I think your point about just not caring about the secondary market being critical to willingness to buy, and that if you aren't willing to watch it go to zero with the bulk of other TCGs, is the big one here. Personally, I'm going with your plan: get some boxes (and KS exclusive playmats) with money I won't miss to sit on, get decks to play with, use the follow up printing to accquire more cards to play with. If it moons, great, if not, I still have a game to enjoy playing with friends anytime even if it craters. But I also think that's a distinction a lot of people just don't get. Anything that's a gamble should be with play money, that you can afford to lose. The money you're using to live on and retire on should be in a different pool of real investments you take less risk with.
@@MagicMetalMoney Habit I picked up from reading about the various stuff surrounding things like the meme-stock escapades and other reddit groups and hodl gangs 😅 It's in that weird spot of technically being jargon as it is in-group slang or shorthand, but it's super useful. Even people who may have only heard things like "meteoric rise/fall" as an expression and be new to the discussion are able to pick up on it if you show them a doge/rocket meme 🐶 🚀🌛🤑 vs 💥😫🚑🤕
Love the production you put into your video, Magic Metal! Really well done, informative, and enjoyable to watch. Whiteboard was very effective. Keep it up!
Just discovered your channel, and subsribed! Very well made and informative. I really like the fact that you give warning on spending, because it is and will remain a game, so any money put into this game should be considered as is (Money put into a game, and if and only if the value rises, its a bonus, not the end in itself) My personal opinion: I am looking for a game to play along MTG (Like we did 20+ years ago with Star wars decipher and Middle earth). MTG is relatively fun and I've been playing since the beginning. But for a very long time, my group and I have been looking for a longer, more developed game (Not longer game because players are slow, but because it involve more mechanics). I didn't purchase any TCG on kickstarter ever, mostly because the theme and gameplay were not appealing to me. This time it is different, for just over the price of a kickstarter boardgame, our group will enjoy a brand new game, random stuff (You know, booster opening), hopefully a good game and of course (Even if people deny's it) a possible value. As I can see it, it does'nt try to replace any TCG, it will be a more serious TCG to play along the actual one you play.
Welcome aboard, glad you like the content! 🤘Well said that value rising of this product is “a bonus, not the end in itself.” I might steal that wording. 🙂 Great point that this does not need to replace Magic but can add to games played and enjoyed by friends. This game definitely looks like a great change of pace.
I bought a case plus 3 gamna crack the 3 and try to complete the set. It looks so awesome and I've been playing on tts and it's actually really fun to play too. Let's hope it does something great
Personally unless you just got money to blow this isn't worth more than picking up a box or two to throw into your closet imo. The one to go for is the Early Bird Sorcerer tier because you get the case and a sample pack for the regular cost of just a case. Even early on you could probably flip that pack and basically cover the whole cost of the pledge considering there are only a few hundred of those packs in existence. Or just take the risk and sit on all of it. One thing to consider here is there are 400 cards, so a lot of these boxes could be eaten up if people go gung ho on trying to complete sets. Personally I think it's just going to discourage people since most will know they won't ever even have a chance so why try. We are currently probably sitting around 16k boxes and that is quite worrying. I really expected Rudy to hold back his video until after the campaign but it's clear he got a good chunk of money to push it now. I fear this game is too fabricated to be the next big thing and that in and of itself could become it's downfall. I mean we have a super unique game that crosses into board game territory with a experimental one year release schedule. With a set size over double most other TCGs. Maybe the game is fun but I feel like most of the demand here is solely on the amazing art and that alone cannot keep it alive. Sure it being aimed at old Magic players means bigger wallets at first, but it also means a niche market that may struggle to grow and expand in coming years. I really don't know how to tackle this one outside of my tip about scoring that Early Bird tier. Even then 750 bucks is a heavy asking price after dumping all my money into so many other games this past year.
You make a lot of really good points. There are so many factors at play, it’s just so hard to predict. The only thing I feel confident in predicting is that it’s going to be a wild ride! Lol
Great video. Few thoughts Low release cycles add to the risk of it not catching on. Attention span in this market is so low. Everyone moves to the next shiny thing. Older audience makes the future difficult unless they can get the younger ones into the game and continue it. Art looks great. Honestly is it better than reserved list magic or unique from 90's magic? Not really imho. However, the collectible of working with one of the most famous fantasy artists of all time is a plus. Every major tcg has something going for it: Magic: Art, nolstagia, best and fun gameplay. Strong competitive scene (formerly). Large IP partnerships to drive new people into the game. Pokemon: 95B franchise...largest in the world 3x side of Marvel. Appeals to youth to adults. Yugioh: A loyal niche community driven by a popular tv/anime franchise still going strong Overall for me: Not going all in. Reserved list is better imho. However, the downside is low. I'm getting a few boxes, worse case you are out a few hundred and will be something you can take out and play with friends. Remember this is a game and a hobby. I don't think cardboard should be anywhere close to the majority of where your money goes. Not advise just my 2 cents
Thanks! Glad you enjoyed it! Great point about an older audience being a double edged sword, didn’t think of that. Completely agree that if you have an extra couple hundred bucks and wouldn’t be sad to just open the boxes and enjoy the game (in the future if the game doesn’t make it), then the downside is fairly limited. A lot of people underestimate the risk of cardboard in general. Anything beyond 5-10% of a portfolio in cardboard is too risky for me!
im in for 3 cases 1 case to open other to sit on till retirment... even old tcg still command value look at marvel and lotr tcg boxes....downside 50% lost or 10x or 100x gain.
1. All kickstarters Rudy promoted has 5k -10k booster boxes. 2. After receiving Kickstar money it is no guarantee you get anything. 3. after the game gets released there will be more people that want it. 4. You assume the founder is not printing boxes for himself, if i would make a kickstarter I would at least print another 1000 box for myself why not I could sell 1 for $10k on Ebay a month you would really have to be an idiot not to print a couple of $20 booster boxes for yourself if you know there is a very good possibility it can sell for $1000 - $10,000 on ebay.
I am backing the game! Game design seems really fun to me and the art is the frankly the best I have ever seen in a TCG. Not sure why all TCGs aren't doing borderless prints - it just looks soooo much better than bordered cards. After seeing the gameplay- the art- and the kickstarter numbers I think this game will catch on and be a success. Understandable that people have concerns for this game after it has succeeded so drastically in its first stage as a kickstarter. I am hoping that all this success continues and people either play the game casually (which seems to be the whole focus of this TCG) or are able to sell their purchases at a 20% increase and get a bit back on the investment. I know for my part I intend to hit my local LGS and get as many games as I can on the weekends :)
Yeah, the game looks like an amazing product with fun game play and truly beautiful cards. But even with a great game, business is hard. I hope it succeeds in the long run, time will tell!
The negative of this being an investment is so many people have backed it. Magic blew up because of scarcity plain and simple. This wont be scarce due to the number of backers.
Excellent point. It all depends on how big the game grows from a player perspective and how many sealed boxes get opened up, relative to this first print run.
I'm worried about the numbers after alpha investments video came out the pledges went from 1.3m cad to 2.25mil. Those new pledges seems like they want to get in on the next high price tcg ks but the issue is if everyone everyone backs the game in the wave that is happening now it will burn a lot of people since premium is based on scarcit. Ks metazoo 8k 90,000 print run Wtr alpha 3.8 400k pack print run Arcane rising beta 2k 400k packs Cru 1st $650 @ 900k print run Cryptid nation first $950 @ 900k print run. Numbers matter and if this gets "too big" then that is setting people up for a big oof no matter how nice the art is. Metazoo has already proven art is not the be all to end all
Yeah, the big push from alpha investments will likely lead to more volatility if too many people are in it hoping for a quick flip. $2.5M will likely lead to roughly 18-19K boxes. That’s a lot for 4,000 KS backers. This is definitely in the extreme risk category. I’m glad the game looks fun to play! Because one day that might be the best thing to do with any alpha sealed boxes lol 🤷♂️
@@MagicMetalMoney honestly if he just held off and said that after the ks the market would be in a mid risk category. There is always risk for something new but that's on the lower end for new products. The issue is now the market is being manipulated and rudy could very well shoot himself in the foot along with the backers because his patrons will back the game and rudy will be left with product that's only appeal is a patron exclusive promo. i have been running the numbers and you really dont want anymore then 600k packs max. Going by market trends with metazoo and fab that should even out to around 125-150 a pack if the game catchs on but that is on the players, influencers and lgs to support the tcg and give notoriety to it. At this moment in time I do feel you are correct with the market conditions being volatile but the end of next week will give a better picture of a true extent of the damage
The $ per Backer didn't go up, if that tells you anything. I think we've seen both heavy investors and new interested players enter the Kickstarter. This is early days, of course. It will be months before the first set is released. I think they plan to ramp up advertising towards that release, rather than for this Kickstarter. Not saying this or that, just my two cents.
@@lystic9392 yeah, I’m sure there are plenty of people who are stoked to actually play the game (hopefully). And good point, I’ll bet they use a lot of this money for marketing.
The answer is no, trading card games aren't investments (they're speculation), your ticket to wealth is a ROTH IRA and maxing out your 401k contributions, not obscure TCG kickstarters. But it sure does look sweet…
stock market is a ponzi scheme as insiders and first ones in makes the most....if the rich sells your shit be worthless as you cant sell without penalty till retirment age
I wasnt sold on this as MTG is already time consuming and pricy. Also, Rudy is involved. Most of what Alpha promotes recently is just for a quick pump and dump. Metazoo is a game no one plays but somehow has value. It legit is just a bunch of collectors buying and selling to each other thinking it will be big. Feel bad to whoever holds that product when it dies. Sorcery may be cool but, the other prior and recent tcg cash grab games that have come out killed this for me.
Yeah, it’s a big risk for sure. Even if you have a good game and are well capitalized and have good business experience, launching a successful TCG is really, really hard. It’ll be interesting to watch!
Also, I am convinced alpha investments is just promoting any new product to hype it up and sell high as it benefits him greatly. He def is a huge part of the recent tcg boom and, he knows most won't be around long but he doesn't care; just wants ur money. I'd go as far as to say Rudy is involved at a higher level with these new tcg companies then he leads on. It's all a scam bro
![I.N "HALLUCINATION" | [Stray Kids : SKZ-PLAYER]](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/n5B5q1Hwt_U/mqdefault.jpg)
I think your point about just not caring about the secondary market being critical to willingness to buy, and that if you aren't willing to watch it go to zero with the bulk of other TCGs, is the big one here.
Personally, I'm going with your plan: get some boxes (and KS exclusive playmats) with money I won't miss to sit on, get decks to play with, use the follow up printing to accquire more cards to play with. If it moons, great, if not, I still have a game to enjoy playing with friends anytime even if it craters.
But I also think that's a distinction a lot of people just don't get. Anything that's a gamble should be with play money, that you can afford to lose. The money you're using to live on and retire on should be in a different pool of real investments you take less risk with.
Completely agree! The money put here should be it’s own pool that can crater. P.S. I really like using “moon” and “crater” as verbs! Lol
@@MagicMetalMoney Habit I picked up from reading about the various stuff surrounding things like the meme-stock escapades and other reddit groups and hodl gangs 😅 It's in that weird spot of technically being jargon as it is in-group slang or shorthand, but it's super useful. Even people who may have only heard things like "meteoric rise/fall" as an expression and be new to the discussion are able to pick up on it if you show them a doge/rocket meme
🐶 🚀🌛🤑
vs
💥😫🚑🤕
@@brentwalker9576 ha yeah, it made perfect sense to me!
Wait... Playing cards aren't a retirement account ?!?!?!
Don't care if it's investment worthy... I'm in love with the art and game play! Great video bud!
Thank you! Enjoying the art and game play are probably the best reasons to buy the game anyway! 🤘
What about the game play?
Love the production you put into your video, Magic Metal! Really well done, informative, and enjoyable to watch. Whiteboard was very effective. Keep it up!
Thank you!!! This was my first time filming B roll, so I’ll glad you liked it! 🔥
Just came across the channel and this vid through the sorcery tcg discord. Excellent video!
Oh wow, glad I could make it on there. And thank you!! Appreciate the support!
This video is aging very well. Pre-orders are selling since the beginning of june 2022 near 500$CAN on ebay (Completed/sold items). Congratulation :)
Wow, that’s wild! This will be such a fascinating market to watch for (hopefully) years to come!
What a fantastic video you killed it. I subbed!
Wow, thank you!! Welcome aboard! 🐺
Great video, love the legos too!
Thanks! Working on a new one for the set 🦇 👨
New subscriber here! Good content!
Thanks, welcome aboard!
Just discovered your channel, and subsribed! Very well made and informative. I really like the fact that you give warning on spending, because it is and will remain a game, so any money put into this game should be considered as is (Money put into a game, and if and only if the value rises, its a bonus, not the end in itself)
My personal opinion: I am looking for a game to play along MTG (Like we did 20+ years ago with Star wars decipher and Middle earth). MTG is relatively fun and I've been playing since the beginning. But for a very long time, my group and I have been looking for a longer, more developed game (Not longer game because players are slow, but because it involve more mechanics).
I didn't purchase any TCG on kickstarter ever, mostly because the theme and gameplay were not appealing to me. This time it is different, for just over the price of a kickstarter boardgame, our group will enjoy a brand new game, random stuff (You know, booster opening), hopefully a good game and of course (Even if people deny's it) a possible value.
As I can see it, it does'nt try to replace any TCG, it will be a more serious TCG to play along the actual one you play.
Welcome aboard, glad you like the content! 🤘Well said that value rising of this product is “a bonus, not the end in itself.” I might steal that wording. 🙂
Great point that this does not need to replace Magic but can add to games played and enjoyed by friends. This game definitely looks like a great change of pace.
Understanding it is a gamble is the key.
Totally!
Artwork alone will hold this together. Pricing is reasonable and I anticipate this holding value well.
Hopefully you’re right! The game looks great!
This guy is spot on. Well done
Wow! Thanks, Jeff! 🤘
Cool I never even heard about this game
It looks pretty fun!
I bought a case plus 3 gamna crack the 3 and try to complete the set. It looks so awesome and I've been playing on tts and it's actually really fun to play too. Let's hope it does something great
That’s awesome! I would love nothing more than to see this game have a lot of longterm success.
Very good video. Nice job
Appreciate it!!
Nice work!
Thank you!! Glad you enjoyed it!
Personally unless you just got money to blow this isn't worth more than picking up a box or two to throw into your closet imo. The one to go for is the Early Bird Sorcerer tier because you get the case and a sample pack for the regular cost of just a case. Even early on you could probably flip that pack and basically cover the whole cost of the pledge considering there are only a few hundred of those packs in existence. Or just take the risk and sit on all of it. One thing to consider here is there are 400 cards, so a lot of these boxes could be eaten up if people go gung ho on trying to complete sets. Personally I think it's just going to discourage people since most will know they won't ever even have a chance so why try. We are currently probably sitting around 16k boxes and that is quite worrying.
I really expected Rudy to hold back his video until after the campaign but it's clear he got a good chunk of money to push it now. I fear this game is too fabricated to be the next big thing and that in and of itself could become it's downfall. I mean we have a super unique game that crosses into board game territory with a experimental one year release schedule. With a set size over double most other TCGs. Maybe the game is fun but I feel like most of the demand here is solely on the amazing art and that alone cannot keep it alive. Sure it being aimed at old Magic players means bigger wallets at first, but it also means a niche market that may struggle to grow and expand in coming years. I really don't know how to tackle this one outside of my tip about scoring that Early Bird tier. Even then 750 bucks is a heavy asking price after dumping all my money into so many other games this past year.
You make a lot of really good points. There are so many factors at play, it’s just so hard to predict. The only thing I feel confident in predicting is that it’s going to be a wild ride! Lol
Great video. Few thoughts
Low release cycles add to the risk of it not catching on. Attention span in this market is so low. Everyone moves to the next shiny thing.
Older audience makes the future difficult unless they can get the younger ones into the game and continue it.
Art looks great. Honestly is it better than reserved list magic or unique from 90's magic? Not really imho. However, the collectible of working with one of the most famous fantasy artists of all time is a plus.
Every major tcg has something going for it:
Magic: Art, nolstagia, best and fun gameplay. Strong competitive scene (formerly). Large IP partnerships to drive new people into the game.
Pokemon: 95B franchise...largest in the world 3x side of Marvel. Appeals to youth to adults.
Yugioh: A loyal niche community driven by a popular tv/anime franchise still going strong
Overall for me: Not going all in. Reserved list is better imho. However, the downside is low. I'm getting a few boxes, worse case you are out a few hundred and will be something you can take out and play with friends. Remember this is a game and a hobby. I don't think cardboard should be anywhere close to the majority of where your money goes. Not advise just my 2 cents
Thanks! Glad you enjoyed it!
Great point about an older audience being a double edged sword, didn’t think of that.
Completely agree that if you have an extra couple hundred bucks and wouldn’t be sad to just open the boxes and enjoy the game (in the future if the game doesn’t make it), then the downside is fairly limited.
A lot of people underestimate the risk of cardboard in general. Anything beyond 5-10% of a portfolio in cardboard is too risky for me!
this is where they can do a party or become like a blizzard con it be called sorc con
im in for 3 cases 1 case to open other to sit on till retirment... even old tcg still command value look at marvel and lotr tcg boxes....downside 50% lost or 10x or 100x gain.
Nice!
1. All kickstarters Rudy promoted has 5k -10k booster boxes. 2. After receiving Kickstar money it is no guarantee you get anything. 3. after the game gets released there will be more people that want it. 4. You assume the founder is not printing boxes for himself, if i would make a kickstarter I would at least print another 1000 box for myself why not I could sell 1 for $10k on Ebay a month you would really have to be an idiot not to print a couple of $20 booster boxes for yourself if you know there is a very good possibility it can sell for $1000 - $10,000 on ebay.
I am backing the game! Game design seems really fun to me and the art is the frankly the best I have ever seen in a TCG. Not sure why all TCGs aren't doing borderless prints - it just looks soooo much better than bordered cards.
After seeing the gameplay- the art- and the kickstarter numbers I think this game will catch on and be a success. Understandable that people have concerns for this game after it has succeeded so drastically in its first stage as a kickstarter. I am hoping that all this success continues and people either play the game casually (which seems to be the whole focus of this TCG) or are able to sell their purchases at a 20% increase and get a bit back on the investment.
I know for my part I intend to hit my local LGS and get as many games as I can on the weekends :)
Yeah, the game looks like an amazing product with fun game play and truly beautiful cards. But even with a great game, business is hard. I hope it succeeds in the long run, time will tell!
The negative of this being an investment is so many people have backed it. Magic blew up because of scarcity plain and simple. This wont be scarce due to the number of backers.
Excellent point. It all depends on how big the game grows from a player perspective and how many sealed boxes get opened up, relative to this first print run.
Heck with food. Just eat card board
😂 Pure genius
Joke is on you, Sorcery! I am already broke and penniless.
🥲
I like the art, and 150ish is not bad of an investment to lose. It won't kill me
The art is 🔥
If it won’t kill ya, it’s a cool, fun purchase!
I want a game that only drops once a year
There’s some upside to it - glad it appeals to you!
I'm worried about the numbers after alpha investments video came out the pledges went from 1.3m cad to 2.25mil. Those new pledges seems like they want to get in on the next high price tcg ks but the issue is if everyone everyone backs the game in the wave that is happening now it will burn a lot of people since premium is based on scarcit.
Ks metazoo 8k 90,000 print run
Wtr alpha 3.8 400k pack print run
Arcane rising beta 2k 400k packs
Cru 1st $650 @ 900k print run
Cryptid nation first $950 @ 900k print run.
Numbers matter and if this gets "too big" then that is setting people up for a big oof no matter how nice the art is. Metazoo has already proven art is not the be all to end all
Yeah, the big push from alpha investments will likely lead to more volatility if too many people are in it hoping for a quick flip. $2.5M will likely lead to roughly 18-19K boxes. That’s a lot for 4,000 KS backers.
This is definitely in the extreme risk category. I’m glad the game looks fun to play! Because one day that might be the best thing to do with any alpha sealed boxes lol 🤷♂️
@@MagicMetalMoney honestly if he just held off and said that after the ks the market would be in a mid risk category. There is always risk for something new but that's on the lower end for new products. The issue is now the market is being manipulated and rudy could very well shoot himself in the foot along with the backers because his patrons will back the game and rudy will be left with product that's only appeal is a patron exclusive promo. i have been running the numbers and you really dont want anymore then 600k packs max. Going by market trends with metazoo and fab that should even out to around 125-150 a pack if the game catchs on but that is on the players, influencers and lgs to support the tcg and give notoriety to it. At this moment in time I do feel you are correct with the market conditions being volatile but the end of next week will give a better picture of a true extent of the damage
@@tysnow9524 it’s definitely going to be a bumpy ride!
The $ per Backer didn't go up, if that tells you anything. I think we've seen both heavy investors and new interested players enter the Kickstarter. This is early days, of course. It will be months before the first set is released. I think they plan to ramp up advertising towards that release, rather than for this Kickstarter.
Not saying this or that, just my two cents.
@@lystic9392 yeah, I’m sure there are plenty of people who are stoked to actually play the game (hopefully).
And good point, I’ll bet they use a lot of this money for marketing.
The answer is no, trading card games aren't investments (they're speculation), your ticket to wealth is a ROTH IRA and maxing out your 401k contributions, not obscure TCG kickstarters. But it sure does look sweet…
Precisely!
stock market is a ponzi scheme as insiders and first ones in makes the most....if the rich sells your shit be worthless as you cant sell without penalty till retirment age
I wasnt sold on this as MTG is already time consuming and pricy. Also, Rudy is involved. Most of what Alpha promotes recently is just for a quick pump and dump. Metazoo is a game no one plays but somehow has value. It legit is just a bunch of collectors buying and selling to each other thinking it will be big. Feel bad to whoever holds that product when it dies. Sorcery may be cool but, the other prior and recent tcg cash grab games that have come out killed this for me.
Yeah, it’s a big risk for sure. Even if you have a good game and are well capitalized and have good business experience, launching a successful TCG is really, really hard. It’ll be interesting to watch!
Also, I am convinced alpha investments is just promoting any new product to hype it up and sell high as it benefits him greatly. He def is a huge part of the recent tcg boom and, he knows most won't be around long but he doesn't care; just wants ur money. I'd go as far as to say Rudy is involved at a higher level with these new tcg companies then he leads on. It's all a scam bro
That is a possibility