had a sneaking suspicion that it was better for me to follow similar rule sets of other Asian languages when i first came upon this conundrum. Asked some Japanese EAP/transfer students and was given indirect answers multiple times across multiple people which lead me to the same conclusion of what is taught in this video.
When my younger brother visited me in Japan some shy elementary school kids called him “gaijin-san”. After he was friendly to them and posed for photos, they began addressing him as ojisan. I told him he’d gotten promoted from distant Mr. Foreigner to comfortable Uncle. This was 30 years ago in Miyazaki.
If American kids called a foreigner visiting "Mr. Foreigner" there'd be at least 3 helicopter families rushing in there accusing the teachers of making the kids racist and then a bunch of conservative pundits would try to make it the new culture war rofl
@@NorseGraphicThese terms are taken up by honorifics which are appended to the end of nouns. It is impossible to call someone just "sir" or "madam." You have to include their name or some descriptor that makes it sound like Mr. Customer or in this case Mr. Foreigner. If you know their name, that is preferred most of the time, with appropriate honorific appended of course.
I visited Japan recently for the first time (after 3+ years of self-directed study). In 2 weeks I only heard ‘anata’ once, from a young bookshop girl who was helping me-I’m a 67-year-old male, btw. Otherwise we all seemed to get on quite well without second-person pronouns (well, except for ‘o-kiaku-sama’.) I only very occasionally needed to use ‘boku’ (I couldn’t bring myself to say ‘watashi’ at all). I did find ‘sumimasen’, ‘suimasen’ and ‘anou’ very useful though. Eventually I realized that even ‘sumimasen’ is often unnecessary if I want to get through a crowd, whether on the train or on the sidewalk-people just seem to be aware of each other and give each other space without needing to be asked. Also hearing train announcements and reading signs made me feel that ‘kudasai’ was too unfriendly, and ‘onegaishimasu’ was maybe a bit closer to how I felt. Or have I unwttingly made numerous faux-pas? In any case, the witty dialogues and clear diction in these videos are wonderful models for learners like me, so I hope you can make many more of them. Thank you.
Japanese people tend to talk casually to non-Japanese-natives. Some people just talk in casual form when they talk to foreigners, partly because they think speaking in very polite form is difficult for them to understand, and partly because they think foreigners don’t demand that high standard of politeness like many Japanese people do. There might be differences in how they talk to you and how they talk to Japanese natives.
In my Japanese course, it says that ください is kind of assertive. It seems it is more for instructions from officials and such and in announcements like you said. Or where お願いします cannot be used. Even in English, if you want someone to move for you to go through, the "can I please get through?" feels kid of pushy.
The connotation of 'kudasai' and 'onegaishimasu' are kind of the different; both are polite but the latter tends to be more polite than the former, however they're not necessarily interchangeable. Kudasai is used when telling/asking someone to do something, it's like saying 'please do X'. Onegaishimasu can have a few meanings but in the context of telling someone to do something, it's a bit more like 'I kindly request that you do X', it's more passive and less commanding. I am oversimplifying but hey.
@@kanamenaito I noticed this immediately when I traveled around with my Japanese friends when I visited Japan for the first time. When I asked them, they didn't even realize they were doing it. I can kind of understand though, I think we all have little switches that we turn off or on during certain situations without consciously realizing it in our native languages.
@@kanamenaito Ah, that make sense to me. My longest conversations did tend to get into casual form pretty quickly, and I tried to do that too, because it *is* easier :)
I forget my friends’ names all the time; it would be awkward if I had to use them instead of “you,” but maybe that way I would stop forgetting their names.
I'd just get their attention with an あのぉ and then say すみません etc, but you can use 店員さん in that moment (てんいんさん, pronounced "teinsan", despite the ん being there).
I was surprised to find out that Japanese doesn’t have the equivalents to “sir,” “ma’m,” “miss” and “young man.” So addressing strangers politely is challenging. I was told to just stick with すみません as Kaname-san says!
@@phantomsinthemistit's pronoun avoidance, these kinship terms swapping are not obligatory to have blood related meaning, basically the phrase and concept of brother in arms, blood sworn brother in Yakuza game eg ani-bun kyoudai etc tho specific Yakuza game term would be actually anigo and anego. It's like a usual word in a dictionary entry vs the technical entry marked (botany) etc
@@phantomsinthemistexamples Pak Budi Bang Rudi Hyeong/Oppa Kim Yamamoto nii-san Tho there are suffix too for Korean and JP eg Jun-nim and Shirasaka-san
When I learn something about Japan, I'm either impressed by how orderly everything is, or, like in this case, I'm shocked by how much you can do wrong in a short amount of time without meaning to do any harm. In German, it's only children calling strangers grandpa, aunt, etc., and we just have one informal an one formal pronoun for second person singular. In Japanese, there is much more nuance and caution involved in how to call someone else. In translation, that nuance has to be correctly analysed in order to produce a translation fitting for the character and the situation. As a future translator, I am, on the one hand, intrigued by, and, on the other hand, anxious of these issues.
If you're not ethnically Japanese or your Nihongo is not that jouzu you will likely get the "gaijin pass" and they understand you're just learning. They won't be offended or think it's rude (but if you call someone "temee" they will probably think you watch too many yakuza movies).
@@JustPlainRob It's true that I'm still learning but if I want to use Japanese for my future work as a translator, I should also learn how to do it correctly
@@JustPlainRobWould this be friendly: "Oi, Temee nani shitendayo? Kusoyaro! Fuzakenna, buchi korosu konoyaro!" I picked this up in a documentary about tea ceremonies. Can I use that in Keigo?
I low-key studied Japanese for a few years, and you are right, we were taught that あなた is used between married couples etc. When I was in Japan, I tried to avoid it as much as possible, but I didn't have the skills to use the correct alternatives, so I used あなた-san! Of course that was well over a decade ago - back in those days, if I was sitting alone in an izakaya, someone or other would always talk to me - after they had had two or more beers! I could guarantee I'd have a conversation during the evening. At the time I was over 50 years of age - just a guy from England, travelling alone. But over the years, I saw the tourist numbers grow and grow, and for my most recent trips, no-one talks to us foreigners any more! There are too many of us - we are not a rarity now, so not as interesting to slightly drunk salarymen! I've said it before - I wish I had seen your lessons back then. They are so clear, and the examples are so relatable. Thank you. I may return for my 70th birthday (I have 6 temples still to visit to complete my second Henro trip round Shikoku, so visiting them, and getting my second complete pilgrimage, will be a nice way to round things off).
That makes me sad. I’m planning to go back to Japan next year and was hoping to be able to converse with some natives there. When I went in 2016, I was very lucky to have the person who sold me pocket WiFi at the airport show me how to use the trains. The only other interaction was with two little boys who told me I remind them of Taylor Swift 😂
@@joannagarcia2001 But remember, I'm an old fart - people are not so inclined to talk to the likes of me! I've had some lovely encounters over the years - especially when hiking in rural areas. I remember sitting on a log for a rest, and the school day must have ended, because suddenly I was surrounded by little moppets wanting to know my name and where I was from. It was adorable! You may still get that sort of thing, but a lot of younger Western people do the pilgrim walk I did first in 2008 - when I walked for weeks without seeing anyone but Japanese people. I've been back to that island many times, and now I will see Western people *every day* walking the same path.
@@JesusChrist2000BC First time I did the Shikoku Henro Pilgrimage, in 2008, I could walk for a couple of weeks without seeing any 'gaijin' (yes, I know I was one!), or speaking anything other than Japanese. I've been going back from time to time, just doing a few temples, but not even visiting Tokyo during the whole trip, and I was speaking to young people from all over the world EVERY DAY! And you don't get much more out in the sticks than up a mountain in Shikoku! ;-) Of course there are fewer outside of Tokyo - that would apply to anywhere really - Tokyo is the nearest thing you will get to a cosmopolitan city in Japan. Oh, and what about Kyoto? There are more people dressed in rental kimonos than there are Japanese people in the main shopping arcade! (forgot the name, runs along the top of Gion).
Right!!! Its completely the opposite here. I rarely get called even just my first name! It's hard for me to imagine being comfortable using people's names in place of "you" because it feels "too personal" to my english brain lol
Sometimes "rude" is too vague a term, and implies that there's some special Japanese way of thinking that we don't understand in an English-speaking culture, especially in subcultures or regions where everyone uses first names and doesn't say "sir/ma'am". The same thing happens when we learn a European language with T-V distinction and are told that using "tu" is rude. But if you said instead, for example, that it assumes familiarity, or otherwise established the norm being broken, then we'd understand it better. There's lots of ways to do that in any culture or language. I don't know about Japan, but in the US, salesmen and pickup artists and con artists are often trained to do exactly that, to get really chummy and touchy and personal really quickly, to get inside your boundaries where the treasure is. Business culture being what it is in Japan, I don't know if that maps -- are there people who go yobisute and use plain-form verbs in order to assume familiarity, get close, and extract money or sex or other favors?
when I was explaining the distinction between polite and informal you in Russian, I used the following analogy: imagine that you use "dude" when you talk to that person. If it feels right, it's an informal "you".
I think that scammers and the like usually speak very formally in order to sound professional or official. That kind of speech is usually more comfortable for people to use. Most Japanese people are extremely uncomfortable with people acting so close so quickly. And pickup artists (in my experience) are basically non-existent.
@@ferretyluv If you use it with someone that shoud be addressed as their title(like teacher) it is rude. In italian I would have never said to my professors:"Come stai? Oggi fai lezione di diritto o economia politica? Ma sei stata te a dirmelo", I'd have to use lei:"Come sta? Oggi fa lezione di diritto o economia politica? Ma è stata lei a dirmelo"
I noticed that the word 'kimi' was not discussed; I assume it's the same as the other second-person pronouns, and I almost exclusively see the word used in song lyrics. Is it a dialect-specific term, or also just one that isn't used frequently/better to avoid in spoken language? Unrelated but the dialogue portions and rakugo approach to them (facing the other direction when it's a different character's dialogue and changing the voice slightly) is very fun to me and I always appreciate that!
It's true that "kimi" is a fairly common second-person word, but it's a word that is rarely heard in colloquial speech. "Kimi" is a friendly way of addressing someone who is your equal or subordinate. Situations where "kimi" is commonly used include when a kindergarten teacher talks to students, It is used when a boss talks to his subordinates at work. The word "kimi" used in music lyrics is generally used to refer to someone close to the same age as you.
I’ve also noticed (although anecdotally) that 君 is more common in songs sung by male singers. I have heard it in female-sung songs, but not as often. Maybe it’s a little more gender specific like 僕? I honestly don’t know and would like some more information on this too because song lyrics tend to throw out all the rules anyway.
@@MiMi_MoMo Lovers don't call each other "kimi". I think the word "kimi" used in the lyrics is a general term for a lover, someone you like, or someone you love. It is mostly used in songs that express the feelings of men. By generalizing, I think it will be easier for the listener to empathize with you.
@@MiMi_MoMoI don't think kimi is gender specific. There's a bunch of female songs with kimi. The main reason that kimi appears more often in male lyrics is, because kimi is a 2 mora (syllable) word and matches boku and ore well, which are both male pronounce. In addition, boku is getting less gender specific, especially when it comes to pop songs. It's completely normal that super feminine idols sing with kimi and boku.
Yeah. Being a foreigner in Japan can works as an advantage. They can break formality of people without making people angry easily. People have strict standard of politeness for Japanese people but not for non-Japanese-natives.
@@kanamenaito But if you speak more than just the most basic Japanese, some of them start having expectations that you actually know everything and then get angry when you make a mistake ;((
Yes. If you are regarded as a foreigner, that gives you a lot of freedom that Japanese are not allowed to have. Once you are regarded as "Japanese", then pretty strict rules (including non-verbal ones) are started to be applied to you..
As a one-year non-Japanese student in Hokkaido University, I was referred as 'あなた' and unmentioned '君' once respectively. For 'あなた', it was when I talked to a Japanese teacher whether I need to take an exam or not since I'm an auditory student. Then he said, "あ、あなた受験（じゅけん）しなくていいよ。だってあなた聴講生（ちょうこうせい）でしょ？成績（せいせき）取らないから受験しなくてもいいよ" (Oh, you don't have to take an exam. You're an audit student, right? You don't take grade anyway). About '君' though, I was looking for somewhere to park my bike, so I decided to park in charged parking lot. Since it was my first time using it, I was struggling when I was going to pay the fee. An elder staff then came in and asked me, "君、ここで初めてかい？" (Your first time using it?), I nodded and he told me what to do. From these situations, I assume that they used these pronouns because I'm a non-native like Kaname-san said in other comments? Might be wrong, though, I don't mind being referred by these anyway. (but if you ask me, I like being called 君/くん a lot) In that year, I heard my non-Japanese dormmates using 'お前' to not only other dormmates, but also Japanese dormmates too (for context, we're close enough to use colloquial to each other). On the other hand, I rarely heard the Japanese dormmates saying 'お前' unless it's a joke or said in a funny way. I kinda half agreed that it helps getting more used to casual conversation, but the fact they used too many times starts irritating me. Maybe just me. Quite irrelevant, but talking about "yobi-sute", I have a Japanese dormmate that's one year older than me, and he asked everyone in the dorm feel free not to "さん付け" ('san-zuke': addressing someone as '-san'). Everyone did so, but as I see him as a senior, I couldn't afford to yobi-sute (along with talking politely), though he insisted me a few time. I wonder if I'm being too mindful of causing any faux pas in Japan. Anyway, I'm just here to share my experience. Best of luck learning Japanese everyone, I'm still studying too (especially Kanji because it's fun lol).
This used to confuse me a lot back in my starting phases and I pretty much had nowhere to find out how to properly use it. u just made it clear as day in 10mins, happy for all the new learners wit ppl like u around bre. Legend frs.
I think I unconsciously used "kimi" and "anata" depending on the formality I wanted to have when I first visited Japan in 2009, but I had never learned Japanese and I was going by purely from exposition through anime. To my surprise it was enough to hold a decent conversation and as I stayed five month in Sakai for my studies (Ryuugaku) and wasn't shy about trying to speak the language with everyone, my conversational level grew very quickly. My Japanese was never called "joozu", but I was often told I was "pela pela", because as I never had formal lesson I didn't try to construct the sentences in my mind, I just copy pasted expression I'd heard from my memories, which for sure lead to a lots of mistakes, but resulted in a more fluid way of talking.
Absolutely fantastic comprehensive coverage of using "You" in Japanese! 10/10! Love your examples using natural conversation together with your explanations of what vibes each different piece of language gives! Great stuff!
I love your dialogues :) an explanation of "kimi" is missing. Having lived in Japan for around a year (as an exchange student in a Japanese family) that's the one I never really understood. Never heard someone use "teimei". Was very honored when my classmates (in school) stopped using any suffix :) My Japanese "okaasan" calle my Japanese "otoosan" "anata" sometimes by the way. They were both old (around 70) though.
When married couple call each other "anata" it usually means something like "dear" or "honey". "temee" is a very vulgar version of "you". There's a chance you may hear it from a very drunk salaryman late Friday night in the izakaya bars streets but it isn't used as often as in those Yakuza games and movies
あなた/おまえ can be used between friends and families but just like Kaname said, we don't often say that to our seniors, boss or person we barely know. However, そこのあなた "Hey you!" is used occasionally. おまえ sounds a bit like, "man", "dude", "mate" あなた could be "darling" "babe"
Thank you for your content! I studied Japanese language and culture at university (even got a degree) but got burned out due to the low quality of education. After five years I finally feel my love of Japanese language rekindled.
What about situations where you've already been introduced and see them regularly but you forget their name? I'm terrible at remembering names, and it would be rude to keep asking. It's led to several awkward pauses in conversation
You can get away without using any sort of pronoun for a little while, but you’re going to have to bite the bullet and confess you’ve forgotten their name or discretely check with someone else.
I'm Japanese. All you have to do is talk to them and say, "ねぇNe･e(hey)…" or "あのさAnosa(You know)...". Fortunately, Japanese sentences can be constructed without pronouns, so there is no need to worry after that.
Thanks man this is actually extremely helpful. I'm at that period of learning Japanese when I'm trying to learn kanji and seeing them thrown into sentences without the hiragana next to it is overwhelming. Addressing a stranger is a huge concern of mine because I'd like to remain polite but use appropriate titles. If I took anything away from this its situational dependant how and when to use specific titles.
If there's anything to take away from this, it's that you can usually find a way to not address them directly at all and just say what needs to be said. Japanese so often allows you to simply imply the speaker or listener without directly mentioning them.
Story time: I once didn't add さん after a person's nickname in an online video game when addresing them. I don't know why, I guess my brain just glitched. It was the most horrible feeling ever. I was dying out of embarrassement. I went into hiding and try to act like I didn't just do that. I should have apologized but I was extremely embarrassed. At the end, when we were all leaving the party after successfully running a dungeon, I adressed them properly and thanked them for the party. But safe to say, any relationship with that person got ruined... If I ever meet them again, I need to apologize 😭😭
Its kind of interesting how Japanese used to sound like random noises to me but now that im studying I actually recognize some words. Like for instance, "てめえ" is what the generic goons in like a dragon say when they're running after you, and "くそ" is what they say after you promptly kick their ass.
As someone who is studying Korean this is so interesting! In Korean, "you" is also not very easy to say. Online translators mostly use "당신" (dangshin) but that is rarely ever used in real life. Most of the time you'd use the name and a polite suffix such as "씨" (shi) just like you use "san" in Japanese. I love finding such similarities between languages! People are also often addressed by titles like director, older brother/sister,... Only when the other person is the same age or younger than you can you use the informal version of you: "너" (neo), which is very common opposed to the formal "당신" (dangshin), and can call their name without a suffix like "씨" (shi). :)
The problem I run into with that, is that I'm really bad at remembering names. ;-) So I would have to worry about how impolite it is so ask for someones name multiple times...
Yeah, I’ve been watching Japanese dramas and I don’t think I’ve heard あなた once. They most commonly say the person’s name instead of “you”. And yeah… a main character from a Japanese drama I like called another character おまえ after the character nearly killed him
This video just confirmed my absolute avoidance of the second-person pronoun in Japanese. Thanks for the detailed explanations and examples. They're always super helpful.
Wow! I tried to study Japanese starting in 1966 and received good instruction. But it was never this detailed and nuanced. I’m going to subscribe and see what else I didn’t get right as a student. This is great!
Oh no, my worst nightmare! Having to actually remember the names and surnames of people. I am the worst at it. I don't even remember names of professors, classmates, etc. I could be super cordial and friendly to someone in class while feeling terrible on the inside because I don't actually remember their name even though we have been together for a year.
Believe it or not we have a similar thing in English. You have to be very careful in how you use the word You in English. For instance. The You I used at the start of this sentence is a generic third person You, it doesn't mean You specifically and it doesn't carry emphasis of You specifically. But if I were to say You made a mistake. That is an accusatory You and has very strong implications. IF we say "How are you doing?" that's a type of passive direct You, where we are showing emphasis for caring about your well being. So we do have many forms of You, but one is a very accusatory form, like in Japan.
It's almost same in Korean language. In Korean, あなた(you) is 당신(ta'ng-shin / 'Dang-sin' is the translation according regular romanization rule of S.Korea). All Korean users know this pronoun but rarely used in common conversations due to the same reasons of using cases of あなた. But 당신 has another example to use for calling the third person in the most honorific title, because it was originally used for that cases in the past. In Korea, the most common polite and casual term to call a stranger(both man or woman) instead 당신 is 선생님(So'n-seng-nim/ seon-saeng-nim, according romanization rule). It is same one but has different pronunciation with Japanese term 先生(sensei), and like Japanese, it is also used for calling teachers.
@@Shotblur 당신 is came from Chinese character-combined word 當身(当身), literally "The body concerned". Korean also has a word "남자" that came from 男子, and the pronunciation is "nam-ja". And 남자 also has same meaning with what you mentioned. :)
I heard あなた used between a wife and husband in a movie recently but i think that's the only time I've seen it used that way outside of music (translated as 'darling' or something similar).
Korean has the same “you” issue-it’s probably even more offensive to use the standard word for “you” unless you want to fight with someone-and it seems like it's even harder to figure out how to address a stranger on the street. (Do you really want to risk using the term for a middle-aged man or woman?) But, in one respect, it's easier: you can always resort to 저기요! [jeo gi yo], literally meaning “Over there!” and is a bit like “Hey!” but in context means “Excuse me.” In any case, I'm not learning Japanese (not yet, anyway) but your videos are so engaging, I just might.
You're the second person I hear about "おじさん" and "おばさん" no longer being so polite/friendly and instead using "おかあさん", "おとうさん" and even "おにいさん" or "おねえさん" with middle aged people. The first one I heard about it, was a teenager who came as an exchange student here in Costa Rica, in a middle-high school (we rarely have middle or high school as separated systems) I'm teaching Japanese, and when I heard that, I was like "Whaaaaat?". Of course I didn't think she was joking in the slightest, there is no reason for that, but I still wondered if that was a generational gap thing. Even a Japanese senior teacher was surprised when I told her about it. Languages indeed change across time. Meanwhile, Spanish has fun with "you" pronouns: depending of which country you go, "tú" (きみ／おまえ／あんた), "vos" (おまはん, maybe?) and "usted" (あなた／貴殿／貴女) are used (or not) in different ways. If you are in Costa Rica or Colombia... Good luck, in these places are used confusingly XD XD
I think temae would work for vos, usted is plural right? Well either say dochira sama desuka or onamae wa nandesuka get their name then use -san after their family name prob solved-war thunder
@@prezentoappr1171 No XD XD It's complicated, that's why I used the Kyuushu dialect pronoun "omahan" for "vos". You see, some countries use "tú" and some others use "vos". But in no way "vos" neither "tú" are locked to mean a rude "temae" or similar. In some countries "usted" is formal, but in others "usted" will be way too formal and only use for very important people. "Ustedes" is actually the plural form for "Usted". Spain and Guinea Ecuatorial also have "Vosotros" (virtually inexistent in América Latina), the plural form of "vos", which in Spain is arcaic and not used, but a daily pronoun for Argentina, Uruguay and some others. Meanwhile, Costa Rica is the king of the mixed used of the 3 pronouns: if you are in San José, you will use "usted" for everyone, even your family and romantic partner, but in Cartago is considered rather cold, and Cartago people will think you are angry if you use "usted". They use "vos" more than anyone in the country, although "vos" is used by younger people and in friendly publicity, but it's recommended not to use it with elder people. Meanwhile, "tú" is not that used (and even some Costa Rican will ask why are you saying "tú" with a frowning face), but that said, some few people use it with ease (my case, I just can't use "vos" even though I live near Cartago), however in the south part of Costa Rica you will hear "tú" a lot more. Oh, and some people will use "tú" or "vos" with their own teachers or chiefs even if you're not that close, although this tend to be the norm for rather young teachers and chiefs, or more serious ones. In that way, and as you say, is easier to ask "dochira-sama desu ka" or "dou yobeba ii desu ka" right away to a Japanese person, than figuring out which second person pronoun to use in Costa Rica... Or rather which one NOT to use XD XD
that was actually fairly interesting, my "japanese" is on an extremly BASIC level, with asking ~some directions, ordering beer and whatnot, so just for traveling. Thank you for ur Video, i'm thinking of maybe putting in alot of time learning this language
Dude, your lessons are priceless! I've been studying Japanese for a few months now and, of course, I run into all sorts of challenges but you help with real-world examples! Keep it up! Omedetō!
6:47 Wow, we have the same thing in Turkish. When you call somebody as "auntie" or "uncle", they might think they are old and it might sound disrespectful in some context. If we want to sound respectful and polite, we prefer using "big brother" or "big sister".
Lot of times Japanese get around the conundrum of addressing someone by skipping saying any pronoun and by looking directly at the person. e.g. Doko e ikimasu ka. Where will (you) go? Another usually safe word is Otaku. Otaku no keitai desu ka. Is it your cell phone?
Oh, thank you for these thoughtful explanations! Every time I talk to my Japanese friends, I still hesitate on how to address them correctly. Even though we speak English most of the time.
I love how you explain things so visually, in fact I wonder if you prefer to learn and express yourself primarily in the visual sphere? It probably helps to connect with a larger audience of people who only receive the auditory or kinesthetic teaching styles when studying Japanese!
Yobisute is interesting. It isn't the same, but I often feel uncomfortable calling older adults by just their name because through school, church, family, scouts, and even friends' parents, I always said "mr/mrs" or "aunt/uncle", etc.. Calling my friend's 50 year old dad "Todd" is just really strange.
when i was younger calling older ppl by the first name at all felt sooo wrong. usually we just call people miss / mister or ms / mr (last name) but i have a friend whos parents go by ms and mr (first name) and it was hard to actually use that at first bcus just sounded so rude even though they specifically asked to be called that, lol.
I get it, but nowadays as I get older I realise those are barriers that are in our heads, they are people just like us, and most of the time would prefer to be treated "normally", like even with my bosses nowadays, I just call them by their first names
Funny, since it's the opposite in my country. Nobody would call their friend's dad "Mister X" or "sir" or anything like that (and "uncle" or "aunt" for people you know who aren't your actual relatives would be odd and rude lol, that's only for small kids with older strangers), we're all on first name basis in most situations in life. Parents of friends, bosses at work, etc. Anything unnecessarily "formal" is very odd and could be taken negatively, like you're seen as super old or there's a conflict. Addressing people formally is only for some rare situations like maybe a young person providing customer service to a very old person. Or a journalist interviewing the president.
As a Japanese who has been learning Japanese since age 0, I thought I should always use あなた… Edit: got farther in the video, I do use the names actually so idk why I was complaining 💀💀, but I use Chan and Kun.
I was heading to work one early Saturday morning in Nishi Azabu a few years. There was a mother in her Chanel suit taking her elementary school daughter to school. The three of us were stopped at a traffic light. A taxi pulled up and a drunk salaryman rolled out of the backseat with a hostess. The Chanel suit mother screamed: ANATA! (Her husband I assumed.)
I get it. It's like using "sup foo" in the US. There's a very fine line. One good thing about getting older as a male learning Japanese (I look Japanese) is that I have less of a chance of offending people
I’m not good in Japanese nor do I claim to understand Japanese culture but here’s how I understand it. Japanese is a very contextual language and people omit words if they are not necessary to convey the meaning. So really think about when it is necessary to say “you”. If you are in a 1 on 1 situation you don’t ever have to say you. It’s clear from context when you’re talking about yourself and when you are talking about the other person. When do you have to say “you”? When you are addressing a specific person in a group for example. When you want to put emphasis on contrast. You said it’s black but I say it’s white. When you want to point out differences, you need the word “you”. The way I perceive Japanese people, these are uncomfortable situations. If your life revolves around not sticking out in a crowd it’s clearly uncomfortable if someone else makes you stick out against your will.
Also my country has such polite issues about talking with someone, i am from Romania, Watashi ha daisuki Nihon desu ! Thank you very much for nice explanation !
It happened to me that some Japanese, mostly at the immigration, called me あなた while also using the non-polite form of Japanese. Like ”ハガキにあなたの住所を書いて". Since his attitude was very rude, I honestly felt offended and wanted to say something but I just froze. What would be a nice, polite way of replying to this type of language? Or when you go to a shop and the staff talks to you without even using ですand ます, how should I point out that?
You know, back in 1972 I had that very same "document" conversation at the kuyaku-sho. Every time I appeared, they would tell me of one additional document or signature I needed to come back with. I finally asked it they'd kindly tell me EVERYTHING I need to bring as these repeated trips were a horrid waste of time! Evidently, little has changed. M
When I studied abroad in Japan, I was referring to my dad as 'aitsu' and Japanese people let me know right away that it was very rude to do so. I told them I don't like my dad, but even then they said to not refer to him that way. I had a hard time in general not using aitsu and omae since it's so common in anime and my brain was comfortable using them.
I moved to Japan three months ago and often find myself talking to strangers (simple but super friendly conversations). Always struggle with the “where are you from” because don’t know how to address the taxi driver or the woman at the cafe table next to me. I tried dropping the subject and just going “どこからですか” but that seemed to create a bit of confusion, like “who, ME? or?”.
poor satoru sitting there watching his dad beef with everyone around him 😭😭 bro just wanted to learn about the teaching profession my jpn professor's a jpn expat and introduced anata to us as, indeed, the way that a wife might address her husband. she's also a fair bit older than you, i think, so maybe it's really a generational thing? and it still exists in media as an assumption that that's still how the form of address works. like how in real life we've switched phones almost exclusively to smartphones, but in contemporary cartoons, we still see a lot of analog technologies to better communicate the image.
- How to say ‘you’ in Japanese?
- We don’t do that here.
i notice that in anime hehe
had a sneaking suspicion that it was better for me to follow similar rule sets of other Asian languages when i first came upon this conundrum.
Asked some Japanese EAP/transfer students and was given indirect answers multiple times across multiple people which lead me to the same conclusion of what is taught in this video.
When my younger brother visited me in Japan some shy elementary school kids called him “gaijin-san”. After he was friendly to them and posed for photos, they began addressing him as ojisan. I told him he’d gotten promoted from distant Mr. Foreigner to comfortable Uncle. This was 30 years ago in Miyazaki.
gaijin-san is really funny
If American kids called a foreigner visiting "Mr. Foreigner" there'd be at least 3 helicopter families rushing in there accusing the teachers of making the kids racist and then a bunch of conservative pundits would try to make it the new culture war rofl
What about ‘Sir’ or ‘madam’? Do these words have a negative connotation in Japanese?
@@NorseGraphic 'Sir' or 'Madam' （aka 'さん' in Japanese） is the base in Japanese.
@@NorseGraphicThese terms are taken up by honorifics which are appended to the end of nouns. It is impossible to call someone just "sir" or "madam."
You have to include their name or some descriptor that makes it sound like Mr. Customer or in this case Mr. Foreigner.
If you know their name, that is preferred most of the time, with appropriate honorific appended of course.
"Men of middle ages are difficult" .... a sentiment true no matter what country you are from.
that and "some people will be upset no matter what you do."
nuggets of wisdom here 🤭
Came here to post this 😂
lol true
hahaha. woman of middle age are difficult xD with the extra added flavor of menopause
Middle aged women are still worse 😂
Came to learn Japanese, stayed for the drama.
Will bring popcorn next time.
😂😂😂😂 Jdrama
"Some people get offended no matter what you do" -- I couldn't agree more 😂
Not even in a Japanese context, this is true for the internet in general!
If Kaname-san wrote a TV drama I'd binge watch it for sure.
His dialogues in these videos are so good.
Yes the dialogues are good and useful. More “every day” dialogues that teach more than what I have ever found on a Japanese lesson.
Shit, if he made a manga I’d illustrate it for him lmao
That last convo was spicy 🔥
@@andresmontero1122Exactly what I was thinking lol
The little kid tantrum gave me a good laugh. 🤣
this man could tell something completely wrong on purpose and i'd still follow his advice 💀
This man... 😅
こいつ*
「こいつ」ｓｅｅｍｓ ｖｅｒｙ ｒｕｄｅ ❌ ✖
この男・この人・この方「かた」is the right way
Is that supposed to signal that that statement of his was incorrect? I'm genuinly confused now@@zehanimohamedyoussef3736
I think he’s English
I visited Japan recently for the first time (after 3+ years of self-directed study). In 2 weeks I only heard ‘anata’ once, from a young bookshop girl who was helping me-I’m a 67-year-old male, btw. Otherwise we all seemed to get on quite well without second-person pronouns (well, except for ‘o-kiaku-sama’.) I only very occasionally needed to use ‘boku’ (I couldn’t bring myself to say ‘watashi’ at all). I did find ‘sumimasen’, ‘suimasen’ and ‘anou’ very useful though. Eventually I realized that even ‘sumimasen’ is often unnecessary if I want to get through a crowd, whether on the train or on the sidewalk-people just seem to be aware of each other and give each other space without needing to be asked. Also hearing train announcements and reading signs made me feel that ‘kudasai’ was too unfriendly, and ‘onegaishimasu’ was maybe a bit closer to how I felt. Or have I unwttingly made numerous faux-pas? In any case, the witty dialogues and clear diction in these videos are wonderful models for learners like me, so I hope you can make many more of them. Thank you.
Japanese people tend to talk casually to non-Japanese-natives. Some people just talk in casual form when they talk to foreigners, partly because they think speaking in very polite form is difficult for them to understand, and partly because they think foreigners don’t demand that high standard of politeness like many Japanese people do. There might be differences in how they talk to you and how they talk to Japanese natives.
In my Japanese course, it says that ください is kind of assertive. It seems it is more for instructions from officials and such and in announcements like you said. Or where お願いします cannot be used. Even in English, if you want someone to move for you to go through, the "can I please get through?" feels kid of pushy.
The connotation of 'kudasai' and 'onegaishimasu' are kind of the different; both are polite but the latter tends to be more polite than the former, however they're not necessarily interchangeable.
Kudasai is used when telling/asking someone to do something, it's like saying 'please do X'. Onegaishimasu can have a few meanings but in the context of telling someone to do something, it's a bit more like 'I kindly request that you do X', it's more passive and less commanding. I am oversimplifying but hey.
@@kanamenaito I noticed this immediately when I traveled around with my Japanese friends when I visited Japan for the first time. When I asked them, they didn't even realize they were doing it. I can kind of understand though, I think we all have little switches that we turn off or on during certain situations without consciously realizing it in our native languages.
@@kanamenaito
Ah, that make sense to me. My longest conversations did tend to get into casual form pretty quickly, and I tried to do that too, because it *is* easier :)
a: call people by their name and suffix
b: what if i don't know them?
a: then why are you bothering them by talking to them? 🙂
This is how I live my everyday life
What about shopkeepers?
I forget my friends’ names all the time; it would be awkward if I had to use them instead of “you,” but maybe that way I would stop forgetting their names.
I'd just get their attention with an あのぉ and then say すみません etc, but you can use 店員さん in that moment (てんいんさん, pronounced "teinsan", despite the ん being there).
c: how do you know people without ever talking to them?
I was surprised to find out that Japanese doesn’t have the equivalents to “sir,” “ma’m,” “miss” and “young man.” So addressing strangers politely is challenging. I was told to just stick with すみません as Kaname-san says!
Two of those do exist though...
おにいさん young man
おじょうさん miss
Doesn't the first one mean brother, or am I remembering wrong?
「おにいさん」「おにいちゃん」は自分の兄のことだったり、息子たちに呼びかける時に上の子のことを指す場合に使います。
ただ、街を歩いてると
👩👱🏽♀️「ちょっと、オニーサン、うちによってかない？」
👴🏻「おっ、にいちゃん良い服を着てるねえ」
と言われたりします。
@@phantomsinthemistit's pronoun avoidance, these kinship terms swapping are not obligatory to have blood related meaning, basically the phrase and concept of brother in arms, blood sworn brother in Yakuza game eg ani-bun kyoudai etc tho specific Yakuza game term would be actually anigo and anego.
It's like a usual word in a dictionary entry vs the technical entry marked (botany) etc
@@phantomsinthemistexamples
Pak Budi
Bang Rudi
Hyeong/Oppa Kim
Yamamoto nii-san
Tho there are suffix too for Korean and JP eg Jun-nim and Shirasaka-san
When I learn something about Japan, I'm either impressed by how orderly everything is, or, like in this case, I'm shocked by how much you can do wrong in a short amount of time without meaning to do any harm. In German, it's only children calling strangers grandpa, aunt, etc., and we just have one informal an one formal pronoun for second person singular. In Japanese, there is much more nuance and caution involved in how to call someone else. In translation, that nuance has to be correctly analysed in order to produce a translation fitting for the character and the situation. As a future translator, I am, on the one hand, intrigued by, and, on the other hand, anxious of these issues.
If you're not ethnically Japanese or your Nihongo is not that jouzu you will likely get the "gaijin pass" and they understand you're just learning. They won't be offended or think it's rude (but if you call someone "temee" they will probably think you watch too many yakuza movies).
@@JustPlainRob It's true that I'm still learning but if I want to use Japanese for my future work as a translator, I should also learn how to do it correctly
@@JustPlainRobWould this be friendly:
"Oi, Temee nani shitendayo? Kusoyaro! Fuzakenna, buchi korosu konoyaro!"
I picked this up in a documentary about tea ceremonies. Can I use that in Keigo?
Tja, wie sagt man so schön. "Deutsche Sprache schwere Sprache, aber Japanisch ist nochmal eine andere Sache."
@@ssjkaryuusennin Zum Sprachenlernen gehören aber nicht nur Sachen wie Vokabeln und Grammatik, sondern auch Kultur ;-)
I low-key studied Japanese for a few years, and you are right, we were taught that あなた is used between married couples etc. When I was in Japan, I tried to avoid it as much as possible, but I didn't have the skills to use the correct alternatives, so I used あなた-san!
Of course that was well over a decade ago - back in those days, if I was sitting alone in an izakaya, someone or other would always talk to me - after they had had two or more beers! I could guarantee I'd have a conversation during the evening. At the time I was over 50 years of age - just a guy from England, travelling alone.
But over the years, I saw the tourist numbers grow and grow, and for my most recent trips, no-one talks to us foreigners any more! There are too many of us - we are not a rarity now, so not as interesting to slightly drunk salarymen!
I've said it before - I wish I had seen your lessons back then. They are so clear, and the examples are so relatable. Thank you.
I may return for my 70th birthday (I have 6 temples still to visit to complete my second Henro trip round Shikoku, so visiting them, and getting my second complete pilgrimage, will be a nice way to round things off).
That makes me sad. I’m planning to go back to Japan next year and was hoping to be able to converse with some natives there. When I went in 2016, I was very lucky to have the person who sold me pocket WiFi at the airport show me how to use the trains. The only other interaction was with two little boys who told me I remind them of Taylor Swift 😂
@@joannagarcia2001
But remember, I'm an old fart - people are not so inclined to talk to the likes of me!
I've had some lovely encounters over the years - especially when hiking in rural areas. I remember sitting on a log for a rest, and the school day must have ended, because suddenly I was surrounded by little moppets wanting to know my name and where I was from. It was adorable!
You may still get that sort of thing, but a lot of younger Western people do the pilgrim walk I did first in 2008 - when I walked for weeks without seeing anyone but Japanese people. I've been back to that island many times, and now I will see Western people *every day* walking the same path.
It depends where you are at. Get out of Tokyo and it increases significantly.
@@JesusChrist2000BC
First time I did the Shikoku Henro Pilgrimage, in 2008, I could walk for a couple of weeks without seeing any 'gaijin' (yes, I know I was one!), or speaking anything other than Japanese.
I've been going back from time to time, just doing a few temples, but not even visiting Tokyo during the whole trip, and I was speaking to young people from all over the world EVERY DAY!
And you don't get much more out in the sticks than up a mountain in Shikoku! ;-)
Of course there are fewer outside of Tokyo - that would apply to anywhere really - Tokyo is the nearest thing you will get to a cosmopolitan city in Japan. Oh, and what about Kyoto? There are more people dressed in rental kimonos than there are Japanese people in the main shopping arcade! (forgot the name, runs along the top of Gion).
Thanks for including furigana, it really helped reading out the japanese as you were speaking
Seems like I’ll need a full video on how to ask for a person’s name after I inevitably forget them.
HAHA😂🤣😂
right and right!
No need to. In Japan everyone's name is "Sumimasen" or "ano.."
It sounds like "anata" is very similar to someone using your full name in English.
So basically if your mother is screaming it up the stairs it's tome to run xD (possibly after seeing someone messed up)
Right!!! Its completely the opposite here. I rarely get called even just my first name! It's hard for me to imagine being comfortable using people's names in place of "you" because it feels "too personal" to my english brain lol
German and Japanese both use the surname with a title - so it's actually less personal and more formal.
As a Korean, this man is really helpful to learn Japanese and English at the same time. Additionally, the situations he's acting are hilarious 🤣
Sometimes "rude" is too vague a term, and implies that there's some special Japanese way of thinking that we don't understand in an English-speaking culture, especially in subcultures or regions where everyone uses first names and doesn't say "sir/ma'am". The same thing happens when we learn a European language with T-V distinction and are told that using "tu" is rude.
But if you said instead, for example, that it assumes familiarity, or otherwise established the norm being broken, then we'd understand it better. There's lots of ways to do that in any culture or language. I don't know about Japan, but in the US, salesmen and pickup artists and con artists are often trained to do exactly that, to get really chummy and touchy and personal really quickly, to get inside your boundaries where the treasure is.
Business culture being what it is in Japan, I don't know if that maps -- are there people who go yobisute and use plain-form verbs in order to assume familiarity, get close, and extract money or sex or other favors?
when I was explaining the distinction between polite and informal you in Russian, I used the following analogy: imagine that you use "dude" when you talk to that person. If it feels right, it's an informal "you".
I think that scammers and the like usually speak very formally in order to sound professional or official. That kind of speech is usually more comfortable for people to use. Most Japanese people are extremely uncomfortable with people acting so close so quickly. And pickup artists (in my experience) are basically non-existent.
I’ve never been told “tu” is rude, just casual.
@@ferretyluv If you use it with someone that shoud be addressed as their title(like teacher) it is rude. In italian I would have never said to my professors:"Come stai? Oggi fai lezione di diritto o economia politica? Ma sei stata te a dirmelo", I'd have to use lei:"Come sta? Oggi fa lezione di diritto o economia politica? Ma è stata lei a dirmelo"
@@GG-ee5hm Well yeah, if you’re talking to the King with casual language, that’d be rude.
I noticed that the word 'kimi' was not discussed; I assume it's the same as the other second-person pronouns, and I almost exclusively see the word used in song lyrics. Is it a dialect-specific term, or also just one that isn't used frequently/better to avoid in spoken language?
Unrelated but the dialogue portions and rakugo approach to them (facing the other direction when it's a different character's dialogue and changing the voice slightly) is very fun to me and I always appreciate that!
It's true that "kimi" is a fairly common second-person word, but it's a word that is rarely heard in colloquial speech.
"Kimi" is a friendly way of addressing someone who is your equal or subordinate.
Situations where "kimi" is commonly used include when a kindergarten teacher talks to students,
It is used when a boss talks to his subordinates at work.
The word "kimi" used in music lyrics is generally used to refer to someone close to the same age as you.
I’ve also noticed (although anecdotally) that 君 is more common in songs sung by male singers. I have heard it in female-sung songs, but not as often. Maybe it’s a little more gender specific like 僕? I honestly don’t know and would like some more information on this too because song lyrics tend to throw out all the rules anyway.
@@MiMi_MoMo
Lovers don't call each other "kimi".
I think the word "kimi" used in the lyrics is a general term for a lover, someone you like, or someone you love.
It is mostly used in songs that express the feelings of men.
By generalizing, I think it will be easier for the listener to empathize with you.
It makes you sound like you're from the meiji era or you're a gangster
@@MiMi_MoMoI don't think kimi is gender specific. There's a bunch of female songs with kimi. The main reason that kimi appears more often in male lyrics is, because kimi is a 2 mora (syllable) word and matches boku and ore well, which are both male pronounce. In addition, boku is getting less gender specific, especially when it comes to pop songs. It's completely normal that super feminine idols sing with kimi and boku.
当然ですが、相手と親しいかそうでもないか初対面か、相手が目上か目下か、くだけた場面か仕事などのフォーマルな場面か、などで言葉の使い方は大きく異なります。日本語の場合は「You」にあたる語が沢山あって使い分けされているところが英語と比べて独特かもしれませんね。
「あなた」という言葉は複雑で理解しにくく、使うのがリスキーな言葉です。基本的に冷たい感じのする言葉で、親しい相手や初対面にはまず使いません。例外として、妻が夫に「あなた」と言うことはありますが2:00で言われてるように一般的なものではありません。フォーマルな言葉ではあるけどSirのような無難な言葉ではなくて失礼になりやすい言葉です。仕事で上司が部下に「あなた」と言うのは問題になりにくいと思います。0:15のように文句を言う時にも使います。英語のdudeなどのように言い方でニュアンスが変わるということもあまりないです。特別な間柄ならば親しみを込めた意味になりえますが、基本的には冷たい意味や高圧的な意味です。
「てめえ」は喧嘩を売る相手に使う言葉です。笑い。非常に軽蔑的で攻撃的なので絶対に使ってはいけません。「お前」もそれに近い所があるのでお勧めしません。
無難な言い方は2:25のように「苗字+さん」です。単に名前(ここではfirst nameのこと)で呼ぶことは親しい相手じゃないと失礼になります。「名前+くん」や「名前+ちゃん」も仲良い相手じゃないと失礼です。2:25の「みかさん」のように「名前+さん」で呼ぶのは無難です。ただし好みもあるので相手に「なんとお呼びすればいいですか？」または「なんて呼んだらいいですか？」などと呼び方を尋ねるのが1番でしょう。
ただし、5:05のように仕事で役職がある人に話す場合は役職名で呼ぶのが普通です。学校の先生や病院の医師だったら「先生」「○○先生」ですね。
あるいは、1:44のように省略されることも多いです。例えば、前を歩いている人が何か落として"Excuse me, is this yours?"と聞きたい時に「これあなたのですか？」と言うよりは「これ落としましたよ」または「これ落としましたか？」と言うのが普通です。
その通りです。
Kaname Naito, is it safe to assume that if a Japanese person sees one’s not a Japanese-native speaker, he or she would give them a break?
Yeah. Being a foreigner in Japan can works as an advantage. They can break formality of people without making people angry easily. People have strict standard of politeness for Japanese people but not for non-Japanese-natives.
@@kanamenaito But if you speak more than just the most basic Japanese, some of them start having expectations that you actually know everything and then get angry when you make a mistake ;((
Yes. If you are regarded as a foreigner, that gives you a lot of freedom that Japanese are not allowed to have. Once you are regarded as "Japanese", then pretty strict rules (including non-verbal ones) are started to be applied to you..
@@kanamenaito
What happens if you're invisible foreigner though because you're also East Asian?
@ip6229-san, you forgot to add sensei to Kaname Naito
As a one-year non-Japanese student in Hokkaido University, I was referred as 'あなた' and unmentioned '君' once respectively. For 'あなた', it was when I talked to a Japanese teacher whether I need to take an exam or not since I'm an auditory student. Then he said, "あ、あなた受験（じゅけん）しなくていいよ。だってあなた聴講生（ちょうこうせい）でしょ？成績（せいせき）取らないから受験しなくてもいいよ" (Oh, you don't have to take an exam. You're an audit student, right? You don't take grade anyway).
About '君' though, I was looking for somewhere to park my bike, so I decided to park in charged parking lot. Since it was my first time using it, I was struggling when I was going to pay the fee. An elder staff then came in and asked me, "君、ここで初めてかい？" (Your first time using it?), I nodded and he told me what to do.
From these situations, I assume that they used these pronouns because I'm a non-native like Kaname-san said in other comments? Might be wrong, though, I don't mind being referred by these anyway. (but if you ask me, I like being called 君/くん a lot)
In that year, I heard my non-Japanese dormmates using 'お前' to not only other dormmates, but also Japanese dormmates too (for context, we're close enough to use colloquial to each other). On the other hand, I rarely heard the Japanese dormmates saying 'お前' unless it's a joke or said in a funny way. I kinda half agreed that it helps getting more used to casual conversation, but the fact they used too many times starts irritating me. Maybe just me.
Quite irrelevant, but talking about "yobi-sute", I have a Japanese dormmate that's one year older than me, and he asked everyone in the dorm feel free not to "さん付け" ('san-zuke': addressing someone as '-san'). Everyone did so, but as I see him as a senior, I couldn't afford to yobi-sute (along with talking politely), though he insisted me a few time. I wonder if I'm being too mindful of causing any faux pas in Japan.
Anyway, I'm just here to share my experience. Best of luck learning Japanese everyone, I'm still studying too (especially Kanji because it's fun lol).
This used to confuse me a lot back in my starting phases and I pretty much had nowhere to find out how to properly use it. u just made it clear as day in 10mins, happy for all the new learners wit ppl like u around bre.
Legend frs.
Same yeah, it's quite weird and unintuitive at first to say someone's name over and over even though you're already talking to them.
Why do most japanese teachers assume that I'm trying to be polite?
majority of situations you will use polite language over casual unless with friends but even then you need polite language before you can get there.
I think I unconsciously used "kimi" and "anata" depending on the formality I wanted to have when I first visited Japan in 2009, but I had never learned Japanese and I was going by purely from exposition through anime. To my surprise it was enough to hold a decent conversation and as I stayed five month in Sakai for my studies (Ryuugaku) and wasn't shy about trying to speak the language with everyone, my conversational level grew very quickly. My Japanese was never called "joozu", but I was often told I was "pela pela", because as I never had formal lesson I didn't try to construct the sentences in my mind, I just copy pasted expression I'd heard from my memories, which for sure lead to a lots of mistakes, but resulted in a more fluid way of talking.
Absolutely fantastic comprehensive coverage of using "You" in Japanese! 10/10!
Love your examples using natural conversation together with your explanations of what vibes each different piece of language gives! Great stuff!
I love your dialogues :) an explanation of "kimi" is missing. Having lived in Japan for around a year (as an exchange student in a Japanese family) that's the one I never really understood. Never heard someone use "teimei". Was very honored when my classmates (in school) stopped using any suffix :)
My Japanese "okaasan" calle my Japanese "otoosan" "anata" sometimes by the way. They were both old (around 70) though.
ていめい？
When married couple call each other "anata" it usually means something like "dear" or "honey".
"temee" is a very vulgar version of "you". There's a chance you may hear it from a very drunk salaryman late Friday night in the izakaya bars streets but it isn't used as often as in those Yakuza games and movies
@@user-uuueo 多分てめえと言いたかった
Boy, that listening comprehension at the end took a wild turn.
あなた/おまえ can be used between friends and families but just like Kaname said, we don't often say that to our seniors, boss or person we barely know. However, そこのあなた "Hey you!" is used occasionally.
おまえ sounds a bit like, "man", "dude", "mate"
あなた could be "darling" "babe"
Thank you for your content! I studied Japanese language and culture at university (even got a degree) but got burned out due to the low quality of education. After five years I finally feel my love of Japanese language rekindled.
One of the best language educational channels out there. ありがとうございます！
What about situations where you've already been introduced and see them regularly but you forget their name? I'm terrible at remembering names, and it would be rude to keep asking. It's led to several awkward pauses in conversation
💀
You can get away without using any sort of pronoun for a little while, but you’re going to have to bite the bullet and confess you’ve forgotten their name or discretely check with someone else.
I'm Japanese. All you have to do is talk to them and say, "ねぇNe･e(hey)…" or "あのさAnosa(You know)...". Fortunately, Japanese sentences can be constructed without pronouns, so there is no need to worry after that.
@@Jim_mearswhich is pretty much how it works in English too, come to think of it
Thanks man this is actually extremely helpful. I'm at that period of learning Japanese when I'm trying to learn kanji and seeing them thrown into sentences without the hiragana next to it is overwhelming. Addressing a stranger is a huge concern of mine because I'd like to remain polite but use appropriate titles. If I took anything away from this its situational dependant how and when to use specific titles.
If there's anything to take away from this, it's that you can usually find a way to not address them directly at all and just say what needs to be said. Japanese so often allows you to simply imply the speaker or listener without directly mentioning them.
"Just yobisute me" had me cracking up.
Kaname videos are bangers! He teaches so well and his English is very good.
Story time: I once didn't add さん after a person's nickname in an online video game when addresing them. I don't know why, I guess my brain just glitched. It was the most horrible feeling ever. I was dying out of embarrassement. I went into hiding and try to act like I didn't just do that. I should have apologized but I was extremely embarrassed. At the end, when we were all leaving the party after successfully running a dungeon, I adressed them properly and thanked them for the party. But safe to say, any relationship with that person got ruined... If I ever meet them again, I need to apologize 😭😭
Its kind of interesting how Japanese used to sound like random noises to me but now that im studying I actually recognize some words. Like for instance, "てめえ" is what the generic goons in like a dragon say when they're running after you, and "くそ" is what they say after you promptly kick their ass.
As someone who is studying Korean this is so interesting! In Korean, "you" is also not very easy to say. Online translators mostly use "당신" (dangshin) but that is rarely ever used in real life. Most of the time you'd use the name and a polite suffix such as "씨" (shi) just like you use "san" in Japanese. I love finding such similarities between languages! People are also often addressed by titles like director, older brother/sister,... Only when the other person is the same age or younger than you can you use the informal version of you: "너" (neo), which is very common opposed to the formal "당신" (dangshin), and can call their name without a suffix like "씨" (shi). :)
The problem I run into with that, is that I'm really bad at remembering names. ;-)
So I would have to worry about how impolite it is so ask for someones name multiple times...
Yeah, I’ve been watching Japanese dramas and I don’t think I’ve heard あなた once. They most commonly say the person’s name instead of “you”.
And yeah… a main character from a Japanese drama I like called another character おまえ after the character nearly killed him
This video just confirmed my absolute avoidance of the second-person pronoun in Japanese. Thanks for the detailed explanations and examples. They're always super helpful.
Such a nice guy, helping us for free
Thank you Kaname-san for this video I absolutely love the dialog you use in your videos. I like the fact that your video are short and super efficient
0:56 I choose to believe this sample monologue is actually reflective of kaname-san's actual frustrations with PM
Wow! I tried to study Japanese starting in 1966 and received good instruction. But it was never this detailed and nuanced. I’m going to subscribe and see what else I didn’t get right as a student. This is great!
ojii sama
This video is both educational and extremely hilarious to watch. I absolutely love these kind of mini-sketches from Kaname様！
My favorite part of learning Japanese RUclips is all the thumbnails are like "just don't speak ever"
Come for the grammar tips. Stay for the one-act dramas at the end!
Poor guy got called out for drinking after work...
Kaname-san is letting rip today. 😂 I can just picture him as a politician taking down the others a peg or two.
Oh no, my worst nightmare! Having to actually remember the names and surnames of people. I am the worst at it. I don't even remember names of professors, classmates, etc. I could be super cordial and friendly to someone in class while feeling terrible on the inside because I don't actually remember their name even though we have been together for a year.
Believe it or not we have a similar thing in English. You have to be very careful in how you use the word You in English. For instance. The You I used at the start of this sentence is a generic third person You, it doesn't mean You specifically and it doesn't carry emphasis of You specifically. But if I were to say You made a mistake. That is an accusatory You and has very strong implications. IF we say "How are you doing?" that's a type of passive direct You, where we are showing emphasis for caring about your well being. So we do have many forms of You, but one is a very accusatory form, like in Japan.
It's almost same in Korean language. In Korean, あなた(you) is 당신(ta'ng-shin / 'Dang-sin' is the translation according regular romanization rule of S.Korea). All Korean users know this pronoun but rarely used in common conversations due to the same reasons of using cases of あなた. But 당신 has another example to use for calling the third person in the most honorific title, because it was originally used for that cases in the past. In Korea, the most common polite and casual term to call a stranger(both man or woman) instead 당신 is 선생님(So'n-seng-nim/ seon-saeng-nim, according romanization rule). It is same one but has different pronunciation with Japanese term 先生(sensei), and like Japanese, it is also used for calling teachers.
That first one also sounds very similar to the Japanese 男子 (danshi), "guy" or "man", which has its equivalent in Chinese as well.
@@Shotblur 당신 is came from Chinese character-combined word 當身(当身), literally "The body concerned". Korean also has a word "남자" that came from 男子, and the pronunciation is "nam-ja". And 남자 also has same meaning with what you mentioned. :)
@@gudohwan Fascinating! Thanks for the info.
I heard あなた used between a wife and husband in a movie recently but i think that's the only time I've seen it used that way outside of music (translated as 'darling' or something similar).
Korean has the same “you” issue-it’s probably even more offensive to use the standard word for “you” unless you want to fight with someone-and it seems like it's even harder to figure out how to address a stranger on the street. (Do you really want to risk using the term for a middle-aged man or woman?) But, in one respect, it's easier: you can always resort to 저기요! [jeo gi yo], literally meaning “Over there!” and is a bit like “Hey!” but in context means “Excuse me.”
In any case, I'm not learning Japanese (not yet, anyway) but your videos are so engaging, I just might.
The examples are always so wholesome I actually can't
You're the second person I hear about "おじさん" and "おばさん" no longer being so polite/friendly and instead using "おかあさん", "おとうさん" and even "おにいさん" or "おねえさん" with middle aged people. The first one I heard about it, was a teenager who came as an exchange student here in Costa Rica, in a middle-high school (we rarely have middle or high school as separated systems) I'm teaching Japanese, and when I heard that, I was like "Whaaaaat?". Of course I didn't think she was joking in the slightest, there is no reason for that, but I still wondered if that was a generational gap thing. Even a Japanese senior teacher was surprised when I told her about it. Languages indeed change across time.
Meanwhile, Spanish has fun with "you" pronouns: depending of which country you go, "tú" (きみ／おまえ／あんた), "vos" (おまはん, maybe?) and "usted" (あなた／貴殿／貴女) are used (or not) in different ways. If you are in Costa Rica or Colombia... Good luck, in these places are used confusingly XD XD
lol im from argentina this is so true especially w/ vos level of casuality
I think temae would work for vos, usted is plural right?
Well either say dochira sama desuka or onamae wa nandesuka get their name then use -san after their family name prob solved-war thunder
@@prezentoappr1171 No XD XD It's complicated, that's why I used the Kyuushu dialect pronoun "omahan" for "vos". You see, some countries use "tú" and some others use "vos". But in no way "vos" neither "tú" are locked to mean a rude "temae" or similar. In some countries "usted" is formal, but in others "usted" will be way too formal and only use for very important people. "Ustedes" is actually the plural form for "Usted". Spain and Guinea Ecuatorial also have "Vosotros" (virtually inexistent in América Latina), the plural form of "vos", which in Spain is arcaic and not used, but a daily pronoun for Argentina, Uruguay and some others.
Meanwhile, Costa Rica is the king of the mixed used of the 3 pronouns: if you are in San José, you will use "usted" for everyone, even your family and romantic partner, but in Cartago is considered rather cold, and Cartago people will think you are angry if you use "usted". They use "vos" more than anyone in the country, although "vos" is used by younger people and in friendly publicity, but it's recommended not to use it with elder people. Meanwhile, "tú" is not that used (and even some Costa Rican will ask why are you saying "tú" with a frowning face), but that said, some few people use it with ease (my case, I just can't use "vos" even though I live near Cartago), however in the south part of Costa Rica you will hear "tú" a lot more. Oh, and some people will use "tú" or "vos" with their own teachers or chiefs even if you're not that close, although this tend to be the norm for rather young teachers and chiefs, or more serious ones.
In that way, and as you say, is easier to ask "dochira-sama desu ka" or "dou yobeba ii desu ka" right away to a Japanese person, than figuring out which second person pronoun to use in Costa Rica... Or rather which one NOT to use XD XD
As someone who is still learning Kanji, thanks for including furigana! It helps a lot to be able to read the word out.
Total beginner trying to learn japanese. The short form lessons/tips interspersed with a bit of scenes is fun and engaging. Definite easy sub
that was actually fairly interesting, my "japanese" is on an extremly BASIC level, with asking ~some directions, ordering beer and whatnot, so just for traveling. Thank you for ur Video, i'm thinking of maybe putting in alot of time learning this language
Dude, your lessons are priceless! I've been studying Japanese for a few months now and, of course, I run into all sorts of challenges but you help with real-world examples! Keep it up! Omedetō!
you explain everything so thoroughly and efficiently. thanks!
6:47 Wow, we have the same thing in Turkish. When you call somebody as "auntie" or "uncle", they might think they are old and it might sound disrespectful in some context. If we want to sound respectful and polite, we prefer using "big brother" or "big sister".
Lot of times Japanese get around the conundrum of addressing someone by skipping saying any pronoun and by looking directly at the person. e.g. Doko e ikimasu ka. Where will (you) go? Another usually safe word is Otaku. Otaku no keitai desu ka. Is it your cell phone?
Thank you for your explanations and examples. But also, you act really well with all your characters 😂 I was quite invested in each scene lol
That would explain why many dramas and anime lines repeatedly use the person's name. I kept wondering why they did that
I came for the teaching, and I stayed for the stories. AMAZING STORYTELLING KANAME-SAN!
Oh, thank you for these thoughtful explanations! Every time I talk to my Japanese friends, I still hesitate on how to address them correctly. Even though we speak English most of the time.
Kaname Naito is the realest OG in the land of japan
I love his introduction ''Hi I'm Kaname''. So short and sweet and concise and beautiful
I love how you explain things so visually, in fact I wonder if you prefer to learn and express yourself primarily in the visual sphere?
It probably helps to connect with a larger audience of people who only receive the auditory or kinesthetic teaching styles when studying Japanese!
Extremely useful to have this clearly explained. Thank you
Yobisute is interesting. It isn't the same, but I often feel uncomfortable calling older adults by just their name because through school, church, family, scouts, and even friends' parents, I always said "mr/mrs" or "aunt/uncle", etc.. Calling my friend's 50 year old dad "Todd" is just really strange.
when i was younger calling older ppl by the first name at all felt sooo wrong. usually we just call people miss / mister or ms / mr (last name) but i have a friend whos parents go by ms and mr (first name) and it was hard to actually use that at first bcus just sounded so rude even though they specifically asked to be called that, lol.
I get it, but nowadays as I get older I realise those are barriers that are in our heads, they are people just like us, and most of the time would prefer to be treated "normally", like even with my bosses nowadays, I just call them by their first names
Funny, since it's the opposite in my country. Nobody would call their friend's dad "Mister X" or "sir" or anything like that (and "uncle" or "aunt" for people you know who aren't your actual relatives would be odd and rude lol, that's only for small kids with older strangers), we're all on first name basis in most situations in life. Parents of friends, bosses at work, etc. Anything unnecessarily "formal" is very odd and could be taken negatively, like you're seen as super old or there's a conflict. Addressing people formally is only for some rare situations like maybe a young person providing customer service to a very old person. Or a journalist interviewing the president.
Your english is so good! Thanks for providing this content!
As a Japanese who has been learning Japanese since age 0, I thought I should always use あなた… Edit: got farther in the video, I do use the names actually so idk why I was complaining 💀💀, but I use Chan and Kun.
I was heading to work one early Saturday morning in Nishi Azabu a few years. There was a mother in her Chanel suit taking her elementary school daughter to school. The three of us were stopped at a traffic light. A taxi pulled up and a drunk salaryman rolled out of the backseat with a hostess. The Chanel suit mother screamed: ANATA! (Her husband I assumed.)
Very helpful, I've been struggling with this for a while
Plot twist: these videos transform into complete drama series in the future, filled with carefully camouflaged Japanese lessons.
I get it. It's like using "sup foo" in the US. There's a very fine line.
One good thing about getting older as a male learning Japanese (I look Japanese) is that I have less of a chance of offending people
thank you for these, they are amazing. :D
Thank you for the pronunciation demonstrations in the example sentences
Kaname Naito ga suki desu! (Normal)
Anata wa suki desu! (Weird)
Temee wa suki desu. (Psycopath)
The gradual descent into depravity
I love it
お前… 嫌いじゃない（中二病）
not to nitpick but itd be ga for all
@@andiiiiiiiiiiWould は not work as well? The topic and agent tend to usually be the same thing.
@@kakahass8845 no. its further explained in a diff video on this channel but for personal feelings about something u use が
日本人なのになぜか参考になりました()
聞き取りやすくてありがたいです
I subscribed after watching 2 videos, your explanation is very detailed and cleared. Very easy to understand. 😊
I’m not good in Japanese nor do I claim to understand Japanese culture but here’s how I understand it.
Japanese is a very contextual language and people omit words if they are not necessary to convey the meaning. So really think about when it is necessary to say “you”. If you are in a 1 on 1 situation you don’t ever have to say you. It’s clear from context when you’re talking about yourself and when you are talking about the other person.
When do you have to say “you”? When you are addressing a specific person in a group for example. When you want to put emphasis on contrast. You said it’s black but I say it’s white. When you want to point out differences, you need the word “you”.
The way I perceive Japanese people, these are uncomfortable situations. If your life revolves around not sticking out in a crowd it’s clearly uncomfortable if someone else makes you stick out against your will.
Finally! This is something that always bothers me about Japanese language and what is the correct way so great to see you uploading this
"Some people get easily offended no matter what you do" -- lol amazing !
I love this! I understand better with your channel!
I just learnt あなた in the Pimsleur 1 course. They didn't mention anything about it being critical. Really interesting to learn more of the nuance!!
Also my country has such polite issues about talking with someone, i am from Romania, Watashi ha daisuki Nihon desu ! Thank you very much for nice explanation !
Bruh I smiled so much at 7:04. I love your videos.
It happened to me that some Japanese, mostly at the immigration, called me あなた while also using the non-polite form of Japanese. Like ”ハガキにあなたの住所を書いて". Since his attitude was very rude, I honestly felt offended and wanted to say something but I just froze. What would be a nice, polite way of replying to this type of language? Or when you go to a shop and the staff talks to you without even using ですand ます, how should I point out that?
Is their vibe rude? If not, they’re just being casual. If they’re acting hostilely, sounds like racism. :(
You know, back in 1972 I had that very same "document" conversation at the kuyaku-sho. Every time I appeared, they would tell me of one additional document or signature I needed to come back with. I finally asked it they'd kindly tell me EVERYTHING I need to bring as these repeated trips were a horrid waste of time!
Evidently, little has changed.
M
the prime minister example was really good 😅 i felt the rage in that word then
I see あんた a lot in manga, usually used among family and friends. Thank you for the lesson.
When I studied abroad in Japan, I was referring to my dad as 'aitsu' and Japanese people let me know right away that it was very rude to do so.
I told them I don't like my dad, but even then they said to not refer to him that way.
I had a hard time in general not using aitsu and omae since it's so common in anime and my brain was comfortable using them.
Informative as always.
Your videos are so helpful thank you
苦労して作った動画がいつもありがたい。このチャネルは早くに大人気になるみたい！おめでとう
I sincerely believe that the last part of the monologue was between Mr. and Mrs. Naito
日本語も英語も勉強出来てとてもいいです😊 ありがとうございます。有益な講義、これからもよろしくお願いします😊
I moved to Japan three months ago and often find myself talking to strangers (simple but super friendly conversations). Always struggle with the “where are you from” because don’t know how to address the taxi driver or the woman at the cafe table next to me. I tried dropping the subject and just going “どこからですか” but that seemed to create a bit of confusion, like “who, ME? or?”.
Japanese people would use expression like 「ご出身はどちらですか？」. If you are talking to a cab driver then say 「運転手さん」 to get attention. 「運転手さん、ご出身はどちらですか？」
poor satoru sitting there watching his dad beef with everyone around him 😭😭 bro just wanted to learn about the teaching profession
my jpn professor's a jpn expat and introduced anata to us as, indeed, the way that a wife might address her husband. she's also a fair bit older than you, i think, so maybe it's really a generational thing? and it still exists in media as an assumption that that's still how the form of address works. like how in real life we've switched phones almost exclusively to smartphones, but in contemporary cartoons, we still see a lot of analog technologies to better communicate the image.