Cincinnati resident Symmes really screwed up the area. Much of the plots of land that were sold, had never been surveyed leading to many local disputes. Oh and he never set aside land for a university (unlike Ohio University in Athens) leading to the repurpose of Symmes personal estate for the creation of Miami University in Oxford (middle of nowhere)
As a former resident of the middle of nowhere, I'd like to dispute that description, but I definitely can't
Ohio and Michigan fought a war, and Wisconsin lost.
It’s now 2023 and nothing has changed between Ohio and ❌ichigan 😂
Go Bucks!
How was the win this year against Michigan?
6:45 Oh! Now I get it. Case Western Reserve University finally makes sense.
It was a merger of Case and Western Reserve colleges and became Case Western Reserve University.
@@cas2985 yes, but the "Western Reserve" part always seemed odd.
5:31 your river (which is a dark brownish green) can’t stop us
All these years later Ohio and Michigan still hate each other 😂😂😂
Hate is too strong a word. A simmering rivalry is more accurate.
@@jasonswiatkowski9127 no, it’s hate
weird statement---I grew up in Cincinnati and not one person mentions it. Only people who went to OSU. I went to BGSU and didn't know
21:54 in some ways, the toledo war still continues today. Its mostly between the sports teams in the two states and their fans. The michigan-ohio state football rivalry is the biggest example imo.
Michigan tried to cheat us out of our land
Michigan now cheats on the football field
As they say, "once a cheater, always a cheater"
Let's go Bucks
Cause nothing else happens in those boring places
@@DENVEROUTDOORMAN do you feel superior now?
growing up I lived on a road creatively named "Old State Line Road" kinda cool to learn that it REALLY WAS the old planned state like between ohio and michigan.
Proud to be ur 100 subscriber
Great video I think you'll have a great future on youtube
thank you for the kind words
Found you on TikTok and have been loving your stuff - so glad to see you've moved to RUclips, too! This is a great first video and I'm excited to see what else you produce!
this was very well executed! I undertood a lot, I hope you do more of these!
thank you!
Came from VTH to support you, fantastic video hope you continue to make videos and see the growth you deserve
thank you! You’ve come at a decent time because I’ll have a video this month, most likely
@GateNerd awesome in the meantime I'm going to watch the rest of your videos
Its the border version of “fun with flags” by Sheldon Cooper
Having grown up on the northern Pa/Oh border this has always blown my mind. I try to tell ppl whenever I can that it was the original 'wild west', while also gushing on abou lt the beauty of the Erie, Grand, Chagrin, and Cuyahoga valleys.
1. I love this! I'm so happy to find someone who actually goes into more of the detail of individual territories within territories that formed the States rather than just another oversimplification video on the topic. So much gets missed! It shaped the State's and Country's character!
2. I think you should differentiate terms. The "stealing" of land should only be used as a term when actual federally sign agreements were violated. Or before being legally discarded, etc.
People groups breaking signed treaties is a normal occurrence in history, of course. The Persian Empires and the Eastern Roman Empire alone are clear examples of that, but the USA should have been expected to keep its honored word if it saw itself as above such things, and how it wished to be dealt with by others with their honor in that regard as well.
The other term I would differentiate and rather you use to be more descriptive of specific Indian battles, just plain removals, or events would be the word "Conquest." The natural law of conquest was practiced by Indian tribes, nations, empires, Europeans, and then Americans alike.
So differentiating the different removals by using the words "Stealing" and "Conquest" would be very helpful. Thank you!
3. Why does the year 1863 keep popping up near the end? Was that a mistake?
4. I do not regret the Electoral College! You could make the USA country ball split on the issue for the joke though!
As someone born just a few dozen yards from the Great Miami River, I can't believe I was almost a New Jersian...
Vlogging through history brought me here.. great video
Shawnee were some fearsome warriors the Comanche and Apache of Ohio.
Pennsyvania didnt just take the land back from Connecticut through political means. They went to war. 3 times. The yankee pennamite wars are little known but a neat part of pa history.
Great stuff and I appreciate your hard work in doing the necessary research. Being from CT and having had relatives migrate to OH, I was hoping though to learn more about the resolution of the CT Western Reserve claim - and when and why that claim disappeared.
there is a Western Reserve University
As someone loosely related to Rufus Putnam, I have learned more through this one video about my own history than my home state ever taught me. Ohio Education truly is something.
As someone from Ohio who knows a lot about Rufus Putnam you clearly didn’t pay a lick of attention in history class
@@chattiermike140 Two things first and foremost;
I was talking about the state lines, and the political history. My schools did a decent job teaching its students about Rufus Putnam himself, as well as a broader overview of the important individuals in America's history. We were just never taught much about the prior topics beyond; "This is Ohio. This is [Our City]. This is the river it was built around. We have hills."
Second, I graduated with a 3.8 gpa. I was paying attention just fine, but I should have put more effort in, I'll admit that.
Please try to think a bit more before you go judging whole people based on two sentences. It makes you appear a bit foolish.
@@lunar9342 well I am very foolish so you’re astute at that
Great Video man👏🏾👏🏾
You now what, Michigan can have Toledo
Not under my watch
As a toledoan, our part of Ohio is much more culturally similar to Michigan than the rest of Ohio! Also super interesting hearing all these people’s names that ended up being Ohio county names!
Right! Though Toledo is rightfully Ohio's.
It’s absolutely a cultural satellite of Detroit, first and foremost.
Also, I have a good idea of where the name for the town of Tiffin came from.
Ohio is a cultural assembly of anything and everything. At no point dose it share anything with itself. 2 hours and It's something new every time. Southern ohio is way more like southern farming, east shared more with township style of new york, central Ohio is where the mix hit to basically create most of the Midwest culture, but even that defined itself the farther north or west you go. Of course the 2 cities closest to each other share more in common than any other 2 city's, thats how it was created.
As someone who grew up in a Michigan county that bordered Ohio, I totally agree with your comment. Toledo is one of the major cities where we always went as kids to go to the zoo or the museum or anything like that. It was a bit closer than cities like Kalamazoo or Grand Rapids and a bit easier to get around than Detroit metro. I always hold it close.
At 17:06, you flip the year around. I'm pretty certain it should be 1836, not 1863. All around, though, great job!
yeah i didn’t notice that mistake while making the video
This is a good video for teachers and regular viewers alike. I think you did a good job blending in both humor and informational facts. Although the portrait at 7:38 is actually of Rufus King.
I had never realized that What a shame, Putnam has a much funnier face. Well, thanks for pointing that out I do appreciate it
It’s fine and your welcome, the video is still great.
When I saw the picture I was like “this is totally Rufus king right?”. I’m glad that I’m that much of a nerd to recognize it lol
Very well made, nice job there :D
thank you!
Toledo here.
One more very important part had been left out.
Plans for a canal system were in place that ended in Toledo so Ohio was not going to pay for a canal that took commerce to MICHIGAN
Love the bit about Athens and Ohio University.
Subbed and great presentation !
Personally as an Ohioan I propose they can have Toledo and we'll take the UP since they refused it the first time
I would like to actually point out something. American settlements did exist in Ohio before the revolutionary war. It’s just that the seven years war destroyed most of these settlements. Also fun fact the Quakers stopped a large amount of these settlements till the start of the Seven years war when the brutality of the conflict and scope of it expanded across the entire frontier.
I live near the Maumee river and everyone pronounces the u as a w like mawmee.
Because it is pronounced that way. The video guy was wrong.
Exactly 👍
9:30 You say this like it is a bad thing. The Shawnee didn't farm, so therefore they weren't using the land anywhere close to its full potential. To this day, Native Americans don't exploit the land as well as we do. The United States supports far more people in far more wealth then would be possible if the Shawnee still controlled the land in their traditional ways. I won't apologize for that.
one of the dumbest things i’ve ever read, congrats
@GateNerd. I'm afraid your response is the dumb one.
Taking 3 tries to correctly pronounce the indigenous name for a river is peak America.
You are underrated, I am sure to subscribe
Glad to see people continuing the legacy of Brain4Breakfast
Great video, thanks! As someone who lived in Toledo for 5 years though, Maumee is pronounced "Maw-mee".
The way it's pronounced in this video makes me think of Super Troopers. Meow-mee.
That's interesting the pronunciation, here in Australia, where we are practical "neighbors" with New Zealand,
we have, or had a rivalry with them in Rugby League & Rugby Union, "they" (NZ) used to produce some tough
players, their "native people" the Maori, were known as tough, still some are, until relatively recently. They have
been getting GENOCIDED by the "irreligion" Eastmal parasitism, as they have been progressively & continually
having their "male bloodlines" replaced by CHINESE & BABOO'S - those Maori's are known as MEAW-REARS. @@RaquelFoster
WTF, your videos are great, why are there only three? This channel could be huge. Hopefully, you're not ill or dead, and just have something else taking up your time.
When doing some family research i discovered two brothers of my Great Great Grandfather with the surname Sharkey left Glasgow here in Scotland and ended up in Bowling Green Ohio in the mid to late 1800s - For whatever reason they didnt stay too long but the two brothers married two sisters with the surname Poss and brought them back to Scotland - i have a feeling they went there because there was already some of the Sharkey family already in Ohio - when i have time i will try and look into that - so anyone in Ohio connected to the surnames Sharkey .Poss. or possibly Hook we may be related
Not one, but I know some.
Oh wow thats interesting @@MuriKakari
Sent this way By Chris with Vlogging Through History.
I Enjoyed the video!
9:55 Super interesting to a local who lives near modern-day Symmes Township, which lies in part of this sane area!
"Lying, cheating and stealing"
A phrase that can best describe the actions of the U Michigan and it's football program.
The OHIO/Michigan rivalry has been taken to a whole new level.
The hammer from the NCAA will soon be leveled upon Ann Arbor! Go Buckeyes!
Growing up in Cleveland, I never really understood why EVERYONE hated Michigan. Took a podcast or two to hear about the Toledo war. The fact I live in Cuyahoga county often makes me think and therefore upset... E: Didn't mean to detract!!! This is an amazing video. Never really thought about why all the western states are so squared off lol...
haha...growing up in Cincinnati, I never knew anyone hated Michigan!
@@lynnhubbard844look up the toledo war. I suggest The Dollop podcast
10:12
Another fun fact of Symmes is that he was the main proponent of the theory that the Earth is actually entirely hollow. There is a "Hollow Earth" monument in the city of Hamilton (major city in the Symmes Purchase region). Wacky part of histiry that's fun to visit if you happen to fund yourself driving theough Butler County Ohio
I wanted to do a full 5-6 minutes about Symmes but I had to restrain myself. One of the funniest guys in American History, honestly
"Funny guys in history" sounds like a good video series. I'm sure there are plenty of candidates.
Hell yeah Ohio university representation. I’m a proud bobcat baby
BGSU here! What is a Cincinnati girl going north to BG, you ask? A more natural choice should have been OU!!!!!!
As a Michigan resident with family living in North Carolina, I can honestly say that the worst part of driving to visit them is transiting through Ohio. Sheer tedium at the slow speed limits in place which are enforced by more state troopers per mile than any other state in which I’ve driven. O how I hate, Ohio state.
At least Ohio has paved roads haha
I was born in Kalamazoo, Michigan (11/10/1946), but grew up in Cleveland, Ohio (mom was from there). With that background, you would think I would know Ohio's history a lot batter. Not. I wonder why we never had any civics or history classes about the state?
Great video. ;-)
we did...I am from Cincinnati, but Ohio History was taught seems like 6th grade or 7th. Hard to remember when you are an adult what our teachers/textbooks said. BUT I am thankful we had geography class, for sure
I live in Akron and the beginning of this video hit me so hard dont forget the roads in southern ohio being made by a drunk
Well, if you're going to play type: the roads in the hills were 'laid out' by wildlife and later cows. Roads in the "flatland" are just laid out in lines. Actually, roads are laid out by the surveys. Virginia measured the claims by metes and boundaries (willy nilly). The rest of the state is measured in ranges and townships (rectangles & squares). Look up at OSR 41 and OSR 72 for the comparison. Clark County Ohio is a meeting point of both surveys. Also, check out the Ludlow Line.
By the way, our Virginia origins are still present as your New England. We pronounced it Wooster like rooster, whereas you pronounced is wuster.
Further playing type: I am comfortable in my blue jeans, cowboy hat, and 4x4 truck. No alcohol or dip, please.
I have a direct line relative who was awarded land in southern Ohio. For serving in the War of Independence
I live near this region now. I knew of this, still amusing.
Many of the towns were built around forts. My family on my father's side has been here at least 150 years.
Ohio called the first frontier, yet everyone forgot Kentucky and Tennessee that was settled since 1770's
From tiktok, love your videos man
Love your TikToks and love this as well! Great work!!
- A fellow Kansan lol
As a genealogist, I always find it amusing when I read an historical reference saying that somebody "moved to the West" -- meaning OHIO!
Subbed
I LOVE GATE NERD
wow thanks mr sealy 2
impressive
growing up in hilly SW Ohio (outside of Cincinnati), I never knew most of Ohio was flat. Until I went to Bowling Green University and drove back and forth
You correctly pronounced Muskingum (muskeggum or muskiggum) River but botched the Maumee. It's not Polynesian but First Nations and pronounced mawmee.
Ohio should have just pushed into Michigan with it's Militia and show them why we become one of the leading states to send the most troops to the Union during the Civil War lol
All that fighting, and now we Ohioans would gladly give Toledo to Michigan
huh? Who thinks about it? I am from Cincinnati. No one thinks about it. I also went to/graduated from BGSU and don't remember any feelings like that....
@@studibakre We'd trade for the upper peninsula (UP) not giving Michigan anything for free except a swift.......; )
Over here from TikTok! Amazing video, can't wait to see something like this for Missouri and why we have the bootheel!!!
I grew up in Marietta! Great town.
This is related to Ohio borders. As you've probably noticed, streets are sometimes named for what's at the other end; for example, one of the major roads in Cleveland is Detroit Road, which goes west along Lake Erie towards Detroit. There is also a road in Cleveland known as Ontario Street, which, according to old maps, used to run straight north to Lake Erie where it dead-ended. That had to be cartographers making a joke: "just keep riding north until you get to Ontario; be advised the road's a little damp in places."
I now live in Toledo! I was born in Cleveland, and I grew up in Niles, Michigan. In between living in Niles and Toledo, I spent most of my life living in Indianapolis. So I found this video interesting since going through school, I was only educated on Michigan history, and not Ohio. I knew how Michigan borders were formed, but until I viewed this video, I knew nothing of the content about Ohio. Now, if I could find a similar video on Indiana.
You are SO underrated
Sent by VTH. This was an incredible video
What is VTH, if you don't mind my asking?
@@GateNerd vlogging through history. He does historical video reactions, but does them in a way that doesn’t suck 😂
@@robbyv109 I went and watched his video. I thought he does a good job at crediting the original and adding his own value. (Unlike some others, as I’m sure you’re aware). Thanks!
The only way Toledo could be worse? If it were Toledo, MI! O - H -
I-O!
As a resident of the great state of Michigan, i want to thank residents of Ohio for their efforts in helping us obtain the Upper Peninsula! ADDITIONALLY, I have read that some very important survey work was done in the northern part of Ohio, in the Lake Erie area and Monroe area as well as an island near Detroit by a Mr Lee. This same Mr Lee would figure prominently in the Civil War on the side of the South. His full name was Robert E. Lee, and became a general who appeared in many battles and featured prominently at Appomattox Courthouse at its end. Do you have any information about him as a surveyor before the war, and as it relates to the Ohio and Michigan conflicts?
Totally. If it wasn't for this dispute Michigan would not have been THE Great Lakes State. While I truly respect Toledo--as I grew up near the Michigan-Ohio border--I am quite confident that Michigan gained a lot more from the U.P. and all of its water area than it would have from the little sliver of land.
The UP was a pacifier the feds gave you to stop crying about losing to Ohio and you're still crying.
@@jacksnyder7318 is Harbaugh still taking up room in your head? So sad!
Is so funny I live in Toledo
Imagine. Greed and corruption in the United States.
I saw a bit of your Oklahoma border story on TikTok. Followed to RUclips and enjoyed this one too!
thank you! ive changed my video style for the time being but glad you’ve liked this!
@@GateNerd The Oklahoma one seems a little more polished.
Episode one is on OHIO! Go my state!
First, I love the video, very well done, and very informative.
However, and I don't know if I'm the first person to point this out or not(and I'm sorry in advance if I'm not) but I think there was a minor error in that "1863" is written in several places where "1836" should have been.
Again, great video, it just made me momentarily go, "Wait, I thought the Toledo War was BEFORE the Civil War?" 😅
Yeah, I loved the video. very interesting and informative.
Yeah, unfortunately I got the numbers switched in my head. I fixed it in the caption. I felt like Chuck McGill yelling about the Magna Carta when I realized.
Pennsylvania and Connecticut fought a war over the Wyoming Valley. It was called there Pennamite-Yankee War. It was during the Revolutionary War.
this is the first ohio empire
It's likely there was dispute within Toledo itself over which state is was in for years leading up to the war but there are surviving post marks from the time that read "Toledo, M. T." for Michigan territory. These would have been stamped by the local postmaster of the time. It's also worth noting that the Maumee and Ohio canal stretched from Toledo to Cincinnati, likely another reason why Ohio fought to keep it.
Awesome history but yoooo no one pronounces the Maumee River as “Mao-Mee”. It’s like “Maw-Mee”
Very good video, however, as a Cincinnati native I have to inform you that Ohio's border is further west than where the Great Miami River meets the Ohio River. It's only a couple miles but it is significant.
This is REALLY well done. I'm a fan.
Michigan goes: HaHa, we lost the war, but we won.
Also - I cringe so hard every time this guy says the land was "unsettled". Native Americans occupied that land for several thousand years, as far as we can tell. They numbered in the millions. Calling it "unsettled" is so damned cringe, considering what they did to the current occupants when they did "settle" those lands.
Then I suppose you weren't paying very good attention because I am quite specific that I'm talking about white Americans/Americans and talk about the Native inhabitants of Ohio throughout the video.
@@GateNerd It's still cringe AF. And interrupting yourself a third of the way through the video to throw in your disclaimer didn't help at all.
alrighty then
relax...the word settle in American English is just for this expansion purpose in this context
The People's Democratic Republic of Ohio stands strong
Now Toledo is a place that neither state would want
Captivating!!!!! Thank you.
As an ohio university grad and resident of Athens I very much enjoyed this video
Yo this is great content I hope you produce more of it
First frontier would have been anything west of the Appalachians.
Nice content! I came here from your TikTok account