wanna know how I got the penance for the speed aura thingy? I played a game on the obsucra den map and got the penance before we planted the second charge. So no, I will not be blaming the penances
The Aura penances go by so fast though, most people will get them in a couple of games by just playing as actions done by randos count to their progress, people bringing non-meta auras is because they want to
I will not tell anyone how to play. But I will say this: If you bring the ammo aura... I see you. I notice you. I appreciate you. I love you. You are making a difference. You matter. You are important. I don't even care if you keep going down to poxwalkers. You are my friend and I thank you.
what needs to be done is for fatshark to not make the ammo economy dependent on a single perk on a single character, so that vets can actually play the way they want rather than being forced to conform to their teams demands to ONLY use that one perk :)
yeah that would require the other auras to be buffed pretty good to be any better than 1% ammo on elite/spec kills. I would probably think to change the damage aura to be 10-20% on weakspots and the other to be 10% movement speed when moving towards an enemy
What you're telling me you don't want to play like it's vermintide and try to run in and melee the 20 aimbot shooters and four 99999rpm gunners all spread out in an open area??? Madness I tell ye!
Tbh, anybody that expects the random-group to 'just work' in any Co-Op-Game is just out of their mind. Everytime I read or hear something like that I'm completely flabbergasted if this is the first time they're playing with any sort of quick match feature
@@thepurplebandit3859 And still, ppl act like entitled smoothbrains demanding that everybody should be 'capable, knowledged and skilled!' while this would not even be necessary if said entitled ppl would be 'capable, knowledged and skilled!' themself xD
Anyone gonna mention Mr. E. Literally has a build on darktidebuilds called "best vet build in the game" made for current patch, that takes this aura :p
Okay you mentioned the ammo crate and now I have to rant: STOP DROPPING THE AMMO CRATE IN THE AIR LOCKS! Or, on a ledge right before people drop down, or an elevator; just stop! Think Tactically! There are FOUR CHARGES in the ammo crate. Put the crate down in the middle of an arena so it is accessible throughout the entire event. Then, the Plasma Gun Veteran can just go ham with the plasma gun and keep stocking up their ammo during the event. Or, a Gun Lugger Ogryn can keep the LMB button held down with suppressive fire and just keep dipping back into the ammo crate. I can't tell you how many times someone puts down an ammo crate in a air lock and I see two charges still on the crate and the door closes and it's gone forever. You've just pissed all that ammo (and damage) down the drain... Also, you only get 4 charges so don't waste a charge if you still have 80% of your ammo left. Wait till you are out of ammo and then pick up a charge. Or better, yet just leave it be and let the Vets or Ogryns have it. Yes, I'm looking at your Zealot that just holds down W and mashes the LMB and can't aim more than 5 meters you front of you. I know you IPAD kids just have to tap on the thing the second you see and have absolutely zero restraint, but again, think TACTICALLY...
Lol I do this a lot. Generally, it's because I'm playing a game with strangers that aren't communicating. The air locks and elevators are pause points where we're all huddled together, and everyone can see it's there and easily access it. Of course I only drop it if I see lots of red and yellow ammo counters. I'll also drop it at a big event point, really just depends on what comes first 🤷
Survivalist before the nerf was the most busted thing in the game. How people look at it now and think 1% every 5 seconds is terrible don't understand how long 5 seconds really is. Its the havoc goat unless you are psyker.
For those who didn't play at launch, this game had next to no ammo then, even on the lowest difficulty, ammo was at an absolute premium, you frequently ran out of ammo for whole sections of missions even in the lowest difficulties, the game is designed to be a scavenger hunt for ammo, melee is called your primary weapon in game for a reason. You're supposed to run out of ammo in this game, this is a feature, not a biug, in fact it should be a lot more scarce than it is.
I know ppl want the Ogryn to see some love, but I want FS to overhaul the Vet’s tree. Not only are 2 of his auras basic white-level nodes, his keystones are kind of meh. I find I play better without any of them. Why do I want to sit still and snipe on a horde shooter that requires constant melee? Or why do I want the occasional 10-20% dmg boost with Focus Target when I can only use it once in awhile. I can just use the points to get that damage all the time. Weapon Specialist is probably better than I tend to think, but I wasn’t thrilled with it either. Kind of just wish they’d rework his whole tree to be more interesting.
If I can't play the Ogyrn I want, I'm sure as hell not playing a different vet build because others want me to. I refuse to use ammo aura. As a weapon specialist enthusiast I only use movement aura
This is true for the VAST majority of builds. However, I've found a niche use for Fire Team in a build that uses some razor-thin breakpoints on the Rashad axe for reliably one tapping on light attacks (without crit) the scab bruisers in hordes to allow for uninterrupted horde clear via bromentum. It completely trivialises hordes in Auric Maelstrom (I can just stand and spam lights all day) and it synergises especially well with Weapons Specialist to farm the free reloads. It's definitely a more selfish pick over the amazing utility Survivalist provides overall, though, and it struggles in high level Havoc due to ammo economy.
“Ok guys. I’m doing penances so I have to die in the beginning, and don’t rez me.” ~ literal quote from a guy the other day. We all said ok, let him die, then left the game😂.
it really sucks having to give up so many talents to take survivalist on my favorite gimmick build :( hope they figure out a way to balance ammo a lil better at some point
Kinda feels like ogryn relies on veteran survivalist more than the veteran does I rarely have ammo issues in auric maelstrom although I’ll admit I don’t play much veteran and haven’t done havoc yet.
The old version is way too strong. Without a cooldown, the higher the difficulty, the more powerful the aura and that is the only aura that works like that, even this nerfed one is also like that. And after I saw the math you did, I started to worry it will get nerf again. lol
I hate how they nerfed Survivalist, because they made it timed based, it punishes you for killing many Specialists ot Elites quickly, you could kill 10 Elites/Specialists within 5 seconds but only get ammo for 1 of them. What they should of done was nerfed it quanity wise, changed it to 0.5% or 0.2% or something per kill, and you may say that might be so little that it would do nothing, but the counter to that would be they could of programmed it so that it accumulated a counter to trigger a 1% drop, so if it was 0.5% per kill, then every 2 kills is 1% given, or if 0.2% then every 5 kills gives you a 1% drop. Timed based nerf is just silly and punishing for players playing well.
Survivalist/Scavenger has been broken since this games conception in Closed Beta and it's baffling that people don't understand how overpowered literal ammo regen is. I'm fine with people not taking Scavenger as long as they're efficient with their ammo so everyone can share the ammo pickups but most Vet players that aren't taking Survivalist, at least on Damnation QPlay, have the lowest damage with the most ammo collected. And considering the amount of ammo hungry players like Gunlugger Ogryns and Relic Zealots taking Survivalist is pretty much a must no matter what mode you're playing on because it will get to a point where even your melee focused builds are going to run out of ammo and encounters are going to become a struggle. Also let's be real about ammo crates, it's ALWAYS 100% value if the Ogryn with Frag Bomb gets all 4 charges and you have Field Improv :)
You absolutely do not need survivalist in quickplay, at all. There's a ludicrous amount of ammo on the map, the only way to run out is if people are literally firing into horde or missing lots of shots. It is a skill issue if the team runs out of ammo. I discussed this on the discord recently and my point was that when looking back at my last auric game there were 23 light boxes picked up, 8 medium bags, and an entire full reload crate. At an asolute maximum everyone had their 100% starting ammo reserve and up to an additional 286% scattered around on the map. there is absolutely no reason that even 60% of that ammo shouldnt be enough, Auric has the opposite problem where it's not the case that you need survivalist, the ammo drops need to be nerfed. Survivalist only becomes a valid pick in havoc and even then you're gimping yourself in other areas. You don't choose your aura based on aura for vet, you pick based on surrounding nodes. 5% damage literally does nothing, but grenade tinkerer does. 5% move speed does almost nothing, but agile engagement is one of the best nodes in the entire game. In auric, all of the auras are useless, you pick for the other nodes and cheapest pathing because of all the taxes in the vet tree. Look at the nodes above survivalist, they're dog shit. Look at the nodes that come after survivalist, they're even worse. And then they path into exec stance which (although I like it and feel its strong) many people consider useless. Also as a point the 5% movement speed node and the 5% aura stack so that you can walk faster than horde enemies can attack you. I feel your take on the issue is so one dimensional, even in havoc where ammo counts are reduced its entirely valid to avoid survivalist if it saves you points elsewhere that can be used to buy other really strong things. EDIT: also watching deeper your math is so scuffed... you can't account for the wastage of ammo crates (which is valid) then assume you can proc survivalist every second, on the the dot, for the entire game. It's efficiency is no where near that high. Like yes it's very good but your math literally shows nothing of value in terms of comparison.
Technically we don't need any ammo at all if everyone in the team is a melee God. But that's not the point. The point is that it gives the team a shitload of resources. If there are gunluggers and gunpsykers on the team, it can be a total gamechanger for them. For havoc40 I fail to see which talents are so insanely important to get that you feel like gimping zealots and ogryns in the team.
@@Ebb0Productions those people are gimping themself if they take weapons they cant reasonably sustain with. Like I said though havoc is the only place survivalist is actually good. Depending on the vet setup both grenade tinkerer and agile engagement are huge. Grenadier vet is one of the strongest builds in havoc right now with it's on 1m cooldown ogryn nukes. Agile engagement is also needed by a lot of current meta weapons for solid one tap breakpoints like the BP or combat blade. Though most seem to be running DS which doesnt really need it. how much ammo, time, and health is saved by one shotting an enemy rather than two shotting?
You said this better than I would have. I would add: this level of thinking is still only relevant in high level difficulties and as far as the survivalist aura, if you’re running with non gun using classes it becomes almost useless. I’d rather have the other auras helping out my psyker.
@@J.B.1982 for sure, in anything outside of havoc 31+ survivalist is just as low impact as every other option. The sorta sad thing about the 5% damage aura is that it's just a straight downgrade of the psykers 5% crit aura which is pretty solid. I can get they want to avoid classes having the same effects but honestly they could both have the aura and it'd be fine.
Don't blame the players. Blame Fatshark for nerfing the talent cause of pick rate. Nobody uses it because they know how good it was before the nerf and how bad it is now.
As much as I agree that survivalist is the best aura on vet by FAR, let people play the way they want and please don't throw a hissy fit if your quick play teammates don't play the game optimally. Ultimately playing optimally is a choice and it isn't one you shouldn't force on others(especially strangers over the internet). However if you are going into auric damnation or havoc I would argue that having at least somewhat optimal perks and/or weapons should be the bare minimum. Ps: havoc nerfing ammo pickups/crates basically just exasperates the survivalist issue and I would argue that its makes the aura damn near mandatory
THIS IS SO TRUE! Quickplay damnation has become a CESSPOOL of bad players with even worse build choices. I literally cannot win a game without playing stealth zealot to revive my teammates AT LEAST 20 TIMES PER PERSON
Best advice I can give is look at a players setup in lobby and if they aren't running something seen on gameslantern leave immediately as they aren't even putting effort into understanding what other better players build or use in this game lmao
For like two weeks, just for fun I ran a melee vet stealth build with 10% Revive Speed on curios, taking the No One Left Behind talent. You rez people in one second, it was hilarious.
I don't think there is a reasonable way to buff the other auras to the point where they can compete against survivalist without breaking the game even more. Survivalist is completely broken, has always been and the only way for other auras to compete is for survivalist to be completely reworked or removed. The devs can't balance the ammo economy in missions properly when whether or not your team has survivalist makes such a massive difference. If you buff the move speed aura too much then all players can outrun enemies and you break the game. For the damage aura to be worth it it would need to be something insane like 25%-50% and even then the ammo from survivalist would likely be worth more and that kind of aura might make playing with it feel bad because of the massive fluctuation of your damage based on coherency makes it very unpredictable for other players and if the other players kinda just ignore the buff and don't plan around it, playing normally, then a lot of it is just wasted as overkill damage. All 3 of veterans auras should be reworked completely for there to be 3 viable options for veterans to choose from.
@@Pakana_ The speed aura just needs a little tweaking imo. I would like to see it give you more dodge distance and dodge count OR more dodge regen speed and dodge count. The movement speed can be buffed to like 10%. Fire team is useless. Whole ass rework needed. You cant just increase the damage to 20% instead of 5 either. I was thinking, since you're going down middle tree towards shout AND towards focus target, to make fire team give you benefits for killing tagged enemies, similar to witch hunter captain in V2. Something like more critchance, attack speed, reload speed for the whole team. Not damage. I dont know how good these changes are, but we need something that actually makes players think twice before grabbing survivalist. Like right now the other 2 are not even comparable lol.
*On Havok? Yes, have at least 1 Vet running Survivalist.* Anything else is pretty much skill issue if you can't beat it without extra ammo being printed. (Granted, someone's ammo-dependant build can be kneecapped by someone else hogging ammo) "What are you tryna tell me, I can make more ammo?" "No Reject, I'm saying when you're ready... you won't have to."
Remember when Surivivalist was just a part of Vet's kit and things were pretty good? Making it 1/3 auras is silly becasue it just makes the other 2 auras absolutely worthless and not even worth thinking it about unless you are memeing. It is silly.
except the only place survivalist is not useless is if you're dog at the game and can't aim, or you're playing high havoc. Even at high havoc it's not even must pick territory it's just very strong. You don't pick the other auras for their effect, you pick them for the surrounding nodes and cheap pathing so you can get all the talent taxes you need further down for breakpoints.
To play Devils advocate for Fire Team: in theory, it adds up to 20% extra damage (EDIT i mean, not 20% damage to the entire team of course, but since 4 players get extra 5% it's sort of equivalent to boosting one player with 20%damage), if everyone is in coherency all the time. This never happenes in practice of course, but it's a bigger ceiling than a mere 5%. It's true of course that 5% never (or almost never) is enough by itself to reach new breakpoints leading much of that damage to get wasted as overkill, outside of bosses. However, you can't assume that everyone is always attacking completely undamaged enemies. Often you will attack someone who's taken a smidge of damage from a stray bullet from a magdump, a sweaping attack from an ally, a bit of fire from a barrel etc. Also, there's loads of different other damage increases that will affect you from time to time, which might allow you to use an attack less when adding another 5% damage. Also don't forget that despire it's name it adds damage to all attacks, not just ranged. All that said; yes, Survivalist is indeed the superior choice (especially on Havoc) but you're not representing the other auras fairly in this video.
@GuyMan8383 Agreed. And it won't achieve new breakpoints by itself. But as I mentioned, you're not always attacking fully healthy enemies using the optimal combo. And often there are other damage bonuses affecting you as well. So sometimes even a 5% damage increase will in fact put you over a breakpoint threshold.
Hey at least everything works fine and is fun for most at damnation qp level which Fatshark should be balancing for anyways, Auric board exists for metagamers and Havoc isnt real because the balance is so ass and streamlined into the same 3 builds(ogryn aint shit in havoc no matter what lets be honest). Also this video feels personally aimed at people who dont bring survivalist to havoc and you just ended a game wihout lol
Crazy how Heresy is the most fun because you can play any build you want, where as every other difficulty funnels the playstyle into revolver duelling sword every time. Guess people don’t like fun
@@Garl_Vinlandheresy is braindead boring though and you cant even enjoy gimmick builds becuase of it, you can still use complete dogwater builds in damnation as long as you arent complete ass at the game yourself, i personally jump in damnation qp myself with smoke nades for fun and its good enough
@@Garl_Vinland cool dude, and you're allowed to do that, but coping that 'erm actually this smoke grenade movement speed aura vet build is good because I win my heresy games' is dumb as hell.
Outside havoc mode you can play anything you want. Also smokes nades are usefull in operatives mision like the train. You have to adapt your playstyle if no survivalist that's all.
I kept taking “the best grenades” and found that my survival rate drastically increased when I dropped them and took the utility smoke grenades instead. Switching your weapon for more dps, rather than a pre emptive reload is the best way to die in higher difficulties.
It is. It's an aura that applies to everyone in coherency. With four people in coherency the team as a whole is putting out 20% bonus damage which can make or break heavily armored enemy blobs or bosses. This guy is just shit at math.
@graveyardshift6691 no they arent. The team was already doing 100% and now they are doing 105%. They can handle 5% more horde or kill a boss 5% faster. The team is doing “”20% bonus damage”” but they were doing 400% damage before. This is like telling me that the team runs 20% faster as a whole when you run the 5% speed aura. Looks like youre the one whos shit at math 😂
@@MisterEtide I'm new on PS5 and that's what has confused me I guess. I thought it was a 5% stack per person, not a flat 5%, which makes it pointless to run like the 5% movement speed. I just read it wrong I guess and never bothered to read it again lol. Unless you don't have the spare points to move across the tree for whatever reason it's dumb.
@@MisterEtide Already addressed the part about the speed on close and kill. Your team is doing 120% damage when in coherency. That's how it works. If your team is only doing 105%. someone is out of position.
I play on Heresy mostly, because that's the highest horde density my PC can handle. I play zealot mostly. That Aura by itself would make me not pick up ammo at all with the way I play. I know this game ain't Vermintide but that's how I want to play it. I barely shoot in a mission. That aura would make me not pick up any ammo throughout the whole mission.
Survivalist is not as good as we like remember it to be unless your teammates play weapons with low ammo capacity. Such as kick back, rumbler, granade gauntlet, revolver etc. With very high ammo count weapons you barely notice survivelist considiring you unalive an elite or specialist every second. Close and kill %5 movement speed is not worth it at all. It does not give a noticible movement speed boost to you and your teammates. Fire team's %5 damage buff just by itself is not worth it as well however when you combine it focus target and also spend point on focused fire you can reach some unexpected breakpoints.
U can't dismiss fireteam because of "overkill" or "breakpoint". You don't dismiss focus target keystone addon for the same reason. You stack them together you have a passive teamwide 17% bonus damage. I wouldn't exactly call 12->17% a drop in the bucket.
Don’t you understand?? A Vet needs to be just a worse Zealot that shouts at enemies and group heals. They need to only take Plasma or revolver and the tooth pick. The vet needs to take all the support picks so the one idiot that’s playing any Ogryn build at all gets to do their thing without being a massive burden to the team.
5% dmg plus 10 percent heavy melee dmg from ogryn and plus 7.5 or whatever on psyker added together goes hard. Add in vet skills that give teammates more dmg and you see why coherent teammates are clutch.
@MisterEtide I know i like the quick cooldown for sure. But stacking raw dmg can be good too especially if everyone has taken their own perks in their trees to help cooldown and also have cooldown in their curios. How fast does a cooldown have to be brother!!! It's a viable thing to do. BTW I'm a survivalist support vet main. Gg love your content
@@BannedinlyfeFor most characters, particularly on highest difficulties, there is no limit to how much cooldown you want or need. That 10% cooldown is a faster ogryn charge meaning more bleed and stagger meaning more survivability, that is 3ish seconds off a psyker bubble, 4.5 seconds off of ogryn taunt, etc etc. cooldown is quite literally always helpful and on some characters is needed for lots of toughness regen / survivability. To a point I agree but at this point in time faster cooldown on highest difficulties is objectively always useful, just for the option alone, not to mention impact.
Staff psyker and melee ogryn don't care about your survivalist aura. Melee zealot probably conserves enough ammo anyways. Once again just a situational perspective preached as gospel. Survivalist is great for ranged builds who use ammo and don't want to worry as much about managing it. My barrage ogryn loves it. But in quickplay to assume everyone will benefit from it is stupid.
Rock does not have enough uptime to replace kickbacks or rumblers place in building especially in higher difficulty when you NEED to eliminate specials
Idc the slightest, what ppl bring to aurics. You do you, bae. But if I see you trolling around with assail psyker, thammer zealot, gunlugger or any veteran that doesn't run those exact three key notes in my H40 runs - fk off. Sincerely yours.
This is such a dumb video. I’m sorry but it’s fueling toxic community engagement. It’s not responsible considering your platform. For one: this type of thinking only really matters in high level difficulty. Two: the survivalist aura is more useful the more ammo dependent your teammates are. It’s effectively useless if, for example, you have two staff psyker and a zealot. I’d much rather have the other nodes. Three: you’re not accounting for the surrounding talent nodes, which are arguably better than that which surrounds survivalist. Four: this is fueling toxic engagement in the game. It’s already anti-social enough. People don’t talk in-game for a variety of reasons. Now they have to question whether people are judging them because of an aura pick which may not even matter depending on the team and level of difficulty?
Nah, don't blame ppl for playing however they want and stop asking ppl to meta play only and not experiment that's shitty. To me personally on about 350 hours of playtime the two reasons every time i lose is either mistiming where all team is out of cooldowns and with no ammo which admitedly is the thing we talk about but it's a base game core problem not a vet problem AND biggest issue i lose maps for and i only play damnation is that one piece of human trash selfish player, either a lasgun or autogun blue variants veteran, a twin stubber ogryn or a lasgun psyker. These three trash playstyles is what ruins games cuz ppl don't know jack about teamwork, they thing they play loser CoD or Halo where they are invincible. So i'd say ppl should adjust their builds rather just playstyles and learn how to teamwork, the rest of game balancing is on FatShark's bad optimizations and balancing cuz they know as little about balancing as those selfish full auto vets know about teamwork or the shitty rushing zealots who join, rush, die and rage quit.
My man you got 350 hours and only play standard damnation, which is perfectly fine. However coping and blaming your teammates is crazy. Don’t get me wrong teammates can be bad but the only common variable is you, and on damnation you can most certainly solo carry. Not to mention dual stubber ogryn is not a terrible choice, particularly at that difficulty. You gotta work on an improvement mentality lol
@@Calamity4 Never said i ain't a problem nor that i never improve nor don't want to improve, yeah i got carried and yeah i carried hard in damnation alot of times but that wasn't the point/ The point was specifically about those veteran and sometimes ogryn twin stubber players who waste ammo mindlessly shooting a bulwark's shield and crusher's chest cuz hitting armor with non armor weapons help -_- and then after wasting their ammo pick up all the ammo around despite their teammates being fully empty. I played and had to carry with zealot melee because i couldn't get a handful of bullets for my bolter in case ranged enemies appeared all because a veteran with a blue recon lasgun had 1100 out of max 1280 ammo and picked up a big bag,shot a bit then picked up another and obviously got pummled later on by would you believe it snipers and gunners cuz i had no range abilities and the aforementioned vet got downed and left so tell me that was somehow my skill issue? And this also happened to me while i played ogryn shield/decoy and someone put an ammo box, i taunted and bought them time to refil and reload and by the time they cleared the area so i can get the last charge cuz i also needed ammo a trash vet with yet again recon lasgun took two charges cuz he rlly needed them. Again i make mistakes myself so do many others and sometimes i carry and again so do many others, i never saw one of these selfish players carry nor have i ever seen a solo zealot rusher carry,they usually run ahead get killed and rage quit. So again biggest issues are ppl not understanding this game is not about them alone it's about the team on high diffs and that they aren't Halo or CoD MCs and are invincible and this comes down all to FatShark's lack of balancing abilities. Make ammo pickups not spammable so one player can't get all of them in less than a second,balance ammo usage a bit for different guns,make other guns more viable play around with the skills of character or anything. One solution would be when a vet uses survivalist on top of the teamwide effect the vet himself gets extra ammo that way that aura on top of helping the team helps the vet always be more or less topped up so more self sufficient.
@@Garl_Vinland only the dumb selfish ones, i play vet too sometimes the full auto guns aswel but when playing the full auto guns you gotta keep mind two things, one is you're the best at crowd mowing not boss fighting so if you have teammates with strong dmg on single targets let them deal with the crushers and such while you deal with the hordes and two always keep in mind your ammo economy and your teammates and these are the two things the dumb vets i talked about don't, they use low armor penetrating guns with low dmg per shot on the tankiest parts pf the tankiest enemies and expect miracles and only care about their ammo not their teammates not realizing them with 500 bullets on their blue infantry autogun will do less than a zealot with a bolt pistol and 20 bullets or something. Again it's all about team play which alot of ppl don't understand or refuse to understand, i have a couple friends who are that way too, one zealot obssesed stealth guy who gets himself killed every time while having a miraculous play once every 50 games and a gun psyker who only uses the gun and nothing from the psyker's kit thinking those proc naturally but they don't like scrier's gaze, he never activates it, so he plays a basic rifleman role worse than an actual base rifleman playstyle and build.
Problem is there are way too many players who want their mystical magical discovery adventure with their shitty exotic builds which they are absolutely convinced work better than everything the theory crafters have determined. These people have zero interest in being a team player, they just expect 3 other people to support their "fun", regardless if it's actually wasting everyone's time and effort. And yet suggest to them that they go experiment with their shitty exotic builds in a normal damnation, instead of in someone's havoc, and you're the bad guy. No dude, I'm just calling out your disrespect for the team and their time.
Why have skill trees in the game then? Why not just make the game where each character has fixed abilities, fixed weapons, and fixed comps? Because all of these things have been “cracked” why give players an option to begin with?
@@Garl_Vinland Because thats like saying why not only have Formula 1 supercars in every type of car race everywhere. Because they're only needed in the very pinnacle of racing, where every single percent of efficient performance matters. In lower levels you can afford to have players experiment with suboptimal builds and weapons, the stakes are lower and errors are not punished harshly. But when you're talking about upper level Havocs, it does matter. The most efficient build and loadout is an important part of taking your team responsibility seriously. I enjoy taking a burn stack recon las and krak grenade build into normal damnations to mess around and have fun setting things on fire. But I sure as fuck wont take that build into a Havoc 40 and waste everyone's time. I respect the 3 other people in the team and understand they expect me to bring every % of performance at that level.
@@grumpydroo That is such a terrible comparison to why the game is clearly balanced so horribly that only specific builds can enjoy content at all levels of play. You can beat Elden Ring with your starting gear, there's no excuse for bad design when you only have three roots to choose from in a "Build"
I PLAYED SURVIVALIST FOR 500 HOURS LET ME LIVE MY LIFE. It's a pve game let me lose if I want to Jesus christ. Preach whatever you want stop having people call me slurs or cuss me out when they died, I had to clutch for miles. This is a cry to witch hunt people trying features in the game. Tell fatshark to fix it not me to play how you want. I will agree Firing squad sucks tho, it's fun to mess with but it's the least viable. Sometimes to reach the bottom of the tree with enough points I need to take fucking close and kill. Also what I'm contributing to the team is not sucking, even with only mid weapons. Your meta builds suck if you can't play. Just tell people to practice, that's enough, improve and bring THAT to your lobbies. It's one thing to put out videos for fatshark, it's another to ask your community to tell people how to play.
Game devs often use data as a major influence on changes to the game, if the data shows people are using trash then it must be fine in thier eyes, the less people using bad things the more likely they'll be fixed
@@Ebb0Productions Yeah but it will unfortunately encourage toxicity in pubs and people throwing a hissy fit because they can't bear their teammates not playing the same boring ass meta loadout for everything.
literally bitching about the auras when a bunch of new players need the penances for the objectively bad ones, i get it but this screams bigger problem. the auras should feel like a choice that matters not "do i gimp myself this match for progress" kinda hoping all the unloved auras get reworked/buffed/something to feel like a choice
Perfect example of how to stay trash at this game, picking completely useless aura's and stuff and saying its the best. r u serious? xD When i solo havoc 40 i dont even need ammo, wth r talking about XD
@@Avatapaxn Loot ammo and you can shoot near infinitely, AND have all the juicy 1-shot breakpoints. Maps spawn much more ammo than you could ever need, but pubs don't loot.
No sir, your allies are already attacking the boss. Think about it from a dps perspective. If everyone does 5% more damage per second a boss dies 5% faster, not 20% faster.
Blame the penances.
I got so frustrated with solo yolo zealots on my team for the longest till i saw a look at the penances that make you play in that ass way.
Yeah lol when i was working on the smoke penance i used the movement speed aura
wanna know how I got the penance for the speed aura thingy? I played a game on the obsucra den map and got the penance before we planted the second charge. So no, I will not be blaming the penances
The Aura penances go by so fast though, most people will get them in a couple of games by just playing as actions done by randos count to their progress, people bringing non-meta auras is because they want to
It only matters on higher difficulties but the vet only has survivalist as an aura penance.
I will not tell anyone how to play.
But I will say this: If you bring the ammo aura... I see you. I notice you. I appreciate you. I love you. You are making a difference. You matter. You are important. I don't even care if you keep going down to poxwalkers. You are my friend and I thank you.
Don't blame the playerbase for being uninformed. Blame Fatshark for having shit talents.
Overall, the balance is so shit currently, and havoc just reinforced the balance issues.
what needs to be done is for fatshark to not make the ammo economy dependent on a single perk on a single character, so that vets can actually play the way they want rather than being forced to conform to their teams demands to ONLY use that one perk :)
Tbh that aura is best for vets even if you are playing with 3 staff psykers. All that ammo you get back is just insane.
yeah that would require the other auras to be buffed pretty good to be any better than 1% ammo on elite/spec kills. I would probably think to change the damage aura to be 10-20% on weakspots and the other to be 10% movement speed when moving towards an enemy
I refuse to use ammo aura.
As a weapon specialist enthusiast I only use movement aura
What you're telling me you don't want to play like it's vermintide and try to run in and melee the 20 aimbot shooters and four 99999rpm gunners all spread out in an open area??? Madness I tell ye!
Tanner Lindberg arc
LOL
Angry Femboy Arc
Thought the exact same thing, and I love it.
It's weird how Vet only has 1 aura.
yeah but how else am I gonna get the penance for using all of my ammunition?
😂 I got it with double barrel easy especially if you find a low intensity
0:25 "lawless wasteland" seems to be working as intended for a ragtag warband full of convicts, no?
I am the senate
Tbh, anybody that expects the random-group to 'just work' in any Co-Op-Game is just out of their mind.
Everytime I read or hear something like that I'm completely flabbergasted if this is the first time they're playing with any sort of quick match feature
@Oroberus matchmaking in any game is a roulette, idk why people think it would be different in a co-op game lol
@@thepurplebandit3859 And still, ppl act like entitled smoothbrains demanding that everybody should be 'capable, knowledged and skilled!' while this would not even be necessary if said entitled ppl would be 'capable, knowledged and skilled!' themself xD
Hear me out hypothetically I get both movement speed nodes and become even faster????
+10% Movement Speed
*Neuron Activation*
Anyone gonna mention Mr. E. Literally has a build on darktidebuilds called "best vet build in the game" made for current patch, that takes this aura :p
You fr?
the grenade too smh
Keep in mind this man did take 3 weeks to get a havoc 40 clear
Yeah this was one of my first thoughts when i saw this video
@@Areyassassinas far as i know it wasnt a skill issue
Okay you mentioned the ammo crate and now I have to rant: STOP DROPPING THE AMMO CRATE IN THE AIR LOCKS! Or, on a ledge right before people drop down, or an elevator; just stop! Think Tactically! There are FOUR CHARGES in the ammo crate. Put the crate down in the middle of an arena so it is accessible throughout the entire event. Then, the Plasma Gun Veteran can just go ham with the plasma gun and keep stocking up their ammo during the event. Or, a Gun Lugger Ogryn can keep the LMB button held down with suppressive fire and just keep dipping back into the ammo crate. I can't tell you how many times someone puts down an ammo crate in a air lock and I see two charges still on the crate and the door closes and it's gone forever. You've just pissed all that ammo (and damage) down the drain... Also, you only get 4 charges so don't waste a charge if you still have 80% of your ammo left. Wait till you are out of ammo and then pick up a charge. Or better, yet just leave it be and let the Vets or Ogryns have it. Yes, I'm looking at your Zealot that just holds down W and mashes the LMB and can't aim more than 5 meters you front of you. I know you IPAD kids just have to tap on the thing the second you see and have absolutely zero restraint, but again, think TACTICALLY...
Lol I do this a lot. Generally, it's because I'm playing a game with strangers that aren't communicating. The air locks and elevators are pause points where we're all huddled together, and everyone can see it's there and easily access it. Of course I only drop it if I see lots of red and yellow ammo counters. I'll also drop it at a big event point, really just depends on what comes first 🤷
Survivalist before the nerf was the most busted thing in the game.
How people look at it now and think 1% every 5 seconds is terrible don't understand how long 5 seconds really is.
Its the havoc goat unless you are psyker.
If this aura is not here, I'm taking a staff. Only if it's there do I consider going gun psyker (or gun Ogryn but that's not something I bring often).
For those who didn't play at launch, this game had next to no ammo then, even on the lowest difficulty, ammo was at an absolute premium, you frequently ran out of ammo for whole sections of missions even in the lowest difficulties, the game is designed to be a scavenger hunt for ammo, melee is called your primary weapon in game for a reason. You're supposed to run out of ammo in this game, this is a feature, not a biug, in fact it should be a lot more scarce than it is.
Ok Malice difficulty gamer.
Now that you're done, us auric and havic enjoyers are talking.
Nobody but me is helping me with penances lmao
Is survivalist the best vet aura? Ofc.
But I also think variety is nice so I will continue to run whatever aura I feel like.
I know ppl want the Ogryn to see some love, but I want FS to overhaul the Vet’s tree. Not only are 2 of his auras basic white-level nodes, his keystones are kind of meh. I find I play better without any of them. Why do I want to sit still and snipe on a horde shooter that requires constant melee? Or why do I want the occasional 10-20% dmg boost with Focus Target when I can only use it once in awhile. I can just use the points to get that damage all the time. Weapon Specialist is probably better than I tend to think, but I wasn’t thrilled with it either. Kind of just wish they’d rework his whole tree to be more interesting.
Guys it's okay he just forgot that penance, it's okay.
Congrats on 10k!
Thank you!!
If I can't play the Ogyrn I want, I'm sure as hell not playing a different vet build because others want me to.
I refuse to use ammo aura.
As a weapon specialist enthusiast I only use movement aura
Ah yeah, the "Did I even pick an ammo box this run?" aura.
I am watching this as I am preparing to play vet. thanks senpai
This is true for the VAST majority of builds.
However, I've found a niche use for Fire Team in a build that uses some razor-thin breakpoints on the Rashad axe for reliably one tapping on light attacks (without crit) the scab bruisers in hordes to allow for uninterrupted horde clear via bromentum. It completely trivialises hordes in Auric Maelstrom (I can just stand and spam lights all day) and it synergises especially well with Weapons Specialist to farm the free reloads. It's definitely a more selfish pick over the amazing utility Survivalist provides overall, though, and it struggles in high level Havoc due to ammo economy.
B-But Havoc 40 is the only game mode
“Ok guys. I’m doing penances so I have to die in the beginning, and don’t rez me.” ~ literal quote from a guy the other day. We all said ok, let him die, then left the game😂.
The problem is that the other 2 auras are too weak the should get buffed but knowing how this goes down fat shark will probably nerf survivalist again
happy new year, and congrats on reaching your goal
it really sucks having to give up so many talents to take survivalist on my favorite gimmick build :( hope they figure out a way to balance ammo a lil better at some point
In asia you only see any combination of krak, smoke, damage or movement speed aura.
Kinda feels like ogryn relies on veteran survivalist more than the veteran does I rarely have ammo issues in auric maelstrom although I’ll admit I don’t play much veteran and haven’t done havoc yet.
they can pick any blitz, all i ask for is Field improv for my fellow ogryn and zealot grenadiers
The old version is way too strong. Without a cooldown, the higher the difficulty, the more powerful the aura and that is the only aura that works like that, even this nerfed one is also like that. And after I saw the math you did, I started to worry it will get nerf again. lol
That's right, I run this aura on all my builds and it's a primary thing to include it.
Seeing vet without it is such a letdown in pub :/
It’s really not that helpful though.
@@J.B.1982 ye ye ok
I have a rule where if i see veteran content that only recommends survivalist, i like the video no questions asked.
"What if they don't bring survivalist?"
*We politely yet firmly ask them to leave*
I hate how they nerfed Survivalist, because they made it timed based, it punishes you for killing many Specialists ot Elites quickly, you could kill 10 Elites/Specialists within 5 seconds but only get ammo for 1 of them.
What they should of done was nerfed it quanity wise, changed it to 0.5% or 0.2% or something per kill, and you may say that might be so little that it would do nothing, but the counter to that would be they could of programmed it so that it accumulated a counter to trigger a 1% drop, so if it was 0.5% per kill, then every 2 kills is 1% given, or if 0.2% then every 5 kills gives you a 1% drop. Timed based nerf is just silly and punishing for players playing well.
You know he's being serious when he starts playing actual Darktide music 😂
Me with my little boy pants on: I guess I’ll never truly know the benefits of the survivalist aura… 😞
Penances got me feeling somthin fierce.
No. I'm going to use what I want.
Survivalist/Scavenger has been broken since this games conception in Closed Beta and it's baffling that people don't understand how overpowered literal ammo regen is.
I'm fine with people not taking Scavenger as long as they're efficient with their ammo so everyone can share the ammo pickups but most Vet players that aren't taking Survivalist, at least on Damnation QPlay, have the lowest damage with the most ammo collected. And considering the amount of ammo hungry players like Gunlugger Ogryns and Relic Zealots taking Survivalist is pretty much a must no matter what mode you're playing on because it will get to a point where even your melee focused builds are going to run out of ammo and encounters are going to become a struggle.
Also let's be real about ammo crates, it's ALWAYS 100% value if the Ogryn with Frag Bomb gets all 4 charges and you have Field Improv :)
Oygrn talent aura that is just he gives everyone 10% more ammunition & 5% attack speed or even 10% of both or just 20% more ammunition.
Movement speed one is the best
get out
@@MisterEtide Mogged by speed enjoyer
@@MisterEtideI am literally unable to detect sarcasm so.... You fr E?
we had MR E now we have MR EVIL
i love my ammo bags
You absolutely do not need survivalist in quickplay, at all. There's a ludicrous amount of ammo on the map, the only way to run out is if people are literally firing into horde or missing lots of shots. It is a skill issue if the team runs out of ammo. I discussed this on the discord recently and my point was that when looking back at my last auric game there were 23 light boxes picked up, 8 medium bags, and an entire full reload crate. At an asolute maximum everyone had their 100% starting ammo reserve and up to an additional 286% scattered around on the map. there is absolutely no reason that even 60% of that ammo shouldnt be enough, Auric has the opposite problem where it's not the case that you need survivalist, the ammo drops need to be nerfed.
Survivalist only becomes a valid pick in havoc and even then you're gimping yourself in other areas. You don't choose your aura based on aura for vet, you pick based on surrounding nodes. 5% damage literally does nothing, but grenade tinkerer does. 5% move speed does almost nothing, but agile engagement is one of the best nodes in the entire game.
In auric, all of the auras are useless, you pick for the other nodes and cheapest pathing because of all the taxes in the vet tree. Look at the nodes above survivalist, they're dog shit. Look at the nodes that come after survivalist, they're even worse. And then they path into exec stance which (although I like it and feel its strong) many people consider useless. Also as a point the 5% movement speed node and the 5% aura stack so that you can walk faster than horde enemies can attack you.
I feel your take on the issue is so one dimensional, even in havoc where ammo counts are reduced its entirely valid to avoid survivalist if it saves you points elsewhere that can be used to buy other really strong things.
EDIT: also watching deeper your math is so scuffed... you can't account for the wastage of ammo crates (which is valid) then assume you can proc survivalist every second, on the the dot, for the entire game. It's efficiency is no where near that high. Like yes it's very good but your math literally shows nothing of value in terms of comparison.
Technically we don't need any ammo at all if everyone in the team is a melee God. But that's not the point. The point is that it gives the team a shitload of resources. If there are gunluggers and gunpsykers on the team, it can be a total gamechanger for them.
For havoc40 I fail to see which talents are so insanely important to get that you feel like gimping zealots and ogryns in the team.
@@Ebb0Productions those people are gimping themself if they take weapons they cant reasonably sustain with. Like I said though havoc is the only place survivalist is actually good.
Depending on the vet setup both grenade tinkerer and agile engagement are huge. Grenadier vet is one of the strongest builds in havoc right now with it's on 1m cooldown ogryn nukes.
Agile engagement is also needed by a lot of current meta weapons for solid one tap breakpoints like the BP or combat blade. Though most seem to be running DS which doesnt really need it.
how much ammo, time, and health is saved by one shotting an enemy rather than two shotting?
You said this better than I would have.
I would add: this level of thinking is still only relevant in high level difficulties and as far as the survivalist aura, if you’re running with non gun using classes it becomes almost useless. I’d rather have the other auras helping out my psyker.
@@J.B.1982 for sure, in anything outside of havoc 31+ survivalist is just as low impact as every other option. The sorta sad thing about the 5% damage aura is that it's just a straight downgrade of the psykers 5% crit aura which is pretty solid. I can get they want to avoid classes having the same effects but honestly they could both have the aura and it'd be fine.
@@bradley6471 yeah, I agree. They could do a lot more with that aura.
Why do you prefer using auto gun with combat blade instead of plasma gun with duelling sword?
I don’t, that’s just a random incomplete loadout i had from prior to dueling sword on veteran
Don't blame the players. Blame Fatshark for nerfing the talent cause of pick rate. Nobody uses it because they know how good it was before the nerf and how bad it is now.
Jokes on you Mister E because I love me ammo bone head like ta ammo shouty likes his ammo and I like when boss gives as all the ammo
fire team god working with plasma
It's a mystery what it's like out there in solo q and why lol.
As much as I agree that survivalist is the best aura on vet by FAR, let people play the way they want and please don't throw a hissy fit if your quick play teammates don't play the game optimally.
Ultimately playing optimally is a choice and it isn't one you shouldn't force on others(especially strangers over the internet).
However if you are going into auric damnation or havoc I would argue that having at least somewhat optimal perks and/or weapons should be the bare minimum.
Ps: havoc nerfing ammo pickups/crates basically just exasperates the survivalist issue and I would argue that its makes the aura damn near mandatory
This hissy fit is because i tried to run a kickback ogryn in havoc and NEITHER vet had it lol
As a vet player I’m tired of other players wanting vet to be a support shout slut for THEIR power fantasy.
Yeah of course I have that on my vet build (I haven’t played vet in 6+months) *checks build* 😬.
This is why I play staff psycher
Survivalist does not scratch the itch for ammo that my Braced Autogun requires
Boltgun is better in every way. This is 40k not cod lol
@@kwm1995 I dont play Cod, this is my Jin Roh full auto power fantasy, fuck warhammer lol
THIS IS SO TRUE! Quickplay damnation has become a CESSPOOL of bad players with even worse build choices. I literally cannot win a game without playing stealth zealot to revive my teammates AT LEAST 20 TIMES PER PERSON
Best advice I can give is look at a players setup in lobby and if they aren't running something seen on gameslantern leave immediately as they aren't even putting effort into understanding what other better players build or use in this game lmao
For like two weeks, just for fun I ran a melee vet stealth build with 10% Revive Speed on curios, taking the No One Left Behind talent. You rez people in one second, it was hilarious.
jokes on you, i can't read (bone head implant not working)
Buff the other 2 so they can actually keep up with Survivalist
I don't think there is a reasonable way to buff the other auras to the point where they can compete against survivalist without breaking the game even more. Survivalist is completely broken, has always been and the only way for other auras to compete is for survivalist to be completely reworked or removed. The devs can't balance the ammo economy in missions properly when whether or not your team has survivalist makes such a massive difference.
If you buff the move speed aura too much then all players can outrun enemies and you break the game. For the damage aura to be worth it it would need to be something insane like 25%-50% and even then the ammo from survivalist would likely be worth more and that kind of aura might make playing with it feel bad because of the massive fluctuation of your damage based on coherency makes it very unpredictable for other players and if the other players kinda just ignore the buff and don't plan around it, playing normally, then a lot of it is just wasted as overkill damage.
All 3 of veterans auras should be reworked completely for there to be 3 viable options for veterans to choose from.
@@Pakana_ The speed aura just needs a little tweaking imo. I would like to see it give you more dodge distance and dodge count OR more dodge regen speed and dodge count. The movement speed can be buffed to like 10%.
Fire team is useless. Whole ass rework needed. You cant just increase the damage to 20% instead of 5 either. I was thinking, since you're going down middle tree towards shout AND towards focus target, to make fire team give you benefits for killing tagged enemies, similar to witch hunter captain in V2. Something like more critchance, attack speed, reload speed for the whole team. Not damage.
I dont know how good these changes are, but we need something that actually makes players think twice before grabbing survivalist. Like right now the other 2 are not even comparable lol.
*On Havok? Yes, have at least 1 Vet running Survivalist.*
Anything else is pretty much skill issue if you can't beat it without extra ammo being printed. (Granted, someone's ammo-dependant build can be kneecapped by someone else hogging ammo)
"What are you tryna tell me, I can make more ammo?"
"No Reject, I'm saying when you're ready... you won't have to."
Happy new yeahr. pls change youre builds on game lantern its confusing. :-)
does it stack with 2 or 3 vets?
No, auras dont stack so you should mix and match
Remember when Surivivalist was just a part of Vet's kit and things were pretty good? Making it 1/3 auras is silly becasue it just makes the other 2 auras absolutely worthless and not even worth thinking it about unless you are memeing. It is silly.
except the only place survivalist is not useless is if you're dog at the game and can't aim, or you're playing high havoc. Even at high havoc it's not even must pick territory it's just very strong. You don't pick the other auras for their effect, you pick them for the surrounding nodes and cheap pathing so you can get all the talent taxes you need further down for breakpoints.
That’s just flat out wrong.
To play Devils advocate for Fire Team: in theory, it adds up to 20% extra damage (EDIT i mean, not 20% damage to the entire team of course, but since 4 players get extra 5% it's sort of equivalent to boosting one player with 20%damage), if everyone is in coherency all the time. This never happenes in practice of course, but it's a bigger ceiling than a mere 5%. It's true of course that 5% never (or almost never) is enough by itself to reach new breakpoints leading much of that damage to get wasted as overkill, outside of bosses. However, you can't assume that everyone is always attacking completely undamaged enemies. Often you will attack someone who's taken a smidge of damage from a stray bullet from a magdump, a sweaping attack from an ally, a bit of fire from a barrel etc. Also, there's loads of different other damage increases that will affect you from time to time, which might allow you to use an attack less when adding another 5% damage. Also don't forget that despire it's name it adds damage to all attacks, not just ranged.
All that said; yes, Survivalist is indeed the superior choice (especially on Havoc) but you're not representing the other auras fairly in this video.
5% spread between four guys is always worse than 20% because it won’t actually change any breakpoints.
@GuyMan8383 Agreed. And it won't achieve new breakpoints by itself. But as I mentioned, you're not always attacking fully healthy enemies using the optimal combo. And often there are other damage bonuses affecting you as well. So sometimes even a 5% damage increase will in fact put you over a breakpoint threshold.
Hey at least everything works fine and is fun for most at damnation qp level which Fatshark should be balancing for anyways, Auric board exists for metagamers and Havoc isnt real because the balance is so ass and streamlined into the same 3 builds(ogryn aint shit in havoc no matter what lets be honest). Also this video feels personally aimed at people who dont bring survivalist to havoc and you just ended a game wihout lol
crazy all the perma Heresy players in the comments coping about their bad builds.
Crazy how Heresy is the most fun because you can play any build you want, where as every other difficulty funnels the playstyle into revolver duelling sword every time. Guess people don’t like fun
@@Garl_Vinlandheresy is braindead boring though and you cant even enjoy gimmick builds becuase of it, you can still use complete dogwater builds in damnation as long as you arent complete ass at the game yourself, i personally jump in damnation qp myself with smoke nades for fun and its good enough
@@marcuso7350 So Havoc is really the outliar game mode that gatekeeps?
@@Garl_Vinland cool dude, and you're allowed to do that, but coping that 'erm actually this smoke grenade movement speed aura vet build is good because I win my heresy games' is dumb as hell.
@@wulf2757 I win damnation too. Just not post Havoc 25 because the game is unbalanced as fuck.
Outside havoc mode you can play anything you want. Also smokes nades are usefull in operatives mision like the train. You have to adapt your playstyle if no survivalist that's all.
This is mostly meant as a havoc discussion, since the value is multiplied there
I kept taking “the best grenades” and found that my survival rate drastically increased when I dropped them and took the utility smoke grenades instead. Switching your weapon for more dps, rather than a pre emptive reload is the best way to die in higher difficulties.
bringing fire team because there was no segment on how much the other two needs to be buffed to compete. :D :P
Nuh-uh
You got me there
I thought fire team was 5% per person, that not being the case is a joke.
It is. It's an aura that applies to everyone in coherency. With four people in coherency the team as a whole is putting out 20% bonus damage which can make or break heavily armored enemy blobs or bosses.
This guy is just shit at math.
@graveyardshift6691 no they arent. The team was already doing 100% and now they are doing 105%. They can handle 5% more horde or kill a boss 5% faster. The team is doing “”20% bonus damage”” but they were doing 400% damage before.
This is like telling me that the team runs 20% faster as a whole when you run the 5% speed aura.
Looks like youre the one whos shit at math 😂
@@MisterEtide I'm new on PS5 and that's what has confused me I guess. I thought it was a 5% stack per person, not a flat 5%, which makes it pointless to run like the 5% movement speed. I just read it wrong I guess and never bothered to read it again lol. Unless you don't have the spare points to move across the tree for whatever reason it's dumb.
Darktide has a nasty habit of not wording things correctly and cause a lot of confusion on what their effects really mean@@swaggadash9017
@@MisterEtide Already addressed the part about the speed on close and kill.
Your team is doing 120% damage when in coherency. That's how it works. If your team is only doing 105%. someone is out of position.
I play on Heresy mostly, because that's the highest horde density my PC can handle. I play zealot mostly. That Aura by itself would make me not pick up ammo at all with the way I play. I know this game ain't Vermintide but that's how I want to play it. I barely shoot in a mission. That aura would make me not pick up any ammo throughout the whole mission.
But I like Field Improv :)
Any updated shouty boy builds?
Survivalist is not as good as we like remember it to be unless your teammates play weapons with low ammo capacity. Such as kick back, rumbler, granade gauntlet, revolver etc. With very high ammo count weapons you barely notice survivelist considiring you unalive an elite or specialist every second.
Close and kill %5 movement speed is not worth it at all. It does not give a noticible movement speed boost to you and your teammates.
Fire team's %5 damage buff just by itself is not worth it as well however when you combine it focus target and also spend point on focused fire you can reach some unexpected breakpoints.
My favorite thing about this is that there are Veteran builds for Havoc on this channel that do not take shredder grenades or survivalist...
I have made exactly 1 vet build since havoc and it uses both of these. My older stuff yea i didnt believe it as firmly as i do now
Has this video been approved by Tanner?
Try to make a shotgun build for a veteran who has a special attack with a fire shot, add a blessing for bleeding and an increased cleave on crit. =)
tks bro
You don't pay my sub!!!
U can't dismiss fireteam because of "overkill" or "breakpoint". You don't dismiss focus target keystone addon for the same reason. You stack them together you have a passive teamwide 17% bonus damage. I wouldn't exactly call 12->17% a drop in the bucket.
There is no build that should be running redirect fire and focused fire AND if you are another 5% MATTERS EVEN LESS
Don’t you understand?? A Vet needs to be just a worse Zealot that shouts at enemies and group heals. They need to only take Plasma or revolver and the tooth pick. The vet needs to take all the support picks so the one idiot that’s playing any Ogryn build at all gets to do their thing without being a massive burden to the team.
5% dmg plus 10 percent heavy melee dmg from ogryn and plus 7.5 or whatever on psyker added together goes hard. Add in vet skills that give teammates more dmg and you see why coherent teammates are clutch.
You should be taking the 10% cooldown aura on psyker, its one of the best auras available
@MisterEtide I know i like the quick cooldown for sure. But stacking raw dmg can be good too especially if everyone has taken their own perks in their trees to help cooldown and also have cooldown in their curios. How fast does a cooldown have to be brother!!! It's a viable thing to do. BTW I'm a survivalist support vet main. Gg love your content
@@BannedinlyfeFor most characters, particularly on highest difficulties, there is no limit to how much cooldown you want or need. That 10% cooldown is a faster ogryn charge meaning more bleed and stagger meaning more survivability, that is 3ish seconds off a psyker bubble, 4.5 seconds off of ogryn taunt, etc etc. cooldown is quite literally always helpful and on some characters is needed for lots of toughness regen / survivability.
To a point I agree but at this point in time faster cooldown on highest difficulties is objectively always useful, just for the option alone, not to mention impact.
Survivalist is good, what a hot take
Staff psyker and melee ogryn don't care about your survivalist aura. Melee zealot probably conserves enough ammo anyways. Once again just a situational perspective preached as gospel. Survivalist is great for ranged builds who use ammo and don't want to worry as much about managing it. My barrage ogryn loves it. But in quickplay to assume everyone will benefit from it is stupid.
Melee ogryn still needs kickback ammo and this solves it, same with rumbler, its huge for him
Melee Ogryn doesn’t need kickback. Just take rock. You get rock refills for free.
Rock does not have enough uptime to replace kickbacks or rumblers place in building especially in higher difficulty when you NEED to eliminate specials
@@isaacwallette6929 The specials you need to worry about as an Ogryn at those levels are gunners.
skill issue
Nah i dont that i will
Idc the slightest, what ppl bring to aurics. You do you, bae.
But if I see you trolling around with assail psyker, thammer zealot, gunlugger or any veteran that doesn't run those exact three key notes in my H40 runs - fk off.
Sincerely yours.
You’ve listed all my favourite builds
I would if the points allowed me. Veteran just runs out.
This is such a dumb video. I’m sorry but it’s fueling toxic community engagement. It’s not responsible considering your platform.
For one: this type of thinking only really matters in high level difficulty.
Two: the survivalist aura is more useful the more ammo dependent your teammates are. It’s effectively useless if, for example, you have two staff psyker and a zealot. I’d much rather have the other nodes.
Three: you’re not accounting for the surrounding talent nodes, which are arguably better than that which surrounds survivalist.
Four: this is fueling toxic engagement in the game. It’s already anti-social enough. People don’t talk in-game for a variety of reasons. Now they have to question whether people are judging them because of an aura pick which may not even matter depending on the team and level of difficulty?
Nah, don't blame ppl for playing however they want and stop asking ppl to meta play only and not experiment that's shitty.
To me personally on about 350 hours of playtime the two reasons every time i lose is either mistiming where all team is out of cooldowns and with no ammo which admitedly is the thing we talk about but it's a base game core problem not a vet problem AND biggest issue i lose maps for and i only play damnation is that one piece of human trash selfish player, either a lasgun or autogun blue variants veteran, a twin stubber ogryn or a lasgun psyker. These three trash playstyles is what ruins games cuz ppl don't know jack about teamwork, they thing they play loser CoD or Halo where they are invincible.
So i'd say ppl should adjust their builds rather just playstyles and learn how to teamwork, the rest of game balancing is on FatShark's bad optimizations and balancing cuz they know as little about balancing as those selfish full auto vets know about teamwork or the shitty rushing zealots who join, rush, die and rage quit.
My man you got 350 hours and only play standard damnation, which is perfectly fine. However coping and blaming your teammates is crazy. Don’t get me wrong teammates can be bad but the only common variable is you, and on damnation you can most certainly solo carry.
Not to mention dual stubber ogryn is not a terrible choice, particularly at that difficulty. You gotta work on an improvement mentality lol
@@Calamity4 Never said i ain't a problem nor that i never improve nor don't want to improve, yeah i got carried and yeah i carried hard in damnation alot of times but that wasn't the point/ The point was specifically about those veteran and sometimes ogryn twin stubber players who waste ammo mindlessly shooting a bulwark's shield and crusher's chest cuz hitting armor with non armor weapons help -_- and then after wasting their ammo pick up all the ammo around despite their teammates being fully empty.
I played and had to carry with zealot melee because i couldn't get a handful of bullets for my bolter in case ranged enemies appeared all because a veteran with a blue recon lasgun had 1100 out of max 1280 ammo and picked up a big bag,shot a bit then picked up another and obviously got pummled later on by would you believe it snipers and gunners cuz i had no range abilities and the aforementioned vet got downed and left so tell me that was somehow my skill issue? And this also happened to me while i played ogryn shield/decoy and someone put an ammo box, i taunted and bought them time to refil and reload and by the time they cleared the area so i can get the last charge cuz i also needed ammo a trash vet with yet again recon lasgun took two charges cuz he rlly needed them.
Again i make mistakes myself so do many others and sometimes i carry and again so do many others, i never saw one of these selfish players carry nor have i ever seen a solo zealot rusher carry,they usually run ahead get killed and rage quit.
So again biggest issues are ppl not understanding this game is not about them alone it's about the team on high diffs and that they aren't Halo or CoD MCs and are invincible and this comes down all to FatShark's lack of balancing abilities. Make ammo pickups not spammable so one player can't get all of them in less than a second,balance ammo usage a bit for different guns,make other guns more viable play around with the skills of character or anything. One solution would be when a vet uses survivalist on top of the teamwide effect the vet himself gets extra ammo that way that aura on top of helping the team helps the vet always be more or less topped up so more self sufficient.
I was with you until you dissed the full auto vet
@@Garl_Vinland only the dumb selfish ones, i play vet too sometimes the full auto guns aswel but when playing the full auto guns you gotta keep mind two things, one is you're the best at crowd mowing not boss fighting so if you have teammates with strong dmg on single targets let them deal with the crushers and such while you deal with the hordes and two always keep in mind your ammo economy and your teammates and these are the two things the dumb vets i talked about don't, they use low armor penetrating guns with low dmg per shot on the tankiest parts pf the tankiest enemies and expect miracles and only care about their ammo not their teammates not realizing them with 500 bullets on their blue infantry autogun will do less than a zealot with a bolt pistol and 20 bullets or something. Again it's all about team play which alot of ppl don't understand or refuse to understand, i have a couple friends who are that way too, one zealot obssesed stealth guy who gets himself killed every time while having a miraculous play once every 50 games and a gun psyker who only uses the gun and nothing from the psyker's kit thinking those proc naturally but they don't like scrier's gaze, he never activates it, so he plays a basic rifleman role worse than an actual base rifleman playstyle and build.
@@SHAdow98V I can literally kill a beast of Nurgle or a fully charged captain shield with one clip of my autogun ammo.
Problem is there are way too many players who want their mystical magical discovery adventure with their shitty exotic builds which they are absolutely convinced work better than everything the theory crafters have determined. These people have zero interest in being a team player, they just expect 3 other people to support their "fun", regardless if it's actually wasting everyone's time and effort. And yet suggest to them that they go experiment with their shitty exotic builds in a normal damnation, instead of in someone's havoc, and you're the bad guy. No dude, I'm just calling out your disrespect for the team and their time.
Why have skill trees in the game then? Why not just make the game where each character has fixed abilities, fixed weapons, and fixed comps? Because all of these things have been “cracked” why give players an option to begin with?
@@Garl_Vinland Because thats like saying why not only have Formula 1 supercars in every type of car race everywhere. Because they're only needed in the very pinnacle of racing, where every single percent of efficient performance matters.
In lower levels you can afford to have players experiment with suboptimal builds and weapons, the stakes are lower and errors are not punished harshly. But when you're talking about upper level Havocs, it does matter. The most efficient build and loadout is an important part of taking your team responsibility seriously.
I enjoy taking a burn stack recon las and krak grenade build into normal damnations to mess around and have fun setting things on fire. But I sure as fuck wont take that build into a Havoc 40 and waste everyone's time. I respect the 3 other people in the team and understand they expect me to bring every % of performance at that level.
@@grumpydroo That is such a terrible comparison to why the game is clearly balanced so horribly that only specific builds can enjoy content at all levels of play.
You can beat Elden Ring with your starting gear, there's no excuse for bad design when you only have three roots to choose from in a "Build"
I PLAYED SURVIVALIST FOR 500 HOURS LET ME LIVE MY LIFE. It's a pve game let me lose if I want to Jesus christ. Preach whatever you want stop having people call me slurs or cuss me out when they died, I had to clutch for miles. This is a cry to witch hunt people trying features in the game. Tell fatshark to fix it not me to play how you want. I will agree Firing squad sucks tho, it's fun to mess with but it's the least viable. Sometimes to reach the bottom of the tree with enough points I need to take fucking close and kill. Also what I'm contributing to the team is not sucking, even with only mid weapons. Your meta builds suck if you can't play. Just tell people to practice, that's enough, improve and bring THAT to your lobbies. It's one thing to put out videos for fatshark, it's another to ask your community to tell people how to play.
Game devs often use data as a major influence on changes to the game, if the data shows people are using trash then it must be fine in thier eyes, the less people using bad things the more likely they'll be fixed
it's not a personal attack dude, it's okay to just smile and politely decline :p
@@Ebb0Productions Yeah but it will unfortunately encourage toxicity in pubs and people throwing a hissy fit because they can't bear their teammates not playing the same boring ass meta loadout for everything.
literally bitching about the auras when a bunch of new players need the penances for the objectively bad ones, i get it but this screams bigger problem. the auras should feel like a choice that matters not "do i gimp myself this match for progress" kinda hoping all the unloved auras get reworked/buffed/something to feel like a choice
The choice is just so insanely lopsided here
This is primarily a Auric/Havoc discussion
Perfect example of how to stay trash at this game, picking completely useless aura's and stuff and saying its the best. r u serious? xD
When i solo havoc 40 i dont even need ammo, wth r talking about XD
Cooking with this one.
If you really think 5% damage is irrelevant, you've never tested Plasma Gun breakpoints.
Is 5% damage worth not being able to shoot near infinitely? No, not really.
@@Avatapaxn Loot ammo and you can shoot near infinitely, AND have all the juicy 1-shot breakpoints. Maps spawn much more ammo than you could ever need, but pubs don't loot.
This has been the case since day 1
Its %5 for you AND your allies, thats %20. That is 40,000 not 47600.
No sir, your allies are already attacking the boss. Think about it from a dps perspective. If everyone does 5% more damage per second a boss dies 5% faster, not 20% faster.
@@MisterEtidepercentages are hard lol
Why do people keep saying this?
5% each is 5% total for the team.
Each= team.