Living with an Electric Kangoo ZE
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- Опубликовано: 28 мар 2022
- Ive signed up to try living with an electric van for a few weeks, starting with a Renault Kangoo ZE Crew Cab. Ive driven plenty of TVs before but this didnt go well..
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Sometimes, watching you review bad vehicles makes for the more entertaining videos. 😂😬
Totally agree with your comments 25k for a van you cannot use on a motorway has limited use
it's like buying anything, you buy things that suit your needs! you would not buy induction pans to cook on gas!
Why cant you use it in a motorway?
Big fan of this channel, I never miss a video. I appreciate your perspective of usage, and the somewhat "EV spec sheet beginner" angle of this review. I understand it was a shock to find it being powered by a "Golf cart" powertrain more or less, but thats still where we are at with EVs when trying to save those last extra cents.
As you alluded to, being realistic this vehicle was never meant to be recharged on the go, no matter what the manufacturers PR might tell you. Its strictly a "Recharge at the company every night" kind of deal. A friend of mine run a local plumbing business, this is the kind of vehicle he would like. Since they only do a few miles between stops, all other considerations fade into nothingness, since they are in the car at most half an hour at a time. For every one else with differing needs, _stay away_. This is the bargain basement/dollar tree EV van for short local transport and nothing else at cheapest possible price, full stop.
I'm no car driver, nor expert in EVs but selling/shipping a car or van in this day and age without fast-charging abilities is a joke! A parts bin special with a nasty price tag!
expected as much from a renault honesly
@@af5579 If people will buy it, then I guess they made the right choice in producing it. swings and roundabouts.
The Kangoo ZE was developed (& paid for) by the French Post Office (La Poste) who bought them in their hundreds in the early days, but refused to pay extra for rapid charge abilities as their plan was to charge them all over night, every night. So Renault never bothered to equip them with rapid charge ports or soft/hardware, even when they started to sell them to the general public.
@@af5579 i agree wholeheartedly
@@GoldenCroc it would be interesting to know how many private buyers have bought them, and how many have been flogged to local councils, health services and the like who may not research the important/practical detail as much as the finances, and who have a reputation for wastage of those finances.
Can’t believe they gave you a van without rapid charge capabilities in an effort to promote EV ownership.
If you were lucky and were aware, there are 22kw chargers out there for that connector type (and it was a type 2) mainly at Tesco’s and Lidl’s as it happens. But even with those, with that van, you’re talking a near empty to full charge of around 2 hrs. But as you’ve discovered the majority are 7kw, and some as low as 3.5, so yes they’ll take 8-9 and 16-18 hrs respectively to gain a full charge.
Just for some context, the I-MiEV that came out in 2009, and then the LEAF in 2011 all had Chademo. It’s pretty ludicrous it doesn’t have a fast charge port. Wtf. Not sure how they thought this would make people want an EV.
I'm wondering if they're offering this scheme because they got landed with a pile of vans that aren't suitable for what they were for, so they're lending them out to people who may be able to use them.
Wouldn’t have made a difference, the kangoo in question has a max charging speed of 7KW so wouldn’t have been any quicker.
@@jamesbuchan416
Seems it's a very specific fleet vehicle being sold to the general public without actual modifications/advertising for it.
A bit like putting a golf cart on the road! XD
The combination of low range and slow charging on a van is a disaster. What were Renault thinking?
Sadly it’s a cobbled together van not originally designed to be an ev. But you’d think Renault would do better than this as tgey have quite a bit of knowledge of EVs.
The logical customer for this type of car would likely be a local small business, where it's used to drive the typically few miles between each customer, and can be charged at the company over night. If you can offer these people a cheap car that can save them money in the bigger cities too, you're likely on to a winner with them. It's very limited to something like the described scenario, but good at doing that. For the rest of us it's useless.
@@jo05dk Yes. This makes a lot of sense 👍👍
These types of conversions have been around forever too, they're just made as marketing gimicks mostly.
It was an early attempt at an EV. The creation of anything has to begin somewhere. EV technology has moved on in huge leaps since the days of the Kangoo ZE. Unlike some present car makers, Renault now has 10+ years experience of EV manufacture and development, mainly via the Zoe. The new electric Megane is a case in point. That car is as good as it presently gets in the EV game for it's class, and will probably sell very well.....
I have a Nissan eNV200. Use it for work. I absolutely love it even though it only has 90 to 120km range on chargers. I do have Fast charging which only takes 30mins. Mainly use 3.2kwh charging at home or at shopping centres.
How is 30 minutes fast anything?
You highlighted all my fears about EVs. When something is free and you still don't want it, must be a red flag!
It’s a one of a kind very bad EV, no reason to be put off by this video
@@jonjoyce3188 Looking forward to the replacement, should provide more info.
The Kangoo is about the worst of the EVs.Short range, slow and slow to charge.
@@cjmillsnun And it certainly shouldn't be cited as state of the art today.
@@jonjoyce3188 It isn’t a bad EV when used for it’s designed purpose, he just chose the wrong tool for the job.
The first true review of an EV I’ve seen without glossing over all the problems.
“Just pop in to your local charging station, grab a coffee and voila your charged”.
Here in Australia we have hills and mountains and vast distances with nothing in between. EVs are simply not suitable.
That kango was empty. Tradies usually have a lot of heavy tools and materials. Imagine the range anxiety in a fully laden one. You’d be down to a 40klm range total.
This is why 4x4 diesel utes are the mainstay of tradies here and it will stay that way for the foreseeable future.
Agreed
🎯
Just looked out of the window and fell in love with my Diesel VW T6 all over again. Thanks for the great vid.
Thanks for the real world review. Van has a no Kangoo attitude.
You mentioned charging at home. Here in Canada, in many provinces it is now mandatory to install a charging station in all new homes as they're built.
Recent legislation here in the UK as well Ian, requiring the provision of EV charging ( or at least the provision to install it) on new build properties. I think there is also a requirement to fit street light EV chargers if a new housing development also has street lighting.....
@@Brian-om2hh Interesting! I've never heard of street light chargers, but it sounds like an excellent idea.
You’ve summed up exactly why I am steering clear of electric cars. I am 68, live in a terraced house, several times a year I undertake journeys of 150 miles plus, and I don’t want the added stress of range anxieties and finding working re-charging points. Thank you.
YUP WE NEED HALF TIME HOUR SUPER CHARGE....
There are EVs that would suit you. But if you have a perfectly good working vehicle then I wouldn't suggest you switch, especially without home charging which is what makes EVs economical. The Kangoo is just not a good EV and you can't really take it as an example and say all EVs are unsuitable.
I have this van for almost 3 years now and it's been great, I'm using for small/medium sized building works daily. As I am in London, here's quite good charging point network from multiple providers. I do not have charger at home.
Driving this van in a city is great, no congestion charge, parking is quite cheap for ev (not everywhere but some of the boroughs gives good rates). Or even you can charge your van while leaving in a parking space and you don't need to pay for parking just for kWh.
Biggest struggle is when in motorway, range is terrible and you have to very carefully plan your journey. So yeah no quick charge is a big issue if you outside the city and need to do more than 50miles/h
Dingbro (a trade auto parts supplier) up here in Scotland use diesel Kangoos all the time, and they do some real miles - it's not unheard of for a 3 year old Dingbro Kangoo to have over 180k on the clock. Now I understand why they don't use electric Kangoos 😂
Any diesel should make huge mileages if they are looked after properly. Crucial to them is a regular oil change with the correct oil type, and keeping the fuel system clean. My Pug 308 e-HDI 64 plate has done 86K and feels just run in, and is zero road tax (for now......)
@@brusselssprouts560 my V40 is a 2017 17 plate with the 2-litre twin turbo 4-cylinder diesel. 147,000 on the clock, still going strong 💪
I'd suggest watching any/all of Harry Metcalfe's videos about his various personal extended experiences with EVs and plug-in hybrids. The van you were driving is best suited for a lot of in-town errands and deliveries. Maybe you should consider becoming a florist! 😂 Anyone who, like yourself, regularly runs 100 miles or more in a day to various job sites would find this a bad fit...which is why Harry points to the plug-in hybrid as the best solution for the widest variety of driving needs: full electric for maybe 20-50 miles of shuttling with petrol-range for the motorways. Also, be aware (not to sound condescending because you might know this already) but the recharge rate for any battery (or battery pack) is going to slow down drastically as you near a full recharge. That last 20% will take awhile. That last 10% will take even longer. Which is why some manufacturers and battery suppliers are quoting a speed of recharge to the 80% point, not to 100%.
It's good to see a totally unbiased review of EV motoring. Most of what I've seen up to now is either in the "greatest thing since sliced bread" category or the "don't touch with a bargepole" camp. My reservations about EVs are very similar to your own. I live in a 2nd floor flat, no on street charging, and do runs of between 90 and 250 miles on a reasonably regular basis. Like you, I really don't want to spend 2 or 3 days on a trip that my current diesel can comfortably manage in 2 to 4 hours (depression on how far I'm going. I have better and more pressing things to do than sit at charging points for who knows how long. I get the feeling that EVs are currently at the same kind of level as conventional cars were in about 1899. All fine and dandy for local trips into the town centre or dropping the kids at school, but not much else. Quirky little toys for the minority to play with, but not yet a real world alternative to the internal combustion engine. I definitely wouldn't want one if I lived in a rural area.
I had a very good experience with the Kangoo EV on a moment it was the only van available I could afford to use to transport furniture for a charity 95 kilometres further. Despite the gloomy stories of batteries leaking empty when airconditioning or CD-player was used, I took the risk. Renault provides a tool on its website to predict the range, which taught me that speed was the parametre second to none to reckon with. To avoid risks I demanded the car would be 100% charged.
Therefore I decided to limit my speed to 80 km/h. Going to Brussels it was the right decision as unexpected emergency braking would send material in my neck and through the front window. In Brussels I got stuck in a traffic jam that cost me almost one hour. Back home I was in the middle of early July rush hours, so 80 km/h was not the worst of ideas either. The last 15 km I sped up to 100 like a horse smelling the stable. Back home I noticed the batteries were still charged for 23%. I'll tell you more: as it was 31°C and later on 32° I put on the airconditioning and I even listened to 3 CDs. A terrific experience!
Supplying a Chademo-plugged car to get a taste for EV’s is as relevant as supplying a fax to get a taste for telecommunications.
As for Renault ZOE business (van) version. My work has them as pool vans. Personally, I'd feel quite ripped off if I'd paid £5k for one, never mind whatever they actually cost. To be fair, the dashboards claim around 200 miles range when they're full, but as you found in the Kangaroo, motorways drain that range big time. And even as pool vans, we need to top-up charge them during the day occasionally.
Lastly, watch out for the HUUUUUUUUUUUGE triangle of doom on the ZOE! 😳
£29k for a Zoe Business Van.
@@JohnnyPaton £25k too much 🤣
Love your honesty . Ideal for the postman or meals on wheels but not for tradesmen
My dad has had a Zoe since 2017 and loves it. He does sometimes drive longer distances for recreational purposes and is pretty accustomed to using the charging network now. He does not use the car for work though, I think having to do a long commute and take time out of your day to recharge on route is a major drawback of EVs. If you drive a small car over short distances in am urban environment and have the ability to charge at home then the EV could be the car for you. If not then you are in for a lot of waiting around in service areas.
Completely agree with your findings; many EVs are difficult to use in terms of range and the waiting at charging stations is agonising.
Had a Nissan leaf on a extended test drive in 2018, and took it from my address in Essex to my mother's in Lake District....300 miles. Encountered massive battery over heating issues resulting in car not accepting a fast charge....took 12 hrs to do the same journey that my diesel mondeo would do in 4 hrs....
when they work they can be very good tools, but when they go wrong its very noticeable and not easy to work around
Nissan leafs are bad for fast charging because of their air cooled batteries. Still, that does seem a bit too bad to be fully functional unless you drove quite fast in high outside temperatures.
@@furiousdriving it was brand new and not faulty.....after I did a lot of research, the batterys are more efficient when being liquid cooled...the 24/ 30/40kwh leaf relys on air cooling....at 70mph it doesn't get enough cooling to keep the battery at an acceptable temperature level to accept a fast charge.... Effectively your driving around in something similar to an engine cooking itself....I do 30k miles a year...the technology on cars available in my price range is not at a level that's suitable for my needs...
@@GoldenCroc I was sitting around 60 70mph....if I was doing 100mph I would have accepted that....but Its a poor design when it can't take multiple fast charges when completing long distances. Something that you wouldnt expect from a 30k+ vehicle and should have been sorted out prior to the vehicle being released on sale.
@@stevenking2946 There are cars availible at very close to the Leafs price level that feature liquid cooled batteries these days. Air cooled batteries was an obsolete tech already after 2013 or so, only reason I can see why Nissan persisted was pure cost reasons.
Excellent review . Loved it !
Your Gemini IV Speedmaster is unbelievably cool.
Great video as always FD! It's staggering how Renault thought that omitting fast charge was a good idea for any vehicle, never mind a commercial vehicle, was a good idea is beyond me. Some might say cost saving but then how many commercial drivers do so little mileage? My answer - very few! Also a big believer in Hydrogen here.
In all fairness, this thing is not a typical example of a modern EV. This is just a panel van for a business operating in big cities and if it fits their needs, why would 25k be a bad expense for them. Anyone else (you included) ... just get a different EV suited for longer distance driving.
I have currently got an identical Renault kangoo crew cab van on loan from Kent revs. The big difference seems to be that they supplied it with a ‘granny’ charger. I leave it on charge overnight and am comfortable doing a 100 to 110 mile round trip every day. It has surprised me how usable it is, especially considering that it was this video that introduced me to the Kent revs scheme. It certainly seems to be that the key is charging at home. This van has really grown on me but I think it really is a case of ‘horses for courses’. If you can charge it at home and do less than 100 miles a day you are on to a winner. Loads of motorway miles and you can forget it.
Hi , what size battery does this have? Is it battery lease, can it charge on a 13a plug ? What other charge options does it have? What's it range with. Full battery , I'm tossing up between one of these or an env200
Glad you did a real world test! Sometimes it seems EV isn't the answer. I'm surprised it doesn't have better range or faster charging
In fairness, a lot of tradesmen's and local authority vans spend a lot of time standing outside customer's premises and don't cover much mileage in a day, so for that purpose the Kangoo is adequate. In this form it's obviously not suited to your requirements, partly because it's now an old design, but one has to wonder at a council seeking to promote EVs offering this vehicle to you. A two-minute conversation would have told them it was the wrong choice.
As an every day EV driver and instructor in a Nissan Leaf, I am amazed that this van comes without a CCS charging capability, how useless?
I hope the Zoe is better, if not see if KCC will lend you a Nissan 62kwh, you won’t be disappointed 👌😎
Great video…….although not for Renault e van sales😂
A very eye opening video! Thank you.
That was your best review ever , loved it and so true . 👍👍
I've had a leaf 30 for 3 years and it's a learning curve , I love it even thou I have to charge every 60 miles :)
Great honest review , i went for a phev instead as the range anxiety worried me as looking after my father i wouldn't want it to have been flat or on charge if something happened to him and is just come back from work, if you fancy doing a review or a test in a mg hs phev , your more than welcome to pop this way or something, keep up the good work on your channel
It looks like they never really updated it since 2011 (a new model was just announced) which is crazy. There were a lot of electric vans released back then with the same limited range as they took the batteries from contemporary EVs, but unlike the passenger cars they were based on the vans were very slow to get upgraded batteries.
Renault had this weird thing with not giving the Zoe proper fast charging until 2019 and it looks like this van shares a lot of the tech. You couldn't even option fast charging as you can see from the lack of space for the plug and their solution was too rare and still half the speed of fast chargers for cheap EVs back then.
Ah, this explains it! I never knew they did an EV van back then.
Once I saw the interior I thought it was all from the Renault parts bin as it's all outdated. The Hvac controls, the auto gearstick etc are the same from my old mk2 scenic and they go as far back as 2003. Feels like they built it cheap and cobbled together without much thought, even back in 2011 they were using 'old' parts as the mk3 range had already been out a couple years.
Excellent review - thank you for the honesty and real life experience comments - makes a refreshing change from the fan boy articles, many of whom I suspect are getting payments for their favours.
This is definitely one of your better videos; you're getting the hang of comic timing 😊
My eyebrows raised when I saw the charger port, the same as on my plug-in hybrid, which takes a couple of hours to replenish its 30-ish mile EV range. To not have a fast charge on a full EV nowadays is crackers.
With all the excellent technology in EVs, they have not thought AT ALL about the infrastructure or anything like that. About 60% of the people I know love in flats or terraced houses so cannot charge an EV at home. They’re damn expensive, out of reach for most and simply not practical. Very cool video Matt!
They could charge at home if they requested a grid be installed in the pavement outside their house Richie, or made a request to have either a street light EV charger or a free standing bollard type EV charger. Government funding is available to Local Authorities whom apply for it. But to set the whole process in motion, you have to request one......
Welcome to the world of lower end EVs. I have the Skoda citigo which is limited by type 2 slow charging as well.
Brilliant car to drive, but its going back at the end of its lease as its no good for long distances and all the type 2 chargers near my house are constantly broken!.
Well a Citigo isn't for long distances is it 🤦
@@stepheng8779
Nor is a ford Ka but, if at the drop of a hat you have to travel somewhere immediately, the Ka will get you from John o groats to lands end
@@brianiswrong bizarre comment. I presume you're not a super hero and would have rest periods in your Ford Ka trip?
Long way John O'Groats to Lands End these rest periods are when sensible people charge their vehicles. So at the drop of a hat a Citigo would do the same whilst being equally not ideal.
As I said bizarre.
OP clearly bought the wrong car for their situation, "chargers near home broken" they shouldn't need to use those. No home charger, don't bother.
But then if you anticipated many long journeys, you wouldn't buy a Skoda Citigo, would you?
@@Brian-om2hh just was hoping the Charging infrastructure was there. So many type 2 chargers are broken, it’s a lottery to if you can charge or not.
It’s a super cheap lease (£120 a month inc insurance and tax), so has still been worth it, but I won’t keep the car.
I worked in Renault last year, and these are dirt 🤣. An Phost (the Irish postal service) have several, and they were constantly in getting fiddly little bits and pieces done.
How is it you don't have any adapters with you?
lol , a local charity i'm involved in has one of these ( again some council promo ) .. we were doing a building project so put about 750 KG of timber & tools in it .. drained the battery going across town & back again ( Edinburgh so lots of hills , total distance about 50 miles )
You don’t throw pallets in the back so the Zoe is probably what you should have gone for to start with, but the boot may be a bit small. Was the Mokka-e or Leaf an option?
I reckon a plug-in hybrid would suit your use better than a pure EV.
That just looks like a crap EV. My wife has a Hyundai Ioniq EV for 2.5 years now, which has a real world small range of 120 miles. We also have a Citroen c8 people carrier and a Lotus Elise on the fleet. Choose the right car for the right journey, but it says a lot that the EV does 20k miles a year, the Citroen 8k and the Lotus 4k. EV as part of the fleet is great, but we always charge overnight at home. Wouldn't be without an EV on the fleet now but if you have a small range one you need a ice car on the fleet too for those longer journeys.
I have a small courier company and my own courier work generally puts me at over 100 miles per day. This is residential driving with use of A roads and occasionally the M25/M23 to reach customers. Sometimes it's more than 100 miles in a day, sometime's it's less, but there's no way I'd ever want to be left with less than 150 miles range at the start of my day at a minimum. This review sums up for me how impractical EVs currently are for my sort of work. In fact if I was to buy an electric vehicle to use for deliveries it'd make more sense to buy a Kia Niro and strip the back seats and extra bulk to use it as a van - 260+ mile range and actually purpose built (as an EV, anyway, and with fast charging). However, if I'm blowing upwards of 25k on something there's absolutely no way in hell I can compromise on the stuff you've brought up in this vid. I'll continue to 'recycle' my old petrol van that has 150k on the clock and still going strong.
what year is this?
I was remembering my time as a same-day courier driving urgent items all over the UK, sometimes 1000 miles a day (Portsmouth to Faslane and return on a snowing night with a life raft for a submarine, 17 hour round trip)
My vehicle was a 1.1 turbo diesel Citroen Nemo with automated gearbox.
It did 180000 miles in three years, sipped fuel and never missed a beat. Can / will any electric van ever beat that?
Maybe, if the technology improves. At one point a few decades ago the trip you describe would have been impossible in most diesel cars.
But the electric vehicles of today are good for certain purposes - eg local deliveries. Just because they're not perfect for every purpose, doesn't mean they have none. This kangoo would be great for a firm making local deliveries in an environmentally conscious area.
@@Rapscallion2009 Hi Rap, I did refuel, coffee, toilet three times. I was told "pedal to the metal" in driving snow and ice as the raft was needed for nuclear sub ready and waiting to go. Could have been emergency defense situation for all I knew. You cannot and probably will not ever be able to give an electric van that sort of work.
But I take your point about local work in cities, that Renault may be able to do that kind of work before the battery fails.
The thing is that older electric vehicles will depreciate to near zero once battery guarantee fails, they will be scrapped at 10 years whereas a diesel vehicle will probably do 20 years. Scrapping good vehicles with plenty of use left in them for want of a hideously expensive battery makes no sense to me. And don't forget the power and pollution entailed in making twice as many vehicles for no good reason.
The council highway maintenance company I work for part time has some electrical kangoos on the fleet and it’s mostly town mileage short trips and I have driven one. The seats were not the best and the steering had a little too much play for my liking but it’s just something I should get used to if I was driving the van every day. Then the brakes were worn. But it had 109k on the clock so it was just expected problems. The automatic tranny got stuck in drive when I was parking it outside the MOT test centre of all the places it could happen at it happened there.
Should have popped into the Poachers pub next to the Hilton for some refreshments!
What's in the filler flap where you'd normally fill with fuel?
Nothing at all. It's blanked off.
A few weeks ago I watched a video by a self employed electrician who bought an electric van. It severely reduced his potential earnings and he bitterly regrets buying it for a lot more than a diesel van, but now he is stuck with it. The bitter truth is that electric vehicles are crap, and new research suggests that they do not really reduce carbon emissions because of the far higher energy input into their manufacture.
If the government gave a fuck about the environment they'd encourage the recycling (continued use and fixing) of older vehicles. It'd keep more people mobile, encourage less throwing away of good materials, take power away from the likes of China where a massive amount of new vehicles are built in slave conditions, pumping everything imaginable into the environment during manufacturing... But no... We've got to #clapforEVs now, because you'd be a bigot not to, or something.
Can you direct people to the source of your claim regarding higher energy input during EV manufacture? Volkswagen might argue with that claim, as *all* their electric vehicle manufacturing plants operate with a zero carbon footprint. All three plants are also powered by 100% renewable energy. VW are also the only car maker to have so far signed up to the legally binding Paris Climate Agreement.... So you've watched a video posted by someone who made the wrong vehicle choice, and on that basis you arrive at the conclusion that *all* electric vehicles are "crap"...... This "new research" wouldn't happen to be Volvo, would it? If it is, you'll also notice Volvo haven't ceased production of electric vehicles.......Why do you suppose that might that be?
@@Brian-om2hh maybe look into the cobalt mines in places like the Congo and what will happen to all those spent batteries in ten years time ,as for vw I wouldn't believe a thing they say ,court case anyone.
Also where do they think the electricity comes from .
Great video Matt. Have to say this the first time I’ve been able to tell you think this thing was utterly rubbish 😂
Such a practical and cute little Kangoo. What a real pity that it was useless, it is quite obviously for use around towns or city centres. It is a good initiative that your local Council is offering so hopefully the Zöe will serve your needs better. Also you won't be liable for the earth shattering depreciation that my work colleague faced when he inquired at his Renault Dealer about updating his Wife's 4 years old original Zöe to a new one.
He was a genuine pioneer EV owner but he traded the little Zoë in for a Petrol powered Clio. After that slap in the teeth he should probably have bought a Fiesta or a Corsa, this is not how loyal customers should be treated Renault. A 4 year old Zöe is worth a lot more than £4000.
I expect this is apocryphal, but I read recently a post on a motoring forum from someone who when buying their new build house ticked the box for EV charging in the garage. What they got was an additional 13A socket near the garage door labelled as 'EV charging point'.
Ahh, so that's what the furious part of furiousdriving looks like!
I think that would be ok if charged overnight at home and used in town. A 13 amp plug with a heavy custom extension cord would be fine, most people don't really need much more than that at home for any car.
That van only works if you can charge it at home every day. And really only drive locally.
This really proves that many EVs are single purpose vehicles whereas nearly every petrol/diesel/hybrid/phew are multi purpose vehicles.
As EVs go, I quite like the MG5, it’s quite practical, fast enough and does not look too bad. But I could only use it 80% of the time. I had to drive 250mi last week for business. The MG would not have done it.
I say roll on hydrogen but that development seems to be slowing down.
Why couldn't you have charged during that 250 mile trip? Presumably you stopped to use the loo, or to eat something?
Yes. Services for 10 mins, then Tesco for 10 mins. Then a private house for the pickup. Then the return journey, another 10 mins at the services. None long enough to do any real charging. Plus the services charge a lot for charging. I once worked out that the costs of charging at the services was the equivalent of a car doing 30mpg.
They're only practical if you were to have a 'fleet' of vans. So some are charging whilst others are in use.
Try North Wales, about 4 chargers in Holt, Wrexham and 6 in Bangor and that's it!
So how far would it go in winter with the lights, heater, and wipers going? Builders would be like "Hi can I plug my van in while I build your extension mate."
Generally, you can subtract about 1/3 or even a bit more of the summer range if its really cold outside. But of course it depends on many factors, but with the 1/3 rule of thumb you wont be too disappointed.
Crazy !! i wonder to siwtch my thermic van to an eletric one
Probably says more about me but I really enjoyed this review
Whilst charging you could catch up on emails calls and other paperwork etc .
Thanks for concreting my opinion of EVs 👍
That would probably be a decent van if fitted with a nice frugal, powerful and efficient diesel engine.
But they're not efficient. I think you are confusing efficiency with economy.
@@Brian-om2hh For a work's van, they're more efficient than this thing.
It's the wind direction and strength you need to worry about on fast roads
So they did not provide type charger cable because those charging station on the side have 7 or 22kw plug in with your own cable
Will be interesting to see how the Zoe goes.
That van is big enough to put a diesel generator in the back....Sorted.
As for the range side of things, it all depends on your use case. I think this van was developed mostly for delivery fleet usage, or for taking a load of kids to soccer practice/school/whatever. Electric vans are crazy succesful for delivery fleets in my area (around Amsterdam) where the distances are short, idle time is high, and speeds are low except for the short bit of highway around the city. I wouldn't blame the car for being focused on that. I get the impression that almost all electric vans are designed for use in delivery fleets.
However, if the marketing implies that this van can just replace a normal van, that is a bad thing to imply. It's worthless for contractors who sometimes easily drive for an hour to reach their job, and then have multiple jobs to do that day. Or for private owners who randomly use it to pick up stuff from far away. It's absolutely a niche product.
You need a big battery and a fast charger. The Hyundai kona is quality around 280-300 miles true range and charged very fast.
Is that an Omega chronograph? Model?
Only works for milkman and people doing very local deliveries-7Kw charge needed back at base.
These where everywhere on a small island, but that's where this is only usefull
That Generation of Kangoo is getting on a bit now and it was rather cobbled together with parts from an earlier Generation Zoe as a van around town.
There are some much better electric vans on the market that are more capable with greater range and rapid charging.
Renault will be launching an all new Kangoo this year which again shares its underpinnings with the new Mercedes Citan. It has a claimed range of 186 miles and 80KW rapid charging is available.
Kent Council must have had a good deal off Renault.
7:20 A normal car needs 15 to 20kW to sit on the highway at 100km/h.
This means that with those 3kWh, you can do about 18km, not including acceleration to 100km/h.
How much kW the van uses at 100km/h i don't know. Does it display it in kilowatts, or just on an arbitrary scale?
This van is fine if you live near a charge station and only want to use it for trips to the supermarket.
I had considered the Zoe as a practical daily for the commute, but it's off my list since it became the first car to score 0 stars in a 2021 Euro Ncap test. Renault decided to save some money and skimp on safety. I'm not down for that. Too bad.. I rather like looking at the little Zoe, even if some claim it's an old lady's car.
Isn't the charger plagued as well?
I can see myself getting one of these cars since it could replace at least 90 percent of the trips I do with my car. With the savings on fuel alone I could also keep a 10 year old diesel or gasoline car for longer trips.
Please do more Modern Van review 🔥
The Hydrogen / Battery electric argument is really a mute point, both concepts utilise electric motor / power electronic technologies.
Infrastructure will decide which will become dominant, the electric charging infrastructure is rapidly increasing, whereas the number of hydrogen refuelling stations is hardly increasing.
For very large machines, like supertankers that are intrinsically linked to large ports / depots, hydrogen could make sense, as you could effectively combine hydrogen processing plants next to the machines that will use them.
For mass transport, especially as batteries improve in performance / sustainability there is no way for hydrogen to match the efficiency of of a pure EV.
The very battery improvements that make EVs desirable, will also make renewable energy production far more effective, as you can provide onsite energy storage via batteries that eliminates the issues of solar & wind power generation not being able to provide 24hr a day power production.
Storage of energy in the production and transmission stage is still a pipe dream at the moment .
I was working on wind farms this week not a single turbine spinning due to lack of wind .
All those people driving about about in their “zero emissions “ vehicles think again .
When the wind doesn’t blow your
Polluting the same as the rest of us
an ebike is mans best friend with one of these mate, it is absolutely amazing , fun and saves you money , time and past traffic easily, park up a few miles away, hop on your 1000w ebike and fly down the road, a foldable bike that is, vans in electric are not worth it, only cars
I think the key thing owning this van is to add diesel generator in the boot to increase its range.
They're so awesome. I mean, even though the electricity is made with coal or gas and then you need to change the batteries every 3-4 years, it's like so good for the environment! Ha ha ha ha ha! Yeah, right.
Loving your channel.
That was a pretty poor van, totally agree with you on this.
And to think … if you need a van for work, you’ll have a load of tools and equipment in it as well. Wonder how well/poorly it would perform then 🤷🏼♂️
And how you would feel about leaving it parked up away from home on charge for any length of time!
This probably suits some people very well if you need a van and don’t do lots of miles in a day etc. charge it at home end of week etc. I have a kangoo diesel and I certainly wouldn’t be swapping out to electric as in the south west going to places in the sticks doing 100 ish miles full of equipment at night for events just wouldn’t work. It would get me there but not sure it would get me back. Very few ev charging points around here. I live in a main town and no chargers for a good number of miles.
This has got to be the first time I have seen you drive something you have absolutely hated. Most things you've driven with a smile, even laughing off their shortcomings. So this thing must be truly horrid.
Its not really any more horrid chassis-wise than most Kangoos, I dont think. Its just got a "Golf cart" drivetrain stuffed into it, and he wasnt informed of this sufficiently for some reason. This limits is usage to citys only, effectively. This naturally had him a bit miffed.
@@GoldenCroc Yep Kangoos have always been excellent and reliable vans/cars - this one like you say is not made for distance driving.
I live in a terraced house and if I owned an EV would have to install a boom like the old kerbside petrol pumps had to carry the cable clear of the footpath, it only needs to be 2.5m above the path when swung out. Front garden is only 4ft wide but 3 ft. below road and footpath level (six steps), so it can be installed on my property. Room in the porch below the smart lecci meter for the charger. I'm lucky in that the council will mark an EV only space on the road outside the house for a reasonable fee. Charger installation covered by Govt. grant.
Oh dear, that's almost funny. Tony, did you realise that your Local Authority can access Government funding to pay for the installation of a grid in the pavement to allow a charge lead to pass under it? The grids are usually installed in 40 minutes or so. The same funding is also there to pay for the installation of street light EV charge points, or free standing bollard type chargers. But to start the process, you have to request EV charging from your local council..... The grants are there. Your council simply has to apply for them....
@@Brian-om2hh Getting Cork C.C. to do anything involving an highway or costing money is a near impossibility unless the public is paying or mandatory. Even the once a year visit of a gully sucker will often leave the drains still blocked as rodding them doesn't occur to them. As for road repairs or resurfacing it's only done when the damage claims get too high. Govt. funding to C.C's here is based on population not the size of a county even if it's the largest by area. Cork City probably gets more funding than the County and would receive more in business rates. A plan to merge the City Authority with the County Council was rejected by both a few years ago. There are no domestic rates or council tax in Ireland, we do pay waste collection charges. (pay by weight, different per kg on waste, recycling, glass and compostable, mine about €200-250 p.a.).
I think you'd be better off with a sail on the roof Matt. My old Kangoo's 'Heavy Oil'.
just imagine, you can fill up a diesel kangoo in less than 5 minutes to get a range of more than 1000km and filling stations are everywhere. if you want to get a coffee (the argument ev owners always use) you can do that at a proper cafe instead of some grimy roadside charging station.
I have a old Renault zoe , its brilliant around town and cheap as chips to run . The charging infrastructure is getting better and will soon be good enough that range anxiety will end. Battery technology is still advancing and soon no one will have cause to worry about running out. Are you aware that thousands of ice cars run out of petrol every day and lots of people put the wrong type of fossil fuel in their tanks. Far more ice cars carch fire than E.Vs pro rata. The introduction of better vehicles will happen no matter how much you squeel about it
Similar to you I do a lot of miles, tomorrow for example I need to carry a boot full of tools and do about 500 miles 2 stops and an o/n same next day. This would be useless, but a friend who does something similar has an id3 nice car etc, however it’s going back because of the cancelled appointments leading to loss of income, extended periods away because of adjusting trips to suit charging etc loss of range in cold weather and finally battery degradation through constant fast charging - if you do local runs with odd private long journey max 10k a year, electric currently works anything else it’s just a pita utter inconvenience- I await the hate and the ‘your killing my kids’ bollocks.
Dont think you will get much of that on this channel though... EVs can be good, but they are not quite there yet at a reasonable price. As an "enviromental saviour" they were never anything else but a scam. Resources much more effectively used elsewhere.
this will make a nice micro camper van
I know the W204 in non AMG guise doesn't set people's pants on fire but they are very good in a dependable way.
That was some real furious (not) driving 😂😂👍🏻👍🏻