LEGO 51515 Motor Secrets - Accuracy, Speed, Torque, Form Factor
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- Опубликовано: 24 июл 2024
- How accurate are LEGO 51515 motors? How fast do they spin? How much torque do they produce? What is it like building with the Robot Inventor motors? How does the accuracy, speed, and torque of the new LEGO MINDSTORMS 51515 Robot Inventor motors compare to the EV3 motors?
The new LEGO 51515 motors are mechanically identical to the LEGO Spike Prime motors (specifically, the Spike Prime medium motors). Today's video uses the FAST method to evaluate the Form Factor, Accuracy, Speed, and Torque of the new LEGO MINDSTORMS 51515 Robot Inventor motors, using the familiar EV3 motors as a benchmark. I also reveal a handful of secrets that will help you make the most of using these new motors in your robots.
Thank you to Philo Hurbain for providing the torque measurements for the LEGO Spike Prime (Robot Inventor) motor. You can read more about his LEGO motor comparison on his website: www.philohome.com/motors/moto...
🔴 Watch my LEGO MINDSTORMS 51515 Review: • LEGO MINDSTORMS 51515 ...
🤖 See all of my LEGO 51515 Tutorials here: • LEGO 51515 Tutorials -...
CONTENTS
0:00 - Introduction
1:02 - The FAST Method
1:17 - LEGO Spike Prime Comparison
1:27 - Form Factor
3:34 - Absolute Motor Encoders
5:11 - Accuracy
6:36 - Rotation Speed
8:07 - Torque
9:45 - Interpreting Torque Measurements
📕 Check out my book, “Building Smart LEGO MINDSTORMS EV3 Robots,” available on Amazon: amzn.to/2MyGVCl
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#builderdude35 #lego51515 #legomindstorms51515 
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Your videos have been very helpful, glad you are back. Having EV3 I am quite excited for getting the new set as well, as it offers different possibilities (like a walking robot). The mechanical parts are also nice addition to the EV3 ones.
I am thrilled to hear you are enjoying the new videos, I am glad to be back! I'm excited for the possibilities as well. Are you working on any cool projects right now?
@@Builderdude35 anyway to find or make a hitechnic angle sensor for 51515 or spike prime?
I think the numbers for the large SPIKE-motor is kind of interesting too. As well as other plug compatible motors from trains and control+, etc.
@Builderdude35 thanks for all the informative videos. I want to ask if there is some fundamental difference between the mindstorms motors and the technics motors, apart from the rotation sensors in the mindstorms. I mean, do the mindstorms use stepper motors for example or are they just typical DC motors?
Thank you for making such a great and insightful videos!
I'm currently building an automatic coffee machine with 51515 set, since i'm using 2 motor which each motor has 2 outputs and another 2 motor for the water faucet, the motors torque isn't enough for each of task of them.
After watching your video, i'm thinking about changing the power supply, but is it safe for the hub and other component? also if i can do it, where can i possibly find the battery that fit to the hub?
I look forward to get a suggestion from you :D
I think the spike is useful for small MOC.Good job:D
Yes absolutely! The smaller motors that come with LEGO 51515 and Spike are great for smaller builds. Thanks!
156, 156 and 156 on my 51515 physical tachometer seems like it works well (also the tachometer senses 15 seconds,30 seconds and 1 minute for as much accuracy as it can get to measure rpm
A quick question. When running the standard robot that avoids obstacles, how do I modify the program to stop when shown the red brick and then resume when shown the green? I have tried but failed miserably. Thanks.
Overall, my FLL team is enjoying the Spike Prime kit -- it is just a lot less buggy than ev3 (especially bluetooth connection and gyros). But... the lack of torque is extremely challenging for a number of the missions this year. The robot simply stalls when it tries to push something that is even slightly heavy (like the train mission, or the one where you need to move the cargo off the ship). I am not sure it is really worth it. I am curious the torque of the large motor (which is used for attachments in Spike Prime)
Honestly, I prefer the new motors. I understand that they're no where near as powerful as the old NXT or EV3 motors, but since they use the powered up electronic system, you can connect both the powered up L and the XL motor, both of which have a similar toque to the old power functions XL motor. The large circle/cylinder at the back of the NXT motor is the main motor, which is identical to the one found in the power functions XL motor. I'm not sure how the output torque differs between the NXT motor and the power functions XL motor, but the power functions one uses a planetary gear set to increase torque, where as the NXT/EV3 motor uses a direct line of gears. Since I can just connect my powered up XL and L motors to the new spike prime hub, the torque problem is not an issue for me. Using a planetary gear set instead of the direct line of gears results in a much smaller and a much better form factor
This is a pretty fair take IMO. I personally am going to miss the extra power/torque, but I definitely see the merits that you mention. Pretty soon, I am going to try to see just how fast of a car I can build with these motors!
The NXT and XL motors had the same core, as you noted. The NXT motor had more output torque because it had a higher gear reduction (which also means lower rotation speed). The XL motors still have more output power though because that planetary gear set was more efficient, meaning less power wasted due to friction.
I’m getting either the ev3 or the new one, this is going to be my first Mindstorms Lego set, I know the basics with Lego boost but I wanna move on to something more complicated, what do you recommend?
Thank you Soo much
one thing i was hoping to learn is whether the ev3 motors can also be used with the 51515 set
The voltages of the batteries are actually the same, if you read closely it says in both of them 7.4v rechargeable lithium-ion battery, when they're fully charged they can reach 8 to 8.5 V
This comparison needs to include the Large Angular as seen in the CAT dozer or Spike, and the large Control+ motor as seen in the Liebherr.
Good Job. Greating for Poland
Would you recommend the large spike motor for sumo battles against the EV3 versions?
Love the RI series so far! Just some questions about the motors though:
Shouldn't an absolute encoder be more accurate than an incremental encoder/is there some factor that influences this?
How much play/lag do the new motors have compared to the ev3 large motors?
How accurately do the new motors drive straight (is it worth making a drive straight program like with the ev3)?
Great questions!
Absolute encoders are not inherently more accurate than relative encoders. The only difference is that an absolute encoder has some kind of reference flag so it always compares motor position to the zero position.
I have not yet formally tested the play in the new motors, but my gut instinct from playing with them is that they are a little less sloppy then EV3 motors, which is great news!
Ditto on not having done a straight-line test, but it's always worth using a drive-straight algorithm, because external factors like bumps or changes in traction on the table surface can cause errors even if you have the most accurate motors in the world! Tutorials coming soon on this!
I'm happy you are enjoying the series, and I hope you keep watching! Lots of cool videos coming up soon!
HI! do these motors work with BuWizz?
Hmm... So the new motor seems to be much less powerful than the ev3 large. But the motors+brick is also much lighter. I wonder how this will scale in terms of acceleration and overall mobility for a typical 3 wheeler... Very nice reviews man, I am devouring your LEGO 51515 review series.
That's correct: power is a function of torque times rotation speed, so less torque at the same rotation speed = less power. In my experience so far, this shouldn't affect the speed of your classic 3-wheel FLL robot; those robots had more torque than they needed anyway, so having less torque with LEGO 51515 shouldn't slow them down at all. Unless you want to use really tall wheels, then you might have insufficient power.
Your videos are really helpful!! Thanks for sharing the knowledge.
I have a question regarding a different topic since your the only expert in lego who replies more than lego itself😅
I have the renewable energy add on and I can’t find any resource for how to charge the energy meter with ev3 instead of pf battery box. Do you have any idea how to do so?
Thanks in advanced😁
Admittedly, I do not have much experience with the Energy Meter, so I did some research myself. I found this document, which teaches you how to charge it using an NXT. It requires an adapter cable that adapts the NXT/EV3's RJ-12 connector to a Power Functions connector; I bough a bunch of these years ago but I don't remember how I got them or how you can get one today (probably on Bricklink)
Check it out here: le-www-live-s.legocdn.com/sc/media/files/user-guides/mm/9688-energy-meter-guide-e526319e083ac417918f4fa7c1563fc1.pdf
Good luck!
@@Builderdude35
Thank you!
I did see that before, I thought there’s a way to do it without extra cables since it’s not provided in either sets and it says on the manual there’s a way to do so.
I’ll try to get the cable.
Thank you for your reply 🙏🏻
@@rawanbakro8297 No problem! Good luck tracking down the cables!
New vid, lets goooo!!!
Yes! Time to get hyped!!!
same here
Hi Kyle, I just got the Mindstorm Inventor kit. I am a school teacher and I have not done anything with Lego robotics in 10 years. Things have changed a lot. I can't find a site that will help me with python coding for Mindstorms. Can you give me the basics or can you recommend a site? I built Charlie and I am having trouble lifting this right arm. I was able to lift his left using run_to_position, but I can't use it to lift his arm on the right.
With those Robot Inventor motors, it seems one can create a much more compact, lightweight robot for FIRST Lego League (FLL). :)
Agreed, the shape of the electronics they really got right this time.
Some might call this foreshadowing... the only way to find out is to stay tuned! 😎
What happened to the bass strum music in the intro - I liked it
Haha, the bass intro goes waaay back, I haven't used it in probably 3 years. That's great that you remember it though!
Will suspension affect my rc car made with MINDSTORMS?
Does the software support doing for example 10.3 revolutions and going back even with variable load?
Yes, the motor encoders ensure that the motor's rotation is accurately measured regardless of load. When you set a target like 10.3 revolutions, the motor will rotate until it reaches that precise target, even if load changes (as long as the load does not stall the motor).
Is it me, or the color of your videos are off? Are you using any color calibration tool?
Can’t wait!
I can't wait either! I hope you enjoy it :D
@@Builderdude35 I have a question. I have an EV3, and I use the gyro sensor for the robot to go straight. But for some reason when I keep the robot in one position, the gyro sensor keeps of thinking that the robot is turning when it's absolutely still! Do you think the gyro sensor has problems?
@@andrewzhuo6399 Hi Julius! The problem you are encountering is called "gyro drift" and it is common. Thankfully, it can be fixed! Check out my video where I talk about fixing gyro drift and improving the accuracy of the sensor: ruclips.net/video/7V16AEW3GG4/видео.html
Good luck!
@@Builderdude35 Thanks!
@@Builderdude35 One more question: Sometimes the EV3 doesn't recognize the gyro sensor (and other motors or sensors). What should I do?
Hey, builderdude, which robot do you suggest I use for the competitions, the EV3 or the inventor
That is a fantastic question! I am going to need to spend more time with the Robot Inventor before I can give a solid recommendation on which MINDSTORMS to use. I will certainly release a video on the topic as we get closer to FLL/WRO season.
I will say that the Robot Inventor comes with a few bonuses out of the box (rechargeable battery, a fourth motor) out of the box that the EV3 does not have... something to consider!
@@Builderdude35 ok thank you, i appriciate how you are helping me team.
@@izacomon6477 no problem! I am glad to hear your team is finding value in my content!
Can you do a video about the colour sensors? The spike prime colour sensors seem to be pretty strange in terms of colour range compared to ev3
You read my mind! The color sensor video is coming out next week!
@@Builderdude35 Awesome! Looking forward to watching it. My 10 year old son who has been watching your videos for years now and was just as if not more excited as I was when we found out you got accepted at MIT (As if they wouldn't..hehe you are amazing!). I bought him his Spike Prime Education edition originally for FLL but his first FLL experience wasn't that great as it was hard for him and his team to get things done due to COVID restrictions and what not. Anyway he is planning on using his Spike Prime for robocup which as you may be aware is 100% Autonomous (once you hit the go button that's it). We found that the sensors are really strange when it comes to detecting green while also having a large enough variation in RLI to black or even Orange/Red. We have tried different heights and even tried the Red/Green. He is thinking of just programming his way through the variations but it's not ideal. For examples, both sensors 3 studs apart (one detects green, the other no color). It's also interesting how white and a reflective tape both show 99-100% at the same height and in some comes varying heights between .5 studs to 2 studs high.
@@alanhaase7165 thanks! Sorry to hear that his FLL experience was less than stellar. This past year has been hard for competition teams everywhere, and I hope that in a few years, he can experience an FLL competition "like the good old days." There is definitely some interesting behavior from the new color sensor, but I am glad to see you are finding some innovative workarounds!
@@Builderdude35 Maybe after the color sensor video, you can do one on the in-built gyro? Have you ever experienced any issues with the in-built Gyro? We know the EV3 is a bit touch and go from our experience and I think you posted a video eluding to that as well, but we have had the in-built gyro seem to just turn off randomly or not read while initializing/turning on the robot. Its weird.
@@alanhaase7165 I haven't run the built-in gyro/accel through its paces yet, but rest assured, a video on each of them will be coming! Expect that to arrive in a few weeks. I will be exploring the ultrasonic sensor after the color sensor.
🤪 an i2c sensor ... what great “old” tools from rcx and nxt sets for testing and data logging .
That's an intriguing idea!
Sell me spike prime or 51515, but sell it to me knowing that I have experience with ev3, open source is important to me, and most of my lego fits ev3 color scheme. Make me want to upgrade.
is the mustang vid tomorrow
Mustang vid won't be out for a little bit... I'm hoping to get time to work on it this weekend! :)
@@Builderdude35 the mustang looks cool in the background
@@Sysop70 thanks Jimmy! Hopefully soon there will be a video where the Mustang is NOT in the background ;)
@@Builderdude35 what?! keep it in the background PLEASE
@@Builderdude35 or if you don't want to its ok
Are the new servos compatible with the EV3 controller?
What do you mean? The new servos arent compatible with the EV3 brick or the EV3 software.
no
the connectors are different.
@@dinhtuan752 Thank you. You saved me quite a bit of money. :)
thanks.
The new rrobobt inventor hub kinda sucks. I wish that they didnt dpwngrade some of very crucial features. Like in FLL we were always required to use all four ports for competition. If i were to use 4 ports for motors for tasks , i could only use 2 sensors which is kind if a bummer because i always find myself using multiple sensors to get accurate results.
No
0 position mark
What about it? :)
@@Builderdude35 I think racingbrick says "you deed to mark the zero position."
0 mark is not fully aligned. Right?
ok