Mark, this is a great video. I'm a small-town dealer in Australia, opened in mid-2020 and started dealing Fender's specialty brands in early 2021 (Jackson, Charvel, Gretsch, EVH, and accessories such as cables, pedals, etc). Initially I had a fantastic rep and things were great, I was moving product and as a small dealer I was just happy to be along for the ride. What really hurt me as a dealer was in mid-2022(ish) Fender redirected a lot of excess stock which was in the European and US warehouses to Australia and other smaller territories. Just prior to this they had been heavily encouraging dealers to join forward order program in which we would order for the next 6-12 months, thus ensuring a constant flow of sales for Fender as guitars arrived. Unfortunately, when the stock was redirected, some stores had up to 12 months worth of forward orders arrive at once, which we were obligated to take, and then pay for within 30 days. I know myself I had about 3 times my account credit limit worth of gear arrive suddenly, which nearly killed me cashflow wise because I couldn't cancel orders and had to pay upfront for everything in order to keep my dealership. Once the stock landed and was in stores, Fender then proceeded to offer deep discounts to stores on many of the same models as they were now overstocked at the warehouse, which had the impact of rewarding those who didn't have forward orders as they could buy the same guitar I had forward ordered, but at up to 40% less than I paid, with these same stores offering that gear to customers at a hectic discount on their websites, and thus you now have to adjust to the market to sell that piece of gear, and you end up making a loss. A couple months after this, Fender started selling direct-to-consumer in Australia via their website. At first they listed at the product RRP (which most dealers sell below), but then they started offering free shipping and discounts if you signed up to a Fender Play trial etc. Where it got really upsetting for a lot of people was when they restructured dealer margins, as they cut dealer margin right back, with part of the excuse being that dealers were selling below RRP anyways, so they'd eliminate the extra margin. At the same time though, they started listing products on the Fender website for sale BELOW the RRP which they set, which meant that if a customer went to Fender''s website to look up a model, the price they would pay was cheaper than the actual RRP we saw on price lists and in the dealer portal, meaning we're obligated to match that, or they're just going to buy off the Fender website. No harm no foul if it's other retailers, but when you're the manufacturer AND distributor AND you're now retailing too, you're making far more margin than your dealer partners are, and you have the search engine SEO and marketing power behind you to drive more sales to your website. It's a shame, because I'm a huge fan of all of Fender's brands (particularly Gretsch and Fender Japan), but it's no longer economical for me to be a dealer with what's happened. It's also interesting that two of the biggest dealers in Australia have closed in the past 18 months, and the common theme is that both were HUGE Fender stockists across the whole line. Unlike a lot of people in this industry, I have worked in the wholesale/distribution side of the game (in fact, my start in the industry was in sales for a distributor), and I understand that the margins in distribution in particular are not fantastic. But as mentioned earlier, when you are the manufacturer, wholesaler/distributor, and selling direct to consumer, you have an obligation to ensure that the people who are still prepared to sell your gear are looked after at the end of the day, and that it is viable for them to continue selling your gear. As for me? Times are very tough, and I've ceased dealing FMIC gear for the above reasons. It sucks. Maybe when times get better I'll look becoming a stockist again, but only if the terms are reasonable and the company is understanding. I should also add the disclaimer here that the staff at Fender Australia have always been really good to me. My reps have always gone in to bat for me and tried to help as much as possible. But the reality is that at the end of the day, the decisions made half a world away in Scottsdale, Arizona are what is enacted in the antipodes, for good or for bad.
You’re so cool and genuine. I’m definitely subscribing to your station. I only wish your store was close enough that I could do all of my business there… thank you for being such a good soul
I'm an old timer. Music stores used to be a place for musicians to hang out and BS . Its all changed now. Guitar center is great but they have a different crew every few months its seems. I miss the old days.
I like going to my local guitar store and check out stuff, I’ve never bought a guitar online, it’s a scary thought for me. Guitars are a very personal thing and I feel that you need to hold and feel it before buying it. So, I’m all about supporting brick and mortar stores like yours. Keep up the good work and everything will be fine, we got your back.
I worked in a small boutique bass shop that shuttered back in 2018. The Fender buy-in cost was huge. That may have been because we only carried bass guitars, though. We also had to purchase X amount of their accessories every year. Ugh, no one wanted to buy that accessory stuff. It piled up stupid fast. Fender gear quickly took over most of our bass inventory. Fender was selling direct and GC had their credit line, so we'd just get "showroomed". Because I kept the Fender basses setup properly and fixed any factory flaws, people came to try ours out and then went over to GC to buy on credit. They'd also buy on GC credit and try to trade for one of ours or get me to make modes (which was still profitable for me). We went from a shop with a great variety of high-end bass gear to being a Fender new old stock graveyard. Access to the custom shop was pretty darn cool, though. Also, I adore my American Fender P. Anyway, thanks for the video. Fender almost bit it a few times before. There are a lot of bright people there. I'm sure they'll find a way through the storm.
Your observations and insights make your videos very rewarding to watch and think about. I'm wondering about who is manufacturing pickups for Fender and others, so I'll google that and probably end up back your channel, ha ha. Thank you.
Thanks for the advice on my blue telecaster neck a couple of weekends ago, got a new neck and it fixed the issue! Great store to visit if you have the chance, will be going back for sure.
Mark ... so glad to see you back doing your talks. Love to hear the business side of the instrument supply chain & your from-the-heart gear reviews. Hope you, your family and the store thrive in 2025.
I think that hobby companies in general are hurting. Not just guitars/amp/etc companies. We have many societal problems: money (obviously), attention span shortening, unrealistic expectations that you will get good in a short time, video games taking up practice time, and "doom scrolling ". The music industry has been using a formula to really make music boring to reach a wide range. And lastly, music is getting defunded from school. Who will ever get excited about music after playing "Mary Had a Little Lamb" on a recorder!?!!? I think Fender is trying to survive without adjusting to change. Or trying to make music exciting again. Screwing with their channels is a sure way to kill the brand.
Interesting topic, whenever I get to New Hampshire I'm definitely going to stop by your shop. I like the row of guitars on the wall behind you. Ive never ordered a guitar on line, I jike to see them in person, thats just how I roll.
I've been playing Les Pauls for a decade, mostly US-made low/mid-tier Gibsons. I bought two MIM Fender Vintera II telecasters over the summer, and I'm actually shocked at how good they sound and play.
Hey Mark! Like many of us, I have a bunch of guitars and a good number (or most) are Fenders that I bought online. I've been to your website but I'm not sure if you're into selling and shipping, like so many are these days. Your prices seem very fair so, FYI, because of my perception from watching your videos that you are fair and honest and my imagined connection to you, I'd rather buy a guitar online from you than from the others. Right now, at least. Haha! Thanks for the video, much love from Portsmouth, vA.
Great insight, Mark, as always 🤝🏼 The big manufacturers' relentless drive for profit, bringing out new lines every couple years, it's got to hit a wall at some point. The capitalist model is killing the magic of the guitar, the excitement of going into a guitar store and trying out your dream instrument after you've saved enough money to buy it, talking to the people there, the sound of wannabe shredders slaughtering their favourite licks. Mark, the world needs people and retailers like you. Like books and vinyl records, I hope guitar stores have a Renaissance asap. Instead of continuously launching new lines, Fender etc could partner more extensively with retailers and artists to promote guitar tuition for example, to drive sales. The new market is completely saturated with thousands of guitar models, and the pre-owned market is 1000 times more saturated! It's like we're being forced to focus on what model of guitar we play, instead of what music we're playing. We're at a turning point for sure, no doubt brought on at least in part by the pandemic. Support your local independent guitar store! 💗☄🤘🏼🎸
My closest local store is GC. I’ll walk in there and mostly nobody notices or helps me and all the cool guitars I like are under lock and key. So I’ve purchased from Sweetwater, stores online, and through Reverb, all with great success. It’s a risk, yes, but I’ve gotten a feel for it. If I was near you, Mark, you can bet I’d be a loyal customer. Happy New Year!
Same. The local store I grew up with has closed so now the nearby place is GC but so many guitars are locked up, and I don't want to have to have someone unlock it and then stand there and have to wait for me to be done looking at it. Or, have someone unlock something just because I've never touched one and just want to see how heavy it is and then put it right back. Locking up everything is just not a fun experience.
The thing that is missing from an online sale is the inspection and set up piece. Guitars are funny things and the playing experience, especially for novice buyers can be altered significantly by a knowledgeable retailer making certain the action is properly set, the fret ends aren’t snagging you, the intonation is correct etc. The good guitar shops used to do those types of tweaks plus give advice on humidity levels and maintenance etc that was part of the guitar buying experience. That is all being lost.
Selling direct will definitely be helpful for them with the tariffs. I be shocked if there any sort of exemption for guitars. I’d be interested to see how the music industry as a whole will react.
Some of us are not lucky enough to have a nice/reliable/honest local music store to go to. I will admit to purchasing direct from fender because of this and thus far have had good experiences doing so- they check the guitar over with a check list and have had hassle free returns. However, I feel for you and hope that your local patrons are coming to you for their fender needs- I certainly would if I was local to your shop.
Interesting video as always! Gibson have been retailing exclusive models direct-to-consumer in the past few years as well. And, Fender already has at least one retail store, in Tokyo.
Love your channel, Mark. I ordered a Deluxe Reverb from their site a couple of years ago. Couldn’t find one in stock locally at the time, and they were running a promotion. I think the Sweetwater’s of the world will lose the most from Fender’s direct sales.
I disagree about Sweetwater. I always buy my stuff through Sweetwater if I can because I trust them and I want someone between me and the manufacturers. Sweetwater has my back. I don't trust Fender for sure. I've also become friends with my sales rep. I'd rather some of my money end up in his pocket than Fender's. Of course, Sweetwater is so large, they might lose the most money. And I understand why my logic would apply to those who have a local dealer they trust, which AFAIK I don't. Customer service matters. And overall, in my experience, it's getting worse. Amazon's used to be great. Not now. I've bought stuff Sweetwater doesn't carry from Amazon and also cheap pedals just to try them out. For the good stuff, the prices are the same and lots are being sold direct. I would guess the biggest gear threat is to boutique pedal companies. Both due to digital and cheap Made in China stuff. My sense is that it they will eventually, if it hasn't happened already, be just as good as the expensive ones. It reminds me of cheap Japanese transistor radios when I was a kid. Lots of junk, but not for long.
@@mikem668 I've had some weak Sweetwater experiences lately. And didn't the guy who founded the store retire? More bean counting and less quality of service going on.
@@ronj9448 agree. Sweetwater seems to be slipping in CS. My last couple of experiences have been less than average. Plus my reps have changed three times in the past few years. I don’t even know my rep.
Good insights Mark. I just had a similar conversation over in Europe 2 days ago. The situation seemed to be even worse. I'm not in the selling business and I’m not in the buying business either. I’m a muso who’s been around. Own about 10 guitars. 3 of them Fenders. Fender (not only) seem to be saturating the market plus fewer kids are into instruments it seems. I see a cliff edge ahead. … Good luck everyone.
Really appreciate all the great information. Where are you going to get set up and service. I support a smallish local store and prefer that. Would hate to see all the small shops disappear
Thank you for exposing these crooks. My local dealer is literally being driven out of selling fender now. I was a Fender Fan boy but due to the fact the guitar I want is only online and I can't have delivery to home or work I now have no choice but to look at other brands such a Gibson and now Epiphone. Eipiphone are making some awesome guitars in the higher price range but not yet the Gibson price, but defiantly as good as Gibson IMO. Keep posting
Fender & Gibson are the tip of the iceberg - the more brands who once relied on bricks and mortar 'local' stores promote their own on-line sales the more retail closures we will see - of course we're already seeing it. It's a terrible shame because in the '70s I worked as a guitar salesman in one NZ's better known music stores and the sense of community was strong and the opportunity for musicians (of all levels of proficiency) to actually try out and compare guitars was great. Sign of the times, sadly. I have only bought long distance / unplayed once (in 1992 - from Roger Sadowsky in New York, a boutique luthier brand at the time, now slightly expanded but still specialist) and I would hesitate to buy online unless the whole shipping / return policy was clearly set out given the room for QC error from the major high volume manufacturers. I live in HK so fortunately the 2 main flagship distributors carry a lot of stock (HK is a duty free port and the high turnover = discounts whenever a new batch of any given brand stock arrive - I picked up a 2019 Japanese Gretsch Player Series at 50% because 2 dozen of the new Chinese made solid bodies were launched) BUT I have noticed a bit of a thinning out of the ranks on certain models which are only available direct online from the brands . . . so it goes!
I liked it better when Fender had no options other than color. You found the one that felt good in your hands and sounded good to your ears and you bought it and that was the end of it. If you want to a Stratocaster now you've got about a dozen choices, to me it'd be if they just made one good one. I'm old Haha.
I agree. I’m 70 and remember when a Strat was a Strat and the same for Teles. So many options now and price levels it’s hard to keep track of . Buying by mail is a crapshoot.Sure return policies are generally good,it still is a pain
I was in the Shibuya showroom a couple weeks ago and what's interesting is what you don't see. They have a room devoted to custom shop (and guys wearing white gloves, it's Japan) but the lower floors are pretty bare. You can buy from a small selection, but realistically, the showroom is more of a proxy than a dealership. And being a Fender store, they discount like Sweetwater (never). To move things along, Fender JP continuously turns out limited models which, as far as I can tell, they offer to retailers as rewards for taking ordinary inventory. Buy 10 Mustangs and we'll sell you a limited Strat you can make money on. I wouldn't be surprised to see a trial Fender boutique in a low rent place like Las Vegas, but is it worth investing in brick and mortar just to cut out the middleman?
Great content and great commentary. However, your volume seems a little low for me? I say that as a question because I'm not sure that anyone else has the same thought. I have to really crank it to hear you it seems.
Hey Gary! Sweet vid. I love your channel! There is a green Gretsch hollowbody hanging on the back wall. To the left. Gold trim. Is it a country gentleman? Just curious. I used to have one and I had to sell it. I miss it:(
Very interesting analysis. I suppose you'll still have a LOT of used Fender guitars as a business, especially without Guitar Center. Fender isn't going to be buying used guitars, and what do they do with all the factory seconds? Unfortunately in my experience, the three American made deluxe Fender guitars I've bought, each had major technical flaws - like they are selling factory seconds as new, straight off of the line. That makes used a better deal assuming flaws have been fixed by previous owners.
Any authorized Fender dealer has to fix any Fender product that is under warranty regardless where it was purchased, as long as it was a Fender dealer.
A new American Standard used to be $1200 CAD in 2010. The American Pros are going for $2500 CAD today. Wages haven't doubled in that time. Will people be buying a CNC streamlined piece of wood for $5000 in 2040?
@@DNKOTOR this is why boutique brands such as Reverend, G&L and others are much better values for money. For the $1200 you can get the equivalent of fender custom Shop quality from these brands. Let Fender isolate themselves, and simply ignore them. Let them become the joke of the industry. It's kind of dumb all the hand ringing about fender doing this or that, they are a name and a legacy, they're not God, or the god of the music industry. There will always be a market for the old stuff, nostalgia, but if they keep in their ways, their future will diminish.
@therealtech833 Do you feel the Nostalgia Market will fade with Boomers and Gen X? There may be shrinking Collector's Markets and smaller pockets of players that seek out Grandpa's gear.
@@emilychanfan it stands to reason with older gear becoming more rare, there will always be a market for it, to your point, not sure how big a market. However that does not help fender selling guitars today. I personally do not have a desire to purchase a pre-cbs strat. But some say for example, as wood ages it gets a boutique sound to it, etc. I just don't like noisy electronics and I find that older stuff needs to be refurbished, otherwise it can be very noisy. Scratchy volume pots, grounding corrosion, worn frets, not for me.
@therealtech833 That's the reason I mention the Nostalgia Market versus the Collector Market. Younger players today, and in the future, won't share the nostalgic feelings because they most likely didn't cut their teeth with those guitars. There is little connectivity to the past for them. All markets are cyclical.
@@emilychanfan When buyers are too young to persuade with nostagia, you have to convince them that old guitars are worth more simply because they're old. Even if they weren't any good to begin with. So far, It's working, but have no nostalgia for the Teisco I grew up with. Paid $60 for it new and if I could buy it back sixty years later, I'd still pay $60 for it.
Bring it back to America! Make legacy guitars like they used to make, quality guitars that can be passed down one generation to another. They can of course also make a budget friendly guitar. It’s time to start bringing back companies that built their brand in America back to America.
Had the choice of ordering a guitar online and getting it before Christmas, or through a brick and mortar store and get the guitar after Christmas. I chose the latter, to help keep brick and mortar stores open. You need to feel your guitar before you buy it, and that’s a lot of returns and time wasted buying online.
Companies like Fender have “diluted” their brand. Every year they come out with new models that aren’t all that different than the year before - except the price... Furthermore, Fender (Squire) guitars built in Asia are much better than they used to be. As a result, it will become more and more difficult for people to justify paying the high prices for an American-made guitar.
Their guitars also vastly range in weight for the same model. Might find a 7lb Mexican strat or a 9.5lb one. They don't pick their woods and they keep making guitars from bad cuts. Their qc is awful. Their American ones are better, but still feel cheaper than an s2 prs, or gibson sg. (Prices of those models are close to each other).
The fender squire relationship in build quality is reminiscent of the Gibson Epiphone relationship in the 90’s. As Squire becomes more China heavy expect a quality drop off. Initial Chinese runs are generally great for the first two years then the quality control just drops off
Fender squire are NOT much better than they used to be, the early Korean ones were great, the Japanese ones were good, the Indonesian CV ones were actually really nice...they've always put our decent guitars like someone else said at the start of a run. The Chinese will start putting out absolute CRAP as soon as the initial run is over.
It seems there is room for smaller regional guitar manufacters to replace Fender and Gibson that can sell through local outlets. Let a thousand small guitar companies bloom.
Exactly. It's time for new players. Fender banks on the fact that they were one of the "first in" makers of guitars. Most people, especially online are obsessed with collecting vintage ones because of this phenomenon. But once you start building your own guitars, putting them together yourself, you realize that that a great playing guitar takes precedence over a name. It's not magic to put together a great guitar, you just great parts and some skill. Let collectors have their own space and have more local makers.
Thanks for keeping us in the loop with this stuff. It's pretty depressing, but I guess that's life. Seems like getting more money for shareholders is harming pretty much everything in every industry. Amazon gets to sell the new Squier Debut series, and I'm guessing they'll be selling a lot of them at $129 for a bass and a little less for a guitar, so FMIC's changes may not affect Amazon in the same way as music stores and other retailers. I was surprised GC lasted this long after Bain saddled them with debt. Other businesses, like Toys R Us and Payless, went under from this kind of vulture capitalism, but GC is still standing, more or less - at least, enough to sell part of to Aries. * sigh *
So basically they are closing the gap between U.S. and Mex. Having said that my Pro 2 tele compared to a player 2 is night and day, not even close which justifies it costing almost twice as much. I hope they don’t compromise U.S. made instruments or raise the prices going forward. Fender stores would hurt the shops that have put Fender where they are.
i'll just wait for a good used git to show up in a store like Garys and play it get their opinion if it been modded. don't mind that but ya got to do a good job and keep the original stuff and it going into the price
I only buy Squier Classic Vibe's. They are the best bang for the buck most coming out of Indonesia. Unlike some, I could care less if a guitar is manufactured in the USA as I now live in the Philippines. All I care about is quality for the money. Fender better watch themselves because Tokai Japan is on the horizon and guitar players are catching on.
Tokai Japan has been around for a very long time. The problem is they're very hard to find in America. The Tokai-Love series which is or at least was made in China is an exceptionally nice instrument, but not up to the Japanese standards in my experience. I have a Squier CV 50's Strat I bought new for 350 bucks years ago. It has the best sounding Strat pickups I've ever heard. The guitar itself though, overall.....pretty cheezee. Thin neck, thin body, and cheapo hardware.
If they have experienced repair staff, then they'll always have a place in the economy despite the ongoing deathblows to brick and mortar. Guitar Center repair work is 50% getting shipped to a major city for repairs and 50% inexperienced wrencher on staff who'll bow your neck because he knows you don't know what a proper truss rod adjustment should look like/feel like/cost.
@@danielsalisbury245 Fender guitars have a factory setup with is rarely perfect or ideal. A shop usually includes a setup with any purchase of a guitar.
Fender are making a mistake going direct. Think of all the costs associated with processing transactions, deliveries, returns, customer service, faults, warranty issues…. It would make more sense for brick n mortars stores to continue to increase their on line transactions effectively for the manufacturers. I’ve not bought an instrument from a shop visit since the 90’s and I’ve spent multiple thousands on gear over the last 25 years. What does everyone else think? Change can be hard to predict. 😊👍🏼
@ I am not convinced. Supplying direct to thousands of customers with one off transactions is a whole different business to supplying a smaller number of dealers with regular /bulk transactions. The costs and logistics will be crippling. IMHO. Let’s see what happens. The answer could be Fender supplying a smaller number of strategically located super dealers who would be better equipped to specialise in servicing the end user transactions. I dunno. Its interesting. I certainly think Fender might have over diversified. Too many variants. 👍🏼🎸
I watched a video about the direct to consumer trend with Nike and how it hasn’t gone well for them and while that’s still an option for customers, Nike is putting more of a focus on their retail partners again. Might be something we see with Fender in a few years.
sooooo, 40% markup of $60 doesn't get you to $100, but I get your point. My feeling is that many guitar players who purchase a new guitar want to hold it in their hands before putting out the cash. My personal experience was with an online purchase from Amazon for a very well reviewed, highly rated budget guitar. It arrived and I knew within the first 2 minutes that I didn't have a connection with this instrument. Had I walked into my local bricks and mortar store I would have had the opportunity to realize this without the time, hassle and disappointment of this situation happening in the first place. I honestly will be heartbroken if my local music store becomes nonviable because of online retail.
Here in Europe Thomann sell an average of 750 guitars a week. That’s a lot of sales over a year (38k?) plus amps, accessories etc.Their customer service is excellent and they have their own QC department which makes it really attractive. Plus the big UK retailers have good online operations as well - PMT, Anderson’s etc.
I don't envy you man. If I was going to do it I'd post up as a lutherie and amp repair shop, and buy, sell, and fix used gear. Greed is king, service is not as appreciated as it once was.
I noticed you can buy Fender on their website. They are now selling returns on their Reverb channel as well. "Certified Returns" or something like that. I don't buy Fender custom shop for $4,000+. Illogical. I did buy over the summer a Vintage Squire Tele for $300.00. I swear there is nothing wrong with it so I had to buy it. It was crazy. I think it is made in China. Played it at a few jam sessions and felt relaxed about it getting damaged vs my G&L which I baby. Ten years ago I bought a used Hamer import for $200.00 and that has been wonderful to play. Past inventory is the biggest threat. There is too much.
The Certified Returns on Reverb are done through a third party, who already sold refurbished Fenders. Basically, they get the seal of approval, can charge extra because of this, which Fender gets a cut of, without Fender seeing a single guitar before they're sold on. It's literally a licensing agreement sold as a Fender operation.
@@bucklberryreturns Hey Buck. Really? They sure looked real flashing that "Fender" every which way. And they sent me discount offers. I guess Fender is just a name to buy/sell with like Gretsch.
@@ronj9448 Yeah, it's true enough. They are genuine 2nd hand Fenders, but Fender does no repairs or anything to them, doesn't touch or see them before they're resold under their approval.
I think the established well known brands will survive but there are so many good manufacturers out there with lower overheads that produce good quality guitars as for the high street shops they are up against it, I worry for these retailers they have high overheads, and in the UK they are being taxed out of business by succesive governments.
Always saw it as crazyness to say the least, people that buy fenders and gibsons as investiment assets. These instruments are way overpriced just like the stock market alright tho but it makes no sense to me at all a electric guitar costing more than $5.000 no matter the year was made. Maybe 100-150 years from now these instruments will achieve a REAL high value but that's way too long term for investiments return. Btw : out of topic here but just responding one of your last videos
I bought thru them during Christmas Sales four times in December. When they offer their second best gig bag for $48 instead of $119 it's a no brainer. They were marking down stuff from 10-60%. That guitar bag was like 70% off.
I got 5 fender Mexican guitars this year online and they are all great guitars. However, I don’t see myself buying another Fender guitar after all that, I have enough.
We cannot forget that Nike followed the strategy to be directly focused on consumers and let a big whole openned on retail stores! Competitor took advantage of that and now Nike is failing miserably.
I think Fender and Squier will have problems if quality standards slip further. In fact the only Fender Squier guitars on my list are Classic Vibe'snout of Indonesia. Fender needs to watch out for Tokai Japan whose quality is high.
I see a day when even the custom shops of these guitar companies move overseas, NOTHING will be left in the USA. But what concerns me the most is what I see whenever I visit a music store or guitar show: Virtually no one under the age of 35 is there. We have become a nation of gamers, home of the thirty year old man-child. This is the biggest threat to our hobby, the lack of new blood coming in to it. I see a drastic fall off in buying in the not so distant future. We are drowning in a sea of guitars that there are no buyers for.
Unless it's a custom guitar that I order, I would rather walk into a music store with my strap and play the guitar. I live in MA so I'll drop in on you sometime. Great videos you produce.
I find more deals on Apple at Bestbuy than Apple store. Feel that would be the same with Fender. And I don't mean the short-lived Bestbuy musical instruments area😂.
Bottom line is money.They want their shareholders to have more money in their pockets. This will come back to bite them. when no one can go to a shop ant try guitars, then i see a lot of smaller shops will go to the wall. i think what they will see by going direct selling is their actual sales per year will drop hugely. why. because most of their sold stock is already in the hands of the shop owners who bought them to sell in their shops. what you have to all do is when fender rep comes to your shop is tell him to f***off and go sell his goods online, and dont come back here again. if you shops all do that, they will realise big time what they have done. There are many great guitar builders out there we dont need fender that badly. Fender have to realise that they sell so much because of these shops. Greedy corporations.
The problem is that, when I was a teenager in the 80's when you played guitar in high-school (and if you were any good) you were the shit! You were on the same level as the starting Quarterback on the varsity team. You got all the girls and everyone wanted to be your friend. You were a "Micro-Superstar". Nintendo and Rap came along and everything changed. Rock became Jazz and the guitar became the saxophone. Yeah, kids still play it and it's still cool but given a choice, it's video games with their online friends. When you go into a music store now all you see is a bunch of Boomers and Gen X'ers. We're retired or approaching it. We're not the demographic for sustainability of a company. Plus there are way more companies that are vying a piece of the dwindling market. Companies like Fender and Gibson have to fight as hard as they can and keep up with the modernization of how young people shop if they expect to stick around. Let's face it. The Boomers are in the process of dieing off, us Gen X'ers are in the process of retiring and for the most part our buying days are behind us. So you're going to have to deal with it because time and life marches on.
Nd all those expensive high dollar classic cars are going to plummet in value because us gen xers don't give a crap about street rods and stuff the boomers spend big money on.
@ I’m a Gen Xer and I remember some of my friends who could do their own work had some classic cars and I really wanted one, but even back in 1984 ( I was 19) it was an expensive endeavor and one friend even told me he couldn’t park it anywhere like a mall or something without worrying if someone would damage it . I see a major collapse on all of these toys too.
When Fender and the other brands bumped prices up they destroyed the used market for individuals because everything froze. People instantly thought their 350$ MIM was worth 500$ overnight. Well, Now they’re reaping what they’ve sown. They chose overpricing a few sales over making many consumer friendly sales. It’s made the consumer more aware of the MBA influence. I heard fender was undercutting used gear on reverb. Lolz
Those some pretty bitter guys at GC, I'll never go back there. They give you no assistance whatsoever. Make an amp feedback and be prepared to defend yourself.
No one wants to hear you cranking up a tube amp. If I was a customer at said store and you were cranking an amp loud enough to get feedback… I’d probably leave. We all know what a Marshall does and it’s annoying as shyt for you to try and do it in a damn store.
Really?? And who is everyone...exactly? You mean the employees? What about other brands like, I don't know, say Supro? What sort of headroom do they have? I can't determine what the thing sounds like until I get feedback and then back it off a little. No one that knows anything about amps would approach it otherwise.
How many guitars are their in the world? Has to be increasing. They keep pumping them out but the old ones don’t deplete like cars. And not everyone is a collector
@@GarysGuitarsUSA For sure. I just put a set of 57'/62' pickups in it and it is all the Strat I will ever need - not that that will stop me from getting more ha.
I’m not a big fan of Fender and don’t even own one anymore. I’ve never owned a Fender for very long. I just don’t like to play them for 3 hours. I cannot get on with their necks. I do like their amps, though.
Mark, this is a great video. I'm a small-town dealer in Australia, opened in mid-2020 and started dealing Fender's specialty brands in early 2021 (Jackson, Charvel, Gretsch, EVH, and accessories such as cables, pedals, etc).
Initially I had a fantastic rep and things were great, I was moving product and as a small dealer I was just happy to be along for the ride. What really hurt me as a dealer was in mid-2022(ish) Fender redirected a lot of excess stock which was in the European and US warehouses to Australia and other smaller territories.
Just prior to this they had been heavily encouraging dealers to join forward order program in which we would order for the next 6-12 months, thus ensuring a constant flow of sales for Fender as guitars arrived.
Unfortunately, when the stock was redirected, some stores had up to 12 months worth of forward orders arrive at once, which we were obligated to take, and then pay for within 30 days. I know myself I had about 3 times my account credit limit worth of gear arrive suddenly, which nearly killed me cashflow wise because I couldn't cancel orders and had to pay upfront for everything in order to keep my dealership.
Once the stock landed and was in stores, Fender then proceeded to offer deep discounts to stores on many of the same models as they were now overstocked at the warehouse, which had the impact of rewarding those who didn't have forward orders as they could buy the same guitar I had forward ordered, but at up to 40% less than I paid, with these same stores offering that gear to customers at a hectic discount on their websites, and thus you now have to adjust to the market to sell that piece of gear, and you end up making a loss.
A couple months after this, Fender started selling direct-to-consumer in Australia via their website. At first they listed at the product RRP (which most dealers sell below), but then they started offering free shipping and discounts if you signed up to a Fender Play trial etc.
Where it got really upsetting for a lot of people was when they restructured dealer margins, as they cut dealer margin right back, with part of the excuse being that dealers were selling below RRP anyways, so they'd eliminate the extra margin. At the same time though, they started listing products on the Fender website for sale BELOW the RRP which they set, which meant that if a customer went to Fender''s website to look up a model, the price they would pay was cheaper than the actual RRP we saw on price lists and in the dealer portal, meaning we're obligated to match that, or they're just going to buy off the Fender website. No harm no foul if it's other retailers, but when you're the manufacturer AND distributor AND you're now retailing too, you're making far more margin than your dealer partners are, and you have the search engine SEO and marketing power behind you to drive more sales to your website.
It's a shame, because I'm a huge fan of all of Fender's brands (particularly Gretsch and Fender Japan), but it's no longer economical for me to be a dealer with what's happened. It's also interesting that two of the biggest dealers in Australia have closed in the past 18 months, and the common theme is that both were HUGE Fender stockists across the whole line.
Unlike a lot of people in this industry, I have worked in the wholesale/distribution side of the game (in fact, my start in the industry was in sales for a distributor), and I understand that the margins in distribution in particular are not fantastic. But as mentioned earlier, when you are the manufacturer, wholesaler/distributor, and selling direct to consumer, you have an obligation to ensure that the people who are still prepared to sell your gear are looked after at the end of the day, and that it is viable for them to continue selling your gear.
As for me? Times are very tough, and I've ceased dealing FMIC gear for the above reasons. It sucks. Maybe when times get better I'll look becoming a stockist again, but only if the terms are reasonable and the company is understanding.
I should also add the disclaimer here that the staff at Fender Australia have always been really good to me. My reps have always gone in to bat for me and tried to help as much as possible. But the reality is that at the end of the day, the decisions made half a world away in Scottsdale, Arizona are what is enacted in the antipodes, for good or for bad.
Thanks for your very well thought out reply. Everything you said is consistent with things I've heard and experienced.
@@GarysGuitarsUSA no worries, cobber.
I’ve found your store and will buy from you when I can 🤙🏽
You’re so cool and genuine. I’m definitely subscribing to your station. I only wish your store was close enough that I could do all of my business there… thank you for being such a good soul
thanks
I'm an old timer. Music stores used to be a place for musicians to hang out and BS .
Its all changed now.
Guitar center is great but they have a different crew every few months its seems.
I miss the old days.
Our local shop sells more modelers and audio interfaces than amps. Owner says kids don't want to gig, they want to be influencers.
@@danielcrescenzo354 Playing with other musicians is the best part about it!
@@danielcrescenzo354 That's very sad they don't know what they're missing.
I like going to my local guitar store and check out stuff, I’ve never bought a guitar online, it’s a scary thought for me. Guitars are a very personal thing and I feel that you need to hold and feel it before buying it. So, I’m all about supporting brick and mortar stores like yours. Keep up the good work and everything will be fine, we got your back.
I worked in a small boutique bass shop that shuttered back in 2018. The Fender buy-in cost was huge. That may have been because we only carried bass guitars, though. We also had to purchase X amount of their accessories every year. Ugh, no one wanted to buy that accessory stuff. It piled up stupid fast.
Fender gear quickly took over most of our bass inventory. Fender was selling direct and GC had their credit line, so we'd just get "showroomed". Because I kept the Fender basses setup properly and fixed any factory flaws, people came to try ours out and then went over to GC to buy on credit. They'd also buy on GC credit and try to trade for one of ours or get me to make modes (which was still profitable for me). We went from a shop with a great variety of high-end bass gear to being a Fender new old stock graveyard. Access to the custom shop was pretty darn cool, though. Also, I adore my American Fender P.
Anyway, thanks for the video. Fender almost bit it a few times before. There are a lot of bright people there. I'm sure they'll find a way through the storm.
Stuck with the used gear...That's all most of us can afford anyway....best of luck..love ur channel 🙏
Your observations and insights make your videos very rewarding to watch and think about. I'm wondering about who is manufacturing pickups for Fender and others, so I'll google that and probably end up back your channel, ha ha. Thank you.
Thanks for the advice on my blue telecaster neck a couple of weekends ago, got a new neck and it fixed the issue! Great store to visit if you have the chance, will be going back for sure.
Yippee!!! Merry Christmas!!! So happy to see my best friend!! Heres to a happy healthy new year to you ! Cheers 🎉
Great channel and discussion
Mark, thanks for sharing your insight regarding Fender. Best of luck into the new year.
Mark ... so glad to see you back doing your talks. Love to hear the business side of the instrument supply chain & your from-the-heart gear reviews. Hope you, your family and the store thrive in 2025.
I would so prefer that the mom & pop stores would come back.
I think that hobby companies in general are hurting. Not just guitars/amp/etc companies. We have many societal problems: money (obviously), attention span shortening, unrealistic expectations that you will get good in a short time, video games taking up practice time, and "doom scrolling ". The music industry has been using a formula to really make music boring to reach a wide range. And lastly, music is getting defunded from school. Who will ever get excited about music after playing "Mary Had a Little Lamb" on a recorder!?!!?
I think Fender is trying to survive without adjusting to change. Or trying to make music exciting again. Screwing with their channels is a sure way to kill the brand.
Interesting topic, whenever I get to New Hampshire I'm definitely going to stop by your shop. I like the row of guitars on the wall behind you. Ive never ordered a guitar on line, I jike to see them in person, thats just how I roll.
Will be interesting to see Fender back at NAMM this year.
I really have to stop by your store next time I'm in Portsmouth!
I've been playing Les Pauls for a decade, mostly US-made low/mid-tier Gibsons. I bought two MIM Fender Vintera II telecasters over the summer, and I'm actually shocked at how good they sound and play.
Hey Mark! Like many of us, I have a bunch of guitars and a good number (or most) are Fenders that I bought online. I've been to your website but I'm not sure if you're into selling and shipping, like so many are these days. Your prices seem very fair so, FYI, because of my perception from watching your videos that you are fair and honest and my imagined connection to you, I'd rather buy a guitar online from you than from the others. Right now, at least. Haha! Thanks for the video, much love from Portsmouth, vA.
Merry Christmas Mike !
Great insight, Mark, as always 🤝🏼 The big manufacturers' relentless drive for profit, bringing out new lines every couple years, it's got to hit a wall at some point. The capitalist model is killing the magic of the guitar, the excitement of going into a guitar store and trying out your dream instrument after you've saved enough money to buy it, talking to the people there, the sound of wannabe shredders slaughtering their favourite licks. Mark, the world needs people and retailers like you. Like books and vinyl records, I hope guitar stores have a Renaissance asap. Instead of continuously launching new lines, Fender etc could partner more extensively with retailers and artists to promote guitar tuition for example, to drive sales. The new market is completely saturated with thousands of guitar models, and the pre-owned market is 1000 times more saturated! It's like we're being forced to focus on what model of guitar we play, instead of what music we're playing. We're at a turning point for sure, no doubt brought on at least in part by the pandemic. Support your local independent guitar store! 💗☄🤘🏼🎸
I just bought a IYV PRS copy off of Amazon. 150 delivered. It is amazing. Good luck, Fender.
My closest local store is GC. I’ll walk in there and mostly nobody notices or helps me and all the cool guitars I like are under lock and key. So I’ve purchased from Sweetwater, stores online, and through Reverb, all with great success. It’s a risk, yes, but I’ve gotten a feel for it. If I was near you, Mark, you can bet I’d be a loyal customer. Happy New Year!
Thanks.
Same. The local store I grew up with has closed so now the nearby place is GC but so many guitars are locked up, and I don't want to have to have someone unlock it and then stand there and have to wait for me to be done looking at it. Or, have someone unlock something just because I've never touched one and just want to see how heavy it is and then put it right back. Locking up everything is just not a fun experience.
The thing that is missing from an online sale is the inspection and set up piece. Guitars are funny things and the playing experience, especially for novice buyers can be altered significantly by a knowledgeable retailer making certain the action is properly set, the fret ends aren’t snagging you, the intonation is correct etc. The good guitar shops used to do those types of tweaks plus give advice on humidity levels and maintenance etc that was part of the guitar buying experience. That is all being lost.
Selling direct will definitely be helpful for them with the tariffs. I be shocked if there any sort of exemption for guitars. I’d be interested to see how the music industry as a whole will react.
Some of us are not lucky enough to have a nice/reliable/honest local music store to go to. I will admit to purchasing direct from fender because of this and thus far have had good experiences doing so- they check the guitar over with a check list and have had hassle free returns. However, I feel for you and hope that your local patrons are coming to you for their fender needs- I certainly would if I was local to your shop.
Interesting video as always! Gibson have been retailing exclusive models direct-to-consumer in the past few years as well. And, Fender already has at least one retail store, in Tokyo.
Love your channel, Mark. I ordered a Deluxe Reverb from their site a couple of years ago. Couldn’t find one in stock locally at the time, and they were running a promotion. I think the Sweetwater’s of the world will lose the most from Fender’s direct sales.
I disagree about Sweetwater. I always buy my stuff through Sweetwater if I can because I trust them and I want someone between me and the manufacturers. Sweetwater has my back. I don't trust Fender for sure. I've also become friends with my sales rep. I'd rather some of my money end up in his pocket than Fender's. Of course, Sweetwater is so large, they might lose the most money. And I understand why my logic would apply to those who have a local dealer they trust, which AFAIK I don't. Customer service matters. And overall, in my experience, it's getting worse. Amazon's used to be great. Not now. I've bought stuff Sweetwater doesn't carry from Amazon and also cheap pedals just to try them out. For the good stuff, the prices are the same and lots are being sold direct. I would guess the biggest gear threat is to boutique pedal companies. Both due to digital and cheap Made in China stuff. My sense is that it they will eventually, if it hasn't happened already, be just as good as the expensive ones. It reminds me of cheap Japanese transistor radios when I was a kid. Lots of junk, but not for long.
@@mikem668 I've had some weak Sweetwater experiences lately. And didn't the guy who founded the store retire? More bean counting and less quality of service going on.
@@ronj9448 agree. Sweetwater seems to be slipping in CS. My last couple of experiences have been less than average. Plus my reps have changed three times in the past few years. I don’t even know my rep.
Good insights Mark. I just had a similar conversation over in Europe 2 days ago. The situation seemed to be even worse. I'm not in the selling business and I’m not in the buying business either. I’m a muso who’s been around. Own about 10 guitars. 3 of them Fenders. Fender (not only) seem to be saturating the market plus fewer kids are into instruments it seems. I see a cliff edge ahead. … Good luck everyone.
Really appreciate all the great information. Where are you going to get set up and service. I support a smallish local store and prefer that. Would hate to see all the small shops disappear
Merry Christmas Mark!
Nicely done Marc
Merry Christmas Mark 👋🏼
Thank you for exposing these crooks. My local dealer is literally being driven out of selling fender now.
I was a Fender Fan boy but due to the fact the guitar I want is only online and I can't have delivery to home or work I now have no choice but to look at other brands such a Gibson and now Epiphone.
Eipiphone are making some awesome guitars in the higher price range but not yet the Gibson price, but defiantly as good as Gibson IMO.
Keep posting
Waiting for American Professional III series...
Fender & Gibson are the tip of the iceberg - the more brands who once relied on bricks and mortar 'local' stores promote their own on-line sales the more retail closures we will see - of course we're already seeing it. It's a terrible shame because in the '70s I worked as a guitar salesman in one NZ's better known music stores and the sense of community was strong and the opportunity for musicians (of all levels of proficiency) to actually try out and compare guitars was great. Sign of the times, sadly. I have only bought long distance / unplayed once (in 1992 - from Roger Sadowsky in New York, a boutique luthier brand at the time, now slightly expanded but still specialist) and I would hesitate to buy online unless the whole shipping / return policy was clearly set out given the room for QC error from the major high volume manufacturers. I live in HK so fortunately the 2 main flagship distributors carry a lot of stock (HK is a duty free port and the high turnover = discounts whenever a new batch of any given brand stock arrive - I picked up a 2019 Japanese Gretsch Player Series at 50% because 2 dozen of the new Chinese made solid bodies were launched) BUT I have noticed a bit of a thinning out of the ranks on certain models which are only available direct online from the brands . . . so it goes!
I liked it better when Fender had no options other than color. You found the one that felt good in your hands and sounded good to your ears and you bought it and that was the end of it. If you want to a Stratocaster now you've got about a dozen choices, to me it'd be if they just made one good one. I'm old Haha.
I agree. I’m 70 and remember when a Strat was a Strat and the same for Teles. So many options now and price levels it’s hard to keep track of . Buying by mail is a crapshoot.Sure return policies are generally good,it still is a pain
I was in the Shibuya showroom a couple weeks ago and what's interesting is what you don't see. They have a room devoted to custom shop (and guys wearing white gloves, it's Japan) but the lower floors are pretty bare. You can buy from a small selection, but realistically, the showroom is more of a proxy than a dealership. And being a Fender store, they discount like Sweetwater (never). To move things along, Fender JP continuously turns out limited models which, as far as I can tell, they offer to retailers as rewards for taking ordinary inventory. Buy 10 Mustangs and we'll sell you a limited Strat you can make money on. I wouldn't be surprised to see a trial Fender boutique in a low rent place like Las Vegas, but is it worth investing in brick and mortar just to cut out the middleman?
Do you deal in PRS? Bet you could sell a ton of SE and they still appreciate you by not selling direct.
So, does this redefinition and expansion of Fender retail at all bleed over into their policy for distribution and sales of Gretsch guitars?
I'm building Mexican guitars in the USA,,, lol, another great vid Marc
Great content and great commentary. However, your volume seems a little low for me? I say that as a question because I'm not sure that anyone else has the same thought. I have to really crank it to hear you it seems.
Hey Gary! Sweet vid. I love your channel!
There is a green Gretsch hollowbody hanging on the back wall. To the left. Gold trim.
Is it a country gentleman? Just curious. I used to have one and I had to sell it. I miss it:(
Very interesting analysis. I suppose you'll still have a LOT of used Fender guitars as a business, especially without Guitar Center. Fender isn't going to be buying used guitars, and what do they do with all the factory seconds? Unfortunately in my experience, the three American made deluxe Fender guitars I've bought, each had major technical flaws - like they are selling factory seconds as new, straight off of the line. That makes used a better deal assuming flaws have been fixed by previous owners.
What I'm wondering is has Fender solved the support issue with direct sales. Who will fix that mis-cut nut under warranty?
Any authorized Fender dealer has to fix any Fender product that is under warranty regardless where it was purchased, as long as it was a Fender dealer.
@@mars6433 Yep, had an amp fixed a few years ago under warranty by an 'authorized' dealer....
If you’re taking a guitar into a shop for a mis-cut nut… you have problems besides a bad nut
@@mars6433
I think what is actually asking is who is going to be doing the authorized repair work once smaller shops go out of business.
@@misterknightowlandco why is that? you think everyone has the time to try to develop luthier skills and buy the tools you need to replace a nut?
A new American Standard used to be $1200 CAD in 2010. The American Pros are going for $2500 CAD today. Wages haven't doubled in that time. Will people
be buying a CNC streamlined piece of wood for $5000 in 2040?
@@DNKOTOR this is why boutique brands such as Reverend, G&L and others are much better values for money. For the $1200 you can get the equivalent of fender custom Shop quality from these brands. Let Fender isolate themselves, and simply ignore them. Let them become the joke of the industry. It's kind of dumb all the hand ringing about fender doing this or that, they are a name and a legacy, they're not God, or the god of the music industry. There will always be a market for the old stuff, nostalgia, but if they keep in their ways, their future will diminish.
@therealtech833 Do you feel the Nostalgia Market will fade with Boomers and Gen X?
There may be shrinking Collector's Markets and smaller pockets of players that seek out Grandpa's gear.
@@emilychanfan it stands to reason with older gear becoming more rare, there will always be a market for it, to your point, not sure how big a market. However that does not help fender selling guitars today. I personally do not have a desire to purchase a pre-cbs strat. But some say for example, as wood ages it gets a boutique sound to it, etc. I just don't like noisy electronics and I find that older stuff needs to be refurbished, otherwise it can be very noisy. Scratchy volume pots, grounding corrosion, worn frets, not for me.
@therealtech833 That's the reason I mention the Nostalgia Market versus the Collector Market.
Younger players today, and in the future, won't share the nostalgic feelings because they most likely didn't cut their teeth with those guitars. There is little connectivity to the past for them.
All markets are cyclical.
@@emilychanfan When buyers are too young to persuade with nostagia, you have to convince them that old guitars are worth more simply because they're old. Even if they weren't any good to begin with. So far, It's working, but have no nostalgia for the Teisco I grew up with. Paid $60 for it new and if I could buy it back sixty years later, I'd still pay $60 for it.
As a Fender dealer. Not sure if I wanna continue.
Wish had a good shop like you close to me.
I've been playing for 34 years. I still haven't played a Fender that impressed me enough to buy it. I do have an amp, though.
Bring it back to America! Make legacy guitars like they used to make, quality guitars that can be passed down one generation to another. They can of course also make a budget friendly guitar. It’s time to start bringing back companies that built their brand in America back to America.
Had the choice of ordering a guitar online and getting it before Christmas, or through a brick and mortar store and get the guitar after Christmas. I chose the latter, to help keep brick and mortar stores open. You need to feel your guitar before you buy it, and that’s a lot of returns and time wasted buying online.
The Gibson Garage is a perfect example of this. Direct sales, and their own store.
Companies like Fender have “diluted” their brand. Every year they come out with new models that aren’t all that different than the year before - except the price... Furthermore, Fender (Squire) guitars built in Asia are much better than they used to be. As a result, it will become more and more difficult for people to justify paying the high prices for an American-made guitar.
Their guitars also vastly range in weight for the same model. Might find a 7lb Mexican strat or a 9.5lb one. They don't pick their woods and they keep making guitars from bad cuts. Their qc is awful. Their American ones are better, but still feel cheaper than an s2 prs, or gibson sg. (Prices of those models are close to each other).
For me I like to own both USA and import Strats. Neither are actually technically better. Just different especially if you do mods and pickup changes
The fender squire relationship in build quality is reminiscent of the Gibson Epiphone relationship in the 90’s. As Squire becomes more China heavy expect a quality drop off. Initial Chinese runs are generally great for the first two years then the quality control just drops off
Fender squire are NOT much better than they used to be, the early Korean ones were great, the Japanese ones were good, the Indonesian CV ones were actually really nice...they've always put our decent guitars like someone else said at the start of a run. The Chinese will start putting out absolute CRAP as soon as the initial run is over.
Prices have to come down all around and they will when people stop buying.
It seems there is room for smaller regional guitar manufacters to replace Fender and Gibson that can sell through local outlets. Let a thousand small guitar companies bloom.
Exactly. It's time for new players. Fender banks on the fact that they were one of the "first in" makers of guitars. Most people, especially online are obsessed with collecting vintage ones because of this phenomenon. But once you start building your own guitars, putting them together yourself, you realize that that a great playing guitar takes precedence over a name. It's not magic to put together a great guitar, you just great parts and some skill. Let collectors have their own space and have more local makers.
Thanks for keeping us in the loop with this stuff. It's pretty depressing, but I guess that's life. Seems like getting more money for shareholders is harming pretty much everything in every industry.
Amazon gets to sell the new Squier Debut series, and I'm guessing they'll be selling a lot of them at $129 for a bass and a little less for a guitar, so FMIC's changes may not affect Amazon in the same way as music stores and other retailers. I was surprised GC lasted this long after Bain saddled them with debt. Other businesses, like Toys R Us and Payless, went under from this kind of vulture capitalism, but GC is still standing, more or less - at least, enough to sell part of to Aries. * sigh *
So basically they are closing the gap between U.S. and Mex. Having said that my Pro 2 tele compared to a player 2 is night and day, not even close which justifies it costing almost twice as much. I hope they don’t compromise U.S. made instruments or raise the prices going forward.
Fender stores would hurt the shops that have put Fender where they are.
Thanks Mark!
i'll just wait for a good used git to show up in a store like Garys and play it get their opinion if it been modded. don't mind that but ya got to do a good job and keep the original stuff and it going into the price
I only buy Squier Classic Vibe's. They are the best bang for the buck most coming out of Indonesia. Unlike some, I could care less if a guitar is manufactured in the USA as I now live in the Philippines. All I care about is quality for the money. Fender better watch themselves because Tokai Japan is on the horizon and guitar players are catching on.
Tokai Japan has been around for a very long time. The problem is they're very hard to find in America. The Tokai-Love series which is or at least was made in China is an exceptionally nice instrument, but not up to the Japanese standards in my experience. I have a Squier CV 50's Strat I bought new for 350 bucks years ago. It has the best sounding Strat pickups I've ever heard. The guitar itself though, overall.....pretty cheezee. Thin neck, thin body, and cheapo hardware.
I dont know how guitar shops can do it anymore
Buying a guitar by remote is the WORST thing you can do.
If they have experienced repair staff, then they'll always have a place in the economy despite the ongoing deathblows to brick and mortar. Guitar Center repair work is 50% getting shipped to a major city for repairs and 50% inexperienced wrencher on staff who'll bow your neck because he knows you don't know what a proper truss rod adjustment should look like/feel like/cost.
@@danielsalisbury245 Fender guitars have a factory setup with is rarely perfect or ideal. A shop usually includes a setup with any purchase of a guitar.
My local mom and pop is making most of their money on repairs and lessons. They also sell a lot of used gear, now.
Support your local dealer; order a Fender through them.
Fender are making a mistake going direct. Think of all the costs associated with processing transactions, deliveries, returns, customer service, faults, warranty issues…. It would make more sense for brick n mortars stores to continue to increase their on line transactions effectively for the manufacturers. I’ve not bought an instrument from a shop visit since the 90’s and I’ve spent multiple thousands on gear over the last 25 years. What does everyone else think? Change can be hard to predict. 😊👍🏼
Retail markups more than make up for the added cost for Fender. Brick and mortar is in bad shape and doesn't look to be improving.
@ I am not convinced. Supplying direct to thousands of customers with one off transactions is a whole different business to supplying a smaller number of dealers with regular /bulk transactions. The costs and logistics will be crippling. IMHO. Let’s see what happens. The answer could be Fender supplying a smaller number of strategically located super dealers who would be better equipped to specialise in servicing the end user transactions. I dunno. Its interesting. I certainly think Fender might have over diversified. Too many variants. 👍🏼🎸
I watched a video about the direct to consumer trend with Nike and how it hasn’t gone well for them and while that’s still an option for customers, Nike is putting more of a focus on their retail partners again. Might be something we see with Fender in a few years.
very good point
sooooo, 40% markup of $60 doesn't get you to $100, but I get your point. My feeling is that many guitar players who purchase a new guitar want to hold it in their hands before putting out the cash. My personal experience was with an online purchase from Amazon for a very well reviewed, highly rated budget guitar. It arrived and I knew within the first 2 minutes that I didn't have a connection with this instrument. Had I walked into my local bricks and mortar store I would have had the opportunity to realize this without the time, hassle and disappointment of this situation happening in the first place. I honestly will be heartbroken if my local music store becomes nonviable because of online retail.
@@raygranger5 we calculate margin from the sale price. Of the retail price of 100, 40 is 40%
Geetar Gorilla loves tales of the greatest guitar company ever in the univers!!!!! 🎸🎸🎸🎸🎸🎸
How many people are buying direct? How much sales have been lost by dealers?
Here in Europe Thomann sell an average of 750 guitars a week. That’s a lot of sales over a year (38k?) plus amps, accessories etc.Their customer service is excellent and they have their own QC department which makes it really attractive. Plus the big UK retailers have good online operations as well - PMT, Anderson’s etc.
I don't envy you man. If I was going to do it I'd post up as a lutherie and amp repair shop, and buy, sell, and fix used gear. Greed is king, service is not as appreciated as it once was.
I noticed you can buy Fender on their website. They are now selling returns on their Reverb channel as well. "Certified Returns" or something like that. I don't buy Fender custom shop for $4,000+. Illogical. I did buy over the summer a Vintage Squire Tele for $300.00. I swear there is nothing wrong with it so I had to buy it. It was crazy. I think it is made in China. Played it at a few jam sessions and felt relaxed about it getting damaged vs my G&L which I baby. Ten years ago I bought a used Hamer import for $200.00 and that has been wonderful to play. Past inventory is the biggest threat. There is too much.
@@ronj9448 G&L 👍🏼
Thanks, there is nothing in the store on 12/272024 but had Christmas Day sales comments... You were one of 150 lucky buyers.
The Certified Returns on Reverb are done through a third party, who already sold refurbished Fenders.
Basically, they get the seal of approval, can charge extra because of this, which Fender gets a cut of, without Fender seeing a single guitar before they're sold on.
It's literally a licensing agreement sold as a Fender operation.
@@bucklberryreturns Hey Buck. Really? They sure looked real flashing that "Fender" every which way. And they sent me discount offers. I guess Fender is just a name to buy/sell with like Gretsch.
@@ronj9448 Yeah, it's true enough.
They are genuine 2nd hand Fenders, but Fender does no repairs or anything to them, doesn't touch or see them before they're resold under their approval.
I think the established well known brands will survive but there are so many good manufacturers out there with lower overheads that produce good quality guitars as for the high street shops they are up against it, I worry for these retailers they have high overheads, and in the UK they are being taxed out of business by succesive governments.
Always saw it as crazyness to say the least, people that buy fenders and gibsons as investiment assets. These instruments are way overpriced just like the stock market alright tho but it makes no sense to me at all a electric guitar costing more than $5.000 no matter the year was made. Maybe 100-150 years from now these instruments will achieve a REAL high value but that's way too long term for investiments return. Btw : out of topic here but just responding one of your last videos
Subscribed!
How many People are buying direct from Fender? How much have store sales declined as a result?
I bought thru them during Christmas Sales four times in December. When they offer their second best gig bag for $48 instead of $119 it's a no brainer. They were marking down stuff from 10-60%. That guitar bag was like 70% off.
I got 5 fender Mexican guitars this year online and they are all great guitars. However, I don’t see myself buying another Fender guitar after all that, I have enough.
There’s only so many real guitar players to go around and we don’t grow on trees and neither does money. Strange times.
We cannot forget that Nike followed the strategy to be directly focused on consumers and let a big whole openned on retail stores! Competitor took advantage of that and now Nike is failing miserably.
The Fender store here in Tallahassee closed down about around 2008. It sold Fender only! They won’t come back!
I think Fender and Squier will have problems if quality standards slip further. In fact the only Fender Squier guitars on my list are Classic Vibe'snout of Indonesia. Fender needs to watch out for Tokai Japan whose quality is high.
I see a day when even the custom shops of these guitar companies move overseas, NOTHING will be left in the USA. But what concerns me the most is what I see whenever I visit a music store or guitar show: Virtually no one under the age of 35 is there. We have become a nation of gamers, home of the thirty year old man-child. This is the biggest threat to our hobby, the lack of new blood coming in to it. I see a drastic fall off in buying in the not so distant future. We are drowning in a sea of guitars that there are no buyers for.
UN Lima Agreement 1975 .. all targets almost now met. it's a shocker 😳 explains a lot. google it 🙏
Unless it's a custom guitar that I order, I would rather walk into a music store with my strap and play the guitar. I live in MA so I'll drop in on you sometime. Great videos you produce.
Fender and Gibsons biggest competition is all of their own guitars on the second hand market. My Fender player plus Strat is awesome.
As trade agreements/regulations around the world change, a return to better made North American products with better qc is possible
I find more deals on Apple at Bestbuy than Apple store. Feel that would be the same with Fender. And I don't mean the short-lived Bestbuy musical instruments area😂.
I will buy from a store as long as it's not GC
Bottom line is money.They want their shareholders to have more money in their pockets. This will come back to bite them. when no one can go to a shop ant try guitars, then i see a lot of smaller shops will go to the wall. i think what they will see by going direct selling is their actual sales per year will drop hugely. why. because most of their sold stock is already in the hands of the shop owners who bought them to sell in their shops. what you have to all do is when fender rep comes to your shop is tell him to f***off and go sell his goods online, and dont come back here again. if you shops all do that, they will realise big time what they have done. There are many great guitar builders out there we dont need fender that badly. Fender have to realise that they sell so much because of these shops. Greedy corporations.
this strategy cost nike billions. let them loose it.
The problem is that, when I was a teenager in the 80's when you played guitar in high-school (and if you were any good) you were the shit! You were on the same level as the starting Quarterback on the varsity team. You got all the girls and everyone wanted to be your friend. You were a "Micro-Superstar". Nintendo and Rap came along and everything changed. Rock became Jazz and the guitar became the saxophone. Yeah, kids still play it and it's still cool but given a choice, it's video games with their online friends. When you go into a music store now all you see is a bunch of Boomers and Gen X'ers. We're retired or approaching it. We're not the demographic for sustainability of a company. Plus there are way more companies that are vying a piece of the dwindling market. Companies like Fender and Gibson have to fight as hard as they can and keep up with the modernization of how young people shop if they expect to stick around. Let's face it. The Boomers are in the process of dieing off, us Gen X'ers are in the process of retiring and for the most part our buying days are behind us. So you're going to have to deal with it because time and life marches on.
I’m Gen X too and you’re correct and it’s also true of a lot of our hobbies and interests from our youth and adulthood.
@@JefferyHagen Definitely, look at classic cars. Go to any car show and the average age is sixty something.
Nd all those expensive high dollar classic cars are going to plummet in value because us gen xers don't give a crap about street rods and stuff the boomers spend big money on.
@ I’m a Gen Xer and I remember some of my friends who could do their own work had some classic cars and I really wanted one, but even back in 1984 ( I was 19) it was an expensive endeavor and one friend even told me he couldn’t park it anywhere like a mall or something without worrying if someone would damage it . I see a major collapse on all of these toys too.
When Fender and the other brands bumped prices up they destroyed the used market for individuals because everything froze. People instantly thought their 350$ MIM was worth 500$ overnight. Well, Now they’re reaping what they’ve sown. They chose overpricing a few sales over making many consumer friendly sales. It’s made the consumer more aware of the MBA influence. I heard fender was undercutting used gear on reverb. Lolz
If I was to buy a strat these days, I'd build a Warmoth.
Those some pretty bitter guys at GC, I'll never go back there. They give you no assistance whatsoever. Make an amp feedback and be prepared to defend yourself.
No one wants to hear you cranking up a tube amp. If I was a customer at said store and you were cranking an amp loud enough to get feedback… I’d probably leave. We all know what a Marshall does and it’s annoying as shyt for you to try and do it in a damn store.
@@misterknightowlandco Thanx__ever_hear_of_headroom?....You_can_tell_a_lot_about_the_tonal_quality_from_pushing_an_amp.__But_as_you're_clearly_a_know_nothing_GS_employee_you_wouldn't_know_about_that
Really?? And who is everyone...exactly? You mean the employees? What about other brands like, I don't know, say Supro? What sort of headroom do they have? I can't determine what the thing sounds like until I get feedback and then back it off a little. No one that knows anything about amps would approach it otherwise.
Fender store… No thanks. I prefer the real deal: old carpet, drop ceilings, and used guitars. The way it should be 🤙🤙🤙🤙🤙
Gary 😎
so , if we can buy directly from fender, we don't have to pay your 60% markup? Sounds good to me.
That's not how it works. The end price is the same. Fender gets more money for their private equity ownership group and stores lay off employees.
Dream on.
I lost interest in fender years ago.
Back in the mid 90s they made sweet guitars.
But, their top tier strats these days are not even close.
How many guitars are their in the world? Has to be increasing. They keep pumping them out but the old ones don’t deplete like cars. And not everyone is a collector
👍👍👍
American made Fender basses still rule the world…
I went out looking to buy an American made Strat and came out with a Player II MIM Strat because it was just better than the Americans I was playing.
Always let the feel decide for you.
@@GarysGuitarsUSA For sure. I just put a set of 57'/62' pickups in it and it is all the Strat I will ever need - not that that will stop me from getting more ha.
Has anyone ever told you your voice sounds like Tom Hanks?
So, you're saying I sound like a movie star? I'll take it! When I did a voiceover in a movie once, I sounded like James Spader.
I’m not a big fan of Fender and don’t even own one anymore. I’ve never owned a Fender for very long. I just don’t like to play them for 3 hours. I cannot get on with their necks. I do like their amps, though.
Ask Nike about going direct.