Stop Adjusting The Action On Your Guitar
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- Опубликовано: 23 июн 2024
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This is spot-on. The neck relief is what I always check first. I also like a neck that is almost dead straight. If the relief is how I like it, i know that I won’t have to do much with anything else.
Well done
Absolutely, setup 101. The best necks I've played are on Shijie S and T type guitars, owner is a luthier with a deep love for those models. Some necks are just wanky, even on old Gibson and Fender guitars, others are totally stable forever.
I’ve only been playing guitar for 6mos and I’ve already learned to check the neck relief first if action has changed. It was all very intimidating 6mos ago but now it seems basic.
Exactly. I'm a bender and need a bit of relief... 0.010 at the 8th while capo on 1st, and holding down string at last. I have seen that I like the relief to be equal to the gauge the little E string is. Using 10s, its 10... using 9s, its 9. I havent tried it with 8s or 11s... lol. So i dont know if that trend continues tho. Haha.
A neck that is almost dead straight the strings will buzz like crazy, the bow in the neck should be the deepest at either the twelfth fret or half the scale length of the guitar.
Right on man it's absolutely ridiculous how much media influences people into thinking that they need stuff or need to do stuff that they don't need to do
Theres a reason they come with an allen wrench
This supports the order of operations when checking the setup of a guitar.
1. Chosen string gauge at the chosen pitch.
2. Truss rod adjusted to have chosen relief for #1.
After these 2 steps are performed to the desired goal, one can…
3. Start futzing with other adjustments to the saddles/bridge/neck angle/nut height/etc…
One has to follow these steps. Jumping ahead to #3 before confirming #1 & #2 is a waste of time and guaranteed frustration.
When the neck relief shifts with the seasons, the string pitch changes. For example: it gets dry, the neck bows a little, the string is still straight and level , but the distance between the nut and bridge is now shorter, therefore the strings are now flat. Just giving a little tightening to the truss rod back to the predetermined relief will find the strings back in their desired pitch.
I just went through this with a new to me Knaggs. I was going crazy chasing intonation and action height and one saddle was maxed out in one direction and wasn't in tune. I wound up adjusting the neck and normalizing the bridge height and it's now perfectly intonation and plays better than ever. Spent 2 days on a 2 minute fix. Thanks for sharing Dylan!
I knew that it mattered (I guess) but I honestly had no idea that neck relief affected everything *that* much - like, to the point that saddles could be maxed out and STILL the intonation is off.
I've had that problem before as well, on my first ever guitar and never would have thought to adjust the truss rod. I was also scared to do it, if I'm honest lol. I was told not to mess around with it!!
I have to adjust all my guitars relief twice a year. Everything else was adjusted once. Spot on video.
Best. Advice. Ever. I now understand the relationship between intonation and neck relief. Thank you so much.
The wood on cheaper guitars isn't dried as long as expensive guitars before shaping and so they change as they dry. In my experience, after two years they are as stable as any and if not, get rid of them. I think necks get blamed for cheap tuner instability as well. I put Gotoh locking tuners on everything. Every string is has the exact same temperature drift in tuning on hot days. That's the strings changing length, not the neck. Good stuff Dylan - thanks!
I agree with that, but I exclude Gibson Nashville from that I think that’s why they have so many QC issues. I love my Gibson guitars, but I think they’re more in to cost savings
@@dlmyrs KKR owns Gibson. And is only concerned about investment returns. Cost cutting and revenue increases are a must to meet their WACC, ROIC and EBITDA measurements.
And while all companies are concerned about earnings and cash flow, PE's are a lot more aggressive and cutthroat about it. Large PE's have the clout of large public companies but far less oversight.
I'm speaking with experience as I have to deal with these types daily.
this must be why the low e on my new MiM strat started buzzing at every fret after 2 hot days lol
Locking tuners aren't for tuning stability. It's for string changes
It only takes 15 days to dry most woods
Great video Dylan, most guitar usually just need a Truss Rod adjustment, especially if you live where you have all 4 seasons, A humidifier is your best friend, ever since a started to run a humidifier in my music room in the winter months I find almost all my guitars need way fewer adjustments.
Dylan…I’ve been guilty of grabbing wrenches and hogging away until I’m so deep in the weeds I can’t get out…but I learned my lesson 👍
A great point in this video. Thanks for making it. As neck relief changes you may also hear a difference as the strings move away from the pickups. I have also found that bridges don't move, except, for Fender offset style bridges. The string down force on the two screws takes its toll over time. I have found multiple Squier Jazzmasters and Jaguars that strings hitting pickups just from hanging on a guitar shop wall too long. Locktite can help fight this
I bought a new Kramer Baretta Vintage, with Floyd Rose. After checking everything I found that, like yours, the neck had a forward bow (I used a ruler the same length as the neck). It now has an ever so slightly back bow, but the intonation is perfect, no string buzz and the string action is very low.
Excellent teaching and coaching! Thank you for the guitar wisdom!
I have discovered that the same neck relief (after confirming the minimal string clearance at the third fret) used as a basis for the same string height (regardless of sting scale length or even diameter of strings) leaves only the need for intonation adjustment. Once all that is done once, the neck bow is the major variable subject to environmental conditions. Returning the "action' to my "feel" is done without gauges. That way I only need to carry the correct tool for that adjustment on the guitars taken to the gig. Each tool is labeled to correlate with however many guitars it fits.
Excellent, comprehensive explanation of precisely why. Thank you for sharing your wisdom & energy.-All the Best!
I have a PRS Custom 24 with a torrified maple neck/fingboard. This is an SE model and was made in Korea. I have owned this guiitar for about 5 years or so and have not had to adjust the neck until just last week. Incredible.
My Gibson Les Paul didn’t need adjustment until its 5 year either during a very dry spell.
I have some guitars that I just keep the truss rod covers off of.
Thank you, Dylan. I have always struggled with guitar setup and things like neck relief. I don't know why it's so hard for me, but this video helped me.
I had this experience once a while. A pefect Intonation as i got my Guitar, a month or two later, Action too high, Intonation gone, another Month later perfect...
Now i know why, cheers.
And about Epiphone and Gibson: I own a Epiphone, actually 2 Epiphones and my Mate owns a Gibson Les Paul, well...it is a complete different Story with the Gibson, you can feel the difference and if i ever get enough money i will try to get an really old Gibson.
You are 100% correct. Always start with the relief.
100% correct. The truss rod is the first and sometimes the only thing to adjust
Most informative video I have personally seen on this subject. Thank you for this!
Very practical and good. Good point on the stability issue. Most players probably don't consider that!
Great video!
Amusingly, at times I pick up a guitar that has been stored away and part of me feels that due to changes in playing style and tastes, I may readjust a guitar's setup.
I agree to every piece of advice here, thank you so much! It took me years of trial and error, to come up with ~same approach , to understand which adjustments matter, _and in which order_.
Plain and simple advice. That is what knowledgeable and honest people give. I thank you for that.
Very interesting. I'll take note.
This was excellent, and great demo. Thanx !
Great video, and you explain things very well as usual.
PRS is known for processing their necks to make them more ridged. There's a great factory video in Maryland where they focus on that. If I find the link I'll post it 😊
I agree, for years I had heard, don't adjust your action via changing your neck relief. Then I watched a highly respected luthier in my town do just that for my vintage LP. He also didn't stick to the commonly echoed technique of turning the tension rod only a quarter turn at a time for days on end. He said you only do that for very old and valuable guitars as a precaution For all guitars, if it is not easily moving then proceed with caution but within reason. You should always be careful not to strip the nut, but in most cases the" quarter turn at a time, wait a day repeat rule" isn't necessary .
So cool! Thank you!
Subscribed!
Very clear, and very useful video...thanks!
Aaahhh, yep! I tune my guitar, check the intonation, and then play it. The only time I’ve ever had an issue with set up after initially done was when I put a completely different gauge of strings on it. And mainly it was neck relief because of different tension (and I probably should have done the nut slots but 🤷♀️). Great video. Just play the damn thing.
Neck relief is my issue. Low humidity in the summer, high in the winter. Once or twice a year, a small neck relief adjustment is required on a few of my guitars. Once I setup a guitar, other adjustments are almost never necessary.
Here in the Central Valley of California, we get high humidity sometimes in the summer if clouds come to us through Arizona from the Golf of Mexico in the summer. But mostly we have dry heat. If I use the heater in the house in the winter, it dries out the air, but I run a humidifier. I’m don’t run the humidifier in the summer because I can’t stand it.
Great tip and video, Dylan, thanks a lot.
I always go straight to the truss rod, I rarely adjust the action at the saddles. If anything I'm a little too trigger happy with the neck adjustments, but I really like play my neck with an exact relief and when it changes it's the only thing I can think about when playing. It's a slippery slope.
I do all my own setups including some other stuff, fret leveling for one. I own a 1974 Guild D35 Dreadnaught that I bought new in 1975 when I was 19 years old, in those days all Guild guitars were made in the USA in Westerly RI,.......
..........and I have never had it set up since I bought it almost 50 years ago!
I don't play it much, I play my electrics almost exclusively these days, but I took it out just yesterday to play, because the power went out and I had nothing to do,..... and t's still perfect, it's almost completely unbelievable!
Great video. Thanks a lot 😃👍
Well said. Spot on
Living in the northeast US with cold dry winters and hot humid summers I run humidifiers and dehumidifiers in the room where my guitars stay. Even with that I still get a difference of 20% from the lowest in the winter to the highest in the summer with occasional larger swings on extreme days. With a collection in the neighborhood of +/- 2 dozen I find that once I have them set up I don't really have to do anything to them. Even seasonal changes don't seem to make a difference. Once every few years I might have to give one truss rod a small adjustment. The only time I have to mess with the hardware is if I take all the strings off and manage to bump something out of place.
This makes so much sense, i think subconsciously I put truss rod last on my adjustment priorities because of warnings about doing damage to it. But now i know what im doing this is going to be my starting point. Cheers 🍻
Thanks, Dylan. Great advice.
Great explanation!
great advice a lot to think about for someone who doesn't usually do that kind of work on their guitar
Right-on. If any-one knows how-to it is you Dylan. Now, I have a 335 with P90 dogears( yes 335). It is a custim shop and it sounds fantastic un-plugged, is there a way to get closer to a Humbucking bridge tone without putting a new pixkup in, like maybe stuffung the cavity under the pickup with some-thing( metal, wood, rubber)? Thankyou.
Good tips. Thanks.
Yep, you can think of the neck/body combo as a bow (as in bow and arrow).
If the bow part expands/contracts (straightens/bends), or the tension of the string changes, the distance between the string and the bow has to change correspondingly.
Adjusting the truss rod just lets the bow-part bend less/more. The tuning of the strings is like when you draw the bow's string, just more or less permanent.
So if your guitar has gone flat while sitting, you likely need to tighten the truss rod.
If it's gone sharp, you probably need to loosen it.
Hell, we get re-rain here in Atlanta. It'll throw a sudden shower so hard, you can't see, then it steams off in minutes, and re-rains few miles away.
Ride the TRAIN is what I was taught.
Tune
Relief
Action
Intonation
Noodle
It's amazing how much the first two fix the last two most of the time.
Great tip as it makes sense. I'm just playing hell getting my G&L ASAT Classic setup to not buzz.
spot on! In some cases, the strings can slightly oxidize, which also changes intonation. Used strings as well will change intonation. In both instances, simply change the strings with the same gauge and brand!
Bull, even Joe Walsh's perfect pitch ear won't detect the small frequency change caused by surface corrosion. If so you could just tune by wiping the syrings clean. I personally set my string heights to my playing. The length between nut and bridge determines intonation. Over 60 years on the guitar. No a novice needs to learn how to fine adjust their instruments to them and their playing. Make it personal to you. I'll bet Gilmore does, and Knopfler, Gary Moore, et. al. many others. Bet none of them tossed those allen wrenches, Gibson truss nut tools or other things that let them personalize their instruments and style.
You are correct. The only thing that can change itself is neck flatness... not action, not pickup height (though I did have an old guitar that would lower the bridge pickup on the bass side, due to sympathetic vibration).But, I find myself tweaking intonation on practically every string change. Typically on the B & G strings. I think that tolerances in manufacturing create this delta, even to the point that I have had brand new strings that were wildly out of tune... only to mount a new string to find the problem eliminated. Granted, I play a lot of upper register triads (with extensions) while using the lowest note I can find in that neighborhood. The upper register stuff really reveals and sharpness or flatness, because the frequencies are very close together, but also, high enough that you can hear the 'beating' between non-consonant intervals ( I didn't say dissonant, because a M3 isn't dissonant... unless out of tune.). Otherwise, great video. I had some guitars that used to punish me if I left them in the case... high action, or buzzing everywhere.... My response was to let them go. WIth all the gigs and sessions, and a family.... I don't want to console my guitar.... Kind of like a carpenter consoling his hammer.
When I buy a guitar (new or used), I generally restring it and do an initial setup. I might try a couple different gauges the first few re-stings and tweak the setup if needed for the different gauge and string type. After that, I do the usually string changes and seasonal truss rod adjustments if needed. I rarely swap parts. I look at a guitar as either I like it as is or not. That applies to my Squiers, Fenders, etc. I've seen too many folks spend more on parts than the initial guitar which is ok it that's your thing, it's just not mine. The story is different on guitars/basses that I build from either parts or raw wood. That is where I experiment and spend my time experimenting.
Pretty much the same for me except I only have Squiers, no Fenders. And I’ve never built a guitar, not even a kit. Agree about parts replacement. I usually only replace parts that have failed. (Squier Strat 5-way switch was begging to be replaced by the proper Fender part. When one of the pickups “stopped working” that switch was outta there!) My Squier Classic Vibes haven’t needed setup adjustments since I first did them.
@@steveg.3022 I love my Squiers. The Classic Vibes are great. The Paranormal series are my favorites because Fender seems to have fun with that series doing more non-traditional things with it. I actually play my Squiers the most.
Shouldn't you lower the string tension before adding tension to the truss rod? I believe I read that somewhere. Great video thanks for the info, I totally agree
Get a string height gauge and the hex wrench to adjust the truss rod a 1/4 turn at a time...check saddle heights as well... and use a room humidifier in the dry months... and finally entonation....the essential setup process....fret files and a crowning file would also be good.
One of your best informational videos.
I'm always surprised some of mine drift a little and others are solid as a rock and we don't have anywhere as much issues with humidity as you guys.
Big argument for roasted necks to get all those pockets of moisture out before the build.
one of my most fav albums since it came out
Your comment about different wood and guitar stability chinched my birthday guitar decision. I have a few higher end HBs and haven't noticed anything going wonky concerning intonation or neck relief. But... PRS recently came out with a guitar I can afford. Color.... Decisions, decisions...👍
I'm lucky enough to live in Sydney, with relatively stable humidity throughout the year, usually between 50-60% year-round. I never have to adjust anything on my guitars. I just keep the same gauge on them and store them in their cases. I've got guitars I haven't had to tweak in 20 years.
Dear Dylan, my guitar's truss rod nut is stripped. Is there anyway to adjust the truss rod? Like winding thread around the allen key? Thanks in advance.
Thanks for that. Over the years it has become clear that the straighter the neck the better. A little relief actually robs string energy because it it pulling against a bowed piece of wood, not a straight pillar that has no flex. Guitars actually ring out better when the neck is straight. If a guitar needs relief, it probably needs fret work.
I’m curious what your opinions are about Evertune bridges. How is it going to affect season changes to the guitar?
that just happened to me. I wanted to cut out a guitar to allow me to back load pickups to test new ones that make. I picked a guitar I made years ago that I hadn't used in quite a while. I finished and got the first pickup installed, and realized that it moved over the time I hadn't used it. It just took a quick neck adjustment to get it perfect.
To paraphrase Tom Sizemore in Heat: "What if the fiddling is the juice?"
More is not better ! Glad I found you ❤
I believe when the action is too high the strings are bent too much so they go sharp.
If the guitar reacts to the seasonal changes, yep… only the trussrod really needs a little adjustment.
It would be interesting to see if that pink PRS will be the same in 6 months when the season is different than a year ago 🤔 quite possibly not a lot. Maple neck also kind of helps 😅
3:47 my acoustic sounds and feels horrible when it’s too dry. The strings sound dead. There’s no resonance. I know the humid is right when the strings ring nicely
I rarely touch the truss rod on my Gibson Les Paul standard. When I had my Epiphone Sheraton, although it sounded good, had to adjust the truss rod every 3 months or so.
.. lol .. I once lowered my action thinking that that will improve my playing .. later I raise it back to comfort, my comfort .. I discovered that low action is just NOT for me
Thanks For Sharing Dylan 🧠🎸🎶
I don't worry about setup too much after I've checked it out when I first get it. I do however, try to avoid nickel frets. I DO wear out frets on guitars quite quickly. I find Fender frets are the softest. I've had to go to stainless on almost all my Fenders after the first year of playing them. Good tips though, very helpful as usual.
I’ve noticed some times The truss Rod will not loosen on older guitars it will only tighten or straighten the neck. I Have a couple of 80s Ibanez Roadstars and the truss rods will turn but will not give any more relief they will only tighten. But the necks on these guitars are almost perfectly straight. I just put 10s on for a while then I can go back to 9s eventually. I’m guessing the wood in these necks have muscle memory.
Thanks.
Definitely the wood quality matters
I rarely have to do adjustments, so even my cheaper ones seem to be well made.
It’s been years since I needed to do that, other than a guitar I swapped out the bridge on.
(So of course I had to set the intonation and action, but I took measurements.)
Years ago looking for a fretless bass I kept seeing some cheaper models that all had serious neck bow. This was at different times of year, different cities, different stores.
At one store they told me they kept adjusting them, but they kept bowing. Guess what I didn’t buy?
Yet one guy who did buy one was getting all worked up, and taking it personally whenever anybody pointed out that flaw. I guess he likes doing adjustments. Oh well, that’s his choice.
The fretless I do own is the instrument that I spent the most on, and the neck’s been great.
Great video and you nailed the subject well. I do have to say that unstable hardware is not limited to inexpensive guitars though. Rickenbacker used an unstable bridge on the 400x bass series from 1961 thru 2019. Those were notorious for the back of the bridge lifting (bending) up. I'd say that at least 1 out of 4 Rick's that I have seen over the years showed either minor to serious lifting which is not only cosmetic, but must be replaced as the lifted bridge does not have enough break angle . Just a horrible design and made of a zinc/pot metal alloy. They kept that design around for tradition sake only. That bridge did look cool though. There are a few other high end brands that have used inferior hardware too.
Thank you. Someone actually has the knowledge and skills with guitars. Dude, you ROCK.
Dylan - do you notice PRS truss rods being particularly sensitive. Same goes for PRS neck. Not sure if it’s also neck joint design that adds to necks going out of whack more frequently? Mine are all pretty unstable unlike your Silver Sky.
Awesome video!
What neck relief do you recommend for a kramer baretta and an ibanez ps120?
The last thing that I will tuch is the rod well if it is well set.
Back in the days luthiers told me not to yank that truss. Set it proper and then wait, play and enjoy.
Yup it is of wood and it will all move up to a couple of years depending on the guitar and especially the neck so from time to time it might give and take some small amount on that sweet spot of release but most of times it will be fine.
Ive been playing now 39 years and have gone through many guitars. Only a few time have I seen this even happen. Being that I move around a lot in my time and life from Las Vegas NV and Laughlin NV deserts, to Florida and TX swamplands of humidity. I find mostly that newer made guitar are more likely to have this issue where they wood was never really fully dried before they made the guitar and has not stabilized yet. My Japan made Ibanez RG 550 I bought in 2000. Its nearly 25 years old now and that guitar has nickel frets and I play the crap out of it. Its just now about to need its first fret leveling and it has NEVER move at all in the neck. It still plays about 97% like the day I got it. But the 3 guitars that did do this, 2 were able to have neck adjustments, and 1 just could never stay stable, so I sold it. I think maybe the wood grain was cut wrong in the neck that it always just kept twisting. But if you store them right, keep them in cases in a room thats stabilized pretty much. You're not going to have much issues with most guitars. I don't play roasted maple necks either, and most of my guitars are bare wood necks. We get 90% humidity here in E TX where I am now and my new Jackson and Kramer. Both of those are bare necks and stay perfect. It really takes a cheap guitar or extremes to do this.
Thanks for the knowledge.
I can't stop making adjustments on my guitars. I don't even want to, I just can't help it. I constantly adjust the relief, the bridge height, and especially the pickup height. I drive myself absolutely crazy. Even when a guitar is playing well, I get this thought in my head that I can get it a little better and then it changes the distance of the strings from the pickup and then I gotta mess with the pickup height for far longer than I should.
Yes 💯
Same here. I'm always thinking, if I tweek it just a tad more.
Lol…that’s how I learned to make all the adjustments so I do it just to keep it fresh in my head. I’m always checking and tweaking but should probably worry more about getting better at playing it.
This sounds like me. Is there Obsessive complusive behavior involved by any chance?
@@JE-western-rider A little OCD probably..... plus most people don't realize that they can only find their perfect dream sound by changing SPEAKERS. Nobody changes speakers- and they make the biggest tonal change.
The drying of the wood is a huge factor, among others (as you allude to) and one of the reasons PRS and others, pay attention to this. But the cost of the guitar won't always guarantee it. I have 2005 Fender American Deluxe Strat that had a tremendous problem with fret sprout. If the fretboard had been dried properly and the humidity in the manufacturing environment had been right, the issue likely would not have occurred. It took me several years before the guitar aged into a better situation, as well as some pretty intense fret end work, through multiple seasons. At the time I bought it, this was the top of the production line guitar and pricey. Because of the sprout issue, I got the guitar at about 50% it's retail value (at the time, I would not have been able to afford it otherwise).
Spot on!
I like my action just under 1mm all the way down to the 24th fret. It I have any buzz or dead spots nope. So since my tool is in a very specific high performance setting and I live in Iowa where humidity changes a lot I have to adjust things several times a year. I agree with you about the neck and just a minor adjustment but since it is so slight if I have a vibrato which is usually yes then I just turn the mounting posts slightly since it is much quicker and almost the same results. Also, the weather will change and then I have to move it right the fuck back. I know it is a truss rod thing and if it goes too far I do pop off the cover and adjust the neck then check the vibrato height. Like i said high performance machines/tools require more maintenance that is true with cars, houses, women and yes guitars as well. My Gibson and my Fender move just as often as my cheaper ones. The older the wood is makes it more less. My older Gibson I adjust a lot less often.
Collapsed tuneomatic bridge is a thing and will throw out intonation
I agree about the wood. I have two expensive guitars for over 20 years and they’re rock solid. Three cheaper guitars need a truss rod adjustment occasionally
I used to be “meh” about your channel but it’s slowly become one of my favorite guitar channels.
❤
same!!!!!
Oh man, I'm 100% guilty of reaching for the tiny wrench first, or the screwdriver. I know, I know... I've always heard you're supposed to adjust the truss first. But I took that to mean: do it first because it'll mess everything else up if you do it last. And usually I'm not planning on doing it anyway.
So, I was admittedly skeptical of where this was going, but this cleared a lot up for me, honestly.
(In fairness, I've also been experimenting with higher/lower action because I still can't decide what I need and prefer). But generally speaking, I'm going to make a point of checking the relief with a string before doing anything else (not just eyeballing it down the neck - I don't think that helps very much, tbh).
Thanks for the video. Makes a lot of sense.
I always set the relief to .010"
These days, higher action at fret one really bugs me.
I live in Canada, usually every year I have to adjust neck relief at least 2 times in most of my guitars as seasons change.
Yes, the wood moves definitely. Do strings lose tension over time?
When you tune the guitar the strings have the original tension…. Otherwise they would be out of tune
I have not setup any of my guitars in years.
I just tweak the neck from season to season.
Sometimes i don't have to. 👍
My guitars hang from the wall, does this effect their neck relief in any way over time?
i play only in thailand and my 1998 prs never have problem about action...just neck adjust sometimes🎉
It was interesting how the neck relief adjustment noticeably affected the intonation of some strings but not others. I'll have to keep that in mind. Thanks
Really truth was said in this video. Congratulations