Why I'm sending these studio monitors back...
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- Опубликовано: 8 июл 2024
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I definitely don’t need speakers that are connected to the internet 😬
Well they need to be networked... they dont necessarily need the internet.
I should have said that better
😂😂😂 lol Colt
How about an Atmos system connected to the Dark Web? That would be truly scary.
🤡🤡🤡
Fair enough! They do indeed work very well in studios, but I also have a feeling that they where never initially designed for use in a studio.
Also, I’ve always found it interesting how many issues software can create compared to hardware 😅
Exactly. - How to create buyers remorse. Poorly implement the software used to control your otherwise very high quality item.
Old studio owner here with sage advise given to me back in the stone age by my mentor. Changing Monitors is always a trust issue. I'm still mainly on Genelec 1031As and a pair of Passive B&W 600 series I bought in the late 90s. Not because they sound great but because I know how to make things sound good with them. I also buy the most popular Hi-fi bookshelf speakers every 5 or 6 years just to hear what the average consumer hears but I don't use them for mixing.
I'm a poor old audiophile still hanging onto my 1979 JBL 4311's. I remember when engineers would use the speaker of a transistor radio, as a final stage. Back then it was checking all the cables for any problems. Now it's spending more time with technology, than the actual recordings.
I agree with your sentiment regarding customer service on a product;
Especially when the product is used in a commercial facility and whereby any downtime or lack of operating correctly affects our ability to product the results our clients hire us for.
I've had this with other products in the past (Unfortunately more-so the issues were caused by distributors not the companies themselves)
Feels my man, all the stores here in aus are not giving the service that is required sometimes. More happy selling you the product, so much that they often they look past things and make you feel bad/ waste your time when they missed something or gave you the wrong product when you go back or call to fix.
Have literally dealt with the most simple mistakes to ones taking my whole week up like getting 2 left speakers or box without adapters or screws, cables etc. The whole process ends up costing the same or more and they don't often like to compensate or help you after the initial purchase. Can only think of a few times things have gone smoothly and that's usually with cables or basic stuff lol.
I master lots of record for people owning d&d 8c, they are incredible, but i still prefer the atc scm25 with a sub. They're so much musical.
You’re not the first one to mention that. I have yet to hear them.
I agree 100%... and add a Trinnov and you are set forever.
@@RecordingStudioLoser The SCM25A Mk II are such incredible spaekers. I love mine.
Dude! Sick studio! I'm sorry you've had problems with the D&Ds. Another reason to get fully analogue PSIs! 💥
Hey mate, sorry you've had a less than ideal experience with these. Could I please ask of the fix your friend recommended to you?
I've had mine for around 18 months now and they've never missed a beat. I've used them as mixing/mastering monitors in my studio as well as for general music listening and I really like working on them.
Also, the D&D support have always been very responsive and knowledgeable in my experience....
Keep up the great work mate and best wishes from Melbourne!
I never did hear from D&D.
The app was reporting incorrect firmware and was only updating one speakers. I reset both of them locally, then had to walk up firmware one at a time on both speakers.
Cheers mate! @@RecordingStudioLoser
thank you for the vid, take care!
Simplicity is unbeatable. Dsp, firmware, networking... all that gets in the way of the sound. On another level it's the same with guitars. You can have coil splits, phase reverse buttons, coil tapping, etc... but nothing's better than a good old telecaster. No bells and whistles. Just the core business components.
Btw if you really need corrections with your Focals, you could get a Trinnov system maybe.
where do you mix broadcast? I mix broadcast for our church sometimes and I like to critique myself every week, and I like comparing the quality I'm getting to people who I know do good work...I'd love to add your broadcast mix to that list of people that I use as a reference...thanks
Try the PMC 6-2 pro, this monitor is incredible... it's just fun and enjoyable to mix and master on the monitors. you can just hear everything in such detail! ❤️and no problems with software and DSP😉
Love your Studio,you are not negative at all
I need to upgrade my studio monitors and I would love to buy a pair of 8c and Boom I checked you video this morning !
I still love these speakers. Just offering some food for thought here and honestly hoping d&d can come back around. I would love to still have a set.
with you video I think that D&D will contact you quickly for a solution... I had same problem with Genelec factory in Europe and is was a nightmare, lost me speakers for 2 months because my model was an ancient model :) @@RecordingStudioLoser
DSP is more trouble than its worth honestly... digital music making is frustrating enough to keep working, and the very last thing I want is software running the most critically important thing in my studio... my monitors. I recently upgraded my monitors and was fortunate enough to be able to test drive 6 different sets of monitors. I found the implementation of DSP to be sort of a crutch and a gimmick for the most part... and I was mostly turned off by it. In the end is came down to PSI and ATC... class A/B power individually tuned isolated crossovers and are exceptionally GOOD sounding with no need for any DSP or gimmicks. The best description is natural sound, vs digital sound.
I ended up buying the ATCs because they were slightly less expensive and sound incredible.
I think the best possible setup is purely analog, class A/B speakers with a Trinnov. You could get a Trinnov and use it with your Focal's and I bet you would be VERY happy.
Eh, first you complain about DSP and then you recommend a Trinnov, which is a DSP.
The simpler a monitor is, the less that can go wrong.
I had bought brand new Focal Solo6's from Sweetwater and one of the speakers would shut off completely after 20-40 minutes of use. Not sleep mode with red light but shut off eternally with no light on at all. I had to take that one speaker back to get a new one. The new one that came had the same issue as the one I sent back but had a different time it would shut off. like 1-20 minutes of use. I sent that one back to get another and that one worked. I am still on the look out for these Focals to go out. I had a pair of Yamahas in my studio that never failed. I love the Focals but I am still concerned there are issues with them. I keep asking Sweetwater about what Focal or they could find out and it seems like no one knows. Maybe you know someone at Focal that can tell you what was wrong with those 2 speakers.
What Yamahas did you have if you don’t mind me asking. Seems like I’m starting to see lots of Yamahas in studios. Did you like the ones you had?
@@SteelTracks i was using HS7's but the Focals sound way better. I wish I never had the troubles I did. I may think, well it was one speaker but 2 Focals in a row with the issue is concerning.
I ❤my Focals shape sub one
I am curious what you think about the Genelec Ones or PMCs?
I’ve heard both albeit not in my room. The ones are fantastic. Genelec has a sound just like focal has a sound. I do feel like the transient throw on the genelecs were awesome. And the room wasn’t a perfect room. PMCs I hear in a PMC room. So of course it was an incredible experience. At the time. I didn’t find anything the size I needed. That was readily available.
@@RecordingStudioLoserYou should give a listen to PSI Audio A23m's or A25m's or PresentDayProduction MUM8's also.
I'm always wary of dsp being built into speakers, especially if it can't be bypassed. At the very least it has to be 100% reliable in a pro setting as you say.
What happens when they stop updating the app and all the connected stuff? Do the speakers still work ok completely disconnected from internet access? I've been burned too many times with audio drivers not being updated/maintained to trust stuff like this any more!
Great point!
And what happened to all the great audio gear that had Firewire 400 connectivity? In the trash can, that's where they are! And what happened to all the great audio gear that had XLR connectors? In your studio (and still working great), that's where they are!
Could you imagine an early VariMu with serial port connectivity? It's like all your SCSI drives... all in museums. Not because the gear was bad, but the interface got obsolete...
(I come from the world of photography, and I do have film scanners I can't use anymore (drivers are obsolete, and connections (serial/SCSI) are too). They are collecting dust... Fast moving technology is NOT your friend!
@@68Snaps Exactly!! I'm an Electrical Engineer also, so my old M-Audio FW410 now has a USB interface! 🤣🤣 And the USB one I bought after that (which now has obsolete drivers) I also had to modify.
@@peejay1981 omg, for a moment I thought "John Paul Jones" had answered me! Ha ha ha. That being said, programmed obsolence is a thing, and anything using electronic interfaces should be regarded as a risk. 4 exceptions come to mind: AES, TOSLINK, S/PDIF and ADAT.
But serial port? Dead. Parallel port? Dead. SCSI? Dead. Firewire 400/800? dead. USB 1.0 ? dunno. Hayes 4800 baud modems? dead. And the list goes on.
(xlr ports? alive and kicking ;-) )
The speakers work fine without internet access. The app can connect via your local network, and the speaker also locally hosts a web version of the app. There's also plenty of people who just send their signal in via analog or AES and never touch the app at all (after intiial setup).
I havent had enough drive time to speak into DSP issues but it’s kind of a turn off and this was a worst case scenario reason why lol…. My buddy has the 25 ATC’s. They’re amazing. Personally…. My bloated opinion is I’m saving for a set of PSI A23’s. The Swiss have no time for those shenanigans.
I Reccomend Looking into The MUMS created by UK Top Engineers & Also RUclipsrs Present Day Studio
They went thru an extensive process in creating them
Monitors Made for engineers made by engineers
I hadn’t heard of these
You can Start by searching We Build a MUM-8 Studio Monitor live, they have like a mini series on the journey to creating them @@RecordingStudioLoser
Still DSP though...
I'm from belgian&belgian :) its sad to hear this with the dutch&dutch,So expansive loudspeakers and then no really a good Customer Service. but now you have The france&france , like me too.....and hope i can level up my focals to the same model like yours....one day.. best regards from Europe to American&American....;) btw...love your channel
Dude, I actually laughed so loud. I scared my kid with this comment. 😂😂
For $15,000 a pair, you definitely shouldn´t be having issues with them.
Agreed. That wasn’t the cost when I got in … still true then. Even truer now
For now because of budget constraints, I'll stick with my Kali LP6s. I'd love top flight monitors but since my studio is more a hobby studio and my ears are old, tired and ring a lot, I don't think it would be worth it to upgrade. Maybe later if I really feel the need and have the money.
For sure. Stick with what works for you. These definitely aren’t right for everyone.
Give a try for: ABACUS Mirra 14 from Germany! Best Speakers!
Never heard of these!
Have you ever tried Genelec? I've been using one type or another of Genelec's spreakers for 20+ years. I couldn't be more happy. If you add a Trinnov, it's magic.
I have listened to ones and they were fantastic. It wasn’t this room however.
these are my feelings with all app reliant audio products. even some pedals do this. we do not need audio hardware or even plugins for that matter connected to the net.
The thing that bugs me is the lifespan of equipment that needs software to control it. In 10 years time, will this software still be around? Will it be able to run on hardware you are using? This is a major investment for your studio and you would expect a decent life out of the equipment, and a subsequent decent residual if you wish to sell them.
Compare that to say a Neumann mic, which after 20 years of reliable service, you can sell for probably the price you paid for it, if not more.
It’s like anything directly connected to a computer invariably has a short lifespan, and usually low residual value.
Funny thing...The consumer will never hear that detail that these monitors give to the engineer. :) I'm good with my mid priced DynAudios. Not enough ROI (FOR ME) to justify anything more at this point.
No. But I understand what you’re saying. It’s about us being able to to hear and make decisions quickly with the best info we have at a time and to do so over a long period of time.
That said. It’s so personal. And not everything makes sense for everyone. If I can save time with monitors. It’s worth a lot of investment for me.
@@RecordingStudioLoser Oh I get it... I am just sadly teetering on the line of hobby and business. Times are tough. :(
For $13,000 a pair, they better work...
Your not wrong
Their price has quite doubled since they are out
Thing I've noticed over the past decade is how customer support is there initially until you have the product for a while or regarding the actual sales etc, but then it disappears or takes a week over most companies :D
In terms of firmware, having that wireless is so unreliable and simply a disaster waiting to happen. should be at least be usb or usbdrive implemented. Connected speakers on a whole is an unnecessary gimmick imo
ah i moved to ATC cuz of similar thing wid dsp....
I didn’t anticipate it being as much of an issue as it was
NOOOOOOOOOooooooo!!!!!!!
I plain to come on 14 to here those speakers...
Try atc man. I recently tried a bunch of monitors and landed on atc truly blew me away.
Which ones did you land on?
@@RecordingStudioLoser I have the new SCM25A mk II... but if you have the space for the SCM45s, they are my dream speaker... but way too large for my studio.
I Landed on 45s lol threw them on my meter bridge on some iso pucks. Its not the best but i am now selling my mains. Once those go i will move them on stands. But for now I'm blown away Its different the bottom end isn't like a movie theatre but the headroom and ability to hear distortion and Mid range is insane.@@RecordingStudioLoser
Sorry about your bummer. D&D's are my dream monitors. Being chained to the internet (like UAD Connect), is a BIG no for me. I only put my recording computer on the web when I'm updating.
They don’t necessarily need Internet. They need a network. If you want the site control then you kinda need Internet. But yes
You don't even need internet for the web app, it's also hosted locally on the speakers.
These are the types of reviews we need. Too many reviews only give the opinion on sound and leave out what happens when something goes wrong.
20k for speakers and their level of tech support is cycling power. Lol
Not that high in price! But yes. You are still very correct
@@RecordingStudioLoser I’m Canadian lol.
Damnit. My ethnocentrism is showing.
I'm a software engineer at D&D... I'm really puzzled what happened to you, normally such technical issues would get the software engineering team directly involved to resolve them quickly. We definitely wouldn't tell customers to just power cycle their speakers, that is obviously not acceptable. In another comment you said "I never did hear from D&D"... did you contact us directly, or through a distributor?
Nice, but you don't answer the phone from the barber! :)
My barber has been leaving voicemail after voicemail...
lol