I should clarify that Mxy doesn't directly refer to the time stream as being the fourth dimension he just says its time but it is called the fourth dimension in other issues. Which is what that reasoning is based off. Anyway as usual give me some ideas for videos you'd like to see in the future and don't forget to subscribe if you want to see more.
WebCamParrot do you think that it’s possible that mxy may just be posturing some of the time, in a way to sort of flex on other characters? It seems like he has a surface level understanding of the universe now.😂
"Hey, have you heard of this God. It's power is beyond anything you know. Hear buy this issue." "Okay thanks, I'll start reading this right now" 5 Minutes later: "Hey, have you heard of this God. It's power is beyond anything you know. Hear buy this issue." "But you just solid me a issue fallow this new God threat. Dude it's been min" "Hey, have you heard of this God. It's power is beyond anything you know. Hear buy this issue."
trexrising 40 99% of the people watching this video weren’t even alive back then. None of us remember it because we weren’t even alive to experience it in the first place
Fr might just stop versus debating, this is getting dumb... What happened to true infinity? Final heaven? Things beyond fictional transcendence? So they can keep adding stuff to no end? This is redundant
DC Writer 1: My character can solo the omniverse! DC Writer 2: My character can solo the multi-omniverse! DC Writer 3: My character can solo the omni-omniverse! STAHP
@@redjirachi1 then there's a blessing that destroys all of them without difficulty. Memes, examples of them being chuck Norris, shaggy, etc and these *meme users* would solo all of fiction.
Bro you post some of the best content seriously, thanks for all the effort and hard work. Also i don't know if you're interested in any Marvel stuff, but a Dr. Doom video would be cool imo
This is some really well-made content. I like to think that I do have pretty decent understanding of the DC multiverse/alternate timelines/alternate dimensions. But damn, this was pretty in-depth and well explained.
Just understand the basic transcendances and the ladder, you'll be fine. Like The Source > Overvoid > Final Haven > Oversphere etc then when you have time, you can take a detailed look at each realm
Excellent explanation, DC is really huge, the largest and infinite among all other comics. The sphere of gods is insanely large, even greater than the beyond realm of marvel
Can you imagine a thousand years from now how our descendants will view the ancient people's way of writing stories of gods? Also DC Comics will be in the public domain by the time just like mythological stories so, lucky.
We know in marvel gods are extradimensional beings with massive super powers and their realms are normal universes with own time-space continuum. In dc those are dimensionless/outerversal archetypal platonic concept beings transcending time and space beyond concept of dimensionans. if u "kill" olympian then u got his/her powers inheriting concept etc.
In even recent comics like the metal and death metal series or injustice series it's mentioned there are infinite universes inside bleed. So those youtubers are retconned easily.
@@slimmy478-6 how so? he gave plenty evidence that contradicts the misconception of there only being 52 universes lmfao yet you’re still in denial and claim he’s wanking the verse
Thank you. I'm glad there are channels out there like yours that are willing to take an unbiased look and study on Cosmologies. We need more channels like yours.
This is all amazing and also makes my head hurt 😁 At a certain point I just have to tap out and be thankful someone else is keeping track of the metaphysics so I can sit back and enjoy the “show.”
Hey parrot love to see you back Enjoyed bobobo Been going back to your old content can’t wait for more. After rewatch your multiverse video I have two Questions: 1. Do you see the bleed as high hyperversal or outerversal? Been seeing arguments for both 2. There’s multiple outerversal realms so was wondering when does the cosmology hits High Outerversal (in your opinion)
Thank you for this vid. Idk much about DC but I like the universe and the stories and this has helped me out a lot. Love your vids. Would be great if you could do similar ones to educate us poor people to specific events that happens in the DC Universe
One thing that's hard for me to understand is how an infinite is less and is within another infinite, for example an infinite multiverse within an infinite megaverse. An infinite has no upper number so transcending that is kinda hard for me to understand. Thanks for this btw, u hv my full support
it's worth mentioning that the observable universe is just that - the OBSERVABLE Universe. We don't actually know how big our universe is because there's only so far we can see
Okay now I'm wondering if I can suss out what having a timecube instead of a timeline could mean. Logically, we are to presume a "timecube" has a relationship to our timeline the way a standard mathematical line and cube are related. A line is one-dimensional, and a cube is three-dimensional. Lets say a plane is two-dimensional, to make it a little easier to conceptualize. A "timeline" is a progression of events that happen one after another in order one way, or in order the other way, like how a mathematical line is a list of all points in order. According to Wikipedia, one property of planes and their relationship to lines is that "A line is either parallel to a plane, intersects it at a single point, or is contained in the plane", which seems to imply a timeplane would by necessity consist of the timelines which are contained within the plane, as opposed to those which intersect it at a single point or run parallel. This means timelines which are parallel are not necessarily included in the timeplane. Maybe, then, it could be said that a "time-plane" is an infinite set of identical, concurrent, infinite timelines; that is to say, a set of unique universes where the same crucial chronological events happen, at the exact same "time"s, but in an uncountably large number of timelines with an inconceivably variable number of players? A set of universes where historically the same specific time-crucial events happen, but not with the same people, or for the same reasons, or in the same places, necessarily. Sort of, a basket of all timelines that feel the same when you run your hand over them, regardless of how they look. This would thus, if my idea is to be believed, imply time is immutable and has explicit characteristics and "fixed points" which must happen across the set of timelines, regardless of who is involved in their expression -- a "texture" of sorts, which time is sure to exhibit -- and that coming from outside the timeline, "intersecting" with it once and altering the course of even one fixed event could catastrophically impact the other, necessarily parallel fixed events throughout the other timelines. A "timecube", interestingly, could then mean a few things. I mean, obviously, because what the flying fuck is a "timecube", but -- you know what I mean. On the one hand, it could mean all parallel series of the timeplanes I just described -- a set of every possible timeplane, with every set of possible necessary timelines. Anything that could possibly count as a fixed event is certainly a fixed event somewhere in one of the infinite timelines, meaning a timeplane exists made of all timelines with those same fixed events (think, "basket of all timelines that feel the same"). The timeplane is a component of the larger timecube, along with all other planes where fixed points in time work that way (think, "all possible baskets of timelines that feel any way at all"). Fundamentally changing time in such a way that the particular nature of fixed events is changed, for example, would impact the timecube, being that such a change affects what counts as fixed events, which are the criteria for determining sets of timelines, and the timecube is the set of all possible sets of timelines. If that makes sense (it doesn't). But that's if you interpret a cube to be a translation of a plane into 3D; If you interpret "cube' as "hollow series of faces" as opposed to "solid consistent mass of planes" a timecube could also mean a set of six timeplanes that form some constituent reality or ultimately interact in some way to each other, in a higher or lower dimension. This is a little more interesting to me because it seems to imply a sense of order or intention in the arrangement of certain sets of timelines (timeplanes) such that they interact perfectly perpendicularly with each other and create something else. Like, lets try and step back and conceptualize literally what this could entail in a comic book. I could understand the idea of a square "being threatened" if someone wanted to destroy one of its sides, so I can grasp an analogue threat to a timecube if a timeline/timeplane is in danger by a time-exterior threat. If a timeline is fundamentally altered in such a way that all necessarily parallel timelines are also compromised (by, say, making a wish that made all timelines inhospitable to intelligent or complex life forms, making the necessary fixed time events impossible), then it stands to reason timelines that run perpendicularly (sharing exactly no similarities besides a single harmonious fixed point shared between timelines) would also be impacted, albeit infinitely less frequently. And I could also probably understand how there could be a group of creator-type beings introduced in a comic who live within the specific balance between timelines inherent to their constructed timecube, and must therefore protect it from intersecting/errant timelines. but some extratemporal threat has arisen and they need help. Etc.
This 100% shows the Overvoid is the omniversal canvas of fiction. Holding infinite anti-matter, dark, & positive realities is just a drip in the cosmology. Mister Mxyzptlk literally proved himself as a singularity in existence as he showed he appeared in brands like LEGO’s & video games.
Actually I just found a statement by grant Morrison stating that the overvoid actually has other fictions like marvel but idk if that's changed but I did find that statement.
🏆Absolute brilliance.💎This is soo deeply complex & well presented. It could give a Univ. of Oxford 'DPhil' viva presentation a run for its money.🏅Beautifully stellar speaking voice, as well, super relaxing.🎯Bravo.
@@hashiondiscord8540 Ya and he did it with prep time give me any situation any person Batman has to fight Batman with prep time>Toaa there's your meme by the way.lol
Time cubed, from what I understand, can only exist in a multiverse. In our regular 3 dimensions there is length, height, and depth as the x,y, and z axis. Hypertime or time cubed in a multiverse sense can be explained as all the possible past events being x, all possible present events being y, and the possible future events being z. In this way something able to exist and maneuver in that cube can be anywhere and anywhen in the multiverse at a whim by triangulating 3 points in time to get a fixed timeline connecting those points, of course if you were outside the cube and could traverse it the more points known the better for getting a more precise timeline.
This video does not show any evidence that the sphere of the gods is 1-A, perhaps the Phantom Zone, but it is not enough to assert that the entire sphere of the gods is 1-A. And the fact that some realms in the sphere of the gods are beyond space does not necessarily mean a transcendence of any degree, but more than one degree of space - the three-dimension. The Bleed is an element supporting the fact that the sphere of the gods is a transcendent realm, since the Bleed, according to Grant Morrison, is the Bulk in the Brane cosmology, whose idea is that our 3D universe is a brane existing in a higher dimension of space called the Bulk, containing all extra dimensions, so other universes. Like DC Cosmology. But what is not explained is the fact that Brane cosmology explains the weakness of gravity relative to electromagnetic, weak and strong nuclear force. Unlike the last three forces being enclosed in a brane, gravity exists in the Bulk and, therefore, "spreads" in all geometrical dimensions (D-branes) within the Bulk. Asserting that the Sphere of the Gods is not "beyond" only to more than one degree, but to any degree, so is a transcendent realm. Consequently, outside of space and time itself.
M'gann M'orzz But knowing that vsbattle wiki is re-visioning its tiering system, I don't know if to transcend space or dimensions will remain a thing for a character to be 1-A/Outerversal.
At first I thought the speed of light in the DC universe is the same speed then the one in real life until watched seththeprogammer video and he States the light in DC is faster than the one in real life
I definitely would've never known anything of this bcuz I'm too lazy to look through all the comics LoL but this was awesome and I'm just waiting for a batman vid LoL
196,833-dimensional snowflake is probably a reference to the SCP Foundation, which has 169,834 dimensions... Or did the SCP Foundation reference this comic?
At 6:52 ..196833 dimensions is probably a reference to a huge mathematical structure called the "Moster Group" which is the biggest simple sporadic group living n 196883 dimensions... Which was described by John Conway as being a "spiky" christmas tree ornament... Glad to see writers referencing higher math (together with the Alephs later in the video )
Two sentences: There is this new God more powerful then any before on palette swapped earth coming straight for us. We'll let everything die a couple of times until someone can calm them down, teach them emotions or retcon their existence.
I'm not sure if you mentioned it, but one thing I seem to remember from doomsday clock is dr Manhattan saying there's basically a dark metaverse or multiverses.
The leviathan of stories is basically just the concept for SCP 3812 which is essentially and entity that continually rises higher in the chain of stories transcending endless fictions of fiction forced to transcend even itself
@@brandoncruse8532 They say they arent canon because Mike Carey's series isnt "official" but it was indeed PUBLISHED by DC so...idk but to me it should be canon
Nice video, though I do have a question. In Green Lantern: New Guardians, Kyle Rayner travels beyond the Source Wall to refuel to emotional spectrum with the entities. Should that not require a heck ton of energy more than the entities provide? I’m not that familiar with anything DC outside of Kyle Rayner and Morrison’s 90s JLA run.
The Lantern Entities are actually implied to be absurdly powerful. The Spectre was scared of Paralax for instance after they shared Hal Jordan's body. I'd have to do more research on them to say for sure how strong they should be but that level of power isn't that outrageous.
are the Oversphere & Leviathan of Stories even part of DC? I did some googling and they appear to be from Vertigo comics called The Filth & The Unwritten. The Vertigo universe doesn't necessarily include every comic Vertigo has ever published any more than Star Wars is part of the Marvel multiverse
@@ugurkaraalioglu2813 Yeah well good for you I still don't understand how they work, just that one is above the other. This reminds me when I tried to understand Marvel's cosmology, which I still haven't. It hurts my head to think that these writers can just come up with such ridiculous stuff.
@@callums1235 i know for certain marvel isnt on par. and tell me about the others, do they have a omniverse as vast as dc. it's not enough to just have infinite universes and dimensions, im talking as vast as dc in its entirety including the leviathan of stories. dont forget, dc as a whole includes more than just "conventional dc", it also includes other comic books like wild storm and vertigo that dc bought. lucifer himself encountered countless multiverses beyond the presence own creation which would include everything within the source wall. the only verses i can think of that are likely on par with dc, is the doctor who verse and the cthulhu mythos verse. marvel and image are close though.
Zubair Lkaderi Joke Battles Wiki contains all of fiction and nonfiction, including DC. There are many DC articles on JBW so the Leviathan of stories would be contained within it, as well as all of Cthulhu since Azathoth has an article as well. I don’t know shit about Suggsverse except it has beings beyond omnipotence and its poorly written, so I’m told. I’ve never actually read any of it. SCP has quite a lot to it like infinite dimensions, a layer above that, a layer above that and a layer above that. There are also beings that see all of that as fiction so that’s another layer of reality in the SCP cosmology but I doubt it’s as vast as DC considering DC has been around a lot longer. I don’t know much about Marvel and Image cosmology so I’ll just take your word for it.
@@callums1235 joke battle wiki? is that a verse or a wiki page. but if its a "joke" than i guess its gag factor would put it above dc. however dc also contained non fiction as well as fiction. towards the end of this video we see that dc in its entirety extends to the real life writers even beyond the over void which itself is a real life thing (black pages of the paper). so given that the presence is omnipotent but he himself is transcended by higher entities such as the writers..etc shows that dc also has beings beyond omnipotence. SCP reminds me alot like the leviathan of stories by your description so id say its on par with dc rather than above it. btw azathoth transcends fiction. the lore of his character is that all that there is, is simply a part of his dream and that should he wake up, all that would remain is him. marvel and image are like dc without the leviathan of stories part.
@@LeaderOfTheLostSouls the presence is omnipotent, he's all powerful, all knowing and all present WITHIN dc. hes surpassed only by beings that surpass "conventional" dc. omnipotence in fiction is different to whats considered omnipotence in real life. considering dc is not real and is unaffected by other verses, the presence can be omnipotent within the bounds of dc. same way the one above all is omnipotent within marvel, the man of miracles within image and so on. this is fictional omnipotence so dont try bring in non fiction laws.
Wait, the Earth is the center of the universe in DC? I knew we were pissing off Albert Einstein due to how many characters can not only go faster than light, but somehow see despite how much the light would lag. But now we're pissing off Galileo as well!
Also; When it gets into the metanarrative storytelling aspect layers... How does this coexist with Dream of the Endless, who is, by his very nature, the... Creator? Source? Of stories within DC/Vertigo? It feels to me as if there'd be some kind of... Link, there, surely?
pretty much for anything past the source what canon and what isn't does not matter at all it's basically an infinite place or whatever you wanna call it beyond all comprehension which contains every single possibility there ever was and ever will be so pretty much I think its fair to say is linked
And when we get a crossover with another comic or film universe, like Marvel , the Dc universe touches or temporarily is melded with a universe from a separate Omniverse of multiverses. Something that only happens when conditions are exactly right.... usually involving vast cosmic forces...
Great video, Though I still disagree a little about the six dimension is beyond The Source, We saw in justice league The Source contains infintie multiverses and Perpetua just one of it agents whose purpose is to create multiverse in The Source
4:20 I wonder. How does this relate to the Lucifer comics, and his conversation with Destiny of the Endless, or even the concept of Destiny of the Endless in general? The above seemed to imply a more deterministic worldview, including divine predestination atop of that - action and reaction binding all in a singular motion of causality, inescapable even to the Devil himself, despite his best efforts. (**Spoilers**: Although in the end, it could be argued he does succeed, by escaping into the Overvoid... Buuuuut then they brought him back in a sequel a few years ago with the very tone of his character fundamentally changed. But let's not get into that) Anyhow, what I was trying to say: Doesn't 4:20 kind of throw a wrench into said deterministic worldview?
How can the overvoid be both the crack the Greg freely made, the flat 2D verse for the high other other beings, and just a piece of paper for the eonymous? I'm guessing that it's all them at once and that all three of these things are in only one layer of the leviathan of the stories?
And also the part with flash the imaginary axis already did that he said he can run faster than a Planck instant and he added scientific information to it
Great video i love it really Welk done and i wanted to ask about the Omniverse which has been in DC recently in the Justice League comic where does it reside in DC
Man.... This video made me question life and think about how nothing really matters. We could all be a spec in the grand scheme of things. Only here to entertain the ones outside of our existence and that our very being is nothing more but a random chance in the infinite possibilities of all of reality. It's fucking scary and pretty depressing to think about if I'm to be honest.
So to simplify: "We made a layer of existence outside another layer of existence outside another second layer of existence where supposedly time either doesn't exist or is just straight up non-linear and chaotic yet for some reason characters can interact with themselves inside of it as if time existed like we experience it in our physical real life counterpart realm. Oh, and we also made another layer of existence that kinda breaks the 4th wall too."
How about doing a power scaling on a different anime character:Dio Brando. Including Heaven Ascended Dio who I’m confident that can defeat Saitama and Superman(but not Constantine)
Mobius _ Post Crisis Superman and below. Heaven Ascended Dio can rewrite reality... Oh wait,Darkseid can do the same. But he can still defeat New 52 Superman and below.
Just to clear up quickly: The DC Universe doesn't actually touch *our* universe at any point. The writers of DC don't exist within the DC Universe. Meta-fiction is really, *really* fucking stupid.
Personally I think meta-fiction is really interesting so long as you realise that it is just that - fiction. Any of the "writers" that appear in DC comics are of course only fictional characters not legitimate real people in our world. It's just that for the purposes of the cosmology much of DC is created by them writing these characters and obviously that would place their world above their creations world. Grant Morrison started using meta-fiction because he wanted a way to connect with the audience without having to resort to things like drama or violence. That's why for instance the Thought Robot reaches his hand out to the page and hears the breathing of the audience. Morrison wanted the reader to feel like they were directly involved in the events of the comic. It's cool I definitely fuck with it.
@@WebCamParrot It is really interesting and fun to read, but the second you go beyond the very first layer of meta-fiction (a fictional version of the author being in the story) and start making that fictional author beneath another, bigger fictional thing, it just gets absurd and ridiculous.
I mean it's not like this author above an author thing is really connected to the narrative in DC at all it just exists as separate stories that happen to come together this way cosmologically. And from a cosmological perspective there isn't really anything wrong with that. The only exception to this is the Unwritten which is centred on the idea that EVERYTHING is a story just from different perspectives and so naturally the world one author lives in would HAVE to be below another world with another author ad infinitum because there is no difference between story and reality in the Unwritten and every possible story exists within the Leviathan. I don't think any of that is absurd or ridiculous from a writing perspective, it's damn well written actually.
Wait, you're telling me The Filth is not only part of the Multiverse, but is one of the HIGHEST plains of existence? Makes sense. Felt high reading that book...
So basically, make it as complex as it can be in order to attempt to create stories using all those structures with the final purpose of continuing to create comics virtually forever. Because, if it wasn't complex, it would end, if it would end, no more jobs or profit or money. I am confused now more than ever but I guess that was the purpose of it all. I am too low dimensional and plane of existence, and I can't comprehend.
@@هاشمباسلهاشم honestly, it should be stronger than the writer, but I really don't think it's ever going to be mentioned in mainline DC. It is Canon, and it is most likely stronger than the writer, but you don't really have to worry about it. The last thing you really have to worry about is final heaven and things on that level.
I should clarify that Mxy doesn't directly refer to the time stream as being the fourth dimension he just says its time but it is called the fourth dimension in other issues.
Which is what that reasoning is based off.
Anyway as usual give me some ideas for videos you'd like to see in the future and don't forget to subscribe if you want to see more.
Parrot could you scale umineko or the masada verse?
Chaos gods would be great, or a video on the warp
Thanks can you do marvel for fun
WebCamParrot do you think that it’s possible that mxy may just be posturing some of the time, in a way to sort of flex on other characters? It seems like he has a surface level understanding of the universe now.😂
Dark tower power scale?
DC: hey guys, how about some existential dread while you read our comics?
Infinite overuse of the word 'infinite'.
-A bountless infinite dimensional joke made by yours truly Atom Overvoid!
"Hey, have you heard of this God. It's power is beyond anything you know. Hear buy this issue."
"Okay thanks, I'll start reading this right now"
5 Minutes later:
"Hey, have you heard of this God. It's power is beyond anything you know. Hear buy this issue."
"But you just solid me a issue fallow this new God threat. Dude it's been min"
"Hey, have you heard of this God. It's power is beyond anything you know. Hear buy this issue."
@@thegooddinggleberry this joke is underappressiated
Remember when DC used to be about a man who could leap tall buildings in a single bound? Moral of the story is: The power-creep is real.
Ikr look at Dr Manhattan..... Jeez😬😬.
trexrising 40 99% of the people watching this video weren’t even alive back then. None of us remember it because we weren’t even alive to experience it in the first place
Power creep?
@@xdrawesome314x4 Fictional characters becoming stronger and stronger.
I don't remember. I only read about that once. When I got into superman he sang Darkseid out of existence
This may be the most complex DC video I’ve ever seen, well done, will have to watch 100x over.😂😂😂
Another absolute banger
Like all his other videos
My god how high were ther when they made everything past "the source"
They should have stopped there. It was fine . Now its confusing and uninteresting
Fr might just stop versus debating, this is getting dumb... What happened to true infinity? Final heaven? Things beyond fictional transcendence? So they can keep adding stuff to no end? This is redundant
@@komlat253 to you
DC Writer 1: My character can solo the omniverse!
DC Writer 2: My character can solo the multi-omniverse!
DC Writer 3: My character can solo the omni-omniverse!
STAHP
@@redjirachi1 then there's a blessing that destroys all of them without difficulty. Memes, examples of them being chuck Norris, shaggy, etc and these *meme users* would solo all of fiction.
I watched and enjoyed the Constantine video last night.
Now youtube recommends this.
Subbed.
The Algorithm worked.
same
SAME
SaMe
Smame
This is an incredible explanation of an incredibly complex subject!
You’ve gained a subscriber!
Your channel is amazing. I love your content.
The DC multiverse is crazy and complicated, keep them coming lol.
People tell me that Marvel's is much bigger,is it?
@@brandoncruse8532 not even close, im no expert but entirety of marvel is probably smaller then the overvoid
@@lassehoffmann625 Oh ok, because I heard that a few times from marvel fans explaining why they say Marvel is much stronger
@@brandoncruse8532wtf
i love marvel (and dc) but to argue that marvel is stronger is crazy
Bro you post some of the best content seriously, thanks for all the effort and hard work.
Also i don't know if you're interested in any Marvel stuff, but a Dr. Doom video would be cool imo
I agree he has the best content
Respect to the work u put in bro. Definitely a Herculean task. Appreciate the time and effort it took to bring it to fruition
This is the most comprehensive video on this subject I’ve seen. You did a really good job. It clarifies a lot than I expected
This is some really well-made content. I like to think that I do have pretty decent understanding of the DC multiverse/alternate timelines/alternate dimensions. But damn, this was pretty in-depth and well explained.
Just understand the basic transcendances and the ladder, you'll be fine.
Like The Source > Overvoid > Final Haven > Oversphere etc then when you have time, you can take a detailed look at each realm
Excellent explanation, DC is really huge, the largest and infinite among all other comics. The sphere of gods is insanely large, even greater than the beyond realm of marvel
It ain't bigger than marvel
war.tsurtle ! It was before the movies and DC is only heading up Shazam joker wonder woman aquaman these movies were really good
@@SaifulIslam-uu9xz what does that have to do with what's said here
war.tsurtle ! Maybe the fact that marvel have put out more movies also DC have bigger characters than marvel
But we not talking about movies
Can you imagine a thousand years from now how our descendants will view the ancient people's way of writing stories of gods?
Also DC Comics will be in the public domain by the time just like mythological stories so, lucky.
It would be cool if u explained gods of religions in marvel and dc
We know in marvel gods are extradimensional beings with massive super powers and their realms are normal universes with own time-space continuum.
In dc those are dimensionless/outerversal archetypal platonic concept beings transcending time and space beyond concept of dimensionans. if u "kill" olympian then u got his/her powers inheriting concept etc.
The gist of it is. If you have a religion you're right but also wrong
Definitely!
Yes
Webcamparrot: dc's continuity should be vastly into outerversal tier
Many Comics channels: Naw, there's just 52 universes
In even recent comics like the metal and death metal series or injustice series it's mentioned there are infinite universes inside bleed. So those youtubers are retconned easily.
Well that proves webcamparrot is a DC comic wanker
@@slimmy478-6 how so? he gave plenty evidence that contradicts the misconception of there only being 52 universes lmfao yet you’re still in denial and claim he’s wanking the verse
Interesting video webcamparrot.
I enjoy how you explained the DC cosmology and its hierarchies.
I think you did a good job.
Sup
@@starflatinum683 not much. BTW just now got your notification.
In my honest opinion this is one very underrated RUclips channel. I wish u luck that u gain much more subscribers in the future
Thank you. I'm glad there are channels out there like yours that are willing to take an unbiased look and study on Cosmologies. We need more channels like yours.
No no nonono no no nonono no no there's no limit🎶🎵🎶
This is the best video you ever uploaded
Glad I found another amazing comic Channel
Glad you enjoy it!
Even at the top and peak of The Leviathan Of Stories you would still not be able to beat a grandma with a rolling pin or a kitchen towel
Oh sh*t bro, you can't talk about the Grandma with rolling pin, the DC multiverse isn't ready for that kind of power yet.
😂😂😂😂😂😂😂
@@Demon-vj9nc Facts
For the love of God, please do not stop posting your videos....I love the research, the passion and the storytelling. I am binge watching you!!!
Idk dc so it’s nice to see someone take the time and explaining stuff from the verse. Thanks
Really enjoyed this breakdown. **subscribed**
This is all amazing and also makes my head hurt 😁 At a certain point I just have to tap out and be thankful someone else is keeping track of the metaphysics so I can sit back and enjoy the “show.”
Hey parrot love to see you back
Enjoyed bobobo
Been going back to your old content can’t wait for more.
After rewatch your multiverse video
I have two Questions:
1. Do you see the bleed as high hyperversal or outerversal? Been seeing arguments for both
2. There’s multiple outerversal realms so was wondering when does the cosmology hits High Outerversal (in your opinion)
Thank you for this vid. Idk much about DC but I like the universe and the stories and this has helped me out a lot. Love your vids. Would be great if you could do similar ones to educate us poor people to specific events that happens in the DC Universe
This video made my head hurt. I appreciate you for putting this video together
Great cumulative summary of the entirety of DC. I was also wondering what music you used, it sounds so familiar?
Fantastic video!
It really cleared up some confusion that I had in previous videos
SCP Cosmology stomps
@@sirwilliamofnir7435 shhh SCP is too op bro.
not a fair comparison.
@@sirwilliamofnir7435 Bro just because SCP is stronger doesn't mean you have to go and tell everyone that says DC is strong.
This video hurt my head this video hurt my friends heads overall this was one confusing trip into the DC multiverse Great video my dude.
Great to see more stuff Parrot.
Videos I’d enjoy seeing you make; Lobo, Psykers from 40K, or the C’tan from 40K.
Chad Thundercock we need that 40k vid
Ren Ji it would be nice.
One thing that's hard for me to understand is how an infinite is less and is within another infinite, for example an infinite multiverse within an infinite megaverse. An infinite has no upper number so transcending that is kinda hard for me to understand.
Thanks for this btw, u hv my full support
@sokratis konomi Pretty cool analogy.
Another excellent video WebCamParrot.
it's worth mentioning that the observable universe is just that - the OBSERVABLE Universe. We don't actually know how big our universe is because there's only so far we can see
Okay now I'm wondering if I can suss out what having a timecube instead of a timeline could mean. Logically, we are to presume a "timecube" has a relationship to our timeline the way a standard mathematical line and cube are related. A line is one-dimensional, and a cube is three-dimensional. Lets say a plane is two-dimensional, to make it a little easier to conceptualize.
A "timeline" is a progression of events that happen one after another in order one way, or in order the other way, like how a mathematical line is a list of all points in order. According to Wikipedia, one property of planes and their relationship to lines is that "A line is either parallel to a plane, intersects it at a single point, or is contained in the plane", which seems to imply a timeplane would by necessity consist of the timelines which are contained within the plane, as opposed to those which intersect it at a single point or run parallel. This means timelines which are parallel are not necessarily included in the timeplane. Maybe, then, it could be said that a "time-plane" is an infinite set of identical, concurrent, infinite timelines; that is to say, a set of unique universes where the same crucial chronological events happen, at the exact same "time"s, but in an uncountably large number of timelines with an inconceivably variable number of players? A set of universes where historically the same specific time-crucial events happen, but not with the same people, or for the same reasons, or in the same places, necessarily. Sort of, a basket of all timelines that feel the same when you run your hand over them, regardless of how they look.
This would thus, if my idea is to be believed, imply time is immutable and has explicit characteristics and "fixed points" which must happen across the set of timelines, regardless of who is involved in their expression -- a "texture" of sorts, which time is sure to exhibit -- and that coming from outside the timeline, "intersecting" with it once and altering the course of even one fixed event could catastrophically impact the other, necessarily parallel fixed events throughout the other timelines.
A "timecube", interestingly, could then mean a few things. I mean, obviously, because what the flying fuck is a "timecube", but -- you know what I mean. On the one hand, it could mean all parallel series of the timeplanes I just described -- a set of every possible timeplane, with every set of possible necessary timelines. Anything that could possibly count as a fixed event is certainly a fixed event somewhere in one of the infinite timelines, meaning a timeplane exists made of all timelines with those same fixed events (think, "basket of all timelines that feel the same"). The timeplane is a component of the larger timecube, along with all other planes where fixed points in time work that way (think, "all possible baskets of timelines that feel any way at all"). Fundamentally changing time in such a way that the particular nature of fixed events is changed, for example, would impact the timecube, being that such a change affects what counts as fixed events, which are the criteria for determining sets of timelines, and the timecube is the set of all possible sets of timelines. If that makes sense (it doesn't).
But that's if you interpret a cube to be a translation of a plane into 3D; If you interpret "cube' as "hollow series of faces" as opposed to "solid consistent mass of planes" a timecube could also mean a set of six timeplanes that form some constituent reality or ultimately interact in some way to each other, in a higher or lower dimension. This is a little more interesting to me because it seems to imply a sense of order or intention in the arrangement of certain sets of timelines (timeplanes) such that they interact perfectly perpendicularly with each other and create something else.
Like, lets try and step back and conceptualize literally what this could entail in a comic book. I could understand the idea of a square "being threatened" if someone wanted to destroy one of its sides, so I can grasp an analogue threat to a timecube if a timeline/timeplane is in danger by a time-exterior threat. If a timeline is fundamentally altered in such a way that all necessarily parallel timelines are also compromised (by, say, making a wish that made all timelines inhospitable to intelligent or complex life forms, making the necessary fixed time events impossible), then it stands to reason timelines that run perpendicularly (sharing exactly no similarities besides a single harmonious fixed point shared between timelines) would also be impacted, albeit infinitely less frequently. And I could also probably understand how there could be a group of creator-type beings introduced in a comic who live within the specific balance between timelines inherent to their constructed timecube, and must therefore protect it from intersecting/errant timelines. but some extratemporal threat has arisen and they need help. Etc.
Fuck me this is beautiful, I was not expecting it but just wow
Well done! The science is mind blowing!
This 100% shows the Overvoid is the omniversal canvas of fiction. Holding infinite anti-matter, dark, & positive realities is just a drip in the cosmology. Mister Mxyzptlk literally proved himself as a singularity in existence as he showed he appeared in brands like LEGO’s & video games.
Actually I just found a statement by grant Morrison stating that the overvoid actually has other fictions like marvel but idk if that's changed but I did find that statement.
About to watch, your content is spectacular
Leaderoflostscrolls? Who u talking about
Loving all the vids parrot. Keep it up
🏆Absolute brilliance.💎This is soo deeply complex & well presented. It could give a Univ. of Oxford 'DPhil' viva presentation a run for its money.🏅Beautifully stellar speaking voice, as well, super relaxing.🎯Bravo.
Insert meme about high hyperversal DC
Also I want an etrigan video
Exist Logic personally I want Lobo first but both are things I want.
With prep time Batman is Hyperversal
@@zombiewolf3244 thats downplay, 10th metal armor, boom tube amp, platonic bullet.
@@hashiondiscord8540 Ya and he did it with prep time give me any situation any person Batman has to fight Batman with prep time>Toaa there's your meme by the way.lol
Yes Etrigan! Omg I see so many people say hes like spiderman level
I am binging your channel. Thanks for keeping up to date.
Time cubed, from what I understand, can only exist in a multiverse. In our regular 3 dimensions there is length, height, and depth as the x,y, and z axis. Hypertime or time cubed in a multiverse sense can be explained as all the possible past events being x, all possible present events being y, and the possible future events being z. In this way something able to exist and maneuver in that cube can be anywhere and anywhen in the multiverse at a whim by triangulating 3 points in time to get a fixed timeline connecting those points, of course if you were outside the cube and could traverse it the more points known the better for getting a more precise timeline.
You got me with the Batman adversary, then Constantine, now this ? SUBB
I swear u would bitchslap entire VS Battle wiki claiming new gods are only High 2A and Death of Endless with OUTLIERS 1-A. I swear....
This video does not show any evidence that the sphere of the gods is 1-A, perhaps the Phantom Zone, but it is not enough to assert that the entire sphere of the gods is 1-A. And the fact that some realms in the sphere of the gods are beyond space does not necessarily mean a transcendence of any degree, but more than one degree of space - the three-dimension.
The Bleed is an element supporting the fact that the sphere of the gods is a transcendent realm, since the Bleed, according to Grant Morrison, is the Bulk in the Brane cosmology, whose idea is that our 3D universe is a brane existing in a higher dimension of space called the Bulk, containing all extra dimensions, so other universes. Like DC Cosmology.
But what is not explained is the fact that Brane cosmology explains the weakness of gravity relative to electromagnetic, weak and strong nuclear force. Unlike the last three forces being enclosed in a brane, gravity exists in the Bulk and, therefore, "spreads" in all geometrical dimensions (D-branes) within the Bulk. Asserting that the Sphere of the Gods is not "beyond" only to more than one degree, but to any degree, so is a transcendent realm. Consequently, outside of space and time itself.
M'gann M'orzz But knowing that vsbattle wiki is re-visioning its tiering system, I don't know if to transcend space or dimensions will remain a thing for a character to be 1-A/Outerversal.
@@y.n9264 actually has shown
Black Lightning43 Shows the evidence(s) that the sphere of the gods is 1-A from this video.
Y.N he did he shown multiple examples of the places inside the sphere of the gods being outerversal
Lantern Corps power scaling video please!
At first I thought the speed of light in the DC universe is the same speed then the one in real life until watched seththeprogammer video and he States the light in DC is faster than the one in real life
You should do a colab with Imaginary Axis
IA is several hundred tiers below Parrot. Axis is simple ignorant.
But unfortunately Axis is much more popular but to me Quality >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Quantity and popularity
Olicity Smoak cool story bruh
@@bowserfierykoopaking4235 IA Quality = Quantity
@@bowserfierykoopaking4235 What?
I definitely would've never known anything of this bcuz I'm too lazy to look through all the comics LoL but this was awesome and I'm just waiting for a batman vid LoL
Where can I find more info about The Leviathan? This is my first time hearing about it.
I know this is late but read the unwritten and unwritten apocalypse
196,833-dimensional snowflake is probably a reference to the SCP Foundation, which has 169,834 dimensions... Or did the SCP Foundation reference this comic?
Now this is crazy and mind-boggling.
At 6:52 ..196833 dimensions is probably a reference to a huge mathematical structure called the "Moster Group" which is the biggest simple sporadic group living n 196883 dimensions...
Which was described by John Conway as being a "spiky" christmas tree ornament...
Glad to see writers referencing higher math (together with the Alephs later in the video )
Two sentences:
There is this new God more powerful then any before on palette swapped earth coming straight for us. We'll let everything die a couple of times until someone can calm them down, teach them emotions or retcon their existence.
Thank you for the upload.
I'm not sure if you mentioned it, but one thing I seem to remember from doomsday clock is dr Manhattan saying there's basically a dark metaverse or multiverses.
A video on rebirth flash maybe?
The leviathan of stories is basically just the concept for SCP 3812 which is essentially and entity that continually rises higher in the chain of stories transcending endless fictions of fiction forced to transcend even itself
So it is can to DC ? Some people say things like final heaven, and the Leviathan of stories are not cannon which made no since to me.
@@brandoncruse8532 They are wrong, those stories are canon
@@brandoncruse8532 They say they arent canon because Mike Carey's series isnt "official" but it was indeed PUBLISHED by DC so...idk but to me it should be canon
Nice video, though I do have a question. In Green Lantern: New Guardians, Kyle Rayner travels beyond the Source Wall to refuel to emotional spectrum with the entities. Should that not require a heck ton of energy more than the entities provide? I’m not that familiar with anything DC outside of Kyle Rayner and Morrison’s 90s JLA run.
The Lantern Entities are actually implied to be absurdly powerful. The Spectre was scared of Paralax for instance after they shared Hal Jordan's body. I'd have to do more research on them to say for sure how strong they should be but that level of power isn't that outrageous.
are the Oversphere & Leviathan of Stories even part of DC? I did some googling and they appear to be from Vertigo comics called The Filth & The Unwritten. The Vertigo universe doesn't necessarily include every comic Vertigo has ever published any more than Star Wars is part of the Marvel multiverse
This video needs a lot more views.
No one actually understand DC omnivores.
And milkman man exist in final heaven.
Leviathan is more powerful than milkman superman
@@ugurkaraalioglu2813
Hey buddy remember me,
I hope you actually understood this complete massive cosmology.
@@omegadeadpool4987 Yes i understand now
@@ugurkaraalioglu2813
Yeah well good for you I still don't understand how they work, just that one is above the other. This reminds me when I tried to understand Marvel's cosmology, which I still haven't.
It hurts my head to think that these writers can just come up with such ridiculous stuff.
@@omegadeadpool4987 the mind can expand very far. I mean the *M* theory allows us to think up to 11th dimentional using mathematics.
So yeah.
Will you do a Marvel Cosmology explained video?
This would be great
@@roleiosports3695 Yep. Excalty!
@@amarie316 i wanna it too. Oblivion, Regulator Thanos, TOAA, True Chaos King and Shamballa form Dr Strange etc,
@@mgannmorzz2412 Excalty!
Same here
So dc is essentially the most powerful and vast verse in existence along with the cuthulu mythos verse
Zubair Lkaderi don’t forget Marvel, SCP, Suggsverse and JBW
@@callums1235 i know for certain marvel isnt on par. and tell me about the others, do they have a omniverse as vast as dc. it's not enough to just have infinite universes and dimensions, im talking as vast as dc in its entirety including the leviathan of stories. dont forget, dc as a whole includes more than just "conventional dc", it also includes other comic books like wild storm and vertigo that dc bought. lucifer himself encountered countless multiverses beyond the presence own creation which would include everything within the source wall. the only verses i can think of that are likely on par with dc, is the doctor who verse and the cthulhu mythos verse. marvel and image are close though.
Zubair Lkaderi Joke Battles Wiki contains all of fiction and nonfiction, including DC. There are many DC articles on JBW so the Leviathan of stories would be contained within it, as well as all of Cthulhu since Azathoth has an article as well.
I don’t know shit about Suggsverse except it has beings beyond omnipotence and its poorly written, so I’m told. I’ve never actually read any of it.
SCP has quite a lot to it like infinite dimensions, a layer above that, a layer above that and a layer above that. There are also beings that see all of that as fiction so that’s another layer of reality in the SCP cosmology but I doubt it’s as vast as DC considering DC has been around a lot longer.
I don’t know much about Marvel and Image cosmology so I’ll just take your word for it.
@@callums1235 joke battle wiki? is that a verse or a wiki page. but if its a "joke" than i guess its gag factor would put it above dc. however dc also contained non fiction as well as fiction. towards the end of this video we see that dc in its entirety extends to the real life writers even beyond the over void which itself is a real life thing (black pages of the paper). so given that the presence is omnipotent but he himself is transcended by higher entities such as the writers..etc shows that dc also has beings beyond omnipotence. SCP reminds me alot like the leviathan of stories by your description so id say its on par with dc rather than above it. btw azathoth transcends fiction. the lore of his character is that all that there is, is simply a part of his dream and that should he wake up, all that would remain is him. marvel and image are like dc without the leviathan of stories part.
@@LeaderOfTheLostSouls the presence is omnipotent, he's all powerful, all knowing and all present WITHIN dc. hes surpassed only by beings that surpass "conventional" dc. omnipotence in fiction is different to whats considered omnipotence in real life. considering dc is not real and is unaffected by other verses, the presence can be omnipotent within the bounds of dc. same way the one above all is omnipotent within marvel, the man of miracles within image and so on. this is fictional omnipotence so dont try bring in non fiction laws.
Wait, the Earth is the center of the universe in DC? I knew we were pissing off Albert Einstein due to how many characters can not only go faster than light, but somehow see despite how much the light would lag. But now we're pissing off Galileo as well!
Also; When it gets into the metanarrative storytelling aspect layers... How does this coexist with Dream of the Endless, who is, by his very nature, the... Creator? Source? Of stories within DC/Vertigo? It feels to me as if there'd be some kind of... Link, there, surely?
pretty much for anything past the source what canon and what isn't does not matter at all it's basically an infinite place or whatever you wanna call it beyond all comprehension which contains every single possibility there ever was and ever will be so pretty much I think its fair to say is linked
And when we get a crossover with another comic or film universe, like Marvel , the Dc universe touches or temporarily is melded with a universe from a separate Omniverse of multiverses. Something that only happens when conditions are exactly right.... usually involving vast cosmic forces...
You've worked hard for this sub
Love your content bro 👌🏻
Great video, Though I still disagree a little about the six dimension is beyond The Source, We saw in justice league The Source contains infintie multiverses and Perpetua just one of it agents whose purpose is to create multiverse in The Source
Ye
Can you please tell me where i could find more about the final heaven,eonymus, leviathan sphere??
Or the comics name??
Please😢
Milk wars
Milk wars, 2016's Doom Patrol run, The Filth and The unwritten/unwritten apocalypse
@@yogaardianto2269 tnx✌
@@momonga1722 tnx a lot dude😊 can you tell me which comic featuring leviathan sphere?
@@shahinislam7550 Unwritten
so we are also a layer in the leviathan of stories, below that being retcon corp, below that being dc, below that being whatever else?
Anyway to get a list of all the story's researched
My brain is about to explode HOW THE FUCK HAVE WE GOT HERE FROM A FEW SUPERHEROS
4:20
I wonder. How does this relate to the Lucifer comics, and his conversation with Destiny of the Endless, or even the concept of Destiny of the Endless in general?
The above seemed to imply a more deterministic worldview, including divine predestination atop of that - action and reaction binding all in a singular motion of causality, inescapable even to the Devil himself, despite his best efforts. (**Spoilers**: Although in the end, it could be argued he does succeed, by escaping into the Overvoid... Buuuuut then they brought him back in a sequel a few years ago with the very tone of his character fundamentally changed. But let's not get into that)
Anyhow, what I was trying to say:
Doesn't 4:20 kind of throw a wrench into said deterministic worldview?
I wonder if DC extended fiction such as the Arrowverse, Injustice Verer, and DCAU exist as separate local multiverses.
Different creations, as the DCAU and Injustice have their own Darkseid.
Insanely well done video, however where would you say the true form of darkseid exists?
in Fourth World, or the Sphere of the Gods if you prefer.
@@gigawarman12 Ye Ik, you'd think that, but I've seen people claim he exists in his own realm that is beyond The god sphere
@@boredsensei7162 what idiots wank him that much.
@@CerealExperimentsMizuki Idk lol but it stopped
Sphere of gods, as a platonic concept.
We’re slowly just getting more metaphysical until the hero’s of DC realize that their in a comic.
and then jump out of the page lol
Cosmic armor Superman
That literally happened lol
I liked and enjoyed previous videos on dc. but can you scale bobobobobo next
How can the overvoid be both the crack the Greg freely made, the flat 2D verse for the high other other beings, and just a piece of paper for the eonymous? I'm guessing that it's all them at once and that all three of these things are in only one layer of the leviathan of the stories?
The OVERSPHERE exists in the crack that Greg freely made not overvoid.
@@starflatinum683 your a legend
@@kaimarquez8046 np
Nice video. Very informative.
And also the part with flash the imaginary axis already did that he said he can run faster than a Planck instant and he added scientific information to it
Great video i love it really Welk done and i wanted to ask about the Omniverse which has been in DC recently in the Justice League comic where does it reside in DC
Man....
This video made me question life and think about how nothing really matters. We could all be a spec in the grand scheme of things. Only here to entertain the ones outside of our existence and that our very being is nothing more but a random chance in the infinite possibilities of all of reality. It's fucking scary and pretty depressing to think about if I'm to be honest.
So DC is like an onion, it has a lot of layers
So to simplify: "We made a layer of existence outside another layer of existence outside another second layer of existence where supposedly time either doesn't exist or is just straight up non-linear and chaotic yet for some reason characters can interact with themselves inside of it as if time existed like we experience it in our physical real life counterpart realm.
Oh, and we also made another layer of existence that kinda breaks the 4th wall too."
TIMECUBE!!!
How about doing a power scaling on a different anime character:Dio Brando. Including Heaven Ascended Dio who I’m confident that can defeat Saitama and Superman(but not Constantine)
Mavi Kartal let me start with this which superman
Ain’t beating Superman lol
Mobius _
Post Crisis Superman and below. Heaven Ascended Dio can rewrite reality... Oh wait,Darkseid can do the same. But he can still defeat New 52 Superman and below.
He stomps saitama but he has no chance against superman he ain't doing shit to superman.
2:06
isn’t the green lantern planet Oa consistently stated to be the center of the universe?
Blackest Night confirms Earth as being the center and where the White Entity first spawned
Oa is the center because all sectors of the universe touch oa, earth is more of the center in terms of importance
Earth is the center, but OA is just the center of the coordinate system the green lanterns use
Just to clear up quickly:
The DC Universe doesn't actually touch *our* universe at any point. The writers of DC don't exist within the DC Universe.
Meta-fiction is really, *really* fucking stupid.
Personally I think meta-fiction is really interesting so long as you realise that it is just that - fiction. Any of the "writers" that appear in DC comics are of course only fictional characters not legitimate real people in our world. It's just that for the purposes of the cosmology much of DC is created by them writing these characters and obviously that would place their world above their creations world.
Grant Morrison started using meta-fiction because he wanted a way to connect with the audience without having to resort to things like drama or violence. That's why for instance the Thought Robot reaches his hand out to the page and hears the breathing of the audience. Morrison wanted the reader to feel like they were directly involved in the events of the comic. It's cool I definitely fuck with it.
@@WebCamParrot It is really interesting and fun to read, but the second you go beyond the very first layer of meta-fiction (a fictional version of the author being in the story) and start making that fictional author beneath another, bigger fictional thing, it just gets absurd and ridiculous.
I mean it's not like this author above an author thing is really connected to the narrative in DC at all it just exists as separate stories that happen to come together this way cosmologically. And from a cosmological perspective there isn't really anything wrong with that.
The only exception to this is the Unwritten which is centred on the idea that EVERYTHING is a story just from different perspectives and so naturally the world one author lives in would HAVE to be below another world with another author ad infinitum because there is no difference between story and reality in the Unwritten and every possible story exists within the Leviathan. I don't think any of that is absurd or ridiculous from a writing perspective, it's damn well written actually.
@@WebCamParrot *Bro Ultra Moniter Vs The Presence How Supreme Being God In DC Make A Vedio ?*
👏👏👏👏👏
@@WebCamParrot How does this apply to fourth wall characters?
Wait, you're telling me The Filth is not only part of the Multiverse, but is one of the HIGHEST plains of existence?
Makes sense. Felt high reading that book...
Don't fuck with the filth ;)
Yes, the 5th Dimension (Named imagination) is the second highest plane of existence after the 6th dimension
So basically, make it as complex as it can be in order to attempt to create stories using all those structures with the final purpose of continuing to create comics virtually forever. Because, if it wasn't complex, it would end, if it would end, no more jobs or profit or money. I am confused now more than ever but I guess that was the purpose of it all. I am too low dimensional and plane of existence, and I can't comprehend.
You seen the downgrading vs battle wiki has done
Our observable universe is never stated to have a limit thats just what we Hypothesize
I love your videos. COuld u tell which comics appears zeus and odin spliting the source and creating the anti-life entity?
Death of the New Gods
This video was amazing
Because hyper time extends into the sphere of the gods, does that mean that there could be multiple dark sides within hyper time.
leviathan of Stories stronger than the writer
And wich is characters strogest than presence, Lucifer, Michael, primal monitor Their number please
@@هاشمباسلهاشم I don't understand, can you rephrase
is leviathan of Stories stronger than the writer
@@هاشمباسلهاشم honestly, it should be stronger than the writer, but I really don't think it's ever going to be mentioned in mainline DC. It is Canon, and it is most likely stronger than the writer, but you don't really have to worry about it. The last thing you really have to worry about is final heaven and things on that level.