I remember The Lost World movie where Jack Horner was the palaeontologist consultant. In the movie a T Rex ate a palaeontologist named Robert Burke whose obviously based off Robert Bakker, who argued with Horner that T Rex was a predator. When he saw the movie, Bakker told Horner: “See, I told you T Rex was a predator!”
As the narrator himself said, "To claim T-Rex was anything less than the king of the Cretaceous food chain is nothing but heresy". Even the NARRATOR hates this documentary.
@@flightlesslord2688 you mean like how lions get clapped by wildebeest and hippos constantly? The animals all evolved together, an apex predator means no predatory animal hunts it for food
@@yrooxrksvi7142 now I will say, he discovered maiasaura and several Alaskan/Canadian dinosaurs. And made sure the raptors acted more bird like in JP. But since then, he's a fucking nut job. He only made this documentary because he's trying to defame T-Rex because he's a duckbill fanboy.
Horner has only in the last few years been admitting that Rexy was indeed capable of predation. His argument is that he wanted to challenge paleontologists to study direct evidence rather than just assume things. Of course, he could be realizing his error and is trying to cover his tracks by saying "I was only kidding", and he hasn't been saying this very publicly, just in interviews when asked about it directly, which feels like a newspaper that buries a retraction in the middle pages.
"Let's figure out how dinosaurs looked and acted based purely on DIRECT evidence with 0 assumptions and speculation!" Meanwhile, dinosaurs are DEAD. There is no such thing as direct evidence. One has to make assumptions to even think they were alive or that they had flesh. How do we know they weren't just rocks from the very beginning? Just weirdly shaped rocks! We know because we have brains and can make assumptions based on what we see. Based on what we see, the rex was built for predation. We don't need direct evidence to see that.
“T. rex wasn’t a true predator ‘cuz it was too slow”. Literally twenty years later, and nobody thought it’s prey, Triceratops, Edmontosaurus and (especially) Alamosaurus were *even slower*? 🤔
It's stupid even if they were faster. Lions, tigers and many other predators hunt animals faster than them. They ambush, attack in packs, run down prey until they get too tired, and can a lot of the time out smart their prey. To say that the rex wasn't a predator, and instead is a scavenger is a huge assumption.
@@suchomimustenerensis And if you subscribe to the pack hunting theory. The juveniles (which were much more gracile than the adults) could simply herd the prey towards the adults
Velociraptor_Feathers I'm a T-Rex fanboy, but even I admit that they're NOT invincible, and that they were facing prey items that could EASILY kill them if they weren't careful.
Am I a trex fan boy? I think that trex would go after a triceratops somewhat regularly but I also know if a herd of edmotosaurus attacks a trex all its going to do is feel pain
"Jack Horner certainly isn't the only predator here" Fucking savage I instantly subscribed after that line I was a kid when this came out and I always loved watching dino docs but even then this program pissed me off. The main reason isn't even that its scientifically full of massive errors but Horner's ego. He acts like he is the adult in the room telling children that their is no Santa Claus with the condescending assertion that people disputed his claims only because it contradicted their childhood perception of tyrannosaurus rex. This is basically just an ad hominem deflection to avoid scrutiny for his claims. Most didn't doubt his claim that t-rex was incapable of predation because it contradicted their childhood but because, as you point out, it made little sense and contradicted the evidence. Like I never understood why Horner kept asserting that being a predator and scavenger are mutually exclusive things when most carnivorous animals both scavenge and kill live prey depending on their circumstances. Being able to do both proficiently would be critical for an animal its size to get enough food to sustain itself. This shouldn't even require fossil evidence to prove only basic common sense
Well, he loved Maias and every time he went out to find more of them, he found rexes. Rexes who were eating his fave. When you boil it down he's just a hadrosaur simp that doesn't like the attention the 'big stupid bully' gets. Good ol' fashioned slander at it's finest.
@@djraptorthetrashraptor7701 Even great scientists can often be incredibly flawed human beings. Science is the best process we have but it is of course driven by imperfect humans who will often advance things for foolish personal reasons
I think the big misconception about T.rex hunting, is often done with the landscape. Its always shown in wide open fields in most documentaries where it would be hard to hide and give a lot of room to run, which T. rex adults probably didn't do. If the actual landscape was swampy like the everglades, it probably hunted more like a crocodile or Jaguar. Hid in the landscape, then ambush bite.
Yeah, also aren’t crocs distinct relatives of T-Rex? So yeah it probably ambushed its prey. Edit: well technically crocs are archosaurs and dinosaurs are also archosaurs so yeah.
there is one quote from Dr. Ian Malcolm that fits so well with the "don't make chicken dinos" argument and it is this one: "Your scientists were so preoccupied with whether or not they could, they didn't stop to think if they should"
I remember seeing that controversy in a magazine when I was a kid, and even at like ten years old, I was thinking "Well, lions and hyenas are both predators and scavengers, T. rex was probably the same, why is it controversial?" XD
Every carnivore ever is a scavenger and a hunter,Vultures eat decaying carcasses but have been seen eating turtles, no animal is a full scavenger or a full hunter.
Yeah because you can't live with just hunting and you are in a place were the only thing to eat is carcasses or you can't live with just scavenging where you are in a place there are no carcasses
the argument that has convinced me the most to this day is that tyrannosaurus was an opportunist, it hunted when it had the opportunity and scavenge when it had the opportunity. Tyrannosaurus feces fossils had hadrosaur chicks inside, and triceratops bite fossils had evidence of being eaten after death, or of a failed hunting attempt, but triceratops, torosaurus or ankylosaurus were their last options, as any injury to a predator is usually fatal, and triceratops, ankylosaurus or torosaurus were very dangerous animals, so young or juvenile edmontosaurus and triceratops were the easiest target for an opportunist and probably the most used food source
Every carnivore is an opportunist to an extent. If there’s meat, they’ll most likely eat it (save for when it’s rotting, nothing eats rotting meat, with some exceptions)
Like most creatures on the top of the food chain they would scavenge 9 times out of 10, but not bcs they were unable to like this documentary is saying, but bcs they didn't need to. Better steal food from someone else that will not dare to fight you
Of course it scavenged sometimes. I've never heard of a single predator that doesn't. I'd say "Except humans", but that isn't true either. There are ways of identifying if roadkill is safe to eat or not, and so there are people who seek it out to eat or do so opportunistically. You don't really need to state "It hunted sometimes but also scavenged when it could", because that's really an implication when you say something was predatory.
I love that, instead of the normal "positives" or "negatives" or "outdated" sections there is a section titled "Horner" that really says it all. 😂 Also I love the memes you put in about the silly dinosaur theories.
Another thing to note, T. rex itself was the only large theropod Horner targeted as being a scavenger. That alone should show it was nothing but him venting and lashing out.
Yeah... a lot of large theropods filled basically the same role as rex did. You'd think, then, that he'd assume they were also scavengers. But... nope. He left them alone.
I do gotta find one thing hilariously ironic. Jack said he tried to make the Valley!T.rex as ugly and unappealing as possible. But it wound up being super burly, has a face covered in scars implying it got into fights and likely won, and it's mere presence sends a pack of his hyped up maniraptors fleeing on sight. In trying to make the most unappealing T.rex ever, Jack unwittingly kinda made an awesome one. I can see why Primal Carnage might have gotten the idea for the bulky look and color scheme.
I remember Horner saying that while he was digging for hadrosaur fossils, animals he loves, he kept finding Tyrannosaurus fossils, which made him really upset, which is why he keeps trying to character assassinate rex.
I love Hadrosaurs,hell I think Shantungosaurus and an extremely large Edmontosaurus would beat T-Rex but I don’t think T-Rex was a scavenger,definitely scavenged time to time but hunted most of the time
@@AlotOfKarma I know but Zucheng was about 11-12 Meters long and about 6 Tons while (Based on Zuchengsaurus) Shantungosaurus could grow to 17 meters and 18 Tons
Horner's tanked his reputation so much that I started reading a paleontology book that had been recommended to me and opened up the first page to a forward he wrote and my immediate thought was to cringe and skip straight to the rest of the book.
The T. rex’s arms were surprisingly powerful, being able to lift over 2 tons. Although useless for hunting/killing prey, they were mainly used to retain balance and to assist when having sex.
The documentary is Just Bodyshaming by a confused Old man and his Outdated 90s JP Hollywood knowledge who is only a shadow of his earlier sucessful researching who are went a weird way at the end . But great Video very love this Kind of analytics and tell so much whats going wrong by some people
Jack Horner Said that he doesn’t even like Tyrannosaurus rex I mean even if you hate the animal or not like the animal you can’t downplayed it like that
Liking something and evidence and facts are two different things. I dont really like T-rex because its so Boring and normal and most basic dinosaurs Imo but facts are facts. I cannot be like arghhh I dont like rex lets reduce its size by 10 meters lol.
Jack Horner is from a family that crushes quarry rock for a living. He was a marine and then never made it through university due to ADD issues. Now he's the foremost expert on a fictional dinosaur with the most absurd skeletal structure of them all. Totally incapable of walking or running. But the fake skeletons look great in museums.
Oh yeah, I totally think that the rex is overrated, but that’s just my OPINION. And it’s not for lack of respect for the creature, it’s just that there were so many other strange and interesting carnivore dinosaurs like carnotaurus(my personal favorite), utahraptor, dilophosaurus(the REAL one), allosaurus, and more. You can dislike a dinosaur without having to somehow justify it by twisting facts and spewing out lies. It’s fine to just NOT like something.
Fun fact: most vultures have almost zero senses of smell whatever. They find carcasses using their vision. Only Turkey vultures use their snoots to find food. Birds in have very poor smellers
I'm glad someone pointed this out because I have a love of turkey vultures since they are native to my area and I distinctly remember learning this fact when researching them.
@@Pipkiablo what I find very interesting, is that other carrion birds in America don't _need_ a god sense of smell, because they can just watch the turkey vultures!
I remember seeing an interview with Horner where he explained an incident where he went on an expedition to find hadrosaurs, but only found rex fossils instead. Because of this, the rex was cemented as his least favorite dino. Thus, he made this documentary (and I use that term loosely) as an excuse to hate on it and to try and ruin the rex's public image
Yes he was once held as a hero in the hearts of children and he somehow managed to take himself from among the most famous paleontologists in history for all the right reasons, to a complete moron who is famous primarily for attention seeking dumbassery, and preying on teenage girls. I had genuinely forgotten that he was involved with Maiasaura along with the *real* great man Robert Makela at this point. Horner is basically the go to example cannon fodder nowadays for "these are the nutters scientists who made up evolution." That Karens love to push. He gives a bad name to all of us who love not only past life but also that which is still with us.
13:39 ironically this edmontosaurus is surprised by the trex coming behind the vegetation showing how trex actually could ambush the prey easily despite its big size and slow running speed because hell creek has a lot of vegetation
Say, there was a show back in 2004 called animal face off. The plot was experts would discuss who would win in a fight between two animals And I think you should do a review on it.
I can’t believe they made a whole special on this. Now that I think about it the bit about the trike/toro relationship into a tv movie, I digress. However I had no idea about his relationship with his student, which is super sketch. I knew I never liked Horner and I’m upset to know my intuition as a young kid was right about him. Alas, great video
I think Jack should tell us what the hell killed a massive Edmontosaurus is Tyrannosaurus was a scavenger... because unless we simply haven't found another one, Tyrannosaurus was the only large carnivore in Hell Creek, so unless a Triceratops decided to tango with it, there is literally no other (Except maybe Dakotaraptor but still) that was taking multiple full grown Edmontosaurus off the census.
This documentary and Jurassic Park 3 aired in the same year. Just if it wasn't clear enough that Horner really has a deep rooted HATE against the T. rex.
This whole documentary reminds me of a Calvin and Hobbes strip where Calvin has to write an argumentative essay, and he chooses the debate about T-Rex being a hunter or scavenger, and his argument just boils down to "They're just so much cooler that way"
I regard Horner as both an important figure and an utter dumbass depending on the topic. We have mountains of evidence that T.Rex was a hunter and was in an environment with PLENTY of targets that wouldn't be able to run away.
I believe that there's evidence and Stygimoloch and Dracorex lived in different times then Pachycephalosaurus, so it's likely that even if Dracorex and Stygimoloch are juveniles, it's likely not for Pachycephalosaurus, just whatever an adult Stygimoloch was
@@hyena_fan No, they did not. Stratigraphy shows there is a 1.1 million year difference between Pachychephalosaurus and Stygimoloch and Dracorex, with the former coming before the latter two.
Great review and rant on Valley of the T. rex. This documentary in my opinion is probably the most disappointing dinosaur documentaries I’ve ever seen because everything seems out of place and especially Jack Horner. Instead of Jack Horner learning about other dinosaurs especially Tyrannosaurus, he beats a dead horse on Tyrannosaurus by making a dumb lumbering scavenger instead of a apex predator who’s smart and strong which is very disappointing and so cruel. Another thing is that they made the T. rex roar like a bear instead of a low pitch birds when we now that dinosaurs couldn’t roar like mammals, they roar like birds like hawks, eagles, crows, peacocks, Toucans and parrots, those are the modern dinosaurs that could roar and make other sound effects. Dinosaurs can still roar but not like mammals, they roar like birds as I mentioned which I didn’t want to repeat the same thing over and over again because I don’t want beat a dead horse like Kent Hovind and Jack Horner. If anything, I agree everything you said in this video. Great work Red Raptor and keep it up. Also at 7:02, great Meet the Robinsons reference with Tiny the T. rex, it was hilarious, not gonna lie.
When I was around 7 or 8 years old, I first heard about this whole T-Rex being a scavenger theory, and it never felt right to me because I always thought that T Rex was a great predator, so this theory kind of struck me when I was little, but now that I’m older I’m starting to understand more about this wonderful creature, Life is crazy
Ironicaly, the super bullky T-rex is an Accurate desing today (just put lips on it and BOOM accurate) PD: Great job puting scars on your "useless scavenger T-rex" because that means that this T-rex was in a LOT of Fights and win (or lose) PD #2: really Jack? Dromaeosaurids taking down fully grown Hadrosaurids?
Even the biggest Dromaeosaurs like Utahraptor and Dakotaraptor would take at least 5 of them to take out even the smallest Edmontosaurus which was 11 Meters Long and the largest,IDK,8!
Don't forget about the forward facing eyes and possibly some patches of quill-like feathers running down the back. One could argue that _Tyrannosaurus rex_ didn't have feathers since the skin imprints only show scales, though I believe there's far too much evidence that suggests that it had at least some semblance of feathers.
@@GabiteEditz Thanks for responding. I remembered I made this comment a while ago but didn't know the video I commented on, and I kept cringing remembering I got the info wrong so I wanted to delete it. Thanks to you I found it lol
Horner's an interesting scientist. I like that he was the paleontological consultant on a movie about why it's a bad idea to Clone dinosaurs, and he's dedicated his life to recreating dinosaurs.
*Red Raptor Writes:* “One last word on Horner is that he’s kind of a predator. I don’t do any personal mud-slinging on this channel, but this is really screwed up.” *Random Thought:* “Would that make it more or less screwed up, if it turned out that Jack Horner was projecting all along, about T-Rex being a scavenger rather than predator?”
From my understanding, dracorex was 12ft long and had a 16inch skull, while the pachy was 14ft long, one would expect that if dracorex was a subadult pachycephalosaurus, the dome would already be present
You know, hyenas have an incredibly sensitive sense of smell, and guess what. They hunt down more than 70% of their own food. All apex predators will scavenge when the opportunity presents itself, but all of them provide more than 50% of their own food. T-Rex would have done the exact same thing.
No carnivore that reaches the size of a Greyhound bus would reach adulthood relying exclusively on carrion. Even small carnivores like domestic house cats will hunt occasionally and kill a mouse, bird, etc.
@@lmn1871 yeah I mean it was 15 meters long and 15 Tons,twice the size of Virginosaurus Rex,it would chase it then bite it with its 250,000 psi bite force before eating with its tail
One thing partially off topic from this was Horner in the documentary said that scavengers like vultures were disgusting and disease ridden when that is very from the truth, vultures keep themselves very clean both old world and new world. The least clean thing about new worlds is their means of cooling off which is urination. The fact that he also said that they looked disgusting as a means of defense is double wrong because the bald head is just to make healthy hygiene easier. Onto the T-rex redesign the fact about the red head on a fully scaled reconstruction of a rex also doesn't make sense, outside of the stupid reason I explained earlier about the defense. Vultures flesh is pink cause it's just skin, no scales, no fancy color pigments, nothing. I COULD see T-rex have a brightly colored head as means of attraction but then again that would ruin any ambush, so I'd actually imagine a brightly colored tail would be more favorable.
If I'm not mistaken some studies suggest that the bald head of vultures and turkeys is for/helps with thermoregulation which is even more evidence against Horner's idea
@@arcticdino1650 Really!? That makes a ton of sense for both of them. If you have a link to those studies I would love to read them. Horner cannot catch a break.
i think even prehistoric planet used the rex with colors thing in the freshwater or forest episode (look IK this is 2 years late but i just wanted to share this really badly)
Though I still believe the theory that T. rex adults probably hunted in pairs either mates, or in just local cooperation others near them which wouldn't require pursuits. Just luring a prey animal near one that would ambush and bite.
Considering the teeth marks we've been finding have been in tails consistently also shows it wasn't just a predator but a pretty active one. It was attacking from behind. What do you think that'd mean? It'd mean its prey was running. Or that it was smart enough to attack from behind where it lacks defenses. Either way, that's the behavior of an experienced predator.
I do wonder if adult T-rex's would have been in a niche similar to bears, killing whatever was too slow for it and scaring competitors off their meals. But I also wonder if juveniles being likely faster would have had a different niche.
Adults would have killed the bigger and lower preys, like triceratops or edmontosaurus (with ambush hunting) While the Young ones would have chased other dinosaurs like pachycephalosaurus, anzu, ornithomimus and competed with dakotaraptor
Only ONCE I want to see a scene were edmontosaurus isn‘t just a walking buffet for rexy, the main attraction of the documentary. Just one scene of a large bull edmontosaurus standing it‘s ground against an inexperienced or old tyrannosaur and give it a whooping.
Stan the Trex before his skeleton was sold it was proven I heard that his neck was broken before he died, the thing is the bones showed signs of Healing, the animal survived the neck injury and lived long after it how does a animal a predator no less survive that kind of injury? Maybe it had a pack or family helping him eat.
Horner is a crank whose biases run so deep, he won't admit he's wrong. For instance, he knew all about the Edmontosaurus with the T. rex bite marks in it's tail vertebrae, but claimed the animal was sleeping, and the T. rex thought it was dead!
3:00 Stratigraphy disputes it-Dracorex and Stygimoloch are younger in the HCR than Pachycephalosaurus wyomingensis. Stygimoloch may be its own genus or a species of pachycephalosaurus, but it isn't definitely a growth stage of wyomingensis. IIRC on twitter Holtz has stated that Dracorex is almost certainly juvenile but if it is a juvenile it is a younger stygimoloch/pacycephalosaurus spinifer. IIRC, There is also a supposed "Giant" Dracorex at the BHI, but it is undescribed, so it isn't really useful.
"is trying to reverse engineer chickens into dinosaurs" AH yes, because if there's one thing we all learned from watching Jurassic Park, it's that bringing extinct creatures back is a good idea. Just as true as venom slinging dilophosaurus
But the thing is hes not bringing back dinos, birds are allready dinosaurs. It would still be a chicken, a mangled misshaped sad existence of a chicken :(
I mean, bringing back certain extinct animals (mainly the ones we wiped out, like mammoths, thylacines, moa, elephant birds, cave lions, cave bears, cave hyenas, etc.) is a good idea. But bringing back dinosaurs is stupid and illogical. They’ve been long dead for millions of years, the ecosystems they lived in no longer exist.
@@beastmaster0934 well rly the same could be said for mammoths too like the world has changed alot since then and there rly is no place for them. Im under the idéa that maybe we should make sure extant species gets keept alive instead of wasting resources on bringing back animals that dont have a place here. Very recent animals like thylocenes or steller sea cows tho maaaaaybe but idk
I just immediately associate the name "Jack Horner" with Puss in Boots: The Last Wish. Whar is wrong with me. I do like how chunky the rex design is here. Everything else about this "documentary" can go die.
Man I love dinos and these videos are awesome, you're debunking these fake ass documentaries with real arguments and memes but at the same time it's actually very educational. Love it! I'll subscribe 🤟🏻
I really don’t get why Horner thinks T-Rex could ONLY DO ONE THING.T-Rex could hunt AND scavenge,T-Rex would hunt large animals like Edmontosaurus,Triceratops,and Ankylosaurus.While the dromaeosaurs(I think Saurornithilestes)would hunt animals like (young)Pachycephalosaurus,crocs and turtles,Orodromeus,and Anzu.BOOM there ya go!
Well in the classes I had about the pachycephalosaurs and its relation to stygi and draco, it was based on the way the bones were. Stygi and Draco skeletons show signs of bone growth with spongey pores while Pachycephalo showed little to no signs of bone growth and and no sponge to it. This is of sourced from the paleontology professor I had in one of my classes and did an assignment with last fall.
The number of creatures that even fit the imagined role Jack has for T. Rex here is pretty small. It may be common knowledge that Hyenas are dedicated scavengers but few bother to ask if this is even true. In some areas, Hyenas kill more than they scavenge and lions scavenge more than they kill. Yet nobody in their right mind would consider lions, an organized pack Hunter hypercarnivore apex predator, to be a dedicated scavenger. There is one group of animals that seem especially adapted to the vertabrate scavenger niche, and that would be vultures. A hyper-mobile soaring bird that mainly uses it's sight range and flight to detect the dead from far away and soar straight to them. They have numerous adaptations specific to dedicated scavengers. Robust carnivorous animals with a bonecrushing bite are not usually dedicated scavengers. This description could be applied to bears, wolverines, alligators, and arguably even wolves, yet all of these animals absolutely need additional food sources besides scavenged bones and meat to survive.
I remember The Lost World movie where Jack Horner was the palaeontologist consultant. In the movie a T Rex ate a palaeontologist named Robert Burke whose obviously based off Robert Bakker, who argued with Horner that T Rex was a predator. When he saw the movie, Bakker told Horner: “See, I told you T Rex was a predator!”
Based Bakker
Bakker moment
Peleoltology is the most savage of all scientific fields.
so he basically made the thing a predator to kill a character based on someone who argued against him saying it wasn't a predator.
He was also in JP3. That's why when the poor schmucks hired him, he *L I E D T O T H E M !*
As the narrator himself said, "To claim T-Rex was anything less than the king of the Cretaceous food chain is nothing but heresy". Even the NARRATOR hates this documentary.
"The king of the Hell Creek formation food chain at the very end of the Cretaceous" to be more accurate, but sure.
@@Flufux look he had to recored next to the horner cut him some slak
@@Flufux and of course, it wouldve been clarted by many an ankylosaurs, edmontosaurus and triceratops in its day
@@flightlesslord2688 you mean like how lions get clapped by wildebeest and hippos constantly? The animals all evolved together, an apex predator means no predatory animal hunts it for food
@@Matt_History true
This one has got to rate low, it's basically Jack Horner's personal T.Rex hate porn.
Jack Horner is the Luc Montagnier of paleontology. He made ONE big important discovery, but he also spouted horse crap nonstop since.
Horner is such a tsundere for tyrannosaurus-kun.
@@yrooxrksvi7142 now I will say, he discovered maiasaura and several Alaskan/Canadian dinosaurs. And made sure the raptors acted more bird like in JP. But since then, he's a fucking nut job. He only made this documentary because he's trying to defame T-Rex because he's a duckbill fanboy.
@@thunderflare59 "i-it's not like I know you are a predator... BAKA!"
edit: this is the worst fucking comment I've ever made but I am very proud of it
@@GaiusIntrepidus You commented a masterpiece dude
Horner has only in the last few years been admitting that Rexy was indeed capable of predation. His argument is that he wanted to challenge paleontologists to study direct evidence rather than just assume things. Of course, he could be realizing his error and is trying to cover his tracks by saying "I was only kidding", and he hasn't been saying this very publicly, just in interviews when asked about it directly, which feels like a newspaper that buries a retraction in the middle pages.
He's definitely just trying to save his own ass. He seriously doesn't like Rex because he's a duck bill fanboy. No joke.
@@ironwarrior2916 fuck T. rex edmontosaurus is cooler
"Let's figure out how dinosaurs looked and acted based purely on DIRECT evidence with 0 assumptions and speculation!"
Meanwhile, dinosaurs are DEAD. There is no such thing as direct evidence. One has to make assumptions to even think they were alive or that they had flesh. How do we know they weren't just rocks from the very beginning? Just weirdly shaped rocks!
We know because we have brains and can make assumptions based on what we see. Based on what we see, the rex was built for predation. We don't need direct evidence to see that.
@@ironwarrior2916 i don't wanna shit on him for being a hadro enjoyer, but man he's got issues
@@ironwarrior2916 I love hadrosaurs and I acknowledge they would be food for tyrannosaurs except for Shantungosaurus.
“T. rex wasn’t a true predator ‘cuz it was too slow”.
Literally twenty years later, and nobody thought it’s prey, Triceratops, Edmontosaurus and (especially) Alamosaurus were *even slower*? 🤔
It's stupid even if they were faster. Lions, tigers and many other predators hunt animals faster than them. They ambush, attack in packs, run down prey until they get too tired, and can a lot of the time out smart their prey. To say that the rex wasn't a predator, and instead is a scavenger is a huge assumption.
Edmontosaurus could've been faster but like, Jack, did you know there is this RADICAL idea called(Read this in Earrape) *AMBUSH HUNTING*
@@suchomimustenerensis
And if you subscribe to the pack hunting theory.
The juveniles (which were much more gracile than the adults) could simply herd the prey towards the adults
They were still faster than a person most likely
Which is terrifying, elephant sized monsters that can outpace men
@@ksoundkaiju9256 tbf, most animals are faster than people. It's only long distance running that we have the advantage in.
i swear horner is sounding just as bad as the t rex fanboys who say that nothing can kill it
Velociraptor_Feathers I'm a T-Rex fanboy, but even I admit that they're NOT invincible, and that they were facing prey items that could EASILY kill them if they weren't careful.
@@kevinnorwood8782 then you’re simply not the type of person who he’s talking about :/
Am I a trex fan boy?
I think that trex would go after a triceratops somewhat regularly but I also know if a herd of edmotosaurus attacks a trex all its going to do is feel pain
@@raptorjesus2516 if a herd of edmontosaurs god after a lone rex it's gonna die
@@JackChop I said that though
"Jack Horner certainly isn't the only predator here"
Fucking savage I instantly subscribed after that line
I was a kid when this came out and I always loved watching dino docs but even then this program pissed me off. The main reason isn't even that its scientifically full of massive errors but Horner's ego. He acts like he is the adult in the room telling children that their is no Santa Claus with the condescending assertion that people disputed his claims only because it contradicted their childhood perception of tyrannosaurus rex. This is basically just an ad hominem deflection to avoid scrutiny for his claims. Most didn't doubt his claim that t-rex was incapable of predation because it contradicted their childhood but because, as you point out, it made little sense and contradicted the evidence.
Like I never understood why Horner kept asserting that being a predator and scavenger are mutually exclusive things when most carnivorous animals both scavenge and kill live prey depending on their circumstances. Being able to do both proficiently would be critical for an animal its size to get enough food to sustain itself. This shouldn't even require fossil evidence to prove only basic common sense
This comment is everything good in the world!
Well, he loved Maias and every time he went out to find more of them, he found rexes. Rexes who were eating his fave. When you boil it down he's just a hadrosaur simp that doesn't like the attention the 'big stupid bully' gets. Good ol' fashioned slander at it's finest.
I’m pretty sure Horner just enjoys being in the spotlight and will do and say stupid things to stay there.
sadly there seems to be alot of people like that in paleontology community too
@@djraptorthetrashraptor7701 Even great scientists can often be incredibly flawed human beings. Science is the best process we have but it is of course driven by imperfect humans who will often advance things for foolish personal reasons
I think the big misconception about T.rex hunting, is often done with the landscape. Its always shown in wide open fields in most documentaries where it would be hard to hide and give a lot of room to run, which T. rex adults probably didn't do. If the actual landscape was swampy like the everglades, it probably hunted more like a crocodile or Jaguar. Hid in the landscape, then ambush bite.
Well probably not like in the water but certainly leopard/tiger like ambush, hell it probably had stripes
Yeah, also aren’t crocs distinct relatives of T-Rex? So yeah it probably ambushed its prey.
Edit: well technically crocs are archosaurs and dinosaurs are also archosaurs so yeah.
@@AkaryusanYeah, no way a T-Rex would stay underwater for that long.
there is one quote from Dr. Ian Malcolm that fits so well with the "don't make chicken dinos" argument and it is this one: "Your scientists were so preoccupied with whether or not they could, they didn't stop to think if they should"
They definitely should
Exactly
Like. Why shouldn't they? There is no valid reason not to make a chicken dino.
@@marvalice3455is there a reason the should
@@TheLejonktopusFiles yes, because it would be glorious. great works justify people, not vice versa
“Valley of the THICC Rex”
Rick Raptor
Looks accurate in proportion besides the stupid arms
Wide birthing hips
No, no, no! It's spelled ㄒ卄丨匚匚 尺乇乂.
ØH LÆWD HE CØMÎN
On one hand, I do respect a lot of the work Horner has done for paleontology.
But at the same time…erm…yeah…
Ditto.
I remember seeing that controversy in a magazine when I was a kid, and even at like ten years old, I was thinking "Well, lions and hyenas are both predators and scavengers, T. rex was probably the same, why is it controversial?" XD
This same exact feeling.
I just thought why not both lol
Every carnivore ever is a scavenger and a hunter,Vultures eat decaying carcasses but have been seen eating turtles, no animal is a full scavenger or a full hunter.
Yeah because you can't live with just hunting and you are in a place were the only thing to eat is carcasses or you can't live with just scavenging where you are in a place there are no carcasses
iirc Vultures have also been observed killing cattle, most old and weak ones
And even then, vultures can fly to cover vast distances, trex couldn't
the argument that has convinced me the most to this day is that tyrannosaurus was an opportunist, it hunted when it had the opportunity and scavenge when it had the opportunity. Tyrannosaurus feces fossils had hadrosaur chicks inside, and triceratops bite fossils had evidence of being eaten after death, or of a failed hunting attempt, but triceratops, torosaurus or ankylosaurus were their last options, as any injury to a predator is usually fatal, and triceratops, ankylosaurus or torosaurus were very dangerous animals, so young or juvenile edmontosaurus and triceratops were the easiest target for an opportunist and probably the most used food source
Every carnivore is an opportunist to an extent.
If there’s meat, they’ll most likely eat it (save for when it’s rotting, nothing eats rotting meat, with some exceptions)
Like most creatures on the top of the food chain they would scavenge 9 times out of 10, but not bcs they were unable to like this documentary is saying, but bcs they didn't need to. Better steal food from someone else that will not dare to fight you
Unable to hunt*
Of course it scavenged sometimes. I've never heard of a single predator that doesn't. I'd say "Except humans", but that isn't true either. There are ways of identifying if roadkill is safe to eat or not, and so there are people who seek it out to eat or do so opportunistically. You don't really need to state "It hunted sometimes but also scavenged when it could", because that's really an implication when you say something was predatory.
This was cathartic to watch. I remember hating this documentary and its poor arguments for years.
I remember I kept asking, "why not both a predator and scavenger like many extant carnivores??"
@@CptnCardboard many, more like *EVERY*
@@suchomimustenerensis There are a few exceptions but otherwise yeah.
I love that, instead of the normal "positives" or "negatives" or "outdated" sections there is a section titled "Horner" that really says it all. 😂
Also I love the memes you put in about the silly dinosaur theories.
All of them are HAHAHAHAHAHAHA!!!! Which is good! It’s accurate
What’s more of a predator?
Jack Horner or his perception of tyrannosaurus...
Thanks for reminding me he once married a 19 yr old xD
@@Bahouudis I thought she was 17
@@CalvinTheCarnotaurus No.......
*...even he has standards-*
@Lapwingfilms didn’t you do the walking with dinosaurs dubs? Or someone else?
Hmm... Tough call.
T. rex is even more of a predator than Jack Horner, and that’s saying a lot.
True
Another thing to note, T. rex itself was the only large theropod Horner targeted as being a scavenger. That alone should show it was nothing but him venting and lashing out.
Yeah... a lot of large theropods filled basically the same role as rex did. You'd think, then, that he'd assume they were also scavengers. But... nope. He left them alone.
I do gotta find one thing hilariously ironic. Jack said he tried to make the Valley!T.rex as ugly and unappealing as possible. But it wound up being super burly, has a face covered in scars implying it got into fights and likely won, and it's mere presence sends a pack of his hyped up maniraptors fleeing on sight. In trying to make the most unappealing T.rex ever, Jack unwittingly kinda made an awesome one. I can see why Primal Carnage might have gotten the idea for the bulky look and color scheme.
In trying to make the virgin looking Rex, he accidentally created the chad of chads.
I remember Horner saying that while he was digging for hadrosaur fossils, animals he loves, he kept finding Tyrannosaurus fossils, which made him really upset, which is why he keeps trying to character assassinate rex.
I love Hadrosaurs,hell I think Shantungosaurus and an extremely large Edmontosaurus would beat T-Rex but I don’t think T-Rex was a scavenger,definitely scavenged time to time but hunted most of the time
@@suchomimustenerensis Little bit of a funny thing, but the Chinese Tyrannosaur (Zhuchengtyrannus) actually hunted Shantungosaurus.
@@AlotOfKarma I know but Zucheng was about 11-12 Meters long and about 6 Tons while (Based on Zuchengsaurus) Shantungosaurus could grow to 17 meters and 18 Tons
@@suchomimustenerensis Shantungosaurus was actually around 16.6 meters (you were super close) and 16 tons.
But yeah, those big boys were very large for a
Horner's tanked his reputation so much that I started reading a paleontology book that had been recommended to me and opened up the first page to a forward he wrote and my immediate thought was to cringe and skip straight to the rest of the book.
The T. rex’s arms were surprisingly powerful, being able to lift over 2 tons. Although useless for hunting/killing prey, they were mainly used to retain balance and to assist when having sex.
I love how horner gets his own separate part in the video😂😂
The documentary is Just Bodyshaming by a confused Old man and his Outdated 90s JP Hollywood knowledge who is only a shadow of his earlier sucessful researching who are went a weird way at the end . But great Video very love this Kind of analytics and tell so much whats going wrong by some people
How am I supposed to take this comment seriously lmao
@@shoother2257 why?
The thing is Jurassic park is for fun he’s serious which shows how bad he is
This comment had me laughing for waaaay too long 🤣
@@FeliciaMay13 that was only a Spontanous thought but thx XDD
Jack Horner Said that he doesn’t even like Tyrannosaurus rex I mean even if you hate the animal or not like the animal you can’t downplayed it like that
Liking something and evidence and facts are two different things. I dont really like T-rex because its so Boring and normal and most basic dinosaurs Imo but facts are facts. I cannot be like arghhh I dont like rex lets reduce its size by 10 meters lol.
Jack Horner is from a family that crushes quarry rock for a living. He was a marine and then never made it through university due to ADD issues. Now he's the foremost expert on a fictional dinosaur with the most absurd skeletal structure of them all. Totally incapable of walking or running. But the fake skeletons look great in museums.
@@polopena3337 ok hipster
My friend hates T-Rex but he believes that it was a top Predator of Hell Creek and a powerful dinosaur
Oh yeah, I totally think that the rex is overrated, but that’s just my OPINION. And it’s not for lack of respect for the creature, it’s just that there were so many other strange and interesting carnivore dinosaurs like carnotaurus(my personal favorite), utahraptor, dilophosaurus(the REAL one), allosaurus, and more.
You can dislike a dinosaur without having to somehow justify it by twisting facts and spewing out lies. It’s fine to just NOT like something.
"Little Jack Horner don't have any scavenger t rex, he was a pathetic Paleo boy, Little Jack's dead now! I'm big Jack Horner!"
Fun fact: most vultures have almost zero senses of smell whatever. They find carcasses using their vision. Only Turkey vultures use their snoots to find food.
Birds in have very poor smellers
I'm glad someone pointed this out because I have a love of turkey vultures since they are native to my area and I distinctly remember learning this fact when researching them.
@@Pipkiablo :)
@@Pipkiablo what I find very interesting, is that other carrion birds in America don't _need_ a god sense of smell, because they can just watch the turkey vultures!
And even though they're heavily considerd scavengers, they occasionally eat live prey
@@amn2760 makes ya think doesn't it?
This documentary *is* educational believe it or not
It teaches people that Jack Horner hates t.rex
not that is true
I mean crocodiles have good sense of smell DOES THAT MEAN THEY ARE SCAVENGERS TOO JACK ?!?!
Jack: yEs
I remember seeing an interview with Horner where he explained an incident where he went on an expedition to find hadrosaurs, but only found rex fossils instead. Because of this, the rex was cemented as his least favorite dino. Thus, he made this documentary (and I use that term loosely) as an excuse to hate on it and to try and ruin the rex's public image
Dude was mad because a bunch of T-Rexes died and had there bones replaced with rocks 💀
Nothing wrong with not liking Tyrannosaurus but this is just ridiculous…
14:32 = Nope, there is direct fossil evidence of raised midline scales in Edmontosaurus annectens, which was described by Horner himself in 1984.
Still doesn’t make Horner a good scientist.
Yes he was once held as a hero in the hearts of children and he somehow managed to take himself from among the most famous paleontologists in history for all the right reasons, to a complete moron who is famous primarily for attention seeking dumbassery, and preying on teenage girls. I had genuinely forgotten that he was involved with Maiasaura along with the *real* great man Robert Makela at this point. Horner is basically the go to example cannon fodder nowadays for "these are the nutters scientists who made up evolution." That Karens love to push. He gives a bad name to all of us who love not only past life but also that which is still with us.
The perfect documentary to use the "Allosaurus had never seen such bullsh¡t before" meme.
More like Trex has never seen such bs before
Jack: Where's the evidence of predation in T-rex?
Also Jack: So dromeosaurs were pack hunters...
UNO REVERSE!
"Horner wasn't the only predator"
DAMN BRO YOU KILLED HIM
13:39 ironically this edmontosaurus is surprised by the trex coming behind the vegetation showing how trex actually could ambush the prey easily despite its big size and slow running speed because hell creek has a lot of vegetation
Paleontology fans 🤝 Pus in boots fans
*Jack Horner is bad*
I’m loving this channel. I know it’ll blow up soon because this is such interesting and funny content.
Thank you! The channel's been doing very well for a while since I focused on dinosaur content.
Say, there was a show back in 2004 called animal face off.
The plot was experts would discuss who would win in a fight between two animals
And I think you should do a review on it.
I hear that show was terrible.
@@TheSharkAnt i heard that it was like Jurassic fight club with modern animals. At least Jurassic fight club had better cgi
@@raptorblack2269
That’s literally what it was.
And yeah, JFC may be terrible in a lot of aspects, but for it’s time, the CG wasn’t that bad.
I can’t believe they made a whole special on this. Now that I think about it the bit about the trike/toro relationship into a tv movie, I digress. However I had no idea about his relationship with his student, which is super sketch. I knew I never liked Horner and I’m upset to know my intuition as a young kid was right about him. Alas, great video
Actually, T-Rex only needed to be faster than the sickest, most, injured, youngest, SLOWEST animal in a group or herd...
Does Horner think that carnotaurus is also a scavanger because of its even shorter arms ?
I hope not. The La Colonia formation can't fire its apex predator! I don't know of any other large carnivore able to fill that niche!
These scientists need to put some respect on Edmontosaurus name!!
I think Jack should tell us what the hell killed a massive Edmontosaurus is Tyrannosaurus was a scavenger... because unless we simply haven't found another one, Tyrannosaurus was the only large carnivore in Hell Creek, so unless a Triceratops decided to tango with it, there is literally no other (Except maybe Dakotaraptor but still) that was taking multiple full grown Edmontosaurus off the census.
Dakotaraptor probably was more of a mobster than a real pack hunter. Plus it's too tiny to hunt herbivores larger than elephants.
Dakotaraptor may have been nomendubium
This documentary and Jurassic Park 3 aired in the same year.
Just if it wasn't clear enough that Horner really has a deep rooted HATE against the T. rex.
2001 was a bad year for T. rex.
This whole documentary reminds me of a Calvin and Hobbes strip where Calvin has to write an argumentative essay, and he chooses the debate about T-Rex being a hunter or scavenger, and his argument just boils down to "They're just so much cooler that way"
I regard Horner as both an important figure and an utter dumbass depending on the topic. We have mountains of evidence that T.Rex was a hunter and was in an environment with PLENTY of targets that wouldn't be able to run away.
Valley of the t-rex, more like
“How much can I butcher t-Rex within one documentary.”
More like turn myself into a laughingstock.
With Horners logic does that mean all carcharodontosaurids are not predators but scavengers too due to their eyes being more to the side???
No because who else is going to hunt those monstrous sauropods?
"That was weird!" *blast*
T. rex: So I can't kill an elephant sized ceratopsid but a bunch of little fox sized raptor birds can?! Ok then!
Probably the best dinosaur documentary review on this channel so far
I believe that there's evidence and Stygimoloch and Dracorex lived in different times then Pachycephalosaurus, so it's likely that even if Dracorex and Stygimoloch are juveniles, it's likely not for Pachycephalosaurus, just whatever an adult Stygimoloch was
actully stggimoloch dracorex and pachycephalosaurus lived at the exact same time
@@hyena_fan No, they did not. Stratigraphy shows there is a 1.1 million year difference between Pachychephalosaurus and Stygimoloch and Dracorex, with the former coming before the latter two.
*Dracorex is my son and he will exist*
Great review and rant on Valley of the T. rex.
This documentary in my opinion is probably the most disappointing dinosaur documentaries I’ve ever seen because everything seems out of place and especially Jack Horner.
Instead of Jack Horner learning about other dinosaurs especially Tyrannosaurus, he beats a dead horse on Tyrannosaurus by making a dumb lumbering scavenger instead of a apex predator who’s smart and strong which is very disappointing and so cruel.
Another thing is that they made the T. rex roar like a bear instead of a low pitch birds when we now that dinosaurs couldn’t roar like mammals, they roar like birds like hawks, eagles, crows, peacocks, Toucans and parrots, those are the modern dinosaurs that could roar and make other sound effects.
Dinosaurs can still roar but not like mammals, they roar like birds as I mentioned which I didn’t want to repeat the same thing over and over again because I don’t want beat a dead horse like Kent Hovind and Jack Horner.
If anything, I agree everything you said in this video.
Great work Red Raptor and keep it up.
Also at 7:02, great Meet the Robinsons reference with Tiny the T. rex, it was hilarious, not gonna lie.
How you just randomly mentioned kent hovind
The last person you want to have in a paleo documentary is a little kid who put his thumb in a pie
When I was around 7 or 8 years old, I first heard about this whole T-Rex being a scavenger theory, and it never felt right to me because I always thought that T Rex was a great predator, so this theory kind of struck me when I was little, but now that I’m older I’m starting to understand more about this wonderful creature, Life is crazy
Horner is just jealous of the T-Rex’s APEX predator status
Jack Horner can't stand a bigger predator than himself, that's why he tries to nerf the T-Rex.
Ironicaly, the super bullky T-rex is an Accurate desing today (just put lips on it and BOOM accurate)
PD: Great job puting scars on your "useless scavenger T-rex" because that means that this T-rex was in a LOT of Fights and win (or lose)
PD #2: really Jack? Dromaeosaurids taking down fully grown Hadrosaurids?
Even the biggest Dromaeosaurs like Utahraptor and Dakotaraptor would take at least 5 of them to take out even the smallest Edmontosaurus which was 11 Meters Long and the largest,IDK,8!
RickRaptor made those same notions.
Also, a hadrosaur would have to be either rather young or very weak for raptors to take it down.
Don't forget about the forward facing eyes and possibly some patches of quill-like feathers running down the back.
One could argue that _Tyrannosaurus rex_ didn't have feathers since the skin imprints only show scales, though I believe there's far too much evidence that suggests that it had at least some semblance of feathers.
@@catpoke9557 what close relatives. No actual tyrannosaur had feathers. Distant cousins of tyrannosaurs did but that's it.
@@GabiteEditz Thanks for responding. I remembered I made this comment a while ago but didn't know the video I commented on, and I kept cringing remembering I got the info wrong so I wanted to delete it. Thanks to you I found it lol
Horner's an interesting scientist. I like that he was the paleontological consultant on a movie about why it's a bad idea to Clone dinosaurs, and he's dedicated his life to recreating dinosaurs.
3:44, Okay...I knew a few basic things about Jack Horner...but that, that I did not know
*Red Raptor Writes:* “One last word on Horner is that he’s kind of a predator. I don’t do any personal mud-slinging on this channel, but this is really screwed up.”
*Random Thought:* “Would that make it more or less screwed up, if it turned out that Jack Horner was projecting all along, about T-Rex being a scavenger rather than predator?”
@@markcobuzzi826
I wouldn’t exactly call him a predator, since the girl is 19.
It would be more accurate to say that he’s a creep.
@@beastmaster0934
Thank you.
I’m sick of people characterizing Horner as a Pedophile. It shows that they have the literacy rating of a 5 year old.
I was just watching Valley of the T-rex today and my brain just melted. On the same day, I watched this video and my brain has been restored.
From my understanding, dracorex was 12ft long and had a 16inch skull, while the pachy was 14ft long, one would expect that if dracorex was a subadult pachycephalosaurus, the dome would already be present
Btw you named it wrong. It's not "Valley of the T. rex" it's "VALLEY OF THE ㄒ卄丨匚匚 尺乇乂"
Rickraptor?
You didn't even point out that, despite Horner's claims, the brain case shows its vision rivaled its sense of smell.
We need a virgin jack Horner, chad Bob Bakker meme someone please make that happen
Yes.
You know, hyenas have an incredibly sensitive sense of smell, and guess what. They hunt down more than 70% of their own food. All apex predators will scavenge when the opportunity presents itself, but all of them provide more than 50% of their own food. T-Rex would have done the exact same thing.
No carnivore that reaches the size of a Greyhound bus would reach adulthood relying exclusively on carrion. Even small carnivores like domestic house cats will hunt occasionally and kill a mouse, bird, etc.
Obviously the trex tooth in the duckbill tail was just the predatory edmontosaurus eating the scavenger Rex with its tail
This is 100% accurate, everyone knows that the apex predator of the hell creek formation is the Chad edmontosaurus that bully the t rex looser
@@lmn1871 yeah I mean it was 15 meters long and 15 Tons,twice the size of Virginosaurus Rex,it would chase it then bite it with its 250,000 psi bite force before eating with its tail
Next thing we know hes gonna publish the theroy of allosaurus being a plant eater
"Little Jack Horner sat in the corner"
lmfao the bee movie scenes
Ya like jazz?
3:31
Agreed, considering that's literally one of the main themes of Jurassic World and one of the themes in Jurassic World Fallen Kingdom.
Idk why, but that final Greek Structure analysis makes me laugh out loud
One thing partially off topic from this was Horner in the documentary said that scavengers like vultures were disgusting and disease ridden when that is very from the truth, vultures keep themselves very clean both old world and new world. The least clean thing about new worlds is their means of cooling off which is urination.
The fact that he also said that they looked disgusting as a means of defense is double wrong because the bald head is just to make healthy hygiene easier.
Onto the T-rex redesign the fact about the red head on a fully scaled reconstruction of a rex also doesn't make sense, outside of the stupid reason I explained earlier about the defense. Vultures flesh is pink cause it's just skin, no scales, no fancy color pigments, nothing.
I COULD see T-rex have a brightly colored head as means of attraction but then again that would ruin any ambush, so I'd actually imagine a brightly colored tail would be more favorable.
If I'm not mistaken some studies suggest that the bald head of vultures and turkeys is for/helps with thermoregulation which is even more evidence against Horner's idea
@@arcticdino1650 Really!? That makes a ton of sense for both of them.
If you have a link to those studies I would love to read them.
Horner cannot catch a break.
i think even prehistoric planet used the rex with colors thing in the freshwater or forest episode (look IK this is 2 years late but i just wanted to share this really badly)
Though I still believe the theory that T. rex adults probably hunted in pairs either mates, or in just local cooperation others near them which wouldn't require pursuits. Just luring a prey animal near one that would ambush and bite.
Considering the teeth marks we've been finding have been in tails consistently also shows it wasn't just a predator but a pretty active one. It was attacking from behind. What do you think that'd mean? It'd mean its prey was running. Or that it was smart enough to attack from behind where it lacks defenses. Either way, that's the behavior of an experienced predator.
I think the greatest argument against Tyrannosaur being a scavenger is that there's no other creature that size that is a scavenger
I do wonder if adult T-rex's would have been in a niche similar to bears, killing whatever was too slow for it and scaring competitors off their meals.
But I also wonder if juveniles being likely faster would have had a different niche.
Adults would have killed the bigger and lower preys, like triceratops or edmontosaurus (with ambush hunting)
While the Young ones would have chased other dinosaurs like pachycephalosaurus, anzu, ornithomimus and competed with dakotaraptor
Jack Horner: T. rEx WaS oNlY a ScAvAnGeR!
RedRaptorWrites: *Allosaurus had never seen such bulls**t before*
a yes that "documentry"
Oh hello
@@bluefury105 err hello
indicating that this animal survived the attack
Fun fact : T. rex Arms were actually capable of lifting 400 pounds
Only ONCE I want to see a scene were edmontosaurus isn‘t just a walking buffet for rexy, the main attraction of the documentary. Just one scene of a large bull edmontosaurus standing it‘s ground against an inexperienced or old tyrannosaur and give it a whooping.
Good video. This doc is an offense to T.rex fans everywhere.
I wouldn’t be surprised if Jack is a hadrosaur fanboy XD
I like hadrosaurs but I wouldn’t downplay a large predator like Horner did with this doc.
I like all dinosaurs all dinosaurs had importent in the echo system
Correct.
@@batspidey7611 True, plus that scene with with triceratops being taken down by dromaeosaurs was a joke to see.
Stan the Trex before his skeleton was sold it was proven I heard that his neck was broken before he died, the thing is the bones showed signs of Healing, the animal survived the neck injury and lived long after it how does a animal a predator no less survive that kind of injury? Maybe it had a pack or family helping him eat.
Holy Shit stan was a dang badass
Yeah there is no excuse for Horner's crackpot theory let's be honest.
Horner is a crank whose biases run so deep, he won't admit he's wrong. For instance, he knew all about the Edmontosaurus with the T. rex bite marks in it's tail vertebrae, but claimed the animal was sleeping, and the T. rex thought it was dead!
Facepalm again. If the Rex thought it was dead, why would it go for the tail?!
You know you suck when JFC did better
That was icing on the cake right there
i love how this video is framed as jack horner just going rogue with a skeleton and a tape measure
Jack Horner is the Luc Montagnier of paleontology. He made ONE big important discovery, but he also spouted horse crap nonstop since.
3:00 Stratigraphy disputes it-Dracorex and Stygimoloch are younger in the HCR than Pachycephalosaurus wyomingensis. Stygimoloch may be its own genus or a species of pachycephalosaurus, but it isn't definitely a growth stage of wyomingensis. IIRC on twitter Holtz has stated that Dracorex is almost certainly juvenile but if it is a juvenile it is a younger stygimoloch/pacycephalosaurus spinifer.
IIRC, There is also a supposed "Giant" Dracorex at the BHI, but it is undescribed, so it isn't really useful.
"is trying to reverse engineer chickens into dinosaurs"
AH yes, because if there's one thing we all learned from watching Jurassic Park, it's that bringing extinct creatures back is a good idea. Just as true as venom slinging dilophosaurus
But the thing is hes not bringing back dinos, birds are allready dinosaurs. It would still be a chicken, a mangled misshaped sad existence of a chicken :(
I mean, bringing back certain extinct animals (mainly the ones we wiped out, like mammoths, thylacines, moa, elephant birds, cave lions, cave bears, cave hyenas, etc.) is a good idea.
But bringing back dinosaurs is stupid and illogical.
They’ve been long dead for millions of years, the ecosystems they lived in no longer exist.
@@beastmaster0934 well rly the same could be said for mammoths too like the world has changed alot since then and there rly is no place for them. Im under the idéa that maybe we should make sure extant species gets keept alive instead of wasting resources on bringing back animals that dont have a place here.
Very recent animals like thylocenes or steller sea cows tho maaaaaybe but idk
I just immediately associate the name "Jack Horner" with Puss in Boots: The Last Wish. Whar is wrong with me.
I do like how chunky the rex design is here. Everything else about this "documentary" can go die.
Jack Horner is a villain in a movie and in reality
Man I love dinos and these videos are awesome, you're debunking these fake ass documentaries with real arguments and memes but at the same time it's actually very educational. Love it! I'll subscribe 🤟🏻
I really don’t get why Horner thinks T-Rex could ONLY DO ONE THING.T-Rex could hunt AND scavenge,T-Rex would hunt large animals like Edmontosaurus,Triceratops,and Ankylosaurus.While the dromaeosaurs(I think Saurornithilestes)would hunt animals like (young)Pachycephalosaurus,crocs and turtles,Orodromeus,and Anzu.BOOM there ya go!
Tbh, out of all his theories.
The Dracorex/Stygimoloch/Pachycephalosaurus theory seems the most likely
I think that the best theory of Jack is the one of nanotyrannus
8:16
And just as rick raptor said vultures can fly to reach a carcass, a t rex would be wasting a lot of energy by walking from 1 place to another.
Did Horner not watch Jurassic World? Does he want Indomunus Rex in real life, because that’s how you get Indomunus Rex IRL!
Well in the classes I had about the pachycephalosaurs and its relation to stygi and draco, it was based on the way the bones were. Stygi and Draco skeletons show signs of bone growth with spongey pores while Pachycephalo showed little to no signs of bone growth and and no sponge to it. This is of sourced from the paleontology professor I had in one of my classes and did an assignment with last fall.
The number of creatures that even fit the imagined role Jack has for T. Rex here is pretty small. It may be common knowledge that Hyenas are dedicated scavengers but few bother to ask if this is even true. In some areas, Hyenas kill more than they scavenge and lions scavenge more than they kill. Yet nobody in their right mind would consider lions, an organized pack Hunter hypercarnivore apex predator, to be a dedicated scavenger.
There is one group of animals that seem especially adapted to the vertabrate scavenger niche, and that would be vultures. A hyper-mobile soaring bird that mainly uses it's sight range and flight to detect the dead from far away and soar straight to them. They have numerous adaptations specific to dedicated scavengers.
Robust carnivorous animals with a bonecrushing bite are not usually dedicated scavengers. This description could be applied to bears, wolverines, alligators, and arguably even wolves, yet all of these animals absolutely need additional food sources besides scavenged bones and meat to survive.