Derek from MPMD goes over the possible Chinese Olympic Weightlifting protocol and how they may evade drug testing at the highest level. Full Podcast At @ComeCorrectPodcast
I love how Derek refuses to speculate on things he hasn't spend days researching. People who have the wisdom to stay in their lane of knowledge are so rare.
@@rationalright8342 Imo it's not really bait. It's not like Zack is trying to squeeze questions out of him for some clickbait. He seems genuinely interested about the state of drugs in his sport. Just that Derek isn't super into weightlifting so it's hard with this topic specifically.
@@wikitiki44 I don’t know. This part of the pod seems a bit clickbait- ish to me. That’s just my opinion. No harm, it’s how you grow the channel. I just think it should be less obvious.
I think the issue is that it's unrealistic to expect anyone of Lu's calibre to NOT be on gear. We know he is, it's just a matter of how they achieve it.
Fact is in the west it’s a coach, and maybe an athlete that can afford the work. Whereas in China it’s the State playing politics because they can’t stand not winning as many medals as America.
@@EroticOnion23 Because then we can go crazy and invest a ton of money into these PEDs for mass market which means there's no legal road blocks into improving these drugs because the data on them will grow exponentially. Not to mention that it will become safer over a shorter period of time compared to if people just did it secretly in gym locker rooms.
"It's weightlifting, everyone is on drugs. It's just they are never caught." That's a metric shit ton of truth right there. Could just as well be said; it's professional sports, everyone is on drugs. One problem with any drug testing regimen is how easy it is to manipulate against small or unpopular countries while the countries that hold power on the federations get away just about anything.
As someone doing a master in analytical chemistry, its very interesting to hear these kinds of discussions. If you have a big enough lab team you could test everyone, but this costs a lot of manpower and a lot of money. In addition to this, there is also problems in hospital labs with determination of different normally present steroids in humans with off the shelve machines and method from big pharmacutical companies, so even if you could test everyone with a test that costs less to run you're still going to have so much problems with detection limits, cross reactivity and general selectivity of your tests
Lu Xiaojun is competing at 73kg for the 2024 Paris Olympics, since his prior weight class of 81kg won't be held in Paris. Thus why he lost a lot of weight first before beginning to train again.
I have friends who are professional weightlifters. These guys do not know how weightlifters trainings. They train 1 or max 2reps only focusing on weights. Their bodies are not look like bodybuilders.
Lu could've dropped to 73 pretty easy in under a year, by his own words he had to force feed himself to even maintain enough for the 77kg class. He probably could've dropped that 8kg in 4 months instead of what was probably 12-15kg in over a year
@@thechosenone93 that is the point. When weightlifters’ bodies are not on good shape, they still lift e80%of their record then they doing diet to meet the weight classes and doing double amount of training during season. Lu looked tiny but turns out bigger is completely normal lol
I wish Derek will do a whole video regarding women’s weightlifting, professional competitors, fitness in general and supplements. Long term effects of synthetic enhancement drugs, androgyny, etc. Also HRT, menopause, creatine, etc. The importance of women’s weight training from HS up until your 80’s. The key factors in our longevity. The WHOLE enchilada. Love you Derek. ❤
@@luxurybuzz3681 I still have bad gyno lost everything I got on it got kinda fat lost so much hair got really Moody my face aged and I just wish I never did roids even sarms
If it is just steroids, then you'd think the Chinese would dominate the heavy weight classes too. But they consistently suck there. I think it is more likely that they have a better system of looking for kids with extreme outlier limb ratios. They look at millions of farm kids and send the ones with extreme outlier limb ratios to weightlifting camp. You don't see any other team with this many short arm, short femur, long torso, squat jerkers. China has a pretty deep bench too. But at the heavy weight and super heavy weight classes, where the athletes are a lot taller, they don't have this advantage any more and the Chinese team is very mediocre there.
What's really needed is some channel that lets Americans directly talk with Chinese citizens, and network to those in the appropriate fields in the know there. Cuz otherwise, the communication gap is so large that any talk about China here is basically largely raw speculation like a Bigfoot channel...
Unfortunately, the Chinese gov has been pretty damn successful in isolating their 'internet' from the rest of the world. It's certainly not impenetrable, but it obviously isn't most of the citizens(probably not even 10% TBH) that are bypassing it.
@@22448824 No wouldnt say bloated, hes bulked up to hit prs in the gym. If you want to gain mass and think youre going to stay chiseled through youre in for a rough ride
Done this natural myself. Simple case of changing from speed work to strength and size. I'm not natty anymore tho btw just for reference tho I pulled 300 natty
The sport i played as a minor started randomly test athletes at the age of 15 Now I grew up in Sweden we have pretty high standard for doping tests in sports
One of my favorite parts about listening to people way smarter than me, is how they open up my vocabulary and expressions. It's cool to see someone else likes that kind of stuff too bro lol
i wouldn't be surprised if the chinese team is doping but only to the degree that all olympic weightlifting teams probably are. the chinese weightlifting system is superior, just as the russian system of wrestling is superior, the cuban boxing system, etc. the usa hates when an asian country is dominant at something though like the hatred towards japan when they kicked the usa's ass in automotives in the 70s.
two reasons: 1.large talent pool due to the huge population 2. East Asians (including myself) tend to have larger torso and shorter limbs in general (not everyone but in general) East Asians are good at power leverage and quick burst power output in middle and lower weight class, like Lu Xiaojun and the boxer Naoya Inoue, but also look at Zhilei Zhang, who is a heavy weight boxer from China, he is also very fast and powerful. I guess it's a gene thing that East Asians are more power efficient for the same weight class when compared with other people in the world.
No they are very weak, in comparison to western lifters. They only have success using the forced training and screening methods that the chinese use and the state sponsored doping.
@@awkwrdly_socleven I am against the communist government of China, I have to say your stereotypical reply is ignorantly biased. Asians have very good body structure for lifting and fighting.
@@awkwrdly_socl you are copium addict. Just spitting you inner racism BS. Inoue is an absolutely beast boxer, not weak. If chinese dominates the competition, they are not either. Keep sniffing cope
@@awkwrdly_socldemonstrably not true. east asians tend to be more powerful than other ethnicities-as in, they are able to output a lot of force in a short span of time
Their system is better, their process is better, and they have the biggest population in the bloody world! They find the genetic anomalies who have massive potential for strength, and make them do weightlifting.
in November 2011, the International Weightlifting Federation announced that Liao Hui had tested positive for the banned substances boldenone and androstatrienedione. Liao Hui was Olympic gold medalist at 69kg in 2008. So it’s BS that Chinese weight lifters are never caught.
That's a poor choice for an example because it is speculated he was busted for political reasons, not that he just happened to get busted. There have been several more doping bans for China, mostly in re-tests for previous Olympics.
@@AfferbeckBeats that's a poor choice for a rebuttal because you stated that it was speculated that he was busted for political reasons. speculation is even worse evidence.
Liao hui getting popped was weird as fuck. The guy gets tested by usada out lf nowhere and he comes clean but he gets in some trouble in china and he magically pops for a substance no drug tested athlete in their right mind would take.
But their Government and Coaches are excellent at ensuring they are not popped. State funded PEDs versus an org like WADA is not exactly an even race. China wants to make a political statement, and they have in the medals race.
based on doping failed test most of the lifters were found to be using Dehydrochlormethyltestosteron and Stanozolol or in common terms turinabol and winstrol although we know they use multiple drugs in their cycle rotation
I’m not sure if the China weightlifters are all juicing but what if a Chinese RUclipsr said “oh wow all the weightlifting record are held by Americans. What steroid are they all taking?”
He said everyone at this level is juicing, doesn't matter which country they represent. I think that part is valid and pretty obvious. His point is that American weight-lifter undergo more testing scrutiny compared to Chinese because of the testing agencies. Less scrutiny = more juice you can get away with taking = better edge over competition. Basically he is saying "Americans take less/benefit less from drugs because our testing agencies are less corrupt because... USA". Which is a bullshit politicized argument.
I think saying it’s only due to PEDs that China is so good ignores some other factors, like how Chinese people tend to have shorter limbs, maybe giving better joint angles (not sure on this). But that’s how it is with long distance running and East African runners holding all the records. Some speculate it’s their tendency to be built leaner, some speculate that culturally it’s taken more seriously, some say it’s that they train from a very young age and train with more volume, but at the same time more East Africans get popped for PEDs than any other area. IAAF was considering banning the entire country of Kenya this year due to 40% of all positive tests being from there. Finally maybe it’s a combination of all factors.
It's been trivial to dodge the tests for YEARS there. First, they don't even have a formal national identification system like we do with social security numbers or even photo IDs and I'm not joking. Then, it's not like WADA uses fingerprinting and $hit. So it's very easy for an athlete to send in a body double to take a drug test, in fact being a body double had become a very lucrative profession for many. Of course you never hear any of this brought up, because that would be WAYYYSISSS WAHHH!
@@soonahero no, I mean Kenya lol. There's nothing like social security or even photo ID there. Or wasn't as of the early 2000s. But WADA didn't even acknowledge it.
The drug abuse problem in the US is the worst around the world. I mean a normal 16-year-old teenage in high school might use steriod and it's just for getting girls' attention, not for any sports competition.
They also live and breathe training. They're not like a regular Olympic team. They live, train, eat at the training center for months on end. Not that they couldn't be on it. It just doesn't equate to the same training experience of most countries.
@@HkFinn83 a lot of the people who don't do as well and complain about everyone else are also on it. I don't know why you're so bitter when I agreed that they could be but also stated their work ethics are bar none. Must be feeling a bit inferior.
@@HkFinn83 And Americans don’t do steroids, but the Chinese do, right? Barry Bonds, Roger Clemens, Mark McGwire, Lance Armstrong, and all the best US athletes are all clean, right? Right? 🤦🏻♂️
@@healthywiseandfit man most Chinese athletes are juicing and if not juicing alot of the times they are cheating work ethic is there but that can be said about lots of athletes who are training. so you can try projecting all you want but knowing how easy it is to get drugs over there I am not fooled.
He not a you tube tick tock, Instagram goof that's running gear all year long, he's a professional athlete that is taking time off the drugs which is smart.
Jamaicans have been popped for drugs numerous times and declined to be tested by WADA in Jamaica just like China, instead they prefer to use their own domestic testing (which surprise surprise never catches anyone). They are clearly on gear. Bolt used a well known steroids doctor on his staff, he also beat Ben Johnsons steroid time during this period. Olympics is dirty as hell from top to bottom.
If someone took time off, and didn't work out barely at all, he could lose 20+ pounds of lean tissue. He is a short guy and was super ripped, which always makes you look bigger. It possible he was not on gear, but so many athletes are using steroids, it's hard to believe that he wasn't. If he blows up back to his jacked status really quickly, then he is definitely getting saucy. The thing he said about other countries Anti Doping Agencies not being as active in trying to catch their countrymen, that isn't necessarily true. A Chinese Anti Doping Agency or WADA's Chinese officials went to take blood from that superstar swimmer, Sun Yang, and they definitely didn't cover for him, or give him special treatment. I think that they went to his place at like 3am to get blood and when he got pissed off, they left without a sample. He ended up getting suspended for a couple years or something, even though he has never had anything show up in his tests. They are all on PED's, but how is it different than the American's like Carl Lewis, or the Russian's and the Olympics they fixed, which was brilliant. How about in the 1950's where the German government and Olympic coaches were giving Turinabol to all of their athletes and telling them that it was vitamins. A bunch of the women sued the government and won. Canada won more Gold Medals then any other country, probably because of steroids somehow. Now it's China's turn and they are going to run with it until they drop the ball or Anti Doping catches up. All major athletes are using steroids.
The major difference here is that, for the US, the prize is qualifying for the olympics, and USADA exists to keep that organic competition (relatively) fair, but for other countries, the prize is the medal itself for national pride to be used domestically for national unity purposes.
The success itself shouldn’t be used as evidence, there are plenty of countries that excel at specific sports like how Kenyans and Ethiopians dominate distance running, before accusing them of cheating you would consider their physiology. Gear aside, the general body types of chinese people do seem to fit what you would expect to be advantageous for certain kinds of lifts, so the number of people in China who are available to become high level lifters is enormous. If it was just about cheating, it wouldn’t just be in the area they also happen to be physiologically suited for. Again not saying there is or isn’t cheating, just saying we shouldn’t overlook the fact that they may just be naturally good at these kinds of lifts in general.
Look up the current positive PED lists. It's mostly African athletes.. surprising isn't it? I expected a lot of Americans, chinese, etc. But it's mostly athletes from African countries.
Every country take shitons of drugs, and the strongest countries are the most tested ( China in this case ). At this level is not about drugs or even training, its straight up human material. The amount of money China puts into olympic scouting and athlete development ( it's not only infrastructure, they pay these kids family in order to have them 100% focused from a very early age ) its unparalleled.
A Chinese Anti Doping Agency or WADA's Chinese officials went to take blood from that superstar swimmer, Sun Yang, and they definitely didn't cover for him, or give him special treatment. I think that they went to his place at like 3am to get blood and when he got pissed off, they left without a sample. He ended up getting suspended for a couple years or something, even though he has never had anything show up in his tests.
We are talking about sports in general, not only weighlifting. Do we really think top tier athletes don't use anything to increase their performances? Nobody believes that. The moneys and prestige for the country involved are beyond every imagination, even with a lot of political implications (strongh athletes = strong country). Drug testes are almost useless: if you know the rules there is always a way to break it, whichever is corrupting, using modified substances not detected by current tests, dosing and timing, or even genic doping why not. It's sad but at the end of the day be on the top it's not only about a person's abilities, but in large part it's about the medical staff and researchers behind the athlete. That said, no one can deny the exceptional abilities of these athletes, especially if we talk about Lu Xiaojun whom I deeply respect.
If you are beating men or women who are doping, it's very likely you are doping. All of these countries have doping programs. Russia, China across the board. Jamaican sprinters, East African distance runners. The concept of 'cheating' isn't really taken seriously in most countries. Your duty it to win and earn money for your family. If you have to take a substance, it is what it is.
They may very well be on drugs, but if you do side by side comparisons with the americans, the chinese have better form imo. I mean do a side my side with Lu and Zack, and its clear to see Lu’s form is basically perfect.
The Chinese are definitely technicians to an extreme degree a lot of the time, but technique isn't going to create a gap like a 180kg C&J vs a 200kg C&J unless your form is REALLY bad
Lu vs zack is a horrible comparison. Maybe you can compare liao hui with alex lee. Both phenomenal athletes with great technique but one snatches the others clean and jerk.
@@signs80 perhaps. Ive never been near that strong to understand the difference. When im close to bumping a 400 pound clean and jerk ill comment back my new opinion haha
There definitely drugs in weightlifting at the same time certain ethnicities do better at certain sports, the general shape of some Asians is optimal for Olympic weightlifting
New Sub, appreciate the channel. I’m 5’10, 228# 1st timer-taking Cjc 1295/Ipamorlen to hopefully trim the spare tire. Workout 3/4x a week, avg diet, protein shake etc.
Which side has more money, science led by capital ventures or science led by budget restraints. We allocate resources in favor of cheating because there is more money in doing so for organizations/athletes/sponsors/big pharma. Knowing this, it certainly feels like a waste of time worrying about drug testing, as if the standards of testing and drug makers will ever be on the same level.
You can still do maintenance training to keep most of your muscle mass... this looks like the man had an injury or something with how much weight he's lost.
The reason it’s way more likely Chinese athletes are taking steroids is because of how the system works over there. They’re taken as children into government run schools to try and make them the best athletes possible, and I’d bet my life that includes forcing them to take steroids since China just cares about winning medals and don’t give two shits about the athletes.
China also has more than 1 billion people and are known for their work ethic so that might be the sole reason instead of also having a chemical advantage.
And the athletes are taken to state run schools to be trained nonstop to be the bests athletes possible. I definitely agree in a world without steroids they would still do very well because of that. Still a horrible system tho and once the athlete is done they just discard them and many struggle to live a normal life with no real education or job prospects.
lol this guy thinks chinese people aren't getting enough food. there was a recent study showing that Chinnese are eating more protein on avg than Americans now...
When China is dominant in a field it's worth noting that there is huge resource put into their programmes. Also, Asian people are advantaged in lower weight power lifting by having shorter limbs in general.
let's spend 4 years living with them to see if they are clean. however, only you can tell, others will still questioning you all the time. this is something that only you know it's true when it's true.
when I watched team china in the olympics I was shocked. Their physiques were different from everyone elses and it wasn't even close. Brazenly obvious when you see it 5 different lifters.
On the other hand, their limb ratios are also the most lopsided too. If you are built like slenderman, you'll have trouble being competitive at the highest levels in weightlifting, you'll have trouble looking jacked, and you'll have trouble squat jerking. The Chinese are pulling from the biggest pool of candidates, so they find the biggest outliers. I think a Chinese coach said that 90% of the kids they train are split jerkers, but on the National team you have a lot of squat jerkers. It's survivorship because those limb ratios are advantageous. If it is some special undetectable drug that the Chinese have found, you would think that they would be more competitive in the heavyweight classes, but the Chinese have always been weak there.
They copied the Russians and have nationally funded Olympic athlete factories where the kids are picked and filtered out from a young age and once they get in it's their full time job
I could hear 1000 plausible reasons, and sure I could be wrong, but I doubt it. If you have athletes that make other competitors look like average Joe's competing against ifbb pros in numerous weight classes I call bs. They have a larger pool to pull from, but a much larger percentage of their population is older. It's more, but I dont think their pool is that much more.
Why are they talking about test? In weightlifting you have to stay in weight classes, you can gain strength but not weight. I would think stanozolol, turanibol, anavar , halotestin, but not test
I really like that you emphasize steroids and ignore the long-term hard training of Chinese people Just like: if he's stronger than me, then he must have some problems!
Maybe China had good weight lifting program. Is not possible? After all, they got a lot of people. They passed all the doping tests. Guilty even if proven otherwise?
Talking like USADA goes out and actually wants to catch athletes 😂 case in point, USADA allowing doped athletes to compete in return for a 'promise' that the athlete would help catch others😅
FULL LENGTH EPISODE HERE: ruclips.net/video/YEu9-x3zYa8/видео.html
Americans athletes took the most of drugs in the world
I love how Derek refuses to speculate on things he hasn't spend days researching. People who have the wisdom to stay in their lane of knowledge are so rare.
I noticed that too. Seems like Zach is reaching a bit with this one. Glad Derrick didn’t take the bait.
@@rationalright8342 Imo it's not really bait. It's not like Zack is trying to squeeze questions out of him for some clickbait. He seems genuinely interested about the state of drugs in his sport. Just that Derek isn't super into weightlifting so it's hard with this topic specifically.
@@wikitiki44 I don’t know. This part of the pod seems a bit clickbait- ish to me. That’s just my opinion. No harm, it’s how you grow the channel. I just think it should be less obvious.
@@rationalright8342 hes just curious stop
I think the issue is that it's unrealistic to expect anyone of Lu's calibre to NOT be on gear. We know he is, it's just a matter of how they achieve it.
If you combine both of their facial hair patterns, you get a full beard
the best kind of friends complete eachother
You mean if they kiss?
Lmao
These comments
Lol
That was the funniest image I got in my head of WADA guys in lab coats parachuting into a country with piss cups 😂
Lu must have forgotten the nine ancestral tenets.
unprimal😆
@@5hydroxyT *suuubprimal
forgot to sunbathe his anus
@@franciscos.2301 irrrrrelevant!
Lmao underrated comment
“Our roided up guy, beat your roided up guy.”
I like to see how far we can push the human body even if substances are involved. Legalize everything….
Fact is in the west it’s a coach, and maybe an athlete that can afford the work. Whereas in China it’s the State playing politics because they can’t stand not winning as many medals as America.
@@yankees29 why does legalizing it make a difference
@@EroticOnion23 Because then we can go crazy and invest a ton of money into these PEDs for mass market which means there's no legal road blocks into improving these drugs because the data on them will grow exponentially. Not to mention that it will become safer over a shorter period of time compared to if people just did it secretly in gym locker rooms.
@@EroticOnion23 Exactly. So few people get caught, it's almost the same as if it were legal.
"Are there drugs available that could get around a test? Asking purely hypothetically of course" - ZT at his biggest
lol
"It's weightlifting, everyone is on drugs. It's just they are never caught."
That's a metric shit ton of truth right there. Could just as well be said; it's professional sports, everyone is on drugs.
One problem with any drug testing regimen is how easy it is to manipulate against small or unpopular countries while the countries that hold power on the federations get away just about anything.
Stop saying every one in professional sports is on drugs lol not even close to being true
@@johnford9070 You're delusional.
@@johnford9070 how come us swimming team so dominant, must use drugs
So by that logic, if everyone is on drugs then it must be skill that wins Gold lol
@@kelinlu5264 Swimming also got a ridiculous number of events. Sounds like US is pulling the strings to pass their asthma athletes into the pool lol
As someone doing a master in analytical chemistry, its very interesting to hear these kinds of discussions. If you have a big enough lab team you could test everyone, but this costs a lot of manpower and a lot of money. In addition to this, there is also problems in hospital labs with determination of different normally present steroids in humans with off the shelve machines and method from big pharmacutical companies, so even if you could test everyone with a test that costs less to run you're still going to have so much problems with detection limits, cross reactivity and general selectivity of your tests
China = manpower & money
Lu Xiaojun is competing at 73kg for the 2024 Paris Olympics, since his prior weight class of 81kg won't be held in Paris. Thus why he lost a lot of weight first before beginning to train again.
I like how they're doing all this analysis but no one's bringing this up lmao
I have friends who are professional weightlifters. These guys do not know how weightlifters trainings. They train 1 or max 2reps only focusing on weights. Their bodies are not look like bodybuilders.
@@ausnonymous8455 That’s a poor argument. You can get a good physique by combining Olympic lifting and high rep isolation work….like the Chinese do.
Lu could've dropped to 73 pretty easy in under a year, by his own words he had to force feed himself to even maintain enough for the 77kg class. He probably could've dropped that 8kg in 4 months instead of what was probably 12-15kg in over a year
@@thechosenone93 that is the point. When weightlifters’ bodies are not on good shape, they still lift e80%of their record then they doing diet to meet the weight classes and doing double amount of training during season. Lu looked tiny but turns out bigger is completely normal lol
I wish Derek will do a whole video regarding women’s weightlifting, professional competitors, fitness in general and supplements. Long term effects of synthetic enhancement drugs, androgyny, etc. Also HRT, menopause, creatine, etc. The importance of women’s weight training from HS up until your 80’s. The key factors in our longevity. The WHOLE enchilada. Love you Derek. ❤
You should dm him on Reddit. Dude is really responsive
That's like 10 different videos
@@yawns3004
Maybe hahaha. I think he can cover a lot in a 2 1/2 hour segment.
@@yawns3004thats content given to him for 10 vids right there
No I love you Maya 😍
So weird to see Derek not in front his woodshed, glad ZT could coax him out
So nice of Telander to go into Derek’s woodshed and hang a curtain for different scenery
New camera angle making Zack look like an absolute beefcake
"Is winstrol ever even supposed to be in your body, even in micro amounts?"
Jon Jones has entered the chat with picograms of turinabol in his system.
I just got off a 12 week winny cycle won't do it ever again
@@tdan6828 I heard Winstrol destroys you
@@luxurybuzz3681 I still have bad gyno lost everything I got on it got kinda fat lost so much hair got really Moody my face aged and I just wish I never did roids even sarms
@@tdan6828steroids are short term gain , long term pain.
The clip we’ve all been waiting for, amazing stuff Zack
China's steroid philosophy, "Learn the rules like a pro, so you can break them like an artist."
I guess this is also true for US swimming team, gymnast team and many others?
And US basketball team? Mainly made up of blacks?
If it is just steroids, then you'd think the Chinese would dominate the heavy weight classes too. But they consistently suck there. I think it is more likely that they have a better system of looking for kids with extreme outlier limb ratios. They look at millions of farm kids and send the ones with extreme outlier limb ratios to weightlifting camp. You don't see any other team with this many short arm, short femur, long torso, squat jerkers. China has a pretty deep bench too. But at the heavy weight and super heavy weight classes, where the athletes are a lot taller, they don't have this advantage any more and the Chinese team is very mediocre there.
@@kelinlu5264 these US kants will never admit it that their own athletes do take steroids. Its part of high level sports. Hypocrite faks right 😂
china always beat you, cry some more. 🤣
Less dates more on my plate
Derek doing a podcast press run to promote exposing the liver king is insane yo😭 ( liver king deserved exposure tho)
Not the collab I was expecting, but a collab I am super happy with!
What's really needed is some channel that lets Americans directly talk with Chinese citizens, and network to those in the appropriate fields in the know there.
Cuz otherwise, the communication gap is so large that any talk about China here is basically largely raw speculation like a Bigfoot channel...
yeah the people would always get along but the goverments dont because of greed
Unfortunately, the Chinese gov has been pretty damn successful in isolating their 'internet' from the rest of the world. It's certainly not impenetrable, but it obviously isn't most of the citizens(probably not even 10% TBH) that are bypassing it.
@@RyTrapp0 countries gotta block US social media because feds use it to regime change/organize terrorism. bangladesh was recently couped by the US.
DEREK is breaking the RUclips Algorithm 👍
I'm not Lu
YOURE NOT LU
I'm not Klokov
I'm not Clarence
I'm not Haack.
Zach looking JACKED, well done sir
Was about to say that! He's made some neck gains thats that's sure
Wonder what his cycle is
@@22448824 No wouldnt say bloated, hes bulked up to hit prs in the gym. If you want to gain mass and think youre going to stay chiseled through youre in for a rough ride
For the algo gainz
More comments more gainz
Interesting discussion, thanks for sharing this man! God bless :)
zach looks like he's put on 10 pounds of muscle in the past 3 months
Done this natural myself. Simple case of changing from speed work to strength and size. I'm not natty anymore tho btw just for reference tho I pulled 300 natty
@@francoisstrength face looks puffy too.
@@Me-vl6jl Isn't the ''puffiness'' related to him demolishing the w8s?
@@Me-vl6jl think that's called fat from eating more than he can burn cause he is trying to bulk
@@simbellemare6999 he's probably just dirty bulking idk
The sport i played as a minor started randomly test athletes at the age of 15 Now I grew up in Sweden we have pretty high standard for doping tests in sports
Zack out here asking the real questions and sneakily taking notes cause he wants his team to win medals 🤣
"I'd be remissed if I didn't _____"= A great statement that I've been using thanks to Andrew Huberman. Great Content Zack
One of my favorite parts about listening to people way smarter than me, is how they open up my vocabulary and expressions. It's cool to see someone else likes that kind of stuff too bro lol
I'd be *remiss*
@@austinjrbdon’t be like that guy he didn’t even get the expression right
i wouldn't be surprised if the chinese team is doping but only to the degree that all olympic weightlifting teams probably are. the chinese weightlifting system is superior, just as the russian system of wrestling is superior, the cuban boxing system, etc. the usa hates when an asian country is dominant at something though like the hatred towards japan when they kicked the usa's ass in automotives in the 70s.
two reasons: 1.large talent pool due to the huge population 2. East Asians (including myself) tend to have larger torso and shorter limbs in general (not everyone but in general) East Asians are good at power leverage and quick burst power output in middle and lower weight class, like Lu Xiaojun and the boxer Naoya Inoue, but also look at Zhilei Zhang, who is a heavy weight boxer from China, he is also very fast and powerful. I guess it's a gene thing that East Asians are more power efficient for the same weight class when compared with other people in the world.
No they are very weak, in comparison to western lifters. They only have success using the forced training and screening methods that the chinese use and the state sponsored doping.
@@awkwrdly_socleven I am against the communist government of China, I have to say your stereotypical reply is ignorantly biased. Asians have very good body structure for lifting and fighting.
@@awkwrdly_socl you are copium addict. Just spitting you inner racism BS. Inoue is an absolutely beast boxer, not weak. If chinese dominates the competition, they are not either. Keep sniffing cope
@@awkwrdly_socldemonstrably not true. east asians tend to be more powerful than other ethnicities-as in, they are able to output a lot of force in a short span of time
@trollaccount4270 I almost fell for it lol
Their system is better, their process is better, and they have the biggest population in the bloody world! They find the genetic anomalies who have massive potential for strength, and make them do weightlifting.
in November 2011, the International Weightlifting Federation announced that Liao Hui had tested positive for the banned substances boldenone and androstatrienedione.
Liao Hui was Olympic gold medalist at 69kg in 2008.
So it’s BS that Chinese weight lifters are never caught.
“Hardly ever”
That's a poor choice for an example because it is speculated he was busted for political reasons, not that he just happened to get busted. There have been several more doping bans for China, mostly in re-tests for previous Olympics.
@@AfferbeckBeats that's a poor choice for a rebuttal because you stated that it was speculated that he was busted for political reasons. speculation is even worse evidence.
Liao hui getting popped was weird as fuck. The guy gets tested by usada out lf nowhere and he comes clean but he gets in some trouble in china and he magically pops for a substance no drug tested athlete in their right mind would take.
But their Government and Coaches are excellent at ensuring they are not popped. State funded PEDs versus an org like WADA is not exactly an even race. China wants to make a political statement, and they have in the medals race.
Very fitting that Derek streamlined his interview on the China weightlifting team by speaking Chinese.
He's not eating enough raw liver.🤪
Lmfaooo
based on doping failed test most of the lifters were found to be using Dehydrochlormethyltestosteron and Stanozolol or in common terms turinabol and winstrol although we know they use multiple drugs in their cycle rotation
I’m not sure if the China weightlifters are all juicing but what if a Chinese RUclipsr said “oh wow all the weightlifting record are held by Americans. What steroid are they all taking?”
He said everyone at this level is juicing, doesn't matter which country they represent. I think that part is valid and pretty obvious. His point is that American weight-lifter undergo more testing scrutiny compared to Chinese because of the testing agencies. Less scrutiny = more juice you can get away with taking = better edge over competition. Basically he is saying "Americans take less/benefit less from drugs because our testing agencies are less corrupt because... USA". Which is a bullshit politicized argument.
Some people have this double-standard where China or other foreign countries are just assumed to be guilty without any evidence
They're all on steroids
Good compassion however RUclips is banned in China so there is hardly chinese RUclipsr lol
@@哪拉酷 there's actually a LOT. ask any Singaporean, HKer, or Taiwanese. They most likely are watching at least a few Chinese youtubers.
Peeled out of his tree 🌴 😂
And diced to the socks 🧦 👌
I think saying it’s only due to PEDs that China is so good ignores some other factors, like how Chinese people tend to have shorter limbs, maybe giving better joint angles (not sure on this). But that’s how it is with long distance running and East African runners holding all the records. Some speculate it’s their tendency to be built leaner, some speculate that culturally it’s taken more seriously, some say it’s that they train from a very young age and train with more volume, but at the same time more East Africans get popped for PEDs than any other area. IAAF was considering banning the entire country of Kenya this year due to 40% of all positive tests being from there. Finally maybe it’s a combination of all factors.
It's been trivial to dodge the tests for YEARS there. First, they don't even have a formal national identification system like we do with social security numbers or even photo IDs and I'm not joking. Then, it's not like WADA uses fingerprinting and $hit. So it's very easy for an athlete to send in a body double to take a drug test, in fact being a body double had become a very lucrative profession for many. Of course you never hear any of this brought up, because that would be WAYYYSISSS WAHHH!
@@soonahero no, I mean Kenya lol. There's nothing like social security or even photo ID there. Or wasn't as of the early 2000s. But WADA didn't even acknowledge it.
The drug abuse problem in the US is the worst around the world. I mean a normal 16-year-old teenage in high school might use steriod and it's just for getting girls' attention, not for any sports competition.
They also live and breathe training. They're not like a regular Olympic team. They live, train, eat at the training center for months on end. Not that they couldn't be on it. It just doesn't equate to the same training experience of most countries.
@@HkFinn83 , anyone could. Lol.
@@HkFinn83 a lot of the people who don't do as well and complain about everyone else are also on it. I don't know why you're so bitter when I agreed that they could be but also stated their work ethics are bar none. Must be feeling a bit inferior.
@@HkFinn83 And Americans don’t do steroids, but the Chinese do, right? Barry Bonds, Roger Clemens, Mark McGwire, Lance Armstrong, and all the best US athletes are all clean, right? Right? 🤦🏻♂️
Firstly, he have perfect proportions for weight lifting
@@healthywiseandfit man most Chinese athletes are juicing and if not juicing alot of the times they are cheating work ethic is there but that can be said about lots of athletes who are training. so you can try projecting all you want but knowing how easy it is to get drugs over there I am not fooled.
He not a you tube tick tock, Instagram goof that's running gear all year long, he's a professional athlete that is taking time off the drugs which is smart.
Clarence made a very good vid on steroinds in weightlifting, wada etc
Link?
Why are the French/Spanish/Brazilian so.good at football.
Why are Jamaicas are so good at sprinting..
Jamaicans have been popped for drugs numerous times and declined to be tested by WADA in Jamaica just like China, instead they prefer to use their own domestic testing (which surprise surprise never catches anyone). They are clearly on gear. Bolt used a well known steroids doctor on his staff, he also beat Ben Johnsons steroid time during this period. Olympics is dirty as hell from top to bottom.
Jamaicns definitely on that gear though.
If someone took time off, and didn't work out barely at all, he could lose 20+ pounds of lean tissue. He is a short guy and was super ripped, which always makes you look bigger.
It possible he was not on gear, but so many athletes are using steroids, it's hard to believe that he wasn't.
If he blows up back to his jacked status really quickly, then he is definitely getting saucy.
The thing he said about other countries Anti Doping Agencies not being as active in trying to catch their countrymen, that isn't necessarily true.
A Chinese Anti Doping Agency or WADA's Chinese officials went to take blood from that superstar swimmer, Sun Yang, and they definitely didn't cover for him, or give him special treatment. I think that they went to his place at like 3am to get blood and when he got pissed off, they left without a sample. He ended up getting suspended for a couple years or something, even though he has never had anything show up in his tests.
They are all on PED's, but how is it different than the American's like Carl Lewis, or the Russian's and the Olympics they fixed, which was brilliant. How about in the 1950's where the German government and Olympic coaches were giving Turinabol to all of their athletes and telling them that it was vitamins. A bunch of the women sued the government and won.
Canada won more Gold Medals then any other country, probably because of steroids somehow. Now it's China's turn and they are going to run with it until they drop the ball or Anti Doping catches up.
All major athletes are using steroids.
The major difference here is that, for the US, the prize is qualifying for the olympics, and USADA exists to keep that organic competition (relatively) fair, but for other countries, the prize is the medal itself for national pride to be used domestically for national unity purposes.
Cope
The success itself shouldn’t be used as evidence, there are plenty of countries that excel at specific sports like how Kenyans and Ethiopians dominate distance running, before accusing them of cheating you would consider their physiology. Gear aside, the general body types of chinese people do seem to fit what you would expect to be advantageous for certain kinds of lifts, so the number of people in China who are available to become high level lifters is enormous. If it was just about cheating, it wouldn’t just be in the area they also happen to be physiologically suited for. Again not saying there is or isn’t cheating, just saying we shouldn’t overlook the fact that they may just be naturally good at these kinds of lifts in general.
Kenyans and Ethiopians use gear that help them perform for long distances/endurance sports, they're still phenomenal athletes regardless.
it's not mutually exclusive almost all pros are on something don't believe the hype
Look up the current positive PED lists. It's mostly African athletes.. surprising isn't it? I expected a lot of Americans, chinese, etc. But it's mostly athletes from African countries.
@@jonnysith this can also be attributed to Americans and Chinese being better at hiding it, but innocent until proven guilty. 🤷🏻♂️
@@bigheadrhino no those athletes were straight up tested and popped. It's literally proven.
Every country take shitons of drugs, and the strongest countries are the most tested ( China in this case ). At this level is not about drugs or even training, its straight up human material. The amount of money China puts into olympic scouting and athlete development ( it's not only infrastructure, they pay these kids family in order to have them 100% focused from a very early age ) its unparalleled.
Crazy how retired LU is tiny af but still squats pretty damn good
A Chinese Anti Doping Agency or WADA's Chinese officials went to take blood from that superstar swimmer, Sun Yang, and they definitely didn't cover for him, or give him special treatment. I think that they went to his place at like 3am to get blood and when he got pissed off, they left without a sample. He ended up getting suspended for a couple years or something, even though he has never had anything show up in his tests.
Liked the outro art
The Asian men and women athletes compete in both men and women events.
We are talking about sports in general, not only weighlifting. Do we really think top tier athletes don't use anything to increase their performances? Nobody believes that. The moneys and prestige for the country involved are beyond every imagination, even with a lot of political implications (strongh athletes = strong country). Drug testes are almost useless: if you know the rules there is always a way to break it, whichever is corrupting, using modified substances not detected by current tests, dosing and timing, or even genic doping why not. It's sad but at the end of the day be on the top it's not only about a person's abilities, but in large part it's about the medical staff and researchers behind the athlete. That said, no one can deny the exceptional abilities of these athletes, especially if we talk about Lu Xiaojun whom I deeply respect.
Can not stop laughing on this video. Accusing better competitors because they are too good.
So American..
This comment aged well
If you are beating men or women who are doping, it's very likely you are doping. All of these countries have doping programs. Russia, China across the board. Jamaican sprinters, East African distance runners. The concept of 'cheating' isn't really taken seriously in most countries. Your duty it to win and earn money for your family. If you have to take a substance, it is what it is.
This comment deserves more upvotes. Classic Americans, objective as the way how they put it, but all just specculative BS.
Lu got busted for doping shortly after this
They may very well be on drugs, but if you do side by side comparisons with the americans, the chinese have better form imo. I mean do a side my side with Lu and Zack, and its clear to see Lu’s form is basically perfect.
Americans are the wrong people to compare them to
@@inmythoughts5450 interesting, who do you think they should be compared to?
The Chinese are definitely technicians to an extreme degree a lot of the time, but technique isn't going to create a gap like a 180kg C&J vs a 200kg C&J unless your form is REALLY bad
Lu vs zack is a horrible comparison. Maybe you can compare liao hui with alex lee. Both phenomenal athletes with great technique but one snatches the others clean and jerk.
@@signs80 perhaps. Ive never been near that strong to understand the difference. When im close to bumping a 400 pound clean and jerk ill comment back my new opinion haha
USADA jokes btw
source: ufc pico jon jones incident
atta baby, way to go zack
There definitely drugs in weightlifting at the same time certain ethnicities do better at certain sports, the general shape of some Asians is optimal for Olympic weightlifting
New Sub, appreciate the channel.
I’m 5’10, 228#
1st timer-taking Cjc 1295/Ipamorlen to hopefully trim the spare tire.
Workout 3/4x a week, avg diet, protein shake etc.
You don't need drugs, you need a less average diet
Which side has more money, science led by capital ventures or science led by budget restraints. We allocate resources in favor of cheating because there is more money in doing so for organizations/athletes/sponsors/big pharma. Knowing this, it certainly feels like a waste of time worrying about drug testing, as if the standards of testing and drug makers will ever be on the same level.
I want a video on supplements that will help and keep you healthy when going natural.
This guy the Chinese guy is recovering from an injury
my boi Lu
Pushing so hard to imply ped use.. good job Derek being impartial
Well Lu has been popped, smh.
Damn, Lu just got caught
You can still do maintenance training to keep most of your muscle mass... this looks like the man had an injury or something with how much weight he's lost.
Hot damn Derek is well-read and well-spoken...
He literally just took a year off after the Olympics and didn't touch a weight that whole time. Ilya Ilyin was the same.
I dunno man, when I see swimming I see a lot of American/Australian flags. So, we're gonna take a look at that, or...?
The reason it’s way more likely Chinese athletes are taking steroids is because of how the system works over there. They’re taken as children into government run schools to try and make them the best athletes possible, and I’d bet my life that includes forcing them to take steroids since China just cares about winning medals and don’t give two shits about the athletes.
They're all doping, it's the Olympics you dummy. But the question is how the Chinese haven't been caught.
AS IF Americans are cleaner than anyone else... 🤣🤣
The United States is the largest producer and user of stimulants An open secret! Look at Phelps' face.
"Heard this from somebody who lives there" you should have shouted out our boy Ramsey Dewey!
China also has more than 1 billion people and are known for their work ethic so that might be the sole reason instead of also having a chemical advantage.
And the athletes are taken to state run schools to be trained nonstop to be the bests athletes possible. I definitely agree in a world without steroids they would still do very well because of that. Still a horrible system tho and once the athlete is done they just discard them and many struggle to live a normal life with no real education or job prospects.
@@kye4216 And how are the American Olympic athletes doing? They’re not all rich after the Olympics, especially if their sport isn’t wildly popular.
@@healthywiseandfit how is that the same as being taken as children and not given any education by the government ?
How come they suck at soccer and didn't do shit in FIFA?
@@SmashBrosBrawl they have spent huge amounts of money trying to invest in football and it just hasn’t worked out, no idea why tbh
lol this guy thinks chinese people aren't getting enough food. there was a recent study showing that Chinnese are eating more protein on avg than Americans now...
Zach is getting thicker by the day.
It's the power of Chi and Gung Fu
Xiaojun just got busted for EPO. As everyone has been saying, they're all on drugs.
Everyone dopes or else you would not even be top 150 in elite sports.
Who has the most money and technology to beat the tests? The Americans by far and its not even close
if USADA is too hard with scrutiny....why not go after and expose USADA?
Let's get to the lab boys
Bro I called Brucie in GTAV online for some bullshark testosterone but theres no option to put in credit card and address to ship it to me wtf
He's my rival lol I squat 265 he squats 600 I got a little catching up... lmao
everyone is using.. Chinese just lift more its simple
When China is dominant in a field it's worth noting that there is huge resource put into their programmes. Also, Asian people are advantaged in lower weight power lifting by having shorter limbs in general.
BS
i think its more a case $$$$ rather than undetectable drugs ... every one has their price ... including WADA
let's spend 4 years living with them to see if they are clean. however, only you can tell, others will still questioning you all the time. this is something that only you know it's true when it's true.
Looking huge bro.
"Overarching concurrently that would otherwise...I don't know". Another Derekism!
when I watched team china in the olympics I was shocked. Their physiques were different from everyone elses and it wasn't even close. Brazenly obvious when you see it 5 different lifters.
I mean it does help that they tend to do way more muscle building accessory work than other countries including others that are known for doping
On the other hand, their limb ratios are also the most lopsided too. If you are built like slenderman, you'll have trouble being competitive at the highest levels in weightlifting, you'll have trouble looking jacked, and you'll have trouble squat jerking. The Chinese are pulling from the biggest pool of candidates, so they find the biggest outliers. I think a Chinese coach said that 90% of the kids they train are split jerkers, but on the National team you have a lot of squat jerkers. It's survivorship because those limb ratios are advantageous. If it is some special undetectable drug that the Chinese have found, you would think that they would be more competitive in the heavyweight classes, but the Chinese have always been weak there.
@@tonyng9 good point!
They copied the Russians and have nationally funded Olympic athlete factories where the kids are picked and filtered out from a young age and once they get in it's their full time job
I could hear 1000 plausible reasons, and sure I could be wrong, but I doubt it. If you have athletes that make other competitors look like average Joe's competing against ifbb pros in numerous weight classes I call bs. They have a larger pool to pull from, but a much larger percentage of their population is older. It's more, but I dont think their pool is that much more.
Larry lilja would be proud zack.
Why are they talking about test? In weightlifting you have to stay in weight classes, you can gain strength but not weight. I would think stanozolol, turanibol, anavar , halotestin, but not test
It’s the don’t ask don’t tell policy ll
Zack needs to let his guests talk more, jeez. Feels like Derek gets a sentence in once in a blue moon and Zack talks the other 80% of the time
So basically whoever can lift the most weight without getting popped wins with a system that can avoid getting popped at the highest rate.
summa summarum
Accusation without evidences
Is it just me or does this camera angle make them look like they have underbites? LMAO
Chinese lifters are also lifting for life long monthly payments sponsored by the government. They have more to gain than western lifters .
I really like that you emphasize steroids and ignore the long-term hard training of Chinese people Just like: if he's stronger than me, then he must have some problems!
Sun Yang's hammer has entered the chat.
What happend to the do you lift bro?
He started lifting
Maybe China had good weight lifting program. Is not possible? After all, they got a lot of people. They passed all the doping tests. Guilty even if proven otherwise?
4:12 no… that’s not true…😰it… can’t be… 😧
We cannot assume people are clean in USA either . That would be too fuckin naive.
Talking like USADA goes out and actually wants to catch athletes 😂 case in point, USADA allowing doped athletes to compete in return for a 'promise' that the athlete would help catch others😅
bro. a week early. assuming a followup is on the way or already out lol.